Fantasy Football Daily - 2022 Week 17 Matchup Podcast

Episode Date: December 29, 2022

John Hansen (@Fantasy_Guru) and Greg Cosell (@gregcosell) preview Week 17 NFL action. --- Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/fantasy-points-podcast/support Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

It's time for the Fantasy Points podcast, brought to you by FantasyPoints.com. Top-level fantasy football and NFL betting analysis from every perspective and angle, from numbers to the film room, with a single goal to help you score more fantasy points. Here we go. Week 17 is upon us, Fantasy Football Championships. It is the Week 17 matchup podcast here on the Fantasy Points podcast feed. and I'm John Hansen and Greg Hosell standing by per usual in the film room per usual Greg how are you uh John I'm doing okay I uh you know believe it or not I worked over the weekend and got got a little bit ahead of the game so uh I'm feeling pretty decent this week last week week was a little tough because we kind of lost a day like a whole day so um the schedule

otherwise is kind of normal during the two holidays here because of, you know, when they fall in the calendar. So back to normal this week here, recording this on a Wednesday night. You've been going through the tape for a number of days here. So we'll try and pull out as much insight as we can and apply it to week 17, of course. Well, we'll start with Gardner Minshu, Greg, because it does seem like, you know, you read the tea leaves. It's like on one hand, Hertz is, you know, pining to play.

They're not ruling them out. But on the other hand, it does seem like we're, we're looking at Gardner Minchu again this week. So how did he look last week? I thought overall he played a solid game. You know, keep one thing in mind. Obviously, the Eagles have a very good old line, but he dropped back 41 times against that cowboy defense,

and he was not sacked. True. And that was, to me, pretty impressive. You know, Minchu, I think most of us know what Minchu is. You know, I made the point in my notes. He's a quick processor. He gets the ball out with good timing. He reads coverage.

He knows where to go with the ball. You know, he's got a few issues that I think hurt him at times. He has a glaring tendency at times to drift to his left, particularly when he senses that he might get inside pressure. And he's not a strong-armed guy. So when he drifts, he even loses more velocity. And that can cause some problems at times. It can cause some inaccuracy.

It can cause some velocity issues. So, but overall, he's a solid player. Now, Elaine Johnson will not play this week. You know, he's a big loss. You could argue that he is one of the two best, not only tackles in the league, maybe two best offensive linemen in the league. Yeah. So that will be a loss for the Eagles.

There will be a lot of Cam Jordan on that side, too. That is for sure. But, you know, I think Nick Siriani and their staff have done a really good job of kind of building this offense and, you know, playing to their strengths and minimizing any potential weakness they don't really have one but now they they may with johnson out but yeah but you're right cam jordan will likely be on that side we mentioned the the trouble spot for the corner spot for the cowboys last week a bunch of times and boy do we apply it to our projections at fantasy points dot com i had devante smith very high how oppressive is devante smith he

really is a pretty rare dude like he's got some dnaa though know if anyone else does. Like he doesn't seem to get hurt. He seems to handle the physicality, the NFL game. I mean, I feel like he has been everything the Eagles could have hoped for and maybe even a little more. And I would agree. And he's got tremendous body control. Absolutely tremendous body control. He's like an alien this guy. Yeah, he's, he's a really good. He's a really good route runner. You know, in some ways, he's built differently, but in some ways he's like Justin Jefferson in the sense that he can make his cuts with those long legs that he has at pretty much full speed. He doesn't really have to throttle down to break.

And for a guy, as you say, he's 160, maybe he's up to 165. He goes up and gets the ball. There's no fear at all when he's in the middle of the field. He's just a really good receiver. Now this week, well, last week we love that matchup. We figured Diggs would be on Brown a lot. He was these Saints, they still play. I'm sure more man than most.

This week, have you seen this Alante Taylor? Oh, yeah, I loved him coming out, loved him coming out, and had debates with people who told me, well, he should be in the slot. And I said, what are you out of your mind? He's long, he's athletic, he can run. He's your classic outside corner. And he has played really, really well.

I watched the tape two weeks ago in detail because he had many snaps against Drake London. And Drake London could not say, separate from Alante Taylor. Wow. Well, and he pushed Bradley Robey inside. Grab to your point. So they have, their corners are actually good.

Oh, I know. I know. Adibo is a good player. And Taylor, I think,'s played really, really well. I think Adibo, based on alignment numbers, will be on Brown more. So I think it'll be an A.J. Brown game, most likely. Good well be. A.

Ebo is not an explosive athlete, but he's got really good size. He's got a really good feel for the position. He understands splits. He understands routes. He's just not an explosive athlete. Yeah, he gets picked on a little bit, too. I mean, he's one of those guys, you know, make a good play, give up a good play, I think. Right, but he also has very good hands.

So if he's near you and get his hands on the ball, he can pick it off. Okay. Any thoughts on, you know, the matchup overall for Gardner against this defense? because, you know, I thought about six weeks ago. They had a little bit of a rough patch. I'm like, what are they doing? But they have righted the ship. They're not giving up crap lately.

You're talking about the Saints D. St. St.D. Yeah. Well, you know, it's funny. I mentioned this to a number of people this week that one of the questions I've now come to ask in the offseason when I speak to coaches, John, and I think, you know, I think it's a good question. And is I always ask, you know, an offensive coach, you know, if you had to give me the three most difficult defensive coach. slash coordinators to go up against, you know, who would they be? And Dennis Allen's name always comes up. Wow. And, you know, he does a lot of things. Their pressures are interesting. They play a lot of dime, but they play with three down linemen and two linebackers. So, and they play man. Now, again,

if it's Minchu, they could certainly play a ton of man because there's no concern about him running. So you will see a lot of two-man cover one robber. They kind of blur the lines between two-man and one robber, and you've got to be aware of that, or you could end up throwing it, you know, where you don't want to throw it. But to Mario Davis is one of the major keys to their defense because he's a real, he's a complete multi-dimensional linebacker. Now, what, what does that match up then? Would you be concerned about Goddard? To some extent, yes. You know, I think Goddard is a matchup issue.

All that, you know, so the question becomes who would match up to Goddard? I don't see Demario Davis like running down the seam. No, no, he's not that guy. He would not be the matchup on Goddard unless it's a rare situation, you know, unless they do something from a pressure standpoint, you know, and they need him to do that. But he would not be the guy that you say he's going to match up to Goddard in their man scheme. He's in the mix, though, a lot, you know, in that, you know, 10-yard area. Like, he's in that mix against tight ends a lot and he's good.

Yeah. But he's not going to be the true man matchup. So, you know, that's a great question. I'm not sure how they'll play that. Look, last week, Marcus May was out. You know. Honey Badger. They played a Honey Badger could easily be the matchup.

You know, they started Justin Evans last week and used PJ Williams as their dime. You know, just Justin Evans. came out of, I believe, A&M three or four years ago, and man, he was a big kid who could run great athlete. He's moved around the league. He seemed to have found a home with the Saints. He has the kind of traits that you could match him up to Goddard. I want to, before we move on,

give one tidbit for anyone listening right now in a dynasty league where you can still pick people up because I saw your note, and I've been saying this for about two months now, and I met this kid at the Combine. Great kid. loves fantasy, Barry Alvarez's grandson, and that is

Jake Ferguson, who I think he's going to replace Shultz next year. I think he's better than Shultz. I made a note just watching him. He has more juice than Shultz. I think he's overall, he overall gives you more as a receiver at the tight end position.

And coming from Wisconsin, my guess is, and I don't remember him in detail, I remember his receiving more, but my guess is coming from Wisconsin, a running football team. He certainly has a ton of experience as an inline blocker. Yes, he does. And again, I think him and Peyton Hendershot have really helped that cowboy offense running

the football this year because Schultz is not really a good blocker. But yeah, great kid too, really good dude. So, you know, he's walking around playing in Wisconsin. He's Barry Alvarez's grandson. And he's like the least entitled guy ever. So good stuff there. Pick him up now because. I think he is the tight end one, the starter for the Cowboys next year.

I think they'll let Schultz go. He's playing on that franchise tag. You know, Greg, last week on the live stream, I threw out a line and over under on Malik Willis's yardage. You guys both went under. You nailed it by one yard. It was 100 yards and he threw for 99. What did you see?

Anything surprising at all out of Malik Willis last week? No, I don't think it's surprising. I mean, the bottom line is he's not really ready to be an NFL starter, which is no, it's not a judgment on his whole career. You know, I want people to understand that. You know, at this point, he's not really patient or poised enough in the pocket to allow the past game to work. He's a one read and breakdown and go quarterback. He's late with a lot of routine throws. They're trying to set him up with basic reads and throws, and he's late.

Yeah, yeah. You know, he's a see-it-throw-at-passer at this point. He doesn't really have a feel for timing or anticipation. And really, John, at the end of the day, they have a very bad mix in their past game. They have a poor pass-protecting O line, really poor, and a rookie quarterback with almost no feel and sense of timing and anticipation at this point.

So it's just a really bad mix. You don't even have anyone he could just send on a go route, like, just go, you know, because he's got a big arm. Do they take any shots? I didn't notice any. I don't recall. I watched the tape and I don't recall a deep shot. I don't think they have the people to do it.

Yeah. You know, but that would be one thing, you know, he does have that big arm. I think Burks can, you know, get deep. But, you know, they don't really have, you know, a lot of weapons, too. And then the O line is a real struggle. I mean, and they have injuries, which they had this past week that are going to be that way tomorrow night as well. So this is a, this is a tough game for, this is probably not a good fantasy game for the Titan.

And by the way, I don't believe Derek Henry is going to play tomorrow night. Right. Unless you're desperate and you need Hassan Hoskins because he's going to have to be the guy. Right. He will be the guy. Good kid. I met him, interviewed him at the Combot. A guy had a five touchdown game against Ohio State. I mean, is he more than a no frills guy? I feel like he's a little bit more.

He may be a little bit more, but not a lot more. Right, right. But I think he fits them. But, yeah, but, you know, he's certainly not an explosive runner, but he's big. He's physical. He finishes. I think he would have a chance to be a solid back, certainly in that system.

Yeah, he'd be a good number two there. He'd be a really good number two. He's right on that borderline there. Maybe you can get away with him for a half a season. but you're probably going to look to upgrade it there. Moving along here with Greg CoSell on the Week 17 Matchup Podcast. Just trying to pull out as much insight as we possibly can for, well, the most important weekend in the history of fantasy football. Well, not that we don't know Joe Burrow is great, but how about Trenton Irwin?

I mean, I feel like Burrow is just making Trenton Irwin a thing. I mean, I'm the coaches. They're scheming him open. He's kind of open a lot. he's he's one of those guys that drives me nuts because no one's worried that much about Trenton Irwin, you know, like you're not game planning, but yet here he goes, making plays, but just a, well, maybe it was an uneven performance for Barrow, right? Second half wasn't that great. No, they threw the ball an awful lot. I mean, he had 52 attempts, John.

That kind of surprised me, given the fact that they were up 22, nothing at the half. But again, you know, I don't, I don't rip coaches for that kind of stuff because, none of us really know what you're working all that so i mean it was working um yeah you know every time i watch burrow i'm just he's so efficient throwing outside the numbers yeah and and that's hard to do there's a lot of coaches defensive coaches in this league who want quarterbacks to throw outside the numbers oh but burrow is so good doing that whether it be vertical routes whether it be out routes um he understands what kind of throw to make whether he needs to put something on it or take something off.

You know, that to me is it really stands out when I watch Borough. And he really is one of the quickest processors in the NFL. He has high level elimination and isolation traits, especially when it comes to reading safety rotation. I mean, he's just, he's a really good quarterback. Made me look good on television. I go right before the kickoff and I said, look, Belichick, per his usual plan, is going to devote resources to stop chase.

T. Higgins going off. So get behind T. Higgins. And it was like, I did that. I said that at like 1249. And then at like 106, he caught like a 36 yarder. Then he scored. I mean, it was unbelievable. Right, right.

Yeah. Unbelievable. Higgins is a perfect example of Burrough when he sees the one-on-ones. And Higgins is, you know, he's obviously 6-3-216. That's what he was. I believe when he came out of college at the combine. You know, you could make a case that Higgins is a number one receiver. He's just on a team with a guy that is, you know, arguably better as a number one receiver.

But, hey, the Bengals are in a good spot there. Yep. Once again, I didn't think he'd be this good, you know, Higgins, no doubt. I mean, got to give it up. Damn good football player. Mack Jones in that same game. I mean, again, another, I mean, what do you take out of it? Anything?

You know, they came on late at least, but another uneven performance. I mean, he's, you know, he's, and by the way, Thornton dropped a go route on the first possession of the third quarter. It would not have been a touchdown, but it would have been a 50-yard gain. I saw that. But, you know, Jones is still struggling at times with basic reads, which is very surprising, you know, stuff that you would not expect him to be struggling with. you know, he's just a little slow mentally at times. And for him to be successful in the NFL, as we know, John, because he's not a big kid, he's not physically imposing.

He has a good enough arm, but not a gun. He has to be a high-level processor. And right now, he shows that at times you go, oh, yeah, there's the Mac Jones that we saw more of last year. But at other times, I watched the tape and I think, boy, that is, that's a basic read. And he's just not reading it the right way. So, you know, I still think he's kind of working through his second year. People forget he's only in his second year.

And, you know, to me, I'm not sure, you know, when I think about Mack Jones in this given game against the dolphins, I'm not sure what to make of it. Well, and I would have to theorize that this change in system and the coaching staff and maybe a lack of guidance, he's lost his way. Because this is not the guy who stepped out onto the NFL field and look like a five-year pro for the most part. Yeah, it seemed very comfortable. last year. I mean, you know, not the kind of guy we're going to say is dynamic. You know, he's not that guy, but seemed very comfortable. By the way, I would love to see my guy Gabe Davis, who's let us down this year, but maybe he can come through when it matters most because he did score last week on that Taylor Brick, because I think that's the matchup. He also tried that fumble after he caught

the inbreaker. Right. I mean, that Taylor Brin. He's been a week-to-week proposition, as you well know, John. I mean, obviously, because there was so much talk before. before the season about him becoming like a big time number two. And it hasn't quite worked out. And I think to some degree that's hurt the bill's offense because I think they expected more of that. Obviously last week they ran the ball and they need volume and production in their run game. They need it.

Well, you know, you know what's amazing? Stefan Diggs, he is not a good number two fantasy wide receiver. You know, a month ago, he was a top five overall wide receiver in fantasy. numbers have really sunk. Really sunk. He's averaging 4.3 catches a game for 54 yards with zero touchdowns per game. I know. And I think they'll need him this week. I mean, look, I would bet this is not going to be a 1310 game.

I would expect there to be points scored. And I would think Diggs, again, we're not going to sit here and say, and I doubt you haven't projected a 10 for 150. But I think Diggs needs to be a factor in this game. Yeah. Yeah, they do play a lot of zone. I keep waiting for that Cole Beasley game. We haven't seen that yet.

Yeah, and I don't know how many targets he might get, but they certainly need digs to be a factor. Theoretically, they need Davis as well to, again, not necessarily to be a big target share volume guy, but to be a factor in the game. Yeah, I've got digs with five and a half catchers, 64. You know, I mean, it's down, it's down, but, you know, you can only go so far with a guy like that.

And also, for what it's worth, you know, his kind of fall off is coincided with Dawson Knox coming on. Can we have multiple guys producing in this passing attack this year? Yeah, Knox has been, I mean, they've actually designed some things for Knox where he's clearly the primary. So he is sort of, in some ways, over the last three, four weeks kind of replaced Davis a little bit. Yeah, yeah, I know, which is very frustrating for me because I went with. them, you know, around Thanksgiving as our, my Thursday special and nothing. And then he goes off ever since then. But that's the NFL.

I mean, you and I spoke about him in the offseason. He's got talent now. Oh, yeah. He is not, you know, he's not a slug-o tight end. He can run a little bit. He's got some talent. Yeah, I mean, you know, is he, does he remind you of anyone, by the way? I mean, you know, like a Dallas Clark.

I mean, he's not as gifted as a Dallas Goddard, let's say, but, you know, about Dallas Clark. What's that? How about Dallas Clark? Oh, that's an interesting comparison. I just kind of came to my head, but, you know, I mean, haven't seen Dallas Clark in a lot of years, but yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Love does some Dallas Clark, though, back in the day. Moving on here, Chiefs offense, this has been the most difficult passing game to handicap ever in the history of fantasy football. Outside of Travis Kelsey, there is absolutely nothing. hang your hat on with this receiving core in terms of like you know this guy's getting targets he's going to line up here i mean it is unbelievable and yet they still have a viable passing attack every single week there's there's very little continuity but they score a lot of point you know i mean yeah um yeah there other than kelsey i'm not sure you know from a fantasy perspective you know mckinons

become a bigger factor and i've been making that point for a couple of weeks now um but And again, two weeks ago, he did have eight targets and he catches, but I don't think that's going to be a weak thing. He had eight touches last week, Greg. That was my point. I'm like, I get it. But you never know. He had eight touches.

Yeah. I mean, the week before he had, I believe, 18 touches because he had 10 runs and eight catches. I call this chief offense outside of, you know, excluding the quarterback. It's probably the most difficult skill group for me to ever handicap in 30 years. and that's saying something because they've got a Hall of Fame tight end. Yeah, you just don't know. You just don't know. Yeah.

Well, the Niners, we do know. We know what they're doing. They keep throwing it to Joanne Jennings. Well, don't forget two Samuels out. Yeah, I know. I'm just looking at. You know, it's funny, but the long touchdown to Kelsey was not designed to go to Kelsey. Ah.

Wow. You're talking, you're talking Kittle, you mean? Kiddle, yes. I'm sorry. I'm sorry about that. Kiddle, yeah. That's fine, yeah. Yeah, well, we're just talking, Kelsey.

That's what threw me off. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, the long one, and it was actually designed to go to McLeod on the post, but Kiddle, who was supposed to run an overrout, saw the safety drop down, and he just took his route to open space. You know, he was not going to just run right into the safety. So he just took his route to open space. And if you see the shot, both guys are wide open,

but the play was designed to go to McLeod. I mean, are we seeing any of Brock Purdy's limitations yet? It seems like they're managing him amazingly. Oh, they're doing a great job with that, a great job. They've added the play action boot game because he can do that. He'll make a second reaction play here and there. You know, as far as the numbers for Purdy, they're very similar to Garapolos. You know, Purdy just does it differently and it looks better because he moves.

but the numbers from a fantasy perspective, John, are very, very similar. Yeah, no doubt about it. I would imagine this week they're still playing for plenty. Lottenham-Cath. No, they're not going to back off. They're not going to back off. Oh, they've got plenty to play for it. With the Minnesota Vikings also.

And they get Jared Stidham this week. Yep, we're going to get Jared Stidham. That's not good, by the way. It's not good for Derek C. No, it's not good. I call him Jarrett sit them. If you've got a Raiders receiver, maybe sit them because I don't know if Jared, they went to Jared, Greg, and I don't know if Jarrett is going to get these guys

to ball like the ball. I just don't know. That's a guy. Look, no offense. He's a professional. But, boy, it's kind of hard for him compared to other quarterbacks in the NFL to get the ball out, it seems like. Well, I guess we're going to find out because,

Based on what I've read, and you saw the same thing, Stidham will start the final two games. This is not just a one-game deal. But what are your thoughts on his passing? Again, it's... It's been a long time. I mean, I remember when he came out of Auburn, he threw a nice ball. You know, whenever he got a chance, he seemed to be one of those guys. Again, I'm trying to remember that just didn't see it quickly enough.

Yeah, yeah. But, you know, he's going to get an opportunity with a coach that knows him because they were in New England together. Maybe I'm... imagining like him there was just something about his release that I just never liked. Right. We'll find out. You know, he's going to get a chance now and we'll see. Yeah, well, we got Carson Wentz returning here as well here.

I don't know if you have any thoughts there. I mean, he played and I saw the tape and he made a couple of good throws. You know, Wentz is an interesting guy. I think he's really good throwing the ball intermediate and down the field. that's the way he plays. He's not particularly good throwing shorter balls that you kind of need to sustain your offense. Yeah. So he can make plays, as we know, but I think the sustainability in his game is always a little bit of an issue.

Sure. But, you know, you got to pick your poison. I mean, you know, maybe Hanuky is a better sustainer, but you're missing out on big plays. Yeah. So, I mean, you know, they made a decision. You know, Wence is obviously a bigger guy with a bigger arm. You know, Heinecke is, you can argue, He played pretty well overall for a guy that's smaller,

does not have a big arm. You know, it's hard to really say that, that what happened last week was his fault. They obviously feel that Wence is a more talented guy, and this is the opportunity now to get Carson Wins back in. I mean, it was like he had two turn, he played relatively well. He had two turnover.

and it just, like, showed his lack of margin for error. It's like, you know, you're playing pretty well, but we've turned a ball over twice here. It's kind of like Mac Jones. I feel like Mac Jones this year is showing us. He's putting on a clinic to display his smaller margin for error. You know, like he does need everything. Well, those guys, it's funny to say that,

not to compare them exactly, but those guys have to be so precise in everything they do snap after snap after snap because they're not necessarily, I mean, Heineke's a little. different because Heineke does have kind of a weird secondary reaction ability. Oh, yeah. Whereas Mac Jones doesn't really. Right, right.

Well, you know, Kirk Cousins a little bit like Mac Jones. And I mean, Kirk Cousins is putting up tape that you'd, if you're Mac Jones, you're like, man, I'd love to do that, you know, every single year. And yet another good performance for the, for Kirkie, I guess. You know, I thought Dalvin Cook would have a really good year. And I thought he would have a better game last week. Do you see anything with him? It's almost undetectable. Like, I don't see a drop off yet.

I don't really think, I mean, I don't see anything where I can say there's a problem. You know, they throw the ball a lot. They don't, you know, he doesn't have many games this year, I think, with 18, 19, 20 carries. They are throwing it a bunch lately. Yeah. So, I mean, I think he looks pretty good. Yeah, okay. But the numbers are not there because he doesn't get the ball as much.

it's not really they don't really feature him you know he's not going to get the ball normally like two three plays in a row that doesn't seem to happen yeah yeah it's mike zimmer's gone and that doesn't seem to happen so you know well no it's kevin o'connell and you know they're not it's an offensive minded process and say what you want kirk cousins has played really well this year hey we talked about them uh midseason around week six and i'm like go get them now uh right because it's coming on. And, you know, it has. I mean, he's thrown for a million yards the last three games.

I mean, he's damn near pushing a thousand over the last three games. No, and, you know, he'll throw a pick here and there, but he's not really a guy who turns it over a lot. He's pretty tough in the pocket. I mean, every week I see throws where he gets hit as soon as he releases the ball. He stands and delivers. They've got a really good play action pass game from under center, you know, which is a little bit of a rarity in today's NFL.

You know, Hockinson is probably a tough guy to deal with from a fantasy perspective because you don't know on a week-to-week basis. This week I think he had, what, 12 or 13 catches, something like that. Yeah. You know, but that's not going to happen every week. True, but he was a great pickup. Oh, without question. Without question.

And it does seem like they're kind of working, you know, working them with the attention that Jefferson gets. I would agree with that. I mean, Thielen is not really, I mean, we spoke when that trade was made, and I think I said to you probably on this particular talk, that he would become the number two, and that's kind of what's happened here. Totally.

We've always loved some T.J. Hawkinson for sure. Let's see. It just looks, as a Norwegian person and Viking fan, he just looks like a Viking state. tight head. You know what I mean? I don't know if he's Norwegian, but he's Scandinavian. S-O-N.

He might be, you know. I also went to Iowa. He may have even been a Vikings fan. It just feels so right seeing him out there. Anything from Kenny Pickett, it's just like, can this season please end so we can get a different offense for Kenny Pickett next year? Well, you know, they're amazingly enough still in it. I know.

I know, I think Pickett, you know, he needs some work. I think he shows a tendency to be a little too overreactive to what he sees his pressure and he moves sometimes when I don't think he needs to. I think he needs to become a little more settled in the pocket. I wonder if that's hard to do behind that line. They don't pass protect. Maybe, but you know, you have to because he leaves some throwing opportunities on the field. Be nice to get some upgrades in the offseason, though.

Yeah. I mean, he's going to be their quarterback. That's not the question. Oh, yeah. They're not going to have a, you know, a quarterback controversy. He's going to be the guy. No. Yep.

No. That's crystal clear. And I think he's shown the thing that he clearly has is poise, composure. He understands, you know, there's a, you can see just his body language, which is separate from what I just said about, you know, being a little overreactive to what he sees his pressure. No, he's the quarterback. He just, look, he's a rookie quarterback. and so I'll have some things to work on in the offseason.

One more. I got to tell you, as you probably know, I haven't talked about them much because the situation around has been so damn bad. But I've always had a soft spot for Daniel Jones. And you will. I didn't see that tape yet this week. Oh, okay. I could have sworn to that.

That's my first thing tomorrow morning, actually. But I didn't see it. I didn't see that. But I'm very curious to see it, John, because the numbers were really good. I saw enough of it on TV to think, you know, this guy's playing pretty good. And it's interesting that they had to throw the ball in that game.

You know, I don't know if it was, I think he might have in their loss to the Lions. I think he ended up throwing it more. But that was a different kind of game where they were way behind. This game, they were never really, you know, they weren't way behind. But he threw it, I believe, 42 times, right? And just seeing what I saw on TV, which is not the same as tape and not enough. but it looked like he played pretty good.

Yeah, it looked like they actually had a professional passing game that could actually come back if they had to. I was paying close attention because I gave him love on TV again, and I actually predicted Jones to Isaiah Hodgians, if I can believe that. And, boy, he looks rock solid, you know, like a, there's a possession receiver, you know what I mean? Like boring, maybe, but reliable.

You know, you know he's the son of a former NFL player. Oh, really? Do you remember James Hodgins, who was the fullback for the Rams and the greatest show on turf? Oh, yeah, yeah, of course. Yeah. Okay, there you go. Play with my boy, uh, Tori Holt. I absolutely remember James Hodg.

That is correct. But I, I am almost guaranteeing that you really like what you see at Daniel Jones on the tape there. And it just, yeah, I'm going to see it tomorrow morning. So, um, when we talk tomorrow night, I'll be able to give you, uh, uh, you. you know, a much better feel. I mean, if you're a giant fan, I work with a guy who's just a hardcore giant fan who was screaming week one, get him out of that, bench him, he's done, it's over. And now he's like, we got to keep him.

Right. So he's been converted. Look, we understand that quarterbacks do not fall out of the sky. It's easy for fans to say with any team that the quarterback's not playing well. I mean, look at the Raiders, okay? They're benching car. Now, not to get into a discussion about Derek Carr and whether you think he's a start or not a daughter. That's not the point. But the point is, let's say that they want to move on from Derek

Carr. Let's just say that's what they decide. So now, as we sit here right now, who's their quarterback next year? Right. Yeah. And ain't sit them. They need it. It won't be Jared Stidham. So the question becomes, who is it? And how do they go about getting one? It's not so easy just to say, let's get another quarterback. You know, I saw, we'll end on this too. I saw Mike Lombardi talking about Derek Card. I know Mike a little bit. You probably know him too. Yep. His son is the office coordinator of the Raiders. He brought up the completion percentage over expectation being a key stat. What does that mean? It means like regardless of whether the ball was actually completed, should it have been a completion, basically. So that's

a, you know, I guess a subjective thing there, but I think he made that point because he essentially said that there are plays where it should have been a completion. The throw was there, and he didn't throw it. Right. And we've talked about that. So let me ask you a question, and we'll end with this. Let's say Mike White plays really well in the next two games and the Jets win and whether they make the playoffs or not. I don't know all the scenarios, okay? Yeah. But let's say Mike White plays really well in the next two games. My guess is you're going to hear a lot of people say, oh, Derek Carr to the Jets.

Is he better than Mike White? I mean, would you automatically say, I'm not taking your side here because I would need to really do a serious study of Mike White in the offseason, but would you automatically say, oh, yeah, Derek Carr way better if Mike White were to play really well the next two weeks? I would say, it is what I would say.

Maybe it's a cop-out. If I knew Derek Carr was going to be in a very, very well-designed offense, I'd go with Derek Carr all day long because, you know, if guys are going to be open and it's somewhat easy for him relatively, I guess, you know, if he's in a really, like, if he play with Kyle Shanahan, like, pull the trigger, dude, like it's going to, you know what I mean? Guys get wide open. Even Derek Carr would probably pull those triggers. He's a very gifted thrower of the football.

There's no question about that. You know, that was evident from the moment I put on his tape at Fresno State. This guy can throw the football. And he's had big, big moments and big years in the NFL. It's not like he's been a bad quarterback. Oh, no, he fools us because he is such a good, a gifted thrower, too. That's the problem. And like I said, you can look at his, for whatever stats are worth, you know,

and a lot of people like metrics, like stats, he's done well. Yeah. But at times, and I don't know the answer to this, you know, it's hard to know, but at times it just seems like something's missing. I go back to the margin for error. You know, like he just doesn't have it. If windows are closing a little quicker than usual, we're screwed with their car. If they're open a little longer than usual, we're going to crush it.

Maybe that's a simple way to say it. But to bring it back to Daniel Jones, I've worried about his processing, but I don't think he's like car. Like, I think he's willing to turn it loose. Is that fair? Daniel Jones? I would say that he is willing to turn it loose. Maybe not as much as a Joe Burrow. I mean, I wouldn't say he's the most, you know, super aggressive,

but I don't think he's risk of verse. Right, right, right. I think that's a point, though, to make because, you know, you could be, have all the physical attributes, but if you're not, you know, processing or willing to, you know, trust yourself and pull the trigger on throws, you know, you're going to be like their car. You're going to drive people nuts.

But, you know, we'll wrap there. Greg, great stuff as always. Another 35 minutes here. Wrapping up, week 17. Well, it's not even wrapped up. We'll do the matchup live stream tomorrow night, cover all the games and, you know, continue to update everything leading up to week 17.

Hopefully take you to the promised land. Greg, we'll talk to you next week. The finale of the 2020 season for Greg CoSell. I'm John Hansen. Good luck in week 17. Thanks for tuning in to this edition of the Fantasy Points podcast. Remember to subscribe. rate and review on your favorite platform and come join the roster at fantasy points.com.