Fantasy Football Today - Potential ADP Risers; Training Camp Battles (07/26 Fantasy Football Podcast)

Episode Date: July 26, 2022

Vote for us for Best Sports Podcast and Best Male-Hosted Podcast! http://podcastawards.com/app/signup/ What are the biggest training camp battles we're keeping an eye on? How about the QB situations in Carolina and Seattle (1:25)? And let's not forget the Packers wide receivers (10:00). Are we overlooking Randall Cobb? We've also got some Elijah Moore talk (13:40) and news and notes (16:25) with a weird stipulation in Kyler Murray's contract ... There are plenty of players who could move up in the rankings over the next few weeks. Let's start at QB (21:30) with Jalen Hurts, Russell Wilson and Trey Lance. Then we move on to RB (26:35) and look at a group of potential #2 RBs. Adam makes a case for Breece Hall as a potential riser. Jamey thinks J.K. Dobbins could have some helium. At WR (35:15), we're looking at guys like Gabriel Davis and Jerry Jeudy plus the best value on the Chiefs. And at TE (39:00), will Cole Kmet or Pat Freiermuth make a jump in ADP? ... Jamey gives us more WRs who could be on the rise (41:00), and then we talk about training camp backfield battles (46:50)! How do we see the backfields shaking out for Atlanta, Buffalo, Houston, Kansas City and Seattle? ... Email us at [e-mail] Follow our FFT team on Twitter: @FFToday, @AdamAizer, @JameyEisenberg, @daverichard, @heathcummingssr, @ctowerscbs, Watch FFT on YouTube https://www.youtube.com/fantasyfootballtoday Get 20% off Fantasy Football Today merch: https://store.cbssports.com/collections/fantasy-football-today%20?utm_source=podcast-apple-com&utm_medium=web&utm_campaign=buy-our-merch&utm_content=fantasy-football-collection Join our Facebook group https://www.facebook.com/groups/FantasyFootballToday/ Sign up for the FFT newsletter https://www.cbssports.com/newsletter You can listen to Fantasy Football Today on your smart speakers! Simply say "Alexa, play the latest episode of the Fantasy Football Today podcast" or "Hey Google, play the latest episode of the Fantasy Football Today podcast." To hear more from the CBS Sports Podcast Network, visit https://www.cbssports.com/podcasts/ To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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He's just going to go the distance. Now, here's some combination of Adam, Dave, Jamie, and Heath. We are battling today. Training camp battles. Position fights. It's a little bit of hyperbole. But that will make a big fantasy impact. We welcome you to the show.

We're also going to look at players that could be on the rise or maybe falling in average draft position or ADP as we call it in the biz over the next month or so. Maybe Allen Robinson moves up. Christian Kirk right now is not even a top 100 pick. He's wide receiver 42. That could be a guy who's on the rise. Maybe Ezekiel Elliott moves down. Maybe Tony Pollard moves up. We'll talk about it right now on Fantasy Football today. Send us your emails at fantasyfootballatcbsi.com. I'm getting a lot of emails, so I can't read all that many. Fantasyfootballatcbsi.com. But I will respond to some of them personally,

which, of course, is a nice consolation prize. I'm Adam Azen with Jamie Eisenberg. Dave Richard. Jamie, what's the biggest training camp battle to watch? You ask me or Dave? Jamie. You're Jamie. Yeah, you're Jamie.

I think it's the two quarterback battles that are at least the ones that make the most sense. The one in Carolina and the one in Seattle. Seattle obviously is going to determine what we think of the Seahawks passing game and obviously what the running back situation will be there. And then the Carolina Panthers quarterback situation, figuring out if Sam Donald actually has a chance to compete with Baker Mayfield. So both those ones, anytime you get a quarterback situation, figuring out if Sam Donald actually has a chance to compete with Baker Mayfield. So both those ones,

anytime you get a quarterback battle, those will be the ones that have the most entry. Are you hesitant to rank DJ Moore as if Baker Mayfield will be his quarterback as of right now? You mean if Sam Donald will be his quarterback? So you have DJ Moore 10th. I know you wouldn't have him there if Sam Darnold were the quarterback.

So as of right now, as you do your rankings on July 26th... I expect Baker Mayfield to win the job. Yeah, but are you hesitant at all to rank Moore as if Mayfield will win the job? Do you think it's a legit competition, basically? I do. I do. I think it is a legit competition. Matt Rules is going to, I think, allow Sam Darnold to win the job. They don't have a huge investment in Baker Mayfield, competition basically i do i do i think it is a legit competition you know matt rules is gonna i think allow sam darnold to to win the job they don't have a huge investment in baker mayfield so you know there's nothing that says he has to be the guy he should be the guy but based on his

play last year while playing injured he was uh not very successful so they like darnold better uh they need their eyes checked but if they like darnold better then you then they're going to give him the chance to still win the job. I doubt that happens, but I think they'll give him every opportunity to do so. I think Baker has to get hurt for Darnold to win that job. I can't see it. I'd be stunned. I think that's the only way. I think Baker was brought in to take that job, and as long as he's healthy... I mean, you kind of said it. They will be a better team with Baker.

We've talked about it. Yeah. Than they would ever be with Darnold. But in terms of a quarterback competition, Jamie isn't going to rule it out. Very good. Thank you. Thank you.

For Seattle, Dave, this is one that you wanted to highlight as well. The Seattle quarterback competition, Geno Smith versus Drew Locke. Which is what it is right now. Right. Right. Geno Smith did start three games last year. He threw for 209, 167, and 195 yards. That doesn't sound very good, and it isn't very good, but he barely threw.

He threw 32, 22, and 24 times. Of course, there was an 84-yard touchdown catch by DK Metcalf that should not have counted. It really inflates the stats for everyone, for Metcalf and Geno Smith. He totally threw Marshawn Lattimore to the ground. I just watched it again this morning. It's a fun play. But when you look at Metcalf's stats in those three games, that really makes it look a lot better because that would have been a one-catch-for-12-yard game with no touchdowns against the Saints if he didn't have any. Oh, yeah, two-touchdown game against Jacksonville, though.

He did. He had six catches, 43 yards, and two touchdowns. Lockett had 142 yards on 13 targets in that game against Jacksonville. But the passing game was not good, really, against Pittsburgh or New Orleans. Anyway, is there a big difference today between Drew Locke and Geno Smith if those are the two guys that are going to end up battling for this job?

I think Drew Locke has a stronger arm. So if he's the guy, I think that helps a little bit with Metcalf and Locke. It certainly gives them the potential to catch more passes 15-plus yards downfield than they would with Geno. Lock also won't be afraid to make those downfield throws. I'm not going to say that he will be accurate when he makes those downfield throws, but he's much more of a chance taker than Geno Smith.

He's the caretaker. He's going to keep things manageable you know, manageable and simple. But I think that you're probably going to, if these are the two quarterbacks that Seattle ends up with, you're going to see both of them throughout the season. And so there'll be points where DK Metcalf, you're going to hope he's going to be a touchdown dependent wide receiver and Tyler Lockett,

you're just not going to feel good about starting him really whoever the quarterback is going to be. And I think that's reflected in Tyler Lockett's ADP. And going to feel good about starting him, really, whoever the quarterback is going to be. And I think that's reflected in Tyler Lockett's ADP. And sorry about my voice being so weird today. Yeah, Dave's still recovering from COVID. Hopefully everyone in the household getting better there. Tyler Lockett's ADP on Fantasy Pros and PPR is wide receiver 38. He's going 88th overall, just after Elijah Moore and Rashad Bateman.

Would anybody take Lockett ahead of Elijah Moore or Rashad Bateman? No. No. Maybe Elijah Moore. Okay. Maybe. The next wide receiver off the board is Drake London. No.

I'll go with London and PPR. Yep. Yeah. I want to give a sort of convoluted but interesting stat on Tyler Lockett. So follow along, everybody. And you guys can tell me if it's confusing. But in the last four seasons. Your stats are never So follow along, everybody. And you guys can tell me if it's confusing. But in the last four seasons... Your stats are never confusing.

Yeah, exactly. In the last four seasons, he's caught eight to ten touchdowns in each year. Very, very good. Now, if we remove all games played an odd numbered weeks on the East Coast... Just kidding. All right. The last four seasons, eight to 10 touchdowns each year, right? In three of those seasons, he had a fairly high ADOT. Not like MVS high or anything,

but in the 12 to 13 kind of range in ADOT. That's kind of been Tyler Lockett's thing. In those three seasons, he caught 28 touchdowns and only five of them were from inside the 10-yard line. That is amazing. 28 touchdowns, five from inside the 10-yard line. That is amazing. 28 touchdowns, five from inside the 10-yard line. But he did have this other season, 2020, where his ADOT was pretty low, 9.7.

ADOT is average depth of target. That tells you how far his routes are when he's being targeted. Seven of his 10 touchdown catches actually came from inside the 6-yard line that year. So basically, in the three seasons where he ran more downfield and was targeting more downfield, his touchdowns were long touchdowns and that should scare you because that's the Russell Wilson connection.

But when he did play a shorter route, short of target, you know, role, he caught a lot of short touchdown passes. So I think the thing with Lockett is, you know, can he get to the eight to 10 touchdowns that he's had each of the last

four years? My conclusion would be, not unless he changes his style and goes to his 2020 mode where he's high catch, PPR kind of stud, low ADOT, lower yards per catch kind of guy.

He'd have to become that player. Otherwise, you're not going to see those Russell Wilson scrambles around, finds Lockett downfield for the 40-yard touchdown that we see two, three times a year, it seems. Right. That's out the window.

But I think if the Seahawks are smart, that's what they're going to do with their offense, especially when it's Geno under center. They're just going to have him get rid of the ball quickly. So slants, digs, outs, screens, all those things, it's not going to be good for his yardage. His metrics are going to stink. But he'll rack up catches that way.

Yeah. All right. So that's just a couple of the training camp battles to watch. We've got a lot more to talk about. That's not my favorite training camp battle.

Oh, go for it. Hey, wait, wait, hold on, hold on. If you want more of Dave's favorite takes, you'll get them anyway. But if you like them, then you should vote for us at podcastawards.com.

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It's going to be something. It's going to be late. All right, Dave, your favorite sleeper. Go to Dallas. No, this is your favorite sleeper. Camp battle, camp battle, camp battle. Go to Dallas. No, this is your favorite training camp battle. Camp battle, camp battle, camp battle. Go to Dallas, but overlook the running backs. Overlook the receivers.

Overlook the tight ends. Go to the kickers. It's Jonathan Garibay versus Liram Hajraululau. Are we really doing that? Come on, different Dallas. It's the Packers receivers. Because every spot there is up for grabs, it seems like. We can make sense of Alan Lazard being a starter there.

Are we sure Sammy Watkins is going to make the team? Randall Cobb probably will be a starter there. How high will Christian Watson ascend? Is Romeo Dubs a sleeper? Is there somebody else that we're overlooking? I think that's the camp battle. Who's going to be the guy that Aaron Rodgers ends up peppering with targets? And right now, you guys really like Lazard at his value.

Yes. Which is, I'll tell you in a moment, I like Lazard and Watson as a combo platter, too. 114th overall, Lazard is wide receiver 47 right now. Oh, the receiver i forgot is amari rogers who was one of your favorites adam as a rookie and i liked him initially before the cob trade before the cob before the cob trade you liked him a lot and i liked him as a prospect and apparently he's he's improved there there was good talk about him good buzz during the otas

and we'll see if he can end up working in as a role beyond special teams for the Packers. So a lot of openings there. Fantasy managers have to pay attention to that. Would you like to hear a Randall Cobb statistic that might make you raise your eyebrows a little bit? Yeah, let's go. Let's see if you can do it. Okay, I'm raising my eyebrows. You can't do it now. You have to hear the stat first.

Well, of course, we remember that famous Thursday night game without Devontae Adams where he caught two touchdowns, 15 yards. But he played the first 12 weeks of the season. Randall Cobb missed the last six games with a groin injury. In those 12 weeks, he was second on the team and 15th in the NFL with 12 red zone targets. And he actually Randall Cobb led the Packers

before his injury. He led the Packers and was 14th in the NFL with six goal-to-go targets. And Devontae Adams had five. So I'm sure some of those goal-to-go targets did come in that one game without... Actually, I shouldn't say I'm sure about that,

but it's quite possible when you had two touchdown catches and 15 yards. But yeah, that is a guy that people... I mean, our listeners email me about it sometimes or tweet me about it. They think we're overlooking Randall Cobb, and maybe in the sense that he could be a reliable end zone target for Aaron Rodgers. I just thought that was interesting that other than Devante Adams, he was the guy that, uh,

that Rodgers looked to the most while he was healthy. And you think about it, he, Rodgers needs those gotta have it targets when it's third down and six and they need to convert to keep a drive alive. How, how willing will he be to trust Christian Watson or, uh, Sammy Watkins

or even Lazard at that point? And he's played with Randall Cobb for years. He begged for them to trade for him last year. Could end up being way better than we thought and a much bigger piece of that offense. You can do worse with a late pick. It was the Arizona game, right? No, no, no, the games that you said, the amount of games?

Oh, 12 weeks. I don't know if, right? It's three catch. No, no, no. The games that you said, the amount of games? Oh, 12. 12 games. I don't know if it was 12 games or 12 weeks. But from week one through 12, they had a late buy. Yeah. He led the team in goal-to-go targets, and he was second

on the team in red zone targets. He was top 15 or top 16 in the NFL in both red zone and goal-to-go targets. Okay, that's Randall Cobb. Thumbnail requirement. I make these thumbnails before I know who we're going to talk about. So we are going to talk about Elijah Moore. I asked you guys for some potential

ADP risers. None of you said Elijah Moore, but I'm sure you could see it. I'll just bring it up because he's in the thumbnail next to Dave. He's currently wide receiver 36. He's going 85th overall. If you've been listening to Jacob Gibbs, every time Jacob Gibbs gets a chance to talk about Elijah Moore, he sees some really, really encouraging data.

And, you know, he's kind of convincing me that I want to at least have more exposure to Elijah Moore. So could he move ahead? The three guys going ahead of Elijah Moore right now are Hunter Renfro, Juju Smith-Schuster, and Devante Smith. Would you take him ahead of any of those three? If Wilson or Corey Davis were to get hurt or just absolutely slump in training camp,

then I think I could take him over Juju maybe and, and over Devontae Smith, maybe. Not Renfro? I didn't think you guys liked that. I think Renfro is going to be better than we think. He's kind of underrated. Renfro would be the only one I would probably take him over right now. But I think the problem with Elijah Moore is this is going to be another situation for the next several years if Zach Wilson does not improve,

where the talented wide receiver does not get the production because of the lack of quarterback play. As Dave said, Corey Davis and Garrett Wilson get hurt, then there's a little bit more to like about Elijah Moore. Elijah Moore's best numbers last year came when it was not Zach Wilson under center. He had two quality games with Zach Wilson Zach Wilson's best receiver for him was Corey Davis um now you're you know injecting another talent into the into the mix with Garrett Wilson and what he brings to the table probably a better run game with Brees Hall and so you know will the target opportunity and

better tight end play you know I think whether it's CJ Uzama or Tyler Con so, you know, will the target opportunity... And better tight end play. You know, I think whether it's C.J. Uzama or Tyler Conklin, you know, the tight ends are better too. So it's just tough to say that Elijah Moore will get the volume that he needs because that's, I think, going to be the thing that caps his production. Yeah, I guess I could see some reports. Elijah Moore is clearly the best receiver at camp.

And these are not far-fetched reports either. And there could be some, some helium for Elijah more news. But those reports in order for the helium to really mean something, there need to be reports about Zach Wilson being better too. Maybe. Yeah. Can't get much worse.

Those reports will be there. I mean, he's throwing against air, you know, so he's probably going to look good. I don't know. Were they there during OTAs? I don't know.

I remember one negative report on him during OTAs. Right. I remember that one, too. We'll see. All right. We'll keep an eye on the Jets. They'll be so interesting. If the Jets had a good quarterback, they'd have one of the best offenses in football. And look, you know, maybe

that doesn't prove me here, too. Maybe. News and notes. This was interesting. Kyler Murray's new contract includes requirements to watch film of upcoming opponents. That's interesting.

He probably didn't want that leaked. He was pulling a Jamarcus. It's not, yeah, it's interesting. Daniel Popper of the Athletic thinks that Chargers wide receiver Josh Palmer will become the clear number three wide receiver for the Chargers. Is Josh Palmer worth

drafting ahead of Randall Cobb? Would you rather have Palmer or Cobb? Palmer. After our discussion about Cobb, I think I'd say Cobb. Would you rather have Palmer or Cobb? Palmer. After our discussion about Cobb, I think I'd say Cobb. How about Palmer or Nico Collins of the Texans? Palmer.

I think I'd go Collins. This isn't to say that Palmer is a bad player. I think he's a good player. He's just, at best, the third target getter in that office. The thing about guys like Palmer compared to the two that you brought up is those guys are locked into their roles, which could be very solid production. Palmer is an injury away as we saw last year for being potential league winner. So I will take Palmer's upside way more than I would take the ability of maybe Cobb or Collins becoming a number three receiver but I my argument to that is I can draft Collins or Cobb and if they're not working out

within the first few weeks of the season I can go to the waiver wire and I can find a receiver who's an injury away from being good for fantasy there sure so I'd rather just start with the guy who might end up being good. If you're drafting Cobb or Collins or Palmer to be starters for you, you're probably doing it wrong with how you're drafting your team. Well, certainly. I'm going to take the upside. This is a lottery ticket type of guy in Palmer who, again,

as we saw last season when we had the injuries to the receiving core for the Chargers, his production was great. He's tied to an unbelievable quarterback. I'm not drafting Collins or Cobb. I'm drafting Palmer. I'm drafting 10 running backs ahead of any of these receivers. Can I tell you how stupid I am? I mean,

this is unbelievable. Schrager, I hate you. You need to come back. We are currently broadcasting in the wrong stream. This is the live mock draft at 1 p.m. stream. Oh, boy. Oh, God, I suck. I mean, this is what a disaster I am.

So that whole Elijah Moore thumbnail discussion. Yeah, irrelevant. Well, I'm going to change it. So now do we have to do a live mock draft right now? I can change everything after the fact. But to all of you watching live, I'm very sorry. And I tweeted the wrong link and everything. I just suck at this.

All right. Tyler Algier could become the starting running back for the Falcons sooner rather than later, according to The Athletic. That's a position battle we'll be looking at in just a moment. There are two players who are on the franchise tag who are not reporting to camp right now, and that's Kansas City left tackle Orlando Brown, according to NFL Network, and Jesse Bates, safety for the Bengals. Meanwhile, Roquan Smith for the Bears.

He's not on the franchise tag, but he wants a new contract, and he's not going to participate in training camp for the time being. That's good. Kansas City rookie wide receiver Justin Ross is on the IR, and he's going to be out for the season. So they drafted him. He had an injury in college, still not healthy. Dynasty stash, I guess,

at best. I don't believe they drafted him. Oh, that's right. They signed him after. Sorry. Buffalo, according to Peter King of NBC Sports, is comfortable with Gabriel Davis being a solid number two wide receiver. And other Bills wide receiver, Jamison Crowder, has missed two straight practices. Hopefully he can get back out there soon.

I was reading in the athletic as well around the Bills, Joe Buscaglia does a great job carving the team. He said, just talking about the running backs, that Zach Moss is still getting work with the first team offense. And that's a little concerning for Singletary and for Cook, probably more so for Singletary. Now, as he noted, he said clearly what they did at the end of last season, going with basically just a one-back offense,

Moss is going to have to really show something to earn playing time. But he said, don't be surprised if what we saw last year, when he was a healthy scratch, if that's not the case anymore, that he will be part of the active roster. Now, again, you probably assume he's going to be, you know, third on the depth chart, second behind Singletary in terms of what role he'll play, but any role that Zach Moss has, because it seems like the coaching staff still trusts him, could just be a cap to whatever ceiling that we get out of.

More so Singletary than Cook, but for both of them. Oh, that sucks. It does suck. We're going to talk a lot about that. Let's see if that sticks. It's early in training camp. Okay. All right.

Let's take a look at some potential adp risers and fallers and start with three quarterbacks jalen hertz this is a list from dave jalen hertz russell wilson and trey lance uh you think all of these guys could rise you think some of them could fall currently jalen hertz using fantasy pros average draft position jalen hertz is qb7 rus. Russell Wilson is QB 9. And Trey Lance is QB 14. Is the overall thing there, Dave, that they all could rise?

Right. That's the idea is that they could get very popular very quickly. Now, Hurts is already popular on this podcast. I'm the low guy on Hurts, but I know that, Jamie, you love him. Heath loves him. You guys, I think you both have him

as top five quarterbacks now? Top four for me. Okay. So I could see people start to build excitement for him. A.J. Brown's there. Great offensive line. It could take one drive in the preseason, and everybody's going to race to get Jalen Hurts on their fantasy team.

And I might raise him where I am. I think it's 11 at like eight or nine. So I could even raise him up. So I can see that there's room for more upside to be built in and more excitement to grow for Jalen Hurts. Same exact thing for Russell Wilson. If he looks good in the preseason and there's all kinds of highlights of him playing great and you know,

he's going to talk after practice and he's going to say, yeah, it's great to be in an offense with so many capable receivers and they let me throw and etc etc people know that russell wilson is a good quarterback already he did it in seattle they will be way more excited to draft him and maybe reach for him and trey lance is you know could be what lamar jackson was in 2020 I think that was Lamar's breakout year. I don't remember all the years kind of blend together right now. Uh, 2019.

Sure. That's what I said. Yeah. You could see Trey Lance kind of take that step in, in fantasy drafts where people reach for him before they take a second veteran quarterback. That's exactly what I intend to do in every draft. So if you had rankings and you were going to recommend

get Trey Lance, you would tell people by round nine, get Trey Lance and then worry about finding a Carr, Stafford, Cousins. This is the year to do it. And here's the thing. His year starts against Chicago and Seattle. Now, I don't know if I could imagine two better matchups for Trey Lance to begin his starting season with than Chicago and Seattle.

So he's going to be a DFS darling in week one. Everybody's going to start him. And then in week two, he'll build off of the big game in week one. He could be a guy that gets you off to a hot start. I did say that about Lamar Jackson in 2019. I didn't love Lamar Jackson in 2019. I was the low guy in him, too. And he ended up making me look bad, and he was the MVP

of the league. But I did say that he would get you off to a hot start because of his match. He played Miami and somebody else. And Trey Lance could do the exact same thing. Okay. So if Jalen Hurts and Russell Wilson rise, I think I said Hurts was QB7. I apologize. He's QB8 and Wilson's QB9.

Who do they move ahead of? Dak Prescott's QB7. Yes. Kyler Murray. Okay, but can they get past Kyler? Can they get... I don't know. Burrow's QB5.

So we have Burrow much lower than that. Burrow will fall. I don't see Russell Wilson rising. I think he's kind of going to be locked into the eight, nine range. I just don't see how he gets a little bit higher because the excitement's already there. Now, obviously the drafts are not there, but I think the excitement for what he is, you know, and, and there there's pro and cons to Wilson that I think people will debate just in terms of the rushing. Will he, you know, actually produce more, even though he's throwing more, you know, all the things that you're going to hear detracting Russell's.

I just don't see him necessarily being, but, but the other two Dave mentioned for sure, you know, I think Hertz can get past Burrow past Prescott because I think that's when, you know, the, the draft process will sort of, you know, push him up. And Trey Lance is easy. I mean, you know, he's, he's going to be, I think he's going to be the biggest riser or any, any when, you know, the, the draft process will sort of, you know, push him up and Trey Lance is easy. I mean, you know, he's, he's going to be, I think he's going to be the biggest riser, any, any player, you know, just because once, once they move on from Garoppolo and you see something from him, uh, you'll see everybody's rank list changed, you know, and that, that will be the biggest, you know, dramatic scenario, I think for any of the quarterback. Here's the

most upside of anybody in round 10 plus. He't be in round 10 yeah so that's a good question who's the biggest riser of ever of anyone who do you this jamie says trey lance it's gonna be trey lance i'll give you what i think lazard could get there what's his adp now it's like 114th i think i said i might could see him going in the 80s by the end of it all it's christian watson's on the pup list right now. I don't know how long that's going to be, but a Packers receiver probably deserves to be in the top 100. So we've got to figure out who it is, and then that guy could really, really move up high.

All right, so we've got two picks locked in. Russell Gage, yeah, he could be. Gage could be another one. So we've got two picks locked in. We can take Lazard in round eight. No one else in our league will do that. And we can take Trey Lance in round nine. No one else is going to do that.

And we've got the two biggest ADP risers locked up. Okay, yeah, we should do it. I don't know if you want to do that until their ADP actually rises, but sure. All right, running back, running back for Dave. He said Zeke. These are four running backs who are going in the RB2 range. RB16 is Zeke.

RB19 is Antonio Gibson. RB21 is Brees Hall. And RB23 is J.K. Dobbins. And they're going between 31 and 49 overall. Zeke, Gibson, Brees Hall, J.K. Dobbins. Dave, who has the most potential to rise in this group? Who's last? Dobbins? Dobbins?

Dobbins. Dobbins. Because all he has to do is just start practicing and looking like his old self. I mean, even I'll chase that. Okay, so if all four of these guys

have good camps, look like they have solidified roles. And you're already hearing about it with Gibson. Right, he's 12% body fat. Zeke Gibson, Brees Hall, J.K. Dobbins. Who are you going to take first in this group, Jamie?

Who am I going to take first? Who do you have ranked highest now? And I guess I'll phrase it differently. Who do you have ranked highest now, and who has the most upside? It's Dobbins, as Dave said. The minute he practices, people are going to get more excited about him because of the team he plays for and what he started to show us

pre-ACL injury prior to last year. Dobbins is what? The guy who could rise the most? Yes. Who has the most upside? I'm moving ahead of all these guys right now. He's in the same mix. Changes by format. I don't ahead of all these guys right now. He's in the same mix, you know,

changing by format. Oh, wow. I don't see myself moving Zeke at all. I'm not excited about him. Mildly interested to see what Gibson looks like, but I don't want to get excited based on body fat percentage because they, their off season has kind of told us,

I think what they think of him. And so, you know, he's somebody that I think he's fallen too far because in some cases, like in the Scott Fish Bowl, for example, in my draft, he went in like round eight or nine. It was just ridiculous. Wow.

But clearly people are out on him for a reason, and I get it. His role in the passing game is minimized whenever McKissick is there. Could be even worse if Samuel stays healthy. Curtis Samuel stays healthy. The receiving core is better. Carson Wentz didn't throw to his running backs to the same level that, you know, Philip Rivers did, for example, in Indianapolis. Different kind of player, different style.

I don't think Wentz will necessarily make that a priority. So, yeah, I'm nervous about Gibson, especially with an offensive line that's going to be worse Brees Hall look at the comparisons you can make to Javante Williams one of them was the 36th pick in the draft one of them was the 35th pick in the draft Javante Williams went to a team that previously finished

28th in scoring the year before they drafted him and Brees Hall is going to a team that just finished 28th in scoring the year before they drafted him. And Brees Hall is going to a team that just finished 28th in scoring the year before they drafted him. I think Brees Hall is probably a better prospect than Javante Williams. I'm wondering why we don't have the same enthusiasm for him. Obviously, the role is going to be huge. We know if Javante Williams had the role that we wanted him to have, he would have been a superstar and a steal in drafts.

I guess I shouldn't say the enthusiasm, because obviously Brees Hall is going ahead of where Javante was last year. But I don't know. I'm not really feeling a ton of buzz for Brees Hall right now, the way I was for Javante last year. And I think if Brees Hall can get a role that we wanted to see from Javante, if Michael Carter just plays kind of a secondary role and Brees Hall is a borderline workhorse, this could be that rookie running back that plays like

a first round pick. I don't know. You guys feel that way? Yeah, but what's the likelihood of that happening? I think it's pretty solid. I mean, they don't have a ton invested in Michael Carter. He was a day three pick. He's a change of pace guy, I think. Brees Hall is an every down back in the making. I don't know if it happens this year, but he's born to be an every down back, I think. And why not? Why not turn it over to him, you know?

Because the coaching philosophy for that team is to use multiple backs. We don't know that. They said as much the day they drafted Brees Hall. They could say, sometimes actions speak louder than words. They're not going to draft a running back and then tell Michael Carter and everyone else,

hey, you're done, right? Sure, but they're also not going to. Yeah, of course. The Broncos drafted a running back Carter and everyone else, hey, you're done. Right? I mean... Sure. But they're also not going to hurt his butt. Yeah, of course. But the Broncos drafted a running back and told him, you're going to split exactly 50-50 with the other guy for however many games that you're healthy. I know. What I'm saying is, if Javante Williams had gotten that role, it wouldn't matter that he

was on such a bad offense. He would have been a fantasy star. If Brees Hall can get that role, I don't think he'll necessarily be held back by the Jets' offense. He could be great. He could be very good. But that's the first hang-up I have with Brees Hall, is that I think that he's going to split more than we'd like to see. And that's going to frustrate us.

I just wonder how long that lasts. We don't think anything of Ty Johnson or Tevin Coleman. Jets think highly of those guys. One of those guys is either going to be just a special teams player or a game day inactive. But the other one will play a little bit. The other one will be a Zach Moss annoyance. Very possible.

I think what will end up happening, though, with Brees Hall is almost like what happened with Jonathan Taylor's rookie season. If he's that talented, which I think he is, and he has that type of upside, by the middle of the season, you'll start to see him take over this backup. And so it may not happen early on like we want it to. I don't think, first off, Michael Carter, he doesn't have the resume of what Melvin Gordon had.

So while Carter did some nice things for him last year, remember when he came back from his ankle injury after he had that great string of production with a different quarterback, they didn't go back to him. You know, he wasn't necessarily the same feature guy. And so I think that speaks more to Michael Carter than it does the coaching staff. So I think if Brees Hall does what Brees Hall's capable of doing,

even in the constraints of what this potentially offensive, you know, ebbs and flows can be, you know, good, bad, whatever, Zach Wilson holding them back, however you want to sort of put the negative spin on the Jets. I think Breesaw could sort of overcome some of these obstacles. The fact that Becton is there, I think the offensive line will be in better shape.

If he's right, he's a big piece of that. They're going to try and run the ball. I think to take pressure off Zach Wilson, I think he could prove that he's successful in the passing game. I think Brees Hall is priced appropriately. Yeah, I'm just saying, I think if there's some reports that he's going to play on third downs and all that, that he could be a guy who really rises.

Well, it's preseason highlights. Yeah, I think people are going to fall in love with Brees Hall. If he breaks the 30-yard run and then scores a short yardage touchdown in the preseason game against the Giants, everyone's going to go nuts. And just one more comparison to Javante Williams. Brees Hall, in three seasons, had 718 carries.

Javante Williams had 366. So that is an edge that Hall has in this battle to be a rookie running back who can overcome a commitment. He has more tread on his tire? No, he has experience carrying a big workload. We know he can do it. Well, the other comparison also is both guys are better than Michael Carter.

Yeah, but Michael Carter, pretty damn good. You know, that is a problem. No, I meant that they both played with him. They both, yeah. Well, one well, one has, yeah. All right, let's take a break here. When we come back, we'll talk about wide receiver ADP, potential ADP risers and followers at wide receiver.

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Dave's got a list of five wide receivers. Jimmy has a list of players too. We'll get to them Terms and conditions apply. Visit amex.ca slash business platinum. drafted. Brandon Cooks is wide receiver 20. He's a round five pick. Jerry Judy is wide receiver 26. He's a round six pick. Gabriel Davis is wide receiver 31. He's a round seven pick. And then after pick 100, you have Russell Gage, who's wide receiver 44, and Sky Moore, who's actually going, I think, one spot ahead of Marquez Valdez-Scantling at wide receiver 54 and 138th overall. So it's Cooks in round five, Judy in round six, Davis in round seven, Gage late around eight, round nine, and Sky Moore truly late. These are your risers. You think Gabriel Davis, can Gabriel Davis get even higher than this? 74th overall wide receiver 31. He's going to, I've been talking about him for months he's going

to be the biggest breakout candidate on everybody's list of wide receiver everybody there's gonna be people who get too excited about gabriel davis but he's got that type of upside we saw it late last season i think he's interesting to compare to jerry jud guys, because they're going nine spots apart. Judy's 65th, Gabriel Davis 74th, and they're both looking for breakouts, and they both have great quarterbacks now. Who would you guys rather have, Gabriel Davis or Jerry Judy? Davis.

Davis. Russell Gage. If Chris Guy starts the year on the pup list, which is a four game absence, right? Minimum four game? Or maybe he's on short-term list, which is a four-game absence, right? Minimum four-game. Or maybe he's on short-term IR, which is what, three games?

Or they don't have that anymore? I forget. Sorry. The IR rules. I don't know. I think IR is three games. If he's going to miss at least three games, when would you take Russell Gage?

I'm comfortable taking him in that same range that we talked about with Lazard, like round eight or so. Because I think he can get you off to a decent start, and I think he's going to end up mattering all season long. Okay. Would you rather have Sky Moore or MVS? They have basically the same adps i've i've landed on more jamie i go back and forth um i think more has probably got more

upside because he's gonna do no pun intended more um you know but i think it's going to be so frustrating with all of these guys i mean you're going to see with Mikko Hardman as well, you know, Juju and, and MBS and, and more and, and Hardman, it's going to be, I think just hard to settle on. This guy is a consistent starter. Hopefully by the end of the year, one of these guys has stepped up and has earned a consistent amount of targets and, and we in week out trust from from Mahomes I should say trust because he's I'm sure he's going to trust all like this but uh week in week out consistent production from all these from one of these guys if not more um you know so it could

be Sky Moore could be Hardman who we've noted uh you know Jacob's uh Jacob Gibbs I know you know Adam but um it seems as if every time Tyree kills off the field, Mikko Hardman's been a go-to option for Patrick Mahomes. Obviously, Juju's got the pedigree. And MBS, he's the one that they paid the most. So they have different investments and different, I think, levels of interest going into all of this. And then we'll just have to see who comes out of it with the highest level of, again, trust and productivity.

So for me, I'm passing on Juju, and I'm more interested in MVS and Skymore and where they're going to end up, and Hardman, and where they're going to end up settling. All right. At tight end, Dave has Pat Frymuth. Jamie has Cole Komet. So they're actually back-to-back in Fantasy Pros

in terms of where they are among tight ends, although Friar Muth at tight end 12 is going 114th overall, and Komet at tight end 13 is going 131st overall. I'm pretty sure Jamie would rather have Cole Komet. How about you, Dave? Friar Muth or Komet? I'll take Friar Muth. I see. Oh, go ahead. It's definitely easier to take Fri Fryermuth than non-PPR.

In full PPR, it's going to be closer, but I think that he's still going to be a red zone threat for the Steelers. You think Fryermuth's more likely to rise or fall? Rise. Kmet might make a higher rise. I'm having a hard time getting excited about Pat Fryermuth. Same. Just all he did was catch a touch. I'm having a hard time getting excited about Pat Frymuth same just all he did was catch touch

I know because it's a terrible thing to catch touch but you can't rely on that why don't I just draft Hunter Henry what's the difference because I think Frymuth is a little bit more of an explosive athlete and I think they're going to try and get him involved more

as a middle-of-the-field target. There's no more juju. They're going to get rid of the ball quickly. There's no juju the majority of the season. And how did he do? He was good. He caught a lot of touchdowns, and he made a lot of plays. He didn't make as many as he could,

and he admitted to that because they needed him to block more. I don't know if he made a lot of plays. So he said this offseason he's been told he's going to run more routes further downfield. He's trying to be more of a playmaker, do more of the ball after the catch. Okay, all right. I think he's got a shot.

So again, this is a late round pick. It's a little tougher in PPR, full PPR, because I think Komet could soak up some more targets. But I think he's a better athlete than Komet. I think he's more explosive than Komet. Okay, Jamie, I'm going to look at your list here of wide receivers that you think could make a big leap in ADP. We talked a lot about Allen Robinson yesterday,

so I'll skip him here, but he's going 70th overall, wide receiver 28, and you guys have him in your top 20, I believe. So I know you guys like Allen Robinson a lot. But there's a big group of receivers being taken between wide receiver 37, Rashad Bateman, and 47, Allen Lazard. Bateman, Traylon Burks, Christian Kirk, and Allen Lazard. So I'm sorry. There were a couple running backs in there.

That's why I got a little thrown off, but it is a decently sized group. Bateman, Christian Kirk, Alan Lazard, and Traylon Burks. Four wide receivers going between 37 and 47. Who do you think ends up, by the time we're at Labor Day weekend, who's the first one drafted in this group? Bateman, Traylon Burks, Christian Kirk,

Alan Lazard? Bateman, by far. And he should be. Then who? Then if Burks has a lot of strong reports and potentially preseason performances, he could have a huge leap. Because I think the fantasy draft process, once the NFL draft ended, it was basically London and Burks were the one and one A. And then all this negative stuff happened for Traylon Burks. And I think then it's Robert Woods is getting healthy

and is he the best guy there? I personally don't get taking Woods over Burks. but i think if burks has anything positive to show people he will be one of the biggest risers as well you kind of don't want to see it though right uh yeah i was on another podcast yesterday and you know we were having a conversation about um you know almost very similar to what we're doing here. And it was, you know, I said to the host, you don't want anything positive about Traylon Burks.

Right, so you can get him late. Right, let it stay where it is. Let everything positive be about Robert Woods. Let it be more about Derrick Henry is looking fantastic and it's going to be the same old offense and they're not going to throw the ball and nobody's going to matter, blah, blah, blah. I think Traylon Burks has huge potential. The later you get him, the better, but I think it's not a bad idea

if you want to reach around or two earlier for what could be a, for at least this year, poor man's A.J. Brown. Why would I take Traylon Burks ahead of Christian Kirk if they both have the number one option, if they both have the potential to be the number one option? And I guess right now I would probably say Christian Kirk has a better chance than Traylon Burks to be the number one option. Would you agree with that? That just as of right now, July 25th or whatever the hell today is, 26th, Christian Kirk has a better chance than Burks to be the number one guy. Yeah, so why would I take Burks over Kirk?

You don't have to. I don't think there's any problem with taking Kirk ahead of Burks. I think they're in a similar situation where there's uncertainty. Pete Prisco was at Jaguars camp as part of his camp tour yesterday. He actually

challenged him a couple times on why is this receiving core not getting the respect it deserves, and why are you being viewed as the poster child for guys who are getting overpaid? And Pete's estimation of Kirk, and I know he liked Kirk before he signed Jacksonville, so we kind of give Pete a hard time about having a Jaguars bias because he used to cover that team. But when Kirk was hitting the market, I know some of the people Pete talked to,

and they were telling him, Kirk is going to get paid. I don't think anybody expected him to get paid this. And has the chance to play much better and prove that he was maybe not misused, but not used enough in Arizona. And so now it's a matter of, is there enough target opportunity for him in Jacksonville? And I think the one difference between Berks and Kirk, you know, the concentrated targets that are going to Traylon Berks, you know,

this offense isn't going to necessarily have multiple options. You know, there's obviously Robert Woods, there's Austin Hooper, whatever they do with, you know, Henry out of the backfield, but that's kind of it. You know, I mean, there'll be some auxiliary, there'll be some other guys that, you know, have chances to play well. Auxiliary? Yes.

I've never heard, that's not a word we use often in the fantasy community. If I see it in my card. There's, in Jacksonville though, I was reading this morning, you know, Zay Jones making play after play and Marvin Jones still there, and Doug Peterson loves the tight end,

so Evan Ingram will have opportunities to make plays. And we know Travis Etienne's a catch ball backfield. And so they're going to spread the ball around. So I don't know if Kirk's volume will necessarily live up to what maybe his play is. So I'd like the upside a little bit better of Burke's, but they're basically back-to-back for me in my ranking. Okay, let's move on a little bit here.

By the way, you know, as a media member, which I used to be, you're very low on the totem pole when you cover an event and you get sent to the auxiliary press box, which is often where I ended up when I was either a student or a young professional, go to a game.

Oh man, I went to the Final Four one time, got sent to the auxiliary press box. was in the ceiling at lucas oil and i mean i couldn't even say i i had to watch on tv it was so embarrassing um but yeah uh all right so just uh more self-deprecation a couple super bowls where um it's not bad though because they put you in the stands and i would prefer that that's so cool it was awesome yeah it's okay bad though because they put you in the stands. I would prefer that. That's so cool. It was awesome. Yeah.

Okay, fine. Thank you. Being in the stands in a football stadium for a football game is great. Being in the stands in a football stadium for a basketball game sucks unless you have great seats. I do not recommend going to a Final Four game and sitting in the nosebleeds. You'll barely be able to see what's going on. All right, I just want to talk about running back training camp battles here to end the show.

We're going to look at four, I'd say. Atlanta, Buffalo, Kansas City, and what do you think? Houston or – I don't want to shortchange this. I don't want to shortchange this. I'm sorry. I have to cut the show a little short today. So anything we don't get to, we can get to on another episode. But why don't we just go?

We don't need to spend five minutes on everything. All right, let's run through it here. Jamie, give me your take on Atlanta right now. They ran the second fewest plays in football last year, but they were actually a fast-paced team. They were 11th in situation neutral pace, but they just stunk and their defense was bad. So they need to run more plays, obviously.

But give me your take on the Falcons running backs. Are we actually going to get a Falcons running back that's worth starting? I mean, we had one last year, so I wouldn't necessarily say we don't have the opportunity to get one this year. I think if Patterson stays healthy, it'll be frustrating. And I think by the end of the season,

Algiro will be a guy that we're using as at least a flex. But to open the season, if Patterson stays healthy. It'll be frustrating. And I think by the end of the season, Algier will be a guy that we're using as at least a flex, but to open the season, if, if Patterson's healthy, it's going to be, you know, probably 50, 50 split at best. I think they still trust Patterson enough.

You know, it's not like they made a huge investment in Algier, but clearly everything that you're hearing and it just makes total sense. They don't want to, I think, use Patterson fully in that role. Like they were forced to last season. So Algier is somebody that I think is the opportunity to be a flex,

better non-PPR, half PPR than full PPR because he's not catch the ball. He's a one-cut runner, physical type of guy. The nice thing about him is that when he makes a decision, he sticks to it. He's not going to dance a lot behind the backfield. He's not a shifty guy. So, you know, he doesn't have a lot of, you know, I think big playability. So we'll find out how that works. But that's what Arthur Smith, I think, is looking for. He's looking for, you know, the guy's going to put his nose down and kind of just get the yards that are there and maybe, you know, a couple extra on top of it. So I'm not excited really

about either guy. But, you know, I think at this point, Algier makes more sense than Patterson. You draft Algier ahead of Patterson? I'm starting to feel that way. I never really wanted to draft Cordero Patterson. They're so close in my rankings to begin with. And so I think we'll also see, based on their receiving core, Patterson plays a little bit more at wide receiver as well. All right, Dave, let's talk about Buffalo here.

If James Cook is the passing downs back, and by the way, as Jacob Gibbs has pointed out, Devin Singletary, I believe he ran the third most routes of any running back last year, something like that. So there's a role in this offense for a pass-catching running back that Singlet the last five games of the season. And then he scored three more touchdowns in two playoff games. Can Devin Singletary be good if he's just basically uninvolved in the passing game? Can he be a must-start running back? He can be a low-end starter because you hope that he finds the end zone and still maybe catches one or two passes

on top of getting 12 to 15 carries. It's not pretty, but you're going to realize this year that there aren't a lot of running backs when you look at the rb2 that are gonna be just it's not gonna be plentiful there's not a lot of guys out there that you can start comfortably and so you'll see a guy that's got a shot at 15 touches per game who can still score from short yardage and you'll say okay i'll take that guy and i think singletary can be that guy if zach moss isn't taking work away from him and if james cook isn't taking work away from him and if James Cook isn't taking work away from him. You know, James Cook, if he starts making plays as a pass catcher,

they're going to start to fool around and let him have some carries too. And if he holds up there, then who knows what his ceiling is. Could you guys see yourself taking Cook ahead of Singletary in full PPR? Not yet. No, not yet. I think the fascinating thing with the Bills is Singletary is going to be the starter in quotes, you know, but what happens when he gets hurt, you know, and is it James Cook taking over that job fully?

Is it Zach Moss? Is it Duke Johnson? You know, who's going to be the guy that steps in if Singletary misses any time? And then as we've seen, you know, there's been times in Singletary's tenure, you know, thankfully didn't happen at the end of last season for people that were riding him. When he struggled, they've replaced him.

And so, well, again, will they replace him with James Cook, giving him more role to carry the ball? I'm so curious to see what they're going to do. Me too. All right, let's go to Houston. Dave, I'll give you Houston here. Oh, great. So you think, same question i asked jamie about atlanta do you think we'll have a a fantasy relevant running back here you know a reliable running back for fantasy in houston no i don't i think damian pierce will be

as close as it gets i think he's he's a capable serviceable runner but i bet he ends up splitting they're going to use multiple running backs there for different downs and distances. And it's not a pretty group. Pierce will be as good as it gets. Maybe he'll be a fill-in running back, a bi-week replacement guy, something like that. And he might have four or five good games

over the course of the whole season. Okay, the last two are Kansas City and Seattle. Jamie, you can go first here. Right now, which Chiefs running back are you drafting first Okay, the last two are Kansas City and Seattle. Jamie, you can go first here. Right now, which Chiefs running back are you drafting first and which Seahawks running back are you drafting first? Still Clyde, but it's getting certain closer. And still Walker, but again, that's getting closer. And I feel like that's the wrong way to go

because it's like we know Penny's been hurt. We know he's going to miss time. But what he doesn't what if he stays healthy if he stays healthy he's going to be the better of the two you know so it's like i hate i have them back to back right now i might just flip it and put penny first uh you know it's just i i i know he gets hurt all the time you know that's the problem yeah and and it's like you like we just keep waiting for that to happen. But what if this is the season that it's more than just a six-game stretch? What if it's a 10-game stretch? He's not going to produce at the same level because the offense is going to be worse.

But if it's a 10-game stretch of him being the guy or a 12-game stretch of him being the guy, maybe he just makes the whole season. And look, right now, I don know uh what the training camp report is but in minicamp penny missed time and then walker missed time and as they ended their otas walker was still hurt so what's to say he doesn't get injured as well right so uh you know if they keep saying time and time again penny's gonna start her pennies our starter pennies our feature guy every beat writer saying penny's gonna be their lead guy until proven otherwise how can we tell people differently okay last question we tell people to feel good about

either one of these guys oh because this all that's right sloppy so yeah if you look at these two backfields who do you take first a chiefs guy or a seahawks guy jamie a chief guy okay go ahead you can finish your thought i'm sorry to cut you off i was gonna say it's like with with seattle atlanta and houston those three backfields for example like you shouldn't feel good about anything you know i i think again if you're approaching it with the idea of i'm drafting a fantasy starter here to open the season you're not doing it right you know you're taking a chance look if you want to take a chance on and wait out walker that he's going to eventually become the guy that's fine i i totally totally get it. Same thing like you're drafting Madison. You're drafting Pollard.

You're drafting the second guy there. You know, Walker's going to play more than maybe, certainly more than Madison, but maybe as much or more than Pollard. So he may be good. But we can't trust that there's going to be a guy from Seattle that's good if they're both healthy. Can't trust there's going to be a guy in Atlanta that's going to be good. The offense is probably going to stink.

Can't trust there's going to be a guy in Atlanta that's going to be good. The offense is probably going to stink. Can't trust there's going to be a guy in Houston. The offense is going to probably struggle. So, you know, which one do you think by the middle to the end of the season could be the most impactful for you? All right, that's going to do it for Fantasy Football today. We are live 1 p.m. on a stream that I'm going to have to create because I broadcasted the wrong one. 1 p.m. with Tara Roberts joining us for a live mock draft.

So we'll see you then. Also, there's some content I want to promote real quick. Chris Trapasso on CBSSports.com did a write-up of all of the year two quarterbacks and what to expect. Very high on Trey Lance. He watched every snap for all those quarterbacks last year. So that's a really good one.

So just go to CBSSports.com and check that out. And we'll talk to you tomorrow on the podcast. And we'll talk to you later today on youtube.com slash fantasy football today. See ya.