Fantasy Football Daily - 2022 Take Talk Epsiode 12

Episode Date: October 19, 2022

Brett Whitefield (@BGWhitefield) and Steven ORourke (@callmesteveo7) took a deep dive on team building, as well as discussed contenders and pretenders. --- Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/fantasy-points-podcast/support Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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This Black Friday, you've got a whole month to catch all the exclusive offers waiting for you. See your local Nissan dealer or nissan.ca for details. Conditions apply. It's time for the Fantasy Points podcast brought to you by FantasyPoints.com. Top level fantasy football and NFL betting analysis from every perspective and angle, from numbers to the film room with a single goal to help you score more fantasy points. Welcome into episode 12 of the Take Talk podcast. I'm Stephen O'Rourke, and as always, I'm with my co-host, Brett Whitefield.

and today we want to kind of talk about quarterback play in the NFL this year. I know that you've been diving deep into the film to kind of look at trends and just quarterback play in general this year. What are your initial thoughts coming away from doing your little study you've done the last few days? Yeah, so actually what ended up happening is, as per usual, I kind of spiral how to control and one thing leads to the next and I go down this rabbit hole

and I ended up going a totally different direction with what I was looking into and I want to talk about team building and how teams are acquiring quarterbacks and what is the best way to go about that process? I know we're at the point in the season now too where we're going to have a pretty good idea of who's going to be picking at the top of the draft.

Yes. And is it true that picking that QB number one, number two, or top five is always the answer. And I, after what I've looked into, I mean, I've, I kind of think maybe that's not true. I have

some stats I want to throw out your like, or not even stats, but they're facts. Like I went on a fact-finding mission. All right, here's one. You ready for this? Yep. There's only five QBs in the NFL that were drafted in the top five that are with their original teams. Four of them are.

on rookie contracts. That was mind-blowing to me because I'm like, there's this notion that you have to tank and get a QB one or two overall to be good. And that right there is almost like a narrative buster. Yeah, as far as like a homegrown quarterback, like, you know, build it from within and that mindset. Exactly. I'll keep going.

So 20 of 32 starting QBs were drafted outside of the top five. Wow, that's higher than I would have thought. Right. Furthermore, 16 of 32, so half were drafted with the 10th picker later. So half the QBs weren't even drafted inside of the top 10. 12 of 32 starting QBs were drafted outside of the top 20. That's still a lot. That's still a lot.

Yeah. That's more than a third of the starting QBs in the NFL were drafted outside of the top 20. Right. Another crazy one. 15 of 32 starters this year are starting for teams that did not draft them. That's another one that's just like, what? 27, this is a crazy one, dude. 27 of 32 starting quarterbacks were either taken outside of the top five or are playing for different teams this year.

So a lot of the guys that were taken inside the top five, they're ending up on different teams. What is this coming down to? I think a lot of it is maybe when you're picking number one or number two in the draft, you are a bad football team. And maybe it's true that not dropping a quarterback into that environment, no matter how good they are, no matter how elite that pedigree is, it's probably not the best way to do it. it just really doesn't work. I mean, we have evidence it doesn't work.

Right. Kyler Murray is the only current number one overall pick. Actually, top five QB selected in the draft. That's with their original team on a second contract. You go, like, Steve, let's do this. Let's do this really quick. Let's look at just the top 10 QBs in the NFL. So we have, like, just a spot off.

We have Mahomes, Alan, Lamar Jackson, Justin Herbert, probably Deshawn Watson, even though he's likely a dirtbag. Aaron Rogers, Tom Brady, Joe Burrow, and then maybe for that 10th spot, you could go like some comma, a Hertz, Dak, car, something like that, right? Right.

Any disputes there. Maybe Kyler gets in there somewhere, but I don't have him in my top 10. No, he was probably 14 or 15 for me. Like, at least the people I thought of up there. Okay. So of the 11, 12 quarterbacks, I just mentioned as potential top 10 guys.

Yeah. Only one of them was selected. in the top five. And that was Burrow, who was the first pick. Yep. Go down the list. Mahones was the 10th pick. Josh Allen was a 7th pick.

Lamar Jackson, 32nd. Justin Herbert, 6. Deshawn Watson, 12th. Not even playing on the same team. They drafted him. Aaron Rogers, 24th. Tom Brady, six-round pick, obviously. Hertz was the 53rd overall selection.

Dak was picked in the fourth round. Carr was picked in the 36th round. Or 36th overall pick. Cousins was, what, a third-rounder? fourth third or four yeah fourth who's a fourth

runner I mean it's I feel like this conversation needs to happen more often than it does because

this is right around the time of year where you know if you're a fan of Detroit or you're a fan of whatever

one win team you say talking about making for that QB right and Detroit's been building

something specifically Detroit where you know they've been trying to get that team right before they put the QB in. Right.

Like that's the whole plan there is to flesh out the team and have a quarterback come into like the perfect situation. You know, learning curve kind of is a lot. Learning curve is a lot smaller compared to, you know, a guy going on to a team that is a mess. But like you said, that doesn't necessarily mean it's going to work. Right. Exactly. And going back to this top 10, 11, 12 list or

I just spout it off the top of my head. I mean, shoot, just look at it there. Patrick Mahomes. He was dropped on a team that was a Super Bowl contender already. Now, they hadn't gotten over the top, of course, because that's why they took him. But that was a good football team. They made a move to come up and get him. Josh Allen getting picked at seven.

That was a good football team already. They had made the playoffs the year before. Right. Lamar Jackson got drafted by a perennially good team in the Baltimore Ravens. that team is always competitive. Justin Herbert gets drafted by the Chargers. Now, they've had their ebbs and flows, but they won 12 games just a year earlier.

So they went 12 and 4 that had a bad season because of injuries. Right. And they take Herbert at 6. Yeah, the Chargers have always had a talented team. Yeah, that was always a team that was ready for a good quarterback. Right. Aaron Rogers, obviously, you know, that was like 15 years ago now, but when they drafted him, I mean, Packers have never been bad in our lifetime, Steve, I don't think.

That one year that Aaron Rogers got hurt, and even then they weren't as bad as they probably should have been. Right. Brady, obviously, New England was already a contender when he took the starting job over. Hertz falls into Philly. They had won a Super Bowl two years before. Still, he came onto a team with one of the best O-lines and D-lines in the league. They had some holes, of course, but it was a good foundation. There was a good football team. Right. Dak, Prescott. I mean, Cowboys with Tony Romo were a playoff team every year.

Couldn't get over the hump, but good team. Derek Carr. You know, that's probably one of the anomalies. That team wasn't super good when they drafted him. Joe Burrow, that team wasn't super good when they drafted him. And Deshawn Watson. Actually, no, the Texans were pretty good, right? Yeah, the Texans were a decent team.

Yeah, they had that. All-Star D-Line with JJ Waugh, Jadavian Clowny, and Whitney Merciless. Yep. And then Andre Johnson was he, he was there, right, when Watson was drafted? Yeah. It would have been like his last year or two, if he was. But they made the playoffs with what, freaking Brock Osweiler at quarterback? Yeah.

You before they took Deshaun? So, I mean, that's what I'm saying. Like, I don't think the play anymore is picking a guy in the top five. I mean, how much of it, like, in theory, like in theory, is it mistakes in scouting? Potentially? Because you look at like Mahomes, Herbert, Josh Allen, Lamar Jackson. Some of those guys were, you know, they were obviously drafted later in the, later in the first round. If they had gone to another team.

Now, Josh Allen, I think is an anomaly. But do you think it's a scouting issue? and it's guys going to the, like, you know, guys not getting picked up by the right spots as far as teams that could go another step? Or is this go into scouting, coaching, development, like all the way through to where, you know, a lot of these guys not necessarily would have made it on the teams that were drafting earlier in their respective draft? I think it's probably both. Or it's probably a little bit of everything, right? I mean, scouting's a big part of it,

but even like Mahomes' draft class wasn't highly regarded as a good class. No, it wasn't. You had Mitch, Mahomes, and Watson, and ironically, probably two of the top 10 QBs in the league came out of that draft class with Mahomes and,

and Watson. But, so like, I don't know that it seems like every NFL scout kind of identified that class the same way. Right. And that was one where I still can remember it, where it just felt like everybody over, like, it just felt like everybody had way too much time before, and it just got overthought to the end of degree.

Well, Trubisky being the first guy of that bunch taken was kind of a joke. Yeah, still. Yeah. I mean, I thought Mahomes and Watson were both light years ahead of him. Yeah, Watson always felt, Watson felt like a guy that it was like a guarantee. at least for me when I was watching. Yeah, I had the same thoughts. Mahomes just his raw tools and what he was able to do.

Just incredible stuff. So I kind of, I had him as my QB1 pretty cleanly in that class just because, you know, I knew there would be a million, a million ways he could help you win outside of just typical boundaries of football. But that class after those three guys went too It was just a train wreck. Deshawn Kaiser in the second round. Davis Webb. Is he still in the league?

Davis Webb? If he is, he's hanging by a thread. I feel like his name pops up every year, but it didn't as frequently this year. Yeah. C.J. Bethard. You remember him? Oh, yeah.

Josh Dobbs. He was part of that rolling cast of 49ers quarterbacks that got rolled through for a period there. Yep. I remember the Lions took Brad Kaya that year. Yeah. Miami. Going into that college football season, Kaya was considered to be a top five potential player. Right.

And the Lions fans were over the moon that they got him in the sixth round. And I tried to temper expectations with the fact that he was drafted in the sixth round. There's a reason that happens usually. For a quarterback, if you're like, most of the time, if you're making it that late, there's definitive flaws in there. Yeah, but back to the main point here is I just, when you're looking at how you build a team, quarterback is obviously the most important position. But development is such a crucial part to how these guys grow and help your team win football games.

If you're putting them in a scenario where you're losing every game or near every game because it's a terrible team, you don't have a lot of talent on the team. How are you helping him develop? Right. Because a lot of these guys, if you get picked first overall, the expectation is you start day one. In fact, I don't even have a recent memory of a guy getting picked number one overall and not starting day one. Going back to, shoot, Matthew Stafford's year. Like, has there been a number one overall pick that hasn't just walked in and started?

No. I don't think so. Maybe not even a number two overall pick. Not that I can think of. Right. So, I mean, that's, that's problematic. And then when you look at the fact that there's 15 starters in the league right now that are playing for teams that didn't even draft them,

it tells me that there's a lot of turnover going on, and there's a lot of quarterbacks available year over year. So, go ahead. Yeah, it's weird because it feels like the quarterback movement has obviously increased over the last three years or so. Yeah. But it's just, yeah, it's just a matter of, you know, I feel like there are those guys that bounce around like your Baker Mayfield, Sam Darnold's, the previous like top tier picks, reclamation projects, teams thinking they can fix that, which I don't, which I think, I don't think necessarily works. I don't think it ever really has worked. Yeah, it's, oh, man.

That's another, that's another one where I see, like, you'll see teams sometimes do that where it's like, all right, this is a guy who was a former number one pick. top 10 pick. He didn't work in his last place, but the last team was a disaster, obviously. So that's done and moved on. And the other teams think they can come in and fix the guy. And that's another method that I feel like never works either. So I used to agree with you on this. The problem is we're kind of seeing it work, right?

You just had back-to-back Super Bowls won by guys that weren't on their original teams, Tom Brady and Matthew Stafford. Yeah, but those aren't reclin, but those aren't guys that you're trying to who necessarily fits. True, but it, like, it shows, I think that we're seeing that taking a bet, taking a bet on a proven guy that's just looking to get out of a situation, paying up to do that is more valuable than taking an unknown commodity at this point.

Like, you're better off trying to gun after the, gun after the guys that have established themselves. and have, you know, maybe... Got you. Okay. Had some mediocrity on their current team. Like, that's more fruitful than trying to get the guy that it's like, oh, I think we, I think he was just failed by his coaching staff at his first spot.

That's why he wasn't bad. That's why this player didn't play well. If we bring him here... Yeah, it's the hubris of the NFL. They always think that, right? Right. So we're on the same page now. I didn't realize that's where you're going.

I get it. The first, it was a too long. of a question and was worded poorly. So let me ask you this. We need to define, like, what is working then? Like, is Kirk Cousins working in Minnesota? Is that considered working? Like, statistically, he's been pretty phenomenal there.

They haven't won as many games as they want to with him, I don't think. But, like, he looks apart almost all the time, except for when they're in prime time. He runs that offense the way they want to run. Is that considered working? Could they have done better if they would have drafted a guy four years ago and developed him? Right. Yeah, that's, and Kurt Cousins is always the one that like breaks my brain as far as kind of in the debate because it's like he always puts up good numbers. But you just can feel it.

It's a feel thing with him where when you watch it, you're like, this just isn't going to do it when it comes time to like need it. Yeah. What about Jimmy G. Is he working in San Francisco? Rand? Does that work? No, I think. You don't think that's working? Not really. He's been to a Super Bowl and multiple NFC championship games with the 49ers. And that's not, I mean, that's on the heels of, I would argue, a defense that can lead a team to a Super Bowl. I'm just picking your brand. Yeah. Tana Hill and Tennessee, is that working? Would you call that working? That's what I would want to say is working.

Okay, I agree. I agree. I think that's worked. Now, they're probably in a spot where Kansas City was, well, assuming they keep the turnaround going and they win games this year. Last year, they were probably in that spot, though, where it's like, okay, cool. Tamahill was better than any QB we've had the last 10 years. He elevated us to a certain level, but now we need to elevate beyond him even, right? So they're probably in that, like, he's their Alex Smith, where, yeah, he's a good quarterback,

and he makes plenty of good throws, but he's probably not going to get you over the hump. So yeah, it's worked, but we need something to work better. Yes. Matt Ryan in Indianapolis is that working. I think that is definitively not working. Carson Wentz, in Indy last year, Washington this year, is that working? That one's kind of iffy. Again, that one feels, it feels closer in Washington than it, I guess it kind of feels the same. It does feel the same. It's so chaotic, dude. Yeah, it's just Carson Wentz where, He just, you can promise yourself there's going to be six to ten plays a game where he actively is trying to throw the game. But other than that, it looks good.

But then there's the six to ten plays that are just defining plays of the game. So I've had this theory that the public is way higher on whence than most NFL analysts are. So I started asking random people just in conversation like, hey, do you know if the public? the Colts made the playoffs last year. And literally every, like, just random person, like every, like, casual football fan thinks, yes, the Colts made the playoffs last year. They had a really good team.

Yeah. The Colts did not make the playoffs last year. No, they did not. They had an epic meltdown to not make the playoffs. They missed in a very embarrassing, like, complete shutdown against Jacksonville. Yeah. Oh, yeah. The one team they had to beat.

had the first overall pick of the draft, and they couldn't beat him. Right. It's almost like, I swear, it's almost like when Indy brought Philip Rivers over, Philip Rivers brought all of his luck from the chart, from his Chargers tenure with him. And now it's like in the Indy building. Yeah. Because like last year felt very Chargers-E to me. Oh, God.

In the meltdown of their season. and how it's like, it's like if you look at a singular moment, you're like, this could be the best team in the league. But then like you zoom out and somehow it just like falls apart and like the image gets more pixely. That's like how I saw their team last year. And like again, this year, a team that should have and I like, I know I had them as a dark horse competitor. A lot of people had them as a dark horse like could come out of the AFC if they, everything goes right.

And I mean, Matt Ryan, it seems like he aged five years and one summer. You're not kidding. Well, so going back to what you previously said, where, you know,

you don't think these reclamation projects are worth it or whatever. Right. So I don't know if that's 100% true. I also don't know if it's false, but just looking at it, just, you know,

briefly processing this, like, while we're like live talking. It's like, what about timing? Doesn't timing matter a lot in when you add a quarterback to the mix? Yes, absolutely. So like the Colts, for example, they've been doing this carousel thing for, what, three years now after luck retired.

They had Jacoby Bressette for a year, Philip Rivers, Carson Wentz, and now Matt Ryan. That's like, okay, that's cool. I like the idea that they're going to buy stability with a vet that has experience and has proven. Right. Let's just for argument's sake, say that the offseason they brought in Philip Rivers, what if they also drafted a quarterback high? I don't even remember who came out that year.

I'm blanking. Was that the Herbert year? No, that was the year before. Yeah. It doesn't even matter. Let's just say they, just for argument saying, they take a QB high. Right. And he gets to play behind Philip Rivers for a year.

And then maybe next year he's not quite ready. So they insert Carson Wentz and they battle it out all year. The Colts potentially be way further along in their team building aspect, right now if they inserted a developmental QB to the mix. Probably. Because like I like like as you're talking through that like I that sounds like the perfect the perfect like quarterback strategy of like bringing a guy that can keep you competitive. But who but like you know maybe be old maybe is a little bit older.

And like you can you know, no obviously no NFL player is going to be under. of losing their job. Unless they're retiring the next year, like every NFL guy, every guy in the NFL is competing for his spot. But like, you know, just the very clear message to the team and the fan base that like, this is step one, step two is getting the rookie in. Because then also I think that it like, I think that you can kind of guard yourself in a way where you have this established guy who may be older, maybe he's not,

but you know what they are and they can play decently well. Like if you're getting the vibes of like you're you, you whiffed on your rookie quarterback. Yeah. You still have that guy in place. Now that doesn't always go over well with a fan base, obviously. But like it offers a security blanket where it's like if you're feeling like this, if you're feeling like your rookie isn't panning out,

you can kind of you still have the established guy in place. Yeah. All right, I'm about to trigger the fan base of the Colts right now. Oh, boy. Trigger warning. All right, listen. That year, the 2020 off season, they did draft Jacob Eason that pick 122 in the draft. Okay.

That's not what I'm talking. I'm not talking about that kind of guy. Talking about a little bit more pedigree than that. But the same year, Jalen Hertz went 53rd in that draft. The Indianapolis Colts just happened. happened to make two second round selections before pick 53. They picked Michael Pittman at Pick 34 and Jonathan Taylor at Pick 41. Now, Steve, what if the Indianapolis Colts instead of taking Jonathan Taylor at 41 when Jalen Hurds at pick 41?

They probably would be, you know, they'd be ahead of where they're at right now. They'd be light years ahead of where they're at right now. Jonathan Taylor is a running back. He's averaging, what, three yards of carry this year? The win it all year that they brought in Matt Ryan to lead this juggernaut to the Promise Land? Yeah. Okay.

Cool. I'm cool with Pittman at 34. I'd much rather have him than Jonathan Taylor. He plays a more valuable position. You go Pittman at 34, Jalen Hertz at 41. You are now cooking with gasoline. Right. So timing is everything, man.

So going back to the point about the reclamation process. I think there is a time and a place for that. Yes. And there's one guy, Steve, I'm thinking of right now. One guy who has lit the NFL on fire. And we got to talk about it. This is worth talking about it. Week one, I was like, whatever, it's a fluke.

Week two, you know, whatever. We're five weeks in now and he is bawling out. And that's Gino freaking Smith. Yeah. Gino Smith, former second round pick of the New York Jets. For whatever reason, I thought he was a first round pick. after I did my research, I realized he wasn't even that. He was a second round pick.

Yeah. In fact, I think he was, what? Yeah, number 39. So he's a top 50 player, but this is the kind of guy I'm talking about, though. Right. You know, he's in that Hertz mold where definitely has to develop. But he went to a pretty man franchise in the Jets. But now he's been, what, four or five years since he started for another team.

I know he got a couple starts with Seattle last year. But he's been Seattle's backup for three years now. Yeah. He had had a couple of starts in New York with the Giants. I think one, one start, right? Just one. I think so. Because that was the point where he started and then Eli came back and then

weird QB controversy there a couple years back. Davis Webb. Yeah, so Gino has been, he's been playing on a vetman deal. for two years. Right. He played pretty well last year in relief of Russell Wilson. I mean, not like, not like he is right now, but he played, you know, he definitely reestablished himself as like, man, this guy's a backup quarterback.

He's worth some money. So they paid him a little bit. I think they gave him like a $3 million raise. I think he's making just under $4 million this year. Good for Gino. But the dude has clearly been working. Steve, this guy is balling out. I don't know if you've got any data points handy, but I do.

I'm looking at him right now, and it's just like. eyebrow raising. Yeah, so we chart throw for throw accuracy on every play. Hold on one sec. And so one of the other things we chart is like the highest level of

throw, basically. We call it like a wild throw, essentially. Right. I would say it's similar to PFF's big time throw. If you guys are familiar with that stat, but wow throw is we're going to be comparable

we take some other things into factor when we're charting a throw as a wild throw. But he leads the NFL all quarterbacks right now in wow throw rate, which is nuts. He is fourth

among all starting quarterbacks in accurate throw rate. So like high level accuracy. I'm not talking about, you know, it was like on the front of a guy's body he had to extend for it. I'm talking like actual

dimes. Like his dime rate is really what we should call the stat. He's 4-3 NFL. And he looks mechanically sound. I actually have a friend who's a quarterback coach in the NFL. I'm not going to name drop

him here. But I texted him and said, hey man, have you watched Gino it all this year? I need feedback. Mechanically, how's the man looking? And he said, yeah, we actually have spent some time watching. I mean, he looks phenomenal. like everything looks good he's calm in the pocket yeah he's using his feet when he has to

manipulating defenders really well with his eyes his throwing motion is dialed in consistent his footwork is great uh he's driving the ball really really well dude he's making i i tweeted yesterday a litany of throws just from week five it was like six throws steve that were just jaw dropping in one week i did like that's like the like the like Those are the type of compilations we put up for guys like Herbert and Mahomes. Right. We're doing them for Gino Smith. Yeah.

I don't know if I was talking to you or Chris when I was making the video, but I even said, this is the classic Mahomes meme where it's like, oh, if Mahomes makes this throw, we're talking about it for three weeks. I mean, it's true for all six of the throws in that compilation. Yes. I mean, it was crazy. That tweet is doing very well, by the way. I think, like, the video I posted has like 50,000 views right now, which is for me, I'm a small-time account.

You know, that's pretty big deal. I went to it and it looked at it last night and the activity on it was pretty impressive. I mean, the second throw where he's scrambling out to his left, he like opens up his shoulders and fires a corner route, guy right over a defender. Like, that throw was absolutely insane. The second lock at touchdown, I think, is the best throw of the season so far. The one down the middle over, like in between three defenders. vendors right in locket's breadbasket you'll be hard pressed to find a throw better than that

the rest of the season i mean like those it's so perfect for gina it's like worked out so perfectly because those wide receivers he has macf and locket are like just they're so good they're so quarterback friendly as targets yeah and that's so like that's so big and clearly like yeah clearly gino i don't know like i don't know if this is all always been there. I feel like he was definitely a guy that it almost always felt like he never got a fair shake. For sure. And but like this is, I mean, light years beyond what anybody thought he ever was.

Even coming in, I don't even like if as a quarterback prospect, like I don't think anybody saw even potentially like this as like a feasible out of it. Yeah. I agree. But going back to the timing, Steve, the Seahawks, where they were in their franchise, or rebuild or whatever, I don't know if they're calling it or rebuild or whatever, but they're clearly retooling. I mean, they traded, they got rid of all the remnants of the Super Bowl team,

with Russ and Bobby and Lockett's really the only guy left there, I think. Pretty much have revamped the entire roster, and they're kind of going through a rebuild, even if they're not calling it a rebuild. Anyways, where they were at in that rebuild, it was a perfect time to take a swing on a couple toolsy guys. And they had Gino who had been with the team for a couple of years now.

So maybe they saw a development that they really liked. And then they bring in Drew Locke, who was a former second round pick, a toolsy guy, cannon arm, mobile dude. Similar to Gino in a lot of ways, actually. Mechanically probably not even in the same stratosphere right now. But my point is, is like, if you're ever going to do the reclamation thing, Steve,

isn't it when you're in a rebuild and you're not ready to win yet? because maybe you accidentally find your quarterback. Maybe the Reclamation Project works. And I think it's kind of weird to say, but through five games in a few games last year, Gino looks like maybe he is a guy. At worst, Gino's established himself as what, a high-end backup. Oh, I mean, like, as high as you can get. I tell you right now, though, he's playing better than just about, you know,

all but maybe five, six quarterbacks in the NFL. Yeah, I mean, like as I was looking through and just trying to off the top of my head, like think of the top 10 quarterbacks in the NFL this year. Like you can't really make it beyond five to seven guys without his name starting to pop into your head. Right. So, well, you know, if you want to use bias from before and like established quarterbacks and all that jazz. Like still, you can't get past, like you can't get out of the top 10 without. thinking about Gino this year. Agreed.

I mean, just in general, like 75% completion percentage in the NFL is absurd. It's absurd. By far, a career high for him, by the way. I mean, that's probably a career high for almost anyone. True. Like, I think we're... Definitely would be a record. I mean, he's probably, like, hit it, like, nearing NFL record status right there.

Yeah. Like, he's just been so... So good. So, like, surgical. Yeah, it's... So basically I wanted to have this conversation so we could get to the point of Gino. And, like, how does the NFL miss this? Is it the Seahawks?

Are they just that good at developing guys? One ironic thing, too, Steve, is Gino's act. He actually throws over the middle of the field. Yeah. Something Russ never did. Like, a bunch of throws in that compilation I posted were right down the middle of the field. Right. You know, there was even a couple slant balls that were like,

you don't want to call him a great throw because it's a freaking slant, right? It's not like, it's not the most difficult throw in the world. But some of them were super tight windows. Yeah. Like it's stone where he's fitting the ball between multiple defenders. You didn't see Russ doing that a whole lot. No. Didn't really throw the dig too much.

Gino's thrown the dig. Yeah. I didn't really like the slant ball too much. Geno's throw the slant. So, the other thing I love about Gino, too, is, he's obviously an athletic guy. He always has been going back to West Virginia. He's 32 years old now, by the way.

So, like, you would assume that athleticism is, you know, on a sliding scale there. But he looks great moving in the pocket. And I love that he never has been a guy who's going to use that athleticism to get himself in arms way and get hurt. Like, he's pretty conservative with it. And he just uses it to open up throwing windows. And that's been apparent this year. Now, he's, listen, he's not. athletic is a guy like Jane Let Hurtain.

He's not going to be a 500-yard per-season rush or ever. Right. No doubt about that. I don't want him to be that either. But he's definitely on the high end of mobile, and he uses that mobility well. All I know is this. When you're capable of putting up a five-game stretch he just put up, you're probably worth starting in the NFL for whatever team.

Yes, there aren't many teams that could turn their backs on you. Right. So here's a question that, like, Like, you said his age and it made me think, what, like, are we misinterpreting or, like, are we getting to the point where we need to accept that potentially the prime of an NFL quarterback's career is later than anybody wants to admit? 100%. I've been a believer of that for a couple years, I think.

With age comes wisdom. Yeah, because, like, I mean, at. a position that does require so much, like, thought and diagnosis and all that, like, things that even the, even the best quarterbacks, you know, they have to come in and learn, like, learn to teach their eyes and everything. Eye discipline. And I think we're just at the point where maybe we're expecting guys to be better. better than they are earlier than they should be.

Like that the learning curve of the position is getting so large because of the complexity of defenses overall and the complexity of offenses as well have both gone, have both, you know, gone up, especially in the last seven to ten years. Are we at a point where we need to kind of rethink the way we evaluate quarterbacks to, anticipate a little bit longer of a learning curve. Now, obviously there are guys that, you know, come in, jump out right away,

Josh Allen Mahomes, people like that. And, you know, with the guys that do develop later, a lot of them you do see it early in their career. But maybe we're just like interpreting the point at which we should expect a quarterback to be really good is on average older than a lot of people want to admit. Yeah, I think that's, It's more than fair. I also, building off that, Steve, like, you look at the one, like, the one major difference

between guys picked in the top five and guys not picked in the top five is the amount of pressure that is on them. Yes. Especially got, like, Mahomes sat a year. Rogers sat a year. And I know we've had this debate a million times. Is it better to sit a guy or start a guy really way? I think the bigger point is, like, what expectations you're establishing for that guy early on?

Right. Like, think about what Josh Allen, the expectations he had. I mean, he was still a top 10 pick, but everybody, everybody in the football community. And I think the bills as well, everybody was like, this is a development guy. So, like, the expectations for year one were super low for him, too. Very much so. Like, everything was, like, everything with him was a debate of, like, is this going to work out? No, it's not.

Yes. yes it is but it's still the expectations from the team and i think from the public was were so low because they're like well this is a guy that's just all tools and not a lot of substance yet so we're not really expecting him to come in and you know make him a super world contender right now like this is a three year project yep absolutely i mean as opposed to like guys like keiler murray baker mayfie field, Trevor Lawrence, you know. Sam Donald. Sam Darnold.

Like these guys that were, Carson Wentz, Jared Goff, like these guys that were taken at top picks for teams that, you know, we're either looking to, on both ends of the spectrum, really, there were teams who were looking to rebuild and there were teams who were looking to take the next step. And it didn't work with any of them. Like, it didn't work with any of those guys. Or at least some, it's still trying to work. work, but, you know, early returns on Trevor Lawrence are mixed.

Kyler Murray, we're changing our opinions rapidly about him. Yep. All right. So I'll wrap a bow on this tightly and then we can move on because I think we have another cool segment to close a show up that you want to do, which is pretty sweet. Yeah. But wrap it a bow on this quickly. So I think the conclusion, Steve, is that maybe there's,

a million different ways you can go about acquiring your quarterback and when it's the right time. Timing is important. Development is important. Where your team is at is important. I think the one thing, though, that is for sure is that if you're a bad football team, there's no reason to force a quarterback in the top five. That's like the one thing we know for sure. Right.

Now, it's a really tough paradox because you can't necessarily pass on a guy either. If you feel like you have a world-class talent, like how do you? justify that. That's the toughest part. You almost have to trust the process, though, and realize that team environment is far more important than maybe. So, like, maybe, Steve, these quarterbacks coming out, maybe traits-wise and skill set-wise,

maybe they're actually closer together than the draft communities put on, including myself. I mean, I 100% think so. like yeah obviously like you have to evaluate where it's like clear definitive like this guy's better yeah this guy's better than this guy and this guy's better than this guy like you have to define it that's why we have rankings and everything and nobody's throwing out ties in there but i like they're all top quarterbacks or maybe even like top three rounds i think like they're all guys that were at one point or are now elite prospects in some respect and like I think that

like all the guys in the NFL in general are just like the most talented like some of the most talented people on the planet earth and like we think the talent gap is a lot larger than it is when reality sometimes it does just take the difference between the difference between having a good coaching staff and not having a good coaching staff and being able to develop a guy to take the next step that every guy needs to take when they come into the NFL. Right. Well, that plays perfectly to my next point, which is it goes that far on the college end as well. Like the circuit, like, and I feel like scouts have done a poor job of this, even talking to some of them,

even talking to draft Twitter guys too. We collectively do a pretty poor job of understanding a player's circumstances in college and how that impacts their valuation. Yes. Like a guy like Mac Jones, for example, I loved Matt coming out, but you can't deny the fact that he had an insane offensive line and he was throwing to four first round freaking draft picks at wide receiver. Right.

Your perception of him is going to be greatly influenced by the fact that he always had guys open and he rarely was under pressure. You don't get to see college quarterbacks operate in that environment very often. No. So that is definitely. definitely we're talking about. I mean, I mean, Herbert is a perfect example for it. Right.

Like, that's a great one. Playing in, playing in in Oregon was bananas, like, totally stripping him of everything that makes him great. Yeah, totally. Like, it was hard to get a read because you saw flashes of the arm, but you didn't get to see him enough. And then with the, with, like, having an offense where, you know, the times you get to show off your arm are times where you're also just, like, testing, testing a deep ball.

And it's like, you know, it's a lot of like these, you know, 50, 50 balls that, you know, you're just trying to throw to a spot and hope your receiver gets there first. And so, like, a lot of it was like, well, is his decision making that, like, how was his decision making? We don't know. He has this big arm, but, you know, he only gets to show it off so often and he's afraid to use it. When in reality, you look at it and you're like, no, it was just a, Like, it was the offense that he was in. The offense that he was in was limiting him. And so it's like that.

And also talentless. Right. Yeah. And, yeah. I mean, there. No good skill players. Oregon offense. They, like, they're all trying to be quick twitch, just fast, speedy guys.

Like, they're not looking for, you know, receive. Oregon's never really going to produce a top 10 receiver. Right. It's not how, that's just not the way their offense or their team is built. But, like, you get like guys like that where it's like, how do you, how can you accurately evaluate a guy when maybe you do get like a Justin Herbert into the building? And all of a sudden you're starting to see him operate an NFL offense. And you're like, holy cow, like we never even, we never even knew this was there because how could you?

Right. All right, Steve. That's a whole other tangent we can get down. I know. You can go in that. We'll come back to, I'm sure we're going to extend TikTok into draft season, of course, right? Oh, of course. So there'll be plenty of awesome draft talk to come.

So yeah, we'll come back to this. We'll revisit the topic probably in February, March, April, May, something like that. But yeah, a lot of dialogue to be had there. But Steve, I know you wanted to do a unique look at the NFL this week. Yes. We're five games into the season. You're starting to see, like you kind of said with the, you know, at the beginning of the quarterback talk, we're starting to see.

the teams that are separating themselves a little bit, the teams that you can start to confidently say are bad, are bad or good. But they're, you know, through five weeks, there's always the teams in the middle. And I wanted to kind of take a look at the NFL playoff picture, as it would be right now, which I know is crazy. There's still a ton of games left to be played. But just take a look at it and go through the teams and, you know, talk about whether we think these teams are for real if they're contenders if they can you know if they're going to make the playoffs and potentially make them play to super bowl or if they're pretenders if they're if their teams like you look at them and it's like you know what okay they're here right now in week five but come

week 17 it's going to be a different story okay i like this let's set a few parameters so we're doing contenders and contenders correct contenders yep contenders and pretenders so let's not, you know, spend 25 minutes talking about every team. Let's be diligent and quick about this. And I'm going to hipfire, Steve. I haven't prepared notes about this. So let's just shoot from the hip here and let's see what we can conjure up. All right.

We'll start in the NFC. All right. I think I want to get your gut reaction first and then let's, and then we can talk about it. Okay. I want you to just like minimal thought, first thing you think of with the team and whether like that'll carry through. So, and the NFC, NFC North leader right now is the Vikings. Okay.

It's a hard one to start. It is a hard one to start. So the Viking, this is I, you know what? The more I think about this, the more I hate you. Because this was one of the teams we disagreed on. Preseason. Preseason. And I, I, I can't correct. Well, I can't confidently tell you that

either, like, who was right? right now because I can. Yeah, record-wise, you can. Absolutely. I said they were rebuilding, dude. I literally said on the pod that they were rebuilding. You said that they were a playoff contender. Yes. You didn't say they would make a plus.

You said playoff contender. I think you're right on this. I think this team has far exceeded my expectations. Despite playing a decent schedule so far, I mean, listen, they handed it to the Packers. I think the Packers are a pretty good team, although they obviously have their flaws. But they got guys balling out right now. This line, offensive line, which I thought was a disaster, is actually really freaking good. Ezra Cleveland is bawling out.

Christian Derisaw is bawling out. Darisaw is a way better player than I ever thought he would be. Brian O'Neill is still really solid at right tackle. Bradbury is even having probably his best year so far. They've got like four out of five offensive line and figured out. When's the last time you could say that about the Vikings? It's been a long time. It's been a really long time.

It's like one side of their offensive line has always been in full. And this Minnesota team is weird to start with because, like, if you look at the stats around the team, it looks like a 500 to below 500 team. Really? Like, if you look at their passing defense, they're giving up 4.5.4.4. percent completion percentage over expected in eight yard average or average depth of target eight point two yards per attempt like teams are throwing the ball pretty easily on them and then you look at over at kirk cousin's stats and he has a 5.9 a dot 3% wow throw 5.1% turnover where they throw and he's 3.2% completion percentage over expected so like you know not amazing stats but you know middle of the road

The rush defense is, you know, about, they're giving up 4.3 yards per rush. It's, you know, they 2.9% explosive play. They only have a 30, about a 40% stuff rate. Like, all of their, all of the stats around the team are saying, like, are middling. But what they're doing is they're winning games. Games where, like, at times it looks like they're trying to give the game away or they're trying to lose, but they end up they end up pulling it out at the end.

This past week. And against the Lions. Yeah, true. But their defense is a little concerning. The D, yeah, the defense for sure. Like I, you notice it watching their past defense. They look. And that was my big complaint about them too when we did our preview show is I just

didn't think they'd have the secondary to cover anybody. Right. I didn't think their D-line was going to be very good. but man, they're playing within each game, I would say well. But yeah, it sounds like in the scope of things, they're not stacking up with the rest of the league. I'm glad you brought up Cousins Adap, by the way, because that was a concern of mine, too. Because outside of Jefferson, who's winning deep balls? Thielen is not at that stage of his career. KJ. Osborne, I know the fantasy community loves this guy as like the sleeper, wide receiver.

He's a jag. He's just a guy. He's just a guy that gets to play next to Jefferson and Thielen. I mean, it's, yeah, he can do some things, but he's not going to be a consistent deep ball guy. So I did worry about his A-DOT. I thought they would do a good job of mixing play action and hitting some of those deep crossers, which they do sometimes. I mean, that's, that's like all of how they beat Green Bay.

Yeah. Yeah, and even the Saints game where they kind of had to come back at the end, like they were just destroying the Saints in the intermediate part of the field. But nothing deep, though. Not a lot deep. So that is concerning to me. They probably need to strongly think about how to get the ball down field a little bit better. I mean, maybe they get Jalen Rager on the field more.

I don't know. But anyways, I like it. Yeah, I mean, overall, like Delvin Cook is playing solidly. He is, you know, 4.6 yards per attempt. He always will. He's fine. He's just running back. Running back so matter.

Not explosive, really. I mean, 2.5% explosive play percentage. 60% of his runs to go over three yards. Like even he's playing middle of the road. But again, there's value to a team that can just figure out how to win. And there's value in that you have Thielen and Jefferson who are very good route runners and can separate. And Jefferson's really good after the catch. So that helps elevate a team.

Yeah, for sure. Working space like that. I still like, I would still say they're a contender because I think that this is a team that can get better. I didn't even say what I thought, did I? Yeah, I like, I think they've kind of established, like seeing them in flux situations, difficult pressure situations, they've come through and won the games. I think that they like, I think they're a contender. I don't think that they're like I would not pick them to go to the Super Bowl, but.

Okay, so contender for what then? that's maybe I'm confused on what this is. Contender for playoffs? Yeah. Okay. All right. Yeah, I think they're a contender for the playoffs for sure. They won't even come close to sniffing the Super Bowl or even the second round.

No, they're a tier. They're an upper, a lower tier two team, I would say. Yeah. But they're a team that could get better and they're a team that can surprise Pete list that could surprise you in a game. As long as long as it's not a primetime game. All right. Who's next?

NFC South Leader Buccaneers. I think that's very clear. They're a third contender. Yeah. They have the best quarterback to ever play the game. Great receiving core. Offensive line that's still playing at a pretty high level. A defense that is capable of completely dismantling anybody,

even though I know they got picked on a couple weeks ago. I'm still very, very high on that defense and that secondary specifically. And like Tom Brady over the last three weeks as he started to get his receiving core healthy. 72% completion percentage a little bit over a thousand yards. 3.7% completion percentage over expected. 3.4% while throw rate.

0.7% turnover worthy. Like he's... Yeah. And they're going to only get healthier too. When you get the dudes around him, like that offense goes. And you even saw the running game start to come alive a little bit this week. You know what, though, I will say this. If I had to say one negative about them quickly, it would just be,

I hate all of these Leonard Fornet dump-offs as much as I hate early down runs in Cincinnati. Just freaking stop. It's a lot. I know Brady is so cerebral and he's always going to try to take a positive play. Yep. I love that about him. But can we just maybe take a couple more risks here and there? do we really need to get 11 targets to Leonard Fornett and four targets of Rashad White?

Yeah, I mean, 15 targets to his running backs, Steve. I mean, yeah, Leonard Fournett had 95 targets last year, I think. Yeah, led the NFL, correct? And for running backs? Or did that clear? Yeah, he did. Or it was, yeah, it was one of those two, but they were, you know, one, two by, you know, probably about two targets. Yeah.

But yeah, Brady loves that quick checkdown. and just like see what four net can create yeah it's just he doesn't like the look he gets cool i'm just going to take two three four or five yards whatever i get here and move on like i i do love that about him he's just willing to kill like i don't like this let's just move on to the next play right it's great like i'm not going to force anything just like let you know see what we get it's like oh this plays over all right next uh nfc east the eagles i mean that oh dude we know I feel like this team. We know how both of us are feeling about that team. Yeah. I'm in love with the team. Hurtz has definitely come down to Earth a little bit the last

week. He's not playing bad by any means. So, you know, I know that we have a lot of Eagles fans, probably our biggest fan base represented here among the listeners, but. I mean, we probably, we probably fostered that growth. Yeah, true. But Hurtz is playing human now. He's still good, still very good still playing great but he is playing a little human i think he's had turnover where they throws him back-to-back weeks for the first time um and i'm eager to see so backing up they're for sure contenders to me i'm eager to see where they go this week because they get a four-and-one cowboy soon who's exceeding all sorts of expectations this is probably the eagle's biggest test and will probably be their only test for a little while because their schedule is cupcake i think uh i saw

something today that the Eagles are like plus 150 for over under 13 and a half wins like that shows how easy their schedule is the rest of the way that wow that's crazy or like there's or like yeah the over under went to 13 and a half like it's it's crazy that that is actually crazy yeah I'm but you're to see with like with Jalen Hertz coming back to earth a little bit Philly's defense has been playing so well. Written to the occasion. I mean, this, like, they're playing so unbelievably well. 5.6 yards per attempt, negative 6.8% completion percentage over expectation, which is leading the NFL.

Six, they've given up six touchdowns, but they have six interceptions. Like, the defense is playing really, really well. And that's helping to compliment and, you know, keep. the offense and keep things afloat while in game while the offense kind of figure some things out yep and they're but yeah they're definitively a super bowl contender like they're clearly they've clearly shown that they can win in different ways that are at the top of the NFL right now I agree I I'm very excited to see how Hertz reacts with demarcus Lawrence and Micah Parsons and you know, some of that crew bearing down on him rushing the passer.

Because this week he got under pressure a little bit, and he still had a really high completion rate, so he was still good about that. But I want to see, I still want to make sure he's making good decisions from the pocket and delivering the ball on time, not getting himself in trouble, looking for those things specifically. So, but yeah, I love contender for sure. Let's go.

Next, NFC West, the 49ers. Oh, man. Kind of a supervised team in the lead there from what everybody expected at the beginning of this season. Well, I don't know. I expected them to be really, really good. I expected them to be good, but I think that the expectations were that the Rams were going to be. Oh, gotcha. And the Cardinals, I feel like people also thought the Cardinals would be kind of step for step with the 49ers, in a sense.

I knew with Warzone 2 dropping this year, the Cardinals. It's too much. It was one of the best cods ever, and he's a big cod guy. You just knew that this season was just going to be a disaster from the jump. You think it's bad now. The game actually drops in like a month or something? Just wait. And it's right when Hard Knocks mid-season kicks in.

Oh, that's, I forgot about that. They're going to sneak into the QB room, and Kyler's going to be in their grinding war zone two camoes on his gun. Oh, and they're not off to a good start, so it's not even like we can talk about a mid-season collapse. It'll just be a terrible season. Right. But the 49ers is the focus. I think if the standards of playoffs, they're for sure contenders.

I mean, this team is insanely talented. Although, how hurt is Bosa? I know he left the game. Is he fine? Can you Google that really quick while I talk? Okay, cool. Because that's a huge. Bosa was the front runner for Dosa.

defensive player of the year easily going into this week. If he's hurt, though, I don't know how that changes their outlook. They also just lost Emmanuel Mosley for the season. Oh, that's a bummer. Yeah. Both two days ago, I was quoted as not feeling great. Okay, but it's not a season ending thing, though. No, no, no, no.

No, like he's there. Okay, cool. His availability will be up in the air for like next week. Okay, that's, we're fine then. Yeah. As long as they don't lose him, that defense is going to be great. I love their playmakers, dude. I love Debo and Kettle and Iuke.

I just love the fact that the way they play, it can be any one of those guys takes over a game. This week, they scored 37 points and not one guy played overly well on offense, except for maybe Jeff Wilson. Right. Man, that running game, those pass weapons, that offense should be consistent, even with Jimmy. I know Jimmy has a capability of messing some stuff up from the time of time, but I think he's consistent enough that he's going to get them to the playoffs pretty easily. I mean, this feels like a team that made their, it feels very similarly to the team that made it to the Super Bowl. And probably should have made it to the Super Bowl last year.

Oh, for sure, should have, yeah. No, you're right. They're probably a little bit better, too, this year. Yeah, like they're number two in pressure rate. They're at 35% pressure rate. They're number two in defensive completion percentage over expected. Like, their defense is playing on an absolutely absurd level. Their number one in rush defense are giving up three yards a rush.

Yeah. Like, over, like, their defense can take them as far as, basically as far as they want them to. Yeah, the thing I love with the pressure rate you mentioned, too, is they don't blitz a ton, Steve. They're getting it done with four guys. Right. We spent a good deal last week talking about how beneficial it is to a defense, but especially when they don't have a ton of proven assets in the secondary,

you're just doing them a lot of favors by getting home with four guys. Right. You're committing seven to coverage on most plays, or not even most, like 80% of plays, which is good. So, no, I like the team. think they win the division yada yada yada they probably even i mean the nfc's looking weird so they probably win a couple of years in the playoffs even oh absolutely i mean in in a year where as i was looking through these as i was looking through these teams for a lot of the teams my

my thoughts went toward defense often i mean under like unders are way up this year. Offensive seem down. It feels like a year where if you have a good defense, it's going to take you farther than it has maybe in the last couple years prior. I can see that for sure. So let me ask you this then real quick. I know we want to be somewhat quick at this.

But in a, let's say they win their division, they get to the playoffs, they're healthy. and then they come, who in the NFC can't they beat, do you think, when they're healthy? Let's say both teams are healthy, relatively speaking. That they can't? I don't think there's anyone that they can't. Okay, who do you think would beat them, though?

Like, maybe the Buccaneers is like... Maybe the Eagles. Maybe the Eagles? Yes, I mean, they're probably Super Bowl contenders. I think. I mean, I do. Yeah. All right. So far through those, like the Buccaneers, the Eagles and the 49ers are probably,

three teams that feel that I'd say everybody, including myself, feels like very confidently. Like I would place a lot of a large amount of my money on one of those three teams coming out of the NFC this year right now. Yep.

So those are the division leaders. And then you get into the wild card spots and there's three wild card spots. First off is the Cowboys. Yeah, they're contenders. Like this is a team. that has completely changed the narrative around them. A team I buried on this podcast.

Yeah. They just beat the defending Super Bowl champions by 12 points while passing for 102 yards. Yeah, like 16 passing attempts, I think. Yeah, Cooper Rush is still undefeated on five starts in his career. I know Cowboys Twitter is kind of going through it with some of the people that are trying to push Cooper Rush to stay in and the rational people who are saying that that'd be an absurd move. Yeah, there's no quarterback controversy because there isn't. No, Cowboys fans, they overreact to everything.

The bright side of what happened with Cooper Rush is you've found your long-term backup. Yes, he's probably never leaving there. Right. You probably sign him to like a three-year, you know, $12 to $15 million deal this year, something like that. That's the bright side with Cooper Rush. But no, he's not your starter. You still have Dak. Dave got this team to a point, though, when Dak comes back, and it looks like we're just a week or two away from that.

I mean, he's starting to work back this week. Yeah, so I would leave Cooper Rush in until they lose a game, for sure. Yeah. Like, just to make sure Dak is 100. Like, I don't want that thing getting re-aggravated. We've established the fact that we are a Super Bowl contender. I want to put the gas pedal down and just, go.

You know what I mean? It's another team where like their defense is playing so well. Yep. They're giving. Oh, their defense is carrying. Absolutely.

But they're giving up 5.9 yards per attempt in the passing game. Negative 5% completion percentage over expected. They're first in the NFL and pressure rate at 36.9%. Like their defense, their pass rush

is breaking teams. yes it's completely breaking teams and that it's just like it's another team where I'm like I their defense is going to keep them in every single game and like you said this is a this is like their first big test you like they're playing an offense they're probably they're playing the best offensive line they've gone up against a one of the most complete offenses they've got up against because the buccaneers were a little bit or hurt and just kind of all over the place when they played each other but like this is this is the first test for the defense where you kind of find out how far how far can they carry them because I'm hesitant I'm hesitant to say it in the um I'm hesitant to say it

until we see DAC back but if like the defense keeps playing the way it does and with the weapons that they do have I mean Tony Pollard is playing well Ezekiel Elliott he is who he is but Cid Lambs playing well Noah Brown is kind of emerged. Gallup is getting healthier every week. Like throw DAC back into the mix. And if that offense could kind of get back to where it was beginning of last year, I would like, I would put them in my top four teams in the NFC right now. Like I would put them fourth. Yeah. Dude, the fact that they're like five deep at pass rusher is just insane. Incredible. And they have, they've got,

a rookie right, Sam Williams, who hasn't even really played yet. At least not a ton. Like, he could continue developing, getting better. And their secondary digs is great. Malique Hooker is playing really well. Wilson's awesome. Like, it's just a good team. Leighton Van der Esch looks the best he's ever looked.

It's just a good defense that I think can take them a long way. Like, I don't see it. There isn't really many things. The pass rush like that, there aren't many offenses that can, like, really, really take it to you. Yeah. It's going to keep you in every game because you just have a relentless force of pass rushers that can wear down an offensive line. Here's a crazy thing about Trayvon Diggs, though. He's actually on pace to allow more yards this year than he did last year.

Really? Which is wild, yeah. his, you know, completion percentage against a little lower. He just, the big thing is he just hasn't come up with the interceptions he has. He's still playing pretty good, though. But I feel like he's not getting burnt deep as often as he was last year. Yeah, I think that's true. It was a big complaint was that, obviously, he was an interception machine,

but with that also came the fact that you could get a couple deep balls on him. So, like, that was a big discourse. And I feel like that hasn't happened as often. against him this year. For sure. Next team. Who would have thought that three teams would be out of the NFC East right now would be looking at? I'm not talking about the Giants.

You're not talking about the Giants? No. All right, let's talk about the Giants, whatever. Pretenders? So that's an immediate... They're pretenders, but I want to give Brian Dayball a ton of credit. Yeah. Especially I look at...

Actually, like, even just overall of the league, like, think about how disappointing the Lions have been compared to what a lot of Lions fans' expectations were. Every other team that picked had a draft pick in the top 10 this year. Yep. Or they were supposed to, at least. I know some of them traded their picks. But every team that finished with a top 10 worst record last year has a better record than the Lions. Yeah.

Not great. The Giants, though, are one of them. They're, you know, they've been pretty darn good. I mean, we should, like, we should have seen this coming. Daniel Jones is, um, the very poor man's Josh Allen in a way. Josh Allen extra light. Like, no calorie Josh Allen. Oh, Cal Josh Allen.

Skinny Josh Allen. Like it's, yeah, not even close. It's Josh Allen if you have a really, really, if you have really, really bad eyes. but like you should have seen it coming jo like this is he still is he's where about where josh allen was coming out less athletic i got a good one you can't go sucralose josh allen like he's not real sugar baby he's just sucralose he's close but you know he's not the real thing and he'll never be the real thing but oh man like is this is an image of Josh Allen junior year of college and that's but like that's what

dable works can work well with like that's what he turned Josh Allen into kind of what he is or like helped develop him into what he is and so he was able to drop Daniel Jones in be a little bit more conservative and now you've got a team that is playing well on offense like they're not blowing anyone away but their defense is playing well and keeping them in games I just like it's and it's funny because like you look at the Giants defense and they're a team where if you look at individual players I don't think that anyone really jumps out at you other than Dexter Lawrence who I think is finally getting the recognition that he deserves oh for sure he's he's playing out of his mind by the way

game wrecker in the middle like a game record what the heck what I mean that's just crazy to me how good he's playing here's the number one that people need to know about Daniel Jones. No, I'm sorry. I didn't mean Daniel Jones. I meant Splenda Jones. Splenda Jones. Splenda Allen.

Splenda Allen. He's taking care of the football. Only 3% of his throws have been turnover-worthy. Yes. And that's probably been the biggest coaching win for Daibel and Jones. Like, hey, we're going to take care of the football here. You're not doing what you used to do. Jones is averaging over a turnover at game as a starter until this year.

Yeah, like you could bank out a fumble or an interception. Yeah. And like it's not like he's, it's not like he's throwing to this litany of weapons who are helping to make this easier on him. True. They've had a nightmare of a situation at skill player there. It was bad coming into the year and that was with everybody healthy. Now we're at a point where it's way worse and they're not healthy.

Oh, Steve. is so if if daniel jones is circlose josh allen is wandell robinson the skinny version of isaiah mackenzie or is he like the extra fat version of isaiah mackenzie i need to know there's so many similarities there yeah my gut says the extra fat but i think so too but like it is remarkable their entire wide receiver room has basically been flipped upside down several times over. Your top of your receivers coming into this year. Kenny Gallaudet, Cadarius, Tony, Sterling Shepard. Yeah.

All three. I mean, Kenny Gallaudet is playing, but he's gone full NPC mode. What is an unplayable character? He just exists. He just exists. He runs his route and he goes home. He's not there to make any splash plays or stand out in any way. Like, Darius Tony can't get on the field.

Sterling Shampers out for the year. But still, this offense is, they're going. Not, you know, not like they're blowing things out of the water. But Sequin Barkley looks to be back about where he was and what we all wanted him to be. Speaking of diminutive nicknames, what is Kenny Gallaudet his nickname. Is his actual one? BabyTron. Yeah, BabyTron was what people dubbed him.

Yeah. But like to the extreme though. Yeah. Is what it should be. But yeah, anyways. All right. I've made enough jokes about the Giants. Let's move on.

Either way, I just, there's no way. Like, there's no way that they're there at the end of the year. Right? I mean, it's the NFL. I'm not going to say there's no way, but it feels like there's no way. It feels like a house of cards. That like, not because of anything derogatory,

but just because like this is a team that doesn't have a ton of talent. Yeah, they weren't even really supposed to win anything this year. So whatever. They were supposed to be pretty bad. They were supposed to be turning over the quarterback position this year. Right. So, but, I mean, like. hats off to what they've done and it's not like they've played this cupcake schedule either they've

beaten teams that people probably think they shouldn't have been in but i just don't think that they have staying power there i think that there's just too many holes in that on that team that will eventually get highlighted and then last wild card spot in the nfc is the green bay packers pretenders i'm furious with the packers right now so there we go we felt what we struck a chord. Yeah, I, dude, we did the power ranking show last week. I think I had them fifth or six with some concern that. I had them at seven.

Yeah, I think you had five or six. Yeah. So my whole thought process was like, hey, if they're going to get these rookies, Dubs and Watson going, then I think the ceiling of this team is a lot higher. Without those guys going to, you know, able to produce week in and week out, though, this team has literally no gas. They have no gas on offense, Steve, and it's going to hurt their defense over time

because their offense goes through stretches where they don't move the ball. Yes. Or they're not putting up seven points. So, I don't know. Ben Rogers has an eight out of six. He has 6.9 yards per attempt. He has eight touchdowns to three interceptions,

but, like, it just feels like when you watch their offense, it is all, there's no deep threat, really. Like a couple. We've seen like a couple this year, but for Aaron Rogers, I mean, you just expect to see so many more deep throws. Yep. Meadil is at 11% deep throw percentage, which is like middle of the road. Not even, it's lower end.

But like it just feels like this offense has, like, Like you said, no juice. Every time they go into score, it feels like it's just, like, so hard for them to get there. Oh, it's insane. 13 play drives. Right. Like, it's just these long, methodical, like, just break down a team. But that's where, like, you know, they have Aaron Jones, who is averaging 6.4 yards of carry.

75% of his runs are going over three yards. He's not like almost a 10% explosive play rate. Like Aaron Jones has been playing well. AJ Dillon is who he is. He only averages 3.9 yards per carry, but he's kind of their guy where you want him to guarantee to get you the first down. He's not going to break any long runs, but he's going to get you like a guaranteed three.

Look at their possession chart from this just this past game against the Giants who don't have a great defense. Nine plays 49 yards. resulting in a field goal. They had a five-play drive that got them a touchdown, but they had a really long punt return, and I think the drive was technically 27-yard or something. Then they had a 13-play drive for 75 yards for a touchdown,

another eight-play drive for 45 yards in a field goal. It's just so nothing is coming easy to them. And I don't see that changing without the emergence of Christian Watson. I know Dubbs will hit the. some back shoulder stuff here and there. He could be a downfield threat for sure. He's a big body receiver that you can kind of put the ball in his area and let him fight for it.

Yeah, great body control. He'll win contest against him. But they need a guy who is just obscenely explosive. And they have him. It's Watson, but Watson's dealing with another hamstring injury. It's like, is this guy ever going to get on the field this year? It's almost like his rookie season is basically just a wash at this point. But until they get some juice, because like Cobb has zero juice, Lazzard zero juice,

those guys are possession receivers at best. And you can tell it's all possession receivers because like, like we said, the way they moved the ball down the field. It's just so just methodical. It's draining to watch. Yes. But yeah, so these are these guys are pretenders for me. I mean, contenders for the playoffs, but they're not doing anything more than that if they make it.

Yeah, like I, they would be honestly, especially because the Giants beat them, like they're the worst of the bunch right now. I don't think the Giants stay, but, you know, I think the Packers will just because they have Aaron Rogers, but they're not competing for anything. Aaron Rogers is playing like a guy who got in an argument with his team and almost tried to leave, and then now is playing with guys that he doesn't want to play with. Yeah. Giants defense, I will push back and say he's playing really well. They're not supposed to be, though. It's supposed to be, but like, I think something to watch is that their passing defense is forcing an 8.4% turnover-worthy throw rate, but they have zero interceptions.

So this defense could get better, could get like a lot better if turnover luck goes their way. Yeah, you know what, though, I'm throwing a flag on that. I don't necessarily think you're wrong, but they've played the Packers who, we've already talked about, their struggles on offense. They played the Bears who are terrible. They played the Cowboys with Cooper Rush starting. I forget. The Panthers. They played Baker Mayfield and the Panthers week two.

Yeah. They've played a week one. They've had a cupcake schedule so far. As far as like a defensive cupcake schedule. Yeah, exactly. Especially passing. None of those teams I just mentioned passed the ball well. They played Tennessee week one.

Yeah. They don't pass the ball super well. And that's why. That's why, like we said, it kind of feels like a house of cards because it's a defense that is not that good, but is playing well because of who they're playing against. Right. There's something wrong with that.

That means that you're doing what you're supposed to do, but they also get, they'll get Dak Prescott one more time, ideally, or once, ideally, they'll get Jalen Hertz twice. You know, they'll start to see better situations on the opposing side. ideally so that that kind of wraps the NFC sorry go ahead

I would say I apologize it sounds like a meeting because I am my blood sugar is a little low so I'm having to eat a little treat real quick now onto the AFC I think that like I said I think right now NFC it's Bucks, Eagles, Niners and Cowboys are knocking

on the door of the top three everybody else kind of feels like you're in play for the play for the house but we're not going to it's going to be a one and done type situation yeah you just confused me so bad because you said now onto the afc and then you said nfc teams yeah i well i wrapped it quick i probably did that in the wrong order but now really out of the a fc in the north the ravens are leading who are the ravens to you um i think they're contenders I mean, for sure for the playoffs, obviously.

And then even beyond that, I think there's a, albeit a small chance, but there's a chance they can be in the mix at the end. You know, Lamar's not playing amazing right now, but he's had stretches this year where he's played amazing. We know what he's capable of. The defense has really settled down, though, and that's the point I wanted to make is, like, there was times in the year we thought the defense was going to be pretty bad.

And they've really done a good job of getting their crap together, together. You saw it Thursday night against the Bengals they, you know, that's a potent pass attack. Potent passing attack. Wait, that wasn't Thursday night, was it? Is that the Thursday night game? No. No, it wasn't, okay. That was Sunday night. Sunday night. Yeah, yeah. And they, uh, they held that team completely in check. So once those busted coverages get kind of fixed, I think that really helps the team. Um, They have elite playmakers and Andrews and Bateman, although Bateman is hurt right now, but he will be back. And then Lamar is what he is.

They're probably not Tier 1 of the AFC, but they're definitely Tier 2. I like them. I still think they win this division. Yeah. Yeah, overall, their defense over the last two weeks is giving up 6.1 yards per attempt, negative 1.9% completion percentage over expectation, forcing 7% turnover-worthy throws, and a 0% wild throw rate. So like you said, that defense has started to kind of settle in. I think that they're getting healthier.

They still don't force a lot of pressure, only even over the last two weeks, just 22 and a half percent pressure rate. But they have a good secondary in that it seems like as they get healthier, that secondary is only going to improve. But that is one area. I will say that is one area of their defense that I worry about,

and that's getting pressure. I feel like quarterbacks are able to kind of sit back there and pick apart Baltimore a little bit more than you would want them to. Yeah, that is true. One nice thing that they do well on defense is they can play both zone and man.

They don't play a ton of man, but when they do, they're very effective at it. They're a very good zone team as well, especially the last two weeks. They've really come on. So I like the secondary. They can figure out a way to, Baltimore's always been great at scheming up pass rush, right?

So, like, if they get that mojo back, I know Jason Owe or Adafay O'A has been a guy who's been looking to really come on strong. If they can get some little bit more out of him, I think, you know, he's a key guy that you just want to see more consistency out of. Yeah, exactly. He'll appear for three plays and then he'll disappear for 10. And that's not, like, that's worrisome. but you know the potential is there for him.

And then, like, they're adding J.K. Dobbins back, who I think adds a little bit of juice to the rushing game. Yep. I don't think anybody, any other running back on their team has. Everybody else is just, like, a MET replacement-level guy that doesn't add any value. I think J.K. Dobbins just adds a little bit of value to that way. I like Gus Eber's a good bit, but he's not back yet either. Yeah, right. But, yeah, the Ravens, I think the Ravens,

are knocking on the, like I said, kind of with NFC, where they're a team that's knocking on the door of the top teams, but there's a couple holes that we're going to have to see start to be corrected for them to take the next step. Yeah. And then in the south, so NFC South is the Titans, or AFC South, sorry, AFC South. You did it again.

No. I'm just kidding. NNA. AFC South is the Titans. This division is so garbage. It's a mess. I thought that the Jaguars were, I thought that the Jaguars were going to separate themselves,

and then they go to Houston, and they completely botch it. They've fallen off a cliff. The Titans are coming on, though. I will say that. They've... Are you erase what happened in Buffalo? though.

Yeah, it is, but they've won three in a row. You know, they beat a Raiders team who just took the Chiefs to the break. Yeah. Trying to think of who they wanted. They beat the Colts, division rival. They beat the Colts, you know, by a touchdown. They felt like they had control of that game, though. Then they beat the Washington commanders this week who are not a great team.

But the thing that they got going is the run game. Henry looks back. Henry. Now, there's not many running backs in the league, Steve, who moved. the needle for me, but Henry is one of them. And the way this team's identity, like, he is that offense. So if he's going, I feel a lot better about this team. It opens up the play action game.

Tannel's able to pass the ball a little bit better. Now, they're really lacking on weapons. Woods is really the only consistent option they have in the past game. They've actually started scheming up some throws to Henry, which they've never done before. It's working. And they're working in, Hilliard.

Yeah, Hilliard, yeah. Getting him targets. And he looks pretty good in the passing game. He does. He does look pretty good in the passing game. So defensively, though, you know, you still wonder. They're not good against the pass. No.

No, they got torched this week by Wents as well. Pressure rate, they're like, what are they bottom third no they're like bottom five in pressure rate six 24 and a half percent

yeah not not good not good at all they're uh they're that low too and they've blitzed a decent amount over 20 percent of snaps they've given up 8.4 yards per attempt in the passing game

106 passer rating which might be it is number two or number three, pass or in worst pass rating. Just in general? Yeah, they're giving up a 6.3 pass rating,

6.2% completion percentage over expectation, 8.4 yards per temp, 7.3a. Like, teams are picking them apart. So check this out. In zone coverages, they're giving up a pass rating of 120.8. And they're playing in zone on like 68% of their snaps. which is nuts. They're dramatically better in man-match or mirror-type coverages,

but they only play the man on like 26% of snaps. So they're going to have to figure something out there. It's a combo of what a lot of teams are dealing with where you don't get a good pass-risk going, your secondary is going to get torched, no matter what coverage you're deploying. But I'm guessing that's why their blitz rate isn't a little high. higher than it is because they've been another team that's usually good at scheming up pressure.

They've always had those kind of stand-up linebackers you can create some deception with with Dupree and Landry while those guys are out of the mix at the moment. And that's why they're, that's where their team is hurting is that usually those two guys are creating and mucking up the backfield and they just don't have those guys that can consistently do that right now. Yep. Jeffrey Simmons is carrying the weight of that defensive line to be anything like. Yeah, he's been even relatively quiet, hasn't he?

right but i think that that's what you know that's kind of what happens when you when he's the the premier guy with replacement level guys around him yeah for sure is that he's coming from here he's actually not been quiet by the way i was i said i thought he'd been playing pretty well especially considering that especially considering who he's playing alongside yep he appears pretty often when you watch their film. I still think the Jaguars come out of that division. I don't trust Tennessee. I feel like their offense is just too listless

and can go through bouts of being unproductive. And if you stop Derek Henry, you kind of stop their team. And that's, I worry about how far that'll know because they're passing because it's just the passing offense isn't as much of a threat without AJ Brown and like, you know, premier playmakers to really, force a team to go away from just like trying to stop henry and i just think that that's going to break down throughout the season fair fair points i don't think the team will be the jacksville though if a team passes them it probably probably be the colts but um i know we've

assaulted the colts pretty firmly on this podcast but some other two two and one i don't understand but some other two and one and you know they've got some things going for them and the right direction. I mean, Alex Pierce looks like a legit wide receiver. Michael Pittman, obviously. We already know he's good. He's been quiet the last relatively. He's been pretty quiet. Well, part of it is Matt Ryan's like unwillingness to throw the ball down field and put the ball in tight windows. But you have Alex Pierce and Michael Pitman. Just freaking let it rip. Literally, they're 60-40 guys. Every 50-50 ball is 60-40 with them. Just give

a chance. Right. And they're not, they're not running the ball particularly. well right now, which could change in a hurry. We know this team's identity. Their offensive line looked suspect. I think that's the big issue right now with their offense is that Indy's offense line has looked sporadic and... Especially at that left tackle spot, right? We're not talking about Indy, though.

We're talking about Tennessee. But I think he's going to touch on them because when I went in when I was looking at, they're not in the playoff picture yet, but when I went and looked at it and I saw that they were in two, two and one. Like the way that the way that I perceived. their that team right now in the way that I feel like a lot of people receive them and it it doesn't help that they played one of the worst NFL games I've ever seen in my entire life on Thursday but I legitimately thought they were like oh and five I was like how does this team have

a win and then but you know well they got the benefit of playing the the Broncos which is like a guaranteed win benefit of playing the AFC South I almost did it again I don't know why I'm not I'm not sure I would take anybody like if the Broncos match up against any of the 31 other teams i'm not sure i picked them to win against any of them maybe the bears Carolina Carolina is bad well they just fired the guy though that yeah but they still have the quarterback that is playing one of the worst season PJ Walker is the wins the uh winds are changing over there well baker's hurt so I think Walker is going to get a start.

That's right. Not about that, Bill. Eish. All right. Who's next? Enough of that. And you can just write off the AFC South. They're, I don't, like, none of them are contenders in any way, shape, or form,

but someone has to win the division. Correct. All right. AFC East, Buffalo Bills. I was just going to say, it doesn't matter who you pick, because both these teams are contenders. But Buffalo, absolutely a contender. And we get to see this week. Chiefs and Bills up each other.

Game of the week for sure. I can't believe they didn't find a way to flex this. I know they can't flex games until later in the season, but man, we really got to get this on 4 o'clock. I'm in the middle of my grind. Make it their own slot. Just give them their own slot. I don't know.

7 p.m. start on Sunday. Yeah. Like, just, you know, do something. Like, this is the game that everybody, I think everybody wants to watch. it's the game of the year so far obviously with the way it went last year it could be the game of the year bar none until they potentially be to get in the playoffs i mean these two like the chiefs have fully come alive in the last two weeks and the bills have just stayed steady with what they've been

Yeah. We've talked like a lot in pretty big detail about the bills on this podcast. So I don't know we need to spend a ton of time here. It's pretty obvious what they have going for them though. Probably a top five QB in the NFL right now with the best defense in the NFL. You don't get many combinations better than that, especially when you're trotting out Stefan Diggs and Gabe Davis and, you know, just a good slew of of weapons. Khalil Shakir looks pretty good.

I thought he looked great. I honestly, like I, if Isaiah McKenzie doesn't come back next week and put him on notice, his job's getting broken. Wally Pip time is that clock has started

for McKenzie because I think Shakir looked really good. And I think that that's a guy who like his ceiling offers more than McKenzie's ceiling does to that office. Oh, 100%. Because Shakir is a rare slot type that can win downfield. Right.

He actually, he's got a little T.Y. Hilton in him. Not quite that freaky fast, I don't think. Although he did test that fast, but he can run all the verts from the slot. And Josh Allen, we know he loves to throw the verts. He wants to get the ball deep. And if you're chopping out three receivers that can all win vertically, like in Davis and Diggs and Shakira, I mean, that is deadly. Yeah.

Deadly. So I love it. I do think Crowder is probably the more consistent slot receiver of the three in the short parts of the field where he's going to win his short area route. I don't think Shakur is quite there yet. He'll get there, though. But yeah, I do think McKenzie's playing time should be on the down, even when he comes back, because Crowder and Shakir offer the offense more in most aspects of the game. McKenzie gives you some trick play options, I guess, but I don't care about that. Like, do you know, like, I feel like you only say that because he's small.

And we just equate. And because it's equate, we plays with small guys. They've used them that way so far. Right. That's the main thing. It's like, they clearly have identified him as the guy they, they, uh. But if you can get a guy who's just a gadget guy off the field and replace him with a guy who can just do everything from that position, like, yeah, the ceiling of that offense elevates even more. But I will, just because we know what both I, what I, like, we like.

know that they're both, you know, probably the top two for a Super Bowl right now. Yeah. If you had to pick one reason right now through five games, why the Bills and the Chiefs won't win the Super Bowl, one for each team, what would it be? Like, what's your biggest concern with each team that you think could limit them? Okay, for the bills, it's as simple as you still see the watch. wild raw Josh Allen's head come out once in a while. It still peaks out every once in a while.

We saw it a couple times this year, actually. Not this weekend, but last weekend, for example. Yep. It would be like they get in the playoffs and then that guy comes out for a game and it just catches them and whatever. The other thing, I know you said one. The other one is they just run into a really good team, like the Chiefs, and it's a battle and they lose, like last year.

Yeah. But if it had to be like one specific reason, And I would say Josh Allen just, you know, just has a bad, one of those random bad games where he puts the ball in harm's way too much. And, you know, the defense isn't able to pull him through. And that also being that this team doesn't really have a safety net if Josh Allen kind of goes that way in a game. Like if he starts to lose it or starts to get erratic, they don't have a run game to lean on. Yep.

And so that like just the one dimensional offense completely operates around Josh Allen. Like you said, if he hits a point where, you know, he gets a little erratic, then, you know, that could, it could spell issues for their offense. Like their offense is so good that like 21 points is like, ooh, that was a tough, tough day for him. Yes. That's, you know, that's a possibility. All right. and then the one for the chiefs. One for the chiefs.

It would be similar to my critique with the Packers where that receiving court doesn't have enough juice. Now, I think it's less likely to happen because they have a lot of guys with juice, right? Yes. Like, Valde Scantling can give that off a ton of juice, and it looks like him and Mahomes have developed a connection. Yes.

So I think as that develops, that situation gets better. Hardman can, when he's on, he can give them juice. I think juju, though, is, I think he's, He's just so done. He's so washed. He's the first 25-year-old ever be washed. Yeah. Like, it just looks, it doesn't even look like the same receiver in any way, shape, or form.

Yeah. Yep. And then I like, I think Sky Moore, he works into the offense eventually. People are begging for it at this point. It's being literally rigged for. I would love to see Scantling hard men. and more on the field together. Yeah.

It's a hard team to defend. Their defense worries me a little bit, too. Yeah. I can see that. Their defense have played pretty well until the Tampa Bay game. Right. The last two weeks have been pretty rough.

It's got a little dicey. I mean, they're giving up 12 touchdowns with one interception, 69% completion percentage. 3.4% wild throw. only 2.4% turnover worthy. Well, they are 30%... They're getting torched and man coverage.

30% pressure rate. But I feel like, I mean, I feel like, I also think that they, a lot of it is schemed. They have a lot of schemeed pressure stuff. Yeah. You said they're getting torched in man coverage? Yeah, they only play man on like 25% of snaps,

but they're giving up a passer rating of like 129. Yeah. Wendman, man. So it's a concern. But that, like, with, again, with Mahomes at quarterback, you get to the point where you're like, all right, we still have to go and score at least 24 to 30 points to beat this team no matter what. Because even on an off day, that offense is still put it up 21.

Yeah, I mean, you saw too this week. How many times our team's going to make this mistake, Steve, where you just end up getting all like reserved and conservative against the Chiefs. Like the Raiders were up, what, 14 points in that game? They're at 14.0. 17-0. 17-0. They had, well, no, I'm going back to the 14-0, though, because they were on a drive. They had the ball fourth and one from like the 30.

Yep. And they kicked a field goal. Yeah. I literally turned to my wife and I said, this game's over. The Chiefs won. And she said, why? They're down 17 points. I said, because the Raiders just waved the white flag.

They just said, you know, we don't think we can beat you. Yeah. They should have gone for that and tried to put another touchdown on the board. 21-0 is a lot harder to come back from mentally. And Mahomes has a winning record when down 10 plus points in a game, which is absurd. Yeah. On to the wild card in the AFC. First team is the New York Jets, J.

J-E-E-T-S J-E-T-S Jets J-E-T-S Jets Jets. E-T-S Jets. These guys are pretenders, but this is another, similar to the Giants, like, tip of the hat to the coaching staff and the front office there for getting this team improving and, you know, better. They're better. They're fun team to watch. Yeah, they can be. I like they're very young they're starting to use breese hall more breese hall has i think i mean he has like a 10.7% explosive play rate on um rushes which is number two in the NFL so like they're they're mixing him a lot more and he

looks to be legit they have a good receiving core zach wilson is chaotic it's still early but the best way to describe him is chaotic which just makes it fun to watch because you know that you're going to get a goofy play out of him. I mean, he's only completing 56% of his passes. And then the defense, just that secondary flies around

Sauce Gardner looks great and they just don't give up a ton of big plays. Sauce Gardner does look great. Yeah, I don't have a whole lot of thoughts. I just think QB-wise, they're little unstable. I think QB-wise is what's going to tank this team, but they're a team with potential if they can if i think if they can admit that zach what wilson isn't the answer and they can go and do something else i think down the road like

this team is young this team is legit there was a rumor that there was a quote on the sideline that uh one of the rookies was looking at another one of the rookies and they looked at each other and said dude we're so effing legit stop there was a rumor i saw it i saw it on twitter that someone had said that from the sideline some of the rookies were like looking at each other and said that. That's pretty funny. But they're a fun team to watch. I don't think they're staying.

I don't think they're contenders for the playoffs. I certainly don't think they're contenders for the Super Bowl, but they're a fun team, and I think that they'll hang around just because of the way, just because their defense is fast and plays well. Quinn and Williams is finally starting to look like the guy that he was supposed to be. Yeah. And so, yeah, sauce gardener's legit.

All right. Next is the Chargers. Wait, one more point on the Jets. Okay. Elijah Verit Tucker, playing offensive tackle, is probably better than playing offensive guard. He's a monster. Yeah, but they've had to play him at tackle because injury is the last two games.

He started one game at left tackle and one game at right tackle. Yep. He's looked very good there, so. So insane that you can be that versatile as an offensive lineman. Even some of the best guys couldn't do that. Yeah. All right. Sorry, next team. That is the Chargers. They are so confusing as a team.

They are. But, I mean, they've dealt with the injury bug, as we've talked about. But, I mean, they won a tough one this week on the road in Cleveland. Yeah. It's the Browns. I know the Browns are being quarterbacked by Jacoby percent. that but I don't know. They're impressive.

I think they're probably contenders for the playoffs, but pretenders overall. Joey Bose is missing eight to ten weeks. That stings. They'll get them back, though, I guess. They'll get them back. I still think that, I think this seems a contender. I think that I still am going to, I still buy into this team in the long run. Justin Herbert's playing well

and the offense has shown it can be explosive in the last two weeks their defense just needs, I feel like their defense just needs to flesh some things out and kind of get back on track. 67% completion percentage, which is right around. I mean, only 0.1% completion percentage over expected, but they're giving up a 5.6% well-throw rate and only forcing 1.7% turnover. right and j c jackson has gone the way of a lot of previous new england corners that changed teams he just he doesn't look completely like the same guy he's getting he's getting torn up a little bit

yes i how much of this is because he's hurt though is he playing through injury right i don't know but yeah he he looks terrible Asante Samuel looks like much the better corner than J.C. Jackson right now. Yeah, and he's even gotten beat up a little bit the last couple weeks. He has. He's had weeks where he looks good. He's had weeks where he looks bad. It's just that, I don't know, like, this was supposed to be the defense that Staley, like, finally got his guys.

And it just looks, it still looks erratic. Their run defense has changed 0%. Their run defense is still horrific. Yep. Which is why, like, Cleveland almost be. them. I mean, they're giving up an 8.9% explosive play rate on, or explosive play percentage, which leads the NFL in the rushing game. They're giving up 5.8 yards per carry. Like, they're getting, they're getting beat up a decent amount.

It's affecting their pass rush a lot, too, because what's happening is they're getting into a lot of unpredictable situations. Right. So a lot of second and medium, second and short, and then third in short. or it's like it's really hard to get a passers going when you're subjected to being play action to death. Right. And that's basically what's happened. I know, you know, their pastor should be performing better.

I think their pressure rate over expectations like minus 4% or something. Yeah. But a lot of it is because their run defense is so bad. And obviously they're missing. Which is the bet that they tried to make. They brought, I mean, they brought in Sebastian Joseph Day. But outside of him, they, Just were like, nope.

I mean, okay, they brought in Smash Joseph Day and Kyle Van Nuoy, but their bat. Cool, Max, a stud against their own, too, though. He is, but, like, their bet was always that they're getting, they have their two edge guys, they have their secondary, they have their outside shell. They didn't really care about linebackers or interior defensive line. Even though those were clear issues last year, they chose to minorly address them and or not address them at all, and it's hurting them a little bit. I agree.

I agree. It was kind of funny to see J.C. Jackson get his lunch stolen from him by Amari Cooper this past week. Amari Cooper looks good. He does. I mean, shocker. Breaking news. Yeah.

What would Dallas do with a wide receiver like that? I don't know. Probably trade him for a fifth. But yeah, I still think I can't jump off the Chargers wagon. Yeah, I still think that they're a top three to four team in the AFC and can very well compete for a spot. Yeah. I think they can get it figured out.

I could be horrifically wrong and they could charges all over the place. But then the last team that we'll talk about the dolphins. They're the last wild card spot. The dolphins. The dolphins. Yeah, pretenders for me. Yeah, big time. They got whacked by the Jets

Wacked by the Jets Granted, I mean, obviously I know they were down to their QB3 Yeah, but guess what? Your quarterback three isn't responsible for giving up 40 points? Thompson had what, two turnovers? Yes. A fumble and interception? Yes.

Yeah, because the Jets only put up like 340 yards of offense but dropped a 40 bomb on you. Right. that's not great Reese Hall was running all over their defense yeah but yeah I think they're pretty clear even with two even if

two makes it back like I just think that they don't have the they don't have the bones of their team to you know get them through a difficult time to win a game it feels like even though they've done it twice I just I don't know when it gets down to playoff time I just

it's hard for me to envision this team stepping up to compete for, you know, four games straight to go, you know, to go to the Super Bowl or even to get into the playoffs. Yeah, I agree. I mean, it's hard when you have, like, when you're in a division with the bills and you can basically just, you can wipe yourself away from winning the division. And now you're trying to, like, the only spot you can get is one of the wild card spots. And that just makes it tough overall. We have breaky news. What is it?

Avanti Adams has been charged this morning in the municipal court of Kansas City with Mr. Meeter assault for the Cambridge push guy. And they showed a different angle, or I saw a different angle today. It looks like he didn't see him. I'm going to get in trouble for this, I think. Uh-oh. I just don't think, this is such Bushley crap to me. Oh, yeah.

Especially when you see the second angle, you can see that the guy clearly walks right in front of Adam. Right. And Adams just kind of gives him a light shove. Yeah, it was a light shove. Now, listen, is Adams a complete jerk for not realizing what happened and helping them up or see if he's okay? Yeah, he probably is. But, like, you're just, like, come on, dude.

You're really pressing charges. Come on, dude. I know. You know how many times I've been, like, I don't know, bumped into. I mean, maybe it's because of the crowd I roll with in the, you know, Jiu-Sit-Cimity or whatever. but like, I don't know, I just, it just seems crazy to me that this is just okay. We all know what this is about, right?

Oh, yeah, it's about. I don't even like defending NFL players for their action sounds like, yeah, Adams is probably a jerk, and he was definitely heated in the moment, but like, dude, you're pressing charges, really? I'd be different. It'd be different if he, like, blindsit you with a right hook across the face. Right, or pushed him down when they were. weren't face to face. Like, like, if the guy had, like, his back to Adams and then Adams just, like, walked, like, runs up to him and puts him up. Or if they were, like, you know, eye to eye and

Adams, like, you know, full on threw him to the side. Yeah, exactly. It looked like incidental contact. Yep. I don't know. The mistake it Adams probably made was he apologized for it publicly. It's, yeah. I never apologized for anything. But, yeah, it's just like, yeah. That's so. dumb, but whatever. It won't. It won't lead to anything, but. It will lead to some off-field settlement.

Yeah. Well, yes. It won't, yeah. We're off court settlement and off-field. I hope it's, I wish it would be. They should settle it on the field. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I wish Adams would have handled it a little bit really.

In the press conference, he should have just said, I mess us up. I'm sorry. I should have made sure. sure the guy was okay but i didn't even mean to push him down blah blah blah yeah he should have gone he should have gone with the incidental contact route i got it yeah exactly i bumped into him it was a quick reaction should have helped him up you know after a after a game it's always hard you know you kind of you kind of have tunnel vision you know just scope yeah just go total cliche route yeah exactly

just there's there's a reason the cliches work Just stick to them, use them. For sure. But this is a good example, Steve, of why it's so important to have discipline and be in control of your emotions all the time. You know? Yes, absolutely. All right. Should we call it?

We're good. We're good. I think we did it. This was fun, dude. This is a good idea. I'm glad we did this. Yeah, trying to spice up to talk a little bit every week. Yeah.

You know, it can just get, it just gets so repetitive at times. You got to kind of switch it up every once a while just to. For sure. Keep the people on their toes. Yeah, and I've told you before. I don't want to do the same Wednesday show every day where we just go through game by game and break it down, which is boring to me. Right.

I will say this though, Steve. I would say the NFL is back. I know we've been critical of the season so far. But this week had a lot of good games. It also helps that outside of Thursday night, the primetime games were good. That does help. I'm telling you, it helps so much when the primetime games are good, because those are the games where everybody's on at the same time talking about the same thing.

And when it's a good competitive game, or, you know, if it's a good game and you get coaching mistakes, i.e. Cincinnati, Baltimore, this week. It just helps the narrative of the NFL for that week Because you think back to like what did we talk about this week? I feel like a lot of times you fall back on the primetime games Because those are the times where everybody's talking about the same games When the primetime games are good The perception of the NFL and the week are good

And I just think that I hope that we start to get more and more better That sounds bad but more better primetime games. Yeah. And we do this week, obviously. I think we still have Broncos Monday night, though, unfortunately. At least, yeah, but it's Broncos, it should be okay.

But Cowboys Eagles is nice. Bill's Chiefs is nice. Oh, we got to watch the Bears tonight. I'm not watching that game. I will watch it once I chart it, but I am not watching that game. Tomorrow? Yeah. Do you use tomorrow to go spend time with your family, don't?

Yeah. Oh, did I say today? Yeah, tomorrow. Have a nice day. dinner. Go outside. Touch some grass. Yeah, touch some grass. That's a joke for me.

Do something that you haven't done in a long time that you've been pushing off. Do that project. Just don't watch. Don't. You don't have to watch it. Don't. Yeah. But, yes, that ties a bow on this one. And we'll be back Friday with more fun and shenanigans. Sounds good. Am I getting us out of?

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