Fantasy Football Daily - 2022 Franchise Focus Series: Seattle Seahawks

Episode Date: June 28, 2022

Joe Dolan (@FG_Dolan) invites The Athletic's Michael-Shawn Dugar (@MikeDugar) to discuss the upcoming season for the Seattle Seahawks. The Franchise Focus Podcast series is brought to you by Underdog Fantasy (@UnderdogFantasy). New users can sign up to Underdog using promo code FANTASYPTS for up to $100 in bonus cash on their first deposit. Visit fantasypoints.com/underdog for more info. The podcast series is also sponsored by Evan's Sports Cards & Collectibles (@evanscards). Follow @EvansCards on Twitter for weekly updates and card releases, Like on Facebook, and head to evanssportsnj.com for more info, including the always-updated eBay store. --- Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/fantasy-points-podcast/support Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Fantasypoints.com and the 2022 franchise focus series is sponsored by Underdog Fantasy, the best and easiest way to play fantasy sports, with no waivers, trades, or lineup setting for season-long drafts. New users can sign up to Underdog Fantasy Fantasy, PTS, for up to $100 in bonus cash on their first deposit. That's promo code FantasyPTS. Head to FantasyPoint.com slash Underdog for more information. Now let's get to the show. It's time for the Fantasy Points podcast brought to you by FantasyPoints.com. Top level fantasy football and NFL betting analysis from every perspective and angle,

from numbers to the film room with a single goal to help you score more fantasy points. Welcome back to the franchise focus podcast series here at FantasyPoint.com. My name is Joe Dolan, but I am certainly not the star of this podcast. series. We are doing 32 beat writer interviews with 32 of the most talented, most plugged in people around the NFL, one for each NFL team. And I've brought you the very best for the Seattle Seahawks today. That is Michael Sean Dugar. He covers the Seattle Seahawks for the athletic. He hosts the Seahawks man-to-man podcast. And you can also listen to his radio show, The Hype from 9 to 11 a.m. Pacific time on Saturdays. That's at 9.

93 KJR, but you can also listen to it online wherever you are. If you're interested in the Seahawks, this is a man you must follow. You can get them on Twitter at Mike Dugar. That's D-U-G-A-R. Mike, it's good to talk to you. Thank you so much for joining me. And how are you doing today? I am doing all right.

Thanks for having me. It's fantastic that you're here. And the franchise-focused series of podcasts is brought to you by Evan's Sports Cards and Collectibles, the best place for cards, collectibles, autographs and more. All our memorabilia giveaways at Fantasy Points are from Evans, and we always have the latest boxes and releases from Panini, Upper Deck, Tops, and more. Family-owned small biz, it's not a super store so you can go in and feel like you're getting the best customer service. It's great for an in-person visit if you're in the Philadelphia area,

but it's just as good to visit the eBay store. Follow at Evans Cards on Twitter for weekly updates and card releases like on Facebook and head on to EvansportsNJ.com for more info including the always updated eBay store. The releases this week include the 2021 Panini Contenders Optic Football Set and the 2022 Panini Select Baseball set. That's Evans SportsNJ.com online and at Evans cards on Twitter and tell them that the guys from FantasyPoint.com sent you. All right, Mike, thanks for going along with us here. But we're here to talk Seahawks and we're here to talk Seahawks briefly and just get to what is going to be the most drastic offensive change for Seattle in more than a decade.

Russell Wilson is no longer there. And you've done all kinds of interviews about what went down with Russell Wilson. You can find them on your podcast. You can find them on YouTube. We don't need to rehash that because this needs to be pretty brief. And I'm sure we could go very long. But looking to the future, as it stands right now, it's looking like we're going to have a quarterback competition between Drew Locke and Gino Smith and training camp.

What have you seen from those two thus far in mini camps? What do you expect to see heading into the summer as we, as the Seahawks try to decide who's going to be their starting quarterback after Russell Wilson's departure? I've seen, it's not a lot just because they can basically only do seven on seven lockthroughs, excuse me, throwing on air, you know, stuff that really doesn't decide who's going to be a good quarterback when, you know, 300 pound dudes are trying to kill you while you throw the ball. and throwing over the middle is a little bit more dangerous in live tackling versus, you know, throwing on air. Like there's a few plays I've seen. It's like, oh, no, that guy would have got killed. But you can make that throw, obviously, when the guys can't hit their own teammates. But what I've also seen, you know, in that limited sample is why neither of these guys are, like, franchise guys.

And I don't mean that to, like, insult them, but, like, I can see it. You know, I'm not like a quarterback coach necessarily. But I've watched a decent amount of guys, you know, whether in person or some of the guys they brought in to compete with Russ. Like, I have a pretty decent feel, I think, for how good a guy will be based on how he's looked in training camp. And one thing that I like to see data, if I can watch guys for multiple days in a row, is consistency, a consistent, you know, touch on the passes that need touch, consistent arm strength on the balls that need to travel, you know. and, you know, consistently protecting the ball. And I think that last part is where it's been kind of evident, like, oh, okay, this is why either of these guys were, like, are getting, like, starter money. You know, I think Drew's on the final year of his rookie deal, it's like a million and some change.

And I think Geno Smith's on something similar because they make some passes. Every once in a while, you're like, oh, that's why this guy was a second round pick. I think they both were. They both were. And then they make a pass from like, oh, okay. well that's why this guy eventually got benched wherever he was at you know and you just can't it's not that no one makes those throws like russ has made some head scratcher fatchick mahomes make head scratchers tom brady etc but it's like how many head scratches do you have mixed in with that with the ones that are

like eye popping and and i think that's what the the mix isn't there at least it wasn't there in camp they had some good throws but then had some ones i'm like dude you didn't see that linebacker you didn't you see that dv sitting on that out route like stuff that i would expect you to see like it's really hard to throw an interception, like a really bad one that hits the DV's stomach when, you know, the DVs can't press. They can barely even attack the ball in the air. You put one in the guy's gut. I saw that multiple times with both guys.

So the inconsistency is pretty evident. And I think that's why I think the guy who is most consistent in August is part of the guy who wins it. Even if it's not the more talented guy, which I think is Gino, like the guy who just is, You know, his Tuesday looks like his Wednesday looks like his Thursday. You know, that's what Pete's going to want to see, I think. Hey, Fantasy Points listeners, Ben Cucanis here, letting you know that the franchise-focused series of podcasts is brought to you by Evans' sports cards and collectibles. The best place for cards, collectibles, autographs, and more. All of our memorabilia giveaways are always from Evans' sports cards.

He always has the latest boxes and releases from Panini, Upper Deck, Tops, and more. It's a family-owned small business, not a super store that you have to deal with. They're located in South Jersey, so great for an in-person visit, but just as good to visit their eBay store as well. Follow at Evans cards on Twitter for weekly updates and card releases, like them on Facebook, and head to Evansportsnj.com for more info, including the always updated eBay store. Some releases this week are the 2021 Panini Contenders and Optic Football, as well as the 2022 Panini Select Baseball. That's Evansportsnj.com online and at Evans cards on Twitter. Tell him the guys from Fantasy Points sent you. And so just to reiterate, you think this is essentially 50-50 heading into August?

No, I think it's about 6535, probably in favor of Gino just because he has the familiarity with the offense. He's been better at protecting the ball in the course of his career, at least as a starter. I don't have the numbers in front of me, but their number of starts is not that far off. I think Gino might be in the 30s or something like that where Drew's got 20 and some chains. You just compare the numbers. I want to eliminate the times that they came in as like a backup or a fill in. I feel like that's not indicative of how they'll perform if giving a starting job. So like in their starts, Gino's numbers are a little better. Interception percentage is a little lower, I believe. I'm just kind of better at handling himself there when it comes to throwing the ball

and completing passes and not giving the other team a chance to score. So I think that part helped. having the familiarity with D.K. Metcav helps. Having the familiarity with Tyler Lockett helps. I know Drew Locke has that familiarity with no offense, which I do think will help him. But I just think Gino's A, more talented, B, a little harder to fool with the disguises and stuff like that and different fronts because he's been around the league for like nine years. So I think Gino has the edge, but that doesn't mean Drew can't catch him. Yeah. And by the way, I actually, I think you're 100% right about that. looking at the stats. The numbers weren't impressive necessarily in Gino's three starts last year, but I don't believe he threw a single interception in any of the three starts. So we did take care of

football. Yeah, and he threw one in the Rams game, you know, when he came in as a fill-in. Right. And Tyler Lockett fell. I think he got tripped up with like Jordan Fuller or something like that. And it's plays like, like you can't throw that pick. And, you know, he did turn the ball over in the Steelers game that ultimately cost him the game. So he hasn't been like perfect. I just think that when the margins are slim between the two of them, it's stuff like, who protected the ball to best that may ultimately decide it along with being consistent with the football. You know how things can change at like the drop of the hat in the NFL, right?

I actually recorded one of these pods last week with your colleague at the athletic Greg Alman, who covers the Buccaneers. And, you know, I mentioned the caveat that, hey, Greg, anything can happen at any point with regards to Rob Grankowski, turns out before we even release that podcast, Gronk retired. So, you know, things can happen. But on the Baker Mayfield front, do you think that is something the Seahawks are continuing to monitor, something that they might be interested in maybe a little bit later this summer? Yeah, if he gets cut, I don't think the trade value is there at all.

Like I mentioned, the salaries of Drew and Gino. Now compare that to like the 18 mil bakers do. And even if you have the Browns eat. like 12 of that, you're still paying more for Baker than these other two guys, like combined. At least I think. Maybe I'm getting Drew. I might be getting Gino Sally Long. He might have actually got a little pay bump.

He might be making like three or something like that. But still, neither one was making starter money. And you'd be paying Baker starting money and with the chance that he could also become a backup. My thing with Baker is that, A, he has some issues protecting the ball, too. he has a lot of head scratching throws mixed in between his like throws that make you say oh okay well that's why he was you know a first round pick maybe not the first round pick but a first round pick um i know he was number one overall but you get my point and then my other thing with baker is that i feel like in 2021 just from an offensive standpoint although the defense matters here a little bit

they were doing what the seahawks want to do you know they had a great running game with Nick and Kareem, and they had an outstanding offensive line that run blocked like crazy. You know, Baker could hit the play action stuff, and it just didn't, I didn't come away from that season thinking, okay, cool, like the Baker thing is what they should invest in. And it's like, that's the same formula they want to use here, you know, have a really good offensive line, have a two-headed monster running a ball, kind of control the game that way. And if we got to throw it, let's play action. And if we have to throw it, you know, on third and obvious, you know, or whatever,

let's hit that, that middle of the field and, you know, possess the ball. And the situation here is just not even as good as the one in Cleveland. Like that Cleveland O'Line in 2020 was really, really, really good and had probably one of the best O-Line coaches in football. You know, this O-Line might have, not might have, will have a new center, might have two rookie tackles, all right, and a first-time O-Line coach. It's just a different situation with two Reddingbacks and Kenneth Walker and Rashad Penny who aren't, you know, Nick Chubb and, you know, Cream Hunt. So if he, if Baker wasn't that dude in that situation, I don't see any scenario in which he's better, you know, or any more consistent in Seattle. By the way, just to throw it out there, according to overthecap.com, Gino's cap hit this year is 3.5 million.

So we did get a little bit of a book. Okay, yeah, he did get the three. Like you, like you alluded to, that's not starter money at the course. quarterback position. So he's not, he's not, certainly not cash strapping them. I thought it was interesting you mentioned the, the two rookie tackles, obviously Charles Cross and Abe Lucas. Very fascinating because we know how, and we're bearing the lead here because we will talk about the backfield, but knowing how the Seahawks want to play, how they're going to play, how they've always played under Pete Carroll, did you find it interesting that they drafted two tackles who

essentially were past setting on nearly every snap in college at Washington State. and Mississippi State, obviously, the Mike Leach connection with both of those schools? Yeah, I was very surprised by that. Although I mocked both of those guys to Seattle at different points in the offseason because I would just like they can, I just think this is the same. I made the same argument with Stone Forsyth last year who was in a pass heavy offense in Florida before he became a six-round pick in the 2021 draft. I think it's harder.

And I've spoken to some old line guys as well who know more about this than me. I think it's harder to find a guy who's like a great pass, excuse me, a great run blocker and then developed him into a good pass blocker instead of doing the inverse. Like it's still hard either way. But like if you give me a guy like Charles who maybe run blocked like, I don't know, 10% of his snaps or whatever it was in college or a guy like Abe Lucas, I feel like if you're elite at the past part, I trust my staff a little bit more to develop you in. to the run part of it. Whereas, like, if you are, I'll take Damien Lewis, for example, or I'll take a tackle. I'll take Germina Fetty, the other first round pick in 2016, who was like, all right, this dude puts his hand in the dirt, he'll move somebody.

But if you leave him on an island, who knows? Like, I think it's just harder to work with those guys. And, like, again, talking to some O-line folks, like, I think they would agree, generally speaking. So that's why I mocked them there. I did not think that the Seahawks would agree with that sentiment because none of the O-line guys I talked to were like their O-line guys. They were just people who knew trench play.

So I was actually encouraged that, you know, if only because it just made me look smarter to, you know, to mock those guys for that reason. For the Seahawks, he's like, yeah, no, he's right. Like, we'll take these guys who pass blocked 90% of the time, teach them how to put their hand in the dirt. And then when it is time to block, we don't got to, you know, on third and whatever, we don't got to teach them that.

I think that is the way that you should operate unless you have like a guy who's a do-it-all tackle, but those are just kind of hard to find with the way the college game goes right now. So, yeah, I was surprised for sure, but I definitely think it was the right decision. I mean, it's just kind of funny just to go on the Charles Cross thing. And like in a discussion of Seahawks draft picks and first round picks throughout the years, it was kind of interesting for them to make a pick in the first round where I think everybody was like, you know what? I think you can talk about his skill set.

but hey, that makes sense. Like they didn't go off the board. They just kind of, they took the really good player to play at a position in need with Charles Cross. Honestly, that was like their whole draft this year. Yeah, exactly. I was higher on this draft than I've been on any drafts since I've been covering them and I've been covering them since 2017.

I didn't have a great feel for how to really cover drafts in 2017 and 2018. But I was critical. My criticism seemed to end up, it aged well. I put it that way. This year, I don't really know how well any of these dudes. will be, will perform at, I don't know how good they'll be.

I should say that, but the process I liked, you know, you needed a tackle, took a tackle. You needed another tackle, took another tackle. You needed edge rushers,

took two. Needed corners, took two. Guys who skill sets in college should translate, like Charles was just a really good athlete. He's skiing versatile in my mind. Boye, Maffei, fits from Minnesota,

fits their kind of three, four look. Even Kenneth Walker at 41, the running back had a Michigan State, like he fits their blocking schemes, kind of that one. He's kind of like a one cut and go type of back. You know, that's kind of what their mid zone, outside zone schemes kind of sets them up to be. You look at some of Rashad Penny's big runs last year.

We're just like him feeling out the backside, cut and boom, gone. Let's see. Kobe Bryant loved him at Cincinnati. Really good zone corner, really good man corner or two, mostly off man. but he just kind of fits, you know, what they needed. And he's really polished, too, you know, spent five years in college, grew up around NFL players. And his brother was an NFL player. So he just kind of comes in a little bit more pro-ready than some other guys.

Tarik Willen, long-armed fits kind of the Pete Carroll thing. I mean, I just took two receivers in the seventh. I was like, whatever. That's fine. In the seventh, I don't really care. You take a punter. But, yeah, their whole draft just made sense. Again, that doesn't necessarily mean any of these guys will be all pros.

But, I mean, you look at some teams. were like, you're like, what the hell are they doing? You know, and that was the Seahawks for the last like four or five years. So it was kind of refreshing that their draft just made sense. So let's get to that second round pick, obviously, of Kenneth Walker. And I know you're intimately familiar with the Let Russ Cook, you know, faction, the running backs don't matter faction. You had to get a little bit of a chuckle when they spent a second round pick on a running back.

Like, you can't help yourself there if you're Pete Carroll. But ultimately, I feel Kenneth Walker is a really good player. Rashad Penny obviously has had some reliability issues. Heading into camp, how do you see this backfield? How do you see it shaking out? And if you can even mention whether or not Chris Carson like ever straps on the pads again as part of that. Yeah, I know this pod's not coming out like this week.

But as of like while we're recording this, I think Chris is making or meeting with doctors in Dallas, I think this week to kind of determine his fate. So his fate could be determined by a time this, this drop, but I feel like it's kind of unlikely that he plays or is cleared to play anytime soon. I just feel like once you get to messing with neck injuries and your neck just not responding to contact the right way and that's just a really, really scary territory to be in, it's kind of a space I'm familiar covering because, you know, Cam Chancellor in 2017 was very similar, kind of

with these ominous updates, you know, that was like, well, maybe he can play, maybe he can't, you know, he feels okay, but we don't know how to respond to contact. similar thing with Cliff Averill, that same offseason, you know, and both of them never played football again. So, like, not to say, you know, Pete Carroll has said that it's a little different than those two, I believe, but like at the end of the day, your spine is your spine, you know, like if you're something wrong with your, you got disc issues or whatever, like that's scary stuff regardless

if it's similar to Cliff or Cam. So I'm a little worried there. I'm a little worried about Rashad, not just, not from a time, talent standpoint, it just hasn't been able to put it together for a whole season. And that's a really hard position to put it together for a whole season. I mean, it's just the play doesn't end until someone smacks you in the face, right? Like that's, that's tough. It's a very tough position to be and to stay consistent. So not to say that I don't hope he stays healthy. I hope he's healthy the whole year, but he just hasn't done it. So it's hard to project that he will, you know.

And Kenneth, you know, we don't have much on his injury, history as it'll, you know, translate to the pros. But I mean, I think he's hurt now. I think he like he came in with like a bad hammy. It wasn't able to practice in minicamp. He was one of the rookies that got called out by Pete Carroll, you know, because Pete Carroll sees that if you show up and you work out and then all of a sudden your hamstring's bad, to him, that means you came in out of shape. I don't know if that's the exact correlation there.

I feel like other things could be wrong, but whatever. Pete's been around the game longer than me, so let's roll with that. So, like, I think the talent is in the room. You know what I mean? Like, I think it's fine. Those three right there are guys. I think could all be thousand yard backs in 2022, but just like how many of them

are going to get the carries and the starts to be thousand yard guys in 2022. So that would be my worry. If they're all healthy, though, I think it's a really, really, really good back food. Before we let you go, Mike, one question that I've been posing to everybody here on the franchise focus podcast series

and we'll continue to do so as we continue this series. Maybe one player we might not have talked about or might not be on the tip of the tongue or the average fantasy player who has a shot to make an impact on offense for the Seattle Seahawks this year? He's not like an underrated guy, but we didn't mention Noah Famp much. I think that like he's, I think he, whoever plays quarterback is just going to love him, man. He's really, really, really good.

When I watched a little bit of Broncos tape this off season, and I was just like, oh, wow. Yeah, no, okay, I see why he was thrown in. Not thrown in, but I was like, I'll see why the Seahawks were like, let's get that dude, you know, because I thought Gerald Everett was a really athletic, really good, really versatile, tight in. I think Noah fans better. You know, I think that that's the only position group I think that like actually upgraded in the offseason was tight end across the entire team. Just just purely by swapping Gerald Everett for Noah Fant.

I think he should be a good threat in the red zone. I think like he should be a reliable target on third downs, especially when teams try to bracket, Tyler Lockett, and D.K. Metcalf, like, I think you can trust Noah to go beat his man. He's probably their third best pass catcher on the team. So I know he's been, like a top 10 guy in terms of production since coming in the league as a first round pick in 2019. So I'm not picking under radar, under the radar sleeper or anything. But yeah, I just think that he's going to be a vital part of the passing game. Even if they're passing game any dynamic this year, which it won't be.

He'll put up some numbers. I'm pretty confident in that. His name is Michael Sean Dugar. You can follow him on Twitter at Mike Dugar. That's D-U-G-A-R. It's been fantastic talking to you, Mike, and obviously follow his work at the after. athletic and his Seahawks man-to-man podcast, his radio show.

You can tell why you've got a podcast and a radio show because you were fantastic. Given all the details we needed, a nice little drop about Kenneth Walker. Mike, thanks so much for joining us here on the Franchise Focus Podcast Series. It was great talking to you. No problem. Thanks for having me. And we'll be back with more of these. We're going to be releasing six of them a week.

So stay tuned with for more beatwriters on the Franchise Focus podcast series here at FantasyPoint.com. Thanks for tuning in to this edition of the Fantasy Points podcast. Remember to subscribe, rate, and review on your favorite platform. And come join the roster at FantasyPoint.com.