Fantasy Football Today - Jacob Gibbs's Favorite Values! Rookies Galore! (05/05 Fantasy Football Podcast)

Episode Date: May 5, 2025

Jacob Gibbs joins our show today with players he is higher on than consensus and this list includes a lot of rookies, but we'll start with Jauan Jennings (3:10) and a look at what the 49ers receiving numbers could look like this season. Then we've got some news and notes and Jacob tells us why RJ Harvey and Kaleb Johnson (11:15) are great fits in Denver and Pittsburgh, respectively ... Let's talk about the Colts wide receivers (27:05)! Jacob makes the case for Josh Downs and Michael Pittman. And we compare those guys to Khalil Shakir (34:10) and Darnell Mooney (42:55). Did Shakir hit his ceiling in 2024, or is there more to come? ... Jacob is also campaigning for a trio of tight ends (44:00), but specifically Colston Loveland. What kind of upside does he see for Loveland in this Ben Johnson offense? ... Email us at [e-mail] Fantasy Football Today is available for free on the Audacy app as well as Apple Podcasts, Spotify and wherever else you listen to podcasts Watch FFT on YouTube⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://www.youtube.com/fantasyfootballtoday⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Shop our store: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠shop.cbssports.com/fantasy⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠  SUBSCRIBE to FFT Express on Apple: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/fantasy-football-today-express/id1528634304⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Follow FFT Express on Spotify: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://open.spotify.com/show/6qyGWfETSBFaciPrtvoWCC?si=6529cbee20634da8⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ SUBSCRIBE to FFT Dynasty on Apple: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/fantasy-football-today-dynasty/id1696679179⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ FOLLOW FFT Dynasty on Spotify: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://open.spotify.com/show/2aHlmMJw1m8FareKybdNfG?si=8487e2f9611b4438&nd=1⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ SUBSCRIBE to FFT DFS on Apple: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/fantasy-football-today-dfs/id1579415837⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ FOLLOW FFT DFS on Spotify: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://open.spotify.com/show/5zU7pBvGK3KPhfb69Q1hNr?si=1c5030a3b1a64be2⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Follow our FFT team on Twitter:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ @FFToday⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠,⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ @AdamAizer⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠,⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ @JameyEisenberg⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠,⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ @daverichard⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠,⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ @heathcummingssr⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Follow the brand new FFT TikTok account: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.tiktok.com/@fftoday⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Join our Facebook group⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://www.facebook.com/groups/FantasyFootballToday/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Sign up for the FFT newsletter⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://www.cbssports.com/newsletter⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ You can listen to Fantasy Football Today on your smart speakers! Simply say "Alexa, play the latest episode of the Fantasy Football Today podcast" or "Hey Google, play the latest episode of the Fantasy Football Today podcast." Visit the ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠betting arena on CBSSports.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ for all the latest ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠sportsbook reviews⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠sportsbook To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

The following was recorded from inside an ice plunge Okay, all right When a core's life is cold enough the mountains on the can turn blue So the next time you want to cold loggered cold filtered cold package Core's light just wait until those glorious mountains on the can turn blue. Woo, it's easy to say that fast when you're freezing gold. The Battle of Ontario's on, and FanDuel's your home for live betting the series, with features like live SGPs, build-a-parlay any game any period, or stack multiple matchups

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It's time to dominate your fantasy league. Off to the races and he stays on his feet. This is gonna go the distance. Now here's some combination of Adam, Dave, Jamie and Heath. What's up everybody? Welcome to the show. Monday, May 5th, Tico de Mayo. And we have Jacob De Welcome to the show. Monday, May 5th, Tegone and Mayo. And we have Jacob DeGibbs on the show. Coming in, he loves the rookies. Jacob, you love rookies this year. What's going on, man?

Yeah, man. This class is so fun. Not much going on. I was telling them beforehand, I'm living the Midwest dream here. I've been going to Royals games like crazy. I'm going tomorrow to see that Thunder Nuggets playoff game. And then next week I'm going to a Timberwolves playoff game in Minneapolis. So yeah, it's been a great time. That's pretty cool. That's great stuff.

Now, okay, I want everybody's favorite Cinco de Mayo Mexican restaurant order. You're going to a restaurant tonight for the holiday. What are you getting? Chimichanga, easy. Keep it Midwest. Are you like chicken, pork? What are we doing?

Yeah, I'll go chicken. Chicken, chimichanga, okay. Jamie, give me your order. I'm simple, I just go tacos. And chicken? Depends, you know, like you go to the place where they have like, you get three for 10 bucks or something like that.

I'll go different ones, steakak, chicken and ground beef. Dave? I like getting the Fiesta combo platter at La Bamba in South Florida. That's a nice ground beef burrito with a chicken enchilada. Nice side of fried beans and rice. You know, it pretty much fills me up. Good, good, good amount of food there. Okay, like that. All right. And I'll get a chicken burrito with probably no beans.

Okay. Are we good with mild guac for the table? Sure. I love it. Is it made table side? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

But I can't do medium. It's too much for me. It just smiled. So, okay. Thanks guys. All right. So listen, I, we have a list of players that Jacob is higher on than Consensus. And I wanted, and a lot of them are rookies,

but I wanted to start with Jawan Jennings and talk about the San Francisco wide receivers. Last 10 games of the year, after Brandon Iuk's injury, Jawan Jennings was on pace for 145 targets. 98 catches, only 1079 yards and six touchdowns. There were a couple of games. He got ejected in the week 18 game when he was playing without Brock Purdy. Remember they had that game against Buffalo where they were barely able to throw. It was like an ice game. They barely able to throw. But he crushed it in terms of targets. So you like Joann Jennings, like he was on pace for 145 targets after the IU injury. George Kittle was on pace for 104 targets in his

eight healthy games. Debo Samuel was on pace for about 100 targets. Ricky Pearsall, not that much. But anyway, let's start with that because for me, and I think for a lot of people, Jennings versus Pearsall is tricky. And yeah, what do you think about the 49ers pass catchers? Why are you high on Joann Jennings? Jennings, it's mostly the per route data that he put up was just like, it's beyond anything Pearsall did.

And it is, I mean, he averaged more yards per hour than CD Lamb last year. He was top 10 among receivers with 300 or more routes run. And so that's the easy starting point. I think that he proved himself to be really, really dependable. Whereas Pearsall showed some encouraging signs at the end of the year and could cut into this. We might not see this type of efficiency again from him, but we have seen it.

And the Niners really didn't do anything to add in terms of pass catching. So I when I'm making projections, he is the top target on the team. And I think he's just there aren't very many people being drafted around him that you can say that for that they're in a good offense, they probably are going to be the top target on the team. And Jamie, you have Piersol and Jennings pretty close. Are they back to back? One player in between. Okay. And where do you come out on this?

I agree. I think he could lead the team in targets. The thing that'll kind of sway this for me will be IUK's health. So if there is, Jacob nailed it. They didn't do very much. They did draft two receivers, but I don't think they're gonna be impacting both Jennings or Pearsall right away.

I do think that if Ayuk is healthy, it just throws a wrench into everything that I don't want to see. I'd like to see Ayuk maybe take his time to get back at 100%, let the other two guys get off to hopefully a hot start, and then maybe build off of it. But I think what Jennings showed last year was certainly a step in the right direction. I think based on the moves that they've made this offseason, letting one of their premier players go, again, not bringing in any significant competition. I do think Pearsall, what he did the last two games is something that hopefully will be a jumping off point for him because clearly everything was thrown out of whack for him

once he got the gunshot situation, missing the first half of the season, lost everything that he was hopefully building toward to be a contributor, and then finally got an opportunity and contributed. So, to Jacob's point, we'll see how much Pierce all cuts into Jennings. Obviously, Kittle is still a significant factor. They do have McCaffrey back that has to be taken into account. Clearly they didn't have him for the majority of the season. We know how much he makes a difference for that offense. So there's a lot of things at play here. Hopefully the offensive line is better than it was a year ago. Missing Trent Williams for all that time

and then everything else around him was bad. So I think everything goes up for San Francisco. At least that's the hope. And Jennings could easily be their number one receivers. I don't wanna get too excited about him, but he is my favorite of the 49ers receivers right now. Dave Heath in our in our draft last week, he took both guys. He took Jawan Jennings in round seven and Ricky Piersol in round eight. What do you think about that?

I like it. I think I think there's obviously a chance that Piersol emerges because I think he's the more explosive of the two. But you can't argue with the targets and you can't argue with what Jennings has brought to the team. I mean, before he was even a target earner, he was a good run blocker, played a decent amount of time. Like he's been with this 49ers squad for a while. They rewarded him with a nice contract. I just don't know how explosive he is.

I like that he's a size winner and I like that he's a red zone target getter. He had 15 red zone targets last year that led the 49ers 10 end zone targets And again, there are some receivers they didn't play the whole year So he's the one that basically did so it makes sense for him to lead those types of Targets, but he blew everybody else away, especially in end zone targets You know, I think that's I imagine he going to be the guy that is the second read. Sometimes first read kid will be the first read. Sometimes second read.

I think that I have no problem taking Joann Jennings first. That's the trust that he has with, with a party. And I think like you bring up the red zone and all that, like he's just a dog. That's what he does. I actually think are you being back would help things because it would allow him to move back to the slot. I was amazed that he was able to win because you bring up that he's not as explosive as some of these other guys that you can pierce all.

He was able to win when they had to put him in that IU curl. He continued to be successful, which was really, really surprising because that doesn't seem like it's a skill set, but it was just like, you would just go down, post guys up and they would throw jump balls to him and he would just win it over and over, get yacked. But yeah, if you look at his splits when he was in the slot, he drew targets at a much higher rate, and his yard per round run rate was higher too. So I think if Ayuka's back and healthy, then it's like you really have all the chess pieces here for this to be a really good offense. Sponsor

Sotiris I think if, yeah, there's a concern, it's McCaffrey and what that means, them. Because if you look at two years ago, now granted two years ago, they were last in the NFL in pass attempts. Last year they were 22nd. The last four years, they've been 29th, 26th, 32nd, and 22nd in pass attempts. So it was pretty high last year for San Francisco.

But two years ago when McCaffrey was healthy, he had 83 targets, Deebo had 89 targets, Kittle had 90 targets and Iuke had 105 targets. All four of those guys played 15 to 16 games. So you can give them a little bit of a bump for 17 games, but we're not even looking at a 120 target guy here. And we've got, you know, we've got four guys. We've got McCaffrey. In theory, we have McCaffrey, Kittle, Jennings, Pearsall and Iuke at some point. So we do have to consider that.

I guess we can talk about that when we get some more information about Brandon Iuke and when he'll be back. And for the meantime, we will move on because there are a lot of names on Jacob's list that deserve some talk. All right, now speaking of talk, tomorrow we've got a live chat.

Oh yeah, kind of a new feature here. Live chat at 2 30 p.m. Eastern on our website. Go to well, I'll put you know what? Let me see if I can find out exactly where to send people. But obviously I'll tweet it. You can follow me at Adam Azer, A-I-Z-E-R, or just go to cbsports.com slash fantasy. I imagine you'll be able to find it there. But 2 30 p.m. Eastern, our first live chat of the season, and I'm hosting it. So we're saving the worst for first.

And, you know, well, the other guys will rotate in as well, but I will be the first guy. I'll be the guinea pig, see how the live chat goes. But I want your questions, 2.30 PM Eastern. Again, I'll tweet out information about how to find it, but I figured, just go to the website, cbsports.com slash fantasy at 2.30 PM Eastern. Again, I'll tweet out information about how to find it, but I figured just go to the website, cbsports.com slash fantasy at 2.30. We're gonna be doing a mock draft at one o'clock.

So we'll be able to react to that and I'll be answering your questions. Some news and notes. Sean McVeigh said he hopes Matthew Stafford plays for the Rams for a couple more years. Tankdale is likely to miss the entire season according to Jonathan Alexander of the Houston Chronicle and the Browns restructured Jerome Ford's contract.

So it looks like they're going to keep him on the team a little bit cheaper and that's probably not going to, probably means they're not gonna bring back Nick Chubb. Correct. And that's it for the news and notes. All right, so before we go to break, let's squeeze in a rookie here. Squeeze in two rookies, two rookie running backs.

Jacob, you're higher on than Consensus. RJ Harvey for Denver and Caleb Johnson for Pittsburgh. Now, I, sorry. Did you say before the draft that Pittsburgh would not be a good fit for Caleb Johnson because of the scheme or the exact opposite? Yeah, I was like, basically he needs to go to Pittsburgh or maybe Dallas, maybe Chicago. There were really only a few spots that specialize in outside zone.

And more than maybe any prospect that I've valued at running back over the last three years, he comes in as a clear skill set that needs to fit into that type of running scheme. But yeah, of course, Arthur Smith signed me up for that. This is Derrick Henry Light. I think it's gonna be really, really cool. Yeah, Harvey was the first name I was gonna bring up because I see Adam Mazer draft Harvey

in every draft I'm in with him. And I'm here for it, I am here for it. I'm really excited. I think Sean Payton has a clear vision for him, and that's of course evidence in the draft capital. But I just did, in the FFT newsletter, I did a breakdown of run scheme data and looking at which play callers are adaptive and how they use their backfields. Some guys are very rigid.

They're running outside zone or they're not. They're running man gap. They're running the same kind of thing. Whereas like Liam Cohen, who's now with the Jags, was with Bucky Irving last year with the Bucks, mixes it up a lot back with his backfield. One back is better at man gap. One back is better at zone running or whatever. So he's a little bit more adaptive and Sean Payton is definitely that way.

Givante Williams, Audra Guestamay and Tyler Beatty all had man gap rates that were above 35%. Whereas Jaleel McLachlan's was only 7%. 64% of McLachlan's total runs were outside zone runs, which is like one of the highest rates in the entire NFL. It would be if you had enough runs to qualify, it could be the highest. The rest of the back foot had a 19% rate for reference. So Peyton clearly will will pick and choose his spots. And Harvey, we're hoping will be more than just a bit roll like McLaughlin.

So probably won't be quite as pronounced, but I just think it speaks to like how clear and ingenuitive like he is with the way that he uses these running backs. And Harvey is really, really good at outside zone runs, which I think makes sense when you watch him. He is really good at like poking and prodding the line and finding the spot. And then he has the burst.

His timed speed on the 10 yard split and the 40 yard dash at the combine was faster than any running back in this draft class. So when it comes to just pure acceleration, even ahead of Bichel Tooten, who was let just shot out of a cannon, Harvey was the fastest. And I think that he's just like a perfect fit for this. I think all of the excitement around him makes total sense. Yeah, we mentioned that with Harvey that he likes to sort of, he's very patient, sets up his blocks and, you know,

waits behind the line of scrimmage, which I mentioned. He's the kind of guy, like I said, I wanted to see him go to, I want everyone to go to a team with a good offensive line, but him in particular, because he really uses offensive line and the Broncos do have one of the better offensive lines. And according to Jacob, it's a good scheme fit. So that's encouraging stuff. Anything to add Dave or Jamie? No, I think we're all kind of excited about how this is going to go.

The fun part will be is how high does his draft capital Go, you know because as we continue to hype him up and you know, obviously other places are gonna hype him up You know, does he get to a point where? The expectations are either justified or a little bit out of control, you know, so right now it's like, okay We're taking him. I think what would you draft him around five? Yeah, pretty sure like to me That's a great spot for him. Like I'm afraid he can get into like the round three range, you know, and then we're just like, okay, here we go. It's a little bit too out of control, but you know what?

Is it though? Is it though? No, that's what I was gonna say. Like, you know, we're drafting Gentian round one and he's easily in the conversation to be the second best running back for this season for redraft. It wouldn't surprise me, you know, if we get into,

you know, especially half PPR or non PPR You know he gets into that range but in full PPR Is he gonna go ahead of some of those receivers that are probably a little better a little safer? That'll be the the talking points I think that will start to come into play with Harvey, but he should be the best running back in Denver by far He's gonna again compete to be the second best rookie running back behind Gentie I think right now I have him just behind Hampton, but in that same conversation So they're they're right there, you know I think round four is where him just behind Hampton, but in that same conversation. So they're, they're right there.

You know, I think round four is where I would be okay with like reaching for him. If you want to put the word reach on it, uh, around five to me is a sweet spot. Think about some veteran running backs that are going to go in that same range. Jamie mentioned around four, and I think I'm comfortable with him in round four at this point too, but it's Aaron Jones, it's David Montgomery, Isaiah Pacheco, James Connor. Who's gonna be in the round four, settle for RB2s? How do you measure- You're taking those guys in round four,

you're making a huge mistake. Oh, you think those guys are too soon in round four? Oh, by far. I wouldn't take those guys till round six. I mean, I'll tell you where they went in- You're not gonna get those guys. I'll tell you where they went. Yeah, I don't want those guys.

Someone's gonna take them in round four or five. Yeah, if you're taking Aaron Jones James Connor went for please play with me. James Connor went in, went at the last pick of round four and then Montgomery went the first pick of round five. Aaron Jones went in round seven. Yeah, David Montgomery. So Montgomery and Connor did go at the four or five turn. Yeah, no, I think Harvey versus the other rookies is gonna be the tough call. Hampton and Henderson and Judkins,

I think he'll go ahead to Johnson. I actually have Johnson only like eight spots behind him. I think he's really interesting. I think a lot of the reasons we're excited for Harvey are reasons to be excited for him. He doesn't have quite as much receiving upside, but I could see him getting more total touches than him. I could see him getting more total touches than anybody

except Jayne T among the rookies. Okay, let's get back to that in a moment here. We've got to take our first break on fantasy football today. We'll pick it up with our thoughts on Caleb Johnson, going to the Pittsburgh Steelers. And in our most recent draft, he was a mid round six pick about a full round behind RJ Harvey. And we'll be right back to talk Caleb Johnson after this.

All right, Jacob, so Caleb Johnson of the Steelers, you like this fit. Does it bother you that he had a pretty disappointing 40 time? I mean, not like bad, but four or five, seven, and he had the worst 10 yard split among running backs at the combine. Yeah, he's the opposite of Harvey. It takes him a second to get up to that top speed, but once he's going, he's really flying and you see that on his film, he's running away from people all the time in the big 10, um, I don't, I'm not, no, I think, I think it's going to

be fine, but he does, he is going to get stuffed, like he has one of the highest stuffed rates in, um, among these rookies. Um, and that is going to be a problem occasionally, like on these outside zone runs, he's going to get nothing. Um, but I think what we saw at Iowa, and I think will kind of be the case here in Pittsburgh, is that he's just sort of inevitable. He's just going to eventually break you

with one of these big plays that happened like against Nebraska, where like they shut him down the whole game and then he just made two back-breaking plays at the end of the game. And I think he has the size and speed once he's going and the skill set to do that. At the pro level, I really liked that his avoid attack array, which is often cited as a weakness, way up on these outside zone runs. I think that when he's going, he's really good at just like

shifting gears subtly, little side to side movements that make people miss. Whereas like when he's trying to navigate traffic and stuff, he's just that's not really his game. I think he'll be a really good compliment with Jalen Warren, who's really strong up the middle and they like him on those runs. And then the last thing is they every everything I hear from Pittsburgh, they talk about how he can handle all of these touches. And like these these post draft pressers. That's exactly what he was at Iowa. He had 40% of their scrimmage yards, which for reference, that's the second highest out of running backs drafted over the past five years

behind only Ashton Genti. Um, and he had 58% of their scrimmage touchdowns, which is the highest of any running back drafted over the past five years. So like truly the engine of an offense and one of the only running backs that was in a pro level running game in terms of like running under center and all the things that I would did.

So I think it'll be a, just like as seamless and natural of a transition as you can get. And I think he really just might get loaded up with volume in a unique way. I think Jacob just gave him his nickname. What's that? He's Thanos. He said he's inevitable.

Pretty, pretty good. I sort of get that, you know, not, you know, I'm the only one who liked the movie dark matter. So, um, and I didn't really, what was the one that everyone loved? Uh, the Thor movie that everyone loved. All of them? No, the one with Jeff Goldblum. Oh, God.

I didn't really like that one that much. It was like, it wasn't my favorite. It was a little annoying. Ragnarok. Yeah, it was a little annoying. You're terrible. I know, I know. Let's get back to some veterans here.

Just with Caleb John's real quick, and you brought this up, I think it's interesting in terms of the touchdowns, like their quarterback situation could be awful. And that scares the hell out of me when you have Jalen Warren there too. So like, if they, I mean, look, I think we're all expecting Rodgers to end up there,

which hopefully will be the case, because he's, I think even at this point, still an upgrade over Mason Rudolph, but like they may not score very much. Like, you know, for, and if he's going to be, we know the history of Mike Tomlin. Like when he has a guy, he leans on a guy. You know what I mean? As bad as Najee was at times over the last four years, he still leads them, you know, 250, 260 plus carries. I think that's easy to say for Caleb Johnson.

But if he's not going to get passing downs work, and both the guys they have behind are really good pass protectors in Jalen Warren and even Kenneth Gainwell. So if he's losing passing downs work, obvious passing downs work, and if they're in some down distance situations, like you said, in college it's easy to still rely on the run game when you're trailing, especially the way Iowa plays.

Will Pittsburgh be able to do that? And that's my concern with him. So like, I like the upside. I think certainly he's going to be a 200 plus carry guy as a rookie. I think that's easy to say. But if he's not getting passing down the work and if the touchdowns aren't there, I think we're looking at a trap back. So I hope the offense gets to the point where he could be productive and get to, I don't know, I don't know how many touchdowns you think is relevant for him to be, you know, a weekly a weekly starter if he's not getting passing down work. But like, to me, it's got to be probably in the eight plus

range, you know, and he's not getting to that number. Like we're talking about a very frustrating, nausea Harris type flex, which could be somewhat annoying, because the upside is certainly there the fit everything you said is 100% accurate. But like my concern is just like the ecosystem around him right now seems like it could be pretty bad. Totally fair. That's where I'm at with Judkens too. Like I see them really similarly that way. Yeah. To me, I have them back to back. Like they're the two that long term, very excited about because you can see the path to success and a lot of upside. This season, though, like it could be a little terrifying.

I actually feel a little bit better about Judkins situation right now, again, because the quarterback situation as scary as Joe Flacco may be. I feel like he'll do some some positive things in our office. At least that's the hope. So but they're both sharing, they're both going to be limited in the passing game. And, you know, again, I think it's touchdown related to help their upset. So if they sign Aaron Rodgers tomorrow, you're going to move Caleb Johnson ahead of Quintin John Judkins?

Um, potentially right now they're 25, 26 for me. No Dave. No, I've got it ranked as if Aaron Rodgers is the quarterback. All right. They're 25, 26 for me too. There's a couple of things that I like about the situation for Johnson. Number one, uh, the Steelers had 45 plays inside the five last year that was tied for 10th.

So pretty good. Not as good as Cincinnati 75, but still pretty good. His floor is what Najee did last year. And that's not anything to write home about, but at least, you know, that that's kind of the range of worst case scenario for, for Caleb Johnson. The other thing that stands out to me, and this is what I want to run past Jacob in his press conference, talking about Caleb Johnson, Arthur Smith mentioned the word explosive nine times.

And they, that's how he views Caleb Johnson, nine times supremely explosive running back. And so I went back and looked and he had a 15% explosive rate. Yeah. It's third best among the top running back prospects. Steelers were eighth lowest and explosive run rate last year. This is clearly an area that they wanted to get better in. This is who they've decided gives them the best shot at being explosive, at least among the running backs that were available to them in round three.

I see Caleb Johnson as a strong runner, physical runner. He's got some explosive runs under his belt. I don't know if I view him as a truly explosive running back though, Jacob, do you? He's really weird in this way. Like I've had a hard time with Caleb where I initially just did not like his film very much, but I've like really tried to come around on him.

It's mostly a stylistic hangup, I think, cause he's a lot different than like the RJ Harvey guys where they're clearly explosive. They make people miss, they create yards on their own. I do think he is fully capable of creating explosive plays, which we saw at the collegiate level. And I think it's because he's so smooth when he's moving, he's like gliding on that horizontal plane

and then transitioning to the vertical plane. At like picking and choosing his spots and then shifting and transitioning his movement to like explode through and get to that top speed. And once he's on that top speed he can make people miss or just run through people. So like yes but it's just not the typical type of explosion that I'm used to, you know? Of all the, so I looked at Gentie, Hampton, Caleb Johnson, Henderson, Judkins, Dylan Sampson, Scadaboo, R.J. Harvey, Giddens,

Brichard Smith, Taj Brooks, Bejel Tutin. That's 12 running backs. He had pretty much by far the highest percentage of carries for 20 or more yards, Caleb Johnson in that group, 8.8%. Second was DJ Giddens at 8.3%. Third was RJ Harvey, 7.7%. If you're curious, Genthe was 6.7%. Percentage of carries, I went for 20 or more yards.

Caleb Johnson, 8.8%. Unfortunately, he also had the highest percentage of runs for zero or negative yards at 21.3% and no one was even, oh, actually I'm sorry, Bashell Tooten was worse, 21.9%. Harvey was 21. Or Caleb Johnson was 21.3%. Those two guys really stood out.

They stunk in that area. That's not a profile I love, but it is good and bad. It's the Ken Walker profile, but not as fast. Okay, let's go to some veterans now. I want to talk about the Colts wide receivers. You're higher on Josh Downs and Michael Pittman. I don't even consider drafting them. I mean, nobody does, but they could fall, right? Like I remember I was listening to

Heath's dynasty show last week. He had Adam Pfeiffer on and Adam said something like, you could not like a guy and still draft them if you think the value is right. So that's a great point. Well said. But like, come on, they just drafted Tyler Warren. They've got two quarterbacks who do not produce passing statistics here. Why are you higher than on Josh Downs and Michael Pittman in consensus?

Josh Downs is awesome. I think he's like one of the top 20 or so receivers in the league, which is crazy to say, but it's backed up by a lot of data points. And then when you watch him, his short area quickness is unlike almost anyone in the NFL. Like he's so good at just making one guy miss and shaking open. The Anthony Richardson is a concern, of course. And if it's him, then like that will probably affect downs more than anyone else, I think, in terms of being dependable on those short yardage looks. But I really like Steichen.

And I really liked when Steichen was able to scheme things where he was using Richardson's legs. They did that a few times and it worked well. And then they would get away from it. I don't know if those worry about injuries or what, but I would think if Richardson gets the job, they're coming out and they're doing that right off the bat because now they have a backup plan they feel good about. If Richardson gets hurt, then it's like, okay, this is your last shot.

This is just conjecture. I think they have the pieces where if they base the offense around Taylor and Richardson's legs, and then they also have Stike and scheming stuff to downs, scheming stuff to, to the tight end position to Warren, I think it could work. And then when it comes to Pittman, all I all that he needs is to be healthy and to have a competent offensive environment. I think people have just forgotten how good Michael Pittman is. And so that's with him, it's just like, it's just a price based thing.

Where he's at, he's basically free and I'll take a shot on that because we know that this guy is good. They both went around 11 in our draft. Josh Downs, three receiver PPR draft. Josh Downs, first pick of round 11, Michael Pittman, second to last pick of round 11. They actually went after Anthony Richardson

and Tyler Warren and of course Jonathan Taylor. Jamie, what do you think about round 11 for Downs and Pittman? I think Jacob said it best, they're free. You know, so look, Richardson's spending time with Josh Allen's quarterback guy. Daniel Jones could be an upgraded Anthony Richardson and we know that he's had some good moments with his receivers

Just not great moments with his receivers. So where you're getting these guys, it's not bad investments But again, you know, you just have to keep your expectations in check Are they gonna be weekly starters for you if Richardson continues to rely mostly on his legs and doesn't have a better completion percentage? Well, obviously not we saw what that was like last year, you know, they were certainly better the two receivers when Joe Flacco was a starter so Obviously not. We saw what that was like last year. They were certainly better, the two receivers, when Joe Flacco was a starter. There's a lot at play here with the Colts that we still have to sort of see how it plays out. Does Richardson look better and perform better?

Because he could look better in camp, and that won't really mean anything until the bullets are live. And then he gets out there and he continues to struggle and turns the ball over and runs too much and doesn't help his pass catchers. And then as you brought up, obviously Adam is the addition of Tyler Warren and how much does that change things for just those two guys in general from a target share perspective? Because clearly they're not going to throw the ball very much with Richardson and probably not with Daniel Jones because why would you go out and sign Daniel Jones if you're going

to keep the offense somewhat on the same sort of structure and plan? So I think again, if you just take these guys with the understanding of they may be players that you drop at some point, you know, when something else comes about or you have an injury or need to replace them, then that's fine. If you're taking them as I'm hoping they're going to be starters for me, then it becomes probably an issue. But round 11, you know, when you're talking about,

and again, I think these are fair comps, you know, what does a Buca maybe become? You know, he's going to be in that range. What does Luther Burden become? He's going to be somebody in that range. Matthew Gold in potential, the rookie receivers that have a lot of upside or some other veterans that we're going to see in this range as well. It's just who you're comparing them to.

Anytime you get into double dessert rounds for a 1 or a 1A receiver that still has plenty of upside and potential, those aren't bad dart throws to see what they become on your fantasy team, especially early in the season. Looking at the other receivers who went in round 11, there's only one guy for me that is an easy call that I would take over the Indianapolis guys. And he is the one that I actually did take. And he's also on Jacob's list of players he's hired on the consensus. And that's Darnell Mooney. But the other guys were Luther Burden, Kion Coleman, and Jalen McMillan. And then Cedric Tillman was the first pick of the next

round. And then Marquise Brown, Keenan Allen. So Dave, I said some names there. Keon Coleman, Jalen McMillan, Luther Burden, Darnell Mooney, Cedric Tillman, Marquise Brown, Keenan Allen, compared to the Colts wide receivers, do you see anyone that's clearly better? I see Keon Coleman as a receiver that has more upside, just simply by being theoretically the number one perimeter receiver for Buffalo taking a year two jump. I'd rather take a chance on that dart versus Pittman who we've seen for years and doesn't really excite. Like he gets good numbers, but I don't think he's necessarily exciting. And, and Downs is exciting. He averaged more PBR points per game than Pittman.

And it's still not enough to make me feel like I've got to get out of my draft with Josh Downs. And part of it is that Tyler Warren is there. And I fully expect Tyler Warren to have a significant role in this offense. And he's catching a lot of short area throws, which is what Downs did. And he's going to fight for extra yardage, which is what Pittman is supposed to do. So I think that he, I think the rookie tight end is going to take a lot away from Pittman and Downs. And it makes me a little bit nervous to have high expectations for them.

That being said, it's round 11. These guys average seven targets per game last year downs a little bit more. So if you're taking them as bench wide receivers, they're good to go. I'd rather take a chance on Coleman, hoping that he does take that year to jump. He gets the seven targets per game. He gets a ton of end zone targets from Josh Allen. And he ends up being, I don't think it'll be the best wide receiver in Buffalo,

but I think he'll be a lot closer to Khalil Shakir than where he was this year. Okay, well, you mentioned Khalil Shakir and I mentioned Darnell Mooney, and these are two other veterans who are on Jacob's list of players that he's higher on than consensus. And Mooney went in this range, round 11,

with the Colts wide receivers, whereas Shakir went in round eight to Dave Richard. How about that? And Mooney and Shakir, so how about this? They averaged the same amount of fantasy points per game last year. Right around the same. You know, you can calculate it differently, whatever,

but about 12, a little bit more than 12 fantasy points per game, that's Khalil Shakir and Darnell Mooney. I've got them a little bit more than 12 fantasy points per game. That's Khalil Shakir and Darn El Mooney I've got them at 12.2 PPR fantasy points per game per FF today And that that's about wide receiver 36 per game There are two round. There's a two round difference there. I Like the value then that of Mooney if that's the case, but how do you do? Do you like better Jacob Shakir or? We're Mooney and yeah, just tell us about why you're higher on them. Shakir by a pretty wide margin.

And still I never seem to get him in our drafts because Dave, he's the RJ Harvey with Adam where it's like, I love this guy, I swear, but I never get him. Really, really bullish signs from Khalil Shakir. So for starters, he averaged over two yards per hour on last year, which is really, really good.

That was above, you know, Jackson Smith and Jigba. That was above Amon Rasayn Brown and Jameson Williams. That was above CD Lamb. Like I was really, okay, no, I was like, this is from the slot. I'm like, that can't be right. That's not above CD Lamb. Sorry. Khalil Shakir was really good on a per hour basis.

He was above Devante Smith, Jameson Williams, T Higgins at 2.16. Okay, so he was above 2. And then they didn't bring in anybody this off season. I thought for sure that those were going to add something, but they really didn't. And so I think we're running it back with Shakir as the primary target. And that's what he was last year. And he, we've just seen slowly throughout his career, Shakir work his way into a more prominent role.

Early on, he was just like insane per target efficiency, where he's catching almost everything, creating yards on his own after the catch. But they weren't ever throwing him the ball. And they drafted him late. And they always seem to try to bring in Curtis Samuels to try to take his spot. And so I'm like, I guess maybe it's never gonna happen but I swear when I watch this guy is really good.

Last year we see his target run rate rise all the way to 26%. And so that's like nearing like, you know, number one receiver in the offense, like running the offense through this guy, designing targets for him, letting him just be the guy. Um, and that, that to me, like, is pretty unique when you look at the range of guys that he's being drafted around. So I have him above Chris Alaba.

I have him above Jordan Addison. I know. Yeah. I like these guys. You're making a mistake, sir. You're making a mistake. I don't know, man. Like I don't want to touch that Saints offense. I guess you could say

Addison probably has more upside and Williams probably has more upside. But when it comes, the guys that like I think have a floor, a real floor, and then also have the ceiling because of the offense they play in Shakir is pretty unique. There's not many guys like that. So I don't know if this will change. It could easily change, but he only had eight red zone, two green zone, three end zone targets last year. He's not a guy that Josh Allen looks for a lot in that area of the field.

He's really, Kalil Shakir is great after the catch. I mean, you could look at his A-dot and Rashid Rice's A-dot, his A-dot, his Yak and Rashid Rice's Yak. It's the same thing. They're both really good after the catch. They're both reliable short area targets. Khalil Shakir catches everything. I really like him.

I just feel like, I mean, he is what he is. I obviously, you know, I'll let the Dave and Jamie comment, but I don't see a high ceiling for Khalil Shakir. And I also, like Josh Allen had a pretty telling comment about the goal of the offense is to spread the ball around and not really feature anyone. And that's a little scary for me. And I think, you know, I think Coleman and Kincaid have more upside than Shakir. To me, I just feel like Shakir kind of is what he is, even though I just compared him to Rashid Rice. I don't know. I just have

a hard time believing he's that kind of player. I cannot even consider drafting him over Chris Olave. But all right, Dave, Jamie, what do you think? Tell me after this quick commercial break. That's a teaser. We'll be right back after this on Fantasy Football Today. Okolee dokolee, we are back. Dave, am I selling Khalil Shakir short? Dave Korsunsky I think my favorite part about Khalil Shakir is that we're drafting him nowhere close to the ceiling, very, very close to right about where he was last year, maybe a little bit higher. And there's room for improvement.

His route rate last year was 66%. In the playoffs, it jumped to 77%. The additions they made this off season in Buffalo, it's Josh Palmer. It's Elijah Moore. That's it. I don't think those guys are going to push Shakir off the field that much. And so all I'm really hoping for was Shakir is more playing time because he catches everything.

He's their slot guy. Josh Allen's always leaned on the slot receiver. That's been the case ever since he started to throw better, but we know who his top target is and we're getting him in round seven. But do you think that I think it's absolutely worth the round seven price. Oh, Lave though versus Shakir.

So as of now, I'm going to say a lot of it because I think he's got a little bit higher upside. But it's really easy to make the case against Chris a lot of a little bit higher upside, but it's real easy to make the case against Chris Olave, given the quarterback situation, change of offense. I would think it would be better with Kellen Moore in New Orleans, but who knows for sure. It could get ugly and Chris Olave has got a much higher injury risk than Khalil Shakir has.

Jimmy, you want to comment here? I just don't, I mean, look, Shakira was, I love him. I mean, he, you know, he was one of my guys last year and I, I, I would be happy drafting him again. I just, like we showed the graphics, 6.7 PPR points per game. Like, I don't know where the ceiling is for him. That's the problem from a- That's not what he had.

Well, that's what they got. I'm just saying with the grapher. You know, he was, he was much higher. No, he did not have 6.7. 12.2. Um, like where, where's the ceiling with him? And I think we saw it. You know, that's that's my concern. Yeah, I mean, I think the case would be he can score more touchdowns, but not if they don't throw to him there. But that's that's part of it, though,

like Dave was just making the case for Keon Coleman, and they're bringing in a couple other guys that to me, they're just guys, you know, I don't think anybody's better than Khalil Shakir in terms of Josh Palmer and Elijah Moore. But we also have, you know, Don K just guys. I don't think anybody's better than Khalil Shakir in terms of Josh Palmer and Elijah Moore. But we also have, you know, Dalton Kincaid's, I would hope is going to be better, you know, based on everything that they've been saying this off-season about, how he's playing through two knee injuries and the expectations for him, what they were last year, and just the way that this offense is structured.

Like it's still, James Cook's going to get his numbers in the red zone from a touchdown perspective. Like, I just don't, I think Shakira is what he is Like he's a really good number three fantasy receiver someone you want to have on your team I just don't know if he's a starter in a two receiver league and Non PPR half PPR like where's the upside there? So I love him. I just don't know if he's gonna get much better than this That's the problem. He could play more like Dave pointed out. His route rate was above 80 percent in five of the final seven games. So he did like even last year they weren't designing stuff to

him at the beginning of the year. And then as the year went on, like they're like, OK, like this is the guy and maybe that changes. Maybe he takes a larger role. But I think if you're looking for upside, that's where it comes. Like better luck on touchdown variants. I mean, the touchdowns all came on the ground last year, but that could change. Like I could see Josh Allen throwing for 40 touchdowns any given year. Yeah. And Josh Allen threw four fewer passes per game last year than he did in 2023. And that's not even counting week 18, where he played one snap. You just look at the first 17 weeks of the season, 30 past attempts per game the year before that 34 past attempts per game. The year before that, 34 past attempts per game.

Now they had Stefan Diggs, but if they get back to throwing the ball a little bit more then okay, there's more potential for everyone in that receiving core. Yeah, go ahead. I've got an obscure Darnal Mooney stat for you. So this is yards per target, yards per target if only including on target throws.

Last year, Jamar Chase is at 13.1 and we're just gonna go up from the Jamar Chase line.ar chase is at 13.1. And we're just going to go up from the Jamar chase line. Zay flowers, 13.2. I think he's really underrated this year. Justin Jefferson and lad McConkey 13.5. Brian Thomas Jr. 14.6. Darnell Mooney 15.5. My, the only guys above him were AJ Brown and Jameson Williams. So that's on target throws, how many yards per target did they average? He led the entire NFL in yards per target on catchable throws versus man coverage. And I think if you watched our own on the news film last year, he was separating down the field a lot. But the QB play at the beginning

of the year was suspect. And it got better with Pinnix and even Pinnix like still was missing him sometimes, you know, I think there's going to be some, um, a bit of a learning curve with him, but like, I think it could be better than what we saw last year. Um, but when he was, when he was in, like the offense was, was humming and I think it will again this year, they've got the pieces to do it. They've got the offensive line. Um, I feel good about the coaching and they didn't add anything in terms of pass catcher. So I think we're just going to see it be like Drake London

is the clear alpha and then Darnold Mooney getting 24% of the targets or something like that and being pretty efficient with them. Hopefully you've got players you're higher on the consensus. That's the theme today. Two tight ends. Oh, three tight ends. All right. Let's do them all. Colston Loveland for the bears, Jake Ferguson for the Cowboys, Terrence Ferguson for the Rams. How do you rank them for 2025? So that's Loveland, Ferguson, Jake Ferguson and Terrence Ferguson. Loveland's in a tier of his own with these guys. I pushing Loveland so high man, like I got him to the point where I'm

basically taking him over San La Porta for dynasty and it wouldn't surprise me if he by the end of his rookie season is like producing at or near the elite tight end level. I don't know what his like numbers of the full season will be like, but I think by the end of the year, he'll probably be putting up top three, top five tight end type of numbers per game.

It's a perfect storm. Like, did you guys see the post draft or like or like when, when they made the pic, how excited Ben Johnson was on that call with them? That was so cool to me. He's like, he's like first pick as a head coach, man, like, you know, I, I know exactly what, what I got in you. Like, I'm so excited for this. Like, this is going to be a problem for people.

And I really think it is the offense has so many pieces, um, that defenses have to worry about. Um, and I think Johnson is just like the perfect guy to make it all come together. And Loveland is just that perfect chess piece. And that's the way they've talked about him too. He's not like a Dalton Kincaid or something like that where you have to work around their weaknesses as a blocker. I think he's really a good blocker and somebody that you can play in line or you can move around and just design different looks to him, kind of like they did with Laporta. But I think he's a better blocker than Laporta even.

And so if that's the role, if that's intact, if he can grow into a role where he's running around on 80% of the drawbacks or something like that by the end of the year, I think he's going to be really efficient with his looks and potentially somebody who can get a lot of targets and that is a projection that you have to just Take a leap of faith on because there are a lot of mouths to feed there But I think it's reasonable to do that And so that's based off of some of his collegiate data that is unlike anything we've seen at the Titan position He had a higher per route target rate last year

than any Titan ever has. It only came on about 200 routes. So take it with a grain of salt. But we saw that number just continually rising throughout his career and he's really young. So the fact that he was even on the field drawing targets at such a high rate for a good offense at that age is impressive.

But then last year he took it to a whole new level. He was the whole offense. People are like, why wasn't the production good? That Michigan offense was as bad as it got. And I watched so many college football games. It was the worst when he was out. The offense averaged 56 passing yards per game in games that Loveland didn't play. Like it was all him and defenses knew that.

And still with terrible QB play, he averaged over three yards per hour round, which is a truly elite number for a wide receiver, let alone a tight end. And so there are, there are plenty of reasons to believe that Loveland is the unique type of receiving talent that would war in a top 10 pick and then to see Ben Johnson come in and make that kind of a conviction pick on him. to see Ben Johnson come in and make that kind of a conviction pick on him when Ben Johnson has been the schemer responsible for the most fruitful fantasy offensive environment of the past three to five years.

I don't know if you can rank him too high, honestly. If you're just looking for upside it tied in, I get that you're not going to put him ahead of Bowers or McBride or guys that you know what the role is, but like that's what makes a difference is a tight end. And I think he's clearly the answer outside of the obvious guys for how you get there. It's pretty interesting. Just, again, I mean, I will give this stat. Basically every single top five tight end at the end of the year, not per game.

Basically every single one, I think I'm going back seven, eight years of data, is first or second on his team and targets. And I don't see that with Colson Loveland. So that's just- He could be second. I'd absolutely think he's good. If he is second, then that is a bad sign for Romo Dunze.

Obviously there could be injuries. It's obviously a bad sign for Romo Dunze. Everything they did this draft was bad for Romo Dunze. Obviously there could be injuries. It's obviously a bad sign for Romo Dunze. Everything they did this draft was bad for Romo Dunze. Yeah, but also you have like Ben Johnson talking about how great he thinks Romo Dunze is, right? I mean, we saw that quote. So I don't know. I mean, it would have to be a big step back for,

not even a step back, just like nothing going forward for Romo Dunze if Colson Loveland is gonna come in and out target him. I think the offense is going to be predicated on getting the ball out quickly. That's something that Johnson has really emphasized. And I think that that like really comes into play for Loveland. I think that's going to be like the bread and butter the offense is like those type of quick looks. And beyond him, it'll probably be more or burden depending on what happens with more of this off season and where everybody's heads at going into the year.

But yeah, it's probably not Odunze. I think Odunze will play an important real life role. And if Caleb improves on his D passing, could be good for fantasy. But yeah, I'm actually kind of low on him for that reason. It's interesting because, you know, the Dolphins get the ball out quicker than any team. And that's not just last year.

That's just like in the two era basically and we've seen Jaylen Waddle have a great year obviously Tyree Hill we've seen deep ball throws so I don't know I don't know what to make of that like they're gonna get the ball out of their hands quickly it doesn't mean that they can't have any downfield passing game. I see this is the only thing I push back on I don't think it's get the ball out of his hands quickly. I think it's quicker. Oh yeah. First for Caleb. Because like it's, it's not, you know, three step drop and throw. It's still going to be, you know, an offense that's, you know, based on timing and, and Ben Johnson system, but it's clearly getting Caleb Williams to understand you can't play hero ball and hold the ball.

So to Jacob's point, Odunze's role is huge. You have to have a field stretcher. You have to have some speed on the outside. You have to have somebody who's going to get three or four shots a game and hopefully come down with them. Like Odunze is going to be a great best ball receiver. He's going to be one of these guys you want because he's going to win you some weeks, but there's just going to be a target crunch for him that I think is a problem.

Whereas Loveland and Burden and hopefully still Moore, which is I think the, I don't know if Burden is more exciting than O'Dunze, but he certainly has the potential to be. But like with what Loveland now brings to the offense, what DJ Moore still does. I mean, we saw what DJ Moore last year, you know, I mean, we saw when the coaching change happened, how many times was it just, where does ADOT drop to? I mean, for the year it was 7.5, but there were games where he had like a negative ADOT

to DJ Moore, you know, or very close. That was, they recognized, we gotta get the ball out of his hands quicker. You know, it's not necessarily like, don't, I just don't want people to think it's gonna be Miami. You know, where it's, you know, Tua's got one read because they're afraid he's gonna be Miami, you know, where it's you know, two has got one read Because they're afraid he's gonna get hit like that's not the case with Chicago and a terrible offensive line in Miami

Whereas Chicago should have a very good one we think Okay, so it let me so that was that was Colston Loveland Jake Ferguson in seven games with Dak Prescott was actually on pace for 126 targets he did not do much with them and he did not catch a touchdown. But I could argue, Dave, he's one of the more underrated winners of the NFL draft, Jake Ferguson, a potentially, I would say the favorite to be second on the team in targets. Would you agree? Yeah. And that's what he was in 2023. And last year was just a crappy year for the Cowboys offense in general. And I don't think it's right to judge Jake Ferguson based on that.

And so you're, you're good. This is another guy that's a double digit round pick definitely has upside to be a usable fantasy tight end. But I, I don't think you can expect them to be much higher than where he was in 2023. It's a little more than 10 PPR points per game. So if you're going great or late, you missed on the great. Here's a tight end to take late. I know what Jamie's smiling about over there.

We got to put this comment up. Adam likes dirty dancing, but not Thor Ragnarok. Terrible. Just terrible. LOL. Yeah. And I also call it dark matter. It's like dark world or something like that. Um, yeah, that's what you were. I had no idea what you're

referring to. Yeah. The other, there were three Thor movies, right? Or are there four now? There's four. There's four. Yeah. I didn't see the fourth one. Um, yeah. There's like a lot of music and dancing. It's fun. Okay. I heard it was terrible. No. All right. Okay. I heard it was pretty bad. All right, Jacob. So let's do, let's do your thoughts on Terrence Ferguson for the Rams and then we'll just pick maybe one or then we'll talk.

We'll finish it with Drake May. I'm sorry. I knew we weren't going to have time to get to everybody here, but we'll Drake May, Kyle Williams duo there, but give me your thoughts on Rams, tight end Terrence Ferguson. I'm really curious to hear David Jamie, your thoughts on how this will shake out with the Rams with Terrence Ferguson, how much playing time he might be able to get his rookie and then Jarkquist Hunter, how much playing time he might be able to get his rookie. Basically, I'm really into these guys because I liked them. I like their profiles. I like their film and they have some

encouraging data points. And then the Ram's offense is just one that I want to place bets on every year, especially cheap. I think that Sean McVeigh has just shown maybe more than anybody an ability to like produce these kind of, these out of nowhere, like league winners, you know? And that's partially due to his like willingness to just kind of change things up, you know, like on a whim seemingly.

And then also the offense is just good, consistently is good. And I think he's really good at finding exploitable edges and mismatches, you know, and I think that that could be like Ferguson's role here. I really liked Ferguson as an athlete because Elijah Roy didn't test first ended up having the best testing of any of the tight ends. He really has impressive buildup speed when you watch him get going. He's a natural, smooth mover. He did have some receiving metrics that popped. I think he had like 25% of the receiving yards when he was on the field, which is fourth in the class and clearly above Arroyo and Mason Taylor and some of those guys. You've seen him produce a little bit at Oregon at a high level of competition.

And then you get the draft capital investment. I think he's picked only four picks after Mason Taylor, early second round, and the fit is great. So he's just an easy one to like. Jarquis Hunter, I'm intrigued by the, they keep talking and it's been a steady drum beat starting back in like February. Leslie Snead and McVeigh both talking about like, they're really intrigued by what Liam Cohen did, former guy that worked with the Rams with the Bucks

last year with Bucky Irving and with the adaptability of the run game and the different ways that he could get the ball in his hands creatively. And that they are looking to kind of emulate that a little bit. And so the Rams have transformed from being, you know, like one of the most prominent outside zone teams to just really simple, mostly duo runs up the gut, just kind of picking and choosing their spots with Kyron Williams and just working on defense with Jabs over and

over and over. But I think it seems like ready to kind of expand on that a little bit. And then they go out and find this explosive play threat and Hunter, who I would think fit that Bucky kind of vision better than Blake Coram. But it's really easy to get rookie fever with these guys and to kind of wish cast these roles where it's like, really, this is a team that wants to compete and they already have veterans in play. So how much do you expect these guys to play? You don't seem like somebody who has rookie fever though. That's surprising. She's got a bad always. He's got a big case.

He's got, I mean, the hunter call makes a lot of sense, you know, just given the fact that Kyron and I think this speaks to your point, you know, how they find talent out of nowhere, you know, late draft capital didn't play as a rookie because of the foot injury, comes in and sort of the can-maker shadow a little bit and then just runs away with the job and has been so special for the last two years, but not explosive. And does Hunter offer a little bit more explosiveness and give them a little bit of a change of pace that's kind of been missing from this offense? The one thing that's sort of different is that what McVeigh's kind of been is like

when he's had a guy, he's leaned on a guy, you know, and does he get away from that, you know, sort of mindset? Dave talked about this last week, you know, Williams in a contract year, you know, how much does he, you know, look to sort of, you know, keep whatever youngsters are behind them, whether it's Coram or Hunter, you know, at Bay, at least for one more season, and do the Rams just kind of, you know know run Kyron into the ground and then Maybe see what they have and you know one of these two guys are still continued to find somebody else I'm still pretty comfortable with Kyron in this lead role

But I do think we could see somebody else taking some more cops play remember they wanted to go with Ronnie Rivers two years Ago right before Kyron got hurt then Kyron got injured Rivers never did anything they sort of had a you know piece together their backfield Kyra comes back And was a superstar again, you know and and sort of had a piece together. Their backfielder Kyra comes back and was a superstar again, and sort of picked up where he left off. I think he's a good lottery ticket in read draft leagues. I think he's a good guy to sort of take maybe round three at the earliest, round four probably most likely for a rookie draft,

for people who are still doing it. But I still think based on McVeigh's track record, whether they evolve, like you said, they're talking about doing some different things, giving Hunter a little bit more of a role to sort of emulate what the Bucks did. That's something that's certainly worth exploring. The telltale sign will be,

do they play him in any preseason games? If they play him in preseason game, it's probably a bad sign that they don't really trust Hunter. If they don't play him, then he's gonna get the, the quote unquote starter treatment. And they probably have a pretty, you know, not big role for him, but at least a role plan for him that they don't want to risk anything during those,

you know, couple of games. That's interesting. You think that that applies to rookies? I don't know. I mean, I feel like even the Rams might play their rookies in the preseason. No, they don't. He doesn't play any guys that he trusts or plans to.

He didn't play Quorum last year. No, they don't. He doesn't play any guys that he trusts or plans to play corn last year. Oh, interesting. Did he play anybody here? Yeah. Did he play Puka? I wonder who could play Puka played one game had five targets in the preseason in 2023. That was it. Interesting. Okay. Yeah, that's something to watch. Good call. Hey, yeah, good. One thing if I can say because Jamie talked about what I talked about, which is Kyron being in a contract here. Think about how this Rams organization dealt with Todd Gurley after they gave him a contract extension and his knees went kablooie. And does that does that weigh on McVeigh's mind when it

comes to running backs? And so it could mean that Cameron Williams is their guy and they ride them this year. And then maybe they franchise tag and maybe they let them walk, but I'd be a little surprised if they made them one of the most highest paid running backs in the NFL when this is all said and done. The other thing I worry about from a fantasy perspective with both of these Rams rookies is, Alright, if I'm going to draft Ferguson with my second-to-last-round pick, or I'm going to draft Hunter with my third-to-last-round pick, how long am I keeping them on the roster for? I don't know if Ferguson's ever going to get a huge opportunity,

because it's been rare when Ram's tight ends have gotten a huge opportunity. There was like that six week span late in the year with Higbee. And other than that, there wasn't much and hunters opportunities are going to be completely tied to Karen Williams. So I like the talents, but I don't know if the opportunity will be there for them, like it was for Nakua when Nakua was a rookie. I'm scooping Ferguson and all my dynasty leagues. You think that's the move Dave more so than, oh man, it's a completely different conversation in dynasty leagues. Well, the problem- Sure.

When are you doing it? You're thinking like round two? End of round two or early round three. Yeah. I mean, I think the- I'm surprised if he lasts until round three to be honest. The third tight end conversation is fascinating to me. Yes, exactly.

It's Taylor, it's Ferguson, it's Fanon, it's, you know, Arroyo. I think they're all worthy of, and I might be missing somebody, but you know, they're all worthy of being in that third spot. You can see the path right away for Taylor because of the lack of, you know, premium pass catchers for the Jets right now. Fanon could be amazing, but we know he's going to be blocked for at least a year with Nijoko. I'm sure they'll have you know some some plays for him, but hard to see the The upside at least as a rookie Ferguson could be in the same situation just because of he'd been all the mouths to feed there But by the time Pook was 30 he's retiring so That could be when I hope sooner than that, but you get the point then a royal

You know especially if you know Cooper Cubs injuries track record creeps up again and you know, no offense can be cut. We can see a path for him, you know, right away too. So I think it's just fun to see who of that foursome will emerge as the best of that group. And will any of them be better than potentially love Leonard Warren, which will be hard to see, but it could still happen. On that note, I want to test your guys like longevity and history here If you can recall anyone like a royal who's like truly in college only Used on the vertical plane and I think it makes so much sense that that's how he helps this offense You know, that's what they need like I don't remember hardly any tight ends being used that way

Let alone being like good for fantasy in that role. Pits maybe it's pits and like everyone knows that's gone. Waller was much more receiver than blocker. Yeah, I'm saying like specifically like deep routes like it's like Greg Dolchitsch was like that recently but like there's really like Mark Andrews is that way but he also does so much other stuff too. His skill sets way different than Arroyo. Arroyo feels like he's truly Mark Andrews. No no I'm sorry.

Dave said? Dave said? What did Dave say? He said Waller? I feel like Noah Fant is like the vision that's like who he was when he came in so I think it's kind of cool that the team who likes Fant brought him in, but I don't know, like it feels like a rejection to assume that he can be fantasy relevant. And that would be like giving him more short yardage stuff. But like, especially in year one, I don't think they're going to do that. They already have the guys that are going to account for those targets on the roster. So let me give you a couple of other names. And this might make your point for you. But Isaiah Likely, Mike Kosicki, like I'm thinking about tight ends that are way more wide receiver than blocker who probably leaned into that a little bit more in college. You get sick. He probably blocked a decent amount when he was in college. Um, and, and how far is Mason

Taylor behind Arroyo in that regard? So I kind of feel like that these, those two tight ends for sure. And fan and you've got to put in that, in that bucket. So I kind of feel like that these those two tight ends for sure and Fanon you've got to put in that in that bucket of tight ends that are more receiver than blocker. But he's saying downfield. Yeah specifically like where the targets are coming for him his average depth of target I think is going to be so much higher whereas like Fanon can work all types of different routes and Taylor's yeah Taylor's mostly like the short out breaking stuff. Um,

Gadsden I love. I really had a tough call and, uh, just rookie draft between Gunnar Helm and, and Gadsden and I went home, but I don't feel good about it. It's Helm for me, but I like them both. Helm is so good. What was the question, Dave? The question was when you're talking about downfield routes, what's the yardage number?

Like what's the A-dot that you're thinking of? I think his A-dot was like- A couple of yards or lower. Yeah, I think his A-dot was like 12 or something like that. Right, it was crazy high. Yeah. That's high for a first- They didn't get that many targets, right?

So his A-dot, a Royal's A-dot was 11.1 yards. That was sixth highest. Whereas Loveland's was 7.1, Warren's was 6.9, Fanon's was 7.5. So 11.1, and Arroyo also led the, led all tight ends with 16.9 yards per catch. Which, you know, high A-dot means yards per catch, which, you know, high A dot means yards per catch usually goes up.

Roy was interesting because he missed a lot of time with injury. You know, he kind of reminds me of Greg Rousseau, different position, but same school. Greg Rousseau basically had one year playing college and he was awesome. And a lot of people thought he was gonna be the biggest bust in the draft. He was the first round pick of the Bills. And a lot of people thought he was gonna be the biggest bust

in the draft, he was the first round pick of the Bills. And there were some advanced metrics, like it took him a really long time to get to the quarterback even though he had a high sack rate, his time to get to the quarterback wasn't that high. But it was such a small sample size. Arroyo's kind of the same way, because he dealt with injuries in I think two seasons,

basically had one healthy season. He didn't get that many targets, but he was terrific. I think he's a really good athlete. I think what you kind of said about Caleb Johnson, it takes a royal a little bit of time to get going. But once he gets going, he will run away from people at a huge size like that's big he's built. There's no doubt in my mind that he would have had the best athletic test thing it tied in there. He'd like just runs away

from people. He's insane. Well, guess what? We ran out of time. So we'll have Jacob on to talk about Drake May and Kyle Williams and some other rookies that he likes at another time, of course. And I will see you all tomorrow at the live chat 2 30pm Eastern for Jacob Gibbs, Jamie Eisenberg and Dave Richard. I am Adam Azer. Thanks so much for watching Fantasy Football Today. Since it's Cinco de Mayo, adios!