Fantasy Football Today - 06/12: SuperFlex Recap, QB Strategy, Mini-Mailbag (Fantasy Football Podcast)

Episode Date: June 12, 2019

Starting the show with an impromptu Kyler Murray discussion, which leads us to our QB strategy. In a standard, 1-QB league, can you spend two late-round picks on QBs with upside? Or do they need to have a certain level of safety? ... Answering your questions (12:45) about Ezekiel Elliott's workload, Carson Wentz, Robby Anderson, a fun league format and the potential secret to winning your league (20:51)! ... A quick round of news and notes (26:00) before we tell you about our 12-team, PPR SuperFlex draft (31:00). In this league, QBs can be used at the SuperFlex position, meaning it's basically a 2-QB league. We compare teams that invested heavily in QB to teams that waited a long time to draft that position. Also, do you need to roster three QBs? How much do tiers matter in this format? ... Your emails at [e-mail] To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

This is Fantasy Football Today from CBS Sports. Here we go! Email us at fantasyfootballatcbsi.com. Here we go! It's time to dominate your fantasy league. Let's go! Now, here's some combination of Adam, Dave, Jamie, and Heath. What do you do in a two-quarterback league when you're confronted with a big decision?

It's PPR, it's round four you don't have your quarterback yet do you go with matt ryan or do you go with a ppr stud like julian edelman i was faced with that exact decision in our super flex league which is basically two quarterbacks and we'll talk about that draft in a little bit welcome to fantasy football today your email is at fantasyfootballatcbsi.com i'm'm Adam Azer. What's up, Jamie Eisenberg? How you doing? Good, man. How are you? Oh, I'm wonderful. Dave Richard, what's up?

What's going on, Adam? I am starting to feel the wave of Kyler Murray hype. Really? Kind of fall over all of us. I don't want to use hype in a negative connotation. I mean it in a positive way, actually. I think that he's got glorious upside. This is where I actually wanted to start with this, if I could be afforded the chance to do something a little bit different. If Lamar Jackson, if you take his seven games from last season when he started, spread it out on a 16-game pace, he would have finished his QB 14 with 2,500 or so passing

yards, 11 passing touchdowns, nine rushing touchdowns over 1200, nearly 1300 rush yards. I'll pose this question to both of you guys. I just gave some numbers. Do you think Kyler Murray will do better or worse than those numbers in his first year in Arizona? Better. Yeah, better. Does he do better on worse than those numbers in his first year in Arizona? Better. Yeah, better. Does he do better on the ground? Does he rush for—predicting him to rush for 1,200 or 1,300 yards sounds kind of crazy. Does he get 1,000 rush yards?

No. 800. But the passing yards, you have to expect him to get 3,500. They're going to run a ton of plays. They have a lot of interesting weapons there. I mean, he's already a top 10 quarterback for me. So right now, I could see myself moving him to size 7 by the time we get to August. I just think, again, it's a position that you can afford to take a chance on.

And if you whiff, you have plenty of fallback options. That's a great point. That's the whole thing. It's the whole crux of quarterbacks. Like, I think the top four are going to be the same. We've talked about this a lot. Probably the whole thing. It's the whole crux of quarterbacks. I think the top four are going to be the same. We've talked about this a lot. Probably the top five. I think Baker's going to solidify himself as the fifth quarterback.

I know, Dave, you have it ranked differently just because I'm looking at it here. But I think just based on ADP, Mayfield will end up being in that top five. He may move ahead of the guys in front of him. But the top five guys based on average draft position are going to be locked in barring injury. Then you have the – I think the next group of quarterbacks is kind of the swing group. And I think Murray can put himself in that category of guys like Cam if he's right. I'm the high guy on Winston maybe in the industry. I have him at seven.

But again, I think if he has a good training camp and everything goes well, he'll be in this conversation too. But it's Wentz, maybe still Breeze. Cam? I say Cam. Did you say Ryan? Yeah. I mean Cam is the one I think that could push himself all the way to six,

just again based on what his pedigree is and if he's right. But Cam, Ryan, Wentz, Winston, Murray, and then it's kind of the older guys. I know Wilson's not old, but Russell Wilson, Drew Brees. This is kind of the way the quarterback landscape is shaping up with a couple of outliers. Obviously somebody's going to still look at Roethlisberger like he does. Prescott, you know, just based on how he finished. Still, you know, Rivers, if you're so inclined. Brady, if you're so inclined.

Lamar Jackson, Josh Allen. You know, it's just we could sit here and name 25 guys that have a chance to be top 15 with a handful that, you know, I think you could say confidently will be top 10. But I think you just look at Kyler's upside and what it could be. There are certainly flaws. He's clearly small. He's on a team that was terrible last year.

And like I said, the weapons are intriguing, but they're young. You look at outside of Fitzgerald, Kirk's a second-year guy and then three rookies. And the offensive line is a mess. I don't know if it's a mess. Uh, you know, I was talking to Pete Presco drink. Um, you know, he was just out there and, you know, we, we kind of, we're, we're talking through some of the things with the Cardinals that, you know, he, he brings up some good points that they had several injuries on the line last year. They add Gilbert to it.

It's not deep, so any injuries are going to be a problem. But how many teams have a deep offensive line? Murray will get the ball out quicker. The system will be different. Pete was just raving about his release. If you read the column that Pete wrote on Kyler Murray, he compares his release to

Dan Marino. Not that he's Dan Marino by any stretch, but, uh, just the way that he gets the ball out quick. That's the first thing that came to Pete's mind. And he talked to Kyler about that. And Kyler's quote back to him was, wow, I appreciate that compliment. Thank you. You know, he talked about his release, but there, there are things that you look at and you say, okay, like, like Dave laid out for you, you know, you look at the way Josh Allen finished, you look at the way Lamar Jackson finished. And if there's an opportunity for Murray to take what he did in college, translate that to

Cliff Kingsbury's system, and perform on what the numbers translate to the NFL, the performance translates to the NFL. I was listening to Kyler Murray's press conference yesterday, and he was like, the windows are smaller in terms of the passing opportunities, the guys are faster, so things are going to be dramatically different for him.

And he had as close to an all-star team in college as you could potentially ask for with what he had around him in Oklahoma compared to what he has certainly in Arizona. But I think – you heard Ben Gretsch talk about it the other day. It's more four-point for passing touchdowns than six points. But the chance for Kyler Murray to exceed the expectations of what typical rookie quarterbacks are, are all in front of him. And so I, like I, I'm taking him over Jared golf. I'm taking him over drew breeze.

I'm taking him over Russell Wilson. And I know that sounds ludicrous to say, but I just think that there's a higher ceiling for him than all of those guys heading into 2019. What round? Uh, I mean, cause that's,

I don't, that's the next part. I don't ever, I don't ever want to put a round tag on quarterbacks. And I'm not saying that as an out. I just think that when we talk about what we do compared to what the public does, it's not necessarily going to ever translate. Right. So I'm always going to take him after my radar will always go up for Kyler Murray in the spot where once I see the first five guys go off, then I'm going to start to judge the board.

Okay, yeah, but that's the problem, right? So it's like in our drafts, you're taking Kyler Murray as the seventh quarterback off the board in a one-quarterback league. That might be like round eight. In a lot of drafts, you're going to be passing up some seriously good players. The seventh quarterback might go in round five. A hundred percent. be passing up some seriously good players. The seventh quarterback might go in round five. It's just it's not just about

QB, ADP and where they're going. In your league, we're not going to take our number seven quarterback before the 20th wide receiver. It's just never going to happen. I also think that the smart drafter, which is the people who are listening to our show now, because the novices are casual

listeners to a fantasy football podcast, and they come in usually around the end of July. Don't tell them I said that. I think the thing that you have to gauge is that those five guys will go in the first four rounds. Then they'll

be a lull. Even in regular drafts, they'll be a lull. Even in regular drafts, there'll be a lull. So it still may get you to round seven to where the next quarterback run will come up. I think Cam, if he's right, will put himself in there. Will Fuller or Kyler Murray?

Will Fuller. Fuller. Because I'm looking at consensus rankings right now and Matt Ryan is QB7, so I'm just using QB7. Will Fuller, David Montgomery, Dante Pettis. Those are three guys. All the skilled players over quarterback. But again, this is just the way we will tell people to draft. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And it'll never be reflective again in average drafts. Now again, that's looking at two QB leagues and things of that nature. I also think that average drafters, novice drafters, losers, whatever you want to call them, will see a rookie quarterback and go, oh, I don't want that. Those guys are never good. So maybe in those leagues that everybody's in that don't involve a bunch of analysts, they might be able to get Kyler Murray in round eight, nine.

I'll give you a real-life example. Just a quick look. We're not going to talk about this because it's for our second edition of our magazine in depth. But we just did our pick-by-pick series, which we generally do for the site as well. But we did it for the magazine, and it was really cool because for the first time, we did it with four people. Ben Gretsch did it with us. And Ben took Kyler Murray as his – it's a one-quarterback league. He took him in round – he took him in round 10, and then he took Roethlisberger.

Give me that all day. All day long. Yeah, sure. I think that you can. It's not like quarterback is foolproof. You can be bad at quarterback. And depending on how you feel about Roethlisberger without Antonio Brown we have basically no sample size we have one game where he was bad okay so replace him

with Dak Prescott replace him with yeah Jimmy Garoppolo who you like I know but I but I don't know if I love that uh you know I look it's probably going to be the route that I go in a lot of leagues, I suppose, because even if they don't work out, I probably can pick up somebody off waivers throughout the year that will work out. Guys have to drop really good quarterbacks throughout the year, right? I mean, I had to drop Kirk Cousins at one point. It just happened. So I'm fine with it. You know what? I'm not going to nitpick.

You're right. How many leagues, and again, the average drafters, the average fantasy players versus the experts, and I'm not putting us in that category. I'm just talking about the people that have played year over year. How many fantasy players in a 15-round draft, one quarterback league, take two quarterbacks? Five maybe? If that. No.

Wait, in like a regular? In a 12-team league that you have 15 roster spots. How many of those people have two quarterbacks? Normal, regular, average Joe Fannis? No, no, no. I think Jamie's talking about – A combination, average. I mean just in general.

How many of the 12 people in a league carry two quarterbacks for 10 weeks of a season? Okay, so like if – What would you say? I mean I have no idea. If you're saying a typical league, I would venture a guess that 10 of the 12 teams would. You say 10. If it's just like 12 dudes that are hanging out at the sports bar down the street. So there's 22 quarterbacks.

Yes. So 22 quarterbacks. But I would argue that if it's a bunch of people that have been playing fantasy for a long time and they know the ebbs and flows of fantasy and they know where the strengths are by position, that's the type of league where maybe five teams. So let's say 20. So knock off two. Let's just say 20. So eight owners in a league carry two quarterbacks. I think you're able to still find probably some guys on waivers

that you could stream. You will. For sure. For sure. That if you take the two and both those guys, like in Ben's scenario, like if Kyler's a flop as a rookie and Roethlisberger takes a huge step back without Antonio Brown. Now, again, I'm not going to use this league as an example because most of us only took one quarterback. But I think you'll find Stafford go undrafted. Sam Darnold may go undrafted.

Both Dolphins guys, I think you can get by with Fitzpatrick to start the season because he looks like he's going to be the starter. There's going to be so many guys that you just have the opportunity to say, I can get by with a couple of weeks if I need to. Yeah, of course. I mean, it's not hard. Just to tie it all in, to where Kyler sort of has the opportunity to fall and play is you shoot for the moon at this position. Okay.

It's a fair point. Well, we have a two-quarterback league. And by the way, well, it's a super flex league, but we'll explain. It's mostly two-quarterback. If you ever are drafting with Ben Gretsch, you are not getting Kyler Murray. He will get him every time. He did in this draft as the eighth quarterback off the board. So we will discuss that league.

And look, it's a PPR super flex league where there's one flex position that can be a quarterback. Does it have to be a quarterback? I'll show you what the math says. But some emails I wanted to read to get the show started. Fantasyfootball at cbsi.com. Subject line is Zeke. Oh, man, I always forget the name.

If you don't put your name in the signature, there's a good chance I'm forgetting your name. So please put your name somewhere in the body of your email. Dave kind of brought it up on the podcast the other day, but I haven't really heard many people discuss the fact that Zeke had 433 touches last year, if you include the playoff games. Not sure if that applies to the curse of 400, but 433 is a lot, no matter how you slice it. And I think it needs to be a serious talking point for ezekiel elliott's 2019 prospects we kind of gloss over it with zeke don't we because he's just been so good and so consistent for fantasy since he's entered the nfl and and this is one of the reasons why i think he's fourth best in full ppr because he's i i think they're going to do a lot to take touches off his plate in the passing game between Witten Cobb and Tony Pollard. He's probably, I think he might have only 40 catches this year. Okay.

The workload doesn't really concern me. He had like three 70, three 80 as a rookie. And then even if he had, I imagine if he had played 16 games, he would have done just fine in his second year. Yeah, but he didn't. And that actually was a blessing once we got through those suspended.

I guess. But I don't know. That offensive line, his physique, for whatever reason, I just don't really fear the workload, especially at his age. And even if he loses the catches, which, I mean, I would say he's probably close to 50, the touchdowns are going up. There's no way that that's going to be the same thing. All right.

Next email is from Driven. Dear Axe, Taylor, and Chuck. That's billions. Great show. I know we just got a big contract, but I'm not sold on Carson Wentz. He was wildly inconsistent last year. Don't really agree with that. And being hurt two of your three seasons makes you injury prone in my book.

I do agree with that. Is it just me? What am I missing on Carson Wentz? He ranked third for me in consistency last year. It's just the games that he missed. And if you want to put the injury prone label on him, you absolutely can. But he's got an unbelievable group of offensive linemen

around him and an unbelievable group of pass catchers around him and a run game that's kind of a question mark right now this offense is going to go through carson wentz and and if he stays healthy he's going to finish minimum top 10 quarterback if not not top five. Jamie, quick thought on Wentz? No, I agree. I think you have to be concerned about the injuries, but the track record is pretty clear. I mean, he's been very good when he's played. Why take Kyler Murray over Carson Wentz,

who was going to win the MVP two seasons ago. Oh, I'm not right now, but like I said, I may. Right now, he's 10th for me. Wentz is 9th. Okay. Next email is from... Oh, Anthony. Anthony from the greatest city in Washington.

Please don't say Seattle. Tacoma? Sure, why not? Dear Ickis, Crum, and Oblina. I'm guessing those are his friends in Tacoma? Sure, why not? Dear Ickis, Crum, and Oblina. I'm guessing those are his friends in Tacoma. This appears to be some type of cartoon. Real Monsters. Okay, great.

I'm sure I'll learn about that soon. Should we be more excited for Robbie Anderson as a potential breakout top 20 wide receiver this year? I'll just let that be the question. Yeah, end it there. Yeah, all the reports, or what did Pete say? It's not all the reports. This is what Pete said from when he was at

Jets camp, that he was running routes really well. He's in a contract year. He's coming off a very solid finish to his 2018 campaign where he finally started to connect with Sam Darnold. Three of his last four games, at least 17 or more PPR points. At least seven targets in each of the last four games.

The one game where he struggled was against New England, and Adam, as you noted many times, New England takes away great receivers, especially with the way Stephon Gilmore has been playing. But I think you look at Anderson. Like I was reading, he's one of my breakout candidates for this year, so I was reading what Heath wrote in his case for, case against, and it's a valid argument. When you look at Adam Gase's offense from Miami,

his best receiver, and even last year, was in the slot. Jarvis Landry for the majority of that time, and then Albert Wilson to start last season. So he hasn't exactly had a lot of success with outside players, outside receivers. But if they're going to move Anderson around, which is what Pete has talked about, now it doesn't necessarily make much sense,

because if you look at the receiving core there, and then was best attributes playing a slot, obviously Crowder's best attributes playing a slot. And Anderson is really the one outside guy that can play outside consistently. But because he's the one guy that could play outside consistently, I think you saw it last year that Darnold's going to take chances with him once he finally got comfortable in the NFL. I don't want to say in the offense cause the offense changing, but once he got comfortable in the NFL, I think Anderson, uh,

his ADP right now is like round six or seven, which is awesome. Uh, I think you could, you could, you should start to look for him in, in round five. Um,

there, there's just a lot to like about what he was two years ago, or I guess at this point, three years, two years ago, 2017 had over 900, uh, receiving yards and seven touchdowns.

I think there's more for him. Uh, I don't think he's going to put himself in the upper echelon of, 2017, had over 900 receiving yards and seven touchdowns. I think there's more for him. I don't think he's going to put himself in the upper echelon of receivers, but I do think he gets to 1,000 yards and can get you, again, seven or eight touchdowns. And I would argue that the receivers in Miami, having the success that they did, might have been a byproduct of who the quarterback was. And Ryan Tannehill struggling on deep balls and checking it down a lot. If Sam Darnold was the quarterback in Miami for the last three seasons, would,

would Kenny Stills and Devante Parker have been as up and down or bad depending on who we're talking about as they were. And I, I would argue that they might not be because Darnold could be a better, he seems to have gotten better at throwing those deep outside passes. And that's only that's only good news for Robbie Anderson. Yeah. Let me just give you the pro and the con for Anderson. I gave you the con last week when we did the top 150 targets in four games without Quincy Inunua, 10 and a half per game targets in 10 games with Quincy Inunua, 5.1 per game, literally half as many. And when

Anderson was great at the end of last year, Inunua mostly was not playing. That's the con. The pro, it is easy to forget back in 2017, he really was great mid-season. His mid-season, six games. First six games were bad. Second set of six games he had an 83 catch, 1,400 yards, 16 touchdown pace. He was a monster. What happened after that? Josh McCown got hurt. Bryce Petty came in and everybody's numbers plummeted. So Anderson was

kind of breaking out in his second season in 2017. It didn't exactly carry it over in 2018 until Quincy Anuma got hurt. Now you've got all that information, and you figure out what you'd like to do with it. This is from Eric in Albany. I'm a corrections officer for Albany County Jail.

Last year I started a league. He's from Albany. Yeah, I know. I said that. I don't get it. I started a league in the jail with the officers. Thank you for the distinction there. So many people wanted in,

I created a fantasy football relegation league. How will this work is this. League A is a 14-team PPR league. League B is a 12-team PPR league. At the conclusion of the season, the bottom three finishers in League A will get demoted or relegated to the B league and replaced with the top three finishers in the B League. It's essentially a 24-man league.

People love it. Breeds competition, blah, blah, blah. I think it's a great idea. Kudos to Eric. You guys play in any leagues like that? I play in one league where the team that finishes last is relegated to an identical league. Same buy-in, same rules, same everything between the two leagues, but

there's one team moves up and one team moves down every year. By the way, just imagine if this was a league between the officers and the inmates, and an officer went to an inmate and was like, alright, you want an extra cupcake today? A pack of smokes or something?

Give me Ezekiel Elliott. They should really raise the stakes in the runoff. We could use our imagination. All right, last email is from Chuck. A really interesting email. Because if I said to you right now, like, what position do you have to prioritize on draft day? What would you say? Kicker. Running back.

Running back. Most people would say either kick, sure. Or tight end. Yeah, tight end. But running back. We always think big priority. So Chuck says, I've played in the same 14-team PPR league since 2007.

We're filled with good players. If you don't draft well, it's difficult to be in the top four at the end of the season. But I noticed that every year, teams that finished in the top four had a late round running back that they drafted finish as a top 12 running back at the end of the year. So he basically compiled a list of the late round running back that propelled the team to a top four finish. 2018, James Conner got a team to second place. 2017, Kamara, first place.

Jordan Howard the year before, second place. The year before that, Danny Woodhead and Devontae Freeman, they were around five and seven. They weren't super late, but first place and fourth place, Woodhead and Freeman. That was the worst year ever for running backs, 2015. 2014, Jeremy Hill, first place. 2013, Noshan Marino, third place. 2012, CJ Spiller, first place. 2013, NoSean Marino, third place.

2012, CJ Spiller, Alfred Morris. He goes on. It is pretty interesting that of late round picks that have... Nick Chubb last year too. Absolutely. Late round picks that have major impacts, waiver wire players that have major impacts, it's almost...

If there were a list of players, it'd be very, very much populated by running backs. What does that mean to you guys, if anything? I mean, it's just the nature of what fantasy is, right? I looked over that list of running backs that

Chuck sent in, and in a lot of cases, it's a young running back overtaking a veteran who is either old or maybe a younger veteran who's unproven. Like you take the case of Jordan Howard in 2016. I believe Jeremy Langford was that guy. And Langford couldn't get the job done,

and they went to Jordan Howard. There wasn't a, I don't remember there being a ton of hype about Jordan Howard during the preseason. And I remember when he came, came out of the draft, he was, he was a good running back, but he wasn't, you know, expected to be this great dynamic running back. And some would argue he still isn't that, but he was great for fantasy in the case of James Connor. It was well, Le'Veon Bile, who knows when Le'Veon Bell is going to show up. So I might as well take this guy and use him just to begin the season until Le'Veon shows up, and then Le'Veon never showed.

Kamara was just a real interesting case because I don't think he necessarily, I guess you could say he replaced Adrian Peterson. He absolutely did. Because the Saints got rid of AP, and they gave the touches to Alvin, and Alvin did really well with them. That was a tough one to project. Right. He was so, because he didn't even get every down carries.

Ingram didn't get – that was a tough one to project. But the point really is running backs, when they get the opportunity, they have so much upside. Well, it's also – I mean, in the case of at least several of those teams, they were on great offenses. Yeah. So you know who the guy is this year that right now now damien i'll give you three damien harris there's a bunch i would say i would say damien harris darwin thompson and and uh justice so how about devin singletary oh look

at the guys in front of him on the depth chart i see that's a to me yeah i i like that a lot but but there's just more like jeff howe the The Athletic reporting that Damian Harris could have a prominent role. You heard on our podcast talk about the Patriots' backfield from Ben Volan. Ben really put that out before anybody did. Yep, absolutely. So we have a real draft today, which I'm very nervous for. I don't know why, but I'm very nervous for our draft today. Real draft that we're playing out.

And I wonder where Harris is going to go. He's going to be trending up. So we'll take a quick break. We'll do some news and notes, and then we'll talk about the Superflex draft at the end of the last 25, 30 minutes of the show. We'll spend plenty of time on that. That's coming up next on Fantasy Football today.

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For free assistance, call the Connex Ontario helpline at 1-866-531-2600. BetMGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with iGaming Ontario. So the news, really that Harris note was the big one. And also, Miles Sanders, the rookie running back for the Eagles, he's going to miss minicamp with a hamstring injury. And Deuce Daly, an assistant coach with the Eagles, said that they are going to continue to use running back by committee. So what, if anything, have we learned about rookie running backs

since rookie camp both voluntaries and mandatories have started up what do you mean what have we learned about them well i think you know we learned that damian harris could have a big role so could daryl henderson josh jacobs seems legit david montgomery we'll see what he does once training camp gets going in Chicago. You don't hear as much about running backs during OTAs and minicamp because they're not full contact practices. So the run games, you can't really even judge. But you hear all sorts of names of players that are, you know, they look good in shorts and t-shirts and helmets. Sure. And you just got to wait and see till July. But the opportunities, I think everybody's starting to see those opportunities begin to open up, especially in L.A. with the girly issue and New England with Sonny Michel not participating in camp.

And Miles Sanders not participating in any of these offseason workouts. That can't be a good thing. And hopefully he's ready to go first day of training camp because he's got some catching up to do. I just hope the girly thing doesn't force Daryl Henderson's ADP to be so ridiculous that it's a waste. Because if Gurley is fine and doesn't miss games, you're wasting a pick on Daryl Henderson where he's going right now. Again, I don't want to reveal too much, but he went in round five of a recent draft. Whoa. Yeah, I didn't mean to suggest that I like Damian Harris better than Daryl Henderson.

I just figured that Henderson was... No, it wasn't about that. But again, I think, you know, and even the case with the Patriots, Mike Reese of ESPN said that, you know, the Michelle thing may be a little bit overblown too. You know, that he's just taking time off because they don't need him out there right now.

And so, you know, while Damian Harris has an opportunity, based on what Ben told us, while Damien Harris has an opportunity based on what Ben told us, uh, while Daryl Henderson has a great opportunity, if, if Gurley, you know, who said his, his knee situation is small, he actually talked yesterday, uh, for Rams mini camp. Um, you know, if those two guys in terms of Gurley and Michelle are fine, you don't want to overvalue those rookies. Now, again, they're huge lottery tickets because in their respective offenses, if they do get a heavy workload, they could be stars. In the case for the Patriots,

it's not like James White is gone and it's not like Rex Burkhead is gone. While Harris may be ahead of Burkhead, which he should be, it's not like he's ahead of White in passing down situations. Still, White's role is locked in and then it could be those other three guys taking away from each other.

Who do you guys have ranked ahead right now? Mark Ingram or Sonny Michel? Ingram. I have Sonny ahead of Ingram right now. So I'm at the point where I would take Ingram ahead of Michel, but if Michel fell farther than that, looking at consensus rankings, Chris Carson,

Kenyon Drake, you know, to me it's like well Josh Jacobs is going to go earlier than this but once once Ingram comes off the board I get a little queasy about running backs the way our drafts are going that's when I'd really love to pull

the trigger on Sonny Michel if he's able to focus that would be falling like a round from where we were seeing him going earlier our other news Marquis Goodwin wants to compete in the 2020 Olympics in Tokyo. He's a track guy and supremely talented,

but I was reading the article and I don't know, I may be misinterpreting it, but I feel like he might miss some training camp

certainly next year, but could he miss training camp this year to train for the Olympics? Did anybody come away with that? I'd be surprised if that's the case.

Because he has to qualify. All right, it's something to keep an eye on. That's the only reason why I brought it up. J.J. Arcega-Whiteside has been good in the red zone for the Eagles, rookie wide receiver. Not a surprise. Not a surprise at all. I don't like that from an Alshon or even Ertz perspective.

No. Well, I mean, he's still got a long way to go to earn that type of playing time. But he's gigantic. And that's half of what he did at college, was just post up. He's a power forward, so he'll just post up in the end zone. Wentz will throw a ball eight feet in the air, and he'll come down with it. Minnesota signed Kyle Rudolph to a four-year, $36 million deal. I wonder if they're going to regret this in a Cameron Brait sort of way.

Probably. I think Rudolph's a little bit better than Brait. He is. Just a little bit. But how much do you have to invest in tight ends? Depends on which tight end you're talking about. I don't know about Rudolph. Oakland will be on

hard knocks. That could be pretty fun. Yep. Who wins tonight? Bruins. Yeah, they're home. Yeah. Well, Boston... There is nothing better

than Game 7 playoff hockey. And for the Cup, it's going to be fantastic. It's terrific. Yeah, Boston hasn't won any championships in a long time, so they could really use this one. Superflex.

I don't even remember. I did the draft. But did the Superflex draft have a regular flex and a superflex or just a superflex? Both. Okay. And it's five points for passing touchdowns. Yeah, it's PPR.

It's one quarterback, two running backs, two wide receivers, a tight end, a regular flex, running back, wide receiver, tight end, and a super flex, which can be running back, wide receiver, tight end, or quarterback. Are there any teams that don't have a quarterback as their super flex? I just remember from writing about it that Chris Hassel, one of our hosts at CBS Sports HQ, he was the last person to take his first quarterback, which ended up being Derek Carr. remember from writing about it that Chris Hassel, one of our hosts at CBS Sports HQ,

he was the last person to take his first quarterback, which ended up being Derek Carr. And then he took two late round flyers on guys. If you want to use one as a flex, his team is sick aside from quarterbacks. But he has Derek Carr, Nick Foles and Dwayne Haskins as his three. We need to talk about this team. I hate this team. How do you hate this team? Because I don't think you can win with such crappy quarterbacks. Well, the hope would be is that Carr takes a big leap. Yeah, let's talk about it.

Let me give the roster. It's a hope. And then the other thing would be is that Haskins is good. Yeah, so I think Foles would probably be is that Haskins is good. Yeah. So I think Foles would probably be better than Haskins. Probably safer. All right. So Carr, you only start two quarterbacks at most.

Carr, Foles, Haskins are his quarterbacks. He is loaded elsewhere. And it's PPR. Josh Jacobs, Joe Mixon starting at running back. Thielen and Schuster. Smith, Schuster, and Thielen, sorry, at wide receiver. Jared Cook at tight end. Chris Godwin at flex.

Not super flex, just flex. Chris Godwin. On the bench, Sonny Michelle, Anthony Miller. Is that Marvin Jones? Will Fuller and Deontay Thompson. Darwin. Darwin Thompson. Thank you. I don't think Deontay Thompson is going to get drafted.

Steve's not quite as bad as I thought. Darwin Thompson. That would be the rookie running back for the Chiefs. Honestly, I think we might have oversold it because everything's got to go right.

Jared Cook could be great. Could not. Chris Godwin, obviously unproven. The two running backs and the two starting wide receivers are really good, but if the Vikings run the ball all the time, Adam Thielen might be a bust. So if you sacrifice quarterback this much, you pretty much need everything else to fall into place. I don't see this team winning.

What I told Chris was where he screwed up because he didn't need this guy is where he took Will Fuller in the eighth round. Here's who is still on the board for him. Trubisky, Garoppolo, Josh Allen, Tom Brady, Lamar Jackson. Oh, yeah. Absolutely. That's a winner. If he takes one of those guys, anyone, whoever you feel the most comfortable with.

It's funny he thinks he's a Bears fan. So if he takes Trubisky there, put Trubisky at the top, and then whoever he replaces Will Fuller with on the bench. That is 100%. And then Derek Carr is his super flex. And that's a great team. Like, that takes this team. It's still a very good team, though.

It's pretty, yeah. I just don't see it winning. Of course, we're not playing that. It is. And again, you know, I don't exactly study all these teams when I write about this. I kind of take just a broad look at it because I want the people who read the story and read the results to make their own opinion. But just based on the roster minus the quarterbacks, it is the best roster minus the quarterbacks.

Oh, it should be. It's got the worst quarterbacks. Right. I might have the second worst. Oh, okay. Let's see. Because I also do not have a quarterback in my super flex. Well, you know what?

I actually want to give these numbers out then. So in this format, PPR, five point per passing touchdown. Should your Super Flex necessarily be a quarterback? Well, let's take a look. Just as far as up top goes, last year in this format, again, PPR, five point per passing touchdown. Christian McCaffrey and Saquon Barkley, their fantasy points would have made them the number three quarterback. That's amazing. DeAndre Hopkins was the number six quarterback based on his fantasy points. But if you want to talk about like Mitchell Trubisky, Trubisky was the number 15 quarterback in this format, five point per passing touchdown. He would have been the number six running back and number 10

wide receiver. Andy Dalton, who is actually on Dave's's team was the number 24 quarterback and he played half the season without aj green he would have been the number 17 running back and number 24 wide receiver in this ppr five point passing touchdown league so dave i would think that andy dalton would probably be your super flex he might be but i couldn't resist some values in the first six rounds of the draft that put me in a tough spot at quarterback to where Andy Dalton is my second quarterback, which in this format, I guess it's not that bad, but I, people who prioritize having that second quarterback in their super flex spot are going to take quarterbacks a lot earlier than I did. And

it's, it's going to make them feel better about their team, especially since most teams will use a quarterback in that flex. And those quarterbacks, as you just told us, Adam score more points. So David Johnson was my first round pick. No big deal there. Odell Beckham came back to me in round two. Again, no big deal. Did you have, uh, where was I? 10th. Okay. So i was actually thrilled to get david johnson at 10 and i knew that i'd get a good receiver coming back i saw some running backs coming off the board so i went with dj and odell was there for me in round two so great start right even in a league where you've got to start two quarterbacks i don't think anybody's going to argue with that ty hilton in round three round four i went with diggs over derrick henry derrick henry made it back to me in

round five i don't think that that's very shocking Kenny Galladay was still there in round six so I'm weighing Galladay versus the quarterbacks that were still there and there were still some really good quarterbacks there but I thought to myself oh I'll just get a quarterback in round seven no big deal and I took Kenny Galladay

who is a bench player for you well you can't I'm starting him or Andy Dalton each week right you can start him at super flex Kenny Galladay. Who is a bench player for you? I'm starting him or Andy Dalton each week. Right, you can start him at Superflex. Right. Like, you had already had three receivers, two running backs at that point. Yes. So I might have just gone a little too hog wild

on receivers there. I don't know. I mean, it's impressive. You could probably, you know, if we were playing it out, it's certainly trade bait. But I think Rivers and Dalton is perfectly fine. You took advantage of the depth of the position. Well, I was also hoping to get somebody like, here are the quarterbacks that were still on the board

when I took Galladay. Breeze, Russell Wilson, Goff, Roethlisberger, who I wouldn't have taken, Dak, who I probably wouldn't have taken. I actually felt lucky to get Phillip Rivers in late round seven because I think plenty of Phillip Rivers, and I think he'll be a good quarterback again this year. He's got the great track record. And then quarterbacks really kind really fell off a cliff between

that pick and my pick in round nine. Round eight, I could have taken another quarterback. Maybe that's really the mistake that I made. I took Jordan Howard over Garoppolo. Josh Allen. I'm thinking that that was good. You know me. I love having that running back depth.

Jordan Howard in a PPR league? You're going to cut Jordan Howard. Probably by week me i love having that running back depth but jordan howard in a ppr league you're not you're gonna cut jordan howard probably by week nine or ten or week four or five well you had derrick henry david johnson you did need running back depth yeah i mean that so so let me ask you this which running backs were on the board when you took kenny galladay when i took kenny galladay in round six as As your fourth receiver. Miles Sanders was the first one to go after. Lamar Miller, David Montgomery,

who if I had a redo, I might actually take him now. Tevin Coleman was someone I was hoping to fall to me in round seven. Didn't do it. I don't know, Jamie, what do you think of his team with Rivers and Dalton? Do you think it's okay? I think it's good. I think the only problem is, again, it's like the Jordan Howard pick is the one that stands out like a sore thumb. I'm looking at his team like comparing it to Chris, and it's very similar.

I think we talked about this with Ben the other day. Derek Henry in a PPR league isn't great, but as your second guy, it's not awful. And Hawkinson is, I think, in a struggle. Yeah, we didn't even talk about the tight end. At tight end, but everything else is fantastic. Rivers loses a little bit in five points for passing touchdowns compared to six just because he doesn't run at all. And Dalton is serviceable and was a great value.

Dalton's the type of guy in this type of format you want as your third quarterback more times than not. For me, my third quarterback is Darnold. I have them basically ranked back to back. So I think those are the type of guys you want to, you know, hopefully get as your third quarterback. The thing that I don't love about Dave's team is his bench, I think, is not great.

You know, so his starters are good. Tight end's questionable. One quarterback's good. The rest of it, I think, has some holes in it. But his starters compared to anybody else's, aside from having the two quarterbacks, is just amazing. You know, Diggs, Galladay, and Beckham, and Hilton are as good a foursome that you'll find at receiver anyway.

Dave's bench is Galladay, or it could be a super flex. Well, assuming the way he has it now. Right now, Galladay is in the super be a super flex. Well, assuming the way he has it now. Right now, Galladay is in the super flex, and Dalton's on the bench, but I can obviously mix and match that. Cincinnati's at Seattle week one. Or, yeah, they're at Seattle in week one. I might go for Dalton there and bench Galladay. Malcolm Brown.

Galladay has a Patrick Peterson list, Cardinals. You're playing Galladay in week one. I'll just bench Odell then. Malcolm Brown, Ido Smith, Dalton, Jordan Howard, Deontay Foreman, and Noah Fant. Two Iowa tight ends for Dave. Yeah, I went with the late round rookie tight end strategy that I'm probably going to stop doing. Because now that I've done it and I've looked at it, I went, oh my God, it's not very pretty.

And I guess the reports out of Detroit in OTAs is that Hawkinson isn't impressing quite as much yet. Okay. Well, another point I want to make is that, let's talk about do you need three quarterbacks? Dave has two, I have three. Jamie has three. When you consider that the number 24 quarterback, this is 12 teams, by the way.

I should have clarified that. 12 teams, super flex. Much harder than 10. The number 24 quarterback last year would have been the number 17 running back, the number 24 wide receiver. So if you get an injury at quarterback or you're just dealing with a bye week, there's not going to be much on waivers. There might not be anything on waivers.

It may be the worst quarterbacks in the NFL. In a super flex PPR league, yeah, you could throw a wide receiver in there. You might only lose a few points. So that's just an important distinction to make. A lot of these formats typically are four points for passing touchdowns. So it changes the conversation,

especially when it's minus two for interceptions. But I think anything above four, you're probably in a disadvantage of not starting two quarterbacks. Not starting, but not rostering three is what I was saying. Yes, yes. You do not have to roster three. You know why you roster three?

To trade one of them to me midseason because I'm going to need quarterback help. Well, my tough decision, even if this were a two-quarterback PPR league, rather than just super flex, I probably would have taken the same approach. When we started doing two-quarterback leagues, I don't know, five years ago, we started our two Q quarterback leagues i don't know five years ago we started our

two qb league something like that like i was pretty much taking at least one if not both quarterbacks early i think maybe not i i agree with you i think back in the day it's we were definitely taking quarterbacks a lot sooner in two quarterback leagues yeah and i don't play in any two quarterback non-ppr leagues but any type of ppr scoring i mean i just you got to take advantage of the depth right we are not going to be the ones that have my homes we're probably i have the number six quarterback i took matt ryan no the number seven quarterback oh no i'm sorry he was number six and was i the first of the three of us to take a quarterback? Definitely before Dave. Jamie, your starting quarterback is Jameis Winston,

so not long after I took Ryan. Right. One round after. I think that's just... I want to say that. We're not going to be... Patrick O'Holmes went ninth overall. Deshaun Watkins was round two pick six. Luck was round two pick nine. Rodgers round two pick pick six. Luck was round two, pick nine.

Rodgers round two, pick 11. Baker Mayfield round three, pick 11. And then I took Matt Ryan round four, pick five. Okay, so I just want to say that. Jamie, why don't we talk about your team and what you did. Before that, I think one team of note in just the opposite of what Dave and Chris did was Ben Gretsch's team, who took two quarterbacks. He was the first one to take two quarterbacks. And he took Cam and Kyler.

Kyler. All right, so you want to look at his team then? We should do that. Yeah, I think his team is interesting just because he invested heavily. I think he took all three of those guys in the first six rounds. His weakness is wide receiver. Without a doubt. So Ben has Cam and Kyler.

He has D'Angelo. I see an initial, and I just go with the guy who's washed up. Damian Williams and Christian McCaffrey. Christian McCaffrey and Damian Williams at running back. His first three picks, he went McCaffrey, Ertz, Damian Williams. And then I think he went Cam and then Kyler back-to-back. DJ Moore and Allen Robinson are his wide receivers. Ronald Jones is his flex.

Now, you heard Ben talk two days ago. He likes Ronald Jones. He loves Kyler Murray. On his bench, Deshaun Jackson, Marquise Lee, Royce Freeman, Matt Breida, Lamar Jackson as a third quarterback, and Kiki Cutie who's getting a ton of buzz right now. So could a combination of Allen Robinson, DJ Moore, Deshaun Jackson, Marquise Lee, and Kiki Cutie get him by at wide receiver?

And, of course, there's always going to be waiver wire wide receivers. I just don't know. If this were a four point per pass in touchdown league maybe it'd be a little different than five. I'm not sure Cam and Murray really blow me away as opposed to even my

quarterbacks, Matt Ryan and Jimmy Garoppolo. It's like I don't know that the investment is worth the big downgrade at wide receiver. And you wonder if he could have gotten Murray maybe a round later. I'll go back and look. So he took Cam.

Kyler Murray was round five. You were right. They went rounds four and five as quarterbacks seven and eight off the board. So let's just say, and we did this draft prior to the latest news on tyreek hill so the first receiver after kyler murray was sammy walken so let's just say he takes uh tyler lockett chris godwin kenny gall kenny galladay where he took kyler murray and then he comes back at the end of round six and instead of taking dj moore he takes kyler murray there he wouldn't have had he wouldn't have been there but he could have gotten somebody like would have been there who i mean

kyler murray yeah no i would have taken him at that point you someone else would have you wouldn't have been there. But he could have gotten somebody like... He would have been there. Who? Kyler Murray? Yeah. No, I would have taken him at that point. Someone else would have. You wouldn't have had the choice to take him if you... Sure, because you're giving him Kenny Galladay in round five. But you have Russell Wilson and Drew Brees ranked ahead of him at the time. That's true.

So I could have taken one of those guys. One of those other quarterbacks could have been there. So what I'm saying is he ends up with Kyler Murray in round six, and then instead of the combination of Murray and Moore, it's Galladay and Murray, and that's a much more attractive situation. You know what I think this really comes down to is how you tier the quarterback position. I mean, it's so easy in a one-quarterback league

to just take shots with upside, like Jamie was saying earlier, Kyler Murray, Ben Roethlisberger, play the waiver wire. In this league, if you draft saying earlier, Kyler Murray, Ben Roethlisberger, play the waiver wire. In this league, if you draft Cam Newton and Kyler Murray, one thing I'll say is we know for a fact from the past that Cam Newton has number one upside potential. We know it. And he certainly has top five potential. We know that there's plenty of potential with Kyler Murray. I think you have to ask yourself, at what point in the quarterback rankings do I get to the spot where this guy doesn't really have top five upside? Like, he's fine, but he doesn't have the upside of Cam Newton, of Kyler Murray, of Jameis Winston.

That, to me, is an important question to ask yourself. I think Jared Goff does have that upside. He did it last year. I think Jimmy Garoppolo has that upside. I don't know if anyone else after that does. Like, I don't know if Josh Allen or that does. I don't know if Josh Allen or Lamar Jackson, Kirk Cousins, if they do. So, you guys know

what I'm saying? That's why he took Cam and Kyler. Because maybe they won't be better than Goff and Dak or Goff and Rivers. But they do have much more upside. So I could see the case to be made. Absolutely.

Yeah. Do you guys think... But again, it's sacrificing the receiver spot. My team's somewhat similar. I think my receivers are better, but it's somewhat similar. All right. Let's get your team.

Do you want me to say it? I'll say it. James, what pick did you have? I had the fifth pick. You took Melvin Gordon in the first round. So Jamie's quarterbacks are Jameis Winston, who he got round five, QB nine, and Jared Goff, who he got round seven, but that was QB like 14. So that's a super flex.

Melvin Gordon and Dalvin Cook, Robert Woods and Dante Pettis, George Kittle, David Montgomery at regular flex, Jared Goff at super flex, with Sam Darnold, Debo Samuel, you got Madison to back up Cook,

Andy Isabel, your team is awesome. And you even have the Jaguars defense to boot. You have the best team. Congratulations. I mean, it's good if Woods is still what he was, which I think he's capable of being because he's shown that over two years. And what I did at receiver at the second spot, like I think Pettis, I mean, I've said this, I think he's got a lot of upside,

but I think he's more of a number three than a number two but i made sure to take samuel we talked about this adam during a draft that i did the friendship strategy um and then i know i'm probably higher on deshaun hamilton than most but i do think that if sanders is slow in his recovery or even if sanders is fine that hamilton is going to challenge to be one of the best receivers in denver maybe even the best um you know i feel about carlos hy. And then I think at the quarterback position, I'm pretty well covered because Goff should be good once again. He may not. I think he's going to take a little bit of a step back, but he should be good.

You know what I think of Jameis. And then I think Darnold is the third guy. That's the type of guy you want to take. You know, somebody that has upside. You can get late. Yeah, I just think that you took your two quarterbacks later than Ben took his two quarterbacks. He took Cam and Kyler. You took Winston and Goff.

I'm not sure that he has an advantage over you. You both have really good running backs. But Damian Williams is a big question mark as his number two. I guess you could say Dalvin's a big question mark as well, but that's only for injury. But his wide receivers, his starting receivers are Allen Robinson and DJ Moore. Yours are Robert Woods and Dante Pettis. Like, I just prefer your route. I just prefer your route better.

I don't know. And we took a similar approach to tight end. You know, we both have the two and three, however you want to flip. Kettle and earths, kettle and earths. I don't know why people, like, why are we down on Goff? He was the number six quarterback last year. And his production stopped. last year and his production stopped you know his production slumped when cup got hurt uh but i like i feel like he's a steal

was it the 15 16 quarterback off the board oh without a doubt at that point in in a super flex league in a two quarterback league yes he should not have fallen as far as he did but at the same time i i think there are some things to you know nitp with him. The biggest thing for me is the offensive line. I mean, they have three new starters on the offensive line. Jared Goff was the 14th quarterback off the board in this draft. All right, my team, pretty happy with it. I also have a stud tight end. Hey, Dave, you want a tight end?

Yes. Let's make a mock trade. Okay, who do I want from you? Do you need a receiver? I actually could use a receiver. Yeah. All right, I'll give you Kelsey. You give me Beckham.

Wow, blockbuster. You have Diggs, Hilton, and Galladay. It's a league we're not playing out either way, so knock yourself out. I actually think I might prefer... No, I'd probably take Beckham. Okay, i have matt ryan who i took in round four i had sorry do you know what pick i had guys you were eighth eighth yeah i was hoping davante adams would get there and he did so i took adams in round one kelsey in round two aaron Jones in round three. My team is Matt Ryan at quarterback, Jimmy Garoppolo at super flex,

Aaron Jones and Mark Ingram at running back, Devante Adams and Alshon Jeffrey at wide receiver, Kelsey at tight end. I don't like my flex so much. Miles Sanders. You liked it better when we did the draft. Yeah, sure.

And then I have justice Hill on my bench to backup Ingram. I have Nikhil Harry, Matthew Stafford is my number three quarterback, Emmanuel Sanders, Jamal Williams, the backup Aaron Jones. And I have golden Tate who I actually think could be, he's probably,

he's probably starting over mile Sanders to start. Golden Tate as a flex is not bad. If you have Kelsey, you're obviously going to be weak somewhere. I don't think plugging in Golden Tate's bad in PPR at flex. Actually, I like the team. I have Greg Zerline. That's amazing. Great, great, great pick.

I like the team, but my big question was Matt Ryan. I don't know if I'd do it again, because when I took Matt Ryan, there were some really good players on the board. Julian Edelman was certainly one. How do you pass up, knowing you're going to be weak at wide receiver

if you take Matt Ryan? If I could do it again, I think I would take Edelman to be my wide receiver two behind Devontae Adams, and then I would just wait. Edelman was the one time where I got upset in this draft because he went right before me in round four. I was like, the way that this is set up for me

when I went with the two running backs and Kittle, Edelman is a top 12 guy for me, so number one receiver for me. Woods is just outside. I think he's like 15. I was like, wow, I'm about to get Julian Edelman and then Maroon Berkson took him one spot in front of me.

So, yeah. So if I could do it again, or you guys tell me, would you rather have Matt Ryan and Alshon Jeffrey or Phillip Rivers and Julian Edelman? Ryan and Jeffrey. Yeah, I think I'd go that way too. If this was six points for passing touchdowns i'd go the other way yeah and alshon is i think a little underrated he basically was really good

when he was healthy except for games against minnesota and jacksonville um do i have to take alshon in your example or could i take Tyler Boyd who you or Robbie Anderson you could take either of those guys yeah I would rather so if that was my option then I would definitely take Matt Ryan over those guys yeah he took Alshon ahead of Boyd head of Robbie Anderson uh head of Mike Williams uh yeah I had a Will Fuller I would do I I don't have any regrets. I took him ahead of Dante Pettis, who I love, so maybe I'd regret that. But I do think Alshon's underrated. Just, you know, that little medical white and red plus sign

is going to be next to Alshon Jeffrey. When you took him, did you have any thought about him possibly making it back to you in round eight? Because that's what I would have thought about if I were you. I'm sure I did. I don't remember. With players like that, I'm always going to try and push to have them fall to me in the next round. Yeah, but I mean, when is the next

round? Then do I go, well, does he make it in round nine? Well, you picked pretty early in round eight, so I'm thinking he might have been able to make it back. The next round after round eight is round nine. No, he took him in round seven. I know you have trouble counting sometimes. I know. I'm pretty sure nine's after eight.

Oh, by the way, why didn't the cannibal eat the clown? He tasted funny. Yeah. Good job. I killed on a group text with that one yesterday. I think we're done here. I think that means we're done. We're not done.

We're not done. What? What do we have? Oh, what did I do we're done here. I think that means we're done. We're not done. We're not done. What? What do we have? What did I do? Oh, okay. Jamie has surprised me. He said that I have to publicly apologize to someone and he hasn't told me yet. So we'll find out

in a later episode. Don't forget to download the CBS app or go to cbs.com slash poker to watch the World Series of Poker. Dave, what do you got to say? Na, na, na, na, na, na, na, na. poker to watch the world series of poker dave what do you got to say