Epic Real Estate Investing - How to Invest in Real Estate WithOUT Quitting Your Day Job - with Dr. Borer | 847

Episode Date: November 25, 2019

This Monday, Matt is joined with Robert Borer, a chiropractor and a successful real estate investor through the REI Ace program. He shares the simple lesson that led him to a breakthrough within 30 days, how he goes about balancing real estate and his clinic (with great success), the very first "reward" he bought with his money earned from investing, and much more! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This is Terrio Media. Success in real estate has nothing to do with shiny objects. It has everything to do with mastering the basics. The three pillars of real estate investing. Attract, convert, exit. Matt Terrio has been helping real estate investors do just that for more than a decade now. If you want to make money in real estate, keep listening. If you want it faster, visit

R-E-I-A-A-S-com. Here's Matt. Yeah, hello, and welcome to epic real estate investing. This is the show where I share the strategy tips and tricks and insights of mine and my guest to reaching financial independence through real estate. And although this has all of the signs and the feelings of being a real estate show, it's really a money show disguised as a real estate show, meaning the real secret to financial independence. And I think that's what we all really want. The real secret to that and attaining

that is creating streams of cash, streams of income. You know, we're all taught to work for 40 to 50 years to create a pile of cash so that it will eventually reach heights someday to where it will create a stream of cash for you. I mean, that's the ultimate goal. Even regardless of which approach you take to it, the goal is to create the stream of cash that's going to support you with or without you working. So the stats show that that plan, building the pile of cash to create the stream of cash, isn't going to work for 95% of you. And the 5% that do make it did it by giving priority to their streams of income over those

piles of income. It's just a little shift in mindset, of which the stream then created the pile. So just rather than focusing on the pile to create the stream, you focus on the stream and let the stream once you've got an excess of what you need to live on, you let that excess then build the pile. And of those 5% that went in that direction, 74% of them either made it or preserve it with real estate. And all that to say is,

I don't care where your streams of income come from. There are many ways to create them. But we discuss real estate on this show because it's how the majority, that 74% of those that succeeded, that's how they did it through real estate. I mean, it really presents your best odds of getting it done. And your best odds by far. It's where the possibility is for you.

And if you put in the work that we've been discussing here on the show for the last eight years, that possibility turns into probability. You know, my dad, he never figured that out. But I did, though, by the grace of God and some good mentors and just some right decisions, I did figure it out. And I'm building much of what I'm building so that my son has a blueprint. So this is all documented for him, with all the necessary help that he needs to make financial independence happen for himself. And I want you to have that option for yourself as well.

I mean, it's the final frontier where the average person has a legitimate shot at creating epic wealth. All righty. So if you're picking up what I'm putting down, I want you to do. to join me at the next epic intensive and will create your own custom rat race escape plan. We'll work side by side to get it done just for you. And speaking of the intensive, this past event that we held, Josh Miller joined me on stage to share his story over the last 12 months. And it's pretty miraculous.

I mean, that miracle might be too strong of a word for it. It's just a testament what focused energy on the right activities will do. and in the audience while Josh was with me on stage sharing, there were three people that were sitting next to Josh the year prior at the intensive where Josh decided to join the RIAEAS program. So there are three people in the audience watching Josh up on stage and they were both sitting side by side at one point in time. And I don't know exactly what they were thinking,

but I can imagine it was something along the lines of, wow, Josh took action and look where he is right now. We were starting from the same place one year ago, and he's on stage sharing his success, and I'm sitting here in the audience again, and I'm watching. And, you know, that wasn't planned. I don't think I could have planned it.

And I'm only sharing it with you because two of those three people brought it to my attention at the end of the intensive. Anyway, I've had Josh here on the show a couple times before, so today isn't about him. It's actually about someone else, that was at that same first intensive that Josh was. And I invited him on to share his experience over that same period of time.

So please help me welcome to the show, Dr. Robert Borer. Robert, welcome to Epic Real Estate Investing. Hey, man, that's great to be here. Yeah, no, isn't it? What's so great about it? Yeah, no, it's awesome, man. I mean, it's been a great journey, you know? I mean, I didn't really think I, you know, would be as far as long as I am right now.

So it's fantastic, and I owe it to this process that you're walking me through. Sweet, sweet. Thank you for that. And thanks for just doing the work because, I mean, you're just a great example of demonstrating, you know, if you do the work, you do the right activities, do them consistently, you get the results. There's really no magic about it. And like I said, you've just been a great testimony to that. So I talked a little bit and introduced, shared with everybody a little bit about you before we started talking here. But can you just kind of, I don't know, tell me what were you doing just before, you?

you found us here at Epic. Yeah, perfect, perfect. Well, you know, I've been kind of dabbling in real estate over the years. I was probably most intently into it prior to the 08 crash, and that really kind of made things go off the rails. And all along, I've, you know, I've had a day job as a chiropractor, so I've, you know, been really enjoying helping people and working on their backs. So that's my day job, but really...

Work on their backs. You're a chiropractor. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So, you know, so what's nice about being a chiropractors, it gives me a little flexibility to add something like real estate investing. So I can kind of mold my office hours around, you know, creating the time to get out and see those properties that I contact for those distressed

sellers. And, you know, you know, have a little bit of flexibility to get out. out and see something right on the spur of the moment. But, um, but yeah, I mean, basically before I met you, um, I was just doing chiropractic full time. Um, my whole real estate kind of investing, um, process had kind of gone off the tracks and the 08 crash. And, uh, I thought about, you know, wanting, you know, I'd really had a hunger to get back into it. So, um, I can't quite remember exactly how we met. I know we met it in intensive. And I'm trying to remember how I got your name for the first time. I probably was listening to your podcast.

I listened to maybe a dozen or so podcasts right now. And, you know, I started just getting my kind of confidence and my understanding of what to do. And I knew I needed some coaching. And I think that's pretty much where we connected. Got it, got it. So maybe you just kind of answered that. But what were you really looking to achieve or what problem were you facing at that moment? Well, really systems, forms, definitely some handholding.

You know, just making sure I wasn't going to do it wrong like I did last time, you know. You've really kind of wrapped my head around having the right investing strategy and mindset, investing for cash flow, not cash chunks or cash, you know, big, you know, big amounts of cash versus the streams of cash. Just getting that streams of cash going. Yeah. So that's really been my focus. That's my target right now. That's my goal.

I am wholesaling to fund my purchases. of buy and hold. So that's kind of my strategy is to do some wholesaling, um, stockpile enough money to buy, buy and hold and then, um, you know,

pull the trigger on that and actually keep, I keep properties that I wholesale. Got it. Perfect. So at that moment, I mean, what is it? What installing the systems and getting some handholding,

you know, what was, what did you see for your future if you didn't get that assistance or didn't get that help? Well, I knew, I know I'd be making lots of mistakes. and expensive mistakes.

And it's kind of fun how you've shared some of your expensive mistakes. And I appreciate that. You saved me a lot of money by sharing some of those. And, you know, that's it is, you know, in real estate investing, I think you can make some pretty big oopses by just not knowing some real simple details, some strategies, some ways to, you know, mitigate risk. And just to kind of know what you're doing, you know, I mean, going into it, knowing how to analyze a deal, you know, right now,

and kind of analyze a deal like in less than 30 seconds, you know, and know whether I should even keep talking in the seller or not, or just say, listen, this is a, you know, pull the rip court, I'm out of here because this just doesn't even make sense. You know, you see, just need some good, you know, framework to know, okay, am I going into something that I'm going to make money in, or is this just a dead end? And I just need to just get out of here as fast as possible.

Got it. So quick decisions, the ability to make quick decisions. What three parts of the REI-ACE system have had the biggest impact for you. Wow, man. I didn't know there's going to be a quiz here. So, you know, it's funny, like when, you know, how you classify things and how I kind of remember things.

So I don't even know if I maybe I'm going to say these things right as far as your systems. But, yeah, there's no right. There's no wrong answers to these questions. So, yeah, exactly. Right. I mean, you know, there's a lot of, you know, a lot, you learn a lot through you. And, you know, you're always learning. I'm always listening to your podcast.

So, so, I mean, you. if you were to say what's my biggest thing that I'm maybe focused on or maybe I use that I've learned from you would certainly be the analysis. So, you know, how to break down a deal, how to figure out the, you know, cash on cash return, how to figure out if it's going to make money for me and my investors that I turn around and wholesale it to. Absolutely, you know, your REI solutions, dashboard and technology that you use. that you provide for your clients is invaluable because it merges everything as far as CRM, the analysis, the, you know, creating the three-letter option of it, you know, intent. That's just, yeah, so that, I mean, so, you know, analyzing and then presenting the offer with that three-letter option is super key because many people love that, that three-letter, you know, option,

you know, they say, oh, well, you know, can I get more? I'm like, well, yeah, but, you know, we'll have to be. to talk about terms, you know, and that means, you know, interest, a balloon or payments over time, you know, and people are, you know, you explain to them and it makes sense. It's like, well, you know, it's like having a tenant but no toilets, you know, I mean, I'm paying you every month. What's wrong? What's not to like about that? So some people just love that. Right, right. Super. So, I don't know, I guess at this moment, I guess we've been, I've been trying to get you on the phone for a while and our schedules have conflicted a little bit, but I think we're hitting right about

the one-year anniversary, right? Right? Yeah, yeah. We're going to meet an indie here for the intensive. Yeah, I'm looking for it. That's right. That's right. That's going to be great. I guess in the first two or three months, you'd call me, you're a little puzzle, a little confused, and I wouldn't say panic, but you were like, this isn't working. And then the next time we talked, I was like, you've got to do the right activities, Robert. You got to do it consistently, just push through and just trust the process. We're Philadelphia themed right now, right, with the 76ers. Trust the process. But really, that's kind of what it is. you know, the next time I talk to you, maybe 30 days later, I mean, you had three deals under contracting. You're like, this is great. I love this. And, you know, the whole future you had before you. I don't know, tell me what was the shift there? Yeah, good one. I would really just say persistence, you know, just not letting obstacles get in your way, not letting, you know, little, you know, setbacks discourage you. You know, I guess that's just kind of my DNA. So that kind of comes naturally to me. It's just kind of maybe being a little

stubborn, maybe being all thick-headed, but say, listen, I'm going to make this work. That sticituativeness, you know, I think is what it was. It's just like, listen, I trust Matt. He knows, I just, just in my gut, in my heart, I know he knows what he's talking about. I know, you know, I just know he knows his stuff. So I'm just going to just follow it, just whatever, just maybe not blindly, but just stubbornly. And, you know, and then it just started clicking. You know, then, you know, just, then I started to prove it to myself, you know, then I started to prove it to myself, You know, then I started to see the success and started to see the fruits of the labor. And then it's just, you know, then it just becomes fun.

Right. So we had about 90 days of figuring it out, putting it all together. And then you had this breakthrough. So we're about, I guess, nine months in when you really hit your stride. So what have you accomplished in the last nine months? Yeah, really good. You know, some of these things, you know, do take longer than you expect. Like, I'm still waiting to close on a couple deals.

that I started like months ago. And it's just, you know, whatever. You just don't get discouraged by that. You know, tenants are sometimes not cooperative. You know, inspections don't go the way you think they're going to. And now you've got to do a little due diligence kind of cleanup work. So what have I done? Let me think.

I've gone through a number of closings. And it's been very fun to post those, you know, closing check pictures. That's been lots of fun. Posted some of that to Facebook on your site. So those are great fun. I haven't posted all of them actually, but I don't want to, you know, whatever, get too. Yeah, you don't want to brag.

Too far away. Yeah, but anyway, so that's tons of fun. So, you know, there's lots in the pipeline like right now. I'm going to go look at two properties this Saturday. So it's constant, right? You're always sending out mail. I'm sending out mail every week. I'm talking to people almost

every other day on the phone. You know, I get tons of incoming calls. All right. And you're still working your chiropractic business full-time. Exactly, exactly. And that's kind of the goal and the objective is to kind of dial that down a little bit. You know, as I, you know, I'm not an old man yet, but, you know, as the years start piling on, I want to not have to use my body quite so physically and just kind of use it more, kind of use my brain a little bit more by doing the whole real estate direction. And so I'm going to kind of transition more from being full-time in the office to be

more full-time out kind of boots on the ground work in my real estate. So that's kind of the transition probably the next 10 years is going to be, you know, it going from full-time car project to probably full-time real estate. Got it. Okay. So of those half-dozen deals, how many, what's the ratio of flipping to holding? Let's see. I am holding one and I flipped the other five. Okay.

Just because they weren't good fits for your portfolio or is there another reason? Cash flow probably more than anything. like the one, am I even doing a little hard money on to wrap it up? I'm needing like 40K to go to close to keep it. So, you know, it's just a matter of being still, like you're saying, kind of in my, you know, training wheel stage. I'm still getting, you know, my cash flow built up. I'm still getting my cash flow kind of established.

Once I kind of get that all clicking, you know, things will get a lot easier because then, you know, things start accumulating, things start compounding. You start having that money to hold that problem. property, whereas right now I don't. Right now I'm still, you know, cash flow is still a little tight. I can't say I can just keep everyone that I get. So I'm definitely wholesaling more right now just to build up the reserves. Okay, perfect. Now that you're managing your, there's a lot of people that are listening right now. They're very interested because they

have a day job or they have a career and they aspire to do very much what you're talking about and what you've done so far. What does your your day-to-day act? look like and I would say how many hours a week are you actually spending on your real estate portion of your business? Yeah, got it. So anybody listening? It's really doable. I mean, if your self-employed, it's super doable. You know, if you've got your own business that you run and you kind of make your own hours, it's, I mean, 100% doable. Because, I mean, you can really modify it to really fit around the real estate. Now, you're working for, you know, the IBM kind of corporate job and, you know, you got to be there at the 9 to 5. A little tougher, but, you know, you can

still make all your phone calls during lunch and after work. I don't know what patients are listening right now, but I'm in the office. Always. When I'm with you, I'm 100% there, all right? But, you know, there's lots of time in between patients. I'm checking my voicemails. I'm checking my incoming messages. I'm even returning calls in between patients sometimes.

I mean, something's really hot. I want to make that call now. You can hear, you can actually hear it in the seller's voice. you're like, okay, this is a motivated seller. You know, like, this needs to be, like, addressed immediately. So, so how much time? Let me think. So almost every day I'm on my, you know, R-EI solutions checking, okay, what's come in,

what's not come in, how many web forms have been filled out, what do I need to respond to? And then, you know, you look at it, you kind of vet it before you can call the guy back, right? You kind of say, is this a, you know, is this even something I want to call back on? So I don't know, that actually takes up quite a bit of time. So I'm thinking at least probably an hour a day, maybe two hours. At a minimum, probably I'm doing either deal analysis, returning phone calls, vetting deals, just kind of checking, you know, managing my contact list, like, you know, updating my contact list as I get a, as I get a buyer, you know, interested in one of my properties, I throw them onto my buyer's list.

So there's lots of kind of admin kind of stuff I can do during the day. weekends, evenings, I look at properties. So I do a lot of my due diligence and walking properties, you know, taking pictures, doing them walk-through videos. And it's also sweet. I want to tell you, I hooked up with this contractor. I actually sold one of my properties to this contractor who's also an investor. And he does all my due diligence with me now.

It's freaking phenomenal. So I just come up, I say, dude, we're going to go look at this property. He's like, I'm there. And he's like, this guy's been done rehab on REOs, like 20 years. I mean, he said he's done rehabs on, you know, burnt out, gutted, you know, worst, you know, rehab job you've ever seen in your life. So he knows what he's talking about. So now I, now I had this like in my back pocket, this like due diligence like dynamo. And like, so I walk my properties with this dude now. And he's like, okay, this is wrong,

this is wrong. This is wrong. And it's amazing. So I've got contracts signed very on the spot with this guy just like just tearing, tearing these sellers. you know, properties to pieces verbally. You know, it's like, listen, you know, he's like, oh, you know, oh, so, you know, I see this over here. I'm like, I never would have seen that. So anyway, so I'm going on about this dude, but it was awesome. So you'll meet.

So the moral of the stories, you'll meet really cool people like I know you have who will kind of you'll bring into your team and you'll make part of your whole system. Like, so now this guy, this is my contract. He's part of my team here locally in Detroit. I've got a great title company, like me and my title crew are just tight and they're awesome. You found that just by doing the amount of activity that you're doing, even if like opportunity or deals don't come directly from the activity that you're doing, but by being active indirectly, a bunch of stuff starts to happen.

You notice that? Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I mean, you just keep talking to people. Like I even met an investor. I met another buyer who wanted to buy one of my properties, but it wasn't quite the right mix, maybe ROI for him. But we had lunch, and turns out he becomes a silent investor. He wants to fund my marketing now because he wants first ride refusal for some of my deals.

I'm like, no problem. I'll run them by you first, you know, if you're giving me X,000 a month for marketing. So, you know, that was another cool deal I ran across. So you'll run across really fun stuff. was just like I just wanted to actually find out what my buyer's buying criteria was. You know, I just I say, hey, let's have lunch. I want to figure out what your buying criteria is and, you know, whatever. And then he suddenly he's saying like, listen, what if I gave you money every month to do marketing?

Could I get first writer refusal? I'm like, I've got absolutely. And we even set it up where I don't have to give them every deal because, you know, I want to keep some deals too. So I said, well, so I'll just show you some of the deals. He says, yeah, that's good. I'm like, okay, we're good. You know, so that was a really fun deal too. Yeah.

Super. So I don't know. I mean, almost every weekend I'm looking at properties. Almost every night I'm doing deal analysis, talking to sellers, talking to buyers. So I don't know. It's not overwhelming. It's kind of fun to me. You know, I don't know.

I haven't added the hours up, but I don't know what, two hours a night plus maybe six hours in the weekend total. What is that? I don't know. That's like 20 hours a week or something like that maybe. Okay. But it's not really work. Yeah. It seems like you enjoy it.

Yeah, it's fun. No, it's fun. Every deal you walk into it's like different. It's like weird. You know, it's like it's also kind of like a treasure hunt, you know, like what's going to find, you know? You know, what's what's behind this door? Oh, that's interesting. Oh, so you've had pit bulls in here.

Oh, okay, that's interesting. Hilarious. All right. So now that you've incorporated real estate and you've got some consistent results going on, it's, I mean, it is your side hustle now with your chiropractic profession. How has it impacted you personally? Well, it's been great. It's really been great.

I mean, it's a great confidence booster. I'll tell you what, you know. I mean, you know, everyone thinks doctors are, you know, just, you know, sitting on their yacht on weekends and on the golf course, you know, and live in large. You know, whatever. Self-employment is also a big hustle. I mean, it's, you know, you're trying to promote your business and keep your business profit margins there.

And, you know, it's stressful, right? And as any business owner, they'll say, yeah, there's stress. Not that it's not rewarding and fun. So it's decreasing my stress tremendously. I actually like buy things now. I mean, it's amazing. I'm like, oh, I want to buy that. And I buy it, you know?

It's like, no, I don't like, oh, my God, how am I ever going to afford that? Oh, my God, I got to save six months to buy that. Now, now I just buy it, you know. So it's kind of fun. It's like that's, I give myself some rewards. Every time I close, I decide to buy something. I have a list. I made myself a rewards list.

So I say, okay, every time I close, I'm buying something. That's kind of nice. It's not just like a pack of bubble gum. You know, it's like, you know. Sure. And I ask what was the first thing on that list? What was the first thing? I bought a series of display cubes for all of my signed memorabilia, my basketballs,

and my footballs, from all of the sports figures who I've been. um you know slowly uh trying to get signatures from over the years and they were all just kind of sitting in bags and just horrible and i said oh man i want to have some nice display cases for that and you know on each of those costs like you know whatever a hundred bucks to have a nice display case so i just bought a whole series of display cases for all my memorabilia so that was really fun yeah sweet uh finished a sentence for me i almost didn't join the ria ace program because wow good one good one um because I almost couldn't creatively work out how to make the finances work.

We did something really fun. I don't know if you remember. We did something really fun that I don't even know if we should go into all these gory details or not. But anyways, we figured out how to find the money and how to pay for it. And I knew it was something I had to do. I knew I knew I needed the coaching. I knew I needed just that little boost to just get over the hump.

Like right now, I think I'm like, I'm just cruising with great momentum. and, you know, I'm going to stick with you just because, you know, I just like that interaction, like the coaching. I like you personally. You're a cool dude. You're a good guy to hang out with. And it's just a fun program you run. So I'm sticking with you.

What else? But I knew I needed to kind of get over, get that little, you know, I had to get over the hump, but I had to get there. I think I'm there. I think I'm, you know, set on Easy Street yet. But I'm definitely rolling. So I want to keep that going. Yeah, I'm just glad I somehow feel.

figured out the money. And you helped me with that and your team helped me with that. And it all worked out great. Super. Super. So, uh, last question here. Maybe it's the last. Maybe there, maybe I got two more. Um, my favorite part of working with Epic is. Wow. I don't know. I just, I just kind of like everything. I mean, you know, I like hanging out with you. I like interacting with you. I like your coaching style. I think your whole team's great, you know, from William, your techie dude who's behind the scenes making sure all the computer stuff is working. Um, you He's constantly coming up with stuff to make my life easier and make my kind of process run smoother. And, you know, all your clients' processes run smoother.

You know, your intentsives are cool. You know, I learn every time I go. I can't wait to get out to Indy here real soon. You know, you just make the whole process enjoyable. You make the whole process fun and interesting and just keep making me want to keep learning and keep moving forward. Sweet, sweet. So who would you recommend this program to? to and why? Because it's not a good fit for everybody. So who would you recommend it to?

You know, that's a good question. I guess I'm not, you know, super good at maybe figuring, fitting that out, you know, it was a good fit for me. I think anybody that is willing to put in some work and willing to apply themselves and really take the coaching. And, you know, I've, I've gone through many business coaches throughout my career, both for chiropractic and other businesses. And, you know, this was no different. I said, I know I need. coaching on this. I know I need, you know, somebody to guide me and, you know, speed up my learning curve. And that's the way I look at it. It's just speeding up your learning curve. So, I mean, somebody, I mean, you could probably piece this together painfully through podcasts and online

websites. You don't quite know who to trust and, you know, what's valid and what's going to work and what's not. So I really wanted to, you know, I wanted somebody that knew what they're talking about, has done there, been there, been successful at it. So I don't know. I guess anybody listening that just needs to know you're the real deal. You're a straight shooter. You know, you've been very fair with me. You've been very forthcoming with knowledge. There's nothing sneaky or tricky about anything you're presenting.

You know, I don't know, I've stepped my foot into lots of bear traps where, you know, it's like, wow, how am I going to get out of this contract, you know? So I've been in a number of those. Years is definitely not one of those. You know, I've enjoyed every minute of it. I have never even contemplated wanting to get out of my contract with you. In fact, I'm just figuring out how to re-up with you. So, I don't know. I mean, I think people should not be afraid of engaging with you.

They shouldn't be thinking it, you know, it's too good to be true or, you know, what's the catch? You know, I think you just need to throw all that out the window. I've really enjoyed it, and it's been nothing but beneficial to me. Awesome. Well, thanks, Rob. I appreciate that. And it's been actually very much a pleasure working with you. You really kind of fit the mold of my favorite type of people to work with.

I like people that can throw the cynicism and the skepticism aside, understand the value of, you know, speeding up that learning curve. But they're also at the same time, they know it's not all going to be done for them that they have to do the work themselves. And, you know, I think you and I, we've complimented each other really well, you know, that you've got the results you're looking for and you're on track to get even more. And you've made me look good too. It's a win-win. Yeah, it's a win-win. Definitely a win-win. No question.

So perfect. Cool. All right. Well, I'll let you go. I got to run. And we'll talk soon, okay? All right, man. My pleasure.

Take care of Rob. All right. Bye-bye. Yeah, yeah, we got the cash flow. Huh. Yeah, yeah, we got the cash flow. Yeah, yeah, we got the cash flow. You didn't know home for us.

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