FACTORALY - E51 PERFUME

Episode Date: August 15, 2024

Simon is on the scent of facts. Bruce is a bit whiffy. Perfume has existed since the first chemists in Ancient Egypt. In this episode, we examine its constituents, uses, celebrity endorsements, and the reason why perfumes smell different on different people. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Good morning, Simon. Good morning, Bruce. How are you on this fine day? I am fantastic, thank you very much. Very good to hear. Well, one tries now as you know every episode of this which is called factorally um we take a different subject each week and we either make big subjects very small or small subjects very big with this but you you've committed listener to half an hour of your life to us.

There's no turning back now. You're in it now. We do appreciate that half an hour that you're spending with us. Thank you. Let's all sit together. Just us. The two of us and the one of you. Let's sit down.

Let's have a nice cup of tea. Let's have a chinwag. And we won't smell you later. No, we won't. But you might smell what's going on in this podcast because this subject is going to be about perfume. Perfume? Yes. How exciting.

Well, is it about perfume or is it about fragrance? Ah, well, there's an overlap, isn't there? There is an overlap. There's a difference because perfume is sort of made up of essential oils and fragrances. Yes. And I discovered that there are major differences between the two i mean an essential oil is like one single thing yes whereas a fragrance is like a combination of lots of different things well a fragrance i mean the word fragrance at its very

heart simply means a smell so yes we're thinking of a manufactured produced fragrance yes but fragrance you know you could you could smell a rose and say oh that's got a nice fragrance would it smell as sweet if it was a rose with any other name it might be i'm not sure if you sniffed a rose and called it a brian would you be slightly turned off i don't know i've brought you a dozen brians a dozen red brians brians are red violets blue. Doesn't really work, does it? So, perfume. I'm assuming the origin is pretty obvious.

Go on, what do you think it is? Well, it's through smoke. Very good, yeah. So, the word perfume, written as it is, first appears in the early to mid-1500s. It comes from French parfum, which comes from an obsolete Italian parfumare, which comes from Latin perfumum, which means through smoke. Yes.

And it's called that because originally, you know, we all think of perfume as being a smelly liquid that you spray upon yourself to make yourself smell nice. Originally, perfume was essentially air freshener. It was something you released into the air. You burnt incense or you burnt a little lump of resin or wood or whatever it might be in some kind of burner. And the smoke releases into the air, leaving a lovely fragrance in the air. It's interesting, isn't it, that we've sort of come back to that with these room fragrances with sticks that stick out of bottles. Yeah, we have incense burners. We have scented candles now.

We have those plug-in wafty air fresheners that you get whenever you go to the loo in a pub. But is that perfume, though? Well, depends how long ago to the etymology we go. It is technically perfume. It is a substance that's created to smell. Okay. So let's say it is. I mean, I'm not suggesting that we should all go around

spraying airwick on our necks. Well, exactly, haze or something like that. I think that we need to define what we're going to be talking about in this episode because there is perfume in pretty much everything isn't it i mean even in um i know that the difference between um a biological and a non-biological uh clothes cleaning liquid is that the non-biological one you know the healthy one doesn't have perfume in it right they're scented and non-scented. Exactly. So it's the scent that makes it artificial and all that stuff.

Okay. So are we talking about scent, fragrance, aroma, or perfume? Take your pick. I think because we've called this episode Perfume and people have read that on the title, that we should talk about perfume. Thank goodness for that. That's exactly what I researched as well.

That was close. Yes. There's a lot of crossover. I mean, we've already done an episode on smells. We talked about the ways in which animals smell, smell each other and their surroundings. Yes. Some animal products have in the past been used to create elements of perfume. Yes, civet things.

Musk. Yes, all sorts of things. I hadn't realised that musk originally came from a secretion from the gland of a musk deer. That's why it's called musk, because it's named after the deer. They took the secretion from it and went, hmm, that smells quite musky. Let's use it.

And therefore the substance became musk. That's why it's called musk. That's why it's called musk, exactly. it's from the musk exactly that yeah okay um by the 19th century they they decided that actually killing deer in order to to use their their gland secretions was a bit mean and they started using alternative methods so uh they stopped it but yeah that's where that came from yeah because a lot i mean that there was a lot of animals involved originally. I talked about civets. I mean, there's a cat called a civet, and they farm the musk from the civets.

They don't actually kill the civets necessarily. Right, okay. But if you're a cat person, then you wouldn't enjoy. These days, basically, they can manufacture pretty much any smell chemically. Yes, absolutely. So they don't need to harm any animals. Indeed. No animals were harmed in the production of this episode of Factorial.

I mean, Bruce and I are sitting here a little bit uncomfortably, but we sacrifice ourselves for our art. Right, so having established that we are talking about perfume, i.e. the stuff you put on yourself to make yourself smell nice, have you discovered where that all began, specifically? There is a woman mentioned who I presumed that you would go into, this Egyptian woman who... And therefore you left it alone so that I would do it?

Yeah. Excellent. It worked so well. I knew you were going to do that, which is why I researched her. Oh, so this, you know, this isn't the first use of perfume. They used it in ancient Egypt.

They used it in ancient China. But the first recorded reference to perfume being what we're talking about here as i mentioned about the the stuff that you release the aroma into the room to make the room smell nice um obviously things like incense has been burnt in religious ceremonies yes um but the first recorded mentioning of this is from 1200 bc in mesopotamia, modern-day Iraq. And it was a lady called Taputi who was sort of written down in records as being the overseer of the house.

And she did lots of sort of household stuff, but including making the place smell nice. And there are engravings on these clay tablets, which look a little bit hieroglyphical, of her saying the ingredients that she uses to make these these aromas for the room and they include flowers oils uh tree sap myrrh uh horseradish surprisingly i know that there are some researchers who are trying to recreate uh cleopatra's perfume oh really and they've kind

of they've they've found sort of remnants of various including myrrh and all the other things you've just mentioned yes and they're actually aiming to make a perfume which is cleopatra's perfume she soaked her sails in perfume when the wind was blowing towards Rome. Oh, wow. So the Romans could smell this wonderful aroma coming towards them. And it was actually Cleopatra's sails were blowing this amazing smell towards Rome. That's fantastic. Isn't that clever? Do you wear perfume? Do you have a signature smell? So I'm currently wearing an aftershave called Happy by Clinique. OK. That's my current favourite. It's got citrusy notes to it. It's rather pleasant.

Well, I wear one called Vetiver by Creed. Right. It's lovely. It's really nice. I've smelt you in person. It's very nice. Thank you very much. And I thought, I wonder what's in that. So I went to their website and had a look. Yes. And the ingredients of vetiver by Creed is that they don't just use the leaves of the vetiver plant.

They use the roots as well. So you get a sort of more earthy note to it as well. We'll talk about notes in a minute. We will. But I looked at the ingredients and it's alcohol, perfume, water, limonene, linalool, citral, geramol, citronelloi,

coumarin, eugenol, iso-eugenol. And I thought, I'm going to look up what each of these things is. Oh my goodness, you were thorough. Well done. Thank you. Thank you.

They're all synthetic, aren't they? Yes, they are. But a lot of them are synthetics based on natural products. So they're synthetics that give you the smell of. Limonene is lemon, basically. Citronello is lemon, basically. Citronelloy is lemon. Eugenol is that sweet yet spicy smell you get. And basically it's all created to produce this smell which I rather like.

Which smells of Bruce. The great smell of Bruce. There is an offshave called Brut. It's only a little bit different from that, isn't it? Yes. I don't know about you. As soon as I think of perfume, I automatically think of France. Yes.

It's just the center of perfumery. All of the brands, all of the top names come from there yeah um jean-paul gaultier chanel coty they all come from paris don't yes they they generally are very french maybe it's because the french smell it might be do you know i tried to find this out as to why france was such a hotbed for it um it's just one of those things it just happens to have landed there and happens to have caught on having started started out in Mesopotamia, it then sort of spread throughout the rest of the world slowly bit by bit through trade routes. It landed in Europe, it went to Spain, Italy, France. For whatever reason, it really latched on in France. But back in those

days, apparently Louis XIV, King Louis of France, was a big advocate of perfume. All of his palace rooms, bedrooms, all of his courtiers were all sort of regularly perfumed in order to make the place smell opulent and delicious. It was very expensive. Back in the days before the synthetics, you had to get these natural ingredients. You had to squeeze the fruits. You had to get these natural ingredients you had to you had to squeeze the fruits you had to press the flowers you had to extract the oils very very timely and and costly process yes have a guess oh no i hate this how many rose petals or how much weight of rose petals you would need

to make just one kilo of rose oil okay so one kilo of rose oil how much oil would you get out of a single petal i'd say probably uh ten to one i'd say ten kilos of rose petals for one kilo of perfume yeah you're you're actually you're quite close oh really it's four tons okay so not that close really um four tons of four tons of rose petal to make one kilo of rose oil i can't even picture what four tons of rose petals. Four tons of rose petal to make one kilo of rose oil. I can't even picture what four tons of rose petals looks like. That's big. It's a lot. And that's generally why, you know,

the better the ingredients that go into the perfume, the more expensive it is. You can recreate this stuff with chemicals. Yes. But if you're going for the real deal, you know, it's really quite a process it wasn't until the late 1800s that they started experimenting with synthetic smells again in france um it was a chap called paul parquet and um he just sort of started

thinking about the fact well all of these smells exist in natural things if we break them down to their smallest possible parts can we just extract the chemical that smells a bit like this mix it with a chemical that smells a bit like that and then ta-da you've got something that smells like a rose yes um it's cheaper it's more easily created and it can be mass produced and sold to a wider market yes that makes sense do you think that louis had his own signature fragrance oh de louis i hope so but isn't it interesting how that's now something something you find in shops there are sort of corporate scents yes of course yes that you do you go into a shop and

it smells you know it's it smells like the shop that you're in yeah it'll smell like you know hugo boss or it'll smell like yeah chanel or whatever it is back when i used to be a postman i used to um pick up the outgoing mail from a ferrari showroom and they had both room fragrance and little bottles of perfume that had been hand created to smell like Ferrari not like a Ferrari they didn't really smell of that you know new car smell or fresh leather or anything like that it was just it was just a generic pleasant smell apparently specifically made to represent Ferrari the brand yeah I once stayed in a hotel and the whole chain smells the same way I really have they have they pump it into the air conditioning system how wonderful so you always know that you're in that that brand of hotel yeah I know um chains

of pubs and restaurants who will use the same brand of of hand soap so you know when you've washed your hands in a Fuller's pub as opposed to a Young's pub. Right, yes, of course. I mean, in fact, I have an interest in a restaurant and we have a specific smell of our restaurant as well. A very fine restaurant it is too. Of course, you have to keep the perfume in something once you've made it. Yes, you can't just have it spill out all over the floor, can you? And one of the things you can put it in is a bottle yes and perfume bottles are amazing if you ever see a collection of perfume bottles they are really beautiful yeah absolutely a lot of effort

goes into it you can you can just tell one from another even these days that they're a signature like jean-paul gaultier has his like sort of. That's right, yeah. But there used to be a couple of companies that made these beautiful glass bottles. So Baccarat is a very famous crystal glass manufacturer. And they once made a perfume called Joy, which I remember remember by jean patu and um this this this perfume came in the most beautiful bottle uh by baccarat and it and it to make the perfume they it took i mean it's quite a small bottle of perfume it was 10 000 jasmine flowers and 28 dozen roses oh my goodness me in this perfume that is a it's no surprise is it really then that the stuff was so expensive if you're just using the essential oils and no synthetics 10 000 jasmine flowers

and so yes so so um that they made bottles and lalique um who are very famous for making uh glassware and lead glass i mean mean, they made all those mascots on the front of cars and stuff in the 30s. Oh, yes. But they also make the most beautiful glassware, including perfume bottles. Yeah. What's really interesting,

and I'll tell you what, I'll put pictures of what these bottles look like on the show notes on factorally.com. Factorally.com? That's the one. What's interesting is, though, that Baccarat and lalique have both decided that they were going to make their own perfumes so you can buy lalique perfume

now and baccarat perfume right so you used to have a perfume manufacturer whose bottles were made by a bottle manufacturer and the bottle manufacturer have now manufactured their own perfume to go into their own bottles yes gosh that's come full circle do you know the difference between like a perfume and an eau de parfum and an eau de toilette no i don't tell me so a parfum is um concentrate it's a concentrate it's always a concentrate so a parfum is over 20 percent concentrate okay an eau de parfum is diluted so it's down to 15 percent and an eau de toilette is diluted further down to 10 percent okay and the difference is how long it lasts on your skin so a parfum will should last you know all day yeah whereas an eau de parfum is probably about six hours on your skin and an

eau de toilette is like three hours on your skin before it fades i see right so when you go to a shop and you buy an eau de toilette yes that's the reason why it's quite a lot cheaper than something that just says perfume it's 10 it's basically a 10% concentrate as opposed to a 20% concentrate. Okay, that makes sense. I looked into the origin of cologne. Oh, yes. The vast majority of information I found is about perfume, traditionally worn by women. Perfume wasn't really worn by chaps until the late 1800s, early 1900s even.

It was a feminine thing. I associate the word cologne as being akin to aftershave. You know, it's a gentleman's scent. Cologne was created first in 1709 in Cologne in Germany. It was created by an Italian perfumer called Giovanni Maria Farina and originally called Eau de Cologne. It was created by an Italian perfumer called Giovanni Maria Farina, and originally called Eau de Cologne. And it wasn't intended for chaps at the time.

It was just a lighter, you sort of said the concentrates came down to 10%. This stuff, Eau de Cologne, had between 2% and 4% concentrate. So it was really, really light, really mild, really subtle. And that was just what he decided to invent so that was in 1709 it wasn't really until 150 odd years later that that men started going do you know what i'd like to have some of this stuff yes and slowly slowly slowly the word cologne became associated with men's perfume yes and the pain that you get when you slap it on your on your neck having had a shave. Yes, yes. I'm thinking Kevin McAllister in Home Alone. Yes, exactly. Ah!

Ah! We talked earlier about those notes stuff. Do you know what the difference is between the different notes? Yeah, so I did a bit of a Google on this um other search engines are available no they're not you don't say i yahooed it anymore do you yes i got i asked um yeah so because there are so many combinations of different ingredients in perfumes

some of them seem to last longer than others. Some of them are lighter or heavier. And that's what the word notes refers to. Right. I found a wonderful, wonderful website, which we will put a link to on the show notes. It goes into so much detail. It just lists every natural substance that could ever possibly be used to add a smell to a perfume you know we've talked about the fact that these things contain a combination of hundreds of ingredients yes yeah and you can click on any one of these items you can click on a rose or you can click on chocolate whatever

and it will tell you all the commercially available perfumes that have that scent in it how wild fascinating website that sounds like one of our regular rabbit holes. It does. It really does. It's fantastic. So how do each of those things work with these notes? So these notes. So it kind of sounds like quite a musical thing.

You think of playing several notes to make a lovely chord. So you put in several fragrance notes to make a lovely combination. So it's divided into top notes, which are quite light and fresh, but that particular part of the smell doesn't last very long. It's the thing you smell when you first spray the perfume on, and that lasts about 10 minutes, and then it sort of fades away. So top notes include things like citrus and sort of lighter scented flowers. Right, Okay. Then you have middle notes, also known as heart notes, which is the real sort of basis,

the sense, you know, the center of what a perfume smells like. Yeah. Those notes last for two to three hours. Okay. They include things like rose, jasmine, lavender, cinnamon, nutmeg, slightly more robust smells. And then you have base notes, which you can smell once the top and the middle notes have evaporated. Those are the things that last up to 24 hours. And they're rich, heavy, deep, earthy things like cedarwood, musk, vanilla.

So you sort of layer up these notes in, you know, any different amount of combinations and coordinations to make your own fragrance. Interesting. I've been flagrantly using a term and I had no idea what it actually meant. And I'll bet you a lot of our listeners don't know what it meant either. I'm excited now. Okay.

This sounds like a quiz to me, Bruce. So you know how perfumes smell different on different people at different times of day? Yes. Do you know why? Well, I used to think it was because the perfume reacts with the heat of the body, your own sweat, etc, etc, and therefore the combination of the two changes. What I'm now wondering is whether it is because each of these levels of notes have evaporated at different points through the day, and therefore what you can smell is the leftovers that haven't.

Well, that's right. The evaporation is something that happens with perfumes anyway. But the big thing that makes a difference is the acidity or alkalinity of your skin. Right. So it's talking about the pH value of your skin. Now, I've been flaunting pH around for... And I never realised what it actually meant, what it stood for. No, I don't know what it stands for either.

It's the opposite end of the scale from acid, isn't it? But I don't know what pH stands for. No, no, pH, the actual scale is called the pH scale. Oh, yeah, you're right, with acidity on one end and alkaline on the other end. Yeah, exactly. Yes. So that's potential hydrogen. There you go. ph scale oh yeah you're right with with acidity on one end and alkaline on the other exactly yes so that's potential hydrogen there you go you've listened you've learned something today potential hydrogen ph well who'd have thought so yeah so so generally speaking skin is about 4.7 to 5.75 right so so it's acidic okay um and what you what you're aiming for is

a very neutral like a seven yeah in the in the perfume so the seven is reacting with the acidity of the 4.7 oh i see so but if you if you have a more alkali skin or in the case of some women the hormones will change the acidity or the alkalinity of your of your skin yeah so it can be that that perfumes smell differently at different times of the month oh i see how interesting and i want to imagine things like uh your your diet how much you sweat um just your own personal chemical makeup yeah we'll pH. Yes. So it stands to reason that people would have perfumes that go specifically with them as an individual. Something that smells good on one person might not smell so good on another. I mean, I think that's why most people generally stick to one particular scent because that's the one that they know. I remember I know somebody for whom they can use the most expensive perfumes in the world.

And within five minutes, it smells like soap. Right. OK. Isn't that interesting? So they had to look around and find specific fragrances and perfumes that didn't do that. Now, there'll be a scientist somewhere, won't there, who says, right, your skin pH level is this. Therefore, you would be better suited to that. Well, there are perfumiers who will do that for you.

Right. We did mention earlier the most famous perfume in the world. Chanel. Chanel No. 5. We did indeed. Why is it No. 5? I was just going to ask you, do you know why 1 to 4 weren't so good no i don't neither do i i didn't look that up do you think coco just went nope nope nope nope oh this one's all right yes or just i'm bored now let's stick with this one

i'll tell you who might know the answer to something that we haven't researched you're talking about the factoralites the The factorolites. They'll know. We'll have someone listening to this who's a professional perfumier or who has just bought an awful lot of cologne themselves. They'll know the answer. Yes. And not all perfume

smells of perfume. Okay. For example, there is a perfume which smells of Pizza Hut. No. So Pizza Hut, to celebrate their 10,000th follower on Facebook or something, released 110 bottles

of Pizza Hut perfume. And there's perfume that smells like books. So if you've got somebody you know who's madly into old books or loves the smell of a library which obviously you and i do um you can buy them a thing called paper passion which is a perfume that smells of old books there's another one federation of bakers came up with a um odor

toast that's fantastic some people say it smells of burnt toast other people say it just smells it's got that nice caramelly smell. Oh, couldn't that be worrying? If you were walking around the streets of London and everyone passing you... You thought you were having a stroke. Yes, exactly, yeah. Oh, my goodness. That should come with a health warning.

Wow. There's one called Money, which smells of freshly minted US currency bills. That's very precise. And there's a British one, which is um blue cheese by stilton why you would want to smell of stilton i have no idea but there is a there is a perfume that's made by stilton that's called blue cheese now that's interesting isn't it because there there are things depending on what you do where you go who you are you could get smells from the natural environment sticking on you yes if you're so you of smoke, for example, if you come out of a smoke.

Right. When you used to come out of a smoky pub or something like that. Yes. And, you know, some people would hate that. But, you know, sort of being wreathed in the smell of pipe tobacco, you know, something like that. Or as you say. The great smell of uncles.

Yes. A very avuncular scent. Yes. If you tinker with vintage cars, you might come away smelling of engine oil. Yeah, exactly. Something like that. So recreating those things could sort of recreate that nostalgic, ah, he smells of my Uncle Mark.

How nice. These days, you can buy perfumes from famous people. There's like celebrity perfumes. Oh, yes. I mean, the first one I came across was from 1957, which was Elvis Presley's Teddy Bear. Oh, no, really? I mean, Elvis was very, very good on the merch front. Yeah, yeah.

So, yeah, they came up with a fragrance called Teddy Bear in 1957. Wonderful. And most of the modern celebrity fragrances are from the 21st century. So they all start quite late. But there were a couple which I thought would appeal to you. Go on. And I will give you the name. They came out in 1995.

I will give you the two names and you've got to guess who they were. There was a his perfume and a her perfume right so the his perfume was called amphibia and the hers perfume was called moi amphibia amphibia and moi. That's insane. Yeah. Brilliant. And they're not the only famous people, obviously. I looked at how many different fragrances.

Beyonce has 17 different fragrances. Oh, does she? Wow. Yeah. I mean, Jennifer Aniston has nine. Oh. But, you know, then you start getting into the serious ones. You know,

Naomi Campbell, she's got 26 fragrances. Yeah. 26 perfumes. Yeah. Paris Hilton, 27 perfumes. Jennifer Lopez,

32. 32 perfumes that Jennifer Lopez has launched. Britney Spears has 35. And Shakira is, as far as I was able to find, was the person that has the most perfumes. Shakira has 36 perfumes.

Really? Yeah. Now, I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that none of these people are professional perfumiers. No. Have any idea how to make a perfume. No. Their marketing department has idea how to make a perfume no their marketing department has

just teamed up with a perfume manufacturer and slapped that person's name on it it's like antonio banderas has has gone to or some perfume companies come to antonio banderas do you like the smell of this and he's gone yeah fine can we call it after you sure yes exactly like yeah and they did that eight times because there's eight different fragrances that antonio bandera wonderful and there's and then there's donald trump but we weren't has he got fragrance oh yeah no donald trump the fragrance it's in a bottle that looks a bit like one of his buildings okay it's the best fragrance in the world there is there are some great reviews i i urge you to go and look at some of the reviews of Donald Trump, the fragrance. They're not good.

Well, that all solves what we're doing with our evenings. Thank you. So, Simon. Yes. Guinness. I know it smells really nice. Yes. But are there any records?

Yes, there are. Rather unsurprisingly, most of the Guinness records around perfume are the most expensive. Shall we do one of our competitions? Why, have you found this as well? I've got one, which I thought was expensive. Okay. And it's got a great name. Oh, that's not where I'm going.

Okay, right. So in that case, on the count of three, how much is the most expensive perfume that you've found versus mine? Dollars or pounds? Dollars. Okay. One, two, three. 1.29 million. 200,000.

Okay, yours wins. How many? 1.29 million dollars. That's a lot, isn't it? Go on. Well, it's by a company called Nalil. Right. And most of the cost is the bottle, as you would expect.

There's a Jewish expression called shmuck, which means idiot. Yes. Look at that shmuck. Yeah, exactly. And this stuff is called shmuck. That's unfortunate. S-H-U-M-U-K. Okay, that's very close.

So I guess if you're going to spend 1.29 million dollars on a bottle of perfume yes you've got to be a bit of a schmuck that's fantastic so so you what was the price you mentioned uh a mere sniff at 205 000 okay so what's that right so this is it this is the guinness record for the most expensive commercially available perfume there are one-offs but the most expensive officially the most expensive commercially available perfume um was created by a chap called clive christian and it was called clive christian number one for men catchy i could could, because today I've got that kind of a voice. I was out last night quite late, so my voice is very bassy today.

So I can do that. Number one for men. Very good. That was lovely. I enjoyed that. So the stuff itself, in its basic form, costs only two thousand three hundred and fifty five dollars right bottle but in 2005 they made a special edition called clive christian number one imperial majesty oh very nice uh which cost two hundred and five thousand dollars per bottle again purely because the bottle was a little bit fancier yeah um part of that cost was also uh down to the fact that um you had this stuff delivered to you by a driver in a bentley

did they leave the bentley with you as well no sadly not no that'd be nice isn't it gonna be a bargain um but yes um harrods sold this special edition. The bottle had five carat white diamonds encrusted onto it. It had an 18 carat gold collar. It was produced by Harrods and delivered to you in a Bentley. That's everything that's wrong with Harrods. Wonderful. Well, I've run out of smelliness

thank you very much it's all it's all faded off me now yes my high notes have evaporated my middle notes

have worn off and all you're left with is the bass my bass notes are just stinky I'm assuming that people have

already subscribed to the podcast and if you haven't then hit that button and please subscribe to us we would really appreciate it thank you very much go and tell all your nerdy chums who love random facts about this podcast give us a five-star review and leave us a a note saying this was the smelliest thing i've ever heard gosh what a contradiction in terms. So that's the end of another action-packed episode of... Factorily. Please come again next time.

We look forward to hearing you then. Or smelling you. Or smelling you, yes. Smell you later. Smell you later. Bye for now. Bye.