EXPLORE WITH US - Killer Breaks Down Talking to Voices In His Head: The Case of Jeffrey Hazelwood

Episode Date: November 17, 2023

Killer BREAKS DOWN talking to the VOICES in his head...The following podcast episode is not legal advice. Do not rely on the information in this presentation without speaking to a licensed attorney.No one discussed in these videos has been formally diagnosed by EWU and our psychological analysis is based on the general behaviors and traits of the people discussed.

When two teenagers were found brutally murdered behind a Publix, the community of Roswell, Georgia was shaken to its core. Robben, my one-on-one-h-h-ch-h-h-h-h-h-h-h-h-hose-in. I just drove around the public's over here at King's Wausa. The two victims were loved by everyone who knew them, and the police were desperate to find the person responsible for their deaths. Little did they know that their murderer was more deranged and twisted than they could have imagined. What did you do? What did you do?

What did you do what happened? On August 1, 2016, a delivery driver was making a standard early morning delivery to Publix when he noticed something that would haunt him for the rest of his life. Two teenagers were lying naked and dead behind the storm. Each one had a singular gunshot wound of the head and had been positioned near their parked cars. The police were quick to show up on the scene and were soon met by some anxious parents whose children hadn't returned last. night. With the help of the parents, the police were able to identify the two victims as Natalie Henderson and Carter Davis, both just 17 years old and preparing to go into their final year of

high school. From what the police could gather, both teenagers were incredibly outgoing, kind, and well-loved. None of their friends or family could think of anyone who wanted to hurt the two, leaving police searching for any lead as to who their mysterious killer might be. But they weren't left without any clues for long. Using the security footage from neighboring businesses, the police were able to see that their suspect was a young, dark-haired man who appeared to be wearing some sort of white mask. In the footage, the two teens could be seen spending time together, while their assailants secretly stalked them from behind a nearby electrical box. After watching the couple for some time, the mysterious man confronted them and ultimately shot the two.

While this evidence was definitely a step in the right direction, it still wasn't enough to positively ID the killer. The next big break for the police came in the form of Natalie Henderson's bank statements, as officers realized her credit card had been used at a nearby Flash Foods gas station several minutes after her death. After checking the security footage at the gas station, officers were able to get enough details on the killer's car to trace it to a 20-year-old man named Jeffrey Hazelwood. After tailing Jeffrey for some time, police officers found him acting erratically outside of a gas station, and they made the decision to detain him.

It hasn't answered the back of the court. What did I do? But she didn't do it. What happened? But I didn't do anything. The police began the long and arduous task of questioning him and those closest to him, and in the following never-before-seen footage, we'll watch as they discover the horrifying truth behind the two teens murders. After arriving at the station for questioning, Jeffrey is brought to an interrogation room and left on his own for 20 minutes.

Give us just a minute, you okay? You okay? Mm-hmm. Tick. No, that's fine. That's fine. During this time, he can be heard talking to himself and experiencing ticks in his hands. The tics in my own back home.

The ticks in Jeffrey's hands could be the result of several things, but is likely an external sign of the extreme anxiety he's experiencing. The fact that Jeffrey is in a fetal position in his chair is another sign that he's under emotional duress, as that position is believed to bring comfort and a sense of safety.

Additionally, Jeffrey may be talking to himself as a way of soothing his anxiety and fear. At this point, Jeffrey is still claiming to have no clue why he was detained, and it's time for Detective Bennett to step into the room and figure out what exactly Jeffrey is hiding. You okay? No. What's what's going on? What's the matter? Why is it yet? Everything was falling apart, not this. I don't know what's happening. Okay, what's falling apart?

Everything. Everything I left. And he was kicked out on me first. But before that, my name was just going to help. Okay. And I couldn't do anything to fix them. They can't take it. Okay. As Bennett walks into the room, she immediately picks up on Jeffrey's discomfort and tries to calm him down.

Jeffrey's confusion, shaking, and anxiety are all signs of a psychotic episode. And Detective Bennett is more than aware of this. She speaks to him in a manner. similar to how someone would speak to a child in an attempt to keep him as calm and cooperative as possible in his fragile state. In order to continue building rapport with him, Detective Bennett gathers some background information on his wife. Tell me your wife's name. Kelsey? Kelsey? Bonham. Okay, so you guys don't have the same life name? We got married in our religion. Okay.

We're not legally, but to us there is. Okay. When did y'all get married? You're the 22nd of April? Okay. I don't know what's going on. How are things going with Kelsey? You said at the very beginning of us talking that things weren't going very well. Do you want to talk to me about that?

What's going on with her? What's the matter? Just keep fighting me for me for my fault. Yeah. It's evident that Jeffrey is incredibly upset at the idea of losing his wife or fighting with her. Detective Bennett soon learns that Kelsey is Jeffrey's only positive relationship. After explaining that he was taken from his mother and given to his grandparents when he was only 18 months old, he goes more in-depth about the kind of relationship he alleges he has with them.

It's important to note that there's no evidence of any of Jeffrey's claims being true and are instead his version of what happened. Is it a beat up to me with a belt? How old were you and I haven't? If you go seven or ten, I don't around that, it is. Okay, so pretty young. Jeffrey paints a very disturbing picture of his childhood. Emotional and physical abuse,

especially when inflicted at such a young age, can often trigger mental health disorders, and this alleged abuse could explain the anxious tics we see Jeffrey experiencing. While Jeffrey talks to Detective Bennett about his life, his wife Kelsey is being brought in for questioning alongside her mom. It's odd that Kelsey's mother is allowed in the interview room with her, given that she isn't underage.

But the police reports reveal that she was there because Kelsey is hard of hearing and is also prone to having seizures. It's important to note that if she is significantly hard of hearing, this also impacts her body language. Individuals with hearing problems will not be able to modulate the tone or volume. of their voice as effectively as a standard hearing individual. Additionally, if she used sign language as a child, she may talk more with her hands in even typical conversations.

And you said that you worked at Marshalls. Michael. Michaels. You still work there? I'm bored, anyway. Which one do you work at? The alcohol, Jeff or Jeffrey or? Yeah.

He worked at the one in an operating at the doorpoint. They can't make my door one night. Okay. That's how I'm going to. With a few simple questions, the detective learns that Kelsey and Jeffrey have been dating for around five months. That's a seemingly short amount of time to date before getting married, legally or otherwise. Does he ever stay over at all at all? Is that something that we...

He has with her. I really don't know much about the boy at all. Based on her tone and the fact that she's... only refers to Jeffrey as the boy. It's clear that Kelsey's mom doesn't approve of their relationship. Wanting to find out more about who Jeffrey is in his daily life, the officer asked Kelsey about his religious beliefs. I heard some mention of, like, with nature about like spirit animals and that sort of stuff, did he believe in that sort of stuff? He did that? Do you have one? What was it?

He had two of them. He just looked up maybe a hawk. Hawks and wolves are both predatory animals, which may give some insight to the officer, as Jeffrey essentially preyed on his two victims. Kelsey also mentions that Jeffrey felt hawks were protecting him, which could indicate that he may struggle with feeling unsafe or threatened in the world. Now that Kelsey has warmed up to the officer,

he begins asking more pointed questions. I know sometimes you're not. carry weapons with them. Live, at least. Yeah, I know about that. Have you ever seen him carrying a firearm? It doesn't appear that Kelsey is lying when she answers this question, meaning that she likely has no knowledge of Jeffrey's recent crimes.

So you have this pretty high-strung, what do you say? Okay, don't. High-strong, like, is he nervous, fidgety? No. the officer can finish. Even if she doesn't know anything about the murders, it seems as though she might be lying about other aspects of his life. This claim from Kelsey directly contradicts how we see Jeffrey acting in his own interrogation, meaning Kelsey is either purposefully lying, or doesn't know her husband as well as she might think. This isn't our only sign that Kelsey

may know more than she's letting on. Does he normally go straight home to his grandparent is when he's on the ear how it's spiritual, I guess, depending on the time of day, you might end up going back to work or something. Yeah, most of the time, too. Where does he go when he doesn't? You know? Mm-hmm. You know, not really.

Right after answering the officer's question, Kelsey can be seen glancing up at the camera, indicating that she may have not been truthful and is thinking about the fact that her lies are being recorded. Even more important than glancing at the camera, her foot starts bouncing, indicating a likely increase in anxiety, and her nose appears twitchy, which can often indicate anxiety as fight or fly causes the nose to become engorged and itchy. Also, despite appearances, she is still quite closed off. Her arm is crossed in a barrier across

her body, legs tightly crossed with ankles close to each other and close to her body, overall still sustaining closed-off body language. When officers are looking for signs of deception, there is no one cue that tells them that an individual is lying, as cues can happen for different reasons. However, as they add up and turn into cluster signs of anxiety, the officers will hone in on this and push a bit harder to see if the individual will crack and tell the truth or share what they're holding back.

Your phone is still at the house, right? Your phone is still at the house? Your cell phone. Where is it? Investigation. Kelsey, just tell them where it's at. my room, I'm a van van. Unless there's a warrant specific to her phone, she is under no obligation to hand it over for investigation.

The Fourth Amendment protects digital devices, including phones and laptops, from search and seizure. So she is well within her rights to question this and to ultimately refuse. What kind of, why do you have anybody seen? Pictures? No. All kind of stuff.

What have you said to him that you don't anybody see? Personal things Like what? Personal things Anything that can hurt you? Huh? No, no. Okay, then it's...

They don't care what you're mushy stuff you put on there. If that's what it is. It's okay. No, not. Most younger people are extremely hesitant to hand over their phones to anyone, law enforcement included. And younger people are more likely to be suspicious of law enforcement in general. Kelsey may see her phone as something that is private and personal,

so it's a violation of her right to privacy to have law enforcement go through it. However, exercising your rights is very much black and white. You either exercise them, or you don't. There's a little gray area. Once you surrender a right to privacy in something, it's virtually impossible to claw back. Just say whatever is, Cussing is. I don't know what I don't know if you're right.

They can to help them, okay? So just tell them what it is. Because I can go. That makes me very. Right outside with the other officer, you can stay close, and then we'll bring you back in. Okay. Back with Jeffrey, Detective Bennett begins establishing a timeline for the past few days.

The timeline starts out very normal, with Jeffrey talking about spending most of his weekend, either working or hanging out with Kelsey. After leaving Kelsey's house early Monday morning, Jeffrey stopped by his grandparents' house to grab a few things before going to a nearby park where he slept in his car. Jeffrey's timeline seems to check out with the detective until he mentioned something incredibly strange he found

while getting gas on the way to the park. I stopped at a trip trip that once. Happened before I got to the park. Uh-huh. You found something really interesting here. What? It's weird. I don't like them.

I don't think they don't. I don't pick them at all. What is it? It was a gun. Okay. That, that quid trip right there at Mayberry Road? It was behind it, and I was going to look a cigarette back there and kicked it. Okay.

Ouch. That was your foot. Uh-huh. And I picked it up and I was like, okay, well, you get somebody lifted, free. Uh-huh. I mean, I could sell it because I don't have a lot of money. Uh-huh. At me at all.

So I was like, okay, I can sell it. Right? And I was a playing with it and all that. This story about finding a gun behind a gas station is hard to believe. It's likely that Jeffrey obtained the gun in another way, but doesn't want to admit it. Can you tell me what it looked like? It was black, and it was one of the really short ones. Okay.

Like one that you hold in your hand or one that you prop on your shoulder? Mm-hmm. Like one of the ones that, but not bad way, no. Okay. Okay. You don't call it any, once we're scared of it. Okay. So more like, you said it was black, right?

So did it have the spinning wheel thing on the side, or did the top of that slide back? The top. It pinched me. Okay. How did you pinch yourself? It pinched my finger. How did that happen?

They got infected. I was playing with it, and it went forward really fast. Oh, okay. So you got your pinky just stuck in the little. sliding car on the top. Sure. Holy cow, I bet. Did it bleed?

It did, but it's more infected right now. Oh. While discussing the gun, Jeffrey uses a lighter, more childlike tone as a way of making this whole story sound more innocent, as well as what sounds like an unusual accent. Using that childlike tone is a way for him to avoid answering questions and to avoid the seriousness of what's going on. He didn't always speak that way, only sometimes, which he didn't always speak that way, which indicates that he might be being evasive and deceptive and trying to avoid the question.

He also focuses on how the gun injured him in order to present himself as the victim and to distract Detective Bennett from assuming he had any ill intent with the weapon. Although she likely doesn't believe his story, Detective Bennett is making sure to appear empathetic to Jeffrey's extremely minor injury. By coming across as warm and understanding, she's able to build up a rapport with him and get him to readily answer her questions. He likely would shut down if Detective Bennett raised her voice or argued with him. Although she's doing a good job of appearing empathetic and understanding, it's clear something is wrong with Jeffrey. And you left her house and headed for grandma's house. Okay. So at that point, we had a crime happen here in Roswell.

that I heard about it the next day from her mom It's horrible Okay Okay Why you think I want to Even more Move up to Canton with that

Nice apartment Yeah But It's horrible You still have to drive by The location Where The incident happened

It is Yeah I have your car on video How so Driving by the incident location When I have you pulling into the parking lot where the incident occurred.

I have you getting out of your car. I'm walking around a little bit. I have you walking towards where the incident occurred. And I have you on video where the incident occurred. Tell me why you were there when that happened. He was scared to say, it was awful. You look, color, and glad. Okay.

Okay. Okay. It's awful, awful, awful. Okay. Tell me what you saw. Look at all in your hands. Uh-huh. Look it's anywhere.

Okay. As Detective Bennett gets more and more information out of Jeffrey, we see him revert back into the fetal position he was in. At the beginning of the. interrogation. You'll notice that Jeffrey loosens up when they're talking about less stressful things. He also once again changes his voice to sound high-pitched. It's clear that he's panicking. Okay, at what point in time did you go to the flash foods? The gas station. What's you mean? What did you do. Gas stations have video cameras.

Yes. I know what kind of car you drive. Yes. I have you on video and your car at the gas station across the street from your job. At what point did you go to the gas station? Later. While it's obvious that Jeffrey was caught lying about going to the gas station, it can be hard to determine if he is intentionally lying

since he appears to be in the midst of a psychotic episode. While Jeffrey may be able to effectively communicate with the detective during this episode, that doesn't mean he's in his right mind. Despite this, Detective Bennett questions Jeffrey about the murder weapon, and the lies continue to add up. Okay, I don't believe that you ever found a gun behind the QT.

Because the employees hang out behind the QT, and that's where they smoke their cigarettes and take their breaks. There was a gun playing with bullets, in a bag, in a case. I'm pretty sure that one of the employees would have been able to see it. It's lit back there. Yes, but how do you know if they actually thought of it? A handgun in a bag with bullets in a case.

You don't think they would have seen it? No, no. Where'd the gun come from? The more Detective Bennett questions Jeffrey about his actions after finding the bodies. the more tangled he gets in his own conflicting stories. Detective Bennett has made it clear that she doesn't believe Jeffrey's story about finding the murder weapon. What Jeffrey doesn't know is that Detective Bennett already knows the real story

behind how he got the weapon. On Monday afternoon, less than 12 hours after the murders had taken place, Jeffrey's grandfather reported that his Sig Sauer pistol had been stolen, and the description of that gun matched the one Jeffrey claimed to find behind the gas station. Your grandfather's stolen gun is going to be in the back of your car, isn't it? I don't know. We already talked about the gun. I think that you're being dishonest about where it came from.

So when I go and get the video from behind QuickTread on the night you said you found the gun, you're going to be picking up a bag, taking the gun out, fracking the slide, talking a bullet out, picking the bullet up, putting it back in the magazine, putting it back in the gun, and then stick it in your trunk, or in a bag, in the back air car. That's the way that it happened. You seem so. I don't know him more. Here, Detective Bennett is using something known as a bait question.

If Jeffrey is being honest about how he obtained the gun, then he should be confident that the security footage will confirm he found the gun behind the gas station. However, he gave a weak and non-committal response to the question, confirming that he's being deceptive about where he got the gun. You don't know his name. Whose name? Name of it. Whose name? The guy. The guy you gave it to.

The guy you gave it to. The guy. The guy. He said he wanted to. Okay. Did you give the end of shopping? Who did you get the gun to? You don't know his name.

Tell me what it looks like. All I know is Matt. His name is Matt. What did he get him? A week ago. He didn't find it a week ago. He told me he found it on Sunday night. It's only two.

Wednesday. What I want to do is see my credit with you. It's clear that Jeffrey has some confusion surrounding dates and times, likely caused by his psychotic episode. However, the police now have a new lead to investigate in the form of this mysterious Matt. Determined to get the whole truth from Jeffrey, Detective Bennett tries one last technique

before ending the interrogation. She pulls out photos of the victims taken at the crime scene and forces Jeffrey to face his actions. What if somebody did this to Kelsey? Demo. Demo. Dema. What would you want to happen to the person that did this to Kelsey?

If this was Kelsey's picture, and they shot her, and they laid her around vacant on the ground, and they spread her legs open, and they touched her. What happens to that person that does that? It wouldn't like that anymore. You wouldn't like it? What would you do to that person? What should I do to that person as a police officer?

What should happen to that person? Bad. What is that? Just bad? Just bad? I want you to look at her. Just look at her in the daylight. You didn't get to see her in the daylight.

This is a technique known as a punishment question. Someone who's being honest is more likely to respond with a strong punishment that fits the crime. Whereas a guilty individual may try to dodge the question, or suggest a lesser punishment. In Jeffrey's case, he appears to be highly distressed and unable to suggest anything other than bad. Realizing that Jeffrey is too upset to give any more useful information, Detective Bennett ends the interrogation. With Jeffrey's interrogation completed, all eyes are on Kelsey.

A new detective comes into her room to continue her interview. I don't think that you've done anything wrong. information that you tell us and I'm just being honest with you and here's what I'm going to say to you you're a young lady you got your life ahead of you okay I want you to be able to be open with me you're not under arrest you understand you've been helping us I have no reason to believe that you're nothing more than helping us but I can't later find out something happened or that you knew of something do you understand? understand that.

Well, thank you. It comes into it's kind of personal. Thanks, all right. Kelsey knows that revealing intimate details about Jeffrey, such as his mental and emotional problems, could incriminate him. It seems that she may need more confirmation about the severity of Jeffrey's actions

before she's comfortable giving details. Additionally, Kelsey clearly doesn't understand what the detective is implying when he tells her that she is culpable and accountable. She appears to take it as a compliment when actually he's saying that if he finds out she's hiding something, she'll be held accountable by the law and possibly face legal consequences. The detective should take a moment here to explain a statement.

He should also use caution going forward and make sure that he explicitly says what he means in simple terms so that he can be sure Kelsey understands. Has he given you or told you about anything that he's done recently? That would be, in your eyes, shocking. No. Okay. All right. So here's what the deal is.

You know, I told you they sent me to all those fancy schools. You just lied to me. No, I didn't. Okay. Okay, get it. That looks the way of it. Let's not just look away, and I can't describe everything. I've been doing this for a long time, okay?

All I can tell you is I'm trying to remove you from any kind of association. If you give me deception and I know you're lying to me, then I have no alternative than to put you over. here as opposed to over here. We know that it's a common misconception that eye contact is indicative of honesty. However, people will typically look to the side periodically as they're considering what is being said or how to best respond to something. This is all a normal part of honest communication.

In fact, sustained eye contact can often mean the opposite. As individuals who are being deceptive will maintain eye contact in order to thoroughly search the person's face for signs of belief or disbelief. so they can quickly adjust their story to fit the reactions of the individual they're trying to manipulate. Kelsey could also have looked to the side because she's hard of hearing and is trying to figure out what the detective said, or even is thinking. If I kept you over here, just because you have an knowledge, just what can tell you? Listen, you're trying to convince me now. I had to remind me three times, okay?

When was that? Okay, well, that's not the... How do you try to commit us with what method? He had a gun? No, pincorrs. And what? Pankoos. The doctor gave me pain doors.

Okay. And he took three of them. And he would mess up for a while. Couldn't remember anything about a week. Okay. And that's the most of the thing I know, okay? Okay. So did you call rescue?

She. I think. I've been three times with CPR and you didn't call. an ambulance. I would enter the nature. Attempts to take one's own life or a major red flag of a number of mental health disorders, including an active psychotic episode. It's a clear sign that Jeffrey's mental state was rapidly decompensating.

This information also gives insight into the nature of Kelsey and Jeffrey's relationship. It appears that Kelsey takes on a caregiver role as evidenced by the fact that she revived him three times and helped keep the attempt a secret so that she could treat the issues herself. Romantic partners will often take on this caregiver role when they want to hang on to a relationship while their partner is struggling with something that could threaten the relationship, such as Jeffrey's erratic behavior. Kelsey may also enjoy the feeling of usefulness and being needed that she gets from having Jeffrey be dependent on her. You're safe here. This is a safer. This is a safe space. I've told you, if you tell me the truth,

because later if I find out something different, it's different. And I don't call you anymore. I don't talk to you anymore. I'm trying to put you over here. I'm sorry you had to see that. I know it bothered you, right? Did it bother you to see you like that? No, no. It would bother me too.

At the end of the day, I've asked you three very, very quick questions, and you were deceptive from two out of the three. And you can, I understand what you're saying, and you can say you weren't. I understand it bothered you. I get it. What bothered me is that you think that I know something that was shocking.

Oh, I see that I know shocking. Before he went to an episode and I had to pin him down because I thought you were going to... So he hasn't told you that he's hurt anybody recently? No, he hasn't. He's been with me most of the time. He never said he hurt anybody. No. He never said that he did something bad.

He never said... Oh, you never do me anything. Kelsey is using open palm gestures here. This is a nonverbal indicator of a lack of confidence, and it's interesting that she makes this gesture while saying that she thought he was fine after a while. It implies that she may not be sure about this statement. He really did his episode and trying to get him out of back.

Okay. Okay. All right. I need you down here. I need you way down here. Okay. He's alive now, right? You revive him, he's safe.

All right, we'll go to there. Let's back up a little bit. The way the detective is speaking with Kelsey could be detrimental to get information out of her. When conducting a police interview, it's important for detectives to ask one question at a time and pause to let the other person answer. The detective asks a question here, but then doesn't give her a chance to respond. He's alive now, right? You revive him, he's safe.

The best questions during an interrogation are short, simple, and straightforward. In the Reed technique, a popular method of interrogation, investigators are trained to do 20% of the talking while the interview subject should be doing 80% of the talking. The detective also downplays Kelsey's feelings by saying she was bothered by Jeffrey's attempt to take his own life. Kelsey and the detective soon come to a head again. So you're positive, you're 100% positive. that you're telling you the truth that he had no no evidences, no anger, no a hatred, no nothing towards anybody.

We might normally say that her saying basically is a qualifier statement, but at the same time, she's young and has at least one disability that affects communication. As well, this detective isn't exactly doing a great job of establishing or maintaining rapport to keep her talking comfortably. she may be feeling pressure to provide answers. The likely truth is that she may not know the answer to the question, but is afraid of saying that since it hasn't gone over well in her interview up to this point. He doesn't tell me everything. I don't know why.

Hold on a second. I'm sorry, you don't like it. You interrupt me. Okay, that's fine. I don't like it when you're deceptive. So here we go. I'm going to back up. And then I've got to go.

His response to her saying she thought he was disrespectful is the perfect example of a damaging power struggle. Interrupting may be more disrespectful to her than most because if she relies on lip reading to help her understand what the detective is saying, then him talking while she's talking doesn't allow her the ability to focus and understand what he's saying. This in turn leads to more communication issues. Oh, you can't move into a day, right? Do I have time? Deep breath. Okay?

And I'm going to leave. Your mom's a sweet woman. You just had a bad relationship. I think you were trying to find something good in him. You said he's violent. He's got these things going on. You were trying to help him? I get it.

He's talked to you, and he's talked to you, and I know he's talked to you. And I can't tell you how I know that. Okay? But I know he's talked to you. And I've been waiting. waiting for you to talk to me about it. But if you're not going to talk to me about it...

No, what? Okay. What are you talking about? He's just right. I don't need your hands. I don't need all that. We're just talking. We're two adults.

We're two adults. We need to get rid of it. I understand that he's talked to you about people that he doesn't like or people that you would like to hurt. Kelsey emphasizes her words with her hands and it all matches up, indicating that she doesn't have a brain-body conflict and is highly likely being honest. She uses a lot of illustrators to emphasize her words in other ways. It may seem excessive, but her emotions are very high, so it matches her mental state quite clearly.

The detective is far too confident and has now caused Kelsey so much distress, that she has likely lost all trust in him. She might feel that the detective is just playing games with her, or she might feel frustrated that no matter how forthcoming she is, he will still doubt her honesty, especially since Kelsey has given all indications of a person responding honestly. Yes, he has hurt. He never told me if I didn't want to hurt.

Kelsey's heated reaction to being told she's lying is actually indicative of her being honest. Many truthful people will react with a strong tone of voice or even become hostile or angry when they're wrongfully accused of something. It's understandable that Kelsey's patience with a detective might be running thin at this point because she's divulging sensitive and painful information

while being repeatedly told she's deceptive. It would be in the detective's best interest to maintain a good relationship with Kelsey if he wants her to trust him with any other secrets she may have about Jeffrey. The detective may also be making this interview unintentionally harder for himself when he tells Kelsey not to move her hands around.

I don't need your hands. I don't need all that. We're just talking. By telling the interviewee to limit body language, the detective is limiting expressive cues that may actually be of use in the interrogation. With the detective questioning her on Jeffrey's recent behavior and aggression, Kelsey is able to deduce that they suspect he's involved in the public's murders.

If he's over here and there's some culpability and some big things going on right here, I don't want to move you into that chair And it's really that simple I don't want to put you in that same chair Without killing, didn't it? Why would you say that? Yeah, the only big thing going around

And we ask about it going. It's not the only thing, but why would you say that? You need to be honest with me or you need to be honest with me. That's what you need to be. I don't know if he did that. Why are you making it so if he did? You're making it a shot. I don't like it.

I'm going to ask you if I would get it. I don't know. How do you know about the killings? What killings would she refer to? The one's behind public. The one's by the public? So why would you think your boyfriend would be anything associated with that? To be honest, I don't know.

As Kelsey says, to be honest, I don't know. She makes very intense eye contact with the detective, as if she's trying to see if he believes her. Yeah, you do. No, I don't. Okay. All right. Yeah, sweet.

Sweet. And you need to start talking to me because I've got three houses waiting on me. I'm done. I have more information than you think I have. Interestingly, Kelsey goes into the confession pose, leaning forward with her hands in her lap, right before the detective pushes her again. If he had sat with the silence for a minute,

she may have opened up at that point instead of freaking out. This is why when conducting interviews, it's so important to pay attention to non-verbal cues and to be able to sit with silence and let the person think. All the detective did was potentially delay the truth from coming out. Interviews should be conducted in a non-accusatory and non-confrontational manner. Interviews should only be confrontational when detectives have evidence someone was involved in a crime, and then the interview will switch to an interrogation style.

However, this detective is choosing to be impatient and not empathetic. He's trying to use her own words against her and make it sound like her question is proof of Jeffrey's plans. This is just one example of why young or vulnerable individuals should have a parent and or lawyer present with them during questioning. We'll be right back. We've got something that just came up. We're going to get you all over, okay? Okay? I'm going to talk to mom, okay?

I don't need to come down and talk to me. What they've been questioning you about, I need to know the front. I want you to tell me, okay? I need to know. But I don't know if they did it. Okay, no, listen to me, though. Okay. You've got to be truthful with these policemen, okay?

I know, I know. Okay, then you guys have everything they want to know. Okay? Can you tell me then? Judge, it's in one person, but I don't know. This is very important, okay? Because I'm scared now. You're not scared me?

You know what I said? I'm not scared for you. You're fine. Calm down. Kelsey. Okay. And you tell the truth about everything. Because they feel like you're not telling you the truth about it.

I don't know. When the detective comes back into the room, Kelsey tells him what she can about Jeffrey's recent violent behavior. He This is, One coming on One I think of Two hours

You got in trouble with her And he didn't matter This is of course An obvious red flag That Jeffrey was dangerous Sadly She thought she was taking care of Jeffrey by just

Taking the knife away But in truth He would have needed Hospitalized care To stop his violence And aggression From escalating Even further

Back with Detective Bennett Jeffrey has requested to speak with her again, and this time he's promising to tell her the whole truth. What decisions that led up to this do you think are the bad ones that you need? What did you do with her? Pretty much to protect her? Kelsey. Protect her. Okay.

Tell me about how you were protecting Kelsey. It was a gap. Okay. He made me drive him around. Okay. And the... high school he made me drive past

past where well on the Brasville High School okay past the um entrance and he told me

that the group was parked in that area and he made me drive aster cut and then when I got to the exit he got that I was like

where are you going he's having your business so he told me to drive there then walked her back Okay. So I parked. And then a little while later, and then I go back there.

So where did you first? He made me show him in my driver's license. Mm-hmm. And he threatened me, which was Kelsey. Mm-hmm. As he hinted towards in his last interview, Jeffrey reveals that there was another man with him at the time of the murders. With Jeffrey giving more information about Matt and the night of the murders, Maybe the detectives will finally be able to piece together a motive.

So where did you first encounter this guy? Where did you first see him or meet him or? It was a while back. Okay. We were reddens or something of the sort. Okay. I smoked a little marijuana with him a couple times. Okay.

Did you get me at a party or at work or how do you? end up meeting? It was a while back. He was, when he met him Kelsey first met. Okay. And you said that was sometime in March, right? Yes. In the March or something? It was March 7th in my first night. At the beginning of March, okay. There was him and the person, a car that was partners of hers. And so they were yelling everything, and we ended up, like, meeting and going into my car and were smoking her on. And that she got pissed at me.

We weren't even together again. We just met. Okay. So y'all aren't even dating yet. Okay. And she got pissed at me because I left her for too strange men. Ah. So where were you, where, y'all?

Where were you parked? In Michael's parking one. Okay. The one here in an on-o-on-o? Where he works? In the broth. Okay. Notice how quickly his emotions and voice change.

He quickly shifts from panic mode and freaking out to laughing about something else. This is another indication that he's in the midst of a mental breakdown. By giving Detective Bennett a detailed description of first meeting Matt in a Michael's parking lot, a story that Kelsey herself could back up, he's making his explanation more and more plausible. Additionally, the police have records of Jeffrey's phone contacts and have seen that he does have a contact saved as Matt, meaning they may now have a solid lead on another suspect. After telling the detective more about meeting and hanging out with Matt, Jeffrey tells her about running into him on the night of the murders. Where did you end up seeing him that night? It was over by Lawam, or what we call Law Blahaw.

Okay. So yesterday, you told me that you and Kelsey hung out around the house. You didn't tell me about Waffle House. Because that's where I went right after I left. Okay, so you went over to Waffle House after you left Kelsey's house. I don't, well, I'm trying to protect her. Okay. I can understand that.

Because of that, then I'm in trouble. Okay. And I won't be able to be there for her. I'm just like a pretty thing. So tell me about the Wafox. Were you going over there to eat, or were you going over there to meet him? No, I wasn't going over the meeting.

I just got a, I took over there, got a while I basically talked to the guy and all that. So then how did you encounter back? When I was driving away, I recognized him. It's like, hey, how's it going? and uh... The entrance, I'm sorry. The entrance.

I just want to make sure I'm understanding the entrance to the shopping center, like from the main road. The center, yes. Okay. Jeffrey is describing meeting Matt in a very public area. It's possible that Detective Bennett is trying to get details on Matt's specific location so that she can pull up security tapes from surrounding businesses and double check Jeffrey's story.

Okay. And so that was over here? He was right on the corner right here. Okay. And, okay. I said, hey, how's the government? Because I stopped all the day. And I was like, hey, nothing much.

Can I get arrived? And I was like, okay, sure. Okay. And then he, I thought he was a nice guy, you know? Uh-huh. I can really know, I guess. So where did you guys go after you picked him up? She told me that she and this girl were,

that he really liked, really loud down this crowd. But you understand, I love Keltzema. We were driving to, uh, down this way. Towards Roswell News, back this way. And he said, oh, I'm good, I'm really loving this girl. She's lovely. I gotta go meet her tonight. And, you know, I see if my daughter said,

I'm like, why? Why? I'm like, this one's sick. I mean, like, my picture's horrible. So I started him, and he says, I'm good. And I had her name. Okay.

Okay. You have my name. Right. You're going to do what I say. And that's... Okay. Now that's... Okay.

And he turns into my family and I realized that me, has my name, my stuff. Then, now it has... Kelsey as hers. You know, she has her families, her parents, her brothers, sisters, all that. I'm like, okay, you don't do anything to them. do anything to them, just what you want me to do. Mm-hmm. Like, drive to Roswell, high school, drive around.

There's this girl that I'm supposed to be. Mm-hmm. So he drives. We drive. And he says, well, it looks like she's in there, so just let me out on the corner. And then, so I did. So he told you to do. What did he say about me to know the words that he said?

Mm-hmm. I know. I know. So all that's the time, too? I know. He was threatening everyone. Do you remember the words that he said? Can you tell me the words that he said to you?

I'm saying, he's, I got to die. And he's talking about the girl from the car? Okay. If you don't do it, and shoot her, it's your life down, and have everybody down.

Okay. I don't want it to come out to my wife. You should have seen his eyes. Okay. With this, the police have at least a tentative motive for Jeffrey. While Jeffrey may not have known either of the victims, Matt was supposedly having some sort of lover's quarrel with Natalie Henderson. As some of the answers begin to fall into place for the detectives,

there are still plenty of questions about the murders they still need answered. Where did the gun come from? Your grandfather's gun. At long last, Jeffrey admits that the gas station story was a lie, and he did in fact steal the gun from his grandfather. Jeffrey admitting to this shows Detective Bennett that he genuinely wants to tell her the truth this time around. Finally, Jeffrey gives Detective Bennett details on how he killed his victims. And so he said, go, go now. Basically, you go and get them.

And you went over and he said you open the door. Which door did you over? The left side. The left side door. So right behind the driver's seat. Okay. Who got out of the car first? He did.

What did you say to them when you opened the door? This, he said, get out right now. Okay. And they hesitated. And he was getting a patient, I could so. Yeah. But do you feel yelling? Yes, he yelled the whole time.

He kept on mentioning my wife, family, but my wife. He said, come on, hurry up. Your family's going to get it soon. Okay, you go. Okay. So you told him to get out, and the guy gets out, and then what? Did you have a gun out of your pocket at that point?

Okay. So while he's yelling And you have the boy out What does the girl do? She's coming out. She's coming out too Does she come out the same door? So they both come out the same way

I was just going to Like hit them a couple times I see that would help Yeah He told me to kill them Yes maybe Maybe if I hit the guy once Then maybe

That would help. Okay. Did you hit him? Yes. Okay. What did you hit him with? With the gun? Hopefully.

That'd be enough? Yeah. Is that enough? No. No. No. No. Okay.

Where did you hit him with the gun? Yeah. And then? Because maybe that would satisfy him to where. Like he could forget all about it. Yeah. What happened to him when you hit him? with the gun.

He fell out of the car. He fell out of the car. Okay. Did he ever hit the girl? Was that the only time that you hit the boy? And he told you that wasn't good enough, that wasn't going to work. So did the boy get up from the ground? Yes.

And then what did the boy do? He was basically yelling. He was starting to come at me, and I looked back, and he wasn't going to do anything. He kept on yelling to me, and I went, crazyness head. Next thing I know, looking around, next thing I know, boom.

Stop it. He's on the crime. Where was the girl when the boy was coming at you? She was over by her car. She was by the car, and what was she doing? Was she saying anything?

She was yelling at me too. What was she yelling? She was yelling. What the fuck? Why did you do that? I don't know. He's telling me to you. She looked over there and saw him, and he killed her, kill her.

Tell her! Remember me the fucking family? So, what place? She said, why are you doing this? She kind of gasped when she thought. Yeah. Then, then he was just telling me at me so much about my family. I was like, okay.

Did you hear the bone? Where were you when you heard the boom for her? I was standing over by, in between the cars. In between the cars? And she was by her car? Okay. Do you remember how she fell down? Did she fall down backwards or did she fall down forwards?

It didn't feel like. Okay. Okay. Close my eyes. Okay. Following his detailed confession, Jeffrey admits, the stealing Natalie Henderson's credit card and using it at a nearby gas station by making a full confession Jeffrey can get things over with more quickly. But making any confession is rarely of any

value to a suspect. The only time it might help is if the alleged crime is more serious than the actual crime, at which point details may mitigate how the crime is actually charged. However, a decision to take that route would only be something undertaken after an in-depth consultation with a lawyer. After gathering a few more details from Jeffrey, Detective Bennett ends this interview with far more answers than she was able to get last time. However, there's still one more surprise in store for detectives. While Kelsey may not have known anything about Jeffrey's murders, she did provide the police with the most key piece of evidence.

Schizophrenia is a serious condition in which someone interprets their reality in an abnormal way. This can include seeing hallucinations. hearing voices that aren't there and extremely disordered thinking. You keep repeating that he couldn't have done that. Do you really believe that? And he would never do that. But anymore he'd make him. The voices.

While most individuals who are diagnosed with schizophrenia do not commit acts of violence, they are at a higher risk for committing violence compared to the general population. One study even shows that those with schizophrenia who do act violently are more likely to have higher levels of trauma from their childhood, such as the trauma Jeffrey alleged he experienced. No medication such as you take me now? Taking no medication right now? No, are you supposed to me?

Yes. When a person with a serious and persistent illness such as schizophrenia stops taking their medication, The consequences can be serious or even fatal. According to his doctor, Jeffrey would experience extreme hallucinations and paranoia while not on his medication. This included seeing messages from God on TV and believing that there were invisible cameras spying on him at all times. With all of this information in mind, the police reviewed their CCTV footage from the night of the murders and made a shocking discovery. Matt, the supposed mastermind behind this whole crime, wasn't real.

There was nobody else in that parking lot. There was nobody else in that parking lot. So some invisible person shot them while you were walking towards them. Why did you need to wear a mask? You were wearing masks. The mask is in the back of your car right now. I saw it this morning. Which one?

The feet from my dad, Matt. Yes? Yeah. I was scared the girl. That was going to see her. Did you think the mask was not going to have him chill you? If there was some crazy person back there with a gun, you thought you could put a little plastic Halloween mask on your face and you'd be okay? That's the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard, Jeffrey.

What is your God? What did you do? What did you do? What did you do? What did you do? What I didn't do anything? But no, you didn't do anything. Yes, you did not. I didn't.

What's going on? Don't leave my life alone. Please. Please. Typically, if a suspect comes up with a wild story, such as being forced to kill by a man no one else can see, we can assume that they are feigning mental illness because they believe that in doing so,

they could avoid getting charged for the crime. However, Jeffrey's case is different because we know the details of his illness. We know he came off of his medication and was displaying red flags indicative of severe mental and emotional decompensation, including increased anger, homicidal thoughts, and attempting to take his own life. Knowing this, there is a good chance Jeffrey genuinely believes this story about Matt. To him, Matt is real, and that night at Publix was a result of Jeffrey acting out of fear from Matt's threats. While this certainly doesn't excuse Jeffrey horrific actions, it does help us understand why two innocent teenagers lost their lives that night.

Following his confession, Jeffrey was treated and evaluated by medical professionals until he was fit enough to stand trial. He then entered into a guilty but mentally ill plea, and on May 17, 2017, he was given a life sentence without the possibility of parole. There hasn't been much information on Jeffrey's census incarceration. However, on August 11, 2017, he was somehow able to post a selfie to his Instagram account from prison. The photo was taken down soon after authorities were notified about its posting, and no information was ever released about how or why Jeffrey posted the image.