Epic Real Estate Investing - Zero to 10 Deals Per Month with Tom Roisum | Episode 215

Episode Date: August 1, 2016

Today Matt is chatting with physician turned full-time real estate investor, Dr. Tom Roisum.  Tom is sharing his most successful tactics and resources he has used to build his business from the ground up – including what his lead generation looks like, how he trains his virtual assistants, and more.  Enjoy! ------- The free course is new and improved!  To access to the two fastest and easiest strategies to a paycheck in real estate, go to FreeRealEstateInvestingCourse.com or text “FreeCourse” to 55678. What interests you most? E.ducation P.roperties I.ncome C.oaching Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This is Terrio Media. Broadcasting from Terrio Studios in Glendale, California, it's time for Epic Real Estate Investing with Matt Terrio. Uh-huh. Yeah. What's up? Hello. And welcome to Epic Real Estate Investing, the place where I show people how to escape the rat race using real estate. Just got to shift your focus from making piles of money to making streams of money, change that one thing just one time.

and you are on your way to financial freedom. It's not the most exciting path. It's rather dull and boring. I'm warning you. But it is the fastest, and that there's a promise. Once you get there, life then becomes exciting. And speaking of exciting, tickets are selling fast for the epic intensive. Great response.

That's September 22nd through the 23rd. And we're going to go ahead. We're going to be shutting down the super early bird pricing at the end of this week. I believe that's Sunday, August 7th. So to take advantage of the 95% discount. out and get all of the details. You can go do that at epicintensive.com. Spent quite a bit of time on that, on the intensive last week. So I'll spare you that for this week, just so if you want to be there, listen to last week or go get your ticket. You can read

all about it. Epicintensive.com. And I'll just leave it there for now. All righty. So this week, I had a phone call with an old coaching client. But it was, it's, and that happens regularly. but what was made this conversation really, you know, storyworthy was that this particular client, he signed up for my coaching probably almost two years ago, I would say. And we had a bit of a slow start. He had brought on a partner who was a little skeptical. He's in the medical field. My client was in the medical field.

He brought out his partner because he needed his sweat equity, I guess. So he needed someone to like kind of run the day-to-day operations because he, he was still in his medical practice. So he brought on his partner. And after a few phone calls and very, very little progress, they decided they wanted to hop on a plane and fly to Los Angeles to, you know, come meet with me here in my office, see how our operation runs. And then we'd go over their business and find out where they're stuck and unstick them. And we spent probably, I don't know, probably three quarters of the day together here in the office. We were whiteboarding.

We're planning. We were mapping out their business. And, you know, we came up with a really nice comprehensive plan. And, you know, we looked at what they were doing. We kept doing more of the stuff that was working. We tweaked a few things, added this, added that. And by the end of the day, they walked out of the office, very pleased with big smiles on their face. And I was feeling like we, you know, we covered, you know, kind of just, I think all they really needed was just assurance of what they were doing was the accurate thing to do.

And they just need to do more of it. So they walked out of here very pleased and with what we'd come up with. And I never heard from them again. and I sent them a few texts here and there. I sent a couple emails, left a voicemail or two, and no response. And I was like, hmm, I wonder what's going on with them. And I've always thought about them. And then Mercedes, she just recently told me that we had a new supplier of properties in St. Louis.

And she said, they were your coaching client. And they were very grateful that they had signed up to coach with you because, you know, they owed their whole business to you and that's when it really, you know, took off as after they met with you. And now they're wholesaling 10 to 15 deals a month. And she said, do you remember Tom Roism? And I was like, sure, I do. I think about them all the time.

And I, you know, I want what happened to those guys? So, you know, sometimes coaching clients, they just drop off the face of the earth and I never know what happened. And I kind of thought they would probably just end up in that group and I would never know, which, you know, I guess they do follow in that group, but I did learn to discover or I discovered what they did do, but little did I know that after that meeting, that specific meeting, they got everything that they needed and they just took the ball and ran with it. And they were just persistent and they stuck to it.

And, you know, 10 to 15 deals a month now when they hadn't done one before that meeting, at least not the wholesaling transaction that they're doing right now. So what they did is they scheduled a call with me because I wanted to get brought up to speed to see what they were doing and how it all came about. And so I could share that with you. And I recorded the conversation and I thought I'd just play it for you. It's not the best recording, but it's certainly discernible. You'll be able to make everything out.

So forgive the recording. It just didn't come. I don't know what. I had a button tweaked or something here, but the interview was just too good. So I'm going to play it for you anyway. All right. So please help me welcome to the show, Mr. Tom Roizum. Tom, welcome to Epic Real Estate Investing.

Well, thanks for having me. You bet, you bet. And I was quite surprised. I mean, there's a little bit of a backstory here. You know, I think we started working together a couple years ago, but our work together wasn't a whole lot. So I'm really interested to see how you've come such a long way with such minimal interaction.

I know we had a couple phone calls, and some of those were a little bit discouraging in the beginning or a little bit confusing. And then you brought your team here to the office, and we spent, I don't know, probably half a day to three quarters of a day together. Yeah. And then it seemed like you guys kind of walked out of here when we're very grateful for that meeting and had everything you wanted and needed. And I don't think we've spoken since, if I'm incorrect. Is that accurate?

That's probably right. We might have talked a little bit after that. I think you may have talked a couple of times for a short period of time after that. Not a whole lot of conversation. I think we're just kind of getting our ducks in a row. And I think a lot of that conversation or that meeting that we had just kind of reassured us what we were doing was what we needed to do. just start doing more of it. Perfect.

Perfect. And here we are almost a little over a year later, I guess. And to my surprise, I hear that we're actually, I think we're in the process or about to be in the process of buying properties from you. Yeah, yeah. You guys are looking at a few of our properties. That's right. That's fantastic. Okay.

So I want to know everything that happened in between. So let's just kind of start from that day that, well, first of all, start with your background. And what was it about real estate that inspired you to take action here? Yeah, that's a really good question. I don't remember, I don't know if you remember my background, but I'm a physician. My specialty is pathology. I do remember. Yep.

Back in 08, you know, kind of around the time of the whole bubble bursting in real estate, and my 401K, you know, kind of about half of it went away. I started thinking, you know, I'd really like to take a little more control over my investments. So I just started reading about real estate. and you know as you start reading that kind of stuff you run across rich dad poor dad so i ran across that and you know now that is as far as like um buying old real estate is something that really seemed like a good idea for me so you know i didn't do a whole lot for quite a few years i started another company that's how i ran into mark who had done some uh flips fix and flips over a few

year period, just like here and there as he did other jobs. Then at some point, probably about 2012, we started, maybe even before that, we started doing just some flips. I was still working full time. And we started doing some flips in our local community here, which is just north of St. Louis. And that just kind of led to doing more and more of it. Finally, we started looking at, you know, we were tired of trying to find the foreclosures and going through realtors. And so we thought, you know, we want to get to these things before they come to foreclosure. So then we decided we wanted to just do wholesaling. And that was probably about two and a half years ago.

We engaged you probably two years ago. And we just kept slowly getting, you know, our feet wet to start out with and then just kind of diving in. And then I started slowing down in. practice probably a year and a half ago. And then I'm pretty much out. I do actually I work a half an hour every month in medicine. So I'm pretty much out of that. But I am doing something for a local clinic here.

But yeah, full-time wholesale in St. Louis. Awesome. Okay. So I remember kind of our biggest issue or the big challenge that we were tackling when you came into the office was really finding deals. I know Mark was handing a lot of the phone calls, and he was really kind of cynical and resigned in the beginning, thinking nobody was going to sell their house at a discount. And that was kind of the – remember that conversation? Yeah, I do. I remember that. It's funny now that you say that because I was like, yeah, you know, I know we're going to find people.

It's going to be a needle in a haystack, but it's just, you know, you've got to just get through the haystack to find the needle. Yeah, Mark was pretty skeptical. And now he's probably one of the – maybe even a bigger advocate than you are. Yeah, probably. As far as his enthusiasm goes. When you guys left here, we went over some basic systems. I showed you what we were doing,

introduced to our guy, David, that was doing that force at the time. And so what happened? Where was the big shift? When did it all, like, was there a moment or was it very, very gradual? You know, it was pretty gradual. So one of our big issues was just getting on the phone talking to sellers. you know, that whole process. You know, we weren't really excited about it.

We were doing it. And then we kind of got the, you know, the flywheel moving. And then pretty much as soon as we felt comfortable, like, hey, we need, you know, we could hand this off and we could like teach somebody how to do this part of it. We did. And so we found a, we actually went through several. I wouldn't call them acquisitions because they really didn't go out. They just did, you know, phone calls. And we put them under contract on a phone call.

And went through several local people, and they just didn't, you know, didn't pan out because they just, you know, they'd make like 13 calls in a day, and that just wasn't getting it done. Right. It's a funny story. We actually, one of our guys, the guy was asking $36,000 for the house. and he offered to pay $38,000. So I'm pretty sure the next day we'll let him go.

He wasn't grasping the concept there. Yeah, not really at a tough time. So really what we ended up doing is we ended up focusing on the rental properties in St. Louis. And so that's really all we're sent to, or that's all we were looking at on Craigslist. And those are basically our marketing. We tried a little bit of Bandit. signs and a little bit of bird dogging. Not a lot.

Never really dove into it. Didn't really produce much when we did it. But, you know, honestly, we probably haven't done it enough to really assess that. But so mostly it's been, it's been yellow letters and a Craigslist, but to the rental market in St. Louis. But once we got, we found a guy, a VA. And he's just been fantastic. Got it.

And, you know, we talked. We taught him, excuse me, we taught him, you know, how to do it, basically, and, you know, just worked with him and worked with them and worked with them and did it at the same time. And, yeah, once we got him, it just, you know, because he's making about 45 phone calls a day. Probably talking, you know, having a good conversation with about, well, 13 to 14 a day on average. And I'd say about every other day we put something under contract. Wow. Those are great numbers. So where did you find your virtual assistant? I went to a company, you know, I didn't want to go to O-desk and try to figure out, you know, how to find somebody because I just wasn't that familiar with it.

Or a similar. So I ran across this company that it's called My Outdesk. I think they're out of San Francisco or someplace. And so, you know, they did some training in real estate. even though it wasn't for investors, it was more for for real estate agents, you know, getting leads, but at least it was kind of something. And they did some training, so they knew some of the terminology.

So I just started interviewing a few. I ran across the guy named John and, you know, gave him a shot. And, you know, he was pretty, you know, kind of a deep personality on the disc. And, you know, one of the things that we found was it was difficult for people to shoot somebody a low cash offer. And so, of course, that was the first thing that I was concerned about. But, yeah, you didn't have any problem doing that. So if you can get past that, you can kind of, you can probably do the rest of it. So it was more of the, what you kind of noticed was maybe the hesitation in your own mind, like you don't want to insult or offend somebody.

So you were kind of nervous about sending that offer. He had no problem with it at all. That's, I understand that, right? Well, no, I never, I never really did. So I would give a low price. But anybody that we had come in to do this, do this for us, I mean, they just had a really hard time, you know, offering 50%. Right.

50%. Got it. I think one of the things also that helped is most of the people that we work with, or most of the sellers are investors also, you know, a lot of, You know, some of them have just inherited a house from their, you know, mom died or whatever. But a lot of them are investors. A lot of them have owned house or have rent them now they want to get out of the business. So, you know, it's not unusual for them to expect a pretty low price.

And it either works or it doesn't. So it's, you know, the negotiation is really not that difficult, you know. Right. Yeah, if you find someone with the right motivation, then it's not that difficult. Yeah, exactly. It really is. You've kind of gotten past the whole caring about, you know, what they think or it's just, you know, it is, and we tell them, you know, it either works for us or it doesn't. It either works for you or it doesn't.

It works for both of us, you know, let's do it. Okay, so you said you're sending to rental properties. How are you looking up those rental properties and who to send to? We use list source. Okay. So you're just doing absentee owners? Yeah, just absentee owners. Yeah.

Got it. And then you're sending those. them yellow letters? Is that pretty much all you've sent? Or have you sent postcards as well? We've sent yellow letters. In fact, our list is about 8,000, maybe 8,200. And for the past couple of months, we've basically sent about 1,200 a week. Okay. We're going to start sending postcards. We're going to increase the time between until about

six weeks instead of eight weeks. We had about 8,000, a little over 8,000. So we're sent about 1,200 a week, something like that, 1,100. a week and so it takes us eight weeks to get through that list or yeah eight weeks to get through that list okay so you send a list once every other month basically yeah yeah super and then how many phone calls is that generating do you do you have an idea on the number or a percentage on your response yeah we're getting about uh like a 1.5-ish you know 1.5 yeah 1.5% response okay you know some weeks it's a little better some weeks it's a little worse but it's somewhere in there all right so the one of the things

a lot of people on this that are in this audience they've a lot of them think their market isn't good enough and they want to do it virtually

and you know one of the biggest issues or stumbling blocks or challenges for people to get past is actually training somebody and I just kind of wanted to point out because I had somebody

another client on here a while back probably over a year ago now McKinsey and she's just absolutely conquered the whole virtual assistant thing and she works like I don't know two or three hours a week

and her VA does everything else and yeah but she mentioned how she had to go through quite a few of them before she found that right person and it sounds like you had the same thing and i think there's just a lesson there that you know you might have to go through a few people and until you find the right one do you have any tips or what if you were to do it all over again how would you go to find this guy that you're using now how would you find him right off the bat oh boy that's a good question um so i it's really hard to know before they actually start doing it You know, I've been looking at, we're looking at some other people to hire too.

And so we did the disc on them, which kind of gives you an idea of their personality type. So I'm looking for somebody with like a D personality, kind of a forceful personality, get things done kind of deal. But it almost seems like they understand the test. And so they just take it to what they think you're going to want. Right. So, you know, I typically will, I kind of know what I'm looking for. So I'll ask them different questions to try to tease some of that out before I hire them. But, you know, honestly, it's, you know, I kind of give them a chance.

And, you know, you can't be afraid to let them go pretty quick if they're not. If they can't, like, overcome some of the, you know, the biggest challenges, like I said, you know, offering somebody $10,000 when they're asking $30,000, or, you know, when they're, when they're, when they're, when they're asking $35,000 for it. You know, so if they can't do that right away, then, you know, I would say, you know, just move on. Don't spend the whole month knowing that they're probably not going to get to it. If they can't get to that pretty quick, they're never going to get to it. And I think it's kind of a gut feel.

You kind of know, so I would say, you know, after you kind of know, maybe give them another day or so. and if things don't get better, I mean, just, you know, move on. You know, because everybody's nice, and it's hard to let people go, but, you know, if it doesn't work, it doesn't work. Are you using, how are you keeping track of them? Are you using, what CRM are you using? What phone system are you using? We use Podio.

Okay. And then, you know, that works good. And then Skype is the phone system that they used to call the U.S. and we've got a St. Louis area code and phone number for them. We've got an administrative person, too, that works with us. So your person is overseas? Yeah, they're in the Philippines. They're in the Philippines.

Okay. And they're getting a contract every other day straight over the phone. Yeah. Super. So by my math, that's what, 15 deals a month? Yeah, so we're not, obviously, we don't close on, you know, all of those. But we're closing on, you know, on average about 10 of them over the last couple of months, maybe a little more.

I think in June we closed on 11. I think in May it was like, it was either 9 or 10. So what's the procedure for your guy? He gets the phone call. He comes to an agreement with the seller. And then to put it under contract, is it just via email? Is it fax? or docusign, something like that?

Yeah, we sent them a contract over DocuSign. We found that's the, you know, the whole email thing, them downloading it. Right. And then printing it, then signing it, then sending it back to us was a lot more difficult than it really needed to be. Yeah, that's terrible. So, yeah, doxy sign works awesome. Super. And DocuSign tells you, if they've looked at it, tells you if it's completed, which is nice.

Yeah, you can stay up with the process of the whole transaction that way. Yeah, yeah. Super. All right, so you get an executed contract back, and then the next step is to go out and find a buyer. What has been your most successful ways in finding buyers and building your cash buyers list? You know, honestly, it's kind of interesting. I would say the buyers in St. Louis are typically harder. to sell to because they want to buy it for the same amount that you paid, you know.

So what we realized was that, you know, that's probably not a really good buyer for us. Because, you know, we can't make a thousand bucks on each of these, you know, in survival five. So what we did is we started having meetups in California. And so we've had them in San Diego. In fact, that's what Mark's doing there right now in San Diego, in L.A., in Sacramento, know in San Jose. Actually, I think we've had a couple in. I think we've got two different locations in L.A.

And this is the third time that Mark's been out there doing that. So that's probably been the best. And we find, you know, we'll find a buyer once in a while around here too. But those meetups have been fantastic. Awesome. Awesome. So you've literally gone to meetup.com and started your own group. Yes.

Okay. And then you hold your own event. Now, are you wholesaling there? or are you actually, is this like a turnkey type model that you guys are running? Yeah, that's a good question. We're wholesaling, yeah. Okay. But, you know, I mean, it's a meetup.com thing.

So it's informational. Of course, we're the only ones there giving them information. So if they're interested, they obviously come to us, you know, and it's called long-distance cash flow. Okay. But they come to us if they're, you know, if that's something they're interested in. Got it. And are you using any special promotion techniques to get people to your event or just through the meetup engine?

Just through the meetup engine and Facebook. And Facebook? Yeah. Are you running ads on Facebook? No, we're not doing any paid Facebook. Okay. He's got a Facebook page and post stuff that. Yeah.

That's fantastic. And how many people are showing up to each event? It depends on. You know, in San Diego, we had like 30-some. the first one in like 20-some. One of the people that came to our meetup in San Diego is a guy who's a couple of guys who have a big, that's not a meetup, but a big group that they run in San Diego. So that helped a lot getting them, and then they advertised it or put it on their group,

investment club, I should say. That helped quite a bit. in Los Angeles, like the first time we had about six, the second time we had, I think, like, 10 or 11. Next time we had somewhere around the same. Sacramento, a little bit less. So, you know, it's probably about 10 or less. So not a lot of people, so it's not a big huge, you know, 30 to 50 people showing up every time. Yeah, it doesn't have to be, though, does it?

No, it doesn't. Right? In fact, it'd be a little overwhelming, I think. Yeah, yeah. So at the meetings, is there any sort of education going on? Are you just talking shop or you just pitching properties? What happens at the meeting? Yeah, so we just talk a lot about the markets.

You know, we kind of give an overview of, well, you know, we kind of address the California market as far as a cash flow market. And everybody understands, for the most part, it's not a cash flow market. It's an appreciation market. Right. And so just go through the cash flow, you know, the advantages of cash flow. And, you know, the price of the properties, the returns you get are, you know, fantastic. And, you know, just kind of go through all that.

The, you know, St. Louis, the pros and cons of St. Louis, why it's a good market. So if people wanted to connect with you, that's at long-distance cash flow. Yeah. On meetup.com. Yeah. Great. So I guess in hindsight, what do you think about the coaching, the Epic Pro Academy, the podcast? What has made the had the biggest impact on your business?

That's a good question. You know, honestly, it's probably nothing in particular. It's probably the whole thing. You know, at some point, it's kind of hard to believe that you can do it. And I think, for me, it kind of goes back to, you know, if Matt can do it, I can do it. You know, so. Ain't that the truth? You know, I mean, I don't think anybody that does it has any special, you know, any special

whatever, you know. So it's just a matter of, like, believing you can do it. And, you know, honestly, it kind of seems like it's pretty straightforward and simple. But there's a fair amount of nuance to the whole thing. And you just have to, like, do it and get in and keep doing it and doing it and doing it. And, you know, if you do that, then you're going to be successful. But you can't stop and you can't quit. Because we had kind of some starts and stops.

But once we really decided that we were going to do it, you know, it's been, you know, we've been pretty successful at it. Right. Still having issues, but, you know, we're going in the right direction and moving forward. Yeah, sounds like it. I mean, I don't think you guys had gotten a deal the last time we met and now we're 10 a month. Yeah, exactly. Fantastic. Congratulations.

So looking back in hindsight again, on the other side of the coin, if, you know, you're going to go through that process all over, say, the last two years. What is one thing that you would do differently or one thing that you wouldn't do? You know, probably stop thinking. My tendency is to, like, think about everything before I do it quite a bit. So just once you learn something, just go and do it. You know, kind of learn as you do rather than try to learn through listening to people. Mm-hmm.

Got it. Nothing so much. Yeah, I suspect that a lot of people that kind of get into it or kind of have my same mentality. Right. Like know everything before they do it or you really can't know it until you do it. Right.

You know, it is a really simple business, but there are also a lot of moving parts at the same time. And it is very easy to fall into that over-analysis and lose sight of how simple. the business actually is. It is. You know, you talked about some turning point. I remember we had a deal that was happening.

I don't remember the particulars of it now, but I remember I was driving in my car, and the deal was, like, going through, like, either the same day or the next day, and I get a call from the title company, and they said, you know, something was wrong. You know, like the whole thing was going to fall. You know, it's letting a verge of falling through,

you know, those kind of. the phone calls. And I remember thinking, normally what I would do is I would just like wait and kind of see what happens, you know, probably for a half a day. And I thought, you know what, I can't do that. I got to try to figure this out. I'm going to make this thing happen. I want to make it happen right now. And so I started calling all of the players, the buyer and the seller and the telecompan. And we just made it happen. And that was a pretty big deal for us. It's awesome, awesome. You know, sometimes people get confused by going through the motions and, you know,

they're executing the right activities on a daily basis, but they lose track of what their actual intent is. They're like, well, I sent out the mail, I called them, and nobody wants to sell. So I guess it doesn't work. Or you can go ahead and you can send out the mail. You can call them and then you can make it work. Yeah. Right?

Yeah. Yeah. You know, and I think one of the biggest things is, I don't think we realize. what we sound like on the phone. But once we, once, you know, I came to and I trained my guy to come to, you know, if this is not a deal for you, it's not a deal for me right now, then, you know what? Hey, that's fine. You know, we'll just move on.

And I think that kind of an attitude, I think sellers really like that. And they respect it. And they think, oh, you know, this guy must know what he's doing. And therefore, there's a little bit of trust built. So if they really do want to sell it, they say, oh, they're their green hour or they come back to you. And I think that's a pretty important place to get to. And you only get to that through dealing it, through experience. Right, right.

Otherwise, you sound like you just started, you know. Yeah, and when you do it. You want every deal to work out, you know, and you're like desperate. Exactly, exactly. Yeah, when you're in the beginning, like, you're just dying to do a deal for the sake of doing a deal. Right. But when you get through it, you've done a couple of those deals that you think back, maybe I shouldn't have done that deal.

Now of a sudden you have a different disposition of, you know, if it's not a deal, for me it's not a deal for you it's not the right time that's perfectly okay we'll move on to the next one and maybe we'll cross past somewhere down the road again right when you have that air of confidence and that air of uh you know you're not showing neediness and you're not showing that desperation all of a sudden a lot more things start to tip in your favor exactly right yeah my son is doing some uh lease options out in idaho and i was talking to him the other day and he had this one deal that the guy just kept asking them questions and questions i told him, I said, you know what, tell him, next time you talk to him, say, hey, you know everything that I know.

Either you want to do it or you don't. And so if you want to do it, give me a call, but I don't have time for this. And, you know, basically hung up the phone. Well, of course, he calls him the next day, telling him he wants to do it. Of course, he did. Yeah. As soon as you're afraid to walk away, you've lost. But when you're not afraid to walk away, you win so many more. Right. Exactly. Exactly. So that was a big deal, of course. Fantastic. Well, great. I mean, what now? What's next? What do you see for the future? Just more of the same? Or do you got bigger plans? Yeah, that's a good question. So, you know, we want to continue to do wholesaling, obviously. Right now we're doing like C class. You know, we're probably going to, we're going to keep doing C class properties in St. Louis.

We'll probably start doing some B class properties. But we really want to get better at, you know, and continue to refine. buying the wholesaling. And we're going to start, once we probably hit 15 properties a month, we're going to start buying and holding ourselves. Cool. So we've got an event. I don't know if you even know about it, September 22nd and 23rd out here in Los Angeles. I'd love for you and Mark and your son to show up. So you guys, that invitation is extended to you to be my guest. All right. All right. And then we've already got, I don't know, we're going to have a pretty full house. We've got a ton of people already registered. And, you know, I know after this conversation, the people that come on here and share

the success, they gain some sort of immediate celebrity inside of this epic community. And they start receiving emails like, are you real? Is this true? Did you really do what you said you did? And so expect that. And I know if you're there and I'll keep the audience updated, whether you're going to be able to make it or not. But I know that they just love to talk to experience real estate investor, especially people that started, you know, kind of where they started and didn't start their, not, it wasn't too long ago when they were in that position. So, I would love for you to come out and be my VIP guest. Yeah, that'd be fantastic. Well, Tom, thanks, and hopefully we'll, we'll chat soon. All right. Okay. Thanks. Say everything you did for us. Yeah, you bet. You bet. My pleasure. Say hey to Mark.

I will. Thank you, Matt. Uh-huh. Take care. All right. You too. Bye. Bye. Okay. So if you can't make it to the intensive and you'd like to connect with Tom. You can reach him at Tom at fairoffers.com. That's T-O-M at Fair Offers. That's F-A-I-R-O-F-F-E-R-F-E-R-Z. Fair Offers with a Z.com. Until next week, to your success, I'm Matt Terrio, living the dream. You've been listening to Epic Real Estate Investing, the world's foremost authority on separating the facts from the BS in Real Estate Investors. investing education. If you enjoyed this show, please take a minute to visit iTunes and share your thoughts. Thanks for listening. We'll see you next time here at Epic Real Estate Investing with Matt Terrio.

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