Endless Thread - Catfish for dinner

Episode Date: May 17, 2024

After Taylor Paré was stood up on a date, she turned to TikTok. In a now-viral video, she claimed to have uncovered a new scheme to scam to singles looking for love on the internet. Endless Thread investigates. ===== Credits: This episode was written and produced by Grace Tatter. Mix and sound design by Paul Vaitkus. The hosts are Ben Brock Johnson and Grace Tatter.

Support for endless thread comes from Mathworks, creator of MATLAB and Simulink Software, to design and develop engineered systems, accelerating the pace of discovery in engineering and science. Learn more at Mathworks.com. Support for this podcast comes from Nature is the Solution, a podcast from the Nature Conservancy. This show tells climate stories like a stubborn optimist, because hope, innovation, and nature itself are key. to solving the challenges ahead. Follow on your favorite podcast app. WBUR Podcasts, Boston.

Hi, Ben Brock Johnson. Hi, producer Grace Tatter. What internet mysteries of the universe doth thou bring for us today? Okay, Ben, do you remember a few months ago, we independently stumbled upon the same video, which I feel like doesn't actually happen. that much, does it? No, it doesn't happen that often. You're out there looking at astrology,

and I'm out there looking and hold my beer, and never the twain shall meet. Exactly, except for this one time. So this was a dating mystery from this TikToker, Taylor Paray. A dating mystery, something I haven't had since about 2004. Yes, this is out of your wheelhouse and much more in mine. Yeah, do you have a lot of dating mysteries? So many. My life is one big dating mystery. So Taylor's in the same boat. Actually, Taylor and I have a lot of similarities because she's also in her 30s. She's also single. She also lives in New York City. Her bio is storytelling

and spilling tea, NYC, just to ground you and who our narrator is. Okay. So you see Taylor. She looks like she's in a leopard print bathrobe, pretty cozy. And there's this sad music playing as she tells us a tale of woe slash horror story, depending on your perspective. I was just stood up on a date and it was the most humiliating experience ever. Well, that doesn't sound good. I know, poor Taylor. So Taylor said she matched with this guy on a dating app.

He asked her to dinner, confirmed the plans the day of, and then he just never showed. As we've discussed, this is like a highly theoretical situation. for you, but say you were meeting an online date, what would you do if they, if you're at the place, it's like five minutes of past, they're not there. What would you do? Well, number one, I wouldn't do dinner first. That's not a first date thing. I feel like a first date thing is like take a walk in a very public place and maybe have an ice cream cone. But that's maybe I'm old fashioned. If somebody didn't show up to dinner and we were meeting for dinner, I feel like I would

maybe shoot them a text and be like, hey, I'm here. This is the hat I'm wearing. I'm in the back at a two-top. You know, I try to give them some helpful information while also trying to check on their ETA. Well, even though you've been out of the game for a bazillion years, I think that that's all pretty sound. I think you're right about not doing dinner for a first date.

It's way too much of a commitment. And then also all of the checking in stuff, that language sounds right. All right. I'll let my wife know that I'm still, that I still have it. No, just kidding. Okay, go on. Well, I don't know if Taylor actually, like, what text she sent when this guy wasn't showing up, but after a while, enough time has passed, she figures, I'm at the restaurant anyway, what the hell?

So she ordered a drink and some food, and she just had a little solo date, and then she went home. I guess I would probably do that, too. If I had sat down, I feel like it would be, like, awkward to leave. Like, for some reason, I feel guilty about that. And also, yeah, I might have even ordered like an appetizer just to be like, oh, this will be nice. Like I'll get some food that like maybe we can both eat and like I can like snack on it. And then like when the date shows up, there will already be some food for them to snack on there. Wow.

I just love snacks. Whole game plan. I think I also probably would order a drink in this situation. But this situation, fortunately, has never happened to me. But it's like not that novel of a situation, right? being stood up, like this alone does not make for a viral story. And I assume people have gotten stood up since time immemorial. But this is the age of Tinder, Bumble, hinge, and there are just so many new ways that things can go wrong. It's a very exciting time to be alive. And I've heard a lot of

horror stories, but what Taylor says happened here, the reason she says she was stood up, was one that I had never heard before. It wasn't until I got home when I was scrolling Facebook, and I saw a very similar story from a girl at that same restaurant who also got stood up. She found out that there are restaurants now posing as people on dating apps just so you go to their business, and once you get stood up, they know that probably nine times out of ten that you're going to buy something from them. And that just blew my mind.

It blew my mind too, but it also felt like something that was like an aha moment for me where it was like if there is one thing along with getting stood up that has probably happened since, you know, ancient sumer, it's also that like humanity will always find newer ways to scam each other and make money. Sure, we are an entrepreneurial, if flaky species. It's true. So this felt legit to me because I was like, oh, that makes sense in a way. Like, I get that. And especially in New York City where there's so much competition among restaurants, they're opening and closing all the time. I mean, we're already using AI and dating apps and dating profiles all the time.

So why not like make 500 profiles, all of which that are trying to like get a reservation at your restaurant and bring in, you know, whatever, 55 hungry singles, you know, it makes sense. Sure. I mean, personally, I want to know where this restaurant is. I'm always looking for a restaurant where you can actually get a seat instead of having to make a reservation really far in advance or waiting. But sure, this theory maybe has some legs to it. Why do you think that this video went so viral?

That's a good question. I mean, like, again, like, it's not at all relevant to my life. and yet I was pretty fascinated by it, right? I wonder if it's sort of like tapping into this deep form of fear maybe that we all have, which is like the idea of effectively being romantically rejected, right? And so like there's something about that that just gets like a visceral, like, oh my God, I can't believe this happened to you. That's so awful, right?

Like, I guess to me that was the thing that sort of made it jump out to me. And also, I guess I'm continually fascinated by how we're using technology to, like, trick each other. So that's the other piece of it to me. I was like, ooh, this is an interesting new way for, like, our boring dystopia to exist. Yeah. And I feel like you're tapping into two things. Yeah, that primal fear of rejection and then how it collides with technology. The American people love a catfishing story, and I think it's because it combines those two things.

I almost feel like I learned about online dating and catfishing as a concept simultaneously at the same time. Like I never knew about online dating without the possibility of catfishing. Yeah, it's a feature, not a bug. Exactly. I feel like in the early 2010s, there were just so many horror stories about catfishing. Like there was that journalist who uncovered the Notre Dame football player. who had been catfish in 2013. Oh, yeah.

The star player, whose heartbreaking loss of his girlfriend just before a big game made national headlines and made Manteo the individual story of the college football season. But now it turns out, his relationship was an elaborate hoax.

Now we're going to hear... That was a sad one. I think just the year before that, the MTV show catfishing debuted and that's still going strong. This could just be another fake profile. He says she's who she says she is. He's married.

And it's that the person she's been talking to is fake. It's bad news. She's a catfish. When I saw that show, I was like, oh, my God, this show is kind of amazing. I mean, there's no spectacle, like, human misery. So I guess in that spirit, after you and I talked about this video, I decided to look into this catfishing mystery. And I'll admit, I was a little skeptical. But if I could spare just one online data from being stood up by a nefarious restaurant, it seemed worth digging into.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. So the first obvious step is buying the restaurant in question, right? Except Taylor was tight-lipped on this. She posted this TikTok as a follow-up to the first one. One, I'm not entirely sure it's the restaurant who's up to this. It could be a second party, like an app, a mob scene. I don't know, an underground restaurant situation.

I reached out to her several times via her social media accounts, via TikTok and Instagram, just to see if she could even give us that information on. background and I didn't hear back from Taylor. You tried to set up a date, if you will, to talk to her about the thing. Yes, and maybe she thought I was a bot. So no response. Yeah, okay. But fear not, I had more. I would never. And the original TikTok, Taylor said she'd learned about the scam from a Facebook post. Do you remember that? And in the video, she included a screenshot of that Facebook post. And you can see some texts of another woman talking about getting stood up and a screenshot of the offending guys dating profile. So I reached out to the woman who wrote that post. Her name is

also Taylor, Taylor Finkelson. And a few days later, she responded. What did she say? What did she say, Grace? She said, hey Grace, you have the right Taylor, but the TikToker got the facts wrong. Oh. Ooh. More on what actually happened after the break. At Radio Lab, we love nothing more than nerding out about science, neuroscience, chemistry. But, but we do also like to get into other kinds of stories, stories about policing, or politics, country music, hockey, sex, of bugs. Regardless of whether we're looking at science or not science, we bring a rigorous curiosity to get to.

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story with a custom podcast from City Space Productions, the creative studio from WBUR's business partnerships team. Become a thought leader. Recruit new talent. Reach new audiences, whatever your goal, we can help. Discover how the magic is made at WBUR.org slash creative studio. Okay, Ben, we're back. And now I'm going to tell you what actually happened on Taylor Finkelson's date gone wrong. Oh, man, I'm here with bated breath. I can't wait. Okay. Also, it's a little confusing that the TikToker is named Taylor Peret. And the woman who's Facebook posts. Yeah, double tailors. Yeah, double tailors. It's a Taylor world and we are all just living in it.

Okay, Taylor squared. Exactly. But henceforth, when we refer to Taylor, we're talking about Taylor Finkelson, who we actually spoke with. Okay, all right. I'm in. Here's the restaurant catfishing story, other Taylor's version. So I was speaking to this person whose name was Antoine, or at least I thought I was speaking to them.

We had a great conversation. We had made plans to meet. I usually require a face time to start, but I had a good feeling about them. So I picked a place that was near me. Okay, that last detail. That's important, right? That she picked the place. Why is that important?

Well, because, like, if he stands her up and she picked the restaurant, then she can't, unless she's the person who's trying to get him to show up to the restaurant and pay money, then there's a major fact in this story, the way it's been represented to us so far. basically like undercuts the entire thesis of the story. Exactly. But the story goes on. You know, I show up and I'm there and I'm waiting and crickets. I had checked in with him like two days before to make sure we were still on.

When I was there, as I was waiting, I received a message from him saying that he was in a slight car accident. And he was going to still try to make it, but like didn't know how long it would take to you know, speak to the police and blah, blah, blah. And he sent me a photo of the car accident. Okay. You're Taylor. You received this car accident pick. What are you thinking?

Either that's what he uses with all the poor women who are waiting for him at dates. Like either this is like a bit or he's legit. Right. So, and he even actually called Taylor and they had a long discussion about this. Okay. All right. So she's like, let's just reschedule.

You take care of this. Just make sure that you're okay. And we'll do this another time. So how are we feeling about this? I mean, I feel like, again, like it's a little tricky. I mean, like, if I were a Facebook Taylor, I would say, okay, is a bit of a red flag that, like, our first date meet up. Antoine has got himself into a car accident. But he did send me a picture of the accident.

He did call me, like, I'm going to give him a second. second chance. I'm still team there's a future for Taylor and Antoine. So Taylor, too. She picks another day. And then that day, she just texts to check in to confirm that they're still on. And this time he doesn't respond. Oh, man. I know. So she's wondering, what's up? But Taylor was not born yesterday. And she remembered that she had that picture of the car crash. And she thought to Google image search, the picture of the crash. He sent her the day they had first scheduled the date. Okay. Okay. And she finds that it's just like a generic image. Oh my God, Antoine. So anyway, I posted about this online, being like I was stood up. I don't like, this guy said

he was in a car accident. He appeared to be lying based on the fact that I found the image online. So that's the Facebook post that the TikToker Taylor had included in the video. This is a totally different story. Totally different story. Totally different story. Wait, can I ask a question? Yeah. Did Taylor Finkelston eat at the restaurant, the original restaurant that she went to?

You know, that is a great question. I believe she did. Here's my guess. Antoine, a day before, he, He went to the restaurant. He asked for a commission on a, on a meal. And he said, listen, I'm bringing people into your restaurant right now. And, uh, and I just want you to give me like, like $3 per customer that I bring in.

I'll tell you the time that I'm, you know, that I'm, that I'm, that I'm working them into the restaurant. And you give me a commission. And that's why he's using the same car crash photo for everyone. He's setting up dates on dates on dates. He's reverse engineering this. Wow. If this whole podcasting thing doesn't work out,

maybe you can be a criminal mastermind. Criminal dating mastermind. I'm sure my wife Sarah would be thrilled at this idea. Well, you don't actually have to go on any of the dates. That's right. I just need a photo of a car crash. That's all I need. Well, that's not what happened to this story.

So about a week later, the identical person, exact profile. Messages Taylor. And I respond being like, dude, you have some guts or balls, like reaching back out to me to, like, try to reschedule something. And they're like, what are you talking about? Yeah.

Someone had just copy and pasted real Antoine's profile. So the first profile that Taylor was talking to was a catfish. But this Antoine is assuring Taylor that he's the real deal. Man, this is getting. This is getting too interesting for trying to date and find love in New York City. It's a little too interesting. Okay, go on. It was like, can we do a FaceTime?

And we did. And sure enough, it was the guy whose profile it actually was. So this actually has a happy ending. They've gone on a few dates and Antoine and Taylor are still talking. What? I know. In fact, the real Antoine is actually how Taylor ended up seeing this TikTok about the restaurant catfishing guy.

What? He was like, a friend just sent this to me because it was his photo in the, you know, in the post that I had shared. And he was like, a friend just shared this with me. That's crazy. How did you feel like being like, hmm, this was kind of taken out of context? And how did he feel since it was his picture? I mean, we both were like, this is nonsense.

But, like, it's amazing what can get picked up by TikTok. Like, here I am, little miss nobody. And like this video has gone viral with a lie. Wait, this poor guy. I hope it works out with Taylor. Because, like, he's now been put on blast by other Taylor, who's apparently just like telling wild stories on TikTok. Exactly.

It seems like fortunately, Taylor and Andhwan both just think that this is kind of funny and no real harm has come from it. Taylor has DMed TikTok Taylor to be like, hey, that's not what happened at all, but she has also never responded to her. What? I feel like TikTok Taylor might be the real scammer here. Forget the catfish her. TikTok Taylor is like scamming.

She's making up stories for views. This is dating misinformation. And I do wonder about TikTok Taylor's content. As I mentioned, her bio is storytelling. And a lot of the stories she does sound are pretty outrageous. Like she tells a story about when she was a roommate with a Victoria. a secret model who was like a hoarder and kept like used toilet paper in her purse, which is a pretty disgusting story.

That story also went viral. She just seems to tell a lot of outrageous stories that would be hard to prove exactly. I'm not saying for sure that she's lying because I don't know, but that seems to be her brand of storytelling. Things that kind of sound like an urban legend, right? Like something that you'd hear from a friend of a friend, but it's her speaking into the camera. using her real name, and that makes it feel a little bit more believable. Grace, how do you feel about this?

How do I feel about this? Deep sigh. Deep sigh. I feel like with this specific instance, people already feel burned out enough on online dating, so I don't think it's particularly helpful to spread. I mean, obviously it's not helpful to spread misinformation. I think particularly around online dating, dating, we don't need any more fodder to hate it. I think we're already there. And it's a necessary evil. So I would prefer people to just stick to true horror stories, which abound. You don't even have to make stuff up. Well, I think, like, the other thing that bothers me a little bit is, like, look, we all know that people do creative writing and creative storytelling experiments on the

internet, right? Like, that is a thing that happens all the time. But like, I have to say, like, I'm pretty disappointed in TikTok Taylor. Like, I feel like TikTok Taylor is trying to make the world a worse place than it actually is. There was catfishing in this case, right? Like, there was some kind of account or person who, like, stole Antoine's identity and gave Facebook Taylor a bad experience, right? That's a real bad thing that happened. But, like, generally speaking, like, if you're a person who's, like, trying to navigate this world, like, it just goes into that kind of weird media echo chamber that happens where you just, you turn into, like, an old person very quickly and you're like, oh, man, it's all a mess. It's all terrible. Everyone's awful to each other, you know? And, like, and the real Antoine and the real Taylor. actually display, you know, like humanity, right?

Like the real Antoine, it turns out, sounds like was not a bad guy. And like they've gone on some dates together. And the real Taylor gave the fake Antoine a second chance, you know, and like took him at his word. And even though that wasn't real, it seems like the real people who were actually trying to find love in the world in this story are,

treating each other and treating this experience with like open hearts. And I guess like when I hear this story, it worries like the TikTok Taylor seems like she's, she's throwing some bad vibes into the world with this storytelling. Yeah, exactly. I would agree with that. I think it's just putting more negativity in the world. And it's making people feel more skeptical and on guard of other people, but without anything useful.

Yeah, and no basis in fact. No basis in fact. It's just a made-up story. Well, Grace, thank you for debunking this story and talking to the real Taylor. And thank you for your service. You're welcome. You're welcome. All right, good luck out there.

Endless Thread is a production of WBUR in Boston. This episode was produced by me, Grace Tatter. And it was co-hosted by me, Ben Brock Johnson. Mix and sound design by Paul Vikis. The rest of our team is Amory Severson, Sumitaj, Dien, Russell, Matt Reed, Caitlin Harrop, Franie Manahan, and Emily Jankowski. And list that as a podcast about the blurred lines

between online communities and excellent dating advice. Yeah. Well, apparently, a lot of which comes from me. Just kidding. If you are a catfishing restaurant owner, or you want to give us advice on our dating profiles, or you have an unsolved mystery that you want us to tell. You can hit us up at endless thread at wbUR.org.