Epic Real Estate Investing - A Sales Technique to Close More Deals Without Sounding Pushy | Steve Trang | 1342

Episode Date: September 4, 2024

In this episode of the Epic Real Estate Investing Show, host Matt Theriault sits down with Steve  Trang, a trailblazer in real estate sales training and the mind behind the Disruptors podcast. From his early days as an engineer at Intel to becoming a powerhouse in real estate investment and sales coaching, Steve  unveils his inspiring journey and key career milestones. Tune in to discover how mentorship shaped his path, the pivotal shift from realtor to cash-flowing asset acquisition, and his dedication to empowering others through sales training. Steve  also dives into the current market trends, the effects of interest rates and elections on real estate, and his ambitious plans for scaling his training business. Don't miss this deep dive into the world of real estate success and the art of closing deals with finesse. Press play to gain insights that could transform your approach to real estate investing and sales! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This is Terio Media. Hey, strap in. It's time for the Epic Real Estate Investing Show. We'll be your guides as we navigate the housing market, the landscape of creative financing strategies, and everything you need to swap that office chair for a beach chair. If you're looking for some one-on-one help, meet us at rei-aise.com. Let's go, let's go, let's go, let's go, let's go, let's go.

Let's go. All righty, welcome to the Epic Real Estate Investing Show. I'm joined by a very special guest today, Mr. Stephen Trang. Stephen, welcome to Epic. Man, thank you for having me. I'm incredibly excited to be here. You're a legend in the game, looked up to you for some time, so it's pretty cool to be on the show. Wow.

Thanks for that. I didn't know. And I'm surprised we haven't met before. But you're doing some things over there, too. I'm a big fan of your closer of Olympics. Oh, you got to see that. Yeah. Do you still do that?

They still run it. I've been involved. I was a contestant of first year, judged the other two years. But yeah, I'm still involved in some capacity. Okay. I just let it play. I always pick up a little pointer here and there and I'm going to remember that for my next call. You can never stop learning.

I love it. Cool. So tell me a little bit about yourself. How did you get into real estate? What were you doing just before you got in? So I think like a lot of people around our age read the purple book, Rich Dad, Poor Dad. Never heard of it. No, never heard of it.

And you realize your eyes are open that there's another way besides working at W2 for the rest of your life so that you can one day retired. Right. And once that toothpaste comes out of the tube, there's no, there's no putting it back in. Yeah, it's not getting big in there. And so for me, I was an engineer. I worked at Intel and went to school, got good grades. I went to grad school, got more good grades, got a degree, master's degree, go work at Intel.

And I actually, in one of those people that enjoyed engineering and actually enjoyed graduate school. And it was really cool to learn like the latest and coolest innovations. And then you get in the real world and you work at a corporation, you don't get to do any of those things, you just sit in a cubicle and just make tiny tweaks, tiny updates to existing designs. I was bored out of my mind. I guess looking back now, right, like I could see how my shiny object syndrome that I've had my entire career was the reason why I was so dissatisfied at Intel because I didn't get to

work on anything cool. I had to just sit there and be another grunt. Grunt. Yes. In the lines. I'm familiar with the term. Yeah. Yeah.

A cubicle warrior. I was. Did you have to share a cubicle? Did you get your very own? There were a couple of instances where I had the pleasure of having a larger cubicle where I got to share with somebody else. And you know, it was funny was like I didn't ever care what anyone ever had to say to me. It's not like I'm a necessarily difficult person.

It's just like, you know, your opinion of me is not in my business. And so my Qib made was always shocked how often I had Yahoo Sports Open because I was on like paying attention to fantasy news and whatever. all day, every day at work, because I was getting work done and it was always getting, it was always quality results, but I was not there at that point for passion. I was there to collect a paycheck. Got it. What was the straw that broke the camel's back that said you had to go?

You know, they never really did anything wrong to me. I would say it was just knowing that there's another way. Again, going back to Rich I Portad, I met, as I'm buying properties to rent, I met a broker who appeared to be living a pretty good life. And I asked them, you know, what do you do? He's like, I just talk to people all day. I said, okay, well, at this point, I'm making $70,000 a year. And this guy just hangs out and just talks to people and plays golf.

And this guy's making six figures. I'm going to do that. So I said, hey, how can I learn from you? He said, go quit your job. Go get your real estate license. I'll teach everything I know. Got my real estate license two and a half weeks. Submitted my two weeks notice.

Went to go work with him full time as my mentor. Unfortunately, there were some inaccuracies. in some of his promises. And so, unfortunately, he was a great, great mentor as far as sales, but not so much as far as work ethic and business. So you started as an agent also. I started as a realtor. Yeah.

Right. So in 2007, it was a realtor. I considered 2007 up until about 2016, my lost decade. Because the Bible, the purple Bible doesn't tell you to go become a real estate agent. It tells you to go buy cash flowing assets and how we got the cash flow quadrants. Well, the shiny object syndrome got in my way here, and I got distracted from what the core focus was. And so I was a realtor. And yeah, if I had to do all over again, I would have definitely skipped the nine years of being a real estate agent, just gone straight to buying properties.

Yeah. Being a realtor, it puts you in that S quadrant. That's like the worst one to be in. Yeah. Well, in hindsight, right? I went from having one boss to about 30 because every homeowner and every buyer was my boss now. Yep. Yeah.

I remember it well. So what was the turning point then? said, hey, I got to get on the other side of the desk of this real estate thing. So along the way, I got some coaching, which took a while because I was an arrogant SOB when I started, so I didn't think I needed coaching. But eventually I got coaching. And when I got coaching, I learned about marketing and specifically how to find homeowners. And then even more specific than that was motivated homeowners. And looking for motivated homeowners, I learned how to do Google PaperClick marketing. And so this is in 2012. And do Google

paper click marketing. I need to find motivated homeowner. So I started with like find out what your home was worth and this and that. Initially as an agent, you were doing this. Yeah, for an agent, as an agent. And that those leads were trash, right? And then I saw that the leads that clicked on sell my house were different. And so I started investigating the competition on side my house. And I land on Sean Terry's webpage.

And Sean Terry's webpage is about sell my house fast, sell my house for cash, fair offer, all these things. And so what I did, which a lot of people do, was I just completely copied everything Sean Terry did. So I just copied his website. I downloaded a keyword spy, downloaded all those paper click ads, all the keywords, everything, right? And I started getting all these motivated seller leads. And as I'm talking to them, I was like, hey, and I was doing your wholesale guarantee I'll buy it. I met with these homeowners and they're like, hey, we want to sell our house for cash.

Like, no, you don't look. I'm a licensed realtor. Here's how this works. I list your house in the market. it and in 90 days, or 30 to 90 days, you can get X month. They're like, we want cash today. Like, no, you don't.

Like, I don't think, I don't think you heard me. I don't think I explained myself well. Here's what you want to do. Right. No, we want to sell our house for cash today. It's like, okay, well, we need cash today. Here's what it's going to be. And so I made a cash offer, high cash offer looking back,

but for me, a low cash offer. So I offer from 80% of market value. And I bought three of those. And I was like, okay, there's something here. I know how to find motivated homeowners. I just need to start buying houses, especially. After we bought three, we were hoteling them, we ran out of money real fast. Yeah, yeah.

And so that's when I started wholesaling. Got it. Yeah, there's a big difference between what an investor thinks a discount is and what a realtor thinks of discount is. Right? Yeah. Drastic difference. Very good. So what market are you in?

Are you in Phoenix? I'm in Phoenix. We're all the gurus live. Sean's market. Yeah. That's the place. I guess I got to go there. Yeah.

It's Tampa, Phoenix and San Diego, right? Is San Diego? I didn't know San Diego was. I know there's some gurus there, but I didn't. They were considered San Diego. Like coaches and speakers and authors and authors. Yeah, yeah. And authors, yes.

Yeah, yeah. So you mentioned golf and I see your Travis Matthew shirt. You a golfer? I am not a golfer. Oh, I'm supposed to disappoint. Oh, I tried. As a realtor, I was a golfer for my first couple years. But what we learned along the way is I, most days, most people know me to be a very even-mannered, well, normal dude,

passive, not too angry. But the golf course brings out the absolute worst in me. And I did not like the side of me that came out on the golf course. There was a, I played a Los Angeles, which is apparently one of the toughest courses in Phoenix. I had no idea. And I remember specifically one day

chipping it onto the green three times in a row. I think it was hole 15. Only to watch it roll down the other side. And after that day, yeah, it's a hill by itself. Yeah. So after that day, like on that hole, I said I am done with golf.

And I've only played twice since then. I want to say that's like 15 years ago. Got it. I played for, I don't know, the first 25 years of my life. And then I quit for the very reason that you are explaining right now. Like, it got to a point like, I'm not having any fun anymore. I quit for 20 years and I just started playing again about three or four years ago. And now I just drink more and I don't keep score.

It's a lot more fun. Yeah. I think at this stage in my life, I'm going to be. 45 in a few weeks, maybe I'll be a lot more mature than it was 15 years ago. Dude, just don't keep scoring. If you hit it too many times, pick up the ball and go to the next team. It's the best. Yeah.

Awesome. So what's your business look like today? What's going on? How's the market treating you? What's your business look like? How are you involved? I stopped focusing on real estate actually on early this year in February. So my core focus today is sales training.

And so I have been doing sales training for five years now. started in 2019. And we've got to a point now where we have so many people that ask us to help them with their sales team to close more sales. And we don't have that many homeowners calling us and begging us to buy their home. We have to spend a lot of money with systems and follows and processes to buy their houses. And it's a good business. But we've put ourselves in a really good position where we've been able to create valuable relationships and have valuable success stories and testimonials that if once I want, wants us to help them with sales training.

And the other side, it's like this battle to get them on the phone. Like, once we get them on the phone, once we're meeting face-to-face, it's a pretty good situation. But there's all this effort. So at this moment, we're really focused on a cell side, particularly. I don't know if you know Jason Medley. Of course. Yeah, he's a mentor of mine.

Paul Sparks, he's a good friend who's helped me get my head straight. And then my best friend, he's been my accountability partner since 2011. He's been pushing me to focus more. And so late last year was the first time I said, yeah, if I want to build a business that can eventually sell, it should be my only business. Got it. So it was hard. Yeah. Real hard. So are you training just real estate people or all sales?

So at this exact moment, 98% of our clients are real estate investors. They have teams. Right. So I'm predominantly training their team, their acquisition managers, lead managers, and Dispo managers. That's who I primarily work with. I would love to work with more people that are just themselves, but we have found to get the price that makes sense for us, makes sense for them. That's who we primarily work with. But in branching out, I'm looking to work with HVAC, solar, roofing, and so on. But we have not cracked that one yet because we've only been working that for a few months. Got it, got it.

It's interesting. I was talking to, I don't know, three or four days ago, I had a guy on from Sandler Sales Institute. Do you know Matt Rocco? I don't know Matt Rocco, but Sandler's fantastic. Yeah, it's the core of what I teach and it's the core of what I do. It's the only one that really, like, I feel comfortable doing without feeling like I don't pretend to be somebody. else, really. That's why I like so much. But as I was talking to him, I was like, you know, the big difference between like all the different sales trainings and sales theories and stuff out there

is that what's very different about us is we're actually not selling anything. We're buying something. And so, right, you always have to make this little switch mentally like, okay, you do that to sell something. How would I do that to buy something, right? What's the foundation of, you know, you have someone brand new into sales. And weirdly, that's, weirdly, that's a you said you're an engineer because I attract a lot of engineers into my program. I don't know why because I'm not one. But it's just probably 60, 70 percent of my students are engineers of some sort. I hear IT, IT, IT, IT all day long. Yeah. But you take someone like that who doesn't really have any sales experience, who's been in a cubicle for a long time. And what's the beginning of teaching them

to sell or to buy a house, put it that way specific? So I think the big thing, there's a few different core philosophies. I think Sandler lays down a lot of wonderful philosophies, right? So I think that's a great start. On top of that, I look at understanding the hero's journey. And what I mean by the hero's journey is that we're the guide, not the hero. So many people position themselves as the hero of the story. I think realtors are the worst defenders in this, right? We're number one. We're the biggest and so on. But we know we're the guide. Like they have a problem. Life was humming along. A life event occurred. Now they need cash. They need someone to help them get the cash out of their house. So I think looking at it as a guide, looking at it from what position of service,

and then seek to understand and that a lot of people say they're out seek to understand before being understood but I think even though it's said a lot I don't think people do a good enough job of impressing it upon how important it is one of the beliefs that we have is that every person wants to be seen,

heard and appreciated and so we go out of our way to really just hammer that point home that if you're talking to a homeowner they need to feel like you get them right Chris Voss plays a huge part in my sales training as well. And one of the things he talks about is the other person wants to be appreciated.

And so we spent a lot of effort here, whether it's labeling. He has a definition of empathy, which I think is probably like one of the coldest definitions he can have for empathy. It is. But empathy is the transmission of information. I know what's important than Matt and I can convey back to Matt exactly what he told me. and if we can create a conversation, have a conversation, where in the middle of it, at the end of it,

you feel like I understand everything that's going on your world. I've been able to convey that to you, then it doesn't matter what I suggest you do. You're probably going to go along with it because you feel like I would have your best interest at heart, which we should, right? We shouldn't do this if we don't. But that's how we were able to convey why it should go with us.

And as far as selling, like we're buying their house, But the way we preach it is we're selling certainty, peace of mind, convenience. Right. That's what we sell. It's just like when you go to the dealership and you buy a car, if you have a car, you trade it in. Well, why would you trade it in? It's because they're selling you convenience. Right?

You don't have to have a bunch of random people showing up to your house and you have to get a driver's license, make sure they're real people and so on. Yeah. That's like verbatim. We must have read the same book because. If Sandler is something that you use a lot of, I'm a very big Sandler fan. I actually did. One of my coaches was a Sandler coach.

He made a very big influence in my journey. Yeah. It really takes the ickiness out of sales. Exactly. For someone that's never sold before, I think it's just the best approach because they get to be 100% themselves. They don't have to pretend to be anything else or anybody else.

Yeah, they get to be themselves and they get to be systematic, which for your IT students. It's fantastic, right? Here's the checklist to run your appointment. Yep. Yeah, we have a nine-point framework and just check each box so it completes the whole conversation

and either you got appointment or you don't. I like it. What else? Closer Olympic. What makes a good closer after talking to so many closures and now that I know that you're a sales trainer? I would say there's two characteristics or more, but I think the first one is empathy, right?

The ability to actually see the other person. There are a lot of people that believe in Sympathy. Sympathy is wrong. Sympathy makes you feel better, but sympathy never helps somebody. Empathy is what helps them. And then assertiveness. A lot of what people think of in sales is aggressiveness. You know what, Matt, I'm not going to take no for an answer. And I think that hurts the relationship. And so I believe in assertiveness. So if you can be assertive, it can be empathetic. You can be humble and coachable, hungry? I think you got what it takes to be in sales. But I would say probably the two biggest is can you be assertive and can you be empathetic.

Yep. And those are kind of the two things that people wouldn't associate with the good salesmen. No, they think of the pushy guy, right? And the pushy guy works in car sales. Because once they drive off the lot,

is done, right? And if we had, if real estate was the moment I walked out the door, the sale is done, we don't need our techniques. You could be pushy. But if we're pushy and they don't like us,

there's no guarantee they're going to show up in closing day. There's no guarantee they're going to answer the phone when the escrow officer calls. They're not going to talk to your transaction coordinator, right? And so, I was talking earlier my mentor. He wasn't as helpful as I would like them to be, but he did share one thing with me, which is that real estate is the big league of sales and asked him what that meant. And what he said was, well, they got to be convinced today. They got to be convinced next week. And they got to stay convinced 30 days, 60 days, 90 days as long as it takes for the real estate transaction to go through. Right. But it's so important to get that contingency removal

sign. Yes. Right. Yeah, super. I always say that, hey, you can be pushy and aggressive, but you're going to need a giant marketing budget because you're going to need a lot of leads to make a living.

Yeah. So just kind of brand new out of real estate, but I imagine you still stay kind of in touch with what's going on, right? You hear it vicariously through your students. Oh, yeah. So I get the good fortune.

I'm in Collective Genius, right? I was mentioning Jason Medley a moment ago. And a lot of my clients are inside collective genius. And so, yeah, we get to hear what's happening on the front lines. We also get to hear from the business owners, what's going on with legislation, regulation, right? How is everyone pivoting? And so I have my ideas on that.

And so the one great thing about real estate is that it's constantly changing. And for me, that's one of the things I love most about it. I don't particularly care for the houses. But I love the challenges that real estate brings because what works today may not work tomorrow. And what's funny is what worked 10 years ago might work again today. Yeah. Like yellow letters. Yeah.

Yeah. Yellow letters went away. Now they're working again. So since you're connected in that fashion, what's the buzz you're hearing about the pending interest rate drops? So it's interesting, right? I don't think this is my own personal belief. An interest rate hike or drop does absolutely nothing for anybody. It's what's going to happen six months from now, nine months from now, right?

Because if you look back in June of 22, like, that was the, a rate hike that killed everything. But there were actually rate hikes before that one. It was the first one that was a strong signal. Here is what we believe to be true. And we're going to take massive action to do that. And if you have that kind of conviction one way or the other, now we've got certainty in the market and we can make some decisions. Right now, there's still so much uncertainty and that's what causes the problems, right? Because now we have sellers who think they want to believe that everything's going to be okay. But the people we sell to, to do not feel like everything's going to be okay.

So it's this disconnect of like what the seller thing is going to happen, what the buyer thing is going to happen, right? If the seller believes the market's going down, the buyer believes the market's going down, okay, we can negotiate a price that we can sell. If the seller thinks price is going up and buyers think prices going up, great. We're not too far on the disconnect. But the seller thinks the market's going to be fine because the interest rates are going down, but the buyers are like we have no certainty as to what's going on.

This is where we need a larger delta. between what we lock it up for, what we can lock it up for, and that causes major problem. So I think the rate hikes or drops that we're talking about isn't going to do anything because the thing we require is not the interest rate to drop. We need conviction and certainty from the Fed as well as the mortgage-backed securities and so on. And the public sentiment has to be there as well. Right, which is not there. It's not there.

I did some, about a year ago, I did something on how a recession impacts real estate. I did a bunch of research on recessions and the depression and everything. And it kept occurring over and over again. I think there was a study out of Harvard where it just talked about that how public sentiment has always extended recessions in the depression much longer than it had to be. Yeah. Just because it's a self-fulfilling prophecy. Where do you believe to be true will be true.

And I think the other thing, too, is not enough people talk about this is the appetite for mortgage-backed securities. It's not just the interest rates. is how much mortgage debt is the Fed willing to buy. I don't ever hear anyone talk about that. That's what affects interest rates, not the Fed rate, but the Fed's appetite for buying mortgage-backed securities. Even on the secondary market,

I'd imagine to have to be solid just because if you've tried to buy a house or refinance a house to a traditional bank in the last decade, you know how tough it has been, right? Oh, yeah. Even with the great credit score, you still got to jump through a massive amount of hoops. I mean, we just did a reply and I think we wrote 32 letters of explanation.

Really? Yeah. I was like, you've got to be kidding me. Do we have to explain that? Now we got to explain this? It's like, oh, my gosh. But I'd have to think that the mortgage-backed securities, the paper is so strong. Yeah, I think the paper is strong.

The paper is strong. What I'm talking about is like when the Fed says, okay, we're going to buy more mortgage-backed securities. Okay, this is what brings interest rates down. But if you look at like the last few years, they say, hey, we don't want to buy as much. And that's what caused the interest rates, the mortgage interest rates to go up, right? Specifically. Right. How about what's the buzz on the election?

I could tell you it's either going to be Trump or the cabal, right? And I think that's it. Cabala? No, not Cavala. She's not going to win. Right. No. She's a puppet.

So, I mean, that might sound crazy on this podcast, but I don't think she has. We like crazy here. That's good. Yeah, I don't think it's pretty incredible, right? that a positionless politician could be popular. It's pretty remarkable, right? Like, she's actually, you know, we're talking about a hero's journey a moment ago. One of the most important caveats of the hero's journey is like the person doesn't have too

many traits because if they have too many traits, it doesn't feel real. Right. Like if we're talking about, let's say, for example, Luke Skywalker, right? And we say he also happens to be a Los Angeles Lakers fan. Well, if you're not a Lakers fan, now you kind of get disconnected from this character. Right. So you don't want too many details on the guy. You just want enough for it to be a believable story.

And Kamel's figured that out. She has no position. So you can't be offended by her because you don't know what she stands for. Yeah. I think the most remarkable thing is it was pretty much bipartisan agreement eight weeks ago that she was the worst vice president ever. Yeah. Right?

We forgot all about that now. At least 50% of the country did. The power of propaganda can, when we do a case study on this in 20 years from now, I was like, how do we control an entire population? This will be the case study. Yeah. And what's remarkable is that we just went through that study, like with the pandemic. Right.

And a lot of people. Did we? People still have no idea that that was all a farce, basically. I think they've forgotten that lesson. No, and they're all right back signing up for the next one. I just did a video on the unrealized capital gains tax proposal. Oh, my God. And it's the most comments I've ever had on a video ever.

And I was like, we just went through 19 different things that were considered conspiracies, but turned out to be true. And now you think, no, but this one's different. This is the conspiracy. You know what I mean? I don't think there's going to be anything more catastrophic. And there's a lot of bad things, right? But I don't think there could be anything more catastrophic.

And there's no way that it passes. But the fact, like, that is even in the topic of conversation tells you how unsurious these people are. Yeah, they're not looking to find serious solutions. They're strictly throwing out red meat so that someone will vote for them. It's just a diversion. to get us talking about it and take our eye off the ball. Yeah. Well, it's working.

Yeah, totally. I'm talking about it for sure. When they say unrealized capital gains, okay, how are you going to treat unrealized capital losses? A refund checks coming out, you know what I mean? There'll be a lot of banking involved. Yeah, a lot of banking involved. Yeah, they couldn't. My wife hasn't got her tax refund from two years ago yet. Wow. Yeah, but they're knocking on our door and pay us for the next year.

You know what I mean? But you still owe us money from the last year. And interest. And interest, of course. No, we didn't get an interest, though. No, we don't get interest, but if you owe them. Yeah, yeah. But if you owe them, there's automatically interest added to it.

Cool. So you got the Disruptors podcast, right? It is a podcast yet? Yes. Yes. Okay. You've interviewed a lot of people. I was just looking at it on YouTube.

What do you say are the three most valuable things you've learned from your guests? Three most valuable things. Man, that's a fantastic question. I would say, I would say the traits that I've seen are that they have tremendous grit. they can't fail, that they're all mentored. So they have a coach, and then that they've all experienced massive failure. There's only one person on the podcast ever that had never experienced failure in his life. I said, what the hell is going on here?

How you know, he's like, nope, grew up in a nice house, married parents, rich parents, never had any such jobs. I was like, really? Okay. Like only one, right? Out of over 300. And so we've all faced a degree of adversity and overcome it. So I would say those are things I've seen from them. Things I've learned,

ah, man, I'm not doing a really good job. I answered that question, but I can tell you another thing that I learned from the podcast, not necessarily from the guest, is that it opens incredible doors. I did not expect the doors to open that I had. And it gave me an undue amount of credibility and authority that I did not know I was going to get.

But what I've learned from the guests, I'm sorry, I'm drawn a blank at the moment. That's all right. That's good. The massive failure thing, I was kind of that guy that didn't experience failure until about 34. And Napster came out and turned the whole music industry upside down. And I was like, oops. Now I have to learn how to do something because I had made music.

What were you doing? I was in the music business for my whole life. And so I got my first paying gig when I was a DJ. I was 17 years old and did a track for Rodney O and Joe Cooley. And got a thousand bucks for that at 17 years old back in 1986. Nice. Six. That was like, wow.

That was a payday. That was a big payday. To do something that I was doing for free in my bedroom anyway. And then just escalated up from there. And I got a huge distribution deal with EMI and was just living the life. And I have to watch what I say now because my lifelong ambition was always to be P. Diddy. But then he hasn't had a very good year. So I have to like kind of change my story now.

Did he like? Yeah. When the whole digital download came along and closed all the music stores down and no one was buying compact discs anymore. Yeah. They're not even buying downloads anymore. So now you don't even do that. Like, you're just streaming and that's it. But yeah, that's a good one. And I've risen and fallen and risen and I've fallen a couple times since then.

But thank goodness we're back up. So what's in your future right now, Steve, that you're most excited about? What I'm most excited about is the training thing. So, you know, we're trying to figure out how to grow the organization because we're trying to build something that we can sell. And that presents a new set of challenges. I've been looking for motivated homeowners for the longest time. Now we've got to find maybe not motivated, but business owners that see value in investing their team.

So that's a great challenge today. And we're going to find masterminds to join. We're going to go to events. I have season tickets to the Suns. And I just had this epiphany yesterday. I don't know why it took so long. I was like, hey, everyone who I'm trying to win their business, I should just invite them to go watch the Suns game with me. It was such an obvious thing, you know?

I didn't think about it until yesterday. Yeah. How are your seats? Row 14, so it's not as close as I would like it to be, but at the same time, 10 years ago, I never would have dreamed it possible. Right. So I got to look back and appreciate.

For sure. You'll get there. You'll get there. Yeah. Well, super. Steve, if someone wanted to get in touch with you, what would be the best way for them to do that? The best way you can find us on YouTube, iTunes, Spotify,

it's a disruptors podcast. Matt's going to be there sometime in the near future. Hopefully, they'll bless us by coming down to Phoenix. And then we have closemarsels.com. That's where you can find our book. Oh, and Instagram at Steve.trang. We post content there. I'm pretty sure every day.

If you made it this far and I haven't offended you by my political beliefs, you enjoy the channel. If I've offended you, you might not want to go there. All right, very good. Well, I'm easily offended by people that are easily offended. So I don't think perfect. I don't think they listen to this show anymore. But anyway, it's been a pleasure, Steve.

Looking forward to meet you in person. Glad we finally got to connect. And let's stay in touch. All right. Thanks, Matt. Take care. And that wraps up the epic show. If you found this episode valuable, who else do you know that might too?

There's a really good chance you know someone else who would. And when their name comes to mind, please share it with them. And ask them to click the subscribe button when they get here and I'll take great care of them. God loves you and so do I. Health, peace, blessings, and success to you. I'm Matt Terrio. Living the dream. Yeah, yeah, we got the cash flow.

You didn't know home for us. We got the cash flow. This podcast is a part of the C-suite Radio Network. For more top business podcasts, visit C-Slee. c-sweetradio.com