Everything Everywhere Daily: History, Science, Geography & More - The Gulf of Tonkin Incident

Episode Date: May 31, 2024

In August of 1964, an event occurred off the waters of North Vietnam that would have repercussions that would echo in US foreign policy for decades.  Two alleged confrontations between US Navy vessels and North Vietnamese ships set off a chain of events that resulted in a dramatic escalation in the United States' involvement in Vietnam and a subsequent backlash that would change military policy to the present day.  Learn more about the Gulf of Tonkin Incident and the event that began the large-scale US military presence in Vietnam on this episode of Everything Everywhere Daily. Sponsors Available nationally, look for a bottle of Heaven Hill Bottled-in-Bond at your local store. Find out more at heavenhilldistillery.com/hh-bottled-in-bond.php Sign up today at butcherbox.com/daily and use code daily to choose your free offer and get $20 off. Visit BetterHelp.com/everywhere today to get 10% off your first month. Use the code EverythingEverywhere for a 20% discount on a subscription at Newspapers.com. Visit meminto.com and get 15% off with code EED15.  Listen to Expedition Unknown wherever you get your podcasts.  Get started with a $13 trial set for just $3 at harrys.com/EVERYTHING. Subscribe to the podcast!  https://link.chtbl.com/EverythingEverywhere?sid=ShowNotes -------------------------------- Executive Producer: Charles Daniel Associate Producers: Ben Long & Cameron Kieffer   Become a supporter on Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/everythingeverywhere Update your podcast app at newpodcastapps.com Discord Server: https://discord.gg/UkRUJFh Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/everythingeverywhere/ Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/everythingeverywheredaily Twitter: https://twitter.com/everywheretrip Website: https://everything-everywhere.com/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In August of 1964, an event occurred off the waters of North Vietnam that would have repercussions that would echo in U.S. foreign policy for decades. Two alleged confrontations between U.S. Navy vessels and North Vietnamese ships saw off a chain of events that resulted in a dramatic escalation in the United States' involvement in Vietnam and a subsequent backlash that would change military policy to the present day. Learn more about the Gulf of Tonkin incident and the event that began the large-scale U.S. military presence in Vietnam on this episode of Everything Everywhere Daily. What if your perceptions about the past were wrong?

ThruLine is a podcast that takes you back in time to uncover the parts of the story that may have gone unnoticed. It effectively turned day into night. And how it shaped the world now. Time travel with us every week on the Thurline podcast from NPR. The Vietnam War is a nuanced and complicated subject. The story really began several centuries ago when France colonized parts of Southeast Asia, which they called Indochina. The fight for independence by the Vietnamese had been going on for decades,

but began in earnest after the end of the Second World War. Communist forces led by Ho Chi Minh managed to take over the northern part of the country in 1945, and in 1954, the North Vietnamese delivered a crushing blow to the French at the Battle of Dienben Fu. The United States' involvement in the region began small with the support of the creation of the nation of South Vietnam in 1955. The United States provided economic and military aid, but was not yet a major regional player. Under President John F. Kennedy, the United States increased U.S. military support and sent a limited number of military advisors to South Vietnam. The United States, via the Central Intelligence Agency, eventually was behind a military coup in the assassination of President

No. Dinsium in 1963. From 1960 to 1964, the number of U.S. military advisors in Vietnam increased steadily. There were 900 advisors deployed in 1960, which had grown to 24,000 by 1964. That was a large increase, but it was nothing compared to what would happen over the next several years. The causes of the Vietnam War and the beginnings of American involvement will be addressed in future episodes of this podcast. But in this episode, I want to address the event that changed the United States. United States' role from advisors to active combatants, the Gulf of Tonkin incident. In hindsight, the Gulf of Tonkin incident seems like a rather minor affair. There have been

much bigger incidents between the United States and other countries that did not result in a full-scale war. The Gulf of Tonkin incident was really two separate incidents. Sort of. That sort of part turned into one of the biggest controversies in the history of U.S. foreign policy. The Gulf of Tonkin is the sea between North Vietnam and China's Hainan Island. The United States Navy had a presence in the Gulf of Tonkin performing signal intelligence off the coast of North Vietnam. These intelligence missions were known as DeSoto Patrules, an acronym that stood for De Haven Special Operations off Sing Tao.

The Dehaven was the ship that originally started the operations, and Sing Tao is in northern China where the signal intelligence originally took place. On August 2nd, 1964, the American destroyer USS Maddox was on a DeSoto mission in the Gulf of Tonkin gathering signal intelligence from North Vietnam. While on patrol, approximately 28 miles off the shore in international waters, the Maddox encountered three North Vietnamese torpedo boats, each carrying two torpedoes with high-explosos with high-explosos. The torpedo boats began approaching the Maddox at high speeds. The Maddox fired warning shots and the North Vietnamese boats responded with machine gun fire. The North Vietnamese boats maneuvered to get into position to fire their torpedoes.

Two of the boats fired both of their torpedoes, but they were well outside of their effective range of 1,000 yards. The Maddox called for assistance, and aircraft from the USS Taekonda Roga intercepted the North Vietnamese boats. In the ensuing fight, all three of the North Vietnamese boats were damaged and four North Vietnamese sailors were killed. On the American side, no one was killed, and no one was injured. One aircraft was slightly damaged, and there was one bullet that hit the Maddox. The Maddox then withdrew and continued its patrol with another ship,

the USS Turner Joy. The events of August 2nd are fairly well agreed upon, and there isn't much controversy surrounding what happened. There were plenty of witnesses and evidence from both sides. In the big scheme of things, this whole incident really wasn't that big of a deal, at least on the American side. There were no casualties,

the damage was very minor. However, I mentioned before that the Gulf of Tonkin incident actually involved two different incidents. The second incident, which caused the most controversy, took place two days later on August 4th. The Maddox and the Turner Joy were once again on patrol, with crews on very high alert following the events that happened two days earlier. President Lyndon Johnson ordered the ships back on patrol in a show of American resolve. That morning, U.S. intelligence received reports that the North Vietnamese might conduct offensive operations in response to what happened on August 2nd and also because of attacks by South Vietnam on August 3rd. August 4th saw poor weather with rough seas and storms. Waves were up to six feet or

two meters high with very little visibility. In addition, the Maddox's long-range air search radar and the Turner Joy's fire control radar were both not working. Given the intelligence of that day, the Maddox and the Turner Joy were both ordered further back out to sea to give them more room to maneuver. In the evening, they were about 100 miles from the coast of North Vietnam. Around 8.40 p.m., the Maddox began getting strange signals. They reported sonar readings of multiple targets that were incoming, seemingly from all directions. Some of the targets had the signature of torpedoes, but then they would disappear. Both destroyers took evasive action and fired at the targets. Collectively, they fired 249-5-inch shells, 123-3-inch shells, and dropped

four or five depth charges. The Maddox and Turner Joy both radioed that they were under attack. Despite all of the activity, there were no visual sightings of any ships or any torpedoes. Word of the attack was sent to Washington, and it was relayed to the president. That evening, on August 4th, in Washington on the other side of the world, President Johnson, made a television address to the American people. He told the American people of the attack and requested authority from Congress to respond militarily. Congress acted quickly. On August 7th, both houses of Congress passed the Gulf of Tonkin resolution, which gave the president the ability to unilaterally use conventional military force in Southeast Asia without a declaration of war

or further approval of Congress. On August 10th, it was enacted into law. The Gulf of Tonkin resolution was perhaps the single biggest increase in presidential power with regards to military matters since the ratification of the Constitution. With the passage of the Gulf of Tonkin resolution, U.S. military involvement in Vietnam expanded rapidly. The 23,000 U.S. troops in Vietnam in 1964 expanded to a high of over 536,000 by 1968. The events I've just described to you so far is what the American people and most members of Congress were told back in 1964. However, there is more to the story. Things which were known almost immediately on August 4th, 1964, that were never released

to the public until years later. Basically, there was no attack on August 4th. There was never any evidence that an attack took place, and this error was known almost immediately. The commander of the Maddox, Captain John, Herrick sent a notification soon after they thought they were under attack, which said, quote, entire action leaves many doubts except for apparent ambush at beginning, suggest thorough reconnaissance in daylight by aircraft, end quote. It was eventually concluded that the sonar sounds that were heard were actually the sounds

of the propeller when the ship turned suddenly, and the radar signatures that kept coming and going were picking up the tops of waves. A single aircraft was sent from the USS Taekonga Roga to survey the site where the Maddox and Turner Joy were supposedly attacked. The plane was flown by then-commander James Stockdale. And just as an aside, Stockdale later became the highest-ranking naval officer to be held as a prisoner of war, serving seven years in a Vietnamese prison. He was later awarded the Medal of Honor and promoted to the rank of Vice Admiral. He was also the vice presidential candidate on the ticket with Ross Prys.

Rowe in 1992. Stockdale later reported what he saw when he flew over to investigate. He said, quote, I had the best seat in the house to watch that event, and our destroyers were just shooting at phantom targets. There were no PT boats there. There was nothing but black water and American firepower. End quote.

On the evening of August 4th, Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara did receive the reports that there may not have been an attack after all. Also on the evening of August 4th, one of the analysts on duty in the Pentagon, who ironically was there for his first day of work that received the communicates from the Manox, was Daniel Ellsberg. Daniel Ellsberg was the same person who leaked the confidential Pentagon papers in 1971. The document that he leaked was actually titled, The History of U.S. decision-making in Vietnam, 1945 to 1968, which Ellsberg had helped write while working with the RAND Corporation. The Pentagon Papers exposed the fact that the Johnson administration had manipulated the events

surrounding the Gulf of Tonkin incident to justify increased military intervention in Vietnam. The paper showed that the second attack on August 4, 1964, likely did not occur, and yet it was used to rally support for the Gulf of Tonkin resolution. Years after the war in 1995, the former Secretary of Defense under Johnson at the time of the Gulf of Tonkin incident, Robert McNamara, visited Vietnam. There, he met with the Minister of Defense of North Vietnam at the time, Vaux Nguyen Gap. During their meeting, McNamara bluntly asked him what happened on August 4, 1964, and Gap responded, absolutely nothing. In the 2003 documentary about Robert McNamara, the fog of war, a movie I highly recommend,

McNamara on camera admits that the entire August 4th attack never happened. Finally, in 2001, a report issued by Robert J. Hanyuck, a historian for the National Security Agency, concluded that the NSA had distorted information about the Gulf of Tonkin. In his report, he said, quote,

as much as anything else, it was an awareness that Johnson would brook no uncertainty that could undermine his position. Faced with this attitude, CIA agent Ray Klein was quoted as saying, We knew it was bum-dope that we were getting from the Seventh Fleet, but we were told only to give facts with no elaboration on the nature of the evidence. Everyone knew how volatile LBJ was.

He did not like to deal with uncertainties. End quote. After the release of the Pentagon Papers, and after knowledge about the truth of what happened in the Gulf of Tonkin became widely known, it evoked a reaction by Congress. In 1973, Congress passed the War Powers Act. which took away many of the powers given to the President in the Gulf of Tonkin resolution in 1964. The key stipulations of the War Powers Act are that the President must notify Congress within 48 hours of committing armed forces to military action

and that U.S. forces cannot remain engaged in hostilities for more than 60 days, with a further 30-day withdrawal period without a congressional authorization for use of military force or a declaration of war. The Gulf of Tonkin incident, from a military standpoint, was not a major affair. Compared to what would come later in the war, it was one of the most insignificant actions of the war. Nonetheless, it turned out to be an incredibly significant event and one of the most important of the Cold War, simply because of what it brought about. It was responsible for the passage of the Gulf of Tonkin Resolution, which paved the way for the wide-scale American escalation of the Vietnam War.

The executive producer of Everything Everywhere Daily is Charles Daniel. The associate producers are Ben Long and Cameron Kiefer. Today's review comes from listener Darth Vader over on Apple Podcasts in the United States. They write, best podcast ever. Great show. I especially like the war operation and kidnapping episodes and hope to see more of these episodes in the future. Well, thank you, Darth Vader. It's always nice to see some of the Sith lords enjoying the show.

And if you like war operations and kidnapping episodes, I think I can rebut between the lines to figure out what you really want. An episode about Order 66. Remember, if you leave a review or semi-a-bustogram, you too can have it read on the show. My fellow Americans, as president and commander-in-chief, it is my duty to the American people to report that renewed hostile actions against United States ships on the high seas and the United States. Gulf of Tonkin have today required me to order the military forces of the United States to take action in reply. The initial attack on the destroyer Maddox on August 2nd was repeated today.