Every Single Album - Taylor Swift Is Married!

Episode Date: July 7, 2026

It's a love story baby, just say yes! Taylor Swift is married (and Travis Kelce was there too). Nora and Nathan break down all of the details that have trickled out from the last weekend's wedding. They talk about who made the guest list from Fergie to NFL commentator Dean Blandino (1:00), the news that Jonathan Anderson of Christian Dior designed Swift's wedding dress (19:47), and how Swift and Kelce managed to pull of an event that was private, but not secret (31:09).Hosts: Nora Princiotti and Nathan HubbardProducer: Kaya McMullen Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

In Toronto, every arrival is a statement, and nothing says it better than this. Cadillac Optic was the number one selling luxury EV in Canada for 2025. Find your rhythm across a seamless 33-inch display and an immersive 19-speaker AKG surround audio system. This city demands agility, and Optic delivers with precision to make every drive extraordinary. Let's take the Cadillac. Find out more at Cadillac canada.ca. Luxury sales claim based on S&P Global Mobility Canadian New Vehicle Total Registrations for calendar year 2025 for the Cadillac definition of luxury. This spring, denim gets a softer, lighter update.

Introducing Old Navy's drapey denim wide leg, a new fit that moves with you. It's everything you want denim to feel like for summer. Easy, breathable, and effortlessly cool. With a fit that creates natural movement and a wide leg that feels modern, not overwhelming. Plus, that signature, wait, for this price? Moment. Old Navy's drapey denim wide leg. Welcome to every single album.

I'm Nora Prince Yati. And as always, I'm joined by my friend Nathan Hubbard, who I'm sure is joining me in saying congratulations to Taylor Swift and Travis Kelsey. Married at last. We're wishing our best to the happy couple. And we're going to talk about what went down at Madison Square Garden over the past weekend. Nathan, how are you doing? Yon.

I'm at peace. How are you, Nora? We do. I'm really, I mean, I really, I really. do feel that I have reached an equilibrium with this whole thing now that it is in the rear view mirror. Now that we have like a real sense of what happened in the scope of everything. Do it? I think we do. I think we learned a lot. I feel like the internet had so much fake shit about this whole wedding that we have no idea what

happened. We got weird super fake reports like they sang their favorite rock song together or she walked down the aisle to one of her songs played by strings. I'm like, first of all, it's very possible that there's idiots who don't actually know her music who would walk out and talk to the press and give that detail but didn't actually know what song it was. There's just so much ambiguous shit that like anybody who was actually there would have filled in a specific detail that just blew it. I think the only source of truth is Tree Pain via People magazine at this point. Anything else, I think I don't believe. That's interesting.

I think there's, my assumption is that there is both truth and fiction in what's coming out from various guests and purported guests. We can sort our way through that. There's certainly a huge amount of information. credible and otherwise that is floating all possible zones at this point. But I think that there are some, there are some things where we can, where we can say that we've emerged with some concrete information. I would like to start with the guest list. Because this is one area in which we have quite a bit of like tangible physical evidence of

people coming and going. You, you and I, this is the only thing you and I texted about this weekend was the guest list. Everything else we kept to ourselves. So, first of all, As reported and expected, it turned out to be around 1,000 people. A real array of sports figures, celebrities, family, friends. I have a list of the people who were most notable to me who I could have expected would go to this wedding and also others, where it goes the other way. Is there anything about who was there that stuck out to you?

Yes. Would you like to share it? Dean Blandino was at this wedding? Yeah, Dean Blandino definitely at the top of my most question mark, question mark, question mark list. I mean, it was mostly the football side that gave you and me the what the fucks. I mean, Mike Vrable makes his first public appearance. Can I tell you, I have four. There are four people.

I was just like, I mean, sure, whatever. But. Yeah. And it is Dean Blandino. Holy shit. Elizabeth Banks. Oh, really? you were surprised at Lizzie Banks?

Tell me something I don't know. I've just never thought about them in conjunction with one another together. I've never seen them together. Are you sure that she went? I mean, again, the internet was flooded with pictures of people in tuxedos and dresses that said, here's Dua Leap on her way to the wedding.

Well, Dulepa wasn't at the wedding. As far as we know. No, Dulepa was not at the wedding. And that's, well, I want you to finish your list. Okay, so Lizzie Banks and who's the last? Dean Blandino, no, it's four. Dean Blandino, Elizabeth Banks, Mike Vrable, and Fergie. Fergie.

Fergillicious, dude. No, totally. Like, I would love to have Fergie at my wedding. It just, like, that is the, wasn't on my bingo card top four. Yeah, and that's my thing, like, look, oh, I don't want to poop on people. But I have no problem with any of the choices. that she made for this wedding. I have a problem with the people

who are using the shit out of their invite for clout. I have a problem with the fact that she created an environment where people had to go into a giant car tent in their tinted window SUVs so that they could get out in private. The whole thing was made so that people, the outside prying eyes

would not need to know that you were there. but there are, you know, the night of the rehearsal dinner, people walking out of their hotel slowly to the pap walk and then getting out of a car on 7th fucking avenue instead of in the private area so that they will be seen and photographed going into the rehearsal dinner. Like there are people who made it their personal brand this week to like hold up the I was there.

And man, it got to a point where I was like, first of all, it's kind of gross. Like she actually, they together created a thing that was supposed to be about privacy. I apologize to Travis. It is impossible for my brain to conceive of this as your wedding too.

Yeah, yeah. And I'm not going to say that that's going to change, but know that I apologize for it. Yeah, yeah, I understand that. But it feels like they created a thing that was just about, I mean, I was on, I was listening to a playlist yesterday and up came the song, Peace.

And I was like, holy shit. She just could not give Joe. Alwyn and his skinny-ass chicken legs, peace. And it wasn't enough. But for Travis, like, he loves and embraces the chaos. It's just that this event. He doesn't want peace. This, he doesn't need peace. He runs towards- But these are two people who love being famous. But they created an environment in which, for Paul McCartney, like, it looks like maybe somebody snapped his eyebrows and that's it in the back of a car. Like, if you didn't want to be seen at this wedding, you didn't have to be seen.

And some people, even the fucking aunt, who is so clearly a problem that they had to give her, TreePain probably had her in a windowless room for a week delivering the bullets, the talking points. They get to Crazy Aunt whatever her name is and she sticks to the goddamn script. She did great job, Crazy Aunt. You did exactly what you were supposed to do. It was like when Donna went on the morning show when they first started dating and everybody thought she didn't like Taylor, but it was just Donna trying to follow them. the talking points and be a good soldier, right?

This was the same thing. The family did it. But, you know, a few podcasters, and I say this understanding the irony. They're nothing but trouble. Dude, who just turned it into being about them, the AMC CEO, who puts out some long fucking posts with no details that basically is just like a,

just a bullshit post that eventually got deleted. he basically just wanted everybody to know he was there. Yeah. Like those are the people who it felt like, come on, man. Give her peace. I completely agree with you on the AMC CEO. I will say like he's the only person that I saw that left me with that impression of just like, come on, dude, how dumb can you be?

In particular, because he described her dress. Like, you have to know that that's a no-no. But he gave no details. Like, he could have said what he said without being in the room. He said it had a long train. And that you have like to not understand, first of all, what is, what is the CEO of AMC movie theaters doing, posting an 18 paragraph screed on his LinkedIn? That's what I mean. What are you doing, man? Okay. No, I'm totally with you on that one.

Where I feel differently is like there are people who did pap walks on their way to this wedding who I'm sure it came with. tacit or literal approval. Like, Gigi and Ashley. Fine. They had no choice. People know where those people live. How about Carissa and Aaron? Carissa Thompson and Aaron Andrews.

And Matthew Stafford's wife. They were pretty highly visible. Yeah, I mean, so like they were in the, I was surprised to see them in the group of 100 people who got the invitation for the rehearsal dinner on Thursday, which like, I will say that one takeaway of this for me, is I think her social circle has changed, which makes sense, like, when people get at a serious relationship that happens. I don't think the public has, like, the right picture of what her actual

inner circle is right now. Right. It's evolved. Like, it has definitely evolved. And I think the sports community is a really big part of it. And I guess that's evidence of that. Um, I don't know. They did a whole... And just for everybody, so you understand, Dean Blandino is the guy in the telecasts when there's some fucking call that they can't figure out

why this call was made or maybe it was a penalty, maybe it was... Dean Blandino is the guy to they go... is the guy they go to, I don't know, once, maybe twice a telecast, and they go, hey, Dean,

was that off sides? And he goes, duh, not to me, Joe. Yeah, and then it's off sides. He's wrong, 98% of the time. The B-tier version of that. No offense to Dean Blanino. Yeah. Yeah, but like these guys are constantly the ones who get referred to to, first of all,

they don't want to pick on their former colleagues. So they're always a little too kind about the situation. Second of all, they seem to just always get the call wrong because whatever, when you're in the heat about, whatever. Anyway, Dean Belladino, I'm sure is a super nice guy, but like he got a plus one. He got a plus one. I know. It's really funny. Travis meets with the, Travis is one of the guys that in the week leading up to the, you know, to the game, the crew comes in and the network crew gets to meet for 15 minutes with a few players to get the sort of storylines. And so the play-by-play guy, the color guy gets to sit down. And I guess Dean Blandino, right, gets to sit down with it. That, by the way, is how Aaron Andrews and

Chris Thompson got to know him and clearly like their friends. They went on vacation together and whatever. My point is at Dean Blandino, I don't know, did he post a ton about it? Like, I love Glenn & Doyle. I haven't seen, but I don't think that I follow Dean Blandino on various accounts. I don't either. But nobody does, right? I love, like, Abby Wambach is a fucking American hero.

Abby Wambach can do what she wants. I've spent time with Abby Wambach before. She's a fucking American badass. I still read Glennon's post and was like, really, do we need to, like, can you just let it be about her instead of, I was there and I'm so happy for, I don't know, man. I don't, I don't know that I agree with this. I think even if you're Taylor Swift, it's nice when people post about your wedding. Can we let her post about it and then everybody can do the...

But I don't think the line, like to me, the line for that does not get drawn at posting. I do think in particular sharing the details of the wedding dress. Yeah. Only some of them, which only the AMC Bozo was stupid enough to do and it got, taken down very quickly. Like, that's over the line to me. I don't think really anything else that I saw felt like an invasion of privacy. No, no, no, it didn't.

I think that this wedding... It felt like clout chasing. Not an invasion of privacy necessarily. It just felt like clout chasing. But, like, you know what? They were there. They got invited. The clout, it's theirs.

It's a cool invite to get. It's a cool invite to get. Like, a long, heartfelt message to social media. He's too fucking cool for that. We know he was there. I don't need to see it on your Instagram profile. Okay, but so then do you think that it's like lame that Ashley's posting? I think it would be lame for people on the outer circle of that thousand person thing to just basically say, yo, I was there.

I wasn't a center of the paparazzi, but I need you to know that I was there. Look, here's where I'll see your point. someone like, well, I think she eventually did post eventually. It was like two days ago. But the moment that, like, I discovered in some roundup of the guests that the chef and recipe author, Alison Roman, was there. Okay. And like, it is a cool moment, right? When you're like, oh, cool.

Allison Roman was there. I didn't know that. finding out that way, like there is something that's kind of cool about it as opposed to seeing somebody post themselves. I do think that like, you know, she is still a woman. If she woke up the day after her wedding and nobody had posted about it, I bet she'd be sad. Like, like it or not, social media is a part of our world and it is a part of how people experience and celebrate milestones. there are major downsides to that. But like, I don't know.

This, that doesn't irk me. Anything short of the AMC guy doesn't irk me about this. And I think that some of the people who you were seeing coming out of the hotels, like, it was like Abigail. Well, like, of course that's okay. Of course that's okay. My point is, like, there were media people

who were in that room. Late night hosts, a few radio people who have smaller audiences than Nora Princeati. So it wouldn't have completely surprised me. That's the thing is the bar. You talked about this in our preview thing. The bar got set really low,

in part because I think, for the most part, they didn't want to edit. And I understand that completely. I have no problem with the size of the wedding. It just got to a point where literally, it almost seemed cooler to not be there. Like, Chalameh was not there as far as we know. You know?

I don't know why you said it like that. Conorock, I said it like that because the officiant of the wedding, Adam Sandler, says, Oh, right, right, right, right, right, right, right, right, right, right. Like, that's it. But, like, it was, it was almost, you could have convinced me that almost anybody was there. Once you texted me, Mike Frable, question mark, 10 more question marks? May I just offer this as a slight tangent while we're talking about this? Can I say that it did bother me that Mike Frable didn't wear a tuxedo?

But fucking Mike Vrabel Like, come on, man, you cheat on your wife You still get an invitation to Taylor's wedding You can't follow the dress code It's that hard to put on a bow tie, man. Like, get a life. That's how I felt about it. Well, I don't even, like, in certain ways,

Find Mike Rable amusing. I don't know. It's none of my business. I just thought that he should have worn a bow tie. Just to come back to this, like by the time it all started, I kind of lost interest in the wedding itself. Like it, the details, I'm sure they'll come out and they'll be interesting.

I just was like happy for her. I just got rubbed the wrong way by everybody using it for clout when she had so clearly created a process and an event that was designed to keep the people out of the public eye. And maybe she doesn't matter. I have to, I really, I really have a zag on that. I really feel that this was, this. This was designed to be a private event, but not a secret one.

Huh. So why the car tent? Why the car, probably for her car. Probably for like certain very principal people, for there to be a way to get in and out without being photographed. But clearly, because there was a car tent, first of all, like, there's only so much, it takes a certain amount of time for every black car, every SUV to make its way in there

with a thousand people if every single person is going to be not being visible on the street at any point in time like I do think that that would have taken hours.

The arrivals period would have had to been really, really long. Well, again, Dean Blandino can walk in the front door.

Like, it's fine. But like if she wants to, so can Gigi Hid. And I don't think that there was much to me that this wedding telegraphed that would suggest that Taylor or Travis would have had a problem with that. The thing that I kept going back to is how when they announced their engagement, the caption, like, and this is like really stuck with me being your English teacher and your gym teacher. there's been this suggestion of even for someone for whom privacy and certain boundaries are such a factor in her life that she's made decisions to allow the outside into this a little bit can be a touchy subject

because generally speaking, I think culture tends to want celebrities to have a touchy relationship with fame. And in moments like this, she can seem like she really doesn't. But I thought the choice to have, you know, I was shocked when those billboards lit up. That was the thing. You're right. That's the answer.

Because that was not for anybody inside. That was like the white smoke. when they pick a pope. Yeah. Yeah. It wasn't like, it had to be, it had to be secure.

But in a lot of ways, this was, I don't want to say that it was designed so that everybody would know about it and everybody would like have all the attention on it. But I don't think that that was something that they minded at all. And that is fine.

That is for them to decide. I think, I really mean this with absolutely no shade, though I do acknowledge that, again, I think broadly speaking, it's something that greater culture tends to have a bit of trouble with. I think they are two people who really love each other, and part of that love is they both really like being famous. Well, I think they also knew they had a lot of people sitting out in the streets. Yeah.

And I don't mind them acknowledging it. I guess I just will say, am I going to care? Like, what did you think of the press release? the press release, which was an ad for the designers who did the clothing and the boots. Yeah, I mean, I think there's two ways to look at it.

I think one is that this is something that they know is going to be relentlessly covered. And celebrities league, photos and information or don't leak it, but just put it out there

for a number of reasons. And some of them are because they want you to know the information. Another one of them is that they want to take the heat off the overall story a little bit. They want to feed the beast so that the beast is not chasing them around with an empty belly and the ferocity

that comes with that. And so I look, I think I've made it pretty clear that like my instinctual reaction to a lot of the choices that went into this is to be a little confounded by it. But what I think it says to me is they want people to know. Like they want to, they want to share what it is. I mean, also look, like, Dior is going to share at some point. I guess, but they didn't, right? They didn't share anything about the vows. They just said, Adam was the efficient.

Brothers were on either side, and here's who designed everything. Which I guess maybe that's just like the basics of a big wedding. It is important that they put out a press release, I think, because they understand that it was like, you know, whatever. There was a countdown clock on CNN. Like, that's the level of shit that we were in. So I don't fault them for any of that. I really don't.

I just thought... I don't know. Here's the thing. She's going to make a post. Probably by the time this podcast is up. Right? I mean, she's going to do a gym teacher. That would certainly be our luck.

Yeah. I feel like we'll have to wait a little longer than that. But like there's not going to be like a video. Is there? Like will they put out where she do like a little edit, like a one minute edit that shows? So did you see that? TMZ had a photo of a filming notice that was up in the garden. But like that's what every wedding you're going to be filmed.

I think there was a sign outside of your wedding. Right. I don't think so. When I walked into Bowery, I thought so. Maybe they just do it and I didn't need to be involved in that so I wasn't. But I don't think that if there wasn't, the reason is that I believe I'm only in entitled to my wedding video and my wedding photos for personal use, right? Like, I can't sell them.

Yeah. And I do believe that some of those restrictions change if there's any possibility that the material is going to be distributed for- I would buy that shit just to keep the video of me awkwardly trying to figure out how to dance to love story out of the public eye. There are great photos of mute from my wedding, maybe. They're fabulous. I do have to say this.

Everybody who was involved in this wedding, outside of me finding out about it in April, did an incredible job of keeping these details under wraps. Like, people did not violate. There's a couple little pictures of the logo and all this shit. We know there's some pink and people pushed it. Clearly, you could have a camera as you're walking up the stairs, but not by the time you got in there.

Yeah. For all of the clout chasing outside and after, people definitely respected their privacy on this thing. And that's what was so, like, just lame about the AMC guy. Yeah. It was like, let them give the... Like, you saw the press release. The only details they want to tell you is that it was Adam fucking Sandler for some reason.

It was the brothers. And these are the people who paid to make all of the things that we wore. Yeah. That's all they wanted out there. And the very carefully chosen... I don't mean anything by this. I just thought it was funny and it was like a little insight into PR strategy. Jonathan Anderson has done Dior Couture wedding dresses before. He's designed two custom couture wedding dresses during his time with Dior for two clients. But they're not, one of them is a model,

but they're not Taylor Swift level celebrities. So the very selectively chosen phrasing of this is the first couture wedding gown for Dior for like a major celebrity by Jonathan Anderson. The very specific way, which you then saw all of the Vogue and Marie Claire, like all of the headlines being historic wedding dress by Jonathan Anderson, which I thought was deftly done. As opposed to like technically Duleepa's Chanel gown was literally the first. first one, who the heck cares? I just thought it was funny to see Tree working her magic. Go ahead. Can I just ask you along these lines? Like, that's the thing that we know the most solidly. Are you absolutely certain we know who did and did not perform at this wedding? McCartney's saying, I want to hold your hand for the first time since the 60s.

I believe that that happened. I do too, a song that he does not like, but apparently Taylor did, and so he did her the solid and played it. Amazing. We were told over and over again that Stevie Nix performed, but I have not seen any confirmation of set list or song or anything. I've seen suggestions that perhaps she sang as part of her vows, or maybe Friday night. She and Travis sang their favorite rock song, in quotes, which nobody... I didn't see that one. That sounds crazy to me. I think it is crazy because no one would say their favorite rock song.

Without saying, you would just say the song. You shook me all night long or whatever. Like, come on. So there just seemed to, this was a place where there was just a lot of slop that got put out. I mean, Ellie Golding? Ellie Golding, they decided to talk about was there. I assume she didn't. No, but wasn't she in the press release?

Yes. No, not the press release, but she was in like, of people. She was in one of the people roundups where I am inclined to trust that information. Exactly. I'm also inclined to go a step further and believe that, like, not only has that been verified, but that's sort of a curation of information that they want you to see. I think that's it. That's it.

It is the tree pain info laundering rag as far as I can tell. And that's great for Fergie to not make the People magazine lists. Tough break for a lot of people to not make it. And so I think the answer to the question I asked is, no, we're not 100% sure. But now I want to just say to you, so given how low the bar was. I need to know when she's hanging out with Fergie. It happened backstage somewhere, right? I mean, they cross paths all the time.

Ferg. I mean, it probably is, it was probably an obsession just like. the somber obsession, but in reverse, right? Like one of her elders that she was obsessed with. What does it mean for people who you would have thought might be there, but clearly did not get the invite? So, who was on that? Carly Claus was there. Carly Claus was there.

Carly Claus was there. And Carly Claus had what looked to me like a likely sanctioned pap walk. Yeah. Carly Claus' name also in the People magazine Roundup. Great. It makes me happy. Yeah, I like when friendships are intact. People who were on tour who couldn't have made it. We're led to believe that Harry Stiles had an invite but couldn't make it.

Right, because he had to sing two ghosts that name. What was that? It's amazing. It comes out in a tie and he sings two ghosts. It's really good. I loved it. I mean, she has had plenty of cheeky moments alluding to their past relationship, which at this point is ancient history, in onstage moments when everybody

knows what everything is about and who everything is about, Harry is more than entitled to one. I thought it was really funny. I loved it. It was great. I mean, not a coincidence, right? Zero chance. God, no. The biggest exclusions from your perspective, I mean, Blake, Blake lively is the one, right?

I mean, that sort of answered the question for everybody. Yeah. And that question to me was answered when they were photographed upstate at their daughter's horse show. Not in a way that would have precluded them from getting back in time, but it just suggested, here we are. We're going to sort of acknowledge that we're not going to be part of this, which is sad. it's, you know, like they're with their daughter who is the namesake Betty in the song Betty to not be, like it makes me sad for the kids, but I don't know.

I ultimately don't really know what happened. There had been some speculation that Miles and Keely or Kelly, I never know which it does, I'm sorry, that they weren't going to get invited and that that friendship was strained. That seems to be the case. It seems like they weren't there. Again, that was another indicator to me that I really feel like the circle has kind of shifted. Yeah.

This happens when you find a significant other, like your friends evolve and I think it's... Yeah, although Miles Teller loves athletes, but I don't know. I don't have anything in particular to say about that. It just seemed notable. Let me just say, I did not see Pat Mahomes photographed going in or out of that place. Did you? I mean, I know he was there. He was there.

But my point is like, that's an... example of how you could have done it if you chose to do it. I didn't see, I didn't see Andrea or Scott going in or out. Well, did you see that photograph of, at one point, I'm not suggesting that this was for Patrick Mahomes, but at one point, people were bringing a bed inside. Yeah, who knows? That felt like, that felt like decor for, I don't know, they created some fantasy worlds. Aren't you glad they didn't actually do the castle?

I was thrilled. They didn't do the castle. thrilled, thrilled for there to be no castle component. The one, I assume she was there. I'd really love to see photo confirmation of Liz Rose at this wedding. Oh. I'm sure she was there. I just was like, I would like to see Liz Rose.

And I didn't see Liz Rose. Also, like, it's the middle of the summer and lots of artists are out on tour and people have things going on. And that's why, again, it all made a lot of sense to me once this eclectic crew of, you know, somewhere between A and D-list celebrities descended on this venue, they were going to invite a lot of people. They needed to be somewhere logistically where people could go. There's no way you could have had that wedding in Cleveland or rural Pennsylvania because

you had to put all those people up somewhere that night. That's like a lot of famous people or famous adjacent people who, you know, Abby Wambach probably doesn't get slammed in New York City. I mean, she gets a lot of people. But if Abby Wambach is in like some rural place, like she's going to get absolutely mauled. So people are, my point there is just like New York City is a place

where some people know how to act around famous folks. Yeah, well, and it's just big, right? Like you have the capacity to swallow a thousand percent event. It just made a lot more sense to me once you understood what it was. and again, you know, the way that they set this up. I think there were a lot of people at that wedding who did not know one another. Those were a lot of different worlds that collided.

Oh, you mean Dean Blandino and Fergie? Well, so this was going to be my question. It's actually a bummer that they did. It sounds like they didn't have tables. It was just sort of cocktail style, which like I think that makes sense for an event of that size. At the same time, doing the seating chart for that would have been hysterical.

It would have been a hysterical exercise. I don't want you to call anybody out by name. I mean, I do, but I don't want to. Are you familiar or aware of whether there was like a hookup at your wedding? Yes, there was. Exactly. So this happens at lots of weddings, right? Do you think there was a rando hookup at this wedding?

Do you think Dean Blandino and Fergie? No, I'm not speaking on Dean Blandino and. and furgeet. But I'm sure. Are you kidding me? It was probably athlete. The thing is a lot of people showed up with plus ones. Yeah, but some people didn't. Some people didn't. And you've got, okay, you have an open bar. You have a lot of people who are just psyched to be there. Right. A lot of buzz. Like this happens, yes. And it's a thousand people. Yes. Yeah. No, totally. Totally. I bet also like it's in a weird location, it's in a place that's going to make people be like, let's go back up to the

call she concourse on the sixth floor and see if there's space behind the behind the Pepsi bar. Let's go behind the soft-served machine in Concourse 5. Oh my God. It's really funny. Wait a minute. Do I know who hooked up at your wedding? Can we talk about this offline? I don't think so.

We can talk about this another time, but we cannot talk about it right here. Okay. I do want to know who hooked up at Tillis was wedding. But, like, yeah, the odds say somebody hooked up at that way. The odds say a few somebody is absolutely. It was also funny how there was some group of people who showed up, they made their appearance, and then they left at, like, nine or ten. Yeah, some people left, like Hugh Grant left really early.

Yeah. Spielberg seemed to go, do his thing, as you would expect of any gentleman. of his years, you know, took himself home. Although I think Andy Reid stayed late. Well, there's some people who stayed late. I think Andy Reid left at like 1.30. I mean, there were some pictures of people rolling out of there even later than that, I think.

But again, I can't tell. Yeah, I think it's like it ended at like two. Okay. I think there was a post-party? I don't know. I mean, there's post-party for a few people. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. I think probably. But these are the things that I'm most interested in. At the end of the day, I'm glad she had a wedding that she made her choices as best she could. They got their guest list. It seemed to be uneventful. It was kind of a yawn a little bit for me. It was cute that they put the billboards up, I guess, although I'm with people that it like was sort of shocking to see the T&T just T&T.

I thought it was an AT&T commercial too. Yes, the TNT does unfortunately really read like an AT&T. logo or ad, I think something that is hard for people to wrap their minds around is, and I actually think that her point of view is consistent and understandable. And I think it has a lot more to do with literal safety than it does with privacy. But I do think that it can be very hard for people to understand the line that bifurcates choices that make this a public spectacle and the other side that says there's almost nothing that we can do to ensure security and, you know, a lack of drones. Like, I think that strikes a lot of people as hypocritical or inconsistent.

I'm not saying that I think that it is. I will say that like the idea of the, like I was with a bunch of people, most of whom don't really care that much one way or another about Taylor Swift. And it was interesting to me that to note that I think that, and like most of these people seemed pretty like whatever, not really worried about her blocking traffic or whatever. This is fine. They should get married. They should be happy. Whatever. It struck me that the billboard detail seemed to go over particularly poorly.

Yeah. And I think that's because sometimes it comes across as there's almost nothing that we can do to protect ourselves. Like we have to go so far for privacy and so far for security. And then something like that, which is broadcasting yourself to the entire world, seems to undermine that. I think if you go a level deeper, it's like... And you understand the Swifty community who that was for. You would understand it. And also, like, understand that there's, there actually, like, is a difference between

I don't want anybody to know anything about my wedding versus, there's some weird people out there who really want access to Taylor Swift and, like, the ability to have a day feeling pretty secure that none of those people are going to find their way in. You know, that's meaningful. I just, I, I can see how it's hard for, people to calibrate too, given the emphasis on privacy, on a certain type of privacy. And on top of that, this is one of those events that the social media bot world grabs and

creates a whole bunch of slop around just to foment division and reaction and range base online. Oh, the discourse is awful. It's genuinely awful. I don't think most of it is real, but if you are not plugged into this and you open your feed, you're going to see hate as a result of it. Or... Yeah, I'm honestly like I'm kind of not plugged into it in a weird way. And I have plugged back in just because this is a big deal

and to see what people are saying, it's... It's just like it is hateful. People fucking suck. Every angle, it is... And it does seem to be incredibly defined by activity from bots. Yeah, yeah. and accounts that are not attached to a real person. I don't really under, like, I think at this point,

the exercise. Yeah, no, the people defending her can be really, really awful, too. Like, the whole thing is awful. And some of it is bot activity too, like hyperbolic, like, just if you really pay attention to that stuff, you're like, God, this is just trying to pretend that there are massively passionate people on both sides. And I wonder, I mean, this was going to bring me to my,

other question for you, which is I just sort of got the sense that like the late teen, 20 somethings in my life were super duper apathetic about this. Yeah, I think that's true. Well, I mean, that's also like, I think a lot of the, a lot of the tone, even like the aesthetic tone of this. Was adult. It's millennial. Yeah.

It's millennial and it's kind of like mid to elder millennial, right? Like there's, you know, I don't mean to be catty about anybody's choices, but I think that, like, there's a chuginess to her sometimes. And I really do think that it's part of her power because I think people can connect with that. But I think a lot of people connect with that. But she has a very, I mean, even like the, it's funny how you can be Taylor Swift and Travis Kelsey with all the money in the world. And like, there are certain things that people just do because it's a wedding. Like the, um, and I thought these were very pretty. The gift. The, the, well, the embroidered napkins. Right. Right. Like, Duolipa also had those. I think I said no,

but like somebody pitched those to me for my wedding. It's just like, you're a woman in 2026 getting married. You must want to embroider a hanky. There's like the Etsy industry making these things. So many of them say like something for your tears. Right. It's just, it's such a thing. And I don't know, it sort of made me chuckle. But I do think that she, like, part of what is divisive is that she is a totem of particularly millennial tastes at a time when that is no longer what is leading culture. I feel you deeply on this, and it was reinforced for me this week. funnily enough with the new Madonna album, which I think we're going to listen to and make a decision about how much,

whether we ever talk about it again after this, and maybe the answer is going to be able. I would love to talk about it. So I think it's okay. I haven't spent enough time with it yet. I think people kind of like it, but, but. Oh, I think I like it more than that. There is this question of how much people, like broadly people,

need or want to hear from Madonna at this point. And some of the songs felt to me like compilations of some old songs. But like Taylor is in this moment where the generational divide between her now and Gracie and Olivia is apparent because that's what happens. She's 36 and she's married. She's in a different place in her life. But it is now clear that she's in a different. phase of life than a lot of young music fans.

And there's nothing she need to about that. She owes nobody an apology for that. That is called life. And I'm interested to see the sort of cultural impact of her clearly walking across a threshold of life evolution and how that affects the young fandom, which I think five years ago was crazy insane Taylor Swift is at the absolute apex for everybody in that age range and five years later, through no fault of her own,

I think there are some of those younger fans who might be grasping for one who feels a bit more relatable just because of the stage of life that they're in. I don't know that for sure, but that was a vibe that I got out of the weekend in terms of apathy of some groups of people. And just the obviousness that when you combine the lyrical content of showgirl and this public wedding, even if it was private,

it just puts her in a different phase of life that I think is less relatable than a couple of these ascendant pop stars. And I'll be interested to see what that means for the fandom going forward. It's just a, it's not a bad thing, not a good thing, but it's a thing that will have an impact on the way that people respond to her art going forward. I think maybe the single most interesting, and to me I have no idea what the answer is, but the single most sort of operative question for where her career goes in terms of can she hold on to this kind of imperial era for a much longer period of time is, What happens with the kids who are even younger than the kids that you're talking about?

Like, what happens with the six-year-olds and the eight-year-olds? Yeah. Who right now, I think, love Taylor Swift. Yeah, and they're going to love Toy Story, and that'll be an introduction, but yeah. But so are those kids going to, because they love Toy Story and they love Taylor Swift, and maybe Toy Story is their introduction, but also maybe their mom is their introduction, right? Hey, by the way, the line you've got a friend in me is in peace. And this weekend it made me wonder, like, is that actually a Toy Story reference?

I mean, it does seem like she really, like, Toy Story was really canon to her as a child. Yeah, formative for her. Yeah. I was like, oh, maybe interesting. No, she really fucks with that movie. Continue. But like the six and eight-year-olds, yeah, I think they're grabbing to a living in grace. Here's my question.

Because I think you're talking about the 12 to 26-year-olds. You're right. the five to 11-year-olds, let's say, who maybe Toy Story is their entry point, I think in a lot of cases, their mom loves Taylor Swift, maybe took them to the Arestro. Like, it's that.

When those kids get a little bit older, are they going to decide that she's not cool? Right. Or because she's important to them now, is she going to remain formative? And, like, I don't know the answer to that. I think that's a really interesting one. it's a similar...

Like, does it just skip a generation? Or is it, does it Peter out? I don't know. Here comes you two with a new album and Bono and another cowboy hat. And like there was a time when that was the fucking coolest band in the world and the biggest band in the world.

And then there was a time where they were totally out. And can you ever come back from that is the interesting question. It's not a male-female thing. I think one of the greatest, what-if sin cultural history is like, what if you two never put that stupid album on everybody's phone?

Yeah, it is. It will always be. Because I do think that it, like, that was when I was in college. And, like, that defined what you two is to me and to, I think, most people that I know. Oh, go listen to the Joshua Tree. Please. No, I've heard. I get it.

I get that there is much more to YouTube than that. But I think it's just like, that was the. It's the same thing I'm worried about with Madonna now and, like, the online cult, like, ripping her in different corners. corners, it's like, do not forget what this woman created and what she was. That's interesting. I think we should talk about the Madonna album when we talk about the Madonna album, because I would like to talk about the Madonna album. I think I'm seeing a more generally positive reaction to it.

I am too. I do think that it's a little different because what Madonna is doing is maybe singular is a bit of a stretch, but like it's so unusual for someone to be. making music, to be making pop music that feels like it even sniffs real vitality at this point. And like that in and of itself is just, is cool and its rarity. And so I feel like what I sense is people being excited about that. Yeah. You know who's not making pop music that's relevant to people?

Katie Perry. Dean Blandino. Dean Blan Dvo No shade brother We're just using as a proxy There were a lot of Dean Blaninos at this wedding And I hope they had a great time It's great

I appreciate that they didn't have to use it To call attention to themselves in that way But whatever man It looked like a great fun wedding Most of all It seems like There was a lot of focus at this wedding About the marriage

And that was the key right don't let this wedding get in the way of the marriage. And it sounds like people came out very inspired by the marriage. So I'm very happy. I agree with that. I think they seem very much in love. Can I run you through like three or four more details that just that caught my eye? I'm fascinated to know.

Yes. Okay. So there are reports saying that Lena Dunham gave a speech. There are conflicting reports on whether or not that speech was at the rehearsal dinner on Thursday or the actual wedding. The gay porn. Yeah, that according to the Daily Mail, the speech divided the crowd in part because she said that football is just straight men reenacting gay porn. I mean, that's fabulous either way to me.

But if that happened in front of Clark Hunt, I changed my tune on this entire thing. The entire thing was perfect, no notes. It was a vital event, in fact. I'm like I'm back in baby by the way yes Clarkon and his daughter posted they were there so yeah and his wife

we question that in the in the preview thing just just four people who would really like nothing other than for nobody to be able to get an abortion in Missouri but that was the that was the question again they just they they they made the circle broad

Lena Dunham kind of put herself back on the map with that one statement Lena Dunham is awesome, guys. Like, just, if you can have Lena Dunham, this is where it's like for all the, and I don't want to lie about where I stand, there are things like the logo and the billboards

that remain confounding to me. If you can have Stevie Nix perform at your wedding and Lena Dunham give a speech, it's a good wedding. Like, it's a good wedding. That's asked to answer. Well, that was a very funny thing to say. And I imagine that that got... That's the kind of joke Travis Kelsey would massively appreciate and do his, like, super high cackle at.

He would get that joke. What hopes? I think so, too. I think so, too. I just think it's awesome. And I just really, really hope that it... I really... I'm going to choose to believe that it happened on Friday because I really wanted to have happened on Friday.

I think that that's when I saw the comment about it. That's what I saw first. and then now it's going around that it was at the rehearsal dinner. I don't really know. Let's see. Yeah.

Where are you on the reports that she walked down the aisle to a string rendition of one of her songs? I don't believe the person who reported that because they would have reported the song. It's the exact same...

Well, so I've seen it I've seen it reported mostly as Love Story. Great. Although there was something that said Wildest Dreams, but I've mostly seen it as love story. It can't possibly have been wildest dreams.

Really? Love story is what it should have. I mean. A string version of Wildest Dreams, which I believe, did they use that in Bridgerton? Yeah, I guess. That would make me personally uncomfortable to do,

but again, I think that Taylor Swift is more comfortable with, like, her own celebrity than is instinctual in some cases. I just, there's like the line is nothing lasts forever is in that song. Well, I mean, they monogrammed so it's going to be forever from blank space. The next line is or it's going to go down in flames.

Yeah. I mean, the general point of that song is like a goodbye song. Love story seems like the more fitting one. For whatever set of reason, there was, I don't know, I found the, I found the tone of the reporting around that to seem like, it was worth taking seriously. I don't really have a better way of, like, explaining why. My spidey sense for that, as surprising as it seems, it's kind of like I think it did happen, but I don't know.

I think that some of that was in the AMC guy's note, right? He said, walked down the aisle to one of her songs or something. I thought he just said strings. My point is like... He also, by the way, he didn't... It's so weird what he chose to share and not share, that it almost makes me think that that was that guy, thinking he was following instructions, but he's just a moron.

Right. Because he didn't name Adam Sandler. He was like, an officiant spoke and sang and spoke. And then he described her wedding dress. I just, yeah. I also think that there's people who are at that wedding. There's people who are at that wedding who, if you played nine different Taylor Swift songs string renditions, would not be able to name any of them.

No shade. It's possible. Kelsey is one of them. Well, she herself has excused that and pointed out that if it wasn't on the ERA's tour, he probably doesn't know it that well. That's fine. It's fine. Also, sometimes people, like, this is, I think, one of the take, like, sometimes things that

are deeply, deeply important to you in getting married, someone's going to be picking picking their nose while you're doing that. Like, they're just going to zone out. They're going to be, they're going to be thinking about. something else. If there's a thousand people, there's certainly going to be people who are just like start daydreaming and that's what happens. Let me ask you this. It's, it's 4 p.m. Eastern, Monday afternoon. Wait, hold on. I'm not done with my list. Okay, okay, but I'm just asking you a question. Okay. At what point is she going to post a picture from the wedding? Like a couple days and a few days

from now. You don't think it's going to be in 15 minutes when poor Kaya is editing this thing. I mean, I kind of do because that's what happens to us, but I don't know. I would expect it to be more like a few days from now. Is there a honeymoon? I hope so. I bet there is. I mean, this was a traditional wedding. She did a not a lot of bouquet tosses happening at the weddings that I'm going to these days. and there was a bouquet toss at this wedding. Did you toss yours? No.

You didn't? No. Just wasn't your thing, huh? I think, look, a wedding is... As the woman with the second biggest wedding of the year in New York City, what do you think of bouquet toss? I think, first of all, that a wedding is a really bad place to police someone's feminism because you start thinking about any of the traditions for more than about four seconds, and you're going to get yourself to a place that is at minimum hypocritical.

I do think that, like, my sense is that for me, for most of my friends who are in a getting-married era, that is one of those things that people have done away with, like, the garters that's just a little bit to, yes, the culmination of your life is to marry a man. Yeah. But also... A veil is also a similar symbol, if you think about it long enough. So is the white dress. So is fucking everything.

So like, do what you want. I just, I found it to be evidence of her desire to have a pretty traditional wedding. To, like, really do the talk to your dad, go put on a white dress, go pick out a white dress version of this. Yeah. And that says to me that they would have a honeymoon, even though these are people who sort of live a different way than most people. I just think that they would want to lean into all the ways of symbolizing that that they can. I just want a new album.

I know her ass is working. She can't help it. I saw you in that studio, girl. I need, Nathan, if I can't talk to you about Aver Levine winning a handbag raffle at this event before the end of this podcast, it was all for not. Why did they raffle things? What do you think that was? They raffled off the car? They ravelled off a Mustang.

They raffled off many items. Are we sure about this? Yeah, there was a, yeah, there were photos of the Mustang going in and out. Man. They raffled off a Mustang. They raffled off several designer handbags, apparently. One of which was one by none other than Avrilavine and or her body double. I will never forget as long as I live hearing complicated for the first time.

It was just so undeniably, obviously a smack. Perfect song. Perfect song, no notes. Song. And she walked away with a handbag because of it's good for her. I also didn't. I didn't know that they were friends. My understanding is that Avril Avril Avivine as a personality is a bit prickly.

But I do know that she means a lot to Taylor as an artist. So I think it's cool that she was there. There's a lot of people that we learned are friends with this couple from this. event that we didn't know. Okay, last question. All right? You think that she is going to post something in a few days in some amount of time to her Instagram, to her own accounts?

It's going to shock me if it's not posted by midnight tonight because I just think she's probably not going to get in the way of the U.S. soccer game and then either there and or tomorrow, it's going to come. I mean, people want to see it. If they're going to put up the billboard, they're going to put a picture. want to see it. People want to see it and I bet she wants to share it. Like, and again, I think there are

there are obvious downsides to our social media obsessed world but I also don't think that the right solution to that is to make it a crime for someone to share their happy moments. Now, we treated this like a royal wedding. You're going to get a royal photo. Do you think

that we will see it in any other form than that? Oh, like either a video or like a vanity fair exclusive or in any other form than that it could be in vanity fair or vogue it could be on disney plus it could be in you think that's going to be it you think she's going to post and then that's the end of it i do i think that she's going to just do that and then keep the rest to herself i think that would be nice yeah and as always we will find out congratulations to taylor and travis yeah

And congratulations to us for finishing this podcast. This has been every single album. As always, I'm Nora Preciati. He's Nathan Hubbard. Thank you to Kaya McMullen for producing this episode and to you for listening. We'll talk to you next week.