Everything Is Content - It Girl Nicola Coughlan, viral street interviews and birthing honesty

Episode Date: June 21, 2024

Today on Everything Is Content - we dive into the It Girl of the moment - Nicola Coughlan. She’s the latest Skims girlie and we are so here for it! When’s it our turn, Kim?! We also take a dive into the world of street interviews. What happens when a voxpop goes viral, and are there moral implications we should consider? We also discuss Louise Thompson’s interview with her former Made In Chelsea co-star Jamie Laing, where she opens up about some of the traumas she has faced around motherhood and birth.Our conversation about Louise Thompson mentions birth loss, trauma and PTSD - so please tread carefully if you find any of those topics upsetting. —HANNAH BERVOETS: We Had To Remove This PostJACQUELINE HARPMAN: I Who Have Never Known MenNETFLIX: Perfect MatchOFF AIR WITH FI AND JANE: Miquita and Andi OliverSTIRRING IT UP: with Miquita and Andi OliverADULTING: The PodmotherMOYA LOTHIAN-MCLEAN: Are You Voting In The General Election?INSTAGRAM: Meet Cutes NYCTIKTOK: Guys I had no idea this was Baz LuhrmannTIKTOK: Selena Gomez, because of all she’s been throughNETFLIX: BridgertonGLAMOUR: Bridgerton's Nicola Coughlan is Kim Kardashian's latest Skims girlieGOOD COMPANY: Louise ThompsonBBC IPLAYER: This Is Going To Hurt—Follow us on Instagram:@everythingiscontentpod @beth_mccoll @ruchira_sharma@oenone ---Everything Is Content is produced by Faye Lawrence for We Are GrapeExec Producer: James Norman-FyfeMusic: James RichardsonPhotography: Rebecca Need-Meenar Artwork: Joe Gardner  Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

you know it's hard sorry because i haven't got my glasses i can't see my phone so close to the microphone i'm beth i'm richara and i'm anoni and this is everything is content on this podcast we get together to dissect and discuss the discourse. This is the place to be for pop culture analysis. We are the salt on the padron pepper of content. Make sure you follow us on Instagram and TikTok at everythingiscontentpod. Send us suggestions of topics you want to hear us chat about, tell us if you disagree, or just send us memes. We're here for all of it. Today on the podcast, we're going to discuss the morality of street interviews, the new iconic Skims Gorley, and Louise Thompson's emotional interview with Jamie Lang.

Okay, girlies, what have you been loving this week? This week, I have been loving novellas, one novella in particular, but I just kind of, novellas are basically like reading a book but really short it's like a great life hack I think to read loads on holiday and I've read a really good one which came out in 2021 I wonder if you both have read it called We Had to Remove This Post by Hannah Bavutz which is a novella about a content moderator working at like an unnamed internet platform so her job is to review all of the most horrific stuff that gets uploaded and then deciding by like the laws and the terms and conditions whether it gets removed or not and

it's about how doing that work like kind of begins to chip away at her psyche and her relationships and it is quite it's quite disturbing so I guess like viewer discretion but having said that I think if you're on the internet anyway and have been for as long as we have it will probably feel like oh that's nothing to what I've seen if that makes sense I was reading it and then I had to put it away because it was like 11 at night and I was like actually this is quite disturbing but it's really interesting as like a very online person have you heard of this book apparently was huge when it came out no I, I've not heard of it. That sounds amazing.

Are you searching for novellas or is it just so happens the books you're choosing are novellas? It might've been a book chocker that was like, these are the top 10 like short books or short novels. So I got it via a social media post which was dedicated to it because I do think in the shops,

they must have a special section for them like short story collections, which often aren't really front and center. And it really made me think, I think Ruchira, it was you who was saying that after university you just could not read actually maybe I know you said it as well and I think anyone who has that kind of difficult relationship with reading get a novella get a novella I think don't try and force what's a long book like a tall story down your down your neck just do get a little snappy book get a there's this one which is very good I have never known men this was a very short very excellent book that came out I

think in the 70s and was re-released that's very good get a short story collection um and just like you know ease back in. Ruchira what have you been loving this week? So I have been loving something which is yeah lowest of the lowbrow it It's called Perfect Match. It's Netflix's, I guess, rival to Love Island, which is on at the moment at the same time. Have you, have either of you watched this? I haven't watched it. I have seen the like, thing on Netflix and I was like, God, that is a bit of me. It's such trash. You have to absolutely jump absolutely jump into it essentially they haul ass for all of the former netflix you know reality tv contestants from the universe the multiverse i should say

and just like bring them together onto one island and get them to just like hook up with each other and that's that's the premise of the show that's it who is on it who is on it that we might recognize from all the other um dating shows so there's micah from love is blind who is on it who is on it that we won't recognize from all the other um dating shows so there's micah from love is blind who is quite a big one yep and then also harry jowsey from too hot to handle series one who is the ex of francesca fargo i don't like him no offense to him he's pure villainy on the show he's so compelling to watch because every single episode you're like, I don't know what this guy's going to do

and I don't think he knows what he's going to do. Agent of chaos. Literally. Every week is dramatic. Right from the jump, it's just like pure reality filth. It's so, so good. I definitely recommend. Love that.

Okay, I might give that a go. And Aini, what have you been loving? So you know how I love Miss Me with Makita Oliver and Lily Allen. And I also love Off Air with Jane Garvey and Fee Glover. I listened to Andy Oliver and Makeda Oliver on Off Air with Jane Garvey and Fee Glover and found out that Makeda and Andy have their own podcast. So started listening to that.

That just broke my brain, all the names. I was like, wait, what? We need like a diagram for this. So Andy Oliver and Makeda Oliver, obviously mother and daughter, they have their own podcast called Staring Up. just broke my brain all the names I was like wait what we need like a diagram for this so Andy Oliver and Makita Oliver obviously mother and daughter they have their own podcast called Staring Up and I was like well let me give this a go and first of all I listened to the Mother's Day special which is Andy and Makita interviewing each other which is so sweet because Andy had Makita when she was maybe like 22 23 she kind of was working in London doing really cool jobs like presenting and like just

doing lots of performing and she kind of just had a baby and brought the baby with her she was like running these nightclubs she was like just put you under the till and we go to the event and then I'd like take you home and then the second one I listened to is with her dad who's actually her stepdad who was basically Andy's love of her life that she met in her 30s and then he kind of brought up Makita so Garfield is Andy's partner and it was his birthday and they'd given Makita their last 10 pounds and they literally had like 20p and they were like oh no but it's his birthday like I really want to celebrate it and then like one of their really good friends came around like took them up for a tie and then because obviously like Andy and Makita are quite close in age and then

she's got this like father figure who's so present and like such a good dad even though it's like he's not actually her dad and they had like such a difficult situation where they really didn't have anything and they were really struggling to get by but the love between these people is so gorgeous and you're just sometimes like it's not the perfect picture you're painted in terms of like how things are meant to go in terms of like you meet someone then you get married you have a baby and you're kind of like financially stable they didn't have any of those pillars that everyone tells you you need to have and yet the dynamic between them is just so gorgeous so that has been very heartwarming oh I love a mother daughter podcast me too I think when done well I think it's so true I mean me and my mom would probably just start arguing and then never record again I love I love it I think it's

so sweet I think I need to get some recommendations on that from you because I feel like I don't love the mother daughter podcast but I also haven't listened to loads of them I'm just thinking of like the real like cliche ones that aren't done very well do you listen to table manners or is that one of the ones you meant no I've actually never listened to table manners but I know that's meant to be really good so that's really good and also I once my first episode of adulting was with me and my mum and it still had the most downloads and I loved it and I when you say to us like can we do a podcast together I was like mum they're so successful like you can actually make some money she's like I'm really busy oh what would you do if she did one with your sister oh my god both are your sisters and then she just didn't want to do one with you I was like it's so easy

and like you'll get paid she's like I just really don't think i've got the time she's busy she's booked and busy i'm sorry she's booked you're busy i know honestly i was like i was campaigning it honest i genuinely think we could have been so successful but she killed my dream i really want to listen to a table man that's kind of just say but i really hate the idea of are they just chewing while talking because they're eating aren't they they are eating the best episodes are like the earlier ones but it's so good because they just argue it's so unfiltered like jesse's like mom stop it then he's like oh shut up stupid it's so funny i actually just love their dynamic i don't really care about the guests but they got so many complaints at the beginning because they would just talk over each other and like start arguing

and basically just ignore be like a really famous person with them and they're just like and i used to love that but they do it less now because they would get like one star reviews like i want to hear the guest and I always find that funny in podcasts. I actually mostly just normally want to hear that. I'm listening for the host more often than not. Yeah. Unless it's Bob Mortimer, I will listen to every podcast he's ever done. Oh, yeah.

Me too. One thing I would really like to talk about with you girls is street interviews. It's something that we see a lot on the timeline, you know, people approaching members of the general public on the street, asking them questions, and these responses often go viral very, very quickly. Last week, journalist Moya Lothian-McLean posted a video to her Instagram of her interviewing a woman on the street in Ashford about whether she was going to vote in the general election. The clip was a trailer for a longer documentary that she was presenting for Navarra Media called This is the Unluckiest Constituency in the Country, Moya Goes to Ashfield. For anyone who isn't aware of Moya's work, she was the former politics editor

for Galdem and she's written for publications like the New York Times, BBC, The Guardian and Vice. Moya identifies as mixed race black and she often writes about under-reported stories and marginalised voices. So in the video Moya asks the woman if she's voting in the general election. Moya wrote in the caption, this was the moment an interviewee told me I wasn't English and Enoch Powell had the right idea. I was in Lee Anderson's constituency in Nottinghamshire with Novara Media doing some reporting to shed light on the electoral race there and what it says about the issues cutting through to voters. What we found shocked me. This encounter was, sadly, not an outlier. It's a really, really shocking video, honestly, and I'd like to chat about it with you guys,

both as a specific interview, but also as a jumping off point about street interviews in general. What do we think about them? I saw the one that Moya posted and I found it very shocking, especially in the bubble that we inhabit online. And especially because it's much easier to imagine that the people that have views that are very different from ours or that we completely disagree with are going to seem cruel or unkind. And what was quite jarring about this woman is Moya's being really sweet to her. She seems like she's just a kind of sweet older lady. And then she goes on to say things and you're like excuse me like how are you saying this so I think it's interesting you bring up the ethics I guess I've never really thought about the fact that like I wonder if she would be surprised it

had gone viral I'm always interested to know what kind of like people of that generation actually think these videos are for like are they on social media I thought that particular video was really interesting in highlighting kind of this ignorance that certain corners of the country have when it comes to just quite backward views that are shocking to hear but also not shocking because we know how people think and vote but I've just never seen necessarily in the flesh the face of someone doing that I've just read statistics and polls and you know things like that yeah that's such a good point that kind of like smiling like confident racism is something which if you're a white person you can go on your whole

life kind of going well that's dying out that's not whereas it's just it is not it's so prevalent I think if you write about it it's one thing to see it in the flesh I do think I have really mixed opinions on the vox pops I think someone like Moya, who I think is a journalist with such integrity, they're not all like that. But in this case, I think it highlights something which you do have to see with your eyes. You can't deny it. You can't kind of like brush it under the rug. And even in description, I think it sort of sanitizes it. When you see it, when you see like a woman that says, well, I've been boasting my whole life and has this sort of sweet demeanor

and then come out with the most vile racism, it is kind of, yeah, undeniable. It's so, I mean, yeah, I have no idea if she's seen it, if like, I don't know, grandchildren or like family member would send it on. I would be interested in a follow-up. I think the power of this is, Moya was doing an interview, she was doing her job.

And then this was a situation that was unexpected and this is the reality of being you know a person of color who is a journalist being out on the street being told to vox pop people from all corners of the UK this is this is stuff that can happen and it's something that like I definitely have internalized sometimes having to you know do interviews to random people I do have that kind of like niggling anxiety of sometimes like I don't I don't know what's gonna happen maybe that could happen and it is something that I have thought about so to see it on film the interview just skews and goes like left field and you can see Moya like compose herself and just like handle it with such grace I think that's the power of it for me just you know showing people that this is part of the

job and also like this is the reality for lots of people that they will get this kind of sentiment just like going to corners of the UK but also like Moya's going viral as well and so I think that's the the thing she you know consented to go out there and like gauge public opinion have kind of you know interesting conversations but like spotlight off her she's talking to the person in this case like putting this out is obviously very important but moya then has to kind of contest with the fact that she is going she's also going viral and i think that is such a vulnerable position i mean she's online she is public facing but like that's quite a burden as well i think yeah what this video has done is like bring into relief that actually this is a sentiment that is being held clearly not something that's been contested because if you knew that was kind of

wrong to say you probably wouldn't say it so confidently whilst being filmed I guess it's going to what will happen from here in terms of ethics will be quite interesting I wonder if people will um see the virality I wonder if there'll be any backlash for her maybe it'll be a moment of learning she could like stop and think or it could mean that people become more shy and nervous or more clever about how they present themselves have you ever been approached to do a box pop on the street because there's also like a meme now of just you know getting anxiety of seeing a guy and his like camera phone and a mini you know there's like fluffy microphone things shoved in your face on the street I've never seen it happen but I do have that anxiety around being caught in somebody's

like viral TikTok like I never want to be part of that shit no I've never done it I would hate I feel like I would dive into a hedge to prevent that happening like whenever I am asked on the spot about anything it's just like all good sense leaves my body I remember once being interviewed after an art show and it was just audio and I swear to god I was walking around this exhibit like thinking I really understood it having like interesting conversation with my friend the minute there was like a little mic clipped me I could not I just like blathered something and that was obviously like really harmless but I just it has put me off anything remotely like that I've never had it either again I get anxiety like sometimes I see

these videos I'm like oh my god I hope this doesn't happen to me because often when I'm like pootling about by myself as well I look a wreck I'm on a mission I've got stuff to do I'm not camera ready I don't want to be asked questions about my life the only one that I do think is so cute is the meet cutes NYC one oh yeah and they're like are you a couple how do you meet and they always get really surprised and then they will launch into the most beautiful story that you've ever heard and then I cry yeah it's funny because there's like I mean street interviews is like such a big umbrella but there's so many different kinds of them actually like there's the one we described which is you know the kind of political like box pops which are going viral and then there's also the kind

of subsect which is like people just on the street asking you probing questions immediately and just getting you on camera being like when did you lose your virginity or something then there's also the like really fun ones which is like did you see that woman in america who interviewed baz luhrmann on the street and didn't realize it was fucking baz luhrmann that was iconic it was so funny so he like gets the phone and it's like i need to make it better lighting and he's like moving the camera around she's asking me all these questions it did seem like it was a skip people were like she obviously knew who it was she's like got him in on it and she was like no I literally had no idea she didn't and it's like it made my skin crawl because he was like basically like talking

like he was main character and he was like yeah you know like me and my wife were original and she's just like got this weird smile like side eyeing him being like we got a we got a weird character here not to be sexist but i do hate it when men do them like not all men but you know the ones where it's just like you've just bought a microphone of amazon and now i think you're a tiktoker and you're just asking the most inane questions and the only time i see those is what on twitter when people are reposting them because the man is being like completely roasted because they've asked the girl like would you date me or something and she's just firing shots left right and center and it's so good because there does seem to be this thing where like it is mostly men just buy microphones they're like we're just going to go and like try

and humiliate and mortify people on the street that's so true I don't like those ones I love the meet cutes one I do quite enjoy the one where they say like this or that artist and there is now this infamous video of this girl who's so sweet they ask her her fave and every single time they give her a different two pop stars she'll be like oh my god definitely the second person and they'll bring up another one she's like definitely them and she changes her mind like 80 times I watch it every time it comes on my timeline because I find it so funny she's like oh yeah Selena Gomez because of all she's been through and she's still singing it's so funny because like everyone was pointing out like somebody needs to break down this woman's logic because none of it made sense she would like pick Rihanna and then she'd pick yeah Selena Gomez over Rihanna and then she picked

Lady Gaga over Selena Gomez and then she'd pick Celine Dion over her it was just nonsensical I want to follow up from her I want to know like how that feels because obviously it's a really popular really funny but I just think that kind of going viral for kind of not people making fun of you but people kind of laughing along with you like was she there going like I have nailed this I've kind of given good answers but everyone's like you don't know if you're coming I really want to follow up I think there is a bit of laughing at to be honest I think like if I'm being completely honest my reaction to that video was like what the fuck like it was a bit laughing at her do you think no I just thought she was so sweet she just seemed so happy and she was like I almost think that she was just being quite

partisan and was like they might see it is what it felt like it was like Selena Gomez Christina Aguilera Rihanna are all gonna see video. And she didn't want to like choose favorites. She seemed like a really diplomatic primary school teacher. Yeah, no, that's true. That's true. What do you think the nuance is between people having those kind of fun interviews, like going viral for, you know, doing something a bit silly versus amplifying either people's like, you know, most intimate stories or at worst you know amplifying

like some of the like horrible rhetoric that exists in the UK if you're saying something and you're saying it with your full chest and you've agreed to be on camera perhaps that is enough and I think that you know if you hold those views it is about time that someone held up a mirror and kind of showed you because maybe you haven't got that around you at the same time i do think do people know about the permanence of the internet do they understand how things can travel is there a duty of care to the interviewee again if someone's saying something abhorrent it's like that's your own fault you shouldn't have said it but like you said could there be a level of ignorance where someone says something and the response to that is the punishment for that is

bigger than the crime. In which case, does there need to be a level of like, just so you know, there is the potential that this could go really viral. Those people might see this and there could be repercussions. Or would that completely disseminate the form? I think when it is someone who's like got all their faculties, is not like very young or very old. And like there is a reasonable doubt this person knows and can like consent and understand this. Like people probably do like clamor to be on screen so I don't I don't know maybe it's just like the culture of the internet that we are just quite cruel and we do take everything out of context and we don't have like fully formed discussions anymore we do just have like

edited clips uh someone saying like the most offensive thing or like something sometimes taken out of context to make them into sort of like meme fodder yeah and i think the kinds of people who will engage with these kinds of videos already have the quote-unquote you know progressive liberal correct views so i part of me wonders i don't know if these videos are reaching the right people i think it is just kind of used to like let people feel like they're morally superior like I think a lot of people would engage with Moya's video and then feel really good about themselves because they you know know that they aren't anything like this woman I don't know if it would get back to the people in you know the woman's life and community in the same way as like

the you know twitter commentators and discourses and all of us talking about it right now like we obviously don't need to internalize that video in the same way that other people do so off the back of what you were saying bath about edited clips jeremy corbin tweeted unfortunately a tabloid newspaper has got hold of a music video recorded in islington north with an iconic grime artist i've admired for years they're planning to publish the heavily edited clip so i'm releasing the full version myself watch here and then he's attached a link and it just takes you through to the government website i saw that he's literally my favorite because i believe you know what he's like i was like he probably has done a video with like a grime

artist i was buzzing i wanted to watch it not a second of me thought that it would be a joke i immediately was like, this is real. He is a legend. That's actually so funny. I love him. Let us know what you think about street interviews. Message us on Instagram at everythingiscontentpod. so after last week's episode we got a message on instagram from jenny who said why is no one talking about the new series of bridgeton souls girls but the series is just so addictive

and i assumed she meant like why is why none of us talking about it because everywhere in the world it feels like the conversation is and has been on the next part of Bridgeton which came out and I watched all within the space of about 12 hours I've got to tell you that I've got a problem do you agree with myself and Jenny um that it's so addictive and have have you watched it girls i am working my way through the second half i have been really enjoying it i find it really comforting i don't know if i find it addictive but i definitely find it the equivalent of like slipping into a warm bath and like it makes me feel like a hug it's so good it's so warm it's just like no trauma involved it's like a bath for the mind I thought you're

gonna say slipping into a coma I was like savage yeah you're right exactly it's so comforting I think I needed to watch it because I wanted to watch something that had like nothing to do with my real life like I wanted whatever it is like regency adjacent horny tv show because thank god that was that is not what I'm living right now actually no not thank god i wish i was living that no one be cross with me i haven't watched any of season three i put it on the other week and then i can't i've got a problem i can't watch tv at the minute i started like trying to redesign my website which was honestly gave me a panic like never do that because remember i was messaging you guys about like how do i add the toggle thing of the podcast

on that's when i had bridgeton on and I was so also I think actually what it is is I definitely have undiagnosed ADHD which reminds me I need to contact my GP about my screening thing but um I got really fixated on doing this this square space thing and I like did quite a lot of really specifically difficult stuff on my website for about five hours like locked in and then I haven't looked at it again since babe what about Bridgerton rather because it's definitely ADHD I was like fixated yeah I opened the the group chat and I saw you asking questions about the website I just closed the group chat again I was like she is on her own do you know what Bridgerton I hated series

one took me so long to watch series two love series two love that like enemies to lovers I loved it changed me as a as a person and I have really enjoyed this what's the trope this one's doing friends to lovers and also like the lady whistle down kind of you know gossip girl-esque reveal I I feel like I way preferred series two than this one and I think that's only because I love a you know enemies to lovers arc I've said it before it's my favorite kind of romantic narrative but also I think the chemistry between Simone Ashley and Jonathan Bailey was insane which is like like I thought it just like was so palpable and they were so kind of like sparky together whereas in this one I feel like

the storyline technically is really interesting but I'm not feeling that same kind of like sparky together whereas in this one I feel like the storyline technically is really interesting but I'm not feeling that same kind of like they want to rip each other's clothes off with every look I fancy Jonathan Bailey so much it physically hurts my soul and then it makes me even more upset that he's gay because I can't even like fantasize about being with him because I know that he like but he's so good there's this clip but I haven't even got to this I think it's in series three and I think he's going down on Simone Ashley's character and she's like I need to go to work and then he like goes back and you're like why is he so good at a man who isn't as far as we know doing this um one thing we do one thing we do have to talk about is Nicola Coughlin who is obviously like the it girl of the moment off the back of I mean it's been building for some time because she's been famous yeah I

guess for like almost a decade since Derry Girls she's been like kind of a fan favorite and now it just feels like she has to use one of her favorite words like stratospheric she's gone up an echelon she's like is everywhere she is the new Skims girly yeah I saw she's joined Sabrina Carpenter and Lana Del Rey the Skims marketing kind of phenomenon industry whatever you want to call it is just like out of control it's like hitting every nail on the head every time there's like a whisper of a you know a woman coming up they've got a campaign imminently coming out and then it comes out and it's like timed perfectly and it's kind of insane how they jump off the back of every popular zeitgeisty thing you know know, understand that it's like coming up, get on it and then like use that to market the shit out of their own products.

Just like kind of weaponizing that like virality. Fucking genius. Nicola Coughlin, as you say, people have been loving her. I actually met her once at Wimbledon. She was just really nice, down to earth person. She obviously didn't know who I was, but I knew who she was. I'm sure she knew who you were she was I was sat next to her and then she like spoke to me once then I kept trying to

like look at her again and she was quite stressfully not pointing her eyes towards me because I think she knew but with with the skims thing obviously there's been all this stuff online the first thing that's happening online was everyone absolutely falling over each other finding out that she's 37 because she does have a very youthful face so that was like a big thing then everyone started being really nasty and saying that she wasn't attractive or being calling her like fat or just being generally rude and negative about the way that she looked and then there was this incredible moment last week after a post-screening Q&A for Bridgerton where a journalist said that Nicola Coffin was very brave to appear naked on screen. And then Nicola went on to say,

you know, it's hard because I think women with my body type, women with perfect breasts, we do not see ourselves on screen enough. I'm very proud as a member of the perfect breast community. I hope you enjoy seeing them. Which obviously everyone just thought was iconic, hilarious, just such a funny clap back at the way that people have sort of been trying to bring her down. And what I want to know is, did Skims pop on a private jet moments after she said that?

Because how have they lined this up like so perfectly? Like, do you think, how long ago do you think they plan their marketing campaigns? I need to know exactly. I think it's really reactive. But I also think it's, you know, I think they would have preempted this because it was the same with the White Lotus where they got the two girls who like win the series of series two. And they got them in a Valentine's Day marketing campaign. And it was like weeks after the finale aired. I think they would have been watching, observing, kind of like wanting something from the White Lotus universe.

And then as soon as it looked like those two girls were being the icons, probably got the phone and were like you need to come to la now or just send someone to them i think that you know i always imagine they've got to go to see kim but they can probably just like do it in london wherever they should have got jennifer coolidge in that case imagine the photographer who took the pictures whose name i really don't want to butcher i'm going to try it anyway elizaveta porradini posted the photos on her instagram um and she referred to nicola as a queen a painting a muse and a goddess which i was like actually very true because she does look even though and i will say this when i say this i'm using the word basic in its actual dictionary definition not like oh it's basic

the dress because it is very basic compared to all of the amazing like couture looks and the regency style dresses I was like oh it's so weird to see her in something really plain like she glimmers and shines and looks amazing but I was like oh she's just in like a kind of like vest dress it just was it was odd my brain didn't compute she does look like Aphrodite like she looks like this goddess for like eternity there's just been like kind of goddesses and like the the bodies that we've always worshipped she kind of feels like she slots very nicely and I think people do get very confused obviously it's awful that like we do so many discourses about her body and her age but like I think people are getting it confused with like going

like oh yes we're championing a fat woman like she is still she's very petite and I think because she has a body which isn't like nine foot tall and very slim it feels really revolutionary because she's got curves I think people have gotten a little bit twisted which is why everyone is now publishing like the anti discourse which also I think might have something to do with how political she is which I think we should also maybe touch on because she wears the artist for ceasefire pin and she's not afraid to say the word Palestine she's not afraid to like kind of champion her beliefs and talk about it and I think that has rattles a lot of like the industry one thing I wanted to talk about was even before this series aired me and my friend I think a month before Bridgerton started we were kind of pre-empting this like discussion

around her body and just people doing this kind of patronizing faux celebration of her being a leading woman because we saw it last season as well with Kate Sharma, Simone Ashley who's a dark-skinned Indian woman and it was so condescending and patronizing all of the kind of takes of being like wow isn't it really revolutionary a dark-skinned woman as the leading woman and like that has the opposite effect somebody like me reading pieces like that because it's just like oh people patting me on the back for this makes me feel like complete shit this doesn't feel progressive or revolutionary because everyone's making a big fuss about it and then by knowing that like nicola was you know coming into this role i was like i know exactly what's going

to happen it's going to be the exact same thing about her body type and then behold it happened and it's just like it's not revolutionary guys if we keep talking about it and like commending her and making her feel like shit but also the content creative writer stephanie yuboa made the really good point she was like nicola's like probably like size 12 to 14 she's not she is not this like plus size fat liberation fat positivity person who is breaking the boundaries and like really pushing the edges of like what we see as a societally acceptable body she's probably like the same size if not smaller than like the national average and she's just very short it does feel like we've got a bit backward there because she's just quite she's just little she's representative of a body that we might not see as

much because again we're in the really worrying kind of like return to noughties heroine chic quite rightfully a lot of fat activists and fat models are going it's wonderful she's wonderful but like this is not the representation that we are continually clamoring for and in the comments under the pictures i think it's on Skims, the actual Skims site. A lot of people were going like, they've retouched her waist. They've done this. And I think, I'm sure they haven't. But I think because she's got this little snatched waist, people are like, oh, I'm a bit confused.

So yeah, a long way to go in the old body discourse. But yeah, she's fucking gorgeous. She is gorgeous can i ask i want to round this off who would you like to see as the new skims girly parmas charlie axiax would be iconic i wonder if that i almost wonder if that's like in the bag that's a really good point because on her album cover the one before brat or maybe two before brat she is kind of on the bed in like a little itty bitty white top which does feel very skimsy i would like an older person do you know we did our age episode i think kim should listen to our episode and choose someone who's not between the ages of i don't know 20 and 50

maybe michael caine they did have that fit footballer what's his name jude bellingham yeah oh a wuga he's wait how old is he is he of no he's 20 years old okay respectfully a wuga i have to be careful i'm a 31 year old woman i'm a cougar imagine if she had megha markle no i thought you were saying angela merkel i was like yes and then i was like wait no megha markle is a different oh my god Do you know who would do it? Ed Davey. Ed Davey probably is. Oh my God. He would be so down.

Oh God. I really come around to him. I don't know anything beyond, he's always like Poe going around the place, but. I just love him. You can watch all three series of bridgeton on netflix now this week louise thompson joined her fellow mid chelsea co-star jamie lang on his podcast good company and as you guys know they are really old friends and it was a really sweet listen and they do discuss the old days of dating on Made in Chelsea

and sort of like growing up together in that era but the bulk of the episode is about some of the traumatic experiences that Louise has had since giving birth to her son Leo and relating to motherhood and the difficult journey that she's been on so just as a trigger warning Jamie and Louisa's conversation is a really emotional chat and it covers descriptions of birth loss trauma and PTSD. I know you both listened Ruchira and Bath what did you make of the episode? Yeah I was really moved by it, especially there was a section where she spoke about, because her birthing story was so traumatic, and she had really debilitating PTSD. There's a lot of time that she missed out with Leo, her child, and she'll never be able to get that time back. And she like, she says it and her voice is like really steady, because I think she's probably had to like, you know, speak about it quite a lot and like grapple with that so she's like that's not a new concept to her she probably thinks about it quite a lot and that just like that like shattered my heart it's so moving as I one thing I think is because I do remember when she kind of did her first post just after the birth and basically just said listen

I'm in hospital this has been and she didn't say and this is the first time she is in any detail talking about it I think that's quite extraordinary that she has handled this and obviously she had to live through it she had to cope with it now coming out the other side really she couldn't have spoken about it but people were so curious I remember like maybe she was deleting these comments but under all the posts it was people kind of going yeah but what happened it was people really wanting to know the details and it wasn't enough for people to understand that something really traumatic, she said the words PTSD, she said it was related to her birth. She said it was very kind of, it was medically very serious. People were really like prying for details. And I'm,

I'm devastated about that. I'm also very glad this feels like it's very much on her terms. And I do feel like I don't know enough about kind of birth loss and birth trauma. And I do feel a little bit maybe ashamed about that because I have friends who've given birth. This was all in the lead up to her book Lucky, which is out now. And it's I guess we're like two and a half years on since the birth. And she didn't say at the time because I guess she was still dealing with it. And she also went on Elizabeth Day's podcast and she shares a bit as well of the trauma there and I think that like you said because it was so abstract what she was describing and because people do have this really cool view of

some people in the public eye especially people on Made in Chelsea because you have this double veneer of sort of like not only have they come from like this rich family and this rich background, which sometimes isn't always necessarily true. Some of the cast members were made in Chelsea which simply slotted in for like storylines and maybe weren't literally made in Chelsea. But they also are like these reality TV stars, which people have this opinion that, you know,

they haven't really earned what they're doing. So when she said, I've suffered this birth trauma, I have PTSD, a lot of people were like, oh, shut up. She's probably like, you know have PTSD a lot of people were like oh shut up she's probably like you know had a bit of a difficult birth and you hear her talking about it and I was aghast and one of the bits um trigger warning I'm going to talk about a difficult experience in hospital but one of the bits that really I found so shocking was she has a really big hemorrhage a big bleed after she's given birth to Leo and has to go back into hospital.

And she literally feels like she's dying. She's like, I'm in so much pain, someone needs to put me under. So they put her under and she doesn't know what's going on. And the next time she wakes up, she's intubated, which is when you have a big tube in your mouth. So she wakes up, can't really feel anything, can't really move.

And like feels she's got something in her throat. And because no one's told her that what's happened, she thinks they've cut out her voice box. It's the only thing she can understand that that's what's happened and then so imagine waking up like normally when you go under you know what's going to happen you kind of come to you've been explained and even that is just like one small section of the things that happen it's just so harrowing I'm so glad that you said Beth that she has taken this time to talk about it because even listening to it you're like oh my god like how can you live through that to relive it and retell it is really brave and I'm so glad that you said Beth, that she has taken this time to talk about it. Because even listening to it, you're like, oh my God, like how can you live through that?

To relive it and retell it is really brave. And I'm glad that she didn't kind of feel bullied into having to relive it too soon, I guess. I feel like it touches on so many fears that I'm sure lots of women have, which is your body isn't your own when you give birth. And, you know, because of, you you know sometimes births don't go to plan when they don't go to plan everything you've you know put into motion for yourself and your

baby goes out the window and it's like your body suddenly has to like be taken over by medical experts and like you know dealt with by them and rightly so you know doctors are doing what they need to do sometimes that doesn't always go the way it's meant to but that in itself is so terrifying and so scary and I think I don't know it is really good that everyone's talking more about birthing experiences because I think a lot of a lot of this hasn't been shared before and a lot of women don't know that this is what can happen and I'm sure a lot of women have internalized so much trauma over many years about their birthing experience and have had you know nowhere really to talk about it I think another thing that's really difficult with birth is for

a long time there's been this kind of like idea that natural is best and if you can push the baby through the birth canal and like kind of when we're brought up all you could really get taught is that it's going to hurt a lot it's going gonna be the most painful thing but that's kind of all you know and that having a c-section is kind of like the less desirable outcome you should only have a c-section if you desperately need to have one and actually kind of conversations around that are really changing now it is women are allowed to advocate it used to be that you had to have a c-section for a reason you had to give a reason and now you can actually just say i want to have a c-section and that's that's fine which is how it should be you should be able to give birth however you want to give a reason and now you can actually just say I want to have a c-section and that's that's fine which is how it should be you should be able to give birth however you want to give

birth and one of the things Louise talks about which is so true is she's five foot she's a very small woman she's like I'm not curvy she's like I've carrying this baby was really hard on my body like I'm not there wasn't that much space for him to be in my body so even when she was like heavily pregnant she said it's really hard of course that's going to be really difficult if you're really little like it's going to be hard um and and one of the major problems that she says is that like because she didn't know that she could advocate or didn't felt like no one was listening to her when she asked to have a c-section all of these complications arose and the fact that it's only being spoken about now and that there are so many babies here and there are so many women especially probably in our

mother's generations who had miscarriages and probably wouldn't have told anyone because it was just like not something you spoke about we're probably going to work miscarrying and like not really say anything about it how's it make you guys feel about giving birth i feel like it's empowering to know empowering to know we can advocate for ourselves but it is not the story we got told as kids at school which is like you just got a person it's gonna hurt but it's gonna be this miraculous beautiful thing as someone who have has no real desire to give birth I you know I think it's probably more likely that it won't I have been like oh I don't need to know about it which I think is actually like I said before I think it's quite a shameful thing I mean I'm not like ashamed but I think it does need to change because actually it does affect everyone it's reproductive health and I think it's made me more because as critical as I always am about how bad reproductive

health is um as someone with like PMDD as someone like who has had a really difficult time just like advocating for myself and I'm not giving birth which is just an incredibly like it's a big medical event I think it just switched me on to like how connected they all are and I don't think it serves anyone to be like oh icky I'm terrified that I don't want to know I it fully made me like feel faint just as a listener I don't know how you feel about but I'm perhaps not that squeamish but I really it really I yeah viscerally yeah yeah it was really it was really distressing to listen to let alone God can even imagine what it was to go through but yeah I have two people in my life uh through

family and through friends who've given birth and their birthing experiences also didn't go to plan and it ended up being quite one of them more so very you know like chaotic and stressful and kind of traumatic and then the other one not going to plan not so traumatic but also you know having to deal with just like the plan changing at the very last minute to make sure that the baby was okay both of them are fine now but it is really scary and I'm not gonna lie to you I think the the dream we were sold of like it's really easy you know your body's made for this this is how it goes isn't matching up to both the public image of

you know the women coming out and rightly telling their stories and also anecdotally more women being honest about or maybe it's not I don't think it's even being honest I think it is just getting to an age where it's happening in my life so people are telling me what it's like it sounds a lot more like having to be okay with things not going to plan and also just like you know shit happens and doctors are there to help but also often it is really scary and often there is all these things that are very terrifying for the woman during childbirth and I'm not gonna lie to you it's freaking me out I'm not I'm not in a good place with it at all I yeah that's my that's

my truth birth in the media is either used as like and I'm thinking of the most recent series like American Horror Story like it's used as like kind of a shock thing in films I think they often use like I'm like Rosemary's baby like it's a really dark twisted thing or it's really sanitized you kind of the baby comes out it's got a bit of jam on it but it's basically like a gorgeous nine months old the mum's like gorgeous and like it's like doing gorgeous and it's not like what whichever way you you know there's tearing there's even if you have a c-section that's quite you know that's a lot of layers of skin that is being and muscle being cut through like there is it is hardcore and what's a good show that's done well I mean I think this is going to hurt did it quite well

because obviously like Adam Kay is a doctor who saw this a lot it was kind of like no frills yeah it's blood guts and gore like that was quite realistic I've heard but apart from that like I don't know what it's like from the media with This Is Gonna Hurt I did I loved the book the only thing is he was in obstetrics and my sister did, she's a doctor and she did her BSc, which is kind of like an extra master's in obstetrics. And the things with doctors in bathrooms, they only see the bad birth.

So doctors really only called in to the birth when something's going wrong. Otherwise it's midwives. So if you want to hear like nice birth stories, speak to midwives because midwives deal with the uncomplicated births. And I think that when you speak to midwife, midwives deal with the uncomplicated births and I think that when you speak to midwife like when I spoke to my friend as much as like I think Louise's story

is so important and I think hearing about these traumas that can happen to people is just I think it's really brave I think it's very generous of her I think that will genuinely save lives I think it can mean that people who aren't mothers who maybe might want to go on to be mothers might be a bit scared because people do do it all the time and it can be fine it's somehow finding this thing where we have the whole picture rather than just like you said even that in Kourtney Kardashian when she gives birth she literally goes and then the baby like plops out on the Kardashians remember that she literally lifts her knees up to her chest and the baby just falls out like it's honestly like two minutes long or you hear these these

terrifying stories we need more stories like Louise's and we need also other people maybe have had better experiences and we just need that communication to be open and it not to be shrouded in secrecy and shame because literally is how all of us got here agree I arrived from heaven but yes carry on definitely listen to that episode with Jamie Lang it's a really gorgeous listen and you can get her book Lucky Witches out now we should definitely do a deep dive on motherhood sometime I think there's obviously lots that we could go into I agree and you know there's a book I just started reading called Motherhood by Sheila Hetty, one of my favourite writers.

And I've avoided this book for so long because I do think it will maybe help me make my mind up. I don't want to have made my mind up. So I'm in the realm and I'm ready to talk about this. Me too. That's all from us this week. Thank you so much for listening.

If you enjoyed the podcast, please tell a friend and leave us a rating on your podcast app and follow us on instagram and tiktok at everything is content pod we'll see you next week bye everything is content is a great original podcast and we are part of the ACAST Creator Network. This podcast was created, devised and presented by us, Beth McColl, Ruchira Sharma and Anoni. The producer is Faye Lawrence and the executive producer is James Norman Fyfe.