Everything Everywhere Daily: History, Science, Geography & More - The Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact (Encore)

Starting point is 00:00:00 The following is an encore presentation of Everything Everywhere Daily. When most people think of World War II, they think of the allied powers of the United States, the UK, and the Soviet Union versus the Axis powers of Germany, Italy, and Japan. However, this wasn't always the case. At the start of the war in Europe, Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union actually coordinated with each other to invade their neighbors. Learn more about the Ribbentrop Molotov Pact and how the Nazis and the Soviets were allies before they were enemies on this episode of Everything Everywhere Daily.

Starting point is 00:00:34 What if your perceptions about the past were wrong? ThruLine is a podcast that takes you back in time to uncover the parts of the story that may have gone unnoticed. It effectively turned day into night. And how it shaped the world now. Time travel with us every week on the Thurline podcast from NPR. Historically, relations between Germany and Russia, were a mixed bag at best. They were both European land powers that often butted up against each other

Starting point is 00:01:21 in or around Poland. There were enemies in World War I, and each country killed hundreds of thousands of the other soldiers. After the war, each country underwent a radical, societal, and political transformation. Russia was swept up in a communist revolution, had a civil war, and then settled in with a couple of dictators. Germany had their economy collapse, had a shaky democracy for a few years, and then fell under control of the Nazi party. In the interwar years, the relations between Germany and the Soviet Union were okay. In 1922, the Weimar Republic and the Soviet Union signed the Treaty of Rapalo, where they renounced any territorial and financial claims against the other.

Starting point is 00:01:59 In 1926, they signed the Treaty of Berlin, where they agreed to remain neutral if either country was attacked. In the 1930s, the rise of the Nazi party put a strain on the relations to the two countries. The Nazis didn't think much of either Slavic people or communists, and the Soviets didn't think much of the fascists and Nazi party. And I'm putting that mildly. In 1936, they fought a sort of cold war against each other during the Spanish Civil War. The Nazis backed the nationalists and the Soviets backed the Republicans.

Starting point is 00:02:29 1936 was also the year that Germany, Italy, and Japan signed the anti-commonetern pact, which was originally intended to be an anti-communist agreement. The Japanese wanted it to be an explicit anti-Soviet alliance, and that was exactly how the Soviets took it. By 1939, Britain signed a defense treaty with Poland, which began to isolate Germany from the West. Russia had always had bad relations with the Western capitalist countries. Early 1939 was a whirlpool of diplomacy. Everyone seemed to know that something was going to happen. No one really liked anyone else, and everyone was angling for some sort of alliance.

Starting point is 00:03:06 The Soviets wanted an alliance with France to protect themselves against Germany, but they were also talking to Britain as well. It was in this environment in early 1939 that the German government made discrete overtures to the Soviets. Their argument was simply that Germany could offer the Soviets a better deal than the British could. On March 10th, Hitler made a public speech where he basically said just that. On that same day, Stalin made a speech where he alluded that he thought that the Western countries were trying to go Germany into conflict with the Soviets. The Soviets also knew, due to spies placed in the German embassy in Poland, that Germany was probably going to attack Poland sometime that year.

Starting point is 00:03:46 In April, the Soviets made advances to Germany to indicate that they could live with each other and that they saw no reason for conflict. However, at the same time, they were negotiating with both France and Britain. In May, Stalin appointed Vyacheslav Molotov as the new Minister of Foreign Affairs, and told him he could expand talks to Germany as well as France and Britain. And yes, he is the namesake of the Molotov cocktail. More on that in a bit. Hitler eventually slipped the one thing that really got Stalin's attention. If he invaded Poland, he would be willing to let the Soviets have a piece. Not only could the Soviets get a piece of Poland, but they could also get what they really wanted, the Baltic states.

Starting point is 00:04:26 Secret talks continued throughout the summer until they finally agreed to sign a formal treaty. On August 23rd, the German Reich Minister of Foreign Affairs, Yolk von Ribbentrop flew to Moscow. The Soviets did a complete 180 in preparation for the visit of Ribbon Trembuds. Trop. Antifascist movies and propaganda were suddenly forbidden. A Soviet band played Deutsche, Deutschland, Deutscheubleaulde's arrival at the airport. Swastika flags were flown alongside Hammer and Sickles on the street to welcome Ribbentrop. Ribbentrop went to the Kremlin directly, where he began the final negotiations with Stalin and Molotov. Hiller had proposed a 100-year non-aggression pact, but Stalin thought that 10 years would be sufficient for now, and 10 years is what they

Starting point is 00:05:09 agreed to. They also agreed to remain neutral should either country enter a conflict with another country. They confirmed the economic agreement, which had been hammered out during the previous weeks. Germany would give the Soviets 120 million Reichmark for the purpose of buying German industrial goods. They would also loan an additional 200 million Reichmark over the next seven years. The Soviets, in turn, would pay back the loan with interest by sending raw goods to Germany. These were the terms that the rest of the world knew about. However, there was also a lot of the also a secret protocol that Ribbentrop and Molotov agreed to. Not only was this not revealed to the public, but the Soviets denied its existence until 1989. In the secret protocol, both countries

Starting point is 00:05:52 agreed to spheres of influence. Poland was to be divided between the two countries, with Germany getting most of it, and the Soviet Union getting the eastern part that had Ukrainians living there. The Soviets were also to get Finland, Estonia, Latvia, and Bessarabia, which is mostly modern-day Moldova, but was then part of Romania. In an addendum to the secret protocol a month later, the Soviets also got control of Lithuania. The Soviets had begun the process of occupying Estonia and Latvia months earlier. While this agreement is often called a non-aggression pact, it was the secret protocol that made it so much more. The Germans and the Soviets were working together to divide up Eastern Europe. They were in a way de facto allies. They didn't agree to work

Starting point is 00:06:36 together militarily, but they did work together economically, and they did jointly partition much of Europe. Ribbentrop phoned Hitler several times throughout the negotiations, and when they were concluded, Hitler was a static. This was the last piece of the puzzle he needed before invading Poland. News of the agreement leaked fast. It was in major newspapers the next day. To say it shook the world would be an understatement. No one expected these two countries to work together. The Soviets had been talking to the French and the British all throughout August, and neither country had any clue this would be announced. Just a week later, on September 1st, Germany invaded Poland. Britain and France then declared war on Germany in return, and World War II was underway. Surprisingly,

Starting point is 00:07:20 even though Britain and France declared war on Germany because they invaded Poland, they didn't declare war in the Soviet Union when they invaded Poland on September 17th, even though they were required to do so by treaty. The Soviet occupation of the Baltics and Moldova ended up lasting over 50 years. Today, the Baltic countries do not consider their date of independence to be the collapse of the Soviet Union, because they consider that period to only be an occupation. The Soviets also tempted an invasion of Finland, which totally didn't work. And I'm going to save that for a future episode, because how the invasion failed is a fascinating story. By the way, you might be familiar with the Soviet foreign minister Molotov's name from the Molotov cocktail. The Molotov cocktail was created in

Starting point is 00:08:04 Finland during the resistance to the Soviet invasion, and it was a pejorative term in reference to Molotov's role in the treaty which allowed the Soviets to invade. For those of you who don't know how World War II ended, spoiler alert, Hitler eventually broke the treaty and invaded the Soviet Union 22 months after it was signed. The Soviets literally kept to the terms of the agreement up until the day of the invasion. There are records of boxcars of Soviet materials crossing into German territory, just hours before Germany invaded. While the Allies had suspicions about the secret pact, they didn't actually find evidence until they found the documents after the fall of Germany in 1945. As I mentioned before, the Soviets denied it for half a century. The Ribbentrop-Molatov

Starting point is 00:08:49 pact is often overlooked in history. It messes up the clean narrative of the Axis and the Allies. Many people say it was the Soviet Union who really won World War II due to the enormous losses they both inflicted and absorbed. However, if you count that, and I think you should, I think you also have to put the Ribbentrop-Molatov pact on the other side of the ledger. The Soviets basically enabled Nazi Germany. If it wasn't for the secret protocol, Germany might never have been able to invade Poland when it did. And had the Second World War happened, it might have played out very differently. The associate producers of Everything Everywhere Daily are Thor Thompson and Peter Bennett. Today's review comes from listener Eeyore Mom, who writes over on Apple Podcasts.

Starting point is 00:09:37 Daily Must Listen. Always excited to see this daily episode in my feed. Thank you very much, Eeyore Mom. Why are at it, could you possibly tell Piglet Mom, Poo Mom, and Tigger Mom about the show as well? I think they would also like it. Remember, if you leave a review or send a question, you two can have it read on the show.

Everything Everywhere Daily: History, Science, Geography & More - The Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact (Encore)

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