Every Single Album - We Talk To Niall Horan! Plus, Mailbag Questions | Every Single Album

Episode Date: April 28, 2023

Nora and Nathan talk with Niall Horan about his forthcoming album 'The Show' and the second single off of it "Meltdown" (1:00). Then they open up the mailbag to answer questions like: Will Taylor Swift release ‘1989 (Taylor's Version)’ soon (20:51)? Which surprise songs have they been most sad to miss on the Eras Tour (1:00:39)? And how do they think Taylor's recent breakup might affect her music and tour (1:06:33)? Hosts: Nora Princiotti and Nathan Hubbard Guest: Niall Horan Producer: Kaya McMullen Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey, it's Sean Fennessey, one of the hosts of the Prestige TV podcast. HBO's Barry is back for a fourth and final season. And that means I'll be back recapping the show with co-creator and star Bill Hader to dive deep on the themes, scenes, and major moments in the series. Bill will provide insight into how every episode was made and why it's ending. New Prestige TV Barry recaps will go live every Sunday night when the episode ends. So make sure you're subscribed to the Prestige TV podcast wherever you get your podcasts. Hello and welcome to every single album. We are back. I'm Nora Pinciotti. As always, I'm here with Nathan Hubbard. Nathan,

it is lovely to see you today. It's nice to see you, but it's nicer to see the guest that we have on our show, Nora. Who's Nile? We talked to Nile, guys. It was so exciting. We have that conversation coming up for you. It was so much fun. I think collectively we brought up about six or seven songs in, in the Nile Horan One Direction discography that went back so far that he needed to like jog his memory and be like,

oh yeah, I remember that. We stunned him. We totally stunned him. It was great. It was really, really fun. I'd had the benefit of hearing a little bit of the new album beforehand. You did all kinds of research

coming June 9th. And absolutely froze him on a couple. It was wonderful. And just the general level of Nileness is off the charts. So we are going to have that interview, which is really, really fun in moments. It's coming at you in mere moments. And then we got a ton, just a ton of incredible mailbag submissions. So we're going to talk a little Ares tour. We're going to talk a little bit more Nile. We're going to talk a little bit about, you know, Taylor out and about in NYC. She walks among us. But without further ado, let's kick it to Nile. All right. Well, this is a very special. day on every single album because we are so excited to have Nile Horan, who's got a new album, The Show, coming out June 9th, a new single Meltdown. Really great song that's out now.

Nile, thank you so much for spending part of your morning with us. Thank you very much for having me. Thank you. So we're going to talk about the music. We're going to talk about the single. We're going to talk about the voice. But I know I have to start by letting Nathan ask you a question that I think he doesn't think you've gotten anywhere else so far. And if I don't let him do it, he's going to be really mad at me. So, Nathan, you have the floor. Yeah, I mean, look, my first question is,

what is the most underrated song from the past five years? And why is it your song, San Francisco, from the equally underrated great album, Heartbreak Weather? Oh, there's a theory on that album, I think. There are. I mean, I just, it must have been the worst timing on Earth. This is an incredible piece of music that I feel like just is never going to get the flowers

it deserved because you released it on the day the world shut down. Yeah, that's very true. It wasn't, yeah, you could say it wasn't the greatest timing of all the time. Yeah, nothing I can do about that now. It's all said and done. But yeah, I still love heartbreak weather. Very proud of it. Obviously, didn't get to take it around the world like I would like to, but it lives. It lives on. Well, in San Francisco in particular, lives on in our hearts. I remember when we, because we've covered your albums on this show and covered all the One Direction albums as well. But we have a category that is like a favorite deep cut from every album we cover. And we don't talk to each other before we do it.

So there's like an element of surprise. And both of us chose San Francisco off of Heartbreak Weather as the song that like, and the two of us were like screaming at each other being like, I can't read it's such a good song. So that is absolutely in the near to the hearts of the every single album family. Emily. Do you, like, is there any story with that song that is meaningful to you? Yeah, well, the whole, the whole song was, was, uh, written from personal experience. But yeah, the, it's got a, it's got a real Nile Horonness to it, and San Francisco. It's a song that I love and it's a, it's a fan favorite and a, like, all my friends are in agreement as well. San Francisco is the one that stands out to them as well.

Yeah, great, great song, really proud of that as well, yeah. shows that we all have good taste, I hope. So it's been three years since Heartbreak Weather. It did get released on that day that everything shut down. And I remember it is when all the sports leagues stopped playing. And that was all so crazy. You didn't get to tour that album and had some missed opportunities there. But now you've got a new album, the show coming out in June.

Did that experience, whether it was just the things that you didn't get to do with Heartbreak Weather or just the time at home to reset and think about stuff, impact what you wanted to do with this new project? Yeah, for sure. I think now that because of that, I'm probably more fired up than ever and more grateful than ever for all the things that I've happened up to now. I think we're all kind of in agreement with that. We're more grateful people, you know, for all the stuff pre-pondemic. But yeah, no, it definitely, for a while I was kind of, like we all,

were kind of like angry at the world for not allowing us to not you know with the album the way came out on that day and the tour being cancelled as you say so I feel like I've got like you know business to tend to when I get back and I've got three albums now to to perform where so I'm I'm just I'm ready to go and it definitely affected what I was writing about I think for this next one took a while for me to like want to write again during the pandemic. Obviously, the album came out summer 15th to March or whatever it was.

Why was that? Why did it take a while to want to write again? You just were still holding out for Heartbreak Weather, or it just was the moment? Yeah, I guess like I just poured all of my heart into Heartbreak Weather and had spent the previous 16th, 17 months making that thing. And then for it to come out the way it did

was just a bit like disheartening, I suppose. Yeah. And then everyone in the world was getting all creative online at the start of the pandemic and I was still a bit like, damn you, world. Yeah, then I just, I was like, right, I need to sit down and do something about this.

And, well, I didn't need to, but I definitely felt like the urge to sit down at points and just kind of see if anything would flow. And then on the first, the first night I wrote the title track of the album. It was like one of those pandemic nights where there was literally nothing going on, same routine every day.

And then it just kind of came out with me like that. And then that was the start of it all. Then it was about waiting for the world to open up so I could actually get the recordings of stuff that I'd written and make it exciting again. So part of that process led to Meltdown, which is the second single off. the album. By the time people hear this episode, it'll be out. It is a great song. It's like a really

fun pop song. To me, it makes me want to sing it with a big group of friends. When in your process did you get to that? And how did you know that that was going to be a single? I was on a writing trip in Joshua Tree last May, maybe. So about halfway through the record, probably maybe just over. and yeah, I've always wanted to write that kind of tempo song that talks about something quite dark. Like, anytime I've attempted to write like a song about like an anxious feeling or something like that, I would always end up being a ballad because I think that's where your brain naturally goes.

But then I realize actually that tempo does not, you know, doesn't, equal how it actually feels when you're doing it. So I was like, right, let's turn the tempo up and allow people to get the feeling of when you're anxious, your heart's doing 190. Totally. Your head's in its waist. And I just kind of wanted to get that tempo across. So it sits at like 180 BPM.

And yeah, I just felt like it was the right match tempo-wise. And people can dance along to it too, which is big chorus. very like one of the biggest choruses you've had in a while. Yeah and actually probably the most simple chorus I've had. Yeah. It's literally the same line about three or four times. Because I feel like I wanted to have that tension and release.

You know, in the lyric it's basically saying like, you know, it's all tension, tension, tension and it's like, well, actually when it all melts down, it'll be fine. And I wanted to have that, you know, that real like pacey verse where it's all tense and then the release of the chorus. Yeah, and probably one of the more simple choruses that I've ever written. We talked about the songwriting retreat, and you also mentioned the word ballad. I happened to a little birdie allowed me to hear, there's a ballad on this album. There's an acoustic ballad on this album that I think is the best representation of your voice ever put to tape.

And I don't want to give way the punchline, but I'm just going to say that. I think you know which one it is. But I want to ask you about the writing process, because You've worked with John Ryan and Julian Bonetta. They're all over this album. It's really been kind of a through line through your career. And it's rare to see a partnership between producer and writing partners that last this long in a lot of ways. Their writing process, I know, is a little bit different and unique. But can you just talk about what it is about their process and that partnership that works well for you and feels like home?

First of all, comfortability, I think, is a massive thing. I've known those guys since I was 17 or 18, which helped. I trust them we have very similar tastes in music and production and I feel like very comfortable when I go to tell them exactly how I feel

yeah do you guys fight I mean yeah all the time me and John are killing each other on a regular basis and like it's that's a yeah that happens a lot yeah but I just we can do that you know we've we've been around

each other's careers for 10, 11 years, which is nuts, as you say, they usually don't last that long. Well, yeah, it's a comfortability thing, I think, and it's also, if it's not broke, don't fix it. We've written, we've written some good stuff together over the years, had some great fights, some great nights. Yeah, it's definitely a comfortability thing, and they're also extremely gifted musicians and writers and producers. Speaking of some through lines that go back to some of your earlier stuff. I did notice that there is a lyric in the bridge of meltdown where you sing where there's wolves on your track catching up fast. Which got my attention because there is a song

called Wolves that I believe you wrote for Made in the A.m. That is one of my absolute favorite one direction songs ever. So like what is your deal with Niles, Nile. Is this like a special animal to you? Like, really powerful metaphor? Actually, I've never even thought of that. But, yeah, I do love the song, Wolves. Great song. It is awesome.

Yeah, I do like that song. I like the vibe of it. I don't know what the thing is with wolves. I feel like wolves, you know, the coming out at night thing. Amazing animals. Yeah. The pro-y-en feeling that you get from them.

So, yeah, it probably just comes from that. I never even thought of that. That's funny. All right. Well, think about it. Think about if that's like a real, real piece of creative, creative fuel for you.

I need to find another animal. I don't know. I kind of disagree. I think like if it's not broke, just like you said, don't fix it. Go with it. More wolves.

Just all, bring all the work. Actually, I'm feeling like concept album maybe. You could do one of those. They have those retreats where you like go stay in the woods in a glass house and you see them like come up and stuff. Wolves isn't being chased down by wolves. Yeah.

Wolves is an example of a great song that, and not unlike San Francisco, by the way, that gets put on later in the album or maybe even added on at the end. There's another one that we just have to ask you about because the listenership on every single album adores this song too. How was the song I should have kissed you not on the standard up all night album? That song is so great. What happened with that song? Do you remember? Trying to think of What's the story around that?

I don't know I think there was just so many songs flying around at that point. Yeah, you just didn't have enough. Yeah, it probably got lost in the madness because you're also going in like an opinion.

So we'd literally vote on what songs made the album, you know? So it probably comes down to that as well and there wasn't enough hands in the air for it. Yeah, great tune though. Yeah, we love that song. That was this cool like laser sounds come in at the end. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's fantastic. Your knowledge is pretty good on this stuff.

Well, we've done about, what, five or six hours of content on it. So, yeah, we've done our homework. All right. So you've got a new role this year as a coach on the voice. And of all your fellow coaches, it's really cool to see you and Kelly Clarkson sort of have a kinship in how you respond to performances, especially when there's some real emotion. coming through someone's voice. That's so cool to me since you both have similar backgrounds on music competition shows. So what I want to know first is if she's seen you

and the rest of the One Direction Boys do my life would suck without you back when you were on X Factor. I don't think she has. Oh, she's got, you have to show her. It was the secret performance. She's all right. She can do it without that. I disagree. We're going to, I'm really sorry now,

but we're going to try to get that in front of her. Well, when you get her on, because I see she's released the music, when you get her on to do this, you're going to have to show it because I'm not. Well, it can be like a reverse Kellyoki thing, maybe. Yeah, maybe. Jesus, no. Almost every single artist who's gone on one of these TV shows as a judge, it has grown their fame and their fan base.

It's been a jumping off point. I find it hard to believe that it's changed your life in any meaningful way, but is having a regular gig on a TV show changed anything about the way you interact with your fan base or the way that you get recognized or anything? Do you know what I did notice? I was in, because I hadn't been in the States since the show started rolling out

because we obviously pre-recorded a lot of it. But I was in Georgia a couple of weeks ago and the amount of people, like different demographics, all sorts coming up to me, talking to me about the voice. That was the first time I'd had that. Because obviously it's not on TV here yet in the UK.

So when I was in Georgia, I really felt the effect, the voice effect, which was amazing. So hopefully, I mean, I'll take any growth I can get. What's been your favorite part of doing it? I think working like the banter between the coaches is a good laugh. Like, that is, it's on and off camera. I got very lucky.

It could have been a disaster of a situation with pretending that we like each other and all that crap for a camera, which that's what would have worried me. but I got very lucky with the folks that I'm doing it with. And then just like literally working with the contestants and making sure they feel like they got mentored in some shape or form while they were on the show. And like picking songs and like,

because I don't really listen to a ton of like music at the moment because it's just like been my record for ages, mixing a master in that and the odd big album that comes out and you get word of mouth. So I haven't been listening to music recently. So going and then sitting on music recently. sitting online and looking for songs that suit this artist and kind of making their little mini album. So when they leave the show, they've got something to walk into a studio and go,

well, these are my references, these are my influences, and this is what I sung in the voice, and it's the way I sing this song. I really... You're going online and doing that work? Oh, yeah. I was like, well, if I'm going to do this, we need to find time where I can actually do it instead of just like being the guy that just sits on TV. We say this all the time. We said to you as we came on. You just seem to be in love with the process. You always do the work.

You've got a bunch of festival gigs coming up. It sounds like you're chomping at the bit to get out and perform this stuff because you just haven't had the chance. I'm sure you got a tour in the works. You're moving around a lot. But that brings up a big concern for us because between the soccer and the human pyramids back in the day, your knees have been a problem. How are your knees, Nile? No, great. No, the one I had surgery on is completely fine.

it's the other one that's messed. I had knee reconstruction in 2014. That one's got a big zipper down in the front of it. That's fine. The other one, I just tore the Patella tendon, which keeps my kneecap in place. What are we doing? Playing soccer running a straight line.

Come on, man. An abrupt stop, felt a pop, and fell on the floor like a sack of shit. Oh, God. So now I have to get all these, I have to get like an injection into my knee, and then they spin the blood, and then they take it out.

Oh, the, like the Kobe Bryant, the platelet, So, yeah, oh my gosh. They're like platelet rich infusion, yeah. Yeah, so I have to do that again. I have to do that soon. I've been kind of putting it off, pretending that I'm busy, but just don't want to feel the pain.

That's messed up, but I do need to get that done because I tell you what, running around that stage is going to be no fun. I actually can't run at the moment. I can barely walk. Does it change the way you tour? Are we going to be able to get you out there

to play these songs for us? Yeah, no, I'll get it started before I go anywhere. Yeah, I'll definitely be touring. obviously the festivals coming up now are just like my first. Get the album out and then just start cracking on with the festivals. It's going to be so fun. It's something that I've never done before either. So that idea of knowing that the pit and the first few thousand past the barrier

are probably going to be fans, I'd imagine. And then I just want to get that, you know, the drunk person on the way to the burger van. I want them to become Nilohoram fans. So I see it as a challenge for the next few months. Well, Nora and I are both those people, all wrapped up in one. Absolutely. That's our identity as a show, is the drunk guy on the way to the burger stand. Nile, thank you so much for joining us.

Everybody should get really excited to listen to the show. That's coming out June 9th. Go stream Meltdown and Heaven. Meltdown will be out by the time you're hearing this. Awesome song. And the voice, the playoff rounds, are going to. to be starting Monday, May 1st. You can catch Nile all over the place.

Again, thank you so much for doing this. Thank you, you guys. I'll see you soon. We'll do an end up some other time. Love it. All right. Thank you so much, so, so much again to Nile Horan for joining us for that little chat. It was really a treat.

We're going to get into our mailbag section now. We did get one question, which I feel is very relevant to the conversation that just played about Nile, which I feel like we can start with. That question is from Austin, from Seattle, who asked us, when you talk to Nile, was he as polite as he seems and were you nervous? I will answer first. And like, I'm not kidding on either one of these accounts. Like, we are very much in the bag as a podcast for Nile, but this is still true. Like, I'm still an objective person, I think, maybe. When you log on to one of these things and like, sorry, but I interview a lot of like football

players who are nice and interesting people, but like nobody in the real world has ever seen them without a helmet on or ever heard them. They do not live the experience of like being a member of one direction and getting thronged in the streets. And when you have one of these like one of these things set up, you log on and you wait for five minutes and there's four handlers on the call and everybody's, you know, know, if you're doing it on Zoom, everybody's picture off and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And they're late and yada, yada, yada.

I log into our interview, like a few minutes early because I'd been told that there was a waiting room. And the last thing in the world that I was expecting, like three minutes before this thing was supposed to start, was to just open up Zoom and see Nile sitting on Zoom going, hi, hi, Nora. Yeah. And I was like, what the heck is going on here? truly just like a very sweet, genuine, easygoing, seeming person. So thank you to Nile for being Nile. Yes. I thought you held it together wonderfully through the course of that. There was definitely, there were some odds in Vegas that there was going to be a total freak out meltdown from you. What on your, from you? Can I just, as we came on, speaking of being on Zoom,

what is the name of the hair apparatus that you have acquired that is making you look so great today? What's it called? I have a Dyson Airwrap has entered. The Dyson Airwrap has entered the chat. I don't think you Dyson Airwrapped before the Nile thing. Did you? No, I didn't. No.

But you, listen, you were a little googly-eyed afterwards in the best possible way. And he was just so kind. Right. He was just so easygoing and normal. And like, well, even the sign-off. Remember the sign-off where it was like, thank you. No, thank you. No, thank you.

Thank you. We like said a hard thing. And then like we were all, then I was expecting him to log off. And then I was like, oh, I got to get out of here. Like, this is weird. Yeah. It was great. I mean, look, we had seen him on hot wings and on the late night shows.

And on every, he's been out there doing the work. And so I, when you and I huddled. Is it hot ones? Yeah, hot ones. Sorry. They eat hot wings. They eat hot. Whatever.

And so this was a different format for us to just jump straight to the third, fourth, eighth layer of the onion. And my favorite, like, he really, I think, was genuinely stunned at the amount of research that team every single album did to get him there. So good news. We could spend two hours with them. Like, it's not even, like, it's not even research. It's just like, we've just lived this. You know, we've just had these lived experiences, uh, to pull from in discussing, like, bonus track one direction songs that Nile had to take a second so that he could remember. Yes. So we will take him up on his offer to go even deeper next time. I think he knows he's got a safe harbor here to pull it apart.

But it is, it is interesting listening to him talk about this album because he does really on this album, whereas his other colleagues from the band came out of that band and kind of ran away from it musically, he does a bit on this album run towards it in the best possible way. And we didn't have enough time to go exactly there, but I think that's one of the things that people are going to like about the record

and that in a lot of ways, I sort of feel like Nile is carrying the torch for the 1D fans. Like he's still proud as could possibly be of that association. It feels like the relationships with everybody are strong. And he's still making music

that feels like a natural evolution. Not to say like Harry's stuff wasn't necessarily natural, but to use the word that gets applied to Taylor Swift, I do think Harry's music has been contrived and planned and charted, whereas it feels like the consistency of the writing room that Nile's been in is a more natural evolution for the core group of fans. And I think it's to be commended, because as we've spoken about,

there are never, in history really, two people who evolve from a boy band. It's usually one who goes on to be the start. and you would naturally think that was Harry Stiles. And he is totally defying the historical track record here. You know, the one thing that we obviously didn't ask him and probably wouldn't out of respect, but you do wonder if we injected him with truth serum,

it would be so interesting to know how he actually feels about Harry's success and whether he felt any pressure going into the studio knowing that Harry Stiles had put out a record and had made a big hit. At that point, he probably, I think he'd already finished recording by the, time Harry won the Grammy is my guess. But that's the one bit that if we really got him in the dark room in a two-hour interview and you could lead him there would be fascinating to think about artistically how it factors into the way he thinks about making music.

But in some ways, those are two different questions, right? Is like, I do think it seems like there's very genuinely lasting mutual support. 100%. Between those guys. He went to the show. No doubt. Totally. But like I really, again, I feel like I sound incredibly in the bag, but like this is a pretty authentic person.

And at the end of the day, usually you can see through when that stuff is BS. There's a difference, though, between like being happy for somebody else's success and not feeling like it weighs on you. Well, that's right. A little bit, right? And that sort of dovetails with,

and I thought one of the things that impressed me the most, in our conversation with him is that he will pretty openly acknowledge, like, he did not get to do everything with heartbreak weather that he wanted to. And he's frustrated. And that's frustrating. And it didn't help that help him that he wasn't able to tour it and go out and promote it and do all of that stuff. And I appreciate that he doesn't totally try to put a, well, you know, everything happens for a reason, spin on it and can willingly say, like, yeah, some of that sucked. And that that drive. some of what he wants out of this upcoming record, which I think does lean into the group sing-alongs and the magic of like a great pop song that brings people together. Like that's, it's cool to be able to just be honest about that. And I'm sure there's a little bit of cross-pollination of, you know, in part because Harry's music is incredible and he's had incredible success,

but also just differences in timing and how things have gone. I think it's important part of his narrative, though, is that he has sort of persevered and navigated through that. He's the perfect personality to not feel the jealousy and envy and let that sort of weigh on him and just to sort of do his thing and keep going, right? Heartbreak weather, we talk about this all the time. It is a very highly underrated album.

I went back after the interview and listened to it over the weekend, and I was like, man, it just, it is great. Ben the Rules is freaking great. And it's the fourth song on the end. San Francisco's the 10th song or something on the record. It's like it's a terrific album. But I think he is, I'm so not interested in how he personally feels about Harry's success

because I'm sure there's a blend of lots of things, most of which is excitement and happiness and some of which invariably. It's how you respond to the insecurity or the pressure real or perceived that could come from that success. that I think is so fascinating because he's managed it better than probably any other guy coming out of a boy band where there was a clearly defined, you know, star. So I think he is unique in that way and his story matters as a result.

And for me, it makes him just, we say we're in the bag. It's just so easy to root for him. He gets it all out on the golf course, you know? Any sort of tension. Like, he just, he works through it. It's all in the swing. I have no idea what I'm saying. No, you don't. It's okay.

All right. That's Nile. I'm sure we will have many more chances to talk about what he's got coming out pretty shortly. But we did get a lot of questions about Taylor Swift. So you want to talk about that a little bit? Oh, boy. Here we go. All right. So, first things first. I mean, there's a couple of things. Yeah, there's a couple things that have happened since the last time we really talked about Taylor. Swift. Yeah, and some of those are in Taylor's life, but one of them was in your life, which is that you went to the Ares Tour, David. I did.

You went to the Ares Tour with Marcus Mumford. I did. I did. What? I went to the Vegas show, and I actually had not, it was kind of a last second thing. I was thinking that I might go see her in New York, and certainly when she comes to Los Angeles where I live, and that maybe I would dive in and go somewhere else, but. But it turned out that I know the Mumford and Sons guys a little bit, and she reached out to Marcus to set it up. And so I went to Vegas to go see the show and bit hard through my tongue to keep the secret that he was going to be the first guest coming out. And I got to watch it from a bunch of different angles. I got to watch it from the nosebleeds.

I got to watch it from side stage. I got to watch it from the floor. I got to watch it from some of the seats. So I got it like a really... Because you walked around? Yeah, I walked around. Okay. They strapped you up in one of the like...

You got into the old flying snake apparatus from the reputation door and they pulled your out of stadiums. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. No, no, no. I walked around and watched it from the soundboard. And so just tried to sort of absorb... How many steps did you get it?

in this one song. A lot. A lot, a lot, a lot, a lot. But it was fun to take the show in from a bunch of different locations because it's very different depending on how and where you sit. It's amazing no matter where you are. But what you sort of absorb is the creative thought that went into how do we make this a show for every single person in the building. And I would tell you that coming into it, I thought, okay, it's a three-hour and 15-minute show with 40, however many songs. Like, it's going to be fairly formulaic. And you'll see it once, and that'll be it. Well, you know, I would say, we've talked about this, but the 1975 did a lot for touring last fall.

They really did with that show because they understood, foundationally, that they were not actually playing to the crowd in front of them. they were playing to the internet. I took out alone to be here. Can I be on stage for a kiss? Poverty. Sexy. And it just became a thing that you had to see.

My concern with the Taylor Show was, is it going to be too long and formulate? The people are going to go once and not again. But I think she's managed to create an environment where, number one, if you see the show in two different locations, it's a different experience. being in the seats and seeing the stage, which is sort of a work of art

throughout the entire night, is one experience. And it plays into the storytelling that happens. Being on the floor, you're closer to her. You can probably see the expressions of some of the dancers who are really actors because they're putting on a play as much as anything. But you don't see the stage in the same way.

And then being up top, you have the big screens that are sort of showing the show, and you've seen some of those from TikTok. So they're just interestingly different experiences from around the venue. And then I think the excitement each night of what are those two surprise acoustic songs going to be

and is there going to be a guest? All in, it's something that you can go to more than once and have a very different but equally compelling experience. Although how much of a concern is this, given that it was, you know, to use Taylor's own language, like surviving several bear attacks just to get one set of tickets for people. I don't know that that's like at the top of the list,

but you do see it online. So it's, I think, relevant to a lot of people in that way. Yeah. That concerned tiny violin about your experience going three times, Nathan. Yeah, but look, that's not it, but I do think there's a lot of people. No, look, there's a lot of people who would go to multiple shows. And the question is, is that a good use of time and money, right? Bear attack aside, like, it's not cheap to go to that show.

and the most passionate fans, if you go to two shows and it's the exact same show, a la like the Harry shows, right? I think the Harry shows, the Harry show was great, but there wasn't a whole lot of variety from night to night. There was maybe be one song that he'd rotate in or out, but it wasn't like a surprise song that everybody was crazy about. Like, if you saw the Harry show once, you saw the Harry show.

It was in an arena, kind of the same experience, no matter where you were, wasn't a whole bunch of graphic and, you know, her jumping into the pool and swimming. This one, you definitely, I know over the course of three hours and 15 minutes, I miss something. So the extent to which I'm going to go back.

You were running from place to play. All right. All right. That's what you. How about is cowboy like me? It's like a three minute song. You were in seven different locations. I have walked around NFL stadiums quite a bit.

They're not small. No, I was there for the whole show. I was there for the whole show. And the thing that you do, having been in the business side of, I like to go to concerts and watch the crowd. Because you learn a ton about who's there, how they're experiencing it. You can see the different demographics, but you can also watch how people are processing the show.

Are they just sitting there with their phone up? Is the phone down? What kind of content are they taking? Are they posting in real time? Like, how are they communicating with their friends? It's just a fascinating way to experience a show. So I love to do that. And I love to do that from all different parts of the venue.

And yeah, I was fortunate to be able to sort of shuttle myself around. So we got a question from Lisa that is pertinent to something that I think you'd voiced as a question before you'd seen the show live. And so Lisa asked, I'm so curious how Nathan liked the folklore and Evermore songs at the concert. What is your answer? So I think I feel the same about this. I think that some were better than others. The band has rocked up a number of them to help them carry the venue.

She really leans heavily into the Stevie Nix, magical fairy, good witch thing. The outfits are great, they're flowy. She's a visual spectacle. You know, tolerate it is an entire sketch. Last Great American Dynasty is a performance. but they have to work. She's working really hard in that stadium.

I actually think the standalone acoustic surprise stuff plays better because it becomes this sing-along. Some of the Evermore and folklore songs get a little bit caught in purgatory between is this visual stadium spectacle? Is it just an acoustic thing? I'm glad she's playing the songs. I wouldn't swap really anything out,

but I think it's a hard sell and she's working super hard and she does a great job but in that moment I found myself watching her more than like really intently listening to the performance of the song. Sure. That makes sense.

I think I mean that's how I'm expecting to feel to especially I do think it's funny. I think folklore which is to me like Evermore is my favorite of those two albums. Folklore, I do give credit. I think the set list choices were very spot on.

Like, of those songs, I think it makes sense to do Betty there. The choices fit, either in the way where she can turn stuff into a real set piece, or it's the more like sing-alongy side of it. But that makes sense. I was just curious to hear how you responded to that in person. Yeah. Shall we carry on? Absolutely.

Okay. Natalie. Is she going method for 1989 Taylor's version, which I'm pretty sure that question refers to the fact that Taylor's hanging out with her friends in New York City. She's out and about. She's like every time I leave my apartment, not really because I live uptown. But like whenever I go downtown, I'm like, you there? Taylor? She could be around any corner. I'm of two minds about this. Okay.

One, well, okay, no. My answer is no. I don't think, like, I do think that this is some sort of, I'm newly single and I'm making it clear that I'm doing great and having fun and living my life, which like all power to her thing. I don't think that it's supposed to evoke I had friends and went out during the 1989 era, so I'm going to do it again. I think she's just doing, you know, she sort of wants the press.

and is courting that in a specific way, which is fine. There is a piece of me that's like, are we making too big of a deal out of this? Because we've just had the first two, like, really nice spring weeks in New York City, which, like, I don't know if you've ever experienced this because we don't have the, like, year-round L.A. weather.

The city becomes feral, like, just, like, positively feral. Yes. Everyone is, like, doing really unconscionable things. to spend as much time outside, like, drinking rosé on a sidewalk as humanly possible. It's, like, a very specific energy is that start of spring, New York City, everyone's just, like, buzzing on the streets thing. And who is Taylor to be immune to that?

Yeah, it's somewhere in between. I mean, are you okay? Like, where has she been for six years? That's the funny things. It's just like such a hard. Like, again, she is a massively famous person. That is a job that involves a specific approach to paparazzi and being seen in public. So I do not begrudge her being strategic in whatever way she wants to be about this at all.

Like, let's be honest, this is a choice when she does not want to be seen. We do not see her. That's the point. And like the first restaurant that when she went out to dinner at Via Corota in the West Village with Jack Antonoff, I forget who else was there. That restaurant is freaking tiny. They don't take reservations. So there's always just like a...

Oh, they took one for her, Nora. Sure. But there is a snaked line of people out the door at all times. Right. It has massive street facing windows. And is in like a very high density area of the city. It sounds like a Dave and bustus. Like rustic Italian day.

Like, like rustic Italian David Busters. They have a very famous salad. No. It just was like such a funny choice. Because like it's, yeah, you want to, it's a CNBC moment. It's fine. She is making a statement.

The thumbs up that she gave to the fan who brought the U.S. sign was another moment. The tweet she sent just the other day when she injured her hand and wrote, don't worry about me, I'm good. like she's telling us that she's okay. Oh my God, I didn't even think, you're like 13 levels on the hand injury. I didn't even think about that. I love this. I've taught you so much.

You have. No, no. This is all very much in service of telling everybody, I am fine. Do not worry about me. I'm out and let's do this. Because as you said, it is a choice. And it is very interesting choice because when I went to the show in Las Vegas, they are as COVID sensitive or just general illness sensitive as you could ever imagine. She is in a bubble, okay? There are a handful of people who get direct access to her. They are wearing masks at all times, and they're not interacting much with the outside world. And that is because they're smart.

There is only one thing that can fell this tour, and it is her getting sick and not being able to perform. And you saw what happened with the opening of the Adele show when she had to cancel last minute. There were people who came in from all over the world. Taylor knows that is happening. And her camp knows that is happening for these shows and that people are spending a lot of money. And the same stuff that happened with Frank Ocean and the same stuff that happened with Morgan Wallin last week. When you cancel a show and people have spent a lot of money, it's a big deal, has a big impact. They care.

They give a shit about that. So they're really trying to protect themselves to keep her. healthy, that's the only thing that can happen. I mean, almost to a point where, you know, there was a little bit of a discussion where a few of us were like, why doesn't she just lay down a vocal tape in case? You know, because like, wouldn't you rather go out there and sort of struggled through with a lot of background track than cancel a show? Well, you know, she's never going to do that in all likelihood. So trying to keep her healthy. My point is she's going out at least. She's going out. Yeah. She just wants some, like, just wants to have a couple good meals in the city.

Who doesn't? I mean, go for it. It's great. This is not, this is like, this is a comment that is coming from the worst possible corners of my personality. She's going to the weird, like, she's going to the most 2014 ass restaurants. Humanly possible. Well, that's the last time she went out, apparently. I mean, from what we can tell, she's been making pizza pockets at home in the microwave for six years while Joe, like, writes gloomy songs on the pipe organ. I don't know. She's going, like, so she went one of her, one of her dinners where she was spotted out was at Lur Fish Bar, which is in Soho, which was like, is was like a celebrity place. Yeah, it was. Last time I, but like, the last time I went there, I saw Pierce Morgan, which was so disappointing.

All right. So it's jumped the shark. But like, really jumped the shark. But that's fine. I don't think we can. She's 33 years old. Like, she's not. So she's like a little, be a little chugie? Is that what? Like, I'm not going to say it. I'm just going to say, I think maybe, you know, she's, she's making 33 year old choices, not 22 year old choices. And that's totally fine. it's going to take her a little while to ramp back up, right? I mean, I think if she gets back on Raya, you know, the first couple dates are not going to work so well. Of course, she's not getting on Raya and being silly.

But, like, she's got to work her way back into being single. She's got to learn. She doesn't know this shit. She barely knew her way out of her apartment, apparently. I, okay. Last comment here. Although, I guess the next question is kind of about this, too. I will say, like, we don't know what happened, right?

We don't know the dynamic and that's their business and whatever. The one piece where I do kind of, and I think it seems fun that she's out and hanging out with her friends, the one piece that I do kind of mourn is just that for whatever happened and maybe there was drama with Joe, maybe he did something bad. Maybe the friends are upset. Maybe they're unfollowing on social, whatever. I don't know what happened, obviously. So I'm not going to comment on it. it seemed like they had a thing. They'd figured out the privacy piece of it,

which seems like it would matter so much just to someone who lives the way that she lives. And maybe it wasn't all as worked out as it seemed like it could have been. But that seemed like such a positive thing that it made, like, I'm like, ah, I want, I want that to last for her and matter, even if like it could be great for her. Do you mean privacy or do you really mean adulting?

I don't like what's the, no, I think I mean privacy. Like it really seemed like and again, this is a complete outsiders, outside observers perspective. It did seem like at the very least he did not care about her fame. If anything, maybe it was a bad thing. Oh, I think that's the point. I think that's the point. So we can get in the next bit. but I think she made lots of sacrifices in that relationship

to try to keep her fame from affecting the relationship. And clearly, that included not going out and being photographed with friends for six years. And it may have been not natural to her. And that's like that, then she deserves to be able to do that if that's the version of her life that she wants. That's what I'm saying. Totally.

This is what I'm saying. But because in the past, some overexposure, some experiences, it seemed like, with past relationships where it was the opposite, where people were courting a spotlight through her. Yes. That is obviously not a positive thing. And the fact that she'd achieved some degree of normalcy away from that seemed valuable. So, and maybe, you know what?

Maybe the total positive spin on this is, like, like that's something that she can can take away and will be part of her life. But I just like, what? Yeah. Yeah. Look, is she going method for 1989 TV? Like if she shows up in a yellow, no, it's Becky shirt.

We know that she is, in fact. Okay. To be clear, I don't think this has anything to do with 1989 Taylor's version. No, I think this has everything to do with 2003 Taylor's version. I don't either. But I think here's what I'll say about this. And then we should move on to another question about her relationship. I'm sure. I think there are two things. One is it's just really sad. It is impossible for one of the

most famous people in the world to meet people in a normal situation. It is impossible for her to have like a normal, you know, romantic relationship. It just, she can't meet someone in the way that almost everybody else on the planet does. And it is sad that after a six-year time investment, it didn't work out. I think the people who root for her would naturally feel that way. And it just, it's going to be hard

to hit the reset button and go. So I think the fan base has felt... It's just like painful. Yeah. You know, like it's... I also don't want to... Like, there's part of it that's a little weird where it's, I mean,

breakups are awful and incredibly hard. Right. At the same time, if something's not right for her or for anyone, it's better to do it. But all, you know... All of us have been through

that situation where it's like, oh my God, I have to get back out there and get back on the horse again. How am I going to do that? Imagine being one of the most famous people in the world where people just can't act fucking normal in front of you most of the time and having to do that. It's just incredibly daunting. So I think there's a little bit of sadness from the fan base about that. There is also a thread of selfishness from the fan base who took six years to shake themselves free of the accusations from the outside world that came in towards Taylor Swift, which is, oh, she breaks,

she can't keep a relationship, she's always writing the breakups, all that stuff. The counter became, hey, she's been in the same relationship with a guy for six years, fuck off. And what I see in some of the darker corners of the fan base is really a projection of disappointment

that they don't have that anymore and that they're going to have to talk about Taylor Swift and boyfriends again. And again, That's not your job. She's okay. She's giving you the thumbs up song. Don't worry about me.

I'm good. Exactly. Exactly. She's 33. She's fine. We go a long way to go. It is okay to be 33 and single. It is.

It's so... It is. I just being publicly single for a famous woman after that amount of time comes with so much dumb baggage about like... It does. Is it automatically bad? if she doesn't have a man. And it was really stupid.

Yeah. Well, there's a protectiveness of the fan base that is not going to help the weirdness of being a single incredibly famous woman. Like Nick Cannon, who went on Howard Stern and they joked about Taylor Swift being single, and then Nick Cannon, you know, says something about inviting her on a show.

And then the entire fan base says, stay away from her. Like, she doesn't need that. She can take care of herself. Yeah, well, Nick Cannon's full. shit anyway, but whatever. All right. Yeah, I mean, fuck Nicana, but like,

you know, it's not your... It's not your job. It's okay. Like, try to give her a sense of normalcy so that she can just be. All right. We do have one more, like, breakup thing.

Okay. Which is not... I also don't want to, like, I don't want to make this, like, all the breakup questions are bad, or we don't want to talk about it. Obviously, we want to talk about it. It's what everybody's talking about.

It's, like, a total thing. I think there are some... sort of annoying undercurrents to it in certain corners, but I didn't mean to make the lead up to that question. Like, this is bad because it's actually a very good question and one that I'm excited to talk about. And it is from Tasha, who asked us, is Midnight's a breakup album?

What do you think? I think it is the album that caused the breakup. That's something very different. And I'm interested to see how the breakup affects her creative output going forward. but I believe there was a very different plan and a conversation around potentially using the re-records to buy some time off. And I think her creative self just took over

and she had to make midnights and she has had to keep creating really since the pandemic came in. I mean, for her entire career, let's be honest. But in a hyper-accelerated way since the pandemic, this woman has had the bug to keep creating. And I think it gets, naturally in the way

of the rest of her life. How could it not? Again, it is really, really not normal to be Taylor Swift. So, I mean, if you want to go fully tin hat, Nora, you want to know,

like, my craziest theory is that bejewled was a threat. And that the line, and when I meet the band, they say, do you have a man? I could still say I don't remember. Like, that maybe that was

like a threat that came through passive aggressively or through the song, but that she was sort of foretelling maybe a dissatisfaction or an ambivalence about the relationship. But I just think that this album threw her into the cycle that she's in where it's all consuming

and that for somebody who apparently wasn't into being out in public with friends in New York City spring weather for six years, that that maybe could have been... Yeah, now it's just impossible. What do you think? I guess in some ways I agree with you, although I hadn't thought about it that way, just in the sense that I think like we're so in it that I think sometimes it's like you lose the context of she really is right now in this moment. I think bigger than she has ever been.

Yes. Which is weird. Because like when, because we're so in the career arc and have been there and think about. like, okay, 1989 era as she was out and about and she's doing everything and she's everywhere and she's doing Pepsi and Capital One and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. She was not like that tour as epic and incredible as it was was not on the scale of this one. Not even close. I mean, it wasn't even on scale of the reputation tour.

No. But the thing, like what she is doing right now and I mean, we see all the streaming data and all the stuff about all the old albums are getting more and more. Yes. attention. She is massive right now and was massive with Midnights in a way that she just hasn't been. So I do think if the scale of her fame was a piece of what was difficult about that relationship, yeah, like it would make perfect sense that that would be a piece of the puzzle.

The other thing, and I don't, like, I don't mean this is like, I said this way back. back when. I don't, like, it doesn't matter. It has always, and I get why she would do it, because I think it has to do with everything that we're talking about, for the last three studio albums. So since folklore, we have been hearing about how she's started more and more to write from, right from the perspective of other characters, to veer away from autobiography, to get inspired by movies and books and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I don't doubt that that's happening. But think about what happens when you get inspired by art or by, you know, somebody's project

outside of your own life. You relay it back to yourself. Yeah. And I just remember even when folklore came out and we sort of started hearing this stuff from her was like, okay, yeah, that's interesting. But when I listen to this album, Taylor Swift's signature is, you know, not just music. but in terms of telling stories is all over so many of these songs.

And, you know, look, there's a song on folklore called Peace. But there's robbers to the east, clowns to the west. I'd give you my sunshine, give you my best, but the rain is always going to come if you're standing with me. That seems like it basically tells the story of what didn't, work here. So I guess I feel like she has been writing it for the last three, essentially. And I think it is a smart and very justifiable choice, if that's what's going on,

to throw a little bit of a red herring and to try to foreground. Oh, no, no, no, no. It's not all about me. It's, you know, don't take it too literally. Don't take it too specifically because I'm drawing inspiration from outside of my own story. I think these albums are about Taylor Swift for the, Yeah. They're always about Taylor Swift. They're always about Taylor Swift. And again, you are exactly right. She is so much bigger than she was the last time she was out taking the celebrity photos.

And there is a tension, a sadness, and also like a fascinating, like human behavioral experiment to watch somebody navigate a fan base that might love her more than any individual could if you were insecure about that sort of. thing as a potential partner, right? A woman who might love creating more than she could love an individual partner who might love her fan base as much as she could love. All of those things may or may not be true, but they play into the human vulnerability and insecurity that it would mean to be in a one-to-one relationship. And watching her navigate that becomes even more fascinating. I'm sort of less intrigued with the paparazzi photograph, like who she did, stuff, then I am, I'm just really interested to see how that manifests itself in her art. And to your point, I think it always, always manifests itself in her art, even if she's writing stories about other

things. I mean, Last Great American Dynasty is about her for crying out loud. She is very much in that. Even the parts that are about Rebecca Frickin' Harkness are also about her. It's not just about Taylor Swift at the end of the song. It's about Taylor Swift the whole time. So again, that's a good thing. Again, like a 33-year-old woman and her personal life is what it is, but it is fascinating to see how it's going to play out in the art that is still to come. There is more ahead. What we have learned more than anything is that she will not stop creating in this moment.

All right. Let's talk a little bit about the art that's playing out on stage a couple nights a week. We have a question from Joni about the surprise song. So she asked us, dream surprise songs that remain. possible. We got a couple other versions of this question about like what are the ones that have popped up at concerts that have already happened that were like, no. I will tell you mine, which when she played Tim McGraw in opening night on the piano, I was like, no. Same goes our song on guitar in Vegas. Death by a thousand cuts, she played in Dallas, but she did, I guess, mess up a lyric,

which she said if she does that, she can do it again. So I'm holding on hope. She did it. Yeah, she did it the same night that she did clean. That to me was the winner of the tour so far.

Those two, I was like, oh. Yeah. You're on your own kid in Tampa was another one that tugged at my heartstrings just because I'm still like, why is that song not on this set list? And then mean in Tampa. I think you're right about Death by 1000 cuts and Clean in Dallas.

Were there any others where you were like, oh, I wish I was there. I mean, that one, I would have been bummed if I didn't see the cowboy like me. But there's more to come, I think. The question is like, what would you be most excited about? So I want to hear, what are the ones that are still hanging out there that you really want to see? I'm still jonesing for some some more speak now. I think like long live would really get me

mine would make me really, really happy. Better man would be great. Yeah, no shit. Better man on guitar, although I would actually like her to play it on piano. I think it would be better. Because we haven't seen that. Yeah, yeah. I want to see that.

I mean, shoulda coulda would have would be incredible. I think I just would love to see her bring that out. And, I mean, the right thing to do would be to play shoulda coulda wood on guitar and then Dear John on piano. I'm like speechless. I have chills. It would be like uncomfortable, but in the best way. No, it would be amazing. This is a different vibe, a very different vibe.

I also, if Heim comes out and does nobody, no crime... Yeah, definitely are. Into it. Yeah. Immaculate vibes. You can lock that one down for sure when they're the opener. Yeah, somebody had asked a question about if we're expecting more guests, definitely. Yeah, unequivocally, yes.

There's, like, no chance that Heim and Phoebe Bridgers do not set foot. on that stage at some point. Yeah, no, they're definitely going to play. And I think there'll be more. I mean, we've seen that she's bringing everybody in for sure. I've had too much to drink tonight, and I know it's sad, but this is what I think about. I want to see a little bit more, you know, Cornelia Street or Getaway Car on piano would be really interesting. I think, you know, there's a couple evermore songs that are not in the set list.

that would be great up there. I mean, Ivy. Ivy. Ivy would be a really hard song to play on the guitar, but it's a guitar song. I would love to see her try to go do Ivy. If she doesn't, I think it's probably because it's a bonus tracks. Well, that, exactly.

Wouldn't it be great if she sang it's time to go on piano? Like that would be, you'd be like, okay, you know when it's time. You did. You left. Oh, shed a tear. the snaps from the same little breaks in your soul. Yeah, right where you left me on guitar would be interesting.

I mean, we'll know she's okay if she plays begin again on guitar. That's when we'll know. She's like somebody else has entered the chat. She just did begin again. Wait, did she? Yeah, she did begin again the last show in Houston. It was beginning again and cold as you. She did begin again?

She did begin again on the guitar and cold as you on the piano. Oh, I totally missed that she did begin again. I'm so sorry. I'm sorry to breakfast you. No. So again, I think that was all purposeful. So the last show she did begin again, she did the tweet that said,

I'm good. She gave the thumbs up to the, are you okay? Like, yes, she's absolutely speaking through these songs. All right. Now that I've got you in Conspiracy Corner, this is a question from Holly, who asked for a follow-up on your belief in the tin hat theory

that the era's red t-shirt spells Speak Now Taylor's version because, and this is Holly, but it's also me, it's looking like a real possibility. I will just refresh you. We have Blank Blank, E-A-blank, now, T-A-blank, L-O-R-R-blank-O-N. Was that good podcasting? You have dropped and ignored so much. many Vs and E's from things.

Like, this is the most... But I will say this. I think the fan base actually might have wished this into existence. It was not a thing. But like a lot of this stuff, she catches the wave and makes it a thing. There was nothing about this that was a thing.

But I am sure she's been paying attention. I just think that's statistically. Like, I need a statistician to tell us the likelihood that this would randomly happen. Because I just, it cannot be... It has to be like an infinitesimally small possibility that the letters would all fit. It's all I'm saying.

I'm bored of it because I think it is... If it happens, it's because the fan base made that happen, which is cute, but it wasn't the original plan. Okay. Well, then we have a question for Maddie, Taylor's Version, who asked us, when do you think that the next re-recording will come out? So if you're skeptical of T-shirt theory, what do you think is going on with Speak Now, Taylor's Version, 1989, Taylor's version, whatever the next week recording is.

Yeah, I'm done trying to predict this, but the last American concert is, the last American dynasty, last American show is in August. So I expect we're going to have it in the fall, probably around the time she usually releases stuff in mid-November. It seems to be gearing towards that time of year and the build-up of the campaign and using the momentum of the tour to go do it. So I'm going to guess it's speak now coming in the fall. Okay. Lawrence asked us another question that is sort of dovetails with expectations for a potentially upcoming Speak Now Taylor's version or whatever. Did you see the stuff about her filming the music video in Liverpool?

Yes. So Lawrence asked any thoughts on what song the music video she shot in Liverpool is for, if it's from Midnights, why were there props from her Speak Now tour? What happened was that after the Dallas leg, she spent some time filming there. and there was reporting that she was filming at some old landmark buildings that were part of, that were set locations for the Batman movie. So at first people were like, oh, is the vibe sort of vigilante shit because it's Batman heisty? I don't dress for women. I don't dress for men.

Lately I've been dressing for revenge. But then, people spotted Joey King. who was in the mean music video. As well as someone who looked a lot like Taylor Lautner. Yep. On the set, Taylor Lautner confirmed to have been in Liverpool for Comic-Con at the same time. And there is some footage that someone got and published of a cut where Taylor is running and stealing a painting, it looks like. but she's got a 13 on her hand

and she's got the OG curly speak now era hair. What say you? I mean, I don't... Look, first of all, she had a week off in the tour. I think it was calculated, right? It was intentional to go do this.

I'm guessing it was scheduled for England because she was going back to see Joe and the irony is that that's when it sounds like the breakup happened. To me, vigilante shit, which was speculating, about doesn't make a lot of sense. You would think that if there's another

song coming from Midnights, that the single would be karma, she's closing the tour with it. So... Yeah, and vigilantee shit isn't actually heisty. It's not heisting. It's in your face. Yeah, and it's dark. So my assumption is

because she's busy, mostly, from now until the end of August, and because editing and pulling together the video and everything takes time, that this was the week to go shoot something for Speak Now. So then what's the, like, is it haunted? Is it better than revenge? What works with a Superman?

We're doing a Superman music video with Taylor Lautner? Well, remember that some of the videos that she did for the re-records were vault tracks that we didn't know existed until they came out. And so that's my expectation. Very good point. All right. Last question. Jocelyn asked us,

do you worry that there are some songs she may not play post breakup? Can I give you mine? Sure. I mean, she's already killed invisible string. Right. So in general, I'm not that worried about this. Love Taylor. I think her romantic history is very normal and just fine.

She is playing a lot of songs about a lot of dudes that she is no longer dating and has been for a long time and that's going fine. So, like, that's going to be fine. If I have concerns, obviously Invisible String has gotten the axe.

So it seems like there's something to that. She was in tears on champagne problems. Yeah, but she's still playing it. If I have concerns, they're about sweet nothing. They said the end is coming. Everyone's up to something. I found myself around

and oh dear sweet nothing. Because it doesn't seem like the William Bowery songs are out. Obviously, she's doing champagne problems, even though it does seem like it gets her in her feels. But that was just the tube of them, and it is such an intimate, like, sweet lullaby to my boyfriend's song. It's also a song that I love and, like, want to hear. So that is where my concerns lie is with sweet nothing.

So there, I'm not so worried about that song because it didn't move me in the way that it moved you. But I think you're right that that would be on the chopping block. There's one that I think is the really interesting, just like existential thing, which is exile. Will she play exile if Justin Vernon comes out? I think I've seen this film before. And I didn't like the ending. I'm not sure problem anymore. Like that was a

I think she I think yes Yeah I Because it's a relatively big song And I also don't think like I mean I don't know I don't know the story

of the real story of how the creation of that and Joe's part of it happened But like there were a lot of people involved in creating that song And I bet I think the fans think of that much more As like that whole folklore evermore

Avengers team working on those songs and doing that, then like this is a song that Taylor and Joe wrote together. So I think we're okay on exile. I think we're okay on, you know, we're certainly okay on Betty, right? We're okay on champion problem.

So I think exile will fall into that group. Okay. Well, so then there's two that, to me, should be of the most concern. And the one is less of a concern to me, and I think probably more of a concern to the majority of the fan base, which is Cornelius Street. Right.

And then the one that is the closest to my heart that is one of my favorite Taylor Swift songs ever that I'm worried we're never going to hear is call it what you want to. My babies fly like a jet stream high above the whole scene loves me like I'm brand new.

At least call it what you want was like a while ago. If I think we will hear, I don't know, you're right. You're right. Those should go on the list. That one is very, very intimate.

Like, what we found through this tour is that, like, she is super capable of playing a million songs in a show and not even playing an album. So, like, she has to make cuts, right? We're not going to hear everything going forward. The catalog is just too big.

Call it what you want. You know, back part of reputation. I just don't know that we're going to hear it. I do think that song has become, that is one of those songs that's taken on a little bit of a separate life with the fan base and how the reputation era has sort of evolved in its perception and how that's so special to a lot of fans. I think it's possible for that song to sort of be about her recovery process from 2016 and like kind of just reorganizing her life. And that way, obviously that seemed to have a lot to do with Joe. But I think, like, my hope would be that that can be, like, she can think of that and it can kind of exist as this thing that's a little bit about ignoring the outside world, whether it's

with a partner or just for yourself. So maybe it continues to have a life in that way. Cornelia Street, I'm going to hope, doesn't go anywhere just because it's such a big song to the fans. but if she gets through the MetLife swing of this and that's not a surprise song, I'm worried. Okay. All right. I think that's the end of our list, Nathan. It was a delight to be here and chat with you and chat with Nile.

It's good to be back. This has been every single album. As always, I'm Nora Pinciotti. He is Nathan Hubbard. Thank you so much to Kai Mammolin for producing this episode. And we'll be back with you soon.