Fantasy Football Today - NFL Draft Bold Predictions, Gibbs vs. Bijan, Offensive Line Talk (04/26 Fantasy Football Podcast)

Episode Date: April 26, 2023

Fantasy Football Today is available for free on the Audacy app as well as Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Podcasts, Stitcher and wherever else you listen to podcasts.  A lot of prospect talk today beginning with TCU wide receiver Quentin Johnston and what he does better than other WRs in this class. Plus we have a few news items (3:05) including a lot of Will Levis hype and which NFL QB could be traded this week ... We discuss Gabe Davis (6:00) and how his value could change after the NFL Draft. Then we give you some NFL Draft bold predictions (9:30)! Only one WR in the first round? Jahmyr Gibbs ahead of Bijan Robinson (17:40)? ... Former NFL defensive lineman Leger Douzable joins us to weigh in on the rookie running backs but mostly focus on the offensive linemen. What kind of an impact do rookie offensive linemen have (24:55)? Who are his Top 5 in this class (28:40)? He also gives us some Run Scheme 101 (32:00), talks about interior offensive linemen (38:50), predicts what the Texans will do with the second pick (43:10), tells us how NFL players view PFF grades (45:15) and then everyone gives us their prediction for the first five picks of tomorrow's draft (49:00) ... Email us at [e-mail] Follow our FFT team on Twitter: @FFToday, @AdamAizer, @JameyEisenberg, @daverichard, @heathcummingssr, @ctowerscbs Follow the brand new FFT TikTok account: https://www.tiktok.com/@fftoday Watch FFT on YouTube https://www.youtube.com/fantasyfootballtoday Get 20% off Fantasy Football Today merch: https://store.cbssports.com/collections/fantasy-football-today%20?utm_source=podcast-apple-com&utm_medium=web&utm_campaign=buy-our-merch&utm_content=fantasy-football-collection Join our Facebook group https://www.facebook.com/groups/FantasyFootballToday/ Sign up for the FFT newsletter https://www.cbssports.com/newsletter You can listen to Fantasy Football Today on your smart speakers! Simply say "Alexa, play the latest episode of the Fantasy Football Today podcast" or "Hey Google, play the latest episode of the Fantasy Football Today podcast." To hear more from the CBS Sports Podcast Network, visit https://www.cbssports.com/podcasts/ To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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No, I can't. It's time to dominate your fantasy league. Now here's some combination of Adam, Dave, Jamie, and Heath. All right, coming up today on Fantasy Football Today, three people who combine to weigh about as much as one and a half offensive linemen are going to preview the offensive linemen in the 2023 draft. We are going to have some help though. Former defensive lineman Liget Dusible, who's a CBS Sports HQ analyst and was on the With the First Pick podcast and broke down the offensive linemen beautifully there. He's going to help us. He's going to talk about these big guys, who to watch out for. Is Peter Skowronski a guard or a tackle?

And what we can expect in round one and beyond. Welcome to the Wednesday edition. Remember, we don't have a show tomorrow morning. We usually record at 11 a.m. We don't have a show tomorrow because we're waiting until after round one. If there's any big breaking news, you can expect some bonus podcasts. But we're going to have a show Thursday night around midnight. We'll probably hear Friday morning.

Friday night, same time-ish, maybe a little earlier. And then Saturday at some point, we'll talk about day three. Adam. Yes. Will we have a live stream Thursday after the draft? Yes. We'll have a – It'll be the podcast, right?

The podcast, yes. We'll be live. So you could join us. When the draft wraps up, head over to YouTube. Go to our page, Fantasy Football Today. That's all you have to search for. YouTube.com slash Fantasy Football Today. Perfect.

Click on the live tab. You'll see our video and catch up with us after the draft. Yeah, and we accept your comments. Heath is here as well. Mr. Dynasty, his Dynasty episode in the podcast feed. That's awesome. What did you learn from your wide receiver breakdown yesterday um i learned that uh it's it was interesting because we talked a lot about some stats that i haven't looked at as much in terms of like how these guys did against

press coverage and verse uh man versus zone and um i i learned that quentin johnson johnston johnson is who a guy who has a lot of questions about his route running technique, his catching technique. Apparently his technique getting off the line against man press coverage was outstanding. So he was very good at that, had a little bit of trouble separating once he got 5 to 10 yards downfield and was asked to make a 90-degree turn. But he is amongst the best, if not the best,

at getting off the line against press coverage okay and you know there are some wide receivers that just barely faced press coverage in college so that's uh that's a bonus for quentin johnston a pretty big wide range of possibilities i think for him so we'll see almost the entire class that was one of the things we really talked about like everybody's number two or number three or number four prospect is either 5'9 or 170 pounds, or we're not sure if they can run routes or catch passes. Well, which category does Quentin Johnston fall in?

The not sure if he can catch passes? The latter. Yeah. All right. Quick news items here. San Francisco, according to Dan Patrick, has explored trading for Lamar Jackson. Which quarterback is most likely to get traded this week?

It's a huge name, guys. You sitting down? You ready for this one? I'm sitting. Ryan Tannehill. That would be a big deal. That's not a small deal. I agree, but it's not sexy.

It's not Lamar Jackson. It's not Trey Lance. Does it count if while a team is on the clock they trade a pick and then that pick is used to pick a quarterback? Does that count as the quarterback getting traded? No. No.

Anthony Richardson is my most likely to get traded. Mac Jones? Anybody think Mac Jones is getting traded? Trey Lance? There's been a couple of different rumors. I know at least one expert who mocked to get traded. Mac Jones. Anybody think Mac Jones is getting traded? Um, there's been a couple of different rumors. I know at least one expert who mocked, um, Mac Jones being traded to the Falcons as part of a deal for Anthony Richardson.

I just read that expert. Yeah, absolutely. Uh, speaking of that expert, he might be a little bit too low on will Levis. This expert, by the way,

is Heath because he has Will Levis going number two overall in his mock draft. There's some buzz that still Bryce Young the favorite, but Will Levis could be number one. His odds have risen dramatically. That's really funny too because his odds of going number two

when I wrote that on Sunday night, he was, I think, the clear favorite. Currently, he is now second. Tyree Wilson is the favorite to go number two. But it seems like that's the one that's kind of been surprising, is it does seem like Tyree Wilson over Will Anderson's a pretty popular take right now. Yeah, and I had to change my mock draft to move Tyree Wilson up. I didn't take him ahead of Will Anderson, but I did have to move him up to three. Okay, so anyway, we've got some bold

predictions coming up in just a bit. The NFL Draft Contest is well underway, and you are submitting your guesses, which is great, and you're not sending them to me, which is even better. You're sending them to Thomas, Thomas.Shafer, S-H-A-F-E-R, Thomas.Shafer at Paramount.com. Finally have that pretty much memorized. Please send him an email and put NFL draft contest in the subject line and guess the top 10 picks in order. Don't care about the teams. Just tell us the prospects one through 10. You have to get the order,

right? Whoever gets the most picks, right. You know, with the order is in the podcast league. Any tiebreakers will be settled. We'll figure that out at a later date. But send them to thomas.schafer at paramount.com.

Also, how should you feel about your team's draft picks? Well, the With the First Pick podcast is your source for comprehensive draft coverage and pick breakdowns with CBS Sports draft expert Ryan Wilson and longtime general manager Rick Spielman. Ryan and Rick will recap each day of the draft, dishing out winners and losers from all seven rounds.

And the draft chatter doesn't stop on Saturday. Stay tuned to the show for team-by-team draft grades and an early look at who your team could be eyeing next year. Download and follow the With the First Pick podcast wherever you find this one. Cool. I wanted to mention one thing from yesterday's show that I forgot and see what you think. We were talking about players who could gain or lose from the NFL draft. I never mentioned Gabe Davis. But my question is, because, Heath, you mentioned the Chiefs. And it's in the same vein, right? If the Bills or the Chiefs draft a receiver late in round one or maybe early in day two,

how many wide receivers, Heath, do you think you would rank ahead of Gabe Davis or Kadarius, Tony, and Sky Moore if they were selected by the Bills or Chiefs? So, JSN for sure. But as far as the other guys, I think it maybe matters more if the Bills select a Quentin Johnston versus a Zay Flowers or a Jordan Addison.

I probably wouldn't rank the slot options. But if it's Johnston, then it might be a competition for who's starting outside. As far as the Chiefs go, I would rank, I think, any first-round wide receiver in Dynasty over those guys. In redraft, I probably wouldn't because I'm pretty skeptical about the, but Addison would be the exception. Um, what Jordan Addison showed in learning and dealing with different coaching systems, um,

would give me some hope that he could be a major contributor for the chiefs in year one, but I don't have a lot of hope. The other guys would have a whole lot more success than Skymore. Dave, same question to you. Uh, I, I'd rank Smith and Jigba ahead of Sky Moore and Kadarius Toney

if he ended up... He said he was talking about the other non-Jackson Smith and Jigbas. Sure. I think I'd probably go with Zay Flowers, too. I like his game. I think that he's an electric receiver, can make big plays.

Schneier talked about it on our podcast. He can beat the double teams. I've seen the film of it. I think he could be pretty good. So I'm intrigued by him. I don't know what I'd do with Quentin Johnston, but probably behind, definitely behind Kadarius and probably behind Skymore too.

If those guys wound up in Buffalo, definitely JSN. For me, definitely Zay Flowers and probably Jordan Addison over Gabe Davis. Look, if they're taking one of those receivers, that's the bills telling us we're not happy with what we've gotten out of our wide receiver group. And we're making a change for the future and the present by taking one of these receivers with a top 30 pick, wherever they are in late round one. So I think getting away from Gabe Davis is going to be pretty easy, whether it's a receiver that they draft

or a veteran receiver that they may trade for come Thursday. I think what I was touching on, though, and Heath kind of mentioned it, was specifically with Gabe Davis. If the Bills have the choice of Quentin Johnston, who is an outside receiver, or Addison, who's 170-something pounds, probably going to play the slot, and Zay Flowers probably going to play the slot, I think who they take might tell you how they feel about Gabe Davis. You know, do they take a slot guy and play?

And maybe Shakira factors in too. But, you know, if they draft Johnston, that seems like a bigger threat to Gabe Davis. I think they're all threats to Gabe Davis. I think they could all play on the outside. Okay. All right. Well, we'll have time to break that down later.

Let's talk about some bold predictions here for the 2023 NFL draft. Dave, you can go first. Give me a bold prediction. Bold prediction. How about five quarterbacks going in the first 15 picks? Ooh. Okay. So who's taking... So

15 is the Jets right now. So first 14 picks, are they a trade or what? There will be a trade. Jets will move down. They've got to start collecting a little bit of draft capital to make up for what they gave away to get Aaron Rodgers. And I could see a team like Seattle moving up to get Hendon Hooker in that spot. And then you already know the other four quarterbacks that will go ahead.

It would make perfect sense for the Texans to pass on a quarterback at two and then trade up using 12 in one of their other picks, probably a third rounder, to go and get Levis or Richardson, whichever quarterback that they like, or Stroud, if Stroud somehow slides. But I've got Young one, Stroud four, Levis and Richardson in the top ten. Not in that order, by the way. And then Hendon Hooker going 15 five quarterbacks first 15 picks all right Heath bold prediction I was going to say there's multiple running backs in the first round but it turns out looking at the uh betting odds that it's actually

uh over one and a half is at minus 250 now, so I don't think that's bold. I'm going to go with JSN as the only wide receiver drafted in round one. We've talked about it a lot over the last couple of weeks, but this is a wide receiver class with flaws. It's size concerns, it's separation concerns, it's hand concerns, it's why weren't they as good as they were two years ago concerns. And so I think NFL teams could talk themselves out of drafting these wide receivers in round one. We really do have to put this in perspective. We've had several years of very good first round picks at the wide receiver position.

Not necessarily in their rookie years. I mean, Devontae Smith had a good rookie year and he didn't win you your fantasy league or anything like that. You know, Jerry Judy's been a little disappointing. CeeDee Lamb as a rookie, Dak Prescott got hurt, right? That was the same year, I believe. But anyway, we've had some great receiver classes lately. So I wonder in Dynasty, if you're doing a rookie draft,

should we be thinking about the quarterbacks over these guys, you know, in a one QB league? How should we be thinking about the quarterbacks over these guys you know in a one qb league how should we approach this pump the brakes on the wide receivers well i think the nf that like draft capital is going to tell us a lot i don't i'm not going in a one quarterback league i don't think and it might be the case that downs or someone sneaks into round one and i do with him but for the most part if you're a wide receiver and you're taken in round one and I do with him. But for the most part, if you're a wide receiver and you're taken in round one, I'm going to rank you ahead of these quarterbacks

because it's not like we have an elite quarterback class either or a flawless quarterback class either. So any round one wide receiver will be ahead of all of the quarterbacks, but the round two guy is not necessarily. Yeah. And I wonder how many of the wrap of the day to rounds two and three running backs are going to be ahead of, you know, most of the wide receivers.

Obviously we have to see where they end up, but just Charbonnet and Gibbs. I don't know. I mean, it's a strong, okay. Are you just talking about the top four wide receivers basically? Yes.

Right. And you think Bijan, he'll be a day one. Yeah, I think we might have a situation where like nine of the picks in round two of rookie drafts are running backs. So yes, once you get past those top four, maybe five or six wide receivers, the next tier of wide receivers, I'd, I'd rather have almost all the day two running backs over them. Dave, how do you feel about that? I mean, should we maybe be thinking about the round suit rounds two and three running backs ahead of even Addison and Johnston and Zay Flowers? Depends on where they end up, but probably not. Because I don't think this draft class is particularly great. I think there are two quarterbacks that will be good for the NFL.

I don't know how good they'll be for fantasy. That's Young and Stroud. And there's going to be great potential with Levis and Richardson and with Hooker. And that might be the deepest position as far as like top five goes receiver would probably be next, but we could debate who that fifth receiver would be. And I think there's a gap between the big four and that fifth receiver. And I feel like there's a gap. I feel like there's like a mini gap between Bijan and Jameer Gibbs. And then another mini gap

between Gibbs and Zach Sarbanet. I'm not even sure who the fourth best running back is, but people are going to gravitate toward that position just to hope that they catch something good. There'll be two or three running backs. We're going to love their landing spots. We'll take them late round one, early round two. But I think the wide receivers, those big four, are talented guys. And only if they go to a team where just desolate quarterback situation or franchise that's just consistently run the football and not given a lot of targets to wide receivers, that would be the only thing that would slow me down from taking one of those top wide receivers.

Don't get me started on tight ends. There are some interesting tight ends. Yeah, the tight ends are going to be interesting too. They are interesting, but I don't know how many of them are going to truly be like, are any of them, none of them are going to sniff the Kelsey level. No one ever does. I don't know if they sniff the Hawkinson level.

Here's a bold prediction. We definitely liked this class more a year ago than we do right now. Yes. And we will like this class more a year ago than we do right now. And we will like this class more a year from now than we do right now. Yeah, it is regarded as a weaker NFL draft. Last year was regarded as a weaker NFL draft, and I can't wait until we get to 2023. We were talking this way about the 2022 class. Were we? Is that because the quarterbacks were so bad?

I don't know. I just remember conversations about how far down do you have to go in the 2022 draft before you'd just rather have a 2023 pick because that class is so much better. I tell you, man, you go look at the top 10 from last year. A lot of really good picks. It was a good class. I mean, yeah, the receivers were outstanding. Yeah, but the quarterbacks stunk. There's no question. In general.

All right, I'm sorry. We got Liget coming on in a little bit, so let's get back to some bowl predictions. I have C.J. Stroud going 11th to Tennessee. That would be a pretty big fall

for him, but it depends if people are really freaked out about his S2 score, which is reportedly very, very low, a cognitive test. Wasn't Will Levis as low as well, though? I don't think so. Not as low as Stroud's.

Yeah, Stroud is getting really dinged for it. People in NFL circles are apparently talking about this, Gordon. It has so many things I've read. So I don't think this is just a small deal. All right, Dave, you're up with your second bold prediction. Well, first of all, Heath, did you watch any of C.J. Stroud play? A little bit, yeah, yeah. Was there ever a point where you questioned his decision-making on the field?

No, I think the thing that Matt Waldman talked about on the Dynasty podcast three weeks ago was that the NFL is coming around the idea that this processing speed is something they've really missed out on. And this is a test that's designed to try to – I think what we don't know yet is how well this test grasps that. But what they're trying to get to is something that the NFL doesn't really have a very good way to measure right now. Because I don't know if – I don't think that college tape necessarily shows that as well as far as how they're going to process the NFL. And one thing I did read about this cognitive test is that there's different sections in it, I guess. And some people think you don't look at the overall score. You look at how the quarterback did in particular areas and Stroud wasn't as bad in that regard. So we'll see. But

he's definitely, there's some shine off of CJ Stroud because of the test results. Dave, round two, bold prediction. I don't know. I thought that Stroud made great decisions on the football field. That's what I care about. I'm not going to ask him to do my taxes. We have heard about Philadelphia drafting B. John Robinson at 10. Bold prediction number two. B. John Robinson won't be there for Philadelphia to draft at 10 overall.

Falcons? Falcons. Okay. Well, I'll just go to my at 10 overall. Falcons? Falcons. Okay. Well, I'll just go to my next bold prediction. Jameer Gibbs goes ahead of B. John Robinson. Oh! Yeah. I don't think it's going to happen,

but I've read so many times. Because I've read so many times, some teams like Jameer Gibbs better than B. John Robinson. This is apparently a thing. They like the pass-catching ability. They like the Camara comparisons. I think it's silly, but that's a bold prediction there. And maybe the Eagles take him at 10.

Here's my reaction to that. Besides, my reaction to that is, let's say you're the Patriots. You're on the clock. You're dying to have another running back. Let's just say that this is what they want. Both running backs are there. Which one better fits what you've got on your team now? Yeah, I get it.

Gibbs. Wouldn't you say Gibbs? I guess so, but Robinson. No. Because you have Stevenson who can be the primary ball carrier. Right. If you're going to take a running back in the 15th pick of the NFL draft, and you're going to choose a part-time running back

because you already have somebody on your roster that can do two-thirds of the job better than he does, why would you use the 15th pick on that? It's the only way a team would take Gibbs ahead of Robinson is because they're so comfortable with the running downs guy that they have. Maybe the Patriots aren't the best example because we know that Ramondre could play in passing downs. There are teams that want a running back that can win in space,

make explosive plays on the edges down the field. Of course, Bijan can do that, but maybe they just like Gibbs better. He's got a little bit better speed, I suppose. You know what? I'm going to bring in,

I'm going to bring in a former football player to talk about this. All right. We're going to bring him in a little bit early. We got Lajay Doosable here. What's up Lajay? How are you doing, man? I'm good guys. Thanks for having me on. I know. I promised you. I said, we were going to talk about in a little bit early we got lege ducible here well what's up lege how are you doing man i'm good guys thanks for having me on i know i promised we i said we were going to talk about offensive lineman i want you to get in on this debate though you know is there any validity

any credibility to a team that would take jameer gibbs over bijan robinson well this may be unpopular i know me and emory hunt have gotten some flack about this, but I actually have Gibbs rated a little bit higher than B. John Robinson. Yeah, there it is. And in regards to that, it's because of what you guys were kind of getting at before I came on, the explosiveness of Jameer Gibbs, right? The returnability, where the NFL game is today, your running backs have to be able to come out of the backfield and essentially run receiver routes. And on third down specifically, Jameer Gibbs, I believe in 25% of his third downs lined up in the slot and ran slot receiver routes. So you talk about a guy that has the contact balance because he's not the biggest guy. He's around like 204, but he bounces off of guys. If you watch the Arkansas game, Drew Sanders, who a lot of people have as the number one linebacker, he made them look silly at times in that game. So I love Bijan

Roberts. I think both of these guys are top 20 guys in this draft and the connotation of don't take a running back in the first round because of positional value, I think is ridiculous when it comes to these two guys. I think they can be special. And this is a draft that isn't as top heavy as it has been in the past. I think both of those guys are first round picks, but I just have Jameer Gibbs just slightly rated above Bijan Robinson. Lijay, let me ask you one more about Gibbs here. We'll take a break and we'll do some offensive line discussions here. So you said 204. I know people aren't going to weigh the same at the Combine as they are during the season, whatever. going to weigh the same at the Combine as they are during the season, whatever. I think he was 199 at the Combine. Christian McCaffrey was 202,

I believe, at the Combine, but two inches taller than Gibbs. What I struggle with with Gibbs is how many carries can we realistically expect from him? You're a former defensive lineman, if you saw a guy his size, you'd probably be ready to rip his head off. So can he, can he withstand it? Can, what kind of a ball carrier could he be 15 carries a game or more like 10? Well, the thing is, Adam, if you look at where the trajectory of the NFL has gone, I mean, there's not too many of those backs that carry the ball 30 to 35 times a game anymore. I mean, Christian McCaffrey is one that kind of did it this last year with San Francisco, but even he's been kind of beat up in the past, right? The Saquon Barkley, he's been kind of beat up in the past. So it's usually been backed by committee.

If you look at some of the best teams in the NFL, the Kansas City Chiefs, the Buffalo Bills, the Baltimore Ravens, even they rotate their back. So realistically, I think Jameer Gibbs is a 15 to 17 carry a game type back with the ability to catch you know at least five to six passes a game that's where he's going to make his say right really being able to be a mismatch for safeties and linebackers in the open field just a trajectory of where the NFL is gone nobody's carrying the ball 30 times a game unless you're Derrick Henry. All right. Well, okay, that was Lachey Dusibald.

I'll give you the proper introduction in a moment. We're going to take a break here. Comment from the chat before we go to break from Jamie. I always pictured Heath as a young Sean Connery. I wasn't even close. Sorry, you're no James Bond, Heath. What do you mean by not even close? In what way were you not close?

He means me. He thinks that I'm the one that looks like me. Oh, yeah, that must have been it. All right, we'll be right back here to talk about offensive linemen as we are just one day away from the NFL draft. We'll be right back. What does possible sound like for your business? It's having the spend to powers your scale with no

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damage cost you time and money. Click before you dig. Ensure your next project is safe. Visit OntarioOneCall.ca. It's free. It's easy. It's the law. Data sourced from the ORCGA 2023 Dirt Report. All right, everybody. Welcome back. Appreciate you being here on this Wednesday and appreciate our guest, Lajay Doozable, NFL defensive lineman from 2008 to 2017. He is now a CBS Sports HQ analyst, and I heard him break down the offensive lineman on the With the First Pick podcast,

and it was terrific. Lajay, you and Pete Prisco and Rick Spielman and Ryan Wilson did a great job, and there's still time for you all to go back and listen to any, they do all position breakdowns, any position preview there. It'll help you out big time as we mostly just focus on the skill position players. But, um, what first question for you, what kind of an impact do you think offensive linemen make as rookies? Is it a harder position to come in and, and, you know, be really good as a rookie? Is it easier? Offensive linemen in

general as rookies, what can you tell us? Yeah, it's a mixed bag, just like any position in the NFL. You got the Rayshon Slaters who played at a Pro Bowl level, the rookie here, Tristan Warris, but then you have guys like Evan Neal and Andrew Thomas who struggle coming out the gate. And I think you're going to see more of that than you see guys like Slater and Warris, because I think those are the exceptions, not the rules. Right. Because there's a learning curve in the NFL, especially in the trenches and the O-line and defensive line. Like when you're in college, you probably dominated everybody that was in front of you. But in the NFL, literally everybody is good.

So, like, if you, you know, slouch it on one snap you could potentially get your quarterback hurt and then if i think we saw some of those growing pains with evan neal but i think that's going to make him a better player we saw the same thing with andrew thomas his rookie year he struggled a lot of people were wondering why did the giants take this guy so high in the draft and he ended up being a pro bowl player so i think you'll see more guys struggle coming out the gate just because the level of play is ratcheted up a lot more in the nfl the techniques that you have to learn are a lot different than what you learn in college like things you can get away with technique wise in

college you can't get away with technique wise in the nfl because everybody plays at a higher level i'll throw it over to dave and heath Dave, got anything? As far as questions for... Yeah, I've been hogging all the questions here. I think you've only asked like one question. One line question, but I was all over the running back. Sure. So, Lajay, I'm curious what your answer is because of your perspective, because you played on the other side of the ball. We know that you can't teach height, weight, hand size, arm length,

quickness for offensive linemen. Short of those traits, what are the hardest things for offensive linemen to learn to make themselves better? And maybe some just can't learn it and can't get over that once they get to the NFL. Yeah, I think first and foremost, the terminology that you use from college to the NFL is a lot different. But then as far as just the technical things of the NFL, as far as angles, blocking angles, right? And then also a lot of these guys like Peter Skowronski, perfect example. A lot of people have Mark Tim being a guard instead of a tackle. That's a little different. It's a lot quicker inside than it is on the outside. You may have a step or two on the outside, but inside at the guard and center position, things happen like this.

Right. And you have to be able to adjust on the move. So that's going to be a learning curve for him. Now, I think he's the most technically sound offensive lineman in this draft as far as footwork, as far as run angles, as far as grit and determination and fight. He plays with a physical nature, especially in the run game. But I think it's going to be a learning curve for him because he's so used to being on the island at the left tackle position. Now they're going to move him in that guard or potentially even right tackle. I actually think he could be a really good right tackle. I think Chicago should maybe take a look at him at pick number nine because they have a really good left tackle in Braxton Jones, who's a young ascending player. But I think because of the armlet, he's not a left tackle in the league, but if he moves to the right side, whether it's right

guard or right tackle, now you're doing everything opposite, right, Dave? And this is what you're talking about, right? Your post leg is different, right? The angles that you take are different, right? Now, if you're inside, you got to learn how to work with your tackle and your center, right? As far as combo blocks. So those are some of the things that he is going to have to learn at the next level. That was a little bit different when he was just at the left tackle. And they're like, you just take out this defensive end and you don't have to worry about anything else.

Well, Jay, I want to compliment you. You are clearly a man who does his homework. You came on to fantasy football today for the first time ever. And in your first offensive line answer, you worked in Giants. And I just think that is, if you could have said, Andrew Thomas, who protects Daniel Jones and got Daniel Jones

into the answer as well, it would have been perfect. Who are your top five offensive linemen in this class? Yeah. So I'll start off with Peter Skowronski, who we were talking about to me, the most technically sound offensive lineman in this draft. I got a lot of people marked to play guard. I think he will be a really good guard, but I like him at right tackle. I think he could be a really good tackle in this league. A lot of people say because of the arm length, he's not a true left tackle. But if you look at it on film, right, it wasn't the taller defensive ends that gave him issues like Zach Harrison.

He gave him the business. Vaness gave him the business. Aiden Hutchinson two years ago gave him the business. Van Ness gave him the business. Aiden Hutchinson, two years ago, gave him the business. It was guys like David Ojabo that gave Peter Skowronski some issues. So I think he could be a really good right tackle, but I think he'll end up transitioning to be a really good guard in the NFL. Next, I got Parrish Johnson. To me, the best pure left tackle in this draft and also has some flexibility.

Played guard all last year at Ohio State before kicking to left tackle in this draft and also has some flexibility played guard all last year at ohio state before kicking to left tackle this year the things that he needs to work on though speed the top power kind of gives him some issues luke van ness had you know some ways with them as far as speed the power and then michael williams from georgia had a nice speed to power rush on him too but he's a guy that finishes in the run game. Again, to me, the best pure left tackle. Then I'm going to go Broderick Jones from Georgia, right, to me has the highest ceiling. He's the youngest prospect out of all my top five guys. He has the highest ceiling.

Kind of reminds me of Andrew Thomas from a few years ago. Very athletic offensive tackle. They get this guy on the move in screen games, get him out there in space. You should see how he destroys cornerbacks. And I don't think people understand the athletic ability it takes for a 300-pound man to block a cornerback in space. And he does it with ease at times. I just need him to finish a little bit more on film.

If he can get that streak where he finishes, then he can be probably the best tackle when it's said and done in this draft cast. Then I'm going to go to my favorite player in this draft, Darnell Wright. You're talking about a guy that is a straight mauler that will rip your face off as soon as you step on the field. Turn on that Alabama tape. Will Anderson disappeared in that game, literally disappeared.

He gave Brian Breezy fits in the bowl game versus Clemson. This is a guy that I think can play in a zone and gap scheme, but I would love to see him just play in a gap scheme and literally just destroy dudes, play in and play out. Does have some issues with being a waist bender instead of knee bender, and that hurts him in pass rush games as far as passing things off. Sometimes he'll bend with his waist instead of actually bending with his knees to be able to pass things off.

He needs to work on that, but that's a technical thing. You can work on that at the next level. And then I'm going to go with Osiris Torrance, to me, the best guard in this draft class. I mean, it's like the Great Wall of China. You just can't get around this guy. Huge. Great battles with Jalen Carter in that Florida-Georgia game.

Now, Carter was coming off an injury and only played on third down, but nobody had blocked Carter, and Osiris Torrance did the best job out of everybody. He's definitely going to be in the gap scheme. I don't think you can put him in the zone scheme, but he's a mauler, and a lot of people were concerned about him leaving Louisiana and coming to Florida, the uptick in competition, but he didn't give up a sack. So those are my top five guys. Can you maybe get a little nerdy here and talk about schemes? Cause you're talking about zones and gaps and things like that. And give us kind of a one-on-one of blocking schemes.

So when you talk about zone schemes, right? You usually see lighter offensive linemen in zone scheme, right? You got to be able to run off the ball. And what you want to do is you want to get the defensive line running East and West. see lighter offensive linemen in zone scheme, right? You got to be able to run off the ball. And what you want to do is you want to get the defensive line running east and west. You don't want them to stay square or penetrate. You're trying to run off the ball, right, to get defensive linemen to turn their shoulders. Because when you turn your shoulders, you have no power. And then in those schemes, the running back is literally just a one-cut get downhill. You see the Green Bay Packers run that scheme. You see the green bay packers run that scheme you see the san

francisco 49ers run that scheme now the new york jets they run that scheme going back to the kubiak days right with the houston texans they run that type of screen and scheme and going back to when he was with denver as well so that is the zone scheme right everything is based off of running off the ball when you're the offensive line you got to have a little bit more athletic offensive lineman in that scheme. In the G scheme, when you talk about your powers, your counters, those are when you have your bigger, you know, mauler offensive lineman. You're talking about double teams at the three technique

or even a double team at a five technique with a tackle and a tight end with a backside guard pulling. That's the power scheme. That's when I talk about G schemes. Also, you could throw the stretch game in that as well, too, when you got the down block by the tight end, down block by the tackle, have that front side guard pull out and you have the running back following that. So I'm actually glad that you asked me that question. I mean, I have no problem geeking

out about different schemes and talking football. I see it all the time. I mean, I have a kind of a basic understanding of it but i think there's probably a lot i probably need some film study to really understand it um yeah so like more in its own scheme it's like everybody's on the string like running together running off the ball where the g scheme is more of a downhill run game where you're going to have those two double teams it's a power game you know that backside guard fit up to either get to that linebacker or knock off that defensive end do you think running backs are mostly adaptable and just need time to learn it or do you think that they are for the most part really fit for one type of scheme yeah i think they're scheme dependent right to me jameer gibbs is better

suited in a you know zone scheme type type offense now he can run in between the tackles in the power game because he did a little bit out of alabama and he was able to have some success but i think he's more of a zone scheme dependent back i think bijan robertson could be a back in any scheme right israel abanaconda i think is a zone scheme guy i I mean, 217 pounds running right under a 4'4". He runs the zone scheme better than almost every running back in this draft. And I'm surprised a lot of people haven't talked about him. I have him as my RB3. I think they didn't use him enough in the past game. And talking to scouts that went to his pro day,

they said he caught the ball clean. He didn't fight the ball when it was in the air. And that's what you worry about some of these guys, right? When you don't see it on tape, can they evolve to being able to be viable pass catchers out of the backfield? And they said Israel Benaconda did everything easy at his pro day. And he's one of my favorite guys.

A guy I really like also is Zach Charbonnet from UCLA. I think he can be an A-Zone or G-Scheme offense. He's just a tough guy to bring down. He's talking about four yards in a cloud of dust. That's the perfect explanation of him. He's going to get you four yards no matter what, whether it's blocked properly or not. And I was surprised that

a guy his size can catch the ball as well as he does out of the backfield and is able to stay in there and pass protection. So, you know, we talked about running backs earlier in this in this show but there's a good depth in this running back class and maybe that pushes jameer gibbs to the second round because you can get a charbonnet you can get a band of candor in the second round um so there's and then tajay spirits is another guy i like i think he's you know people say he dependent, but at Tulane, they ran a lot of pulling guards, and he, you know, in that USC game, my goodness,

he was the best player on that field. I know Caleb Williams had a heck of a game that game, but Tajay Spears was untackleable, if that's even a word, in that game, and also in the American Conference Championship versus UCF, he was the best player on that field that day, too. Yeah, incredible game. 17 carries, 205 yards,

four touchdowns against USC in that bowl game win for Tulane for TyJay Spears. We'll take a break. When we come back, more questions from Dave and Heath for LeJay Duesable, and I guess we're going to talk about the NFL draft. We're going to talk about offensive linemen the whole time. We'll be right back on FFT.

I have one question here, and then I'll throw it over to my co-hosts. Lujay, what is the funniest pronunciation that you've heard of your name from someone who got it wrong? That's a good one, Adam. I've heard Liger, Lagar, Ledger. So it's been bad right and literally up until i think my fourth year in the nfl a lot of the announcers were gonna get wrong which is crazy but that's that's when you when you have a challenging name right and a lot of people look at my last name and thinking it's

more challenging but i think my first name just just because it doesn't sound how it's spelled, right? It's Liget Doosable. I think Doosable is a lot easier when you look at it phonetically on paper to say than Liget. So I've heard multiple different errors of the pronunciation of my name. It's a doozy, right? It literally is a doozy. Dave, why don't you take it in any direction you like? Obviously, we can talk about any prospects here. Two-part question. Number one, confirm this for me, Liget, that the interior of the offensive line, the guards, the center,

are very important to a team's run game, maybe more so than the tackles. And if you agree with that, then part two is, other than Skowronski and Osiris-Torrance, who are the guards and centers that fantasy managers should be looking to track as far as players that can help the run games that they go to take it to the next level next year? Yeah, I don't know if I 100% agree with that, Dave. I mean, it just depends on the scheme and what each person is being asked.

In different schemes, guards and centers and tackles are asked to do different things. So I think it just depends on what the actual coach is asking each player to do. But as far as guys that I like that you should keep an eye on as far as fantasy implications for what teams they go to to help the running back out uh John Michael Smith is I said Darnell Wright's my favorite player he's probably right there 1B behind Darnell Wright I mean you talk about a guy that finishes in the run game and your guys talk about you know cliche a guy that plays through the whistle no he plays through the echo of the whistle, play in and play out. Now,

he does have some struggles getting to the second level and blocking in space, but this guy is going to block literally until the end of the whistle. I think he's quick enough, even though he's a bigger center, to play in his own scheme, but he can play in the gap scheme as well. And Steve Avila from TCU is a guy that at 320 should not be able to move the way he moves. Now, I know people have said he's gap dependent, but I think he has the athletic ability to play in his own scheme. Now, I would like to see him in the gap scheme, just like I like to see Osiris Torrance in the gap scheme

and have them just maul guys, right? Now, Mozzie Smith did give him some issues in that college football playoff game. But besides that, I mean, Steve Avila was literally just destroying dudes, play in and play out. So those are two of the guys that I would, you know, as far as fantasy implications, watch where they go because they're going to make their offensive line better from day one. So in the 2021 draft, the Chiefs took Creed Humphrey at the 63rd pick,

I think, and that was a great pick. But they got Trey Smith at pick 226 in the sixth round. Who are your favorite sleepers that are probably going to be drafted on day three, but could have that kind of impact? Quick story. Let's do story time. So I'm in that draft, Trey Smith draft. I was doing, I was working with SNY for the Jets and I still do some stuff for them.

And I literally was saying in round three, the Jets should look at Trey Smith. I know he had the blood clots, but if everything checked out medically, I'm like, you're getting a first-round talent in the third round if you take him. This dude lasted until the sixth round, and then the rest of the NFL let him go to the Chiefs, which is absurd. I couldn't believe it, man. But that was just a quick story because I literally painted him to the Jets at three, but the Jets used that third round pick to move up to get AVT from USC, which was a great

pick also, right? I didn't think there was going to be a possibility after taking Zach Wilson in the first round. I'm like, well, there's no way they're going to be able to get AVT. He's going to be gone at the end of the first, but they traded back up into the first using that third round pick to get Elijah Vera Tucker, but a sleepers. I like Anthony Bradford from LSU, right? He's a mall or two. I think he's going to be gap dependent in a scheme in the NFL.

Now he does waste bend as well and has some struggles as far as quicker off defensive linemen that give him, you know, some, some head movement and shoulder movement because he always wants to rip somebody's face off. His technique kind of wanes at times and he bends with his waist instead of using his knees and keeping his head out of things. But he's a guy that I really like. And also Chandler Zavala right now, there is concerns with the back issues, but I think he's a guy also that plays really well in a gap scheme but can play in his own scheme knocks guys off the ball and is really good in pass protection he's one of the best pass

protecting guards in this draft if everything clears medically I think he could be a sleeper as well yeah well Heath couldn't really deal with all the Giants talk so he had to bring up the Chiefs so that was very subtle um what do you think the Texans are going to do at number two? There's a lot of Will Levis buzz right now. What do you think they do? Yeah, nobody knows. Just being honest, nobody knows. Honestly, to me, if you look at this, right,

and if you're D'Amico Ryans and you're changing the culture of the Houston Texans and get guys to buy in. Say you win five games. Are you going to be in the running to get Drake May? Are you going to be in the running to get Caleb Williams? I don't think so if you get five wins. So when are you going to be able to be in this position to take one of the top two quarterbacks in the NFL draft? And I know they love Bryce Young.

And if things somehow change, because I don't even know when they decided to change. I thought everybody knew CJ Stroud was going to be the number one pick in this draft. Then all of a sudden, a few weeks ago, it was Bryce Young. And by the Vegas odds, for sure, it's Bryce Young. I think CJ Stroud makes a lot of sense in that offense. You're talking about the best pure passer in this draft, a guy that throws with accuracy. And I think things get lost on people when it comes to fundamentals and footwork. And to me, he has the best when it comes to quarterbacks in this draft, right? I think things get lost.

We saw Geno Smith fundamental everybody to death last year, right? As far as being able to stay in the pocket, know where to go with the ball, great on intermediate throws, great on a deep ball. That's what CJ Stroud brings. And then if you can add a Jackson Smith and Jigba at 12, you got some familiarity there. Let's not forget John Mechie is coming back this year. They added

Dalton Schultz. They have some pieces. And people forget this offensive line is actually pretty good for the Houston Texans. They got two book-end tackles. The highest-paid tackle in all the NFL at left tackle and Lermie Tunsell. So, I mean, I think to me, if you're the Houston Texans, yes, you want to build out your roster, but it's like, are you really going to roll out Davis Mills for another year? Like how would the

fans react to that? And again, you have to do things that's best for the team, but I'm hard pressed to believe that they're going to roll out there with Davis Mills another year. And again, you have to do things that's best for the team, but I just hard, I'm hard pressed to believe that they're going to roll out there with Davis mills another year. And you don't know what the future holds. If you could potentially even be in a position to take one of the top two quarterbacks next year. All right. Last question I have for you. I asked you about this before the show. Um, I thought it was a funny response. What do you think about PFF grades? Because that's really the only thing I can use to talk about offensive lines, really, unless I read some scouting or something. But I do cite it fairly often. I always take it with a grain of salt.

What do you and what do players think about PFF grades? Yeah, Adam, I'm glad you asked me this question. I know we were emailing back and forth about this. So my good friend Chris Long, we came out together in the 08 draft and i think it was like our sixth or seventh year when pff kind of started coming into the nfl and becoming big and you know different media websites were actually using it i think even nbc puts the grade up there during intros on sunday night football which i do i think is absurd um my question is, and we actually were actually supposed to go to their facility to see how they do things. In a complex scheme that I played in

most of my career with Rex Ryan, my job changed every week. How do you know what my responsibility is to grade it properly? So as players, we kind of scoff at it now. It's twofold, right? Because when you're graded high, everybody posts it, right right because when you're graded high everybody posts it right but when you're graded low everybody's like how the hell did i grade though you don't even know what i'm supposed to do this week perfect example 2017 i'm playing for the san francisco 49ers we go to philly right philly ends up winning the championship that year uh lane johnson had never given up a sack that year i he got i gave i got i hit him for sack. I had two sacks that game, four tackles for loss and seven tackles. Guess what my PFF grade was that game? I don't even want to guess. It was like 70.

And then 2016, we're playing the San Francisco 49ers when I'm with the Bills. Now, I did everything I was supposed to do, right? That game was predicated off us as defensive line, kind of holding the blocks at the line of scrimmage letting the linebackers run free uh try to stop Carlos Hyde right that was I think Kaepernick's first game back as the starting quarterback for San Fran I had like four tackles that game I think maybe two for loss and I graded out at like 95 that game so it's like on one end it was like you actually got it right because I did my responsibility I did it at a high level but I was unblockable versus philadelphia eagles and i graded out at 70

like what are we doing here like how do you know exactly i even had a pbu because they dropped me in coverage twice that game i'm like how did i grade out at 70 so i think players always take it with a grain of salt some players laugh at at it. Some players scoff at it. Some players agree with it. I think it just depends on the player you ask, but I always find it interesting. Like when you have a guy like a Rex Ryan or a Todd Bowles who have a complex defense where literally my position changed every week, how do you know what my responsibility is to grade it properly? What about the team grades? What if I look and I see, okay, this team graded as the third worst run-blocking team in the NFL? Is that something that we should take with,

something we should put stock in? I think you take everything with a grain of salt. I mean, you maybe could take stock in it depending on what the film shows, like where they're getting blown up by the defensive line, where the offensive line are not able to get to the second level to get to the linebackers, were there missed blocks when the defensive line moved on movement, lateral movement, were they able to redirect and pass things off in the run scheme?

I think once you look at the film, if it merits what the grade says, then OK. But again, I think it's you're hard pressed to believe unless you know exactly what the offensive play was and what everybody responsibility was on each and every play to truly have a fair grade of what they're doing out there all right everybody this is uh our last show until after day one we'll record midnight ish on thursday so i feel honored you're putting me on the last show before the draft. I really feel honored. I'll tell you, not just the episode I keep referencing of With the First

Pick, but every episode of With the First Pick was so helpful, but I loved the offensive line breakdown. It was so good, so I'm glad we had you on. Would you guys be willing to give me a mock draft? Can we do a mock draft top five picks? We good with that?

Get everybody's top five? I can do it. All right. So Carolina on the clock. Go Dave, Heath, Liget. So are we doing one pick a piece or we are going to each do a pop fly? I'm trying to understand. I think each do it.

Everybody give me one. Everybody give me two. Everybody give me three, et cetera. Okay. Okay. Sounds good. All right. Dave, you're me three, et cetera. Okay. Okay. Sounds good. All right. Dave, you're on the clock.

Carolina. Bryce Young won. No, no. Then Heath won. Oh, okay. I thought we were each doing it. Bryce Young won. UJ?

I'm reluctant to say Bryce Young, but the Vegas odds are just too great. I'm going to go Bryce Young, number one overall. We can't deal with that much confusion here. You have to go Bryce Young. It's the only thing we think we know. Bryce Young has to be one. All right, Dave, number two. Will Anderson.

Wrong Will. Will Levis. And we're keeping it to the Texans here. Which I love. I love he's saying that because the Vegas odds are showing that lately that it's going to be Will Levis. And a few people that I talked to in the Houston organization could be a viable choice,

but to me, C.J. Stroud makes the most sense. I'm going C.J. Stroud at number two. And feel free to make any trades you'd like. Arizona at three. Dave? Arizona would love to trade down. I don't have a trade that they... Oh, sure. Why don't I make one? They'll trade with Detroit. So the Lions will move

up to number three, and they will take Tyree Wilson. I also have Tyree Wilson, but going to Arizona. I have a trade down with Tennessee, and I have Tennessee taking Will Levis. There you go. Three overall. Three quarterbacks for Luget with the first three picks. Dave, pick four, Indianapolis.

This is where I think C.J. Stroud goes. Breaks my heart because it takes Gardner Minshew's job, but yes, C.J. Stroud. If I didn't give Will Anderson to three with Tennessee trading up, I would have went Will Levis here, but I'm going to go Anthony Richardson with Shane Steichen. Oh, wow. So four quarterbacks for you, right, Luget?

Four in a row. Four picks. All right. Hooker at five? We'll find out. Oh, wow. So four quarterbacks for you, right, Liget? Four in a row. Four picks. All right. Hooker at five? We'll find out. Dave, you have the fifth pick first, Dave. Seattle. After going Young, Will Anderson, Tyree Wilson, and CJ Stroud,

I think the Seahawks take Jalen Carter at five. I will go Will Anderson falling to the Seahawks. They are very, very happy with this development. I'm with Dave. If Jalen Carter's there at five, Seattle needs to run that card up there. And I feel like he fits in with that locker room and Pete Carroll allowing guys to be who they are.

I think getting Bobby Wagner back as a veteran will help Jalen Carter be a pro's pro. They're going to, Ken Walker's going to run that card up there. That's how excited they're going to be. Liget Duesable, thank you so much for coming how excited they're going to be. Liget Newsable, thank you so much for coming on. It was great having you.

Of course. Thanks again, guys. Dave Heath, it was fine. It was okay. It was fine. We'll do it again. Talk to you guys soon. All right, we'll speak to you.

So either tomorrow, if there's breaking news, there could be. Could be a lot of players traded. You'll hear from us then or we'll talk to you after the first round with a fantasy recap. See you.

Thanks for watching and listening, everybody.