Fantasy Football Daily - Post-NFL Draft Rookie Sleepers and League Winners You NEED to Target w/ Mike Renner

Episode Date: May 5, 2025

Mike Renner joins Scott Barrett and Theo Gremminger to break down the biggest dynasty takeaways from the 2025 NFL Draft. From favorite team hauls to bold rookie predictions, we’ve got you covered. ���� 💥 Topics include: • Best draft classes: Buccaneers, Cardinals, Giants, Patriots & more • WR debate: Tet McMillan vs. Travis Hunter, Matthew Golden, Luther Burden hype • RB outlooks: Hampton, Henderson, Croskey-Merritt, and the Judkins vs. Sampson dilemma • Bears’ double dip (Burden + Loveland) & backfield buzz • Sleeper picks: Kyle Williams, Day 3 RB dart throws, and WRs taken after Round 2 • 2026 RB class preview: How good is Jeremiyah Love? Dynasty drafts are heating up — get the edge with Fantasy Football Daily. Where to find us: ⁠⁠⁠http://twitter.com/ScottBarrettDFB ⁠⁠⁠http://twitter.com/TheOGFantasy⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://twitter.com/MikeRenner_ Join the Discord here: ⁠⁠⁠https://www.fantasypoints.com/media/discord#/⁠⁠⁠ Find Our Podcasts here: ⁠⁠https://www.fantasypoints.com/media/podcasts#/⁠⁠⁠ Subscribe to Fantasy Points for FREE: ⁠⁠⁠https://www.fantasypoints.com/plans#/⁠⁠⁠ Fantasy Points Website - ⁠⁠⁠https://www.fantasypoints.com⁠⁠⁠ NEW! Data Suite - ⁠⁠⁠https://data.fantasypoints.com⁠⁠⁠ Twitter - ⁠⁠⁠https://twitter.com/FantasyPts⁠⁠⁠ Facebook - ⁠⁠⁠https://www.facebook.com/FantasyPts⁠⁠⁠ Instagram - ⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/FantasyPts⁠⁠⁠ TikTok - ⁠⁠⁠https://www.tiktok.com/@fantasypts⁠⁠⁠ #fantasypoints #nfl #fantasyfootball #dynastyfantasyfootball #FantasyFootballAdvice #dynastypoints #dynasty Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Scott Barrett in the house here on Fantasy Football Daily. And today we're joined by Mike Renner. Mike, you were super busy during the NFL draft, crushing content. Why don't you talk a little bit about a couple of classes that sort of move the needle for you when you're giving out your grades post-draft, the classes that you graded the highest? Yeah, I think two teams really stick out to where they just got so much surplus value that I'm like, damn, they're those like those teams. I'm very excited to see how their, you know, rosters look. Next year it's the Bucks and the Ravens to me, truthfully. Both those if you just go, for the Ravens, it's like those top two picks I thought we're in.

I think Malachi Stark's was easily the best safety in this draft class. I think very much, you know, a guy who if he had better measurables could have been like a top 10 to 15 pick the way Cal Hamilton was. And then obviously Mike Green, we all know why he fell, but like when you watch him on tape, I don't think anyone evaluated him as anything other than like a top 20 guy in this class. So to get two of those guys, I thought it was insane for the Ravens. And then the Bucks, Bucks is more about like down their board. I thought they got the best just after the first round because like Mekabuka, whatever you want to think about him.

But like I thought Benjamin Morrison and Jacob Parrish were both top five cornerbacks in this draft class. I love both of their tape. And then after them, I thought their day three was a bunch of guys who can play a role, even if they're not starters, but who can be like high-end backups and David Walker and Elijah Roberts, who are two like pass rush specialist type of guys, one on the outside, one in the interior. And then Tess Johnson, who's just like a pure third down sort of slot receiver that can separate from man coverage. So it was an interesting draft for them, but I thought they just got a lot of surplus value from where they picked all those guys. Yeah, and obviously the Cardinals, you mentioned them as well, getting Will Johnson there at the beginning of the second round, that could turn out to be an absolute steel.

Ravens won. I know you had Mike Green at 10th overall on your big board. Yeah, I mean, the guy fell, but he could end up being a pro bowler for the Raven. So definitely a lot to unpack there. Scott Barrett, do you have any draft classes that got you fired up collectively, whether it was fantasy football or in general, maybe flex your giants a little bit? I mean, like, who cares about my opinion when we have Mike Renner on? I wanted to ask Mike's thoughts on, like, could the Browns and the Rams have like sneaky elite draft classes? Because we're only looking at this from, you know, 2025. I don't know anything about the 2026 draft, but I am seeing, you know, every way too early 26 mock that's come out has five quarterbacks in the top 10 and has eight.

quarterbacks in the first round. So, and all I heard was like this year's class kind of sucked and like, you know, wasn't very top heavy. Are you seeing the same thing? I think the quarterback class will be better. I don't know if the all the round class will be better, though. I'm not sure I see guys who are sure fire studs next year in the draft class. Obviously, that can change as next season wears on, you know, it's not always the predictor.

but usually, you know, when it's like the really good classes, so like 2021, I'd even throw a last year into the mix, 2024, you kind of can see that come in a ways of the way. You know, like Michael Parsons, Jemar Chase, those guys didn't even play the last year at college football. You just knew they were going to be like top 10 to 15 picks early on. It didn't matter that they didn't play the junior year. So I think that's like the draft class as a whole might not be as good, but I think there's a very good shot with a much, much better quarterback class. Yeah, I think this is a, when I look at this upcoming 2026 class, and we'll get a couple of your 2026 thoughts later on.

This could be similar to last year. You might have like six quarterbacks, five quarterbacks, six quarterbacks inside of the first round. And a lot of those guys are going to go inside of the top 10 overall picks. But let's go back to the bucks. This is one where some people were very, very surprised where we saw Mecca, Egbuka go at 19 overall. there had been a couple of late mock drafts sort of projecting Matthew Golden in that spot. Certainly, Egbuka fills that need. But what are the bucks telling us with that selection, Mike? Is this an indictment on the age of the wide receivers?

Or is this sort of a, this is what we are. We're putting elite skill position players out on the field and we're going to outscore you. This is who we are. Yeah, I think it's two different things. I think it's one, they care about character more than any. see him in the NFL. I think it's safe to say in terms of who they draft and who they covet, like free agency. So he is the highest character like wide receiver in this class. You know, like he blocks. He's going to do everything right. He's super intelligent. Like,

you talk to this guy and you're like, okay, it's like a guy you want in your building. So in that perspective, he was always a cute bucks fit. They were always going to have him higher on their board than other guys just because of that. And then secondly, it's like that receiving court, you know, Chris Godwin at 29 coming off a major injury. Mike Evans at 31, I believe, in a contract year. It's obviously not a massive need, but it's one that could very easily and very quickly become a need for them. And truthfully, we saw it become one for them at times during last season.

So if you want to stay elite in today's NFL, if you want to compete at the highest level, more often than not, you need a bevy of weapons. So I don't hate the process whatsoever. You know, the Seahawks, people said a lot of the same things when JSN got drafted a couple of years ago. And now they look smart as heck for having drafted them, right? Because he's a true, you know, their number one wide receiver and none of the other guys are there anymore. So I do think that is a situation that we could be looking at with Abuka three years down the line. And Chris Godwin, Mike Evans, nowhere to be found.

Two classes that I circled as some of my favorites, and obviously I have a lot of fantasy football influence with this one, was the New England Patriots and the Las Vegas Raiders. New England obviously gets Trayvion Henderson, who we're very excited about here at fantasy points, but also the Will Campbell and Jared Wilson selections. And then, you know, end up getting a wide receiver a little bit later than we had anticipated. But Kyle Wilson, very interesting player there. Your thoughts on, excuse me, Kyle Williams, your thoughts on New England and what they have done sort of around Drake May heading into year two? you almost had me ready to say Kyle Wilson there too because he there wasn't Kyle Wilson in the NFL right

it's like a Boise State corner or something so yes I was about ready to run with it but yeah Kyle Williams one of my favorite players in the draft class and I with Trayvon Henderson I think he went to a perfect spot for him because I always saw him as a member of like a running back by committee situation I never thought he gets drafted he goes to a spot and then all of a sudden you know he's getting Christian McCaffrey workload where he doesn't come off the football field, right? I just don't think that's who he is. He's had injury issues in the past, and he's not your, you know, short yardage sort of back. But he goes to a spot with Romandre Stevenson where that's fine. You know, he is going to take that load. He,

Stevenson's going to take that load. Tratigan Henderson takes all the pass downs. He takes, you know, your three wide sets. He takes those sort of place because that's what he can excel at. And that's the value brings the table. So I think he's still a committee back. But Kyle Williams, I think has a very good shot because it's really a wide open receiver room. They've thrown a lot of, you know, you know what at the wall just to see what sticks in that receiving room. And I don't know. Like, do I trust, what is it, 32 year old Stefan Diggs coming off in ACL who already didn't look like Stefan Diggs, you know, the last season? Do I trust Jalen Polk to make a year to rise after one of the worst rookiesies I've ever seen? Do I trust

Javon Baker to get his head on straight and actually know the playbook and be able to see the football field. It's like there's a lot of ifs in that receiving room, but I know Kyle Williams could separate. So from that perspective, that'll ingratiate him really quickly if he's getting open consistently, day one on NFL football field. So I think that guy sees a pretty big role as a rookie even though he's the third round. Yeah, he had 14 touchdown catches last year, which is right up there with Travis Hunter ahead of every other wide receiver in this draft class. Scott, you wrote extensively about these wide receivers. Your thoughts on Kyle Williams, when you add context to, this guy's probably going to be on the field right away

and has a chance to get, like, maybe a much larger role than if he had landed with some other teams in round three. Well, I was a hater based on the analytics. People talked about the year he had with Cam Ward, but he was wide receiver three on that team. It was an older, small school wide receiver. Some of the positives on him, though, like, I'm just saying he didn't make my top 10 list, but some of the positives he had a really early breakout age,

I think as an 18 or 19-year-old true freshman, he had over 2.0 yards per team pass attempt. And then last year, he ranked second among all FBS wide receivers in yards per route run against man coverage. So maybe that's where you really see the separation abilities pop. But yeah, he was a film, darling. I know Chris Sims had him as like wide receiver two. Mike was really high on him.

I didn't get a chance to watch him too deeply. And again, this is, this is just the analytics. And like, when you're talking about a, you know, a smaller school player, you kind of just like throw out the, it's just like nothing is really predictive. So I don't know, maybe you can kind of explain what happened there two years ago or or anything like that. But obviously, the landing spot is great. And like I said, film people really high on him.

I would be curious to know what his ass is because that's where I Thank you. Right, right. Thanks for the plug, Mike. Shout out fantasy points data. And I'll say this. He is pretty young for a fifth year guy. He's still only 22.

So he's not like, you know, your super aged fifth year wide receiver. And I think if I were to put like a comp of a guy who has a similar profile and a similar collegiate sort of, I guess trajectory, like say Flowers is a guy who late career breakout. I think it was like, It wasn't until a senior year where he really started being a guy. You saw him, like, get stronger.

And when guys are really skinny, I think you see the strength difference matter. So, like, he came in, we have to go in, like, 175, or like 170. And I was like, 1805. And that's like, that's a lot of muscle when you have a skinny frame. So I think you saw him just get a little more twitched up and similar to Zayflowers. Well, like, that's just extra hump. You saw it over the course of their careers. Then all of a sudden, by the time they get to the NFL, you know, they may not have been

early dominant guys, but by the end, they really were on tape. Well, you know who he reminded me of as like an upside comp would be Deontay Johnson, which is like an all-time Mike Renner guy where I was in my pre-draft rookie drafts. I was taking him 412 every single time just because you were so high on him. He goes much earlier than expected. Another film darling, small school guy didn't have the Dankas stats. Do you see any Deontay Johnson to his game, hopefully without the off-field or, you know, the problems he causes.

Yeah, right. The good Deontay Johnson. Yeah, I'll see a little bit. Now, even, I think he's a little more twitched up and a little better athlete. Deonté was probably just a little crisper as a route runner and had a little more wiggle to him. But that's like that mold of wide receiver is what we're talking about. That's a weird mold. But I think when you're that, like that, when you move the way those guys do, you feel good about them translating.

Let's take a quick break. can we come back? Mike's going to break down the Las Vegas Raiders and also the Los Angeles Chargers, their draft classes, and the potential impact for fantasy football. Welcome back, Fantasy Football Daily with Scott Barrett, Theo Greminger. And today we're joined by Mike Renner. Mike, let everyone know where they can find your work and post-N-FL draft. What do you have coming up? Yeah, you can find my podcast.

It's called Pushing the Pile. We're doing a lot of draft recap stuff. And you can find me at X at Mike Renner underscore. And then my work's over at CBSSports.com, my written stuff. But I don't do a ton of that anymore, unfortunately. We've had a real run of CBS guests in a row here. Heath Cummings joined me on Dynasty Life this week. And then Jacob Gibbs was on this show like a week and a half ago.

So it's not planned, but it's been a CBS run here at Fantasy Points. And you guys are all crushing it. Let's talk about the Las Vegas Raiders. Obviously, the Ashton Gentie pick is about as big as it gets for fantasy football. we're starting to see him steam up to the mid-first in redraft leagues, let alone Dynasty Rookie Drafts where he's the locked-in 101. But they didn't stop it Gentie. They drafted Jack Betch in round two, which is a player I'll be interested to hear your thoughts on.

Then they also drafted Dante Thornton, a true downfield, huge yards per reception guy Tennessee last year. And Mike, you also liked the two offensive tackles that they drafted in round three. Your overall thoughts about this class? Yeah, I do think Bash, I think he's super talented, super NFL ready, like super polished sort of wide receiver. I just worry about where he went to because he's very similar to Jacobi Myers, just like as an athlete, the routes he runs. And it's going to be Chip Kelly offense. They're going to run the football a ton.

You know, like it's just that's what they're going to want to do. So you got Ashen Gentie, you probably have a receiver out snapping them. And then you have a tight end in Brock Bowers, who's going to out-target him as well, that he's like the fourth mouth to feed on an offense that, you know, we'll see, I'd rather be cautiously optimistic about how good it's going to be than, you know, go all in on this being a world beat or an offense. Because it's in a division that traditionally has some pretty good defenses there, the Broncos, the Chargers, the Chiefs.

So it just may not be putting up a ton of points. So, Gentie, though, I, I, was in agreement with pretty much everybody on his draft status. You know, there's been some busts of top five picks like Leonard Fournett, like, who you had as a day three running back. Shout out. Yeah. Leonard for that, I was just like, dude, he's so linear and stiff.

Like, Jenti is up there with anyone you want to even put. I know people want to, like, won't put him in the Saquan Barkley category because Saquan's like an athletic marvel. But I feel good saying that, you know, he's probably the second best back by in Saquine that I've seen scouting. Like he's just, there's no weaknesses to a game. Like there's not a lot of holes to poke. Like Bijan, you could say he doesn't run with quite the same, with quite high in power.

Obviously, you could poke holes in Lender Farnett's game. Zeke Elliott wasn't quite an elite athlete, just a good athlete. But Genties like, he's really got it all. So I expect him to be highly productive, especially since Chip Kelly. you know, what he did from the running game perspective last year, Ohio State, I think really flew under the radar because obviously they were such a talented team, but he did a lot of creative stuff. And that running game was very, just very well-schemed.

And if he's doing that at the next level with the good offensive line, Gentry will have a field day. Well, not just last year, Richard Kelly, but like every year of his career, like dating back to LaShawn McCoy, LeMichel James, right? Well, but they used to with the Eagles, they would just spam a lot of inside zone stuff. And that's kind of like when he was with the 49ers, it got stale, right? And that it just like didn't quite work out.

But I think he's really kind of turned the page on that. And it looks a lot different now. I just mean from like an analytics perspective, everywhere you went, you've seen like insane hyper-istency for running backs who didn't really translate at the next level, except Zach Charbonnet, maybe a little bit. But yeah, and I loved listening to this press conference where, Pete Carroll kind of talked about Ashen Jeanty as like sometimes you get this running back, like who has their own unique style or like on-field personality.

Like a Marshawn Lynch had that and you have that with a Jeanty and maybe a way you don't with a Bijan. By the way, this is like the most Pete Carroll draft ever. Jack Bess, who has one of the greatest stories I've ever heard about a prospect. Deonté Thornton, who's like the discount D.K. Metcalfe, physically. and then Tommy Malat, which is another just, why not, right? Julian Edelman 2.0, who knows? Six rounds.

And then he drafts the wide receiver turned cornerback who's got like a six-eight wingspan. He did all of it. He hit Pete Carroll bingo car. D. Eskridge, 4.0. Love it. Let's talk about the chargers a little bit because this has been a team where last year I'd say they went two for two early on, draft Joe Alt.

They draft Vlad McConkey. And this year they went back to the offensive well. the Omaran Hampton selection was followed up by Trey Harris. And then they came back and they drafted Kandre Lambert Smith in round five, Arronday Gadsden in the same round. They've really leaned into the offensive side of the ball with this draft. How do you see Harris and Hampton sort of influencing this offense? Obviously, the Harris question, I think, put a little context into,

does this have any sort of effect potentially on Ladd-McConkey? Do you think this franchise loves Trey Harris? Where are we out with that one? And then Hampton, does he completely nuke Naji Harris on day one? Or does it take a little bit of a buildup for him to establish sort of an alpha role? I feel very confident saying he nukes Naji Harris immediately. Like I see it being like last year with when, gosh, what's his face was healthy, the Ohio State back of that offense.

J.K. Dobbins. Dobbins. Yeah, I see it being like that where it's just where, Naji Harris plays the Gus Edwards role, and Omar Nhampton is the leadback. Just because Naji is just not dynamic. You don't have the dynamism. You don't have the home run hitting ability when he's in the game. So that's what made that offense so dangerous early on last season before they obviously had to pivot, injury struck, and they became a little bit more pass-happy.

I do think Trey Harris is going to cut into Ladd-McConkie just because, like, when there was only Ladd-McConkie, of course, the quarterback's only going to throw to Ladd-McConkey, right? Of course, Justin Herbert's only going to go that way. He's the only guy you can rely on. I think Harris is a great fit to that offense, though. The only thing I worry about is just like, what's it going to be? I think it's going to be classic Greg Roman, where they are not going to open it up. There's just not two miles to feed in the passing game when Greg Roman's calling up plays.

So I don't know if he's going to put up good numbers, but I think he quite clearly is going to establish himself quickly as the number two there. He's just much more reliable than Quinn Johnson. He can run closer to a full route tree than Quinn Johnson. and even if he really hasn't to this degree. Like he's going to need to get better because he hasn't had the reps. But when you saw him after you do different stuff, he was capable of it doing it physically in a way that Quinn Johnson just has never proven to be so, unfortunately.

So, yeah, I think Trey Harris eats into some targets, but it's not going to be so much that Lad's not going to probably even build on his numbers from last year. Well, Scott, I think there's something to unpack there. Just with the Ladd-McConkie, I saw a very sort of, successful high stakes FFPC manager sell off a Ladd-McConkey share or two recently. Could this just be a Ladd-McConkey's at his dynasty value peak? Therefore, we should explore kind of trading a little bit. It's a controversial one because you say trade Ladd-McConkey and people just come after you.

He's so steamed up in Dynasty. I know you're not so scared of the Trey Harris landing spot, but Ladd-McConkey was already at like 24 and a half percent target. share last year right about that line. Greg Roman offense, they just drafted O'Marie and Hampton, could be way more run-happy. I believe they were 12th in rush attempts last year, collectively as a team. Now they add the best free agent running back and the second best running back behind a generational prospect with the first round pick. Do you think that there's a little bit to kicking the tires on maybe pivoting off of Lad? No, I want to be buying Ladd who just had like a generationally

great rookie season by yards per route run. first down per route run, ask, whatever you want to look at. And I'm not, I'm not worried about, I think Quentin Johnson stinks. I think Will Disley kind of stinks.

I think, Trey Harris, I was not a fan. And like to me, I was kind of envisioning, Matt Harmon thinks he's going to be in the sacrificial X role. I kind of think he's going to be

a little Josh Palmer light. I just think, I just think Lads really good. And I don't feel as good about some of the other receivers they have. So even if it is, just like Craig Roman back in his old BS. I still would not want to be selling Lad, might want to be buying him. Yeah, I think you can make an argument sort of both ways there.

It depends on what you could sell him for. I had the same conversation with Sean Siegel. We talked about potentially a Ladd-McConkie sale and what it would take to get him off of his hands. Actually, on the previous episode here of Fantasy Football Daily, Mike, let's go back to Amaran Hampton. You think he's going to nuke Nashi Harris? We believe this is going to be a run heavy offense. We believe this is going to be an efficient offense. When you compare the potential impact in year one specifically from Omarian Hampton and Trayvion Henderson, who do you think scores more fantasy points?

Who do you think has the stronger season for fantasy managers? I think O'Marian Hampton because one, Greg Roman and his running scheme I trust more and two, that off the line is just so much better. Like, it's going to be a very good run blocking offense line after adding McKay back. it already was last year, but like Joe Walt, year two could be all pro level play from what we saw from him as a rookie. Mackay Beckett in adding to that team that was like struggling on the interior. I just think it should be one of the best run blocking lines in the NFL.

And again, I just don't see Najee being, even if he takes some short yards away from him, I don't see him really thieving that much, whereas I think Romandre could take a lot of ops away from Trayvon Henderson that offense. That's an interesting one. Remandre, there's been sort of a number of people sort of saying what you said about Naji. So that take is definitely not like everybody's saying it type deal. Scott, anything to add with your expectations, year one for Trayvion on Henderson. Like for me, I agree with Mike. I think Hampton outscores them.

I do think Henderson was a huge post-NFL draft winner for me in both the overall dynasty rankings and this year's dynasty rookie rankings. Yeah, I kind of agree with Mike. Like that was the big question on Trayvion is like, is he just doomed to be a committee back? And, you know, Mike, Brett both felt the answer to that was yes. Whereas with Amerian, like, the big calling card on him is like, this is just a prototypical bell cow elite yards after contact guy, like, jacked out of his mind, handled a robust workload, great as a pass catcher. And that's kind of what you heard in the press conferences as well. well. You take him round one. That's probably what you're going to try and do. Like, we know Greg Roman has this committee backfield, but it's historically, but it's also,

you know, a backfield that's like a lock to finish top five and carries, touches. I watched the press conference. They did kind of talk about nausea. Like Harbaugh was uncharacteristically muttering and stammering the whole time and like looked super awkward. The vibe I got was just, you know, maybe reading too much into this, but the vibe I got was just, uh, maybe the hold his agent, like he'd have a chance to compete for the starting job. But more than anything, it's no, like they love this guy. They signed Najee to like a one year deal that was basically nothing, $3 million. Naji is a player who has zero 40 plus yard runs in his career. Like I think it's kind of, yeah, the O'Mary and Hampton show and it should be and they kind of know that. Well, we're going to

unpack also. We have to at least talk about the Cleveland Browns, what they did during the draft. We're going to leave the Shadur Sanders questions alone, but specifically we're going to look at Dylan Samson's impact on Quinchan Judkins, especially in year one. And we're going to unpack some of Mike's favorite day three running back selections after this. Mike, everybody sort of talked about the Cleveland Browns draft, and it was because of the quarterback situation. We'll get to your prediction of who starts games for Cleveland this year.

So you had a take on that on X. But let's talk about Dylan. on Samson because I would say in the draft buildup process, Samson was one of your guys. You had him, I believe, at 44th overall in your top 100 rankings. And you had Quintan Junkins actually behind him. So Samson was the guy you were betting on big time. And he ends up going inside of round four,

whereas Judkins goes inside a round two. This is a situation that dynasty managers and fantasy managers are attempting to unpack. On day two, it looked like Quinn Sean Judkins was going to be this massive, massive winner post-N-Fel draft for fantasy. But the Samson landing spot for me throws a big wrench in that narrative. Samson led the SEC in rushing touchdowns last year, set a Tennessee record doing so. This screams like it could be a kind of a really annoying committee for us. Am I wrong on that?

No, I think that's exactly what it is. And I was Florida fell to the fourth round, given it like all the numbers you said. Like the guy was awesome last year, you know, filling in for Jail and Wright. And I think it was awesome the year before when Jalen Wright was still there.

So I, I see him as very complimentary backs too, which isn't going to help in terms of like the workload and that Samson much more of a smaller space back. I think the size, the injury against Ohio State, a big reason as to why he fell to the fourth round. because he is, you know,

kind of the same way Bucky Irvin was last year. Like he's just not NFL size. So he just scraping 200 pounds, small frame. But he runs really hard. And he's dynamic in space and difficult to pin down. So he can be your space back, whereas Quinshan Junkins, he's much more prototypical size,

prototypical between the tackles runner, you know, bounces off guys. It doesn't shake guys, but like lower shoulders and keeps it moving. So I do think it is going to be a very much, I don't want to say 50, 50 split, but if it's more than 60, 40, I'd be really surprised. So you would say sort of based on your argument, Judkins might be getting a little

overdrafted and Samson might be getting a little underdrafted? Yeah, I would more just say, I'm not sure I'd want to touch either of those guys because the way the Brown's offensive line was a year ago, I'm not sure that either are going to have a ton of success. And when you're going 50-50 split with a bad passing game, I just don't know how productive this Brown's offense is going to be this year. Scott Barrett, why take Quinchon Judkins in the middle of the first round when you can wait a pick or two later and take RJ Harvey and bank all that production. What was your pre-draft running back rankings? You were super high on Samson, right?

Yeah, I was. Honestly, I kind of saw it as like tiers. I thought Samson is like Gentry tier. And then I thought Hampton and Samson were in the tier of just like, I know these guys are going to be exceptional NFL players. And Samson, I think the thing that I'm very interested is he's still the youngest player in this draft class. He doesn't turn 21 until September. And that's like all positions he's the youngest player in the draft class. So like if he's small now, I do think there's actual some development that can happen physically from him.

And he's like a former track guy with like verified fast track time. So he's very much kind of athlete that can succeed in that mold. So it was those two. And then I thought Camp Scadaboo was like your elite short. yard back. Trayvon Henderson was your elite pass down back. We're kind of like my next tier. And then there was like four backs that I just like knew were going to be good NFL backs. They were R.J. Harvey, Quinn Sean Judkins, Jordan James. And there's one guy who's named escaped me. I should probably pull up my rankings and find out. But those guys were like,

kind of my next. It's just however you wanted to draft them, I was completely fine with whatever. It's just more stylistic fit, you know, scheme that you're running. That was more whatever. I was looking at that point. But it was such a good running back class that I really wasn't too pressed either way where you were going to go in this class. RJ Harvey was certainly a fantasy points guy throughout the process. Brett Whitefield had him at RB3. Scott and I, Scott, I believe you had him RB6.

I had him RB6. You had him RB5. I had him RB6 heading into the NFL draft. A lot of other sites were like way, way lower on him. And it was sort of like different universes when I would podcast with Scott and Brett, we talk about him all enthusiastically. He's going to go on day two. And then I'd podcast with people from other sites. They'd say, you know, I think he's going to be a day three, a day three guy. I'm a little worried the age, et cetera. That sort of narratives out. He lands in the nuts landing spot. Denver was a spot

that we had circled as a potential first round. And of course, they take Harvey in round two. Your thoughts on him this season is, is he going to make a massive impact? Or do you have a little bit of trepidation that this might be a little bit more of a committee than some people are banking on right now? I don't think it's going to be much of a committee. I just don't. But the problem is, if there is anything that's worried so much that Sean Payton, you know, I guess some years with Alvin Kamara, he's been like lead dog, but really hasn't turned the keys over to a back or hasn't been known for turning the keys over to a back wholesale. And so like if you have an Audrick estimate there, I think that could eat.

into his production a little bit, but I don't see anything. Like if you just look at RJ Harvey and who he is, there's nothing in his profile that says he can't be in every single downback. Like the compromise that I had was Ray Rice. You can catch. The guys, got contact bounce.

And he's just like very low to the earth. It has that sort of cutting ability that's unique for guys who are built like him and Ray Rice. Completely rocked up guy as well. The narratives, that's the other people who are like, he's small. I'm like, he's short. He's short.

Exactly. Let's put a qualifier on that. Talk a little bit about the one criticism for RJ Harvey that I've heard from some is, and this is an after landing spot, pass blocking. Do you have any question marks on that? Was that something that you wrote down at all? And Brett Whitefield, we didn't hear that from him. That's been a sort of an outside of fantasy points sort of narrative that's come up.

He wasn't a red flag pass blocking guy for me. I can't so I can't recall exact what I had my notes on him but like red flag pass block means like you know he's lacking effort entirely um which he wasn't that and usually if the guy's not lacking effort entirely you can coach him up at the NFL level and you'll get there interestingly enough the jaguars actually did have him as a red flag pass blocker he brought it up in like the i don't know one of these deep dive investigations um they they mentioned uh r j harvey struggling there but he loved He wanted to get him.

They were pissed. The Broncos sniped him. Yeah, and everybody listening to Fantasy Football Daily. Highly recommend School of Scott, not only because Scott and I put out an awesome podcast every week, but Scott did a bunch of these special podcasts with Greg Brainos of the CoachSpeak Index, breaking down each and every one of these press conferences. So Scott put out like three podcasts that basically broke down about 40 hours worth of press conferences.

Highly recommend those ones, especially if you're drafting in rookie drafts over the next week or so. Let's stick with these day three running backs and get your opinions on them. You mentioned Cam Scataboo. Lans in New York. So he falls out of day two. It goes in round four. Does Cam Scadabu take the job from Tyrone Tracy or is it somewhat of a committee and your expectation of a timeline if he is going to take away that job? Yeah, I think we're looking at more of a committee, but I think it starts to one of those where it trends over time, probably towards Scadabu. I say that's someone who loved Tyrone Trace. I was telling everyone last year, I think it was either my, I think it was my RB6 in last year's class.

And I was like, you know, this guy has what it takes to be a starter. You just needs a little bit more reps. But what I saw from as a rookie encouraging as the athlete, but not really encouraging from like a vision perspective. I think you saw it on short downs. He had some fumble issues as well, which like, again, if you're going, just knowing, you know, Brian Dable, who he is. Like I said, I think he's going to trend more towards Scatabble. with time. So I thought it was a great landing spot for him in where he can take over that job pretty quickly. I just see the guy with after Ashton Jentee, the best contact balance in this class,

and truly one of the best short yard backs have ever scouted, because he has such good feet for a guy who's so aggressive as a runner in that if there's, if it's like blocked up and if you just watch the Texas game, it's really all the tape you need to watch on him because it's like about as bad or run blocking as you can get and he still goes for the. like 150, is that he is so capable of bouncing between points of attack to find a gap when nothing's there and still maintaining like a physical running style. So, yeah, I think he's a great back, but he's just obviously incredibly limited by the fact that he's a high four-sixthus guy and really never going to be a breakaway home run threat.

Scott Barrett, 100 Cam Scatabooz or one silver back gorilla. Give me Scataboos for sure. Yeah, give me the scatabooze. as well for sure. My favorite version of that is like, Mike, who do you think like the worst team in the NFL is right now, the Saints without? Yeah, they don't have Derek Carr. All right.

What about the Saints lose Taysam Hill and what's the second worst team in the, let's say the Giants? The Giants get Taysam Hill and a cloning machine, but it can only play Taysam Hill at every position. What wins? Taysam Hill clone team? or the Saints without Tee's. Dude, and I think he's like the correct answer for if you were to clone anyone to be,

just play every single position. Terrell Pryor's up there. I watched a clip today where someone was talking about him in high school where he's like a five-star recruit at every position except O-Line. 12throb is ridiculous. Starting quarterback, a thousand receiving yards? Crazy. You're going to give a lot of chance.

I take that if, uh, If he played, though, or Travis Hunter? If Tason Hill played in the 50s, Bill Belichick would have, like, came himself talking about him on that NFL 100 because he would have been like the goat, like the uncertified goat from back then.

Yeah, I can't believe he's not a patriot. I can't believe Ladd McConkey's not a patriot. Kim Skadavo is not a patriot. That's his girl, man. It's changed him. That's too bad. That's right. That's right.

I have been waterboarded with, you know, information regarding that relationship for the past week, nonstop. It's a great, it's a great thing to follow, especially if UNC season, it goes south a little bit. Things could unravel there a little bit at UNC. Stay with Jordan James. You mentioned him when you're talking about your tears. Lands extremely well. Goes in the fifth round, but we saw Jordan Mason traded this offseason to Minnesota.

Isaac Gorendo is sort of a speed score guy that doesn't really stay healthy. Christian McCaffrey missed a ton of time last year. Could Jordan James be like a sneaky person to add on to your dynasty roster, maybe your redraft roster as well? Do you see him as sort of the handcuffed back in San Francisco? Yes, I will be adding them to all my dynasty teams. I'll probably be going like a little early just so I make sure I get him because I think he will ingratiate himself very quickly with Kyle Shanahan

because I think his vision and running style is as good as it gets in this track class. Like he is always gaining ground. He hits holes physically. He lowers the pads. He comes in with the head of steam. Just like, I loved watching this guy's tape in terms of the way he ran. Now, he's not physically special. That's how you follow the fifth round.

There's like no traits about him that you're like, oh, that's great. He's a little on the undersized side, but he's really compact. And he is just going to get what's blocked every single time. So I'm a big fan of his game. And like I said, I just feel good about him being a solid NFL running back, maybe never great. But for the 49ers and you hit the nail in the head there, like McAfrey can't say healthy, Isaac Rendo can't stay healthy and like has his own vision concerns, I think he could very easily find a role there in San Francisco, you know,

maybe not this year, but in years to come here. Scott put it in the chat here. And I know it's a player that Scott and I sort of talked about in the lead up as a sleeper, goes in the seventh round, but there are some traits with Jacori, Croscott, Merritt. And Lenz in Washington, Austin Echler is getting older,

and this is a player that was very productive at New Mexico, was one of the best players at the Shrine Bowl. Your thoughts about him as a sleeper for Dynasty managers to add late in their draft? Oh, I was hyped about this one when he got drafted because I thought that was the ideal landing spot. I could not have picked a handpicked a better spot for him to go because I do think Brian Robinson is very limited in the sort of runs you're going to ask him to do.

And they're perfectly complimentary backs. And that across the mayor, it's a little bit on the undersized side. He's not completely undersized, though. I don't think he's, you know, he had a ton of carries in New Mexico the year prior. So he's not, like, limited in that regard. But he has dynamism to him that you're going to get a lot of space to work with if you have Jaden Daniels running options next year. You're going to have clean looks and especially with how much they've invested in that offensive line. So he's got insanely good feet.

He's a hard and patient runner. I just think that, you know, he played one game this past year. It's such a weird profile. But this year, even from last year in New Mexico this year, I thought he got a lot stronger. I thought his tape was a lot better. And then he went to the Shrine Bowl and, like, the guy won the MVP of the Shrine Bowl over the week there.

And it's not like, you know, obviously Shrine Bowl doesn't have the same level of competition at the Senior Bowl. But if you just watch the tape of the runs he had at the Shrine Bowl, he is making guys who are going to be on an, NFL roster, it looks silly a lot of times there. So I'll put some stock into that and think that in that commander's backfield, that doesn't have a back really that can do what he does, that he could easily see some touches. And Scott, your thoughts on Kroski Merritt? I don't have much. I'll take Mike's word for it. But, you know, late round seven guys,

those typically don't tend to amount to much. But, you know, this is a team that, you know, went with a committee approach. Eckler's up there in age. So yeah, why not? One player steaming up dynasty rookie draft boards. I'm in a single QB high stakes league. And Jarquez Hunter went off the board at the 207. He's sort of been a lot of people's favorite day three pick that's not steamed up.

Like facial tutin, Cam Scadaboo cost you an arm and a leg. Jarquez Hunter, you're able to get a little bit cheaper in some leagues. This is a fun one. Like Scott and I talked extensively about him, Brett Whitefield earlier this week, right here on this show. Your thoughts on Jarquist Hunter. And do you see any potential chaos in this LA Rams backfield? Well, let me snipe this. Let me snipe this is one of my favorite sleepers at the running back position.

Like the analytics just pop for me in a major way. And so I went to some of my film bros like yourself. I went to Brett. I'm like, yo, tell me what do you think about Jerkaz Hunter? I really like him. He's like, hey, he's kind of stiff hip. and but I guess he's a decent explosive play threat. And I was like, damn, all right.

Went to Danny Kelly. I'm like, yo, what do you think about Jarkis Hunter? I got him hyped up. I like told him my dang stats on him. He's like, ah, he's a pretty good explosive play threat, but stiff-hipped. So that was really disappointing. But the Rams really liked him. They said to Peter Schrager, like before the draft started, this is our guy if he's

there on day three. He did hype up his explosive playability, which is something he lacked last year. But yeah, now I'm dying to hear what you say. And it's going to be like a Christmas carol. You're going to shoot your eye out thing if you see stiff-hift. But what did you think, Mike? He's a little stiff-hift. It's just like you see it as cuts.

He's not like Chris. He doesn't have the one-cut ability you would want of like a speedback. Right. If you have speed, you want to be able to really deploy it by not having to decelerate through your cuts, right? And I just didn't think you saw that great from him. And again, he goes to a spot. where Kyron doesn't come off the field to begin with.

And like Blake Corum, they just used even more draft capital on the year ago. And I like Blake Corum a lot, truthfully. I liked him a lot coming out last year. So I think he just has a very uphill climb. But he does have one thing that those two other guys don't at speed, right? Those two other guys are not high-end explosive backs. They are grinders. So maybe he can play a little bit of a different role, but I just don't see like every down guy.

good note on him is that Fio gave me. It was in high school. He won a bunch of powerlifting competitions, and he refused to take off his cowboy. He refused to take off his cowboy boots. Mississippi muscle, the Mississippi muscle was like 17 years old, and he was like 190, 185 with like a 590 pound deadlift.

In cowboy boots, like, Aschridge, cowboy boots. 600 pound. squad or two. So yeah, we're rooting for, for Jarquiz Hunter, stiff hips sort of be damned. Scott and I are, are playing to flagged in. He needs to take some like salsa lessons and give up the power lifting competition. A little yoga, maybe some yoga loosened up a little bit. One back that I've, I'm curious, Ollie Gordon, mega producer at Oklahoma State, that 2023 season, if I told you was a sixth round pick in 2023, you probably would have pushed back on that one pretty hard.

Ends up going in the sixth round, but lands in Miami. And Scott and I have sort of talked about this as Miami maybe needs a power back. Do you think that there's a chance Jalen Wright is just the handcuffed to Devon A. Chan And Ollie Gordon can sort of grab a hold of a somewhat Rahim Moster like role? I think so. And I think you went to a great spot

because the Rams run a lot of like wide zone, wide pitch plays that that's when he's at his best. I mean, he's very similar to like a Derek Henry or even like a Caleb Johnson in this year's class. when you're that big of a dude. And Ollie Gordon has this, like, his frame looks like an Hback, not a running back, right? Like, he's just a unique build for a running back. You need a head of steam.

Those guys can't just be stopping their feed and shimmying behind the last scrimmage on, like, inside zone or power or whatever. You need that head of steam to start breaking tackles, to start getting stiff arms out in space. Like, those are when those guys are at their best. So I think it's a great fit for them. I do agree that I think there is a world where A. Chan and Wright are kind of redundant and that Gordon's kind of this third other thing. It's like doing this completely other role in that backfield. But I will say, I was so disappointed in his tape this past fall. It was not good. And that's someone who loved his sophomore tape. Like I was like, man, this guy could be,

you know, in that mold of a Derek Kendry. Like, he really could be this unique powerback that bring something different to the table, but just was not on film this past fall. So I ended up being pretty low on them. Like I was like, sick around is where I would have taken him. But I do think the landing spot was really good for him. Did you have a comp for him? Because to me, just seemed like exactly like Chiba Hubbard, both went to Oklahoma State, both lights out as sophomores and then really fell off as juniors.

Similar size. From like a physical perspective, I didn't actually end up having a comp for him because is a weird ass back, man. Like, they're just aren't many backs in that mold. Like I said, guys that look like that play off ball linebacker, more often than not. So you miss a calling. It was like standing next to Harold Fanon Jr.

when we were down in Mobile at the senior bowl. Like Gordon's really long wingspan, big guy, but yeah, that last year for Oklahoma State, complete disaster as a team. Scott, I'm going to add in Jaden Blue, and then if you have any other day three back names to throw out, we'll wrap this one up. Jaden Blue, 42 catches last year, six receiving touchdowns,

run a sub 4, 340 at Texas Pro Day. He's interesting just because the guys around him are kind of nothing exciting. Talking about Javante Williams, talking about Miles Sanders, Phil Maffa. There's nothing really there in Dallas that sort of would hold back blue if he comes into camp and is just the most electric back there. Do you agree with that take? Yeah, I think Blue, and there's like some developmental potential there too, because it's funny that we're saying like he's a junior coming out and it used to just be all juniors at the running back position, but it's not anymore with NIL. But he is a junior.

Like, he came out early out of Texas. And he is dynamic, man. He's almost like him and Basieu Tuton, I thought, I honestly thought blue was a little bit more electric and had a little bit better speed when he got him out in space, whereas Tudin was a little bit more physical. It could break tackles a little bit better. I do see Blue as like a guy who's a pure spaceback. You know, he really is not between the tackles runner. But I don't see in a role like that, I don't see why he can't be really, really productive because he is just so dynamic and not just long speed, but short area quickness as well.

I will say that if there is an issue in terms of him seeing the field, he had five fombo last year. And he was like the second back on that roster. So he is the ball security. it doesn't improve and like he's fumbling training camp he just might never even see the football field and scott he rose up your rankings uh in your like going pre draft to post draft yeah you just have to do to you know low level of touch competition in that dallas backfield um the running backs i'd ask you about i think are you can take your pick either Barshad Bashard Smith in Kansas City, is there like Jarek McKinnon 2.0 upside there?

Or what are your thoughts on Damien Martinez? Like, do we just write them off? I know a lot of film guys were very high on him, but round seven draft capital just, you know, I'm getting Dwayne McBride vibes. Yeah, I liked Martinez quite a bit. Another early DeClearee. I thought would be more of like a fourth rounder than a seventh rounder. But he went to be medicals, you never know.

Yeah, went to literally the worst situation, right, that you could possibly go to behind two backs in Seattle. That's just like he will never see the football field until one of those guys has traded. So if for some reason things change in that regard, then I'm interested. Like if Charbonnet gets traded or one of those guys, you know, then. But I just don't see him ever even seeing the football field until then.

Smith, I will say I have a higher likelihood that he sees the football field, only because that's such a poor receiving backfield. And he was a former receiver. And that is like the trait you want in him. Because I honestly didn't think he was that good as a actual running back. So I would consider even moving him back to wide receiver with what I saw from on tape. But in a backfield where, I mean, you just think about Ken City when they had Jerich McKinnon, they would use the running back as a, you know, wheel routes.

They'd split them out wide. they would actually do some things with them that they just objectively did not do last year with what they had in that backfield. So I think there's a good chance he sees the field, but it's like, it's such a limited production. And I never, I'm never, but like, I would be shocked if he ever turns into starter upside as like a true running back. That's like his only upside is past game stuff. Scott, good on the running backs? Yeah, yeah. I have another question for you. And we kind of touch on this before we started recording. But yeah, all my friends keep hitting me up and they're asking why should Er Sanders fell? Why do you think shoulder Sanders fell? I think it's probably three big things.

One is quarterback is different than other positions and how it's drafted. If Cam Ward didn't get drafted one and say he fell to, you know, fell past three, well, it fell past three, he was probably going to fall all the way to nine, right? Even if, even if, even if, even if, everyone saw him as the top of the draft guy. There's just teams would not draft a quarterback in there. It's such a dichotomous thing that the vast majority of teams aren't looking for one until the sixth or seventh round. They just have other places on the roster they're going to go.

So they wouldn't even address it even if, you know, the best quarterback in the draft, the top 10 guy falls to them. So it's just a different position from that perspective. The second thing is that I saw him as a day two guy. Most people I talked to saw him as a day two guy. day two quarterback in the NFL is not a starter, right? Day one guys, you're expecting to start early on. Day one guys, you're expecting to be like developmental projects.

They're going to have to be on the bench. And so you see a guy being on the bench, there's a profile that you look for, and I think you can pretty objectively say it's not Shadurr Sanders in terms of who is personality-wise, the media circus that's going to surround him, and just what that locker room is going to look like with him in the building. So all those things,

there's just a lot of teams that are like, he's a backup quarterback, and then that's not what I look for at a backup quarterback. So you had all that put together. And I think after he, you know, it kind of reminded me of, you know, Sam Howell was the guy that a lot of people thought was his day two quarterback. He felt to literally the exact same pick, 144 overall in the fifth round. I was like, how's that happen? Well, I think very similar reasons. People like, for some reason or another, I think with Sam Howells his height, with Shudor Sanders, it was obviously the media a circus where they're just like, you know, I don't have a high enough grade on him to justify it. We're going to look elsewhere at the position.

Over under on games, Dylan Gabriel will start this year for Cleveland. That's great. You know, I ultimately think after all this circus, Joe Flacco probably starts week one. But Joe Flacco is 40. And 40-year-old quarterbacks not named Tom Brady don't have a strong track record of staying healthy. So I'll put it at three and a half. I think. And if I did, I'd probably take the over on that. I think he actually sees some real time because he's just, the guys played a zillion snaps of football, cut it into the NFL, more football than anyone else has ever played, hasn't in the NFL. So I think, you know, he's handle it year one.

Wait, that's your boy, right, Dylan Gabriel? I love Dylan Gabriel. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. It'll be interesting to see if Oregon can give us. Did you have him above Shadur? No, I had him right behind just because I think Shadur maybe is a little bit higher end in him. But I think he's the better quarterback right now. between the two. Let's go a little lightning round to end it, Mike, and look at some of these wide receivers. Who's your favorite wide receiver selected in round three or later? Jalen Royals, Eeluk Ayamanner, Pat Bryant, Isaac Tesla, or is there another name that sort of stands out for you? And again, we talked about Kyle Williams already. Gosh, of those guys, it's probably Jalen Royals. I think he is just, I mean, just from like a. a on-field tape production standpoint last year,

if he would have played a full 13 games, he would have led college football and received. He was on pace for, I think, like, 1,500 yards or something through the seven games they did play. The guy had the fastest 10 split at the combine. He is good after the catch, got great ball skills. There's just a lot to like. It's so hard to evaluate his tape.

One, the competition level, two, just the offense. There's a lot of weird concerns. there. And then I will say he went to the senior ball and he didn't have a great time there. But, you know, neither did Isaac Tesla. Some other guys in this class, like, weren't elite at the senior bowl. But I see a guy who's just really natural with how he catches the football. I put a lot of stock into the way guys attacked football in the air as to who they'll be as receivers because I think Darius Lay actually said this on the draft show. I was on the Bleach Report draft show last Thursday. I thought it was something that doesn't.

you talked about a lot, but he said without the stripe on the football, the NFL football is a lot harder to catch. It's a lot harder to track in the air. So in college, if guys have trouble tracking it, it gets harder in the NFL. It gets worse. It just gets amplified. So when you don't have the stripe, I want the guys who are it's second nature to them that they're catching that football. So I think he's one of those guys when I watched them on tape. So there's a lot to like. Obviously, he's kind of buried on that depth chart. But, you know, if you rise to the top in that depth chart, you're obviously going to see a lot of production. So Jalen Royals is probably the guy, I'd say. Now, I love that take on the football. I think that's very, very interesting. Terrence Ferguson,

this is a guy that you talked about on X. You really seem to love the landing spot, the athletic profile. Scott, you were also talking about him this past week. Mike, your thoughts on Ferguson and his impact in L.A. Yeah, I think he's in a great spot to produce. Maybe not your one, obviously. he's going to be buried behind Tyler Higby, but my count for him was Tyler Higby, and I think he's even a little bit better of an athlete than Higby was coming out. He's got just the fluidity that I think it takes to be a high-end pass catcher at the tight-end position.

You better be able to, you know, you see a lot of tight ends who are like 6, 5, 250, and they are not, the top of their routes don't look like the top of routes that wide receivers run. They are, you know, just plant a foot and they're going, whereas with with Ferguson, you saw him be able to break down. You saw him be able to sink his hips. You saw him be able to rotate his hips. And just like it looks like a big athlete in the way that a lot of tight ends don't, you know,

in a way that most guys, you know, most guys who are 1,200 plus yard tight ends do. So I'm a big fan. He obviously needs to get a lot stronger. But he's great after the catch. He could run routes. He's got good hands. It really is just the. play strength. So maybe not year one, but I think as his rookie contract goes on, I think you'll

be even more productive. And Scott, you have him as your tight end. What in this class right now? Well, tight in four. Yeah, I'm curious, Mike. What would your top three look like, you know, focusing on fantasy, so past catching upside? Maybe you bake landing spot into that. But were you like definitively a Warren over London, uh, Loveland guy or vice versa? Was it basically tied for you and then who did you have three? Yeah, so I had Loveland clearly won, Warren clearly

two. Can you expand on that? I think Loveland's a much better athlete. I think Loveland's route tree hits every area of the football field whereas Tyler Warren's route tree is going to be more limited. It's going to be more of an underneath

intermediate, whereas Loveland can get down the field and can do more outwise. if you needed them too. And then after that, I saw Ferguson and, so I think the next tier of three, I would put Ferguson, Fanon, Arroyo, just depending on what type of tight end you want. Obviously with- I love that tier. A lot of film guys not high on Fanon. Oh, dude. Fanon is just weird. Like, he just is weird. And I think he went to the perfect spot, though,

because he's not a starting tight end. So I kept saying, Like you never, if you just want a tight end, you're not picking him. You almost have to have another tight end and then use him as a hybrid player who's almost more like a wide receiver. But then if he's out there, what are you going to treat him as? And if he's treated as a wide receiver, he can block really well for a wide receiver if he's coming in and just having to take on a linebacker or grind out a safety in the box. Like he's great in those roles. Just one-on-one against a defense then. he's too small.

Andrew Barry was asked what position he plays and he said, Queen on the chess board. Yes, that's awesome. And that's like, that's what I kept saying pre-draft. I was like, he's this, this weird other thing that you almost have to dream up a role for.

But if you put that in, it's almost, it's kind of, it's going to be very difficult for opposing defenses to deal with. And whichever way they go with it, right, whichever way they match personnel, if you match,

if you treat them like a tight, end, well, your third linebacker is not able to cover him. If you treat him like a wide receiver, well, then that safety that you just put in the box is not going to, is going to be blocked by him super easily. So I like the forward thinking. We'll see how they end up using him. But that's him. He's kind of this weird other thing.

Ferguson, I thought, is much more of a polished route runner. I feel just, like, good about him being a good receiving back for tight end. Whereas Arroyo is this, like, unbelievable athlete that if you want to run, on, you know, if you just want guys who can get, if you run a lot of play action, you just want play action over, is you want drag routes, you want seam routes,

and you're just letting him just fly, his top speed is crazy for a tight end. He's got good ball skills too. Like, he'll come down with a lot of stuff. So I saw all three of those guys being able to do one skill set at a high level. And then my next guy after that was Mason Taylor,

who I had a little bit behind because I don't think he does anything elite, but I think he's just kind of solid. I think my comp for him was, gosh, the tight end of Luke Schoonmaker, who just, you know, he went in the second round to Dallas, but he's just not exciting, right? He's just fine. He will do most things correctly. You won't be upset at him, but you're not going to ever get 1,000 yards out of that guy. Let's end it on this one. You talked about Luther Burden and how you liked him way more if he fell to the second round.

He's certainly risen up of Scott's rankings as well. how good is he going to be in Chicago? It's tough because it all depends on Caleb Williams, right? But I think he's too buried for me to get super excited about the landing spot for him. If you're a Bears fan, you're super excited about the landing spot because I think, you know, the fact that he fell in the second round, he literally tweets out the picture of him, you know, working out after day one. And that was kind of the biggest knock was just that he didn't get better from sophomore

or junior year. In fact, like if you watch the tape, it's worse. and the effort that he puts forward is way worse. And it's like that's just, you know, he needs a wake-up call at some point because he is so gifted, five-star. And just at some point, you're going to have to refine your route running ability better than he did. But you watch him move.

You're just like there really is nothing stopping this guy from being a high-level route runner. Kind of how I felt about Malik Neighbors last year. Malik neighbors obviously like a better route, like better athlete all around. But he was not a polished route. outrunner coming out. But there was nothing stopping him from getting to a point where it's just like, this guy's going to be unbelievable. So I feel somewhat similarly about Burden. Like, he's a better athlete than DJ Moore, probably a little better overall than Roma Dunzee. But I think in three

years, that room is probably just O'Donzee and Burden. And, you know, we've seen what Ben Johnson can do offensively that that's probably going to be a scary offense when that's case. Can you, can you elaborate on, obviously this all comes down to Kayla Williams. All the, everything loaded into the periphery of that. Like Caleb Williams, what were your thoughts on him coming out of college? What did you think about his rookie season? And what do you think about all of this help that they've spent to give him three new starting offensive linemen, round one tight end, round two slot?

I think it's shrewd from the team building perspective. because if it really doesn't work out this year, I think you have a good handle on where you're at, and it's going to be a really attractive location for other quarterbacks to want to be there. So I think they'll know, but Caleb coming out, I think you were kidding yourself if you didn't think he was more of a project than Jaden Daniels

than Drake May or even Bo Nix. Like the guy just, he had played the least football of all those guys in terms of like past heaviness, NFL past concepts. He had the worst sack problem of all those guys. But here's the thing. He was and is the most physically gifted. His arm talent is out of this world.

What he can do as an athlete is unique. One of the most, if not the most gifted athlete to come out in the NFL draft past, you know, since like Josh Allen. So there is high end, crazy high end ability. It just was going to take time to develop. The problem is you put him in a situation that was about as bad. has it got developmentally just from a consistency standpoint when you're moving from new OC to new OC and then this third OC in his tenure already.

But it is Ben Johnson. I trust Ben Johnson more than I'm scared for Caleb Williams is probably how I put it, that he will get him right because remember when Jared Gough came over to Detroit, everyone's like, what the hell are they doing? This is damaged goods. Jared Gough's never going to be a good quarterback. And all of a sudden, best offense in the NFL last year. I would not put it past Ben Johnson to work his magic on a guy like Caleb.

Love it. Caleb Williams is definitely a player we're going to be talking about right here on Fantasy Football Daily over the next few weeks. Mike, this was awesome. Let everybody know once again where they can find your work and what you have coming out. Yeah, you can find me in my podcast pushing the pile over at CBS Sports. Check out the, gosh, I have a few articles coming out over the next time. When's your way too early? 2026 coming out.

I'll do it at the beginning of the season. I want to actually watch more than, like people watch 32 guys and then they put it out a mock draft. Not to like, some people obviously watch more, but like you aren't grinding. I want to do like a full offseason scouting and then I'll do it before the season.

But I have a Dylan Gabriel versus Shadur, Sanders, Taylor's Tail of the tape that's coming out next week on. Hell yeah. That you might want to read if you're drafting those guys. And for all of the dynasty managers who are trading late 2020, first for random 2026 first. I think of the hope for many is Jeremiah Love, the running back for Notre Dame.

Is he your number one skill position player heading into 2026 and your favorite quarterback in the 2026 class right now? Well, disclaimer, you're a, you're a Notre Dame alum, right? So there might be some. I am. Love is love is like that, though, Scott. He's like that.

But Jeremiah Love is insane. This guy is. so freakish athletically what he can do. And he's young to, I mean, he will be a 20-year-old on draft day. So a really young prospect coming out. And he should have four three speed. I mean, he had verified high-end track numbers coming out of high school. Yeah, I, everyone remembers the run from Penn State.

But like, he has so many runs on his tape that are just, if he develops, you know, if he gets stronger in the off season and develops in that manner. I think he could be a top-ting guy. Like, I would not put it past him. That's the kind of athlete we're dealing with. The running back is back. And your favorite quarterback of the 2026 class. Okay, so right now, if I just had to put a pin and say,

this guy is likely to be a top-cent pick, I think Garrett Nussmeyer is the one I'm putting in it. He's not physically gifted. Like, he's not, so like, Drew Aller is going to be in that conversation and has much better physical tools. Obviously, Arch Manning has insane physical tools. but I would doubt he comes out given that, you know, Peyton Manning came back for senior, Andrew Luck came back for a senior year.

These guys are making $8 million a year to do it. He doesn't need the NFL right now. So I'd be surprised if he came out. But what just happened? It would be Archmanning. He watched that. Yeah, right. It would be Archmanning.

I do think he's going to be that guy when he comes out, but they still think he comes out. But Garrett Nussmeyer, his dad is the OC for the Saints. He's, you know, quarterbacks in his blood. You see that on his game. He knows how to layer throws. He knows where to put it on guys leverage. He just got a little, it was just a little, he was in a super pass heavy offense last year.

He was all on his shoulders in certain games. You just saw the quicksand come and he tried to do too much. I don't think, like I think with one more year under his belt, he's going to get rid of a lot of that. And I think you're going to see a guy ascend into top 10 sort of status, even if he doesn't have like special physical traits. I feel good about that guy being an NFL QB. Well, this was just awesome, Mike.

Make sure you check out School of Scott. Scott and I were joined by Rich Harribar. We did a three-round dynasty rookie mock draft. Get you ready to crush all your dynasty leagues. And then here at Fantasy Football Daily, we're going to keep it going. We're going to help you crush all of your fantasy football leagues this season. We'll see you next week.