Fantasy Football Today - 2024 Rankings Disputes! (01/03 Fantasy Football Podcast)

Episode Date: January 3, 2024

To display your continued support of the show, please vote for Fantasy Football Today in the Sports Podcast Awards in the "Best Fantasy Betting and Gaming Podcast" Category https://www.sportspodcastgroup.com/sports_category/fantasy-betting-gaming-sports-podcast/ Fantasy Football Today is available for free on the Audacy app as well as Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Podcasts and wherever else you listen to podcasts We've got very interesting rankings disputes for 2024, but first we talk about a player we reluctantly or accidentally drafted that helped us win a Fantasy league (3:05) and we give you your news and notes (6:00) ... Rankings disputes beginning with Tank Dell vs. Nico Collins (9:45) and Bijan Robinson vs. Jahmyr Gibbs (15:55). We make cases for and against each player. Does Robinson get more touches than Gibbs next season? ... Aging #1 WRs vs. young #2 WRs (24:15) like Amari Cooper vs. Tee Higgins and Cooper Kupp vs. Puka Nacua. Then we debate Chris Olave vs. Mike Evans (28:40) and Deebo Samuel vs. Brandon Aiyuk (35:00) ... Your emails at [e-mail] SUBSCRIBE to FFT Dynasty on Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/fantasy-football-today-dynasty/id1696679179 SUBSCRIBE to FFT Dynasty on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/2aHlmMJw1m8FareKybdNfG?si=8487e2f9611b4438&nd=1 Follow our FFT team on Twitter: @FFToday, @AdamAizer, @JameyEisenberg, @daverichard, @heathcummingssr, @ctowerscbs Follow the brand new FFT TikTok account: https://www.tiktok.com/@fftoday Watch FFT on YouTube https://www.youtube.com/fantasyfootballtoday Get 20% off Fantasy Football Today merch: https://store.cbssports.com/collections/fantasy-football-today%20?utm_source=podcast-apple-com&utm_medium=web&utm_campaign=buy-our-merch&utm_content=fantasy-football-collection Join our Facebook group https://www.facebook.com/groups/FantasyFootballToday/ Sign up for the FFT newsletter https://www.cbssports.com/newsletter You can listen to Fantasy Football Today on your smart speakers! Simply say "Alexa, play the latest episode of the Fantasy Football Today podcast" or "Hey Google, play the latest episode of the Fantasy Football Today podcast." To hear more from the CBS Sports Podcast Network, visit https://www.cbssports.com/podcasts/ To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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No, I can't. It's time to dominate your fantasy league. This is going to go the distance. Now, here's some combination of Adam, Dave, Jamie, and Heath. Well, let's look ahead to some pretty fun ranking disputes that I anticipate we're going to be having for the next several months. Tank Dell versus Nico Collins. Brees Hall versus basically the field.

Bijan versus Gibbs. You know, we'll get into that. But Heath, I was looking at it yesterday. I cannot find one reason to go with Bijan over Gibbs. Yet that's how I ranked it. But I mean, everything on paper is Gibbs. Why did you rank it that way? I think he has a better chance to be a true feature back next season.

Whereas Montgomery's not going to. So that's one reason. I know, but there's no 2023 reason to rank Bijan over Gibbs in 2024. Better pedigree, higher draft pick. Barely, though. But still, those are reasons. I guess so. And I think the biggest reason, and i did not rank bijan over gibbs because i am not confident that arthur smith's no longer

going to be the coach but the the the argument will likely be in may is that well look bijan's offensive environment is so much better he's got a new new head coach. He's got a new play caller. He's got a new quarterback. Gibbs is in the exact same situation as he was last year. So Gibbs will be what he was last year, but B. John's going to pass him because of the improvements to his environment. You know, one of my bold predictions were not very good. I think Marquise Brown, top 10, Jerry Judy, top five,

something like that. But one of them was, I think one of them was Jameer Gibbs, number top five running back. Yeah, you got that one right one of them was, I think one of them was Jameer Gibbs, number top five running back. Yeah, you got that one right. He's six per game right now. So come on, we need a big finish. He's top five overall, right?

I doubt it. Didn't he? Let's see. Didn't he miss some time? Let's see. McCaffrey, Mostert, ETN, Brees Hall, Rashad White. He's eighth in PPR.

Oh, huh. Yeah, he missed two games. I thought maybe Kyron missed more time than he did, so he would move into the top post. Oh, Kyron did miss more time,

but Kyron is sixth. Kyron has scored how many more points per game? Kyron has scored almost five more points per game than Jameer Gibbs. That's insane.

Yeah. Yeah, he's the guy I. That's insane. Yeah. He's the guy I think we're going to have some serious fights about this offseason because somebody's going to rank him like he played this year, and then everybody else is going to have to argue against it. You know, the other thing is Gibbs was better than B.

Gibbs was just so good as a rusher. I mean, just incredible. All right, whatever. That's coming up a little bit later. Jamie should be here soon. Dave is sick. I finally got Dave sick. It took 18 weeks.

Here's our email of the day. It's from Eric. That's for Dave. What player either drafted by accident or reluctantly helped you win your league? For me, when I started my draft this year, I did not know I was on automatic draft. I had number three, and I took Tyreek Hill. I'm in the Super Bowl of my league because of him. Any accidental fortuitous draft picks?

I can't think of any accidental draft picks. And I reluctantly drafted Tony Pollard, but he didn't exactly help me win my league. So I don't know that I have a good answer to this question. I'm looking at the team that was the worst that won a championship. And it's a whole bunch of like waiver wire ads just got trey mcbride and zamir white and devon achan um so i don't i don't know i reluctantly drafted michael pitman i finally bit the bullet in one league like in the 90s or something and i just had no interest in michael pitman because i had no faith in anthony richardson uh mike evans mike i wish i didn't like mike evans and i i did end up drafting him in the uh in the saint jude

the 20 remember the i think it was 2022 you and i put saint jude leagues together that was my pitman league yep and i and i won that one so you did i had the two seed i did not win that one but i yeah i had a good team i had a good team team. Maybe Michael Pittman could help me in the semifinals there. All right. We have a lot of other podcasts for you, by the way. Heath's Dynasty podcast is a great time to get into Dynasty. If you haven't done a Dynasty League, do a startup Dynasty draft. They're super fun.

We had the Bake Burger League this year, which was a startup Dynasty draft. But, yeah. Next Tuesday, I've got John Bosch coming back on he's been on a couple times already since we started the show and we are going to do a so you want to start your first dynasty league podcast we're going to break down our favorite settings john actually has some advice it would be a wide range because our favorite settings may not be best for beginners so we're also going to have some some advice just for people starting dynasty who don't want to go completely crazy with it. Like some of us do. All right. Uh, but anyway, we have so many great podcasts. In addition to fantasy football dynasty,

we have cover three. If you want to get into college football right now, that's a pretty big game coming up the early edge, which is this daily sports line betting podcast, pick six for NFL, the first cut for golf, kicking it, morning footy, fantasy baseball today, attacking third, which is a women's soccer podcast, with the first pick, NFL draft podcast. That's a great one for you right now. Ion College basketball, in soccer we trust, your DFS podcast, morning combat, fantasy baseball today in five, fantasy football today in 5. I'm going to stop reading. We have so many podcasts. Please check them out.

All right, news and notes for Week 18. Noah Brown, the Colts play at the Houston Texans and the Colts. They play Saturday. They face off Saturday night. Noah Brown did not practice. Laramie Tunsell left tackle for the Texans. He did not practice. This is a must-win game here.

So hopefully CJ Stroud can at least have Tunsell. Be nice to have Brown as well. Zach Moss was listed as limited. Zavian Howard is not expected to play for the Dolphins in that big game against Buffalo. Jonathan Mingo is out for the season. Meanwhile, Sean McVay will be back next season. And right now they're talking in Arizona

like Kyler Murray is going to be their starting quarterback next season. You're buying that? I kind of expected when you asked that question that Thomas was going to flash up the Josh Rosen QB1 tweet. Remember that one before they drafted Kyler Murray? They had tweeted out that Josh Rosen was their QB1. I'm mostly by it. It seems really unlikely that both Justin Fields and Kyler Murray are going to hold onto their jobs. I would guess Fields is going somewhere else and Kyler's staying.

Wow, look at this. You talk about dedication, Iron Man. Iron Man, Dave Richard. How do I sound? You sound terrible. Dave, I don't understand. How do you show up to a podcast sick? Like that's just bad for the listener.

I know, it's crazy. Is it worse that he's on the podcast sick or at his desk sick? But I'm in an enclosed room. I'm away from everybody. How did you get there no one will catch this this season from me well season virus would you like to take part in our rankings disputes yeah as long as you guys don't mind my voice sounding like this if everybody thinks it sounds bad i'll leave you know what dave i do not care and just so everyone knows i decided this. I am

just throwing caution to the wind this week. I am just on a different mode. I am going to get today, Dave, my lunch that I told you about yesterday, my Sunday routine. Run it down, run it down. I'm getting it today. I'm getting a haircut, and then I'm going to the bagel place, and I'm getting cinnamon raisin bagel with ham, Swiss cheese, tomato. I forgot about tomato and Russian dressing. I am going throwback, throwback lunch today. So I don't care about your voice. I don't care about my health or my taste buds, whatever. YOLO. I just, I'm picturing you sitting on a park bench covered in your own hair, eating a disgusting sandwich, bagel sandwich.

All right. Did you lose a bet? No, this was my Sunday afternoon football Sunday sandwich that I would get every week. He's the only person on the planet. A cinnamon raisin bagel as the bread part of a ham sandwich? Ham and cheese, tomato, and Russian dressing. My word. I don't know what Russian dressing is,

but I'm going to assume it somehow ties all those things together, because otherwise that's awful. You've never had Russian dressing? No. It's great. It's ketchup and mayo based. It's really good. Are you sure you're not confusing that with thousand

island dressing that's what i thought too and i was like no it's not that but it is that it's no russian dressing is great it's like one of the best like on cold cuts or pastrami oh pastrami or corned beef with russian dressing elite elite okay first rankings dispute comes from shane ferris i asked everybody on twitter if you had some rankings disputes thank you for the responses i also got this conversation going in our facebook group you can join our facebook First rankings dispute comes from Shane Farris. I asked everybody on Twitter if you had some rankings disputes. Thank you for the responses. I also got this conversation going in our Facebook group. You can join our Facebook group. Just search for Fantasy Football Today on Facebook.

Shane Farris says Tank Dell versus Nico Collins. Who do you guys have? I haven't done my – are we talking about 2024? Well, we're not talking about next week. We're talking about 2024. I have not done my wide receiver rankings yet, but I would anticipate having Tank Dell ahead of Nico Collins. Try and make the case against it.

I can do it. And it required a lot of research last night because on paper, I mean, what was cool about this was let's just look at the games that they both played together and played basically their normal snap share. Fifty three targets for Tank Dell. Fifty two targets for Nico Collins. This is seven games.

So I took out the injured games. I took out week one when Tank Dell barely played seven games. They had the same amount of targets. Basically, Tank Dell had one more touchdown. Nico Collins had two more catches. Nico Collins had 41 more yards, I think. 39 more yards. So very even production.

One from a rookie. One from a third-year guy. So you're going to favor the rookie, typically. But there was one thing that I think is the case for Nico Collins. Maybe two things. One is red zone, green zone. Almost none of that for Tank Dell. His touchdowns were kind of like Jamar Chase as a rookie.

I mean, he's like super long. But you don't want that. Well, he had seven touchdowns. Four of them were from longer than 20 yards, whereas Nico Collins has been a short area, red zone, green zone, end zone target for kind of like a Mike Evans with some big playability as well.

And that's basically it. I don't know if that would matter at all, but you asked me to make a case. That's the case I would make, that maybe Tank Dell is a little bit too much big play dependent. Nico Collins can get you some more touchdowns because they're less fluky. That's the only case I would make, I guess.

Well, I think I'd argue with almost everything you said, but most of all, I would argue with Nico Collins being a Mike Evans type when he has 10 career touchdowns in 38 games and had three coming into this year. I specifically meant getting a lot of targets near the end zone and in the end zone from five yards, 10 yards out. That's, that's what Evans used to do all the time. But yeah, if Collins had done that before this year, I think I'd be more open to that. Um, and this is like, it's, I think these guys are more open to that. And this is like, it's, I think these guys are both going to be ranked very close. So I don't want to make it seem like I think that there's no argument for Nico Collins. I think there's,

there's a little bit of concern about tank Dell's health and size that just like there was when he came into the league, the fact that he got hurt and missed part of the year didn't clear that up. But I think when you have a rookie and a third-year wide receiver, and the third-year wide receiver had been almost completely irrelevant before this year, you have to go with the rookie. I agree 100%. The rookie also happens to be one of the fastest people in the league,

and that big play potential matters. And he's had synergy with the quarterback since day one. I expect the Texans to improve their offensive line. I expect the Texans to probably improve their run game too. And I think both those things are a double-edged sword for Tank Dell. But ultimately, when Dell was rolling in the middle of the year, he was their number one receiver. And it was a close number one between him and Nico, but I would imagine that Dell, as long as he's healthy, has the chance to be anywhere from

Tyler Lockett to Tyreek Hill. And I would want to chase that on draft day before the steady production, what I think will be steady production from Nico, but I like them both. I would draft them both as top 20 ish type of wide receivers next year. I think I had them both of my top 12. I was trying to do a top 12 and it was really, really hard to get like getting to the bottom of the top 12. Heath agree or disagree.

Sick Dave sounds like Jamie. LOL. No, I don't think he does disagree? Sick Dave sounds like Jamie, LOL. No, I don't think he does at all. He sounds a lot like Adam. Because Adam's always sick. Here's a cool stat on Nico Collins. Nico Collins, among all wide receivers with 40 or more catches, he was fourth in yak per catch.

6.6 yards after the catch per reception. And there were 59 receivers. We have another week to play, by the way. So right now he's fourth. Here are the wide receivers that rank ahead of him in yak per catch. Debo Samuel, Rishi Rice, and Demario Douglas. I mean, these are all really short areas. Wow, Demario Douglas. Really short area guys.

Nico's got a 10.7 yard ADOT, and he was still fourth in yak per catch. Very impressive. And again, this is one of those things. And I'm not an anti-Nico guy. I think Dave was telling me yesterday on FFT Dynasty that I had him too high in my current Dynasty rankings around wide receiver 20.

But this is also the first time he's done that and that one's not you realize there's something to do with quarterback yeah it's not entirely influenced by the quarterback like what you do after the ball has already been cut well i think i think offensive system helps there too right i mean it's coming from a system that creates a lot of yak out of san francisco i think you have to say much better coaching staff for all of their skill sets than what they have. Can we rule out that Houston is done with their receiving core and won't try and improve it this offseason? That's the biggest risk. I think what the risk is that they go draft a wide receiver in the first two rounds.

And then we're not arguing Nico versus Tank Dell in a which one is in the top 12, which one's in the top 15. We're like, which one of these guys is losing out? All right, let's go to our next one here. It's from Tony. Bijan versus Gibbs. All right, so Heath, you said you had Gibbs ahead? Yep. And I said I had Bijan.

And Dave, how about you? I've got Gibbs ahead. Adam, are you... think that like this could be a really short argument because if you're simply just saying you don't think Arthur Smith is going to be back then Dave and I might agree with you if if like I think there's a very good chance we get to April and they've got a good a better quarterback and a better offensive system, and I have Bijan ahead of Gibbs. I will make the case for Bijan even if Arthur Smith is back. I know none of us like Arthur Smith.

Well, I don't really mind. I don't dislike Arthur Smith. I know the fantasy community does not like Arthur Smith. And if Bijan Robinson fumbled the ball, then tried to pick it up, and then punted it out of his own end zone for a safety, everyone would blame Arthur Smith for it. It's like anything that B. John did wrong was always Arthur Smith's fault. But I would say that even if he were in a shared backfield, it would

have to be more weighted to B. John than it is now. But even if he were in a committee, Arthur Smith does produce some of the best running games in football. He I remember Todd Bowles talking about it, about how they have some of the best run schemes in the NFL. We always see his running backs do well. I think if you look at the last portion of the season, maybe the last five games or so with Bijan, he did claim the number one role. It wasn't as much and it wasn't enough as we need, but at the very least, one thing that was missing most of the year

that came later in the year, he was the goal line, the inside the five guy. So he didn't have that for most of the year. There's no doubt in my mind he'll get most of that next year. I just think that they can have a better year running the ball. They've had injuries on their offensive line.

I don't really like Arthur Smith for fantasy purposes, especially for the receivers, I just think that they can have a better year running the ball. They've had injuries on their offensive line. If they're, I don't really like Arthur Smith for fantasy purposes, especially for the receivers, but for the run game, he's pretty darn good. So I, I can make the case that, you know, that next year they unleash him a little bit.

He actually, I mean, I think he was on pace, uh, similar. His 17 game pace is 54 catches. Jameer Gibbs, 17 game pace is 63 catches. So he's still

a factor there. And yeah, and then there's still the David Montgomery factor. I think no matter what, he won't have as much competition in his backfield as Jameer Gibbs does. Famous last words, considering the coach in Atlanta. And if he

stays somehow, then I guarantee you he will have some competition for touches in Atlanta oh I didn't say that I said he won't have as much as Jameer Gibbs I think they're gonna both have a shared backfield to some degree but I think they'll be the lead guys in both of their backfields I've already done a little bit of a number crunch for both these backs you tell me what you think of this. There were 11 games this year where Bijan had at least 15 touches. In those games, he averaged 17.4 PPR points per game. His average on the season was 13.8. So that's a really good jump. And that's what tells me that if Bijan is the main guy in Atlanta, that's a pretty fair

expectation, maybe even a little bit higher than 17.4. Maybe you can get to 18 PPR points per game. When Gibbs played at least 50% of the snaps, this isn't just raw touches. This is just playing half the snaps or more for the Lions. Nine games, he averaged 19.1 PPR points per game, 15.1 in non-PPR. He was a factor there too. And on the season, he averaged 16.7 PPR points per game. That was what made me rationalize that Gibbs, both,

both of them have a good offensive line, but Gibbs has the better offensive line. And I know there's going to be an offensive play color change there. It doesn't bother me as much. Cause I think that there'll be all right. That makes me believe that Gibbs has more upside than Bijan. All right. Heath, you want to get a word in there and jamie is here we'll get his take on this no i was just trying to put in context the the competition difference and it looks like we're talking about two touches a game

at most like the difference between what David Montgomery and others have done versus what Tyler Algier and others have done. I, I think it's 250 touches to 225 or somewhere in that range. So they both, neither one of them is a full feature back unless they get a coaching change. But this is, this is what a full feature back looks like now,

Heath, like we're not going to find guys that regularly play 85, They'll get a coaching change. But this is what a full feature back looks like now, Heath. We're not going to find guys that regularly play 85%, 90% of the snaps that often anymore. No, but I think... Right, but there's still a lot of guys getting more touches than Jameer Gibbs. Sure. I don't know about a lot.

How many do you think? 12? Okay, maybe. a lot. How many do you think? Twelve? Okay. Maybe. I'll get Jamie in in a second here, but one stat, if Bijan's going to be better than Gibbs, here's the stat that has to change. The Falcons have eight running back rushing touchdowns

this year. The Lions have 22. And that's so much of what this is. I mean, Dave gave those fantasy points per game with those sample sizes. How much of that is touchdowns? I'm sure it's a lot. Jamie, Gibbs or Bijan? Today, Gibbs.

Black Monday, Bijan. All right. Bijan's going to be so much better next year when they have a head coach. Not so much better than Gibbs, but he's going to be so much better. The version that we'll see will be the version that you hoped to see this year

because the head coach will change everything about how bad this Falcons team has been run. How about this thought Ben Johnson? Yeah, no, that's a hundred percent. A hundred percent is it would be fantastic because all those, all those rushing touchdowns would, would be there. Um, at least you hope, i i i think the the difference you you're talking about difference in talent between the backups is dramatic david montgomery is a much better running back than tyler alger not take anything away from algeria but david montgomery's a better running back so the the usage will will change for both these guys i'm sorry we'll change for bijan it is interesting to think about Ben Johnson because

do we think that Ben Johnson then would want B. John Robinson to be a featureback or would B. John be in the Gibbs role or would B. John be in the Montgomery role? I think B. John would be in the B. John role, which is what you want. I think you would just have a better offense in theory. Yes. You have a better...

First off, you've got to get a better quarterback, too. That's the thing. we crap on Arthur Smith. They're 7-9. They don't have a good team, I don't think. I mean, they have a bad quarterback. So, I don't know. Most teams are not 7-9 with a bad quarterback. I don't know.

I don't know that he's as bad as everyone makes him out to be. He's misused three elite players. I don't really think he's misused Bijan all that much. I think where he really misused him was they should have used him more near the goal line. And earlier in the season. And not waited until his job was basically being threatened.

I guess, but have they misused Pitts in London? They just don't throw the ball that much. Pitts dramatically. Well, Pitts was hurt also and might still be dealing with the injury that he had last year I don't want to be the most unpopular person in fantasy

by defending Arthur Smith nobody likes that so we're going to take a break and come back with some more rankings disputes for 2024 on Fantasy Football today. Take back your free time with PC Express Online grocery delivery and pickup. Score in-store promos, PC Optimum points, and more free time.

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Be alert, be aware and stay safe. Okay. Our next tweeter is Evan Pohl, who wants us to rank aging number one wide receivers versus young number two wide receivers. And Heath, is there one example where you are going to take the aging number one receiver? So it's Amari Cooper versus T. Higgins and Devante Smith,

Hopkins and Ridley versus Zay Flowers and JSN, and Cup versus Puka. So I'm going to take Puka over Cup. I'm going to take Devontae over Cooper. T. Higgins, let's see who he's playing for before I make a decision on him. Just look behind you. Yeah, I doubt that the Bengals allow that to happen.

I think as much as they don't want to pay T. Higgins, they'd rather pay T. Higgins. They don't have a choice. They don't have a choice. He's a free agent. Well, they can franchise him. Franchise. That'd be the dumbest thing ever if they franchise him.

Why? Because it would just kill their salary cap. Well, yeah. I mean, yeah. But guys get franchised. He's gone. He's gone. He's absolutely gone.

Unless he signs some very team-friendly deal. I don't think he's going to do that, probably. Who was the other one? The middle one was the one that was interesting, Adam. It was Hopkins and Ridley. I mean, I don't think Hopkins is going to get a lot of love, but Ridley maybe versus Zay Flowers and JSN. Where's Ridley playing?

Right. And who's playing with JSN? I think I'm pretty confident I'll have Zay Flowers over those guys. And if Lockett's gone, then I'll have JSN over those guys. But if it's still DK and Lockett and JSN, I'm probably going to still have JSN behind them. What do you guys think, Dave? Any of those scenarios? I'm going to put the young hotness over old talent.

In every single case that's here. Yeah, man. Marty Cooper is giving me some kind of Mike Evans vibes here. In just the games that weren't Dorian Thompson-Robinson games, he's averaging almost 18 points per game. He's averaging as many points per game as Puka Nakua is this season. Of course, I would have to take out the Brett Rippon game. So he's not been as good, but he's basically been a number one wide receiver when anyone but Dorian Thompson Robinson.

And that's three other quarterbacks, by the way, have been playing. And he was very good last year. It wasn't great. It was very good last year. So Cooper, I understand getting away from Hopkins. I understand, you know, being pretty down on Ridley. And Cup is, you know, Cup will go ahead of Cooper, but not ahead of Pukunuku, I assume.

But Cooper's been, we got to give him some due here. Good for him. And he might be pretty underrated next year. He is every year. I mean, since he was a Raider. Yeah, but again, the one that I struggle with more is not the old guys. It's JSN. Like the idea that

he does. I don't think he has a 70 yard game this season. I just don't know. I don't know why. It'd be nice if Tyler Lockett would go away, but if Lockett's still there, just a complete flip the situation on its head when Lockett has 40 more targets and 37 more catches.

It's not been close between those two. I mean, Lockett has more targets and catches than Metcalf. Which is the case every year. Yeah. I mean, I'd be surprised if Lockett, if he's back, has the exact same role. Right. Maybe not the exact same, but it takes a big change for JSN to become someone that you can use in fantasy. It's not like he's a 2% change in target share or a slight shift towards him.

It takes a monster change in what they've done for him to be fantasy relevant. Okay. Yeah, Metcalf... Lockett's played one more game than Metcalf. He has 12 more catches

on five more targets, but Metcalf is averaging 6.3 more yards per catch. Not a great year for Lockett, so you'd hope... You'd hope he'd start losing some of those targets, right? Well, I mean, really, it's not been a great year for Lockett, so you'd hope he'd start losing some of those targets, right? Well, I mean, really, it's not been a great year for almost everything

in Seattle, given how they started and how they're finishing. Pete Carroll was saying yesterday about how the, or Monday, how the run game has just been struggling, which I think we could all see. You wonder what's going to change.

They did have a new coordinator this year. And we know Pete Carroll has certainly been, you know, apt to change these guys. Yeah. All right. Next one is from Scott Cobe. Chris Olave versus Mike Evans. Olave.

Yeah, that's an easy one for me. Certainly going to rank it that way. And probably feel stupid about not drafting enough. Mike Evans, once again, it's just, you can still do both.

You can rank a lot of ahead of Evans is still drafting. Hold on. Where's Mike Evans playing. See, he, I could see get franchised because of what he's been to that team. And, you know,

especially if they win the division, they're, they're sort of in one of these. You got to wonder, will they run it back? Right. You are not allowed to say it's okay for the Bucs to franchise Mike Evans, but not for the Bengals to franchise T Higgins. The Bengals just paid their quarterback. The Bengals have a franchise wide receiver on their team that the,

the Bucs, this might be their best offensive player ever. What I'm looking at right now, the Bengals have the sixth most cap space in the NFL. And the franchise tag is for one year. Yeah, like if it's dumb for the Bengals, then it's dumb for the Bucs. They've been talking about it in Cincinnati all season long. I think the more important thing is the Bucs are not letting Mike Evans go. I don't think T. Higgins is back at Cincinnati next year at all. I think he's back, but

I think he's back for one year. I don't think the Bucs are letting Mike Evans go. Yeah. Agree. The thing with T. Higgins is, remember when they said there were trade rumors and their GM said get your own wide receiver or something. We look so dumb now.

Because they were a Super Bowl contender. Well, they're a Super Bowl contender next year. But now they have to pay him. All right. Well, yeah, they have to pay him. But that's the point of the franchise tag is that you can delay that for a year. They're going to kick the can down the road,

and then when they have to pay Chase, they're going to say goodbye to T. Higgins. They have to pay Chase now. They could pay Chase now, but they don't have to pay Chase now. I don't think you want both your franchise wide receivers mad at you. You're going to make somebody besides Burrow happy. They got to do business as they need to do it.

And they've got a franchise quarterback that they've already committed a lot of money to. They are. And maybe they'll just continue, but they're a franchise very much like the chargers that the, the ownership in the front office has not gotten out of the way enough and not paid enough. If they do that again with this situation,

they... What do you think the franchise tag is? $20 million for a receiver? Something like that? It will go up. They have almost $70 million in cap space. And a defense that they still have to rebuild. An offensive line they still have to fix.

They'll be fine. With that much cap space, they can defense that they still have to rebuild, and an offensive line they still have to fix. They'll be fine. With that much cap space, they can franchise T. Higgins. And T. Higgins will be on a different team. Alright, I mean, maybe, but they can franchise him. They absolutely can't. Of course they can't.

You cannot do the Mike Evans means so much to the franchise. It's okay for them to franchise him, but it's not okay for the Bengals to franchise him. The situations are totally different. Mike Evans, I'm sure, would love to finish his career as a Hall of Famer with the Bucs. T. Higgins is looking to get a mega deal right now.

The Bengals are not doing that. He can look for whatever he wants. They're going to franchise tag him and not give him the mega. They could. That absolutely could happen. not give him the money. They could. That absolutely could happen. You're 100% right. It could happen. There's not an NFL person that I've spoken to that said that that will happen. There's spoken to two.

You have no idea who I speak to. Jamie, there's a very different situation. Very different situation. The Bengals have $20 million more in cap space than the Bucs. I mean, like, all right, let's go to our next one here. I think the loser of the T. Higgins bet should have to eat Adam's bagel. I didn't make any bet.

I'm just saying it's like there's a double standard. I don't know why it's so dumb for the Bengals but not for the Bucs. One guy has been with his team for 10 seasons. I'm sure would welcome finishing his career there. The other guy is on the way to getting his first huge deal, and it's not going to come from this team. Plus, if he leaves, he could be the alpha, which me, an NFL player, doesn't want to do that.

As opposed to staying there, getting a franchise tag, and having to play as the second guy. Right, but here's the thing that you're not remembering. It's not his choice. All of this is out of the receiver's control. Right, that's right. Unless he makes us think, oh, by the way, what happened to Tyreek Hill and Devontae Adams and Stephon Diggs and how many more guys?

So what's he going to do? He's going to sit out the year? No, he's not going to sit out the year, but he may force his way out like all these other guys have. Yeah, well, Barkley and Jacobs tried that, right? I mean, they both threatened. They have some positions. Nobody wanted them.

They would have had a market if they had hit free agency. They both threatened to not play, especially Jacobs. They got franchised, and they played. I mean, it just, I know Higgins doesn't want to get franchised. I'm just saying it's not necessarily his choice. And the Bengals... Is the argument that Higgins is going to get traded, Jamie? Is that what you're saying? If he is

not going to be let go or get a huge contract extension, I would imagine he's going to try and force their hand way out with a trade. Yes, I mean, for sure. All right. All right. Let's see what we got.

We got Debo versus Ayuk is our next debate. Actually, commercial break is our next debate. So we'll be right back with Debo versus Ayuk after this. Fall is almost gone. But have you sipped enough Starbucks fall faves? Enough of the pumpkin spice latte, the cinnamony pumpkin-flavored legend, or the new iced apple

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Conditions apply. Okay, Debo versus Ayuk. Here we go. This is from Andy Rosenberg. Dave, who do you got, Debo or Ayuk? I think I'm going to lean toward Debo just because of his usage and utilization in that offense. But I really love both.

This is another situation where I would imagine Ayuk is going to get the franchise tag from the 49ers, and he's going to have to play on that unless he makes a stink and forces his way out, which is always now going to be the asterisk that we put with any of these receivers. But I think Debo is the one that I'd rather have. Heath? Yeah. I mean, I go back and forth on these guys.

The answer to who I'm going to draft is which one's going later. But I would lean towards Debo. I think and it's just like what the stuff they do with him and the little bit extra that he gets in the running game is enough of a tiebreaker. And Iuke,

that target crunch with all four seems to impact Iuke just a little bit more, I think. Because Debo can do a little something bit more, I think because Debo can do a little something on the ground. Jamie, Debo or Ayuk? Slightly toward Debo, but

I think the thing that, and I hate saying this, if McCaffrey starts to deal with injuries, Debo becomes that much more valuable. Entering his 28-year-old season, who knows if that happens. But both, I think, are going to end up being probably decent value picks. We saw Deebo, I think, get overdrafted this year,

and I think we'll see a little bit of market correction, maybe around, not by much, but maybe around, depending on how the playoffs go. Ayuk was definitely underdrafted, and I think we'll see that get corrected too where he goes a little bit higher. 6.7 touches per game for Deebo, 4.8 for Iuke. You know that Iuke literally all came on receptions. Debo had 36 carries.

And fantasy PPR points per game, really close between the two. 17 for Debo, 16.3 for Iuke. Iuke played one more game than Debo. Oh, yeah, but... But that's just an Acer stat. My Acer stat is the heck out of this one. Okay? Okay.

Let's take away the injured games. Let's take away the decoy Samuel game. Remember, he came into a game hurt. Didn't get a single target. I got nine games where they both played 68% or more of the snaps and not including the Decoy Samuel game. They had the same amount of targets in those nine games.

Brandon Ayuk had 48 catches. Debo had 42. Ayuk had a lot more yards, 829 to 649. They both had six touchdowns, but Debo had the 22 carries, 128 yards, and three touchdowns rushing. So I think you got to go Debo here. We'll see. We'll see who gets –

Did they crack your top 12, guys? Are they top 12 receivers? I haven't done my top 12 yet. That's my next job after this show, but probably not. I'm going to try not to have them in my top 12, but top 15, one of them should make it in there. Yeah, I got Debo as

number 11 per game in PPR. Iuke at number 14. And that's two out of three with Debo. So, kind of hard. That ain't bad. And last year, they were basically the same on a per game basis as well right like 13.5

and 13 fantasy points so it's three and I don't know how much that third year three years ago probably we just shouldn't hold against IUC but yeah take the one that goes later they have to pay out you too

by next year so we'll see what they do. Franchise. All the wide receivers are going to be franchise tag this year. We could laugh about it. We could laugh. It's okay. All right, Mickey Walker. Last debate here.

Joe Flacco versus Patrick Mahomes next year. That's a good one. It's close. Depends on where Flacco is playing. Maybe he's backing up Mahomes next year. It's a good one. It's close. Depends on where Flacco's playing. Maybe he's backing up Mo. Maybe. But he doesn't have to do that until November, basically. He could just stay at home, sit on

the couch, no training camp. Also, I think I can no longer look at per-game quarterback standings and be like, well, if you remove Joe Flacco, because he's just in there now. He's played five games. He's just in.

My rule is you've got to play half the season, nine games. Okay. He might get, what, three more? Yeah, maybe. That's it, four. What if Flacco goes to Atlanta? That'd be fun. Don't you think he's going to end up with a team like Washington or New England where they take a quarterback

in round one and he's the bridge for the first four weeks of the year? I think he's probably going to just hang out and not go to training camp and wait until somebody says, we're going to start you the rest of the year, and then he'll come play. He's not going to go sit on somebody's bench and have to go to practice and stuff. Then he won't make as much money.

Look at this graphic. I mean, look at this graphic. It's amazing. 2023 season, Joe Flacco averaging 25.4 points per game, six points per touchdown. That's amazing. Mahomes averaging 20.9. And so four and a half more points per game for Flacco.

He's averaging 323 passing yards per game. And he has 13 touchdowns compared to 27 for Mahomes, and he's played five games. That's incredible. All right, I got a few emails I'd like to read from the audience. Fantasyfootball at cbsi.com. Now is a great time to send in your emails. Maybe not for the Thursday and Friday shows,

but going forward, certainly we'll have more time to read emails. Fantasyfootball at c CBSi.com. That's the letter I. Jason from a city west of West Des Moines. St. Paul, Minnesota. It's actually Waukee, Iowa. Wait, Minnesota's north of Iowa. That's terrible.

I'm going to do some research on that one. I was thinking Omaha. Yeah, that's terrible. Okay. 12-team league has a mandatory side bet in week 18. The teams are split into two groups based on final standings who play each for one draft dollar in next year's salary cap auction. So each manager either gains or loses $1.

You have to field a team of one quarterback, two running backs, two wide receivers, and a tight end. And you have to pick one player from each team. It's a little confusing, but he gives us this list here. And it's four point for passing touchdown and it's half PPR. So he gives us a list of six teams and three players per team. And you have to make your lineup from those teams. And I'm just doing this now and realizing this was one of the worst emails to have read on the internet. I think it's the worst.

Way too much information. I think it's the worst email you've ever chosen. Way too much information. Also, St. Paul is east of West Des Moines. Okay, I'm not going to answer this on the air. I'm sorry, Jason. I'll try to answer you in the inbox. Man, Jason was so excited. He had his piece of paper out already.

He was going to mark things up, and nope. He told his friends, he's like, you've got to listen to the podcast today. They've got to read my question. Alright, it's my fault, not yours. From Gio. Where's Gio from? St. Paul, Minnesota. Alright, I wanted to let you know that I took home a championship this year based off of your best

friend strategy. It's actually the friendship strategy. I drafted both Ayuk and Debo and I had Devante Smith as well. Let's see. So yeah, he's saying I wouldn't recommend the friendship strategy for teams or quarterbacks with the

next man up mentality, but I would do it again with Debo Ayuk, with Goddard and Devante Smith. That's a pretty good one. Gibbs and Montgomery, to name a few off the top of my head. We haven't talked about it. I don't think we talked about the friendship strategy at all this year. Yeah, but I think in the case of the 49ers guys, they're both usually productive throughout the course of the season fairly consistently. The Eagles guys would be awful.

Yeah, I agree. I think as the way Adam described it, literally zero of those examples fit the friendship strategy. It's true. It's usually one early, one late. Late? It doesn't have to be super late.

I think Devante Smith dallas goddard probably did and how did that work though no you won't want him to be a bench player who benefits if the starter goes down you don't want to be starting dallas goddard when davante smith's active no that the friendship strategy is to draft two starters who have value, but if one of them gets hurt, the other becomes a star. So the original example was Cooper and Crabtree back in their Raiders days. Yeah, I think this year could have been Ridley and Kirk. Yes.

That could have worked out in a big way to some extent. It would have fizzled late because Kirk got hurt and Ridley's been so up and down. But that's the point. Ridley had a couple of big games, though, once Kirk went down. He did. Up and down. The 49ers, I think, is the flip side of that,

where you're taking those two relatively early, and you could have confidence in starting both. I would put maybe Evans and Godwin in that category of guys that you could have taken in the first, let's say six rounds. And it worked out starting both of them. The Debo Evans, the Debo,

Iuke, excuse me, combo worked out amazing. There were 10 games this year where one of them had at least 20 PPR points. I forget where Iuke was. And then the other one, like some of the games, they were pretty bad,

but like still some with like anywhere from 10 to 18 PPR points. Ayuk was like round six. Ayuk was like round five, round six. Debo was a couple of rounds earlier. Cup and Puka would have been probably the best, right? If you had lived in a world where Puka was drafted. All right. And here's a Dynasty question from Adam in New York City. Our four-year-old Dynasty League is at a crossroads

where some managers are disgruntled by the lack of QB and other depth available to them. It is a 12-team super flex league with deep benches, and some teams will carry five to six quarterbacks, while others struggle to start a second quarterback at times. What are your takes on practice squads or making unused players available to be claimed? Is there an ideal league setup that you find works well?

Go ahead, Heath. You should make, there's a function called trades. And if you turn that on, then the people who don't have the players that they want can offer trades to get those players. I've never played in a league like that. So I have played in one league with positional limits this year and I hated it. So I hate it. Yeah.

I don't like it. I have a league like that. I also, I think finishing last place and maybe that's why I hated it. But yeah, I don't like positional limits. The practice squad thing, I am tempted to just move away from that

because it's so hard to enforce and it causes me to have to check people's rosters so often to make sure that they have the people who are eligible for a practice squad spot in that spot. Was I supposed to do that? Was I supposed to be checking people's rosters? No, you were busy setting people's lineups. Thank you.

It's one thing off my plate. I liked this dynasty. Whenever I bring it up, I think people, they don't think it's a good idea, but we had contracts. We had one-year, three-year, and five-year contracts

that you had to sign people to. There was also a franchise tag so you could keep people. Love contract leagues. That's one of my favorite leagues. But then you would have – This was the one that you took over? This was the one that ended and became Bake Burger. Then you would have a draft, a free agent draft,

and you would have some stars in there. I mean, like one year I got Stefan Diggs. Right. So, there were never 12 stars. There were usually something like 7 or 8. But it was good for parity, that's for sure. That was also not a super flex league. But is the goal, again,

is the goal parity or is the goal to reward the best fantasy managers? You want every league to be competitive throughout. You got to have a balance for sure. All right. I think I'm going to call it a day and go get my bagel

and go get my haircut. Probably haircut first. You're right, Dave. I don't want to get hair in the bagel. Can you go get the sandwich and then eat it while you're getting the haircut? What a disgusting thought that is.

Oh, yeah, that's the disgusting part. That is the gross part of it. It makes it worse, but the whole thing is nauseating. All right, everybody. We'll talk to you tomorrow with Starter Sip for the AMC Hold Games on Fantasy Football.