Fantasy Football Today - Potential Risers and Fallers in Training Camp; Big Injury News (07/24 Fantasy Football Podcast)

Episode Date: July 24, 2023

Fantasy Football Today is available for free on the Audacy app as well as Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Podcasts, Stitcher and wherever else you listen to podcasts.  Vote for Fantasy Football Today for "Best Male-Hosted Podcast" and "Best Sports Podcast" on PodcastAwards.com Training camps are underway and we've got so much to talk about including our predictions for the biggest risers (2:00) and fallers (3:10) in ADP during camp and the preseason. Anthony Richardson's stock could go in either direction, while J.K. Dobbins and Breece Hall could be fallers if the news doesn't get more encouraging soon. We also have a Dak Prescott conversation (8:40) and then a lot of injury updates (14:10) that you need to know about ... On to our potential training camp risers at QB (26:55), RB (29:40) WR (35:40) and TE (39:00). Can Deshaun Watson and Jahmyr Gibbs go much higher? How high could Marquise Brown climb in the rankings? ... Our potential fallers at QB (46:50), RB (49:30), WR (52:05) and TE (57:15) include Kyle Pitts, Cam Akers, Najee Harris and Justin Fields. Find out why! ... Email us at [e-mail] SUBSCRIBE to FFT Dynasty on Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/fantasy-football-today-dynasty/id1696679179 SUBSCRIBE to FFT Dynasty on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/2aHlmMJw1m8FareKybdNfG?si=8487e2f9611b4438&nd=1 Follow our FFT team on Twitter: @FFToday, @AdamAizer, @JameyEisenberg, @daverichard, @heathcummingssr, @ctowerscbs Follow the brand new FFT TikTok account: https://www.tiktok.com/@fftoday Watch FFT on YouTube https://www.youtube.com/fantasyfootballtoday Get 20% off Fantasy Football Today merch: https://store.cbssports.com/collections/fantasy-football-today%20?utm_source=podcast-apple-com&utm_medium=web&utm_campaign=buy-our-merch&utm_content=fantasy-football-collection Join our Facebook group https://www.facebook.com/groups/FantasyFootballToday/ Sign up for the FFT newsletter https://www.cbssports.com/newsletter You can listen to Fantasy Football Today on your smart speakers! Simply say "Alexa, play the latest episode of the Fantasy Football Today podcast" or "Hey Google, play the latest episode of the Fantasy Football Today podcast." To hear more from the CBS Sports Podcast Network, visit https://www.cbssports.com/podcasts/ To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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It's time to dominate your fantasy league. Off to the races, and he stays on his feet. He's just got to go the distance. Now, here's some combination of Adam, Dave, Jamie, and Heath. Fantasy football feels like it's in full swing right now. Our Dynasty League has begun. You know, the one we talked about, the start of Dynasty League from a few months ago that we've been planning. And training camps have begun.

AFC Championship Game Preview, the Jets training camp, the Chiefs training camp. Those are both underway. And more and more and more will be opening up this week. We're really excited for it. And we're excited to talk about some training camp risers and followers predicting which players will have a big bump up or down in their average draft position. We also have a lot of news to get to. And we have Heath and Jamie here. Heath, we haven't talked to you in a little while. How was your week last week and your weekend?

It was fantastic. I discovered something very surprising. I am kind of a, not in the way people think of it, but I'm kind of a South Beach guy. Really? Went to South Beach guy. Really? Went to South Beach for a couple of days with my wife, and it was just fantastic. I enjoyed it more than the times when we've gone to the Keys. It was a really nice few days of just, I mean, it was hot, but it was, you had the ocean and the pool, and it was really nice.

That's good. That's right. It's beautiful. Yeah. It's a nice beach. There's a big scene down there, but just the beach itself, the sandy part, very nice beach. Jamie, how are we doing? Doing well.

How about yourself, Adam? How are you? I'm doing great. Thank you. Jamie and I had a very interesting text conversation about fantasy football yesterday. We'll let you all in on that conversation and let Heath weigh in. All right, real quick, because we're not going to get to the risers and fallers for a little while. We have so much news to get to, so let's do a little fill in the blank the biggest training

camp riser will be blank the biggest training camp riser will be blank i will say anthony richardson i think he's still outside of the top 12 quarterbacks in terms of all ADP that I see. Some of it you look at and he's like QB 18 or QB 20. And so if he gets named the starter, he'll definitely be in the top 12 and he'll probably be in the top 10. That's a good one. Jamie, how about you?

The biggest training camp riser will be blank. I'm going to say Jameer Gibbs. I think he's got a chance to approach the top 12 running backs if he continues to, if he performs like he's supposed to. There's been some video of him. I think the Lions have also maybe started as well. There's been some video of him catching passes from Jared Goff.

And obviously anytime you get those things, and then people like me who make jokes, but they think it's serious when I do the rocket chips, he's just fun. People like me who make jokes, but they think it's serious when I do the rocket chips. He's just fun. You know, I think he's going to be a good fantasy option as well. Yeah. You know, on NFC, he's already RB12.

Fantasy Sharks, RB17. So it really depends on where you're looking for Jameer Gibbs. All right. How about the biggest fantasy faller will be blank. Oh, sorry, biggest training camp faller for fantasy will be blank. I think it's the two holdout running backs. Okay. Barkley and Jacobs. You know, if they play this out like they could,

when fantasy drafts start to happen, people get concerned. You know, and so when you're talking about those two guys as top 10 running backs and you put them in the same range as high probably as Bijan and as low maybe as, I don't know if they'll fall behind like that Ramondre Stevenson group,

but they're going to fall. I think people will start to panic. Yeah, it's definitely going to happen. It's really easy for me to say on July 24th, there's no way that they and their agents are going to look at this market and actually sit out and give up money because there's no money to be had later. But I do agree with Jamie that if we get to August 24th and they're both still skipping training camp, their ADP is going to fall. Yeah. I mean, I was going to talk about this a little

bit later, but at this point, would you take Nick Chubb over both Barkley and Jacobs? I'm not downgrading them yet. Not yet, but, I mean, look, they're definitely going to hold out. You know, so they're going to be training camp holdouts. Are they going to be game holdouts? That's the question, you know. And they're going to try and, you know, leverage and posture and say all the things that they need to say to hopefully help themselves. But at this point, you know, I think the writing's on the wall

that they're going to have to play out their season to accrue the games that they need for next season to get their money. I thought Nick Chubb's quote was interesting. He was asked about over the weekend. He was on the Zoom that Austin Eckler set up with the running backs, and he said, Our production ends up hurting us. The better we play, the worse it ends up hurting their potential to earn long-term money. I wonder what that sort of means in terms of, he said all the right things. I'm not going to do anything to jeopardize my team, but he's one of those guys that's

going to be up next year. So it's a very fascinating development that we have to keep an eye on. But I think in regards to those two guys for fantasy, I don't think they're going to fall yet. I think you just got to make sure that you understand, follow the news, and hopefully you draft late enough for your redraft leagues that it will give you enough information to know when you're picking those guys. But yes, if they do hold

out long enough, I wouldn't be surprised if that scenario happens. Nick Chubb is one of those guys that can go ahead of them. Heath, did you have another follower you wanted to mention? I'll go with two more running backs, and I don't know which one it'll be, but whoever's the last to get off the pup, Bree Saul or J.K. Dobbins. Um, I think Hall's now basically a round two pick around RB12 most places.

Um, now, if I'm the best ball ADP, it's probably round four because that's the way the running backs are being drafted. But I still think even when he's cleared in 100%, it's likely that this is more of a committee than people are drafting it to be, especially in Hull's first year back off the ACL. But if he spends two, three weeks on the pup, for the same reason as Barkley at Jacobs, that uncertainty, his ADP, he's definitely going to fall. And what did you make of J.K. Dobbins opening up on the pup list?

I hate it. So I, I saw a couple of things where he, um, I guess had some sort of surgery this off season, maybe cleanup process. And then there was also the soft tissue injury that he had in many camp that caused him to sit,

which a lot of people, I think just attributed to him being unhappy about his contract. Um, there was a report, I think on the Ravens team site, you know, the, the stories that they do there where he was seemingly in the facility. And,, I think, on the Ravens team site, the stories that they do there, where he was

seemingly in the facility, and I think the quote was, he was all smiles. So, I'm guessing it's just more precautionary than anything. I totally agree with Heath on Brees Hall, but I think Dobbins will probably come off. I'm going to guess this week. Okay. A lot of people are just going to throw the

injury-prone label on J.K. Dobbins and don't want any part of him. I guess, uh, if he's a fourth round pick, are you guys comfortable with JK Dobbins? Let's say he's off the pup list within a week. You know, good with him as a fourth round pick. I love him in the fourth round and I would even take him late round three if it's a heavy running back draft. Only heavy running backs? Like what, 215 or more pounds? 220.

Sorry, I got to... Let's move on here. Quick Dynasty draft update. We have named the draft. It's been the named TBD League. It is now the Baked Burger Dynasty League. And the Baked Burger Dynasty League has been on the clock for one hour and 51 minutes. This is our startup Dynasty League has been on the clock for one hour and 51 minutes.

This is our startup dynasty league with five CBS people. Me, Jamie Heath, Thomas Schaefer, and Dan Schneier. Two people who donated very generously to St. Jude. And five people who I kind of know. And in an hour and 51 minutes, we have made zero picks. We do not have a pick yet, so we'll keep you posted on that. We do have a trade. We have someone traded their first round rookie pick and the 12th overall pick for the 5th overall pick in the startup draft,

which, by the way, does include rookies, rookies and veterans. So there you go. Now you know everything about the Baked Burger Dynasty League. The interesting conversation that Jamie and I had, we'd love to know how Heath feels about this. We're talking about Dak Prescott. We're just two dudes texting about Dak Prescott on a Sunday. And the question is,

is Dak Prescott closer to the Anthony Richardson, Deshaun Watson, Tua group? And I put Richardson in there because that's the way you guys have it ranked. I know ADP doesn't have it like that. But, you know, more like quarterbacks 8, 9, 10. Richardson, Watson, Tua. Or the Cousins, Geno, Daniel Jones, Russell Wilson, Aaron Rodgers group.

I feel like I was kind of leaning. Dak was more in the Richardson, Watson, Tua group. And Jamie was kind of leaning. He was more in the Cous cousins, Gino, Daniel Jones, Wilson Rogers group. I don't know if I'm forgetting any names or including too many, but Heath, what do you think? Where's Dak Prescott for you? He is, well, I mean, he's in between those two groups. This is the reason you're asking the question, but I actually, I do have him quite a bit closer to the, um, the Watson group.

I think he, like, I'm a little bit concerned that the offense in Dallas, the pass attempts won't be there for Dak to give us another top five season. Um, I don't know that he has that. I mean, he's one, another one of these guys who over a five or six game stretch, I think multiple times has shown us the 30 point upside. I don't think he probably has that with McCarthy running things there and how good we think the defense is going to be. But I still expect that unless he's hurt, he's going to be a top 10 quarterback. All right, Jamie, what do you think? You think he's closer to the cousins group, right? Dak Prescott? Yeah, but I don't think that should be viewed as a negative thing. I think as he said, I don't know if he has the ability to get back to being a top five guy. And the three guys that you mentioned, Richardson, Watson, and Tua, I could see them being top five guys. Obviously Dak can do it. But just based on, I think the loss of Kellen Moore and what McCarthy kind of wants. And again, you've heard me say this many times, because going back to the owners meetings, he sort of backtracked off of that because it was right after Moore was let go from the team

or moved on from the team that it was kind of taken out of context about him wanting to be more run heavy. And he said at the owners' meetings, for example, that how do you replace Ezekiel Elliott? Well, you distribute the ball differently. He said we could see more throws at the goal line situations, certain things that could change.

And obviously what they've done this offseason, you know, bringing in Brandon Cooks, not bringing in the running back of significance, you know, it kind of says they're still going to throw the ball enough. But I think just hearing what McCarthy said and how they won last year when Dak was not there, you know, where they just didn't necessarily have to rely on their passing game to be dominant. And I think that's kind of where this offense is trending. Like, I don't think they want Dak to have to go out and win games. I think they're happy with him just not being a game manager,

but a little bit better than that. You know, and I think that's kind of just where he is right now. So Cousins, to me, feels a lot similar to Dak as opposed to Dak being compared to what Anthony Richardson could be if Richardson hits. Obviously, there's a different floor conversation, but ceiling, I think, you know, you lean toward those guys. So to me, it's kind of that's the bridge, essentially.

It's like Dak's in between those guys, like you said. And I think the upside is a little bit capped. In terms of pace of play, time in between snaps. In the last four seasons, the Cowboys under Kellen Moore, pay attention to anybody who wants Justin Herbert, they were second, first, second, and fourth in pace of play. They were one of the fastest teams in football, getting the ball snapped and getting going.

The Packers were nothing like that under Mike McCarthy. Their pace of play rank, they were first in pace of play in his first season as head coach. But other than that, I don't think they were higher than 11th. Or no, they weren't higher than 10th any other year. They had some very, very slow seasons. They actually did run a decent amount of plays. They were usually in the top half of the league in plays

because they were on the field. They were good. They were efficient, picking up first downs, staying on the field. But pace of play was completely different. Plays run, it'll be lower. It'll be lower. I don't think they'll be,

they might be slow, but they're still gonna probably run a lot of plays because they're gonna be a good offense. I think you brought up one thing that for me is difficult in doing projections because Kellen Moore has always been that really high pace of play guy, but he's going to a Chargers team that ran a ton of plays because every play was designed to go for three yards. And so I don't know that Justin Herbert actually sees an increase.

In fact, I have him projected for fewer plays than they ran last year, even though they do have Kellen Moore going there who has been a very fast OC. Okay. That's a good point.

I think also, though, just the Rodgers comparison or the Packers comparison, Aaron Rodgers has said this. He likes to run the clock down. Right. Yeah. So he can observe everything.

I don't think Dak is like that. Green 18! Right. Green 18! Right at the right of the buzzer all right thank you uh for that dak prescott conversation we're going to get into our training camp risers and followers after we update you on all the news and notes and tell you about heath's dynasty show it is no longer in this podcast feed it is in its own special awesome retro podcast feed with the coolest logo in town. FFT Dynasty, Fantasy Football Today Dynasty. Anywhere you listen to podcasts, check out FFT or Fantasy Football Today Dynasty. You can still watch it live Tuesdays at 11 a.m. Eastern at youtube.com slash fantasyfootballtoday.

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I think we were probably runner-up last year. Okay, so let's win this year. Okay, news and notes. So I was not invited to the Zoom call yesterday, but all the running backs had a Zoom call. A lot of the running backs had a Zoom call. And according to NBC Sports, participants in that call felt that Josh Jacobs

does not plan to show up for training camp or the preseason. So, yeah, I mean, we already addressed this. But he seems a little – Saquon Barkley seems angry. Josh Jacobs seems a little angrier. Should we be drafting Zemir White? Do you think any chance Zemir White has the third down roll, or is that definitely going to be Abdullah or Bolden or something? Heath, what do you think any chance Samir White has the third down roll or is that definitely going to be Abdullah or Bolden or something? Heath, what do you think about Samir White?

I mean, we should be drafting Samir White, yes. But it's still one of the last two non-kicker or defense rounds for me. And I don't think that there will be somebody who's on the field sharing with Jacobs a lot, enough to matter. I think Jacobs has to miss time for any of those guys to matter. All right, Jamie, we already talked about Dobbins. We didn't talk about Melvin Gordon, though. The Ravens signed Melvin Gordon, and they have Gus Edwards, obviously. Is there a backup that you're interested in on Baltimore?

It's still Gus Edwards. I think as long as he's healthy, he's in the same boat as J.K. Dobbins, two years removed from the ACL tear they tore basically in the same month in 2021 prior to the season. And so Edwards has been five yards per carry every year of his career.

You know, he's going to be productive. The thing about Melvin Gordon, I know people look at it and say, wow, he's got still the name recognition. I don't think a lot of people realize he was on the Chiefs practice squad the majority of the second half of the year. Actually won a Super Bowl ring, but he never played in Kansas City. So he's past 30.

He struggled at the end of his Broncos tenure, bounced around until he ended up with Kansas City. So I think there's just more. They got stuck a couple of times over the last couple of years without somebody that they probably feel like they trust. And this is more, I think, a scenario of somebody that they trust. So I wouldn't put too much tension on it. And the contract, up to $3 million, I'm sure it's just very incentive-laden. I don't think we've seen the release yet on what the money is, but it probably has to do a lot to earn the $3 million.

Yeah. And I think Josina Anderson had a report out yesterday or the day before that both Gus and Ed Dobbins are expected to be 100%. This is just a depth signing. I think it tells us more about the state of the running back market. The fact that Melvin

Gordon got signed and Leonard Fournette and Ezekiel Elliott and Dalvin Cook are all still free agents with training camp starting for everybody. The way to get a job as a veteran running back is to agree to take an incentive-laden deal. There's not guaranteed money available right now. All right. Biggest news, maybe. Javante Williams not expected to start training camp on the PUP list.

So since July 1st, it's more than 100 drafts on NFC. Javante Williams is RB26, which is basically the same ADP as DeAndre Swift, Rashad White, and Damian Pierce. It's ahead of James Conner, Isaiah Pacheco, and David Montgomery. So, Jamie, what do you think about Javante Williams in that range right now? Look, I mean, maybe he's going to be even higher as a training camp riser show. Javante Williams

could certainly be one of the biggest risers. Should he be going ahead of DeAndre Swift, Rashad White, Damian Pierce, James Conner, Isaiah Pacheco, David Montgomery? He should go ahead of Pacheco and he should go ahead of Swift. But that's it for me. I still have the same reservations. This is great news and it's obviously exciting, but there's so much history that tells us that these guys in year one after their ACL tear, unless your name is Adrian Peterson, they struggle. And so I think that's just something you have to take into account. And we saw last year firsthand, you know, J.K. Dobbins, for example. I think this is going to be a shared backfield to begin with,

and probably the majority of the season, even if Javante is healthy, he should be the lead guy over Samaj P. Ryan, but they're going to both split time. It's a great situation. You know, the additions that they made this offseason, from Sean Payton to the two offensive linemen, should make things a lot better. But I still always worry about these guys coming off ACL tears, and, you know, especially if they come off, if they come back too soon, you know, so there's always the risk of something else. We see sometimes, you know, uh, ACL is fine, but the hamstring, you know, compensating something else, soft tissue,

uh, becomes an issue also. So I'm, I'm still probably out on Javante Williams if he creeps up too high, but he's, he's going to move up one spot for me right now. He's 27. He'll move ahead of the others. All right. I just, I still, I guess now, we kept saying, you know, why is Brees Hall ranked so much higher, being drafted so much earlier than Javante Williams? And I think one of the reasons was he had a less severe injury. But now, I mean, I guess you could say that Javante is ahead of Brees Hall. Hall is on the pup list.

Javante not expected to be. So what's your take? I don't think we know for sure. I think some of this could be team specific in terms of how comfortable they are bringing a guy off a pup at certain points. I wouldn't want to take it that far quite yet. If we go another week and Javante is doing everything and Brees Hall's still on the pup, then I would say I think Javante is ahead of Brees Hall. But like Brees Hall is running. They were talking about how he's clocked at 23 miles an hour or something.

He's there. He's just not ready to practice. Is Javante going to be a part-time player just not on the pup for a week? And then they're both in the same stage. So I'm not ready to say Javante is ahead of him yet. player just not on the pup for a week. And then they're both in the same stage. Um, so I'm not ready to say Javante is ahead of him yet, but I, I do think round six at RB 26 is a good price. I've got Javante at RB 20 in round five.

So, okay. I think there's also a talent difference here too. You know, you're drafting. If, if both these guys are healthy, Resol is a much better fantasy option.

At least he's proven. So in the small sample size, you know, what you project. But I think that factors in also. But I mean, I'll speak for myself. I think just looking, I'm looking at the rankings here. Heath, you have them five guys apart. Brees Hall's at 15. Williams is at 20. They're six spots apart for me. And Heath and I, I think for the most part, have been the low guys on Brees Hall. I wouldn't, as I've said here, I wouldn't take him until round four right now. So that's way behind, I think, where ADP is. Man, remember that one game in 2021 against Kansas City when Melvin Gordon did not play? Week 13, Javante Williams, 23 carries, 102 yards, 6 catches, 76 yards, and a touchdown.

29.8 fantasy points. But he's just never – that's really been his only game where he's been the guy. And he came through. All right. Back to the news and notes. Probably pick up the pace a little bit here so we can get to the crux of the show. But Brees Hall is on the Pup List, as mentioned. That's old news.

That was from last week. But Jimmy Garoppolo – oh, Naeem Hines. That broke this morning. Buffalo running back Naeem Hines, that broke this morning. Buffalo running back Naeem Hines expected to miss the season with a knee injury. We weren't really talking about him. I guess in the back of my mind, I was thinking maybe he could get some more work. He only had five catches in nine games last year and cut into James Cook's share a little bit, but that's not going to happen.

Sorry to hear it for Naeem Hines. Jimmy Garoppolo passed his physical with the Raiders, so that is good news. Amari Cooper and Kadarius Toney had suffered injuries, apparently minor for Cooper. I don't know about for Toney, but that's unbelievable with Toney. I remember Rashad Penny got hurt very early in training camp last year,

and then he came back. He was fine. He played six, seven games, whatever it was, but Heath, can you believe this? Can areas Tony's hurt already? I don't think it's that surprising. Like, I don't, I don't know. One day that's, that's kind of what happens. And I think like there was some, uh, a big positive thing that came out about Richie James being the best receiver on the first day of camp, which is makes you feel bad about sky more. But, but what I wrote like a month ago or a month and a half ago in one of my dynasty wide receiver updates was if this happens, which just happened and

Caderius Tony misses two or three weeks, like the biggest training camp riser is going to be Sky Moore going to the moon. Yeah. Yeah, I guess. Why not? I mean, is this just a question? Why not MVS? Because we know he's 29 years old or something. He can't earn more than four targets per game. Okay, that's fine. How about Dalvin Cook? So Dalvin Cook reportedly, he offered his ex-girlfriend a million dollars to send a letter to the NFL claiming that he did not abuse her, even though she had already testified under oath that he did. So she had accused him of abuse. He tried to offer her, bribe her basically to, I don't know, maybe I shouldn't say that word, but he offered her a million dollars to write a letter to the NFL absolving him.

So he could be facing a suspension, Dalvin Cook. Just keep that in mind if you're doing any drafts anytime soon. And it might keep teams from gambling on him too. I asked this yesterday. Who are the guys who have been relevant for fantasy who were like Cook and Zeke and Fournette and Hunt right now, free agents when everybody opened camp? Not guys that got cut and then picked up by somebody else,

but guys who were legitimate free agents going into camp. Somebody said Deontay Foreman, Antonio Brown, because he had the suspension thing hanging over his head. But, like, I just wonder if we should just be out on Cook. Yeah, I don't know. Why not all of them? Well, because he's the only one who's really getting drafted in the first 10 rounds.

He's also the best one. He's the best player. Well, no, no, yeah, I agree. But I just was curious why you're excluding the other guys. I guess the one situation could be if Zeke returns to Dallas, and then at least you know there's familiarity there. Or for whatever reason, Kareem Hunt goes back to Cleveland or something like that. But yeah, I, I, I mean, look, I, I don't, I don't see the, the path to not perfection, but the path to just, you know, the, the workload that we're looking for, you know, even if, you know,

Doblin goes to Miami and we know that that backfield is, is not full of stars, but there's still guys that the coach likes and the Jets would presumably be a situation where he's sharing with Brees Hall at some point, unless Hall's just not ready to play at all. Alright, so many notes. Bryce Young signed his rookie contract. CJ Stroud and Anthony Richardson have not.

Patriots right tackle Mike Onwenu is on the pup list. He's a very good player for them, starting right tackle. The Jets seem confident that Aaron Rodgers will play more than one season. Rashad Bateman is back with Baltimore. Washington apparently could change its team name again. Chase Claypool, remember him? He's on the Pup List for the Bears.

Cleveland head coach Kevin Stefanski said Nick Chubb has done well catching the ball. Detroit wide receiver Marvin Jones is on the non-football injury list Josh Reynolds SZN and Detroit rookie tight end Sam Laporta is expected to have an important role right away according to DetroitLions.com Sam Laporta or Dalton Kincaid who are you taking?

Kincaid for now but Laporta is a very very intriguing option I feel like I got bullied into taking Dalton Kincaid higher than Sam LaPorta. But yes, still Kincaid. Okay. That six-game sample size is going to be interesting. That first six games without Jameson.

The Giants signed James Robinson and Cole Beasley. It's really great news if you're a Giants fan. It's really what you want to see. That's what we have to do. We have to sign James Robinson and Cole Beasley. Definitely need more slot receivers. Let's take a break. When we come back, potential training camp risers and fallers after this.

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Jamie did all the work. Jamie, is your column out? No, I'm sorry. Wait, that sounded bad to Heath. Jamie wrote an email replying with like 70 names. So that would suffice. That would suffice. There was nothing for me to do.

Exactly. Jamie, is your column out yet? No, I've not finished it yet. It will be done later today. You're nothing for me to do. Exactly. Jamie, is your column out yet? No, I've not finished it yet. It will be done later today. You're writing about this subject, though. I'm writing about training camp storylines. So just things to keep an eye on in training camp. Things to look

forward for the next month. Alright, so let's talk about some risers. Jamie thinks Tua, Watson, and Kyler could be risers at quarterback. Tua and Watson are quarterbacks 10 and 9 in NFC ADP in July. Kyler Murray is 22. I guess we should put Anthony Richardson in this column as opposed to the other one.

Yeah, you had him as a follower. I was looking more at our rankings and who could rise. Gotcha, gotcha. All right, so Richardson, that makes sense. I think that we don't have to expand on that. But when you talk about Tua and Watson, if they're going to rise, they're going to have to rise ahead of Trevor Lawrence,

Justin Fields, Justin Herbert, guys like that. Can they do that no matter how good their training camp is? No. So they're probably not risers then. Not from that standpoint, no. I was thinking more in terms of their overall rankings for these two in particular. Will they get closer to the group in front of them?

Because we're having the conversation, obviously, first time in a long time about drafting quarterbacks early. We don't typically say that. The industry, for the most part, doesn't typically say that. And so now when these quarterbacks are getting pushed up, is it forcing fantasy managers to feel like they have to take these guys a little earlier? And these two in particular, Tua and Watson, are so polarizing because I think if they have strong camps and look like they're capable of looking, we may see them in a situation where they get drafted a little bit higher. If Kyler Murray is ready, let's say he's expected to be back in week three,

when would you draft him? Regular season? Yeah, yeah. This range, maybe a few spots higher? Yeah, I'm quite a bit higher than his ADP, which I think is 22 or something at QB. QB 15 range, 15 to 18. Okay.

And yeah, I can't get over this idea that I read that they're going to try to have him play under center. It just seems like if they do that, and he's coming off toward ACL, and he doesn't have DeAndre Hopkins, but obviously you're not investing a high pick in Kyler Murray. He already takes the seven-step drop. I think he doubles it.

He runs backwards so far. He's so fast, that's the thing. Potential running back risers for Jamie are Jameer Gibbs, depending on the ADP you look at. But do you think Gibbs could get ahead of, I guess it would be like Ramondre Stevenson. It's kind of like a bridge running back after Pollard and Henry

and before Najee and Gibbs. I guess, do you think Gibbs could flirt with the second round, the 2-3 turn? I think the only way that happens, again, if it's a lot of running backs go early, the 2-3 turn's a little early, but I think mid-round three is Stevenson gets Dalvin Cook.

That type of scenario. I don't think – it would be pretty dramatic to see Ramondre Stevenson fall like that if without company. I think Gibbs is another one in the 2-0 Watson mold that could rise in our rankings but is unlikely to rise much, at least from RB12 in the running, unless David Montgomery gets hurt, obviously. But, I mean, he could go ahead of Ramondre Stevenson without rising.

They just have to sign Dallin Cook. You got to think that David Montgomery could be a camp riser. This guy's like RB30 in ADP. I hope not. It's nice to be able camp riser. This guy's like RB30 in ADP. I hope not. It's nice to be able to find that. Yep. Javante Williams is on this list, of course.

Alexander Madison. So, Jamie, what would you need to see to have more confidence? Not to say you're not confident in him, but to make Madison into a riser? I think he's just going to rise by nature of more people drafting and the spot that he's in. I don't think he should be past the fourth round. But I do think that when you talk about where he's starting from,

round six in RB22, I think he's one of the more polarizing people you see because depending on what you're looking at, you're looking at workload, you're looking at opportunity, people are excited about it. You look at advanced metrics, and he's not of the more polarizing people you see because depending on what you're looking at, you're looking at workload, you're looking at opportunity, people are excited about it. You look at advanced metrics, and he's not the best running back with his explosive rate and the teams that he's had success against when he's replaced Dalvin Cook.

So I think it'll just be by nature of you're looking for a potential starting running back. A guy's going to get a lot of work and has shown some flashes of brilliance in terms of what he's done with that work, then he'll get pushed up into the fourth round. And I think that's where he'll end up settling. Okay, I'm sorry. I got distracted here.

We have an update on Naeem Hines from Tom Pelissero. While sitting stationary on a jet ski, Naeem Hines was struck by another rider and sustained serious but non-life-threatening injuries. Hines will require surgery and will miss the 2023 season. What a bummer. That's just terrible. There's some thought that this is a Dalvin Cook destination now.

Yeah. Oh, boy, that would be interesting. That would be a long bonus pod. All right. Any of the Dolphins running backs? These are the guys that Jamie has as potential risers. Any of the Dolphins running backs? They're all going in round 10 or later.

Khalil Herbert, who's a round 9, 10 pick, RB 37 in NFC ADP. James Cook, round 8 pick in RB 30. Heath, your reaction to that? Any of the Dolphins running backs? Khalil Herbert, James Cook as risers. Do your reaction to that? Any of the Dolphins running backs, Khalil Herbert, James Cook as risers, you agree with that? Yeah, I think you could just say any of the Bears running backs. It's whoever wins that job. And Herbert's probably the most likely, but he's going to have to prove that he can do some things that he hasn't been able to do in the past.

I think we'll see Cook's rise maybe just from the way that the beat writers have responded to the Naeem Hines injury. Because there's been talk I've seen already in a couple places about how Hines was in the mix to compete with Latavius Murray and Damian Harris for touches behind James Cook. and if that type of narrative continues that it's it's cook's the lead back and harris is that is the two even if he's taking the short yardage work which i think he would then i think we see cook maybe get up into that rb25 range geez more bad news here off the injury front from lions.com or from tim twentyman who writes for detroit lions.com. Defensive back C.J. Gardner-Johnson. This is a guy who won the Super Bowl last year with the Eagles.

It was really good for them. Now he's on the Lions. He went down with a right leg injury Monday and was carted off the field. He was visibly upset and team captains Buggs and Goff made it a point to go comfort him, hoping for better news than it looked.

That team did a lot to upgrade their secondary, a lot to upgrade their defense. That was part of it. That's a tough break for them. We'll see what happens there with CJ Gardner-Johnson. Anything you guys want to add here with running backs who might rise? I think whoever wins the Dolphins' job,

as Heath sort of said with the Bears, same situation. If we get some sort of clarity on A-chain is this, that, and the other, he's going to be the more popular of the trio. But Wilson and Mostert, and especially if there's an injury to one of those two guys, the other one might significantly rise. So that's one to keep an eye on. I think that Jamie makes a good point in that A-chain could be a big riser. If we get to right before week one and Jeff Wilson or Raheem Mostert's at the top of the depth chart, I don't know that they're actually going to rise that much.

We're just going to convince ourselves that the young guy is going to take the job. Same thing in Chicago. I think if Deontay Foreman wins the job, I'm not sure he's going to be a huge riser. But Herbert or Roshon Johnson could make a big leap if they were the clear one. Yeah, I just wonder if A-Chain in be in Miami, will be a special teams guy and like a gadget player. You know, if he's getting any carries really before the third quarter of preseason games or anything like that. I'm curious to see because I mentioned this all the time. He's he's small, very small, something like 180 pounds, as I recall, at the combine.

187. Yeah, that's that's small. Okay. Wide receivers who could rise. So Jamie has Jerry, Judy, and Calvin Ridley. They're in round four. Deontay Johnson, and then kind of later, this group of Deontay Johnson, Marquise Brown, Gabe Davis,

Jackson Smith, and Jigba. But the round four guys, Judy and Calvin Ridley. So could you see Judy and Ridley going ahead of DK Metcalf at some point, getting into the middle of round three? Yeah. I have it ranked that way. I know you have it ranked that way, but people aren't quite drafting it that way.

I think Ridley is the one that could really, like if he shows up in whatever, if they play their starters for a series or two in the first preseason game or the second, and Lawrence is just peppering Ridley with targets and he looks like Calvin Ridley, then yeah, he could jump into the round three discussion for sure. Yeah, yes, he could. Not going to be round two for these guys,

but round three, maybe. Yeah, Judy, I do wonder where people are going to be. I feel like people who do fantasy rankings are going to be higher on Judy than average Joe fantasy player. I don't know how you guys feel about that. I would totally agree. Yeah, I mean, I think anytime you mention Jerry Judy,

you hear bust attached to his name because he's struggled through the first three years of his career for the majority of it, battled some injuries. There's this stigma attached to the Broncos after what happened last year when I think everybody, for the most part, is settling for these guys as opposed to wanting to draft them, which will sort of lend itself to your Russell Wilson argument. But yeah, Judy, I think

if you look at the way he finished last year and what he profiles to be, and if he could ever live up to that, he can easily be a top 12 receiver. It's going to take a little bit of a leap of faith to trust that, but he's got that upside and potential. Yeah, and I think I'm the low guy on Judy.

So he has a great opportunity to rise in my rankings, but I've got him in round six, so I'm not getting an A.J. or a Judy right now. Jamie, with Deontay Johnson, Marquise Brown, Gabe Davis, and Jackson Smith in Jakebo, round six through eight wide receivers, who do you think could rise the most?

Oh, Marquise Brown. I mean, it's more of, you say Kyler's ready to go. He may jump two rounds easy. You know, I think again, you know, you look at what he did at the beginning of the season last year, his opportunity, the targets he should be able to get

and a healthy quarterback. You know, even if it's not 100% of Kyler Murray, that's I think what's going to sway people. You know, so he's a great buy right now because even with Colt McCoy, he should still be good. But he has a chance to be special with Kyler. Have we heard anything on Kyler Murray?

I feel like they've been very quiet about it. Just that Will Brinson pissed him off. He came out and said something about – I don't remember what it was, though. I'll find it. I'm just reading right now on ESPN they just put a Cardinals training camp preview up a few hours ago in reality Murray may not be ready until sometime during the season

I mean nobody knows what can you say at this point all right how about some tight ends who could be on the rise you have two listed they're both outside the top 12 and average draft position Dalton Kincaid and Greg Dulcich what do you have two listed. They're both outside the top 12 in average draft position. Dalton Kincaid and Greg Dulcich. What do you have to say about Kincaid and Dulcich? Yeah, I was just looking at the,

you know, the young tight ends, for example, who have, you know, I think some upside. And I think depending on where you look in terms of rankings, you know, that's what people will start to follow and probably projections,

you know, for sites that lend itself to do that for their draft rooms. I think Kincaid is going to be the most popular rookie. And once you start to hear more buzz about him when training camp opens and the different formations that they're using him in. And Josh Allen is looking for Dalton Kincaid.

And, you know, he scored this touchdown in a red zone drill or this touchdown in a seven-on-seven. You know, those things will get some hype. And I think the same thing with Dolchitz, who, you know, at least based on the second-year tight ends right now, you know, you're looking at probably him and Trey McBride unless I'm missing somebody. Oconquo, but, you, but we know where his situation is. But the second-year tight ends,

Dulcich has probably the best upside of that group right now. And so if he has that, again, training camp performance and there's been some more positive buzz. Remember, there was negative buzz when Sean Payton first took the job. Now there's more positive buzz coming out, and I think there'll be more so once training camp is in full swing. These are two guys I think that can creep into the top 12 conversation. Well, we've mentioned Judy and Dulcich from Jamie.

But I mean, Russell Wilson's got to be on this list, right? He just seems like such an obvious. The Broncos in general. Is this why you did this show? Yeah, yeah, yeah. What is Russell Wilson going to do, though, in the offseason or in the training camp or preseason that's going to wash the stink of last year off of him? He might be a huge riser the first month of the season in perceived value, but I just can't imagine. Is Russell Wilson going to play in the preseason?

Well, I would think so. With a new head coach, I would think they'd want to get the starters out there a little bit for some reps. But I just think that if there are positive vibes and there's a lot of talent on offense there, there really is. And you've got Sean Payton. Look, I think people are going to be on opposite sides of it. I'm not going to have a hard time buying into it. Some people are. But if you're like me and you can buy into Sean Payton and you don't think Russell Wilson is completely done, and if you heard Robert Turbin, who was on our show last month, and I asked him, has Russell Wilson washed up?

And he said, hell no. If you can buy into the bounce back, it's not going to take much. If you like Judy, if you like Dulcich, if you like Sutton, even as a number three receiver, it's not going to take much to buy into Wilson. And then could you move him ahead of Rodgers, Daniel Jones, Geno Smith? I don't think it's really asking so much. So I just think positive vibes, Heath. Positive vibes.

Yeah. Well, you'll get those. They'll be corny. I mean from the reporters, not from him. But I think it's also, look, when you say rise, this is, I think, what started our Dak Prescott conversation. Is he going to get to where Dak is? I don't think so.

Is he going to pass Kirk Cousins or Aaron Rodgers or Geno Smith? Whether he should or he shouldn't, I don't think he's going to. And I think that's sort of where the cutoff lies. Like I said to you, I think if you're drafting Anthony Richardson or Tua Tungavailoa, Russell's in that group of guys you want to pair with him because there's still the potential for him to be a good floor quarterback. Can he get you 20 to 22 points per game? I think that's where he'll end up sort of living with the chance to have some spike weeks. But the positives are he's got Sean Payton.

He's got two offensive linemen that should make his protection better. I think I told you I saw something where, you know, he lost 15 pounds. Yeah. Now he's back. He's back with the team as opposed to this stupidity of having his own office and being away from, you know, the guys. That was why he said fail. Everything is trending in the right direction for him. And I think the biggest thing probably is that

they didn't trade their receivers. You remember what that story was at the draft of Cortland Sutton and Jerry Judy are on the move. Now he has a pretty solid group, especially if one of Tim Patrick or Marvin Mims can perform to maybe what their expectations are. You know, Patrick a couple years ago and Mims now. So with Dolchitz as well, it's a good group.

And, you know, the run game is still, I think, a little bit of a question mark, even though Javante Williams is back. So there might be a little bit more on his shoulder. So I don't think Russell Wilson ever gets back to what he was with Seattle, but he could certainly be a guy that can, you know, get you through some weeks.

Adam's just waiting for me to say. I've been stuck on this. He has his weapons being a plus compared to other fantasy quarterbacks. Maybe. Well, compared to Daniel Jones, yes. Well, Daniel Jones is not being drafted for his passing like he threw for 3,000 yards last year and it was like his breaking out party

nobody thinks Daniel Jones is going to have any success as a passer oh well that's okay that's not true nobody thinks nobody reasonably thinks that no I don't I think that's unfair to Daniel Jones I mean I think the Giants think that. I think that you bring in Darren Waller and you hope that he just keeps developing

under Brian Nabel. It wasn't unfair to Daniel Jones. Their path to success is not... Well, I think it's... They didn't go get a number one wide receiver. It's a little vague what you mean by success as a passer, I guess. You could interpret it many ways,

but I would take Wilson over Daniel Jones is what I'm saying. But no, I mean. You could interpret it in many ways, but I would take Wilson over Daniel Jones is what I'm saying. But no, I mean, some people believe in him, you know, and they just think that finally the time is right. But anyway,

all right, whatever. Let's move on. Any other risers you want to talk about, Heath, before we go to fallers? No, I think that's good. All right, good stuff. Let's take a break

when we come back. Potential ADP fallers in training camp. We'll be right back. Miller Lite. The light beer brewed for people who love the taste of beer and the perfect pairing for your game time. When Miller Lite set out to brew a light beer,

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And the ability to reach further with access to over 1,400 airport lounges worldwide. Redefine possible with Business Platinum. That's the powerful backing of American Express. Terms and conditions apply. Visit amex.ca slash business platinum. Welcome back. I do want to update everybody on the baked burger dynasty draft as we are now about two and a half hours in. And here are the picks so far. Okay, let's move on to the training camp fallers. Like I'm having this nightmare scenario in my head.

The first draft pick of the startup draft of the dynasty draft, I cannot let it be an auto pick, right? I mean, he's still got three and a half hours left, but I cannot let him auto pick. If he lives on the West Coast, it's still 730 there. Right, exactly.

I don't know where he lives. I'm glad that Adam doesn't know where these guys live. I know he lives in America. I also know that he made a very generous donation to St. Jude, and I do not want to make him auto-pick the first pick of our fantasy draft. No, you can't. You have to pause it. Yeah.

My question is, did he reply when you said the draft was starting on Monday? No, I had to email him personally to make sure he was aware. And then I said, he did not indicate to you that he was ready to go for this draft. Not that he's not ready to go, but he did. Like he was. He did. He did. Okay.

Yeah. But then I emailed him again this morning and I said, hey, you're on the clock. Just want to, you know, I don't know where you live, blah, blah, blah. All right. This is really interesting. You have Justin Fields in here as a potential faller. Um, how could that happen? What do you think? I think if he has bad training camp reports and, and, you know, any bad preseason performances, you know, he's, he's a guy that I think some people are still a little bit concerned about because while he's great as a rusher, you know,

he was under 2,300 yards passing last year and we can get excited all we want to about DJ Moore. Is that enough to put him over the top? I mean, I think we would all say yes, that we're, we're excited about Justin Fields, but, and when I say fall, or I think, you know, when you're starting to see like anybody like me, I don't know where you are on this Heath in terms of drafting. I guess I just pulled up out of the rankings page here, but, um, by comparison to Burrow or Herbert or those guys that are behind him, uh, for me, at least, you know, it's easy to say, okay, I guess I just pulled up out of the rankings page here, but by comparison to Burrow or Herbert or those guys that are behind him, for me at least, it's easy to say, okay, I'll take those guys over them because they're safer. And so if Fields hits and does what he's capable of doing, he should be an absolute fantasy star. But again, the passing is the thing that's going to have to get him there because he was on pace to be the best rushing quarterback of all time from a single season standpoint yeah i i i think it will be very very concerning if we get negative camp reports about

justin fields i am expecting everyone to be glowing even if he's not great and so i i will probably drop him now i think his adp's qb6 or 7 right now i don't know that i drop him below that but i've got him either 4th or 5th. I've kind of gone back and forth between him and Lamar. I could see dropping him down to 6th, maybe even 7th. You and I have the same first seven quarterbacks. Mahomes, Allen, Hertz, Jackson, Fields, Burrow, Herbert. And the only thing Dave differs on is Dave has Burrow 4,

Fields 5, Jackson six. It's really painful to have to put Justin Herbert seventh, isn't it? It's like doesn't feel right. It's not painful, but it's great to draft him. I mean, it's a lot of fun. Yeah. Well, I would say that if Justin Fields has a bad training camp or preseason and there are bad reports, I would present the argument of buying the dip because he wasn't a good passer last year, and he was QB 6 per game, and in the last nine games of the season, he was QB 4 per game,

QB 3 and 4 point for passing touchdown league. So I think he's already shown that he can be kind of a negative as a passer. I mean, he was on pace for 2,541 yards, 19 touchdowns, and 12 interceptions. That's like Daniel Jones would look down on that. Not the touchdowns part, I guess. But he's already shown, Justin Fields, that he can be close to elite if he's a bad passer or has bad passing statistics. So I think I would probably at least present that argument of buying the dip if there are negative reports on fields. So I just did. Okay.

Running backs. Barkley, Jacobs, Brees, Hall, Dobbins. Let's talk about potential fallers at running back that aren't injury-related. Do you want to throw out names, or would you like me to? Heath, anybody want to get in there? Yeah, I do not have additional names. You go ahead. Okay, I don't have any either, but let's figure it out.

I could see, depending on, again, what the ADP is, but guys like Rashad White, who don't have a lot of competition, but people question can he handle being the lead guy. I could see, who was I just thinking of? Sorry. Akers is another one. If he has another disappointing practice report, because they're not going to play him in the preseason,

that's the one I think that could fall. And if you get maybe any sort of, Devin Singletary looks great and Damian Pierce does not, that's one I think you could see some negative spin on as well. I think Ramondre, obviously, with all the flirtation they've done with veteran running backs, any of those guys get signed and he's going to fall.

And, I mean, if we get more about Jalen Warren's going to be on the field more, then Najee could maybe, I don't know where Najee's at in ADP. I've got him at RB17, so... Yeah, I mean, it depends. I'm looking at fantasy sharks or draft sharks,

and he's RB11. He's at the 2-3 turn. He's ahead of Brees Hall, Travis Etienne. I think, actually, pretty much all of the round three running backs could be fallers. If you're talking about Ramondre Stevenson, Najee Harris, Brees Hall, Travis Etienne, if there are more Bigsby reports.

Ken Walker is in this ADP. I don't know about that. Jameer Gibbs, if he's a round three pick. All of those guys could be followers. And Tony Pollard is obviously one as well. Although I also wonder if he could be a riser. I feel like right now his ADP might be kind of in between the Zeke scenarios. He's a mid to late round two pick.

Well, he's a mid to late round two pick, but he's RB7 or 8, right? I got him as RB9 on draft sharks. And I would just say he's got the same ADP as Derrick Henry. Yeah. Which I get, but that's one where we could look back and feel pretty dumb about it. Yeah, RB7 on NFC. All right.

Wide receivers. Potential fallers. This is a guy you really like, Christian Watson. I'm surprised by his ADP, that he's the 24th receiver. I would expect him to be higher. So this is probably wrong to say he's a faller. Oh, you're saying that he's higher in your rankings.

Yes. Like I said, I was looking at rankings when doing this, probably should have looked at ADP. So, um, but yeah, I,

I would expect him to fall if he has Jordan love stinks reports attached to him. I'm also, you know, I was going to put Romeo Dobbs in the potential riser thing because that was some of the talk during many camps that Dobbs was the favorite target for Love. And if we see that again in training camp, is that something that would take you off of Christian Watson, Jamie? No, but it would make me more excited about Dobbs. Again, you know,

we see this all the time. Yes, there's going to be a number one receiver, but there's also going to be secondary targets that are going to be successful. And I think when you look at it, this is a very barren receiving core, at least based on paper. It's so young, especially the top three guys who are expected to be with Watson, Dobbs, and Reed. And then Musgrove, Musgrave, whatever his last name is, I apologize. The tight end, you know, so this is a group that, you know,

has plenty of potential and upside, but also a lot of pitfalls. And so, you know, Watson and Dobbs in their second season, I think both are going to be competing for, you know, Jordan Love's attention. But even if one is not significantly better than the other, that's just going to make that second guy, which in this case, he would be a little bit down on Watson, but really excited about Dobbs if he's, you know, close in this case, he would be a little bit down on Watson, but really excited about Dobbs if he's, you know,

close in, in target potential to what Watson should be. Yeah. And I think, I think Dobbs was even held down a little bit when Jaden Reed was drafted. Cause there are people who like read more than Dobbs. I think Dobbs will rise even if it just becomes clear.

He's the clear number two. And you've got two bucks receivers on this potential followers list. And they're obviously Chris Godwin and Mike Evans, and I understand the concerns here. My question is, are Godwins and Evans? I'll go to Heath first. If Godwins wide receiver 27, about a round five pick, Evans is wide receiver 33, round seven or so,

could the quarterback situation get any worse? Is it already baked into the ADP? No, no, no. Did you watch DJ more last year? Um, it could have, so I'm lower than ADP on both of these guys right now. Um, so I think the only, the only case for them having a good, uh, rising would be that somehow the bucks talk Tom Brady at a coming out of retirement. I don't think, I think, I don't think it should go up with Baker Mayfield.

I don't think Baker Mayfield is going to do something in camp or the preseason. That's going to make people feel better about him. This is another one of those situations where at OTA is like a lot of the reports were about how bad Baker Mayfield and Kyle Trask both were. If that continues, and I think these guys will fall. Is it too early to assume it's going to be Baker Mayfield? Do you think Kyle Trask has a legit shot of winning this job?

I don't think so. Based on everything that I read, I think there was even one of the Bucs beat writers was saying they'll give Kyle Trask his opportunities, and it will come at the detriment of Baker Mayfield getting first-team reps that he needs. Yeah, I don't have either one of them ranked in my top 32 quarterbacks. Okay. Michael Pittman as a potential faller.

So I actually thought, Jamie, that maybe he could be a riser because of Gardner. I feel like if Richardson falls... When I first looked at ADP, when I did Buss' column a few months ago, following the draft, he was still being drafted as a starter. So to see that he's wide receiver 32 is a little surprising

to me. But yes, I would agree with you. He could be a riser. But I was, again, looking more at, I think, where Richardson was ranked and assuming that Pittman was still in that same range. But you'd rather see Minshew for Pittman, right? Yes. From a floor standpoint, yes. From a stealing standpoint, no.

Okay. Heath, how about you? Does Pittman have a higher ceiling with Richardson or Minshew? I would think it's possible that in a year or two he has a better ceiling with Richardson, but I think right now he has a better ceiling with Minshew because I think they'll throw it 450 times if Richardson's starting 17 games. I think that the problem is even if Minshew wins the job week one

or let's say Richardson loses it, at any moment they could easily go to Richardson. That's always going to be hovering over Pittman. I would be surprised. I don't know anything, but I would think if they think Richardson's close, he'll just start week one. If Minshew's starting, I would think that Richardson's probably a little'll just start week one. Like if, if Minshew starting that would, I would think that Richardson's probably a little ways away. I agree. I agree. Yeah. Um,

but we've already had their owner come out and say that Minshew will be better in week one than Richardson would be. So it is just a matter of how big is that gap? Everybody should accept that. That's true. It's just how big of a, I think it's, it's not about who would be better for the team to win. It's about, is Richardson close enough to not be detrimental to his own development by being out there? Yeah, yeah. I agree. All right, and finally, tight end Kyle Pitts. You have as a potential faller.

In ADPs, tight end five. He's a round six pick. What's your interpretation here of Pitts? Again, he's a very polarizing fantasy option. Based on his talent, he should be a much better fantasy producer. But we know the offense that he plays in and the coach that he plays for, and it's just a matter of, and the quarterback he has, all those things working against him too much that I think people look at it and say, okay, is it safer to avoid chasing the upside of what Pitts can be and take one of

the more reliable tight ends, whether it be Darren Waller or George Kittle or Dallas Goddard and those guys. And so I think that's just the decision fantasy manager is going to have to come to grips with on top of the fact that he's still coming back from the injury that kept him out of mini camp, you know? So if he's,

if he's banged up by any stretch that might push down his, his ADP as well. Okay. I mean, do you, is there something that would develop, other than an injury, offensively, a development for this team that would hurt Kyle Pitts?

They named Taylor Heineke the starter. Oh, wow. Is that in the realm of possibility? If Ritter stinks, maybe. I mean I would assume that Arthur Smith needs to compete

for the division this year for his job's sake so I think he's probably going to start whoever he thinks is better

so why would that be bad for Pitts if Heineke's better than Ritter because we know what Taylor Heineke is we have hope

that Desmond Ritter could be better than Taylor Heineke I would almost think though it's your Gardner Minchu argument

that Heineke would be better for those guys than Ritter would be. Just in terms of veteran versus young quarterback. If I'm not mistaken, Heineke last year was great for McLaurin, right? Or was it the opposite? I think McLaurin popped with Heineke and kind of stumped with everyone else.

I think Wentz was great for McLaurin. He was throwing the ball like 35% of the time. I don't know. Yeah, I think you're right. I think it was Wentz was great for McLaurin. He was throwing the ball like 35% of the time. I don't know. Yeah, I think you're right. I think it was Wentz. Okay, well, let me just say Heineken was great for the tight end. No, JK. All right, thank you, everybody.

Good show. Good stuff. Just saw an update that Amari Cooper's knee injury is apparently minor. Could be back out there any day. Adam Teicher tweeted that Kadarius Tony was not on the field at the start of practice today. It's just unbelievable. First day of camp. I don't know how anybody's taking

Kadarius over Sky Moore right now. Right now. I still would. There's your training camp follower after one day. He just fell like four rounds. Actually, I don't know if I would now with the knee, but I would have yesterday. Yeah, I mean, what did I say? Two weeks ago that I'm taking Sky Moore? You got lucky with the injury.

No, I mean, it's enough of what their roles are. And they both did nothing last year. I mean, let's face it. They both did absolutely nothing with the Chiefs. They had two moments. They each did absolutely nothing with the Chiefs. They had two moments. They each had a moment in the Super Bowl. Tony had a special teams moment. They both caught a touchdown.

Andy Reid has talked up both these guys. Sky Moore is going to be the slot receiver. I think that's big. Yeah, it's just he had such a bad rookie season. At least I've seen Kadarius Tony be a good wide receiver. We just haven't seen a productive wide receiver. If he plays, he should be better, but you've got to bake that into it, Mr. Bakeburgers. You've got to bake

in the injury risk. That's the question. Do you? It's easy to say that now. Of course you do. Look, some people would say no. Some people would say I never... You've heard this. Chris Towers and Dan Schneider. I'm pretty anti-baking in that.

Yeah, right. You don't project injuries typically. So some people just don't care. You never project injuries, but if it's two players that you're comparing and you're nitpicking between the two guys, you have to obviously factor something in. But I'm not nitpicking them if I'm not factoring in the injuries. Like if they're both playing 17

games, I could obviously be wrong about this because we don't know what Skymore is. I'm not saying that he's bad and his destiny bad, but if they're both playing 17 games, I could obviously be wrong about this because we don't know what Skymore is. I'm not saying that he's bad and his destiny bad. But if they're both playing 17 games, then it's an easy Kadarius Tony call for me. So I'm not nitpicking them in that regard where the injury is the tiebreaker. The injury situation is the only thing

that's making it close right now. That's the way I interpret it anyway. But I think role matters too. What's wrong with Kadarius Tony's role? I think there's a better chance of Skymore getting more targets and more opportunities than there is for Kadarius Toney. All right. But they were both playing 17 games. You would have who rank higher?

I would take Kadarius Toney. I would want further clarification because Kadarius Toney was still a 20%, 30% snap share guy in a lot of games last year. Like, is he playing 17 games as we're going to design five plays for you a game? I mean, I don't know. I don't know the answer to that. I would think he would have a legitimate role,

and he would run, you know, most of the routes, many of the routes at least. All right. Hate him missing time when he's trying to learn Andy Reid's offense. It's not good. Very complicated. Very weird offense that could be the highest scoring team in football. It's possible they have two good fantasy options. All right.

We are out of here, everybody. Thank you very much for watching and listening. We'll talk to you tomorrow on Fantasy Football Today.