Fantasy Footballers - Fantasy Football Podcast - AFC North Breakdown + Partying Thoughts - Fantasy Football Podcast for 7/3

Episode Date: July 3, 2025

Fantasy Football show for July 3, 2025. Let’s get divisional! AFC North fantasy football preview on today’s podcast! Get a full breakdown for the Ravens, Steelers, Bengals, and Browns for 2025 fantasy football drafts. Plus, keeper strategy talk, and how to decide between best player or best value. Manage your redraft, keeper, and dynasty fantasy football teams with the #1 fantasy football podcast.2025 ULTIMATE DRAFT KIT is available now at UltimateDraftKit.com(00:00) Introduction(03:00) Keeper strategy(07:45) Divisional Breakdown: AFC North(09:10) Baltimore Ravens(21:20) Pittsburgh Steelers(32:00) Cincinnati Bengals(43:45) Cleveland BrownsConnect with the show:Subscribe on YouTubeVisit us on the WebSupport the ShowFollow on XFollow on InstagramJoin our Discord

Welcome to the Fantasy Footballers Podcast with your hosts, Andy Holloway, Jason Moore and Mike Wright. Welcome in. Thursday July 3rd we are the Fantasy Footballers Mike Wright, Jason Moore, Andy Holloway. The crew is back together we are 10 Sundays from football and we are 10 yeah wait wait wait like real yeah I'm like the season like the first the first week I think it was Scott Hanson that tweeted that out it's the first weekend of the red zone okay that's I mean if you're like hey 10 weeks

till the Hall of Fame game No, get out of here. Get out of here. No, it's just I'll be excited but don't I don't need to count out for that That's fair. I mean we are still very close to meaningful football and The Hall of Fame game is this month. We're in the month of the whole was last week It was a heck of a game. Have it gone that long? But is it this month? Yeah yeah. It's in July? July 31st this year. What is happening with the world? Like my my daughter. Yeah they're going back to school in

July. My daughter starts school in July. No that's... What are we doing? We're trying to psychologically destroy our children. Like... You can't put them back in school in July. When we were the youths, it was... So long ago... But it was like you go to school around September, wasn't it? And then they like started scooching it forward for us. All of a sudden we we're going to school in August, and now we're starting school in July? Like, why? What are we doing? Why even stop school? Just go every day, year round.

I like where your head's at. Ruin these kids. Oh no, I was giving me more free time. Yeah, apparently- You go learn, kids. Dad needs a nap. Yeah, I mean, technically speaking, we're under 10 weeks if you count NFL kickoff. Because Hanson's worried about his red zone.

So we're nine weeks from today exactly from the kickoff of the NFL season. And so, appropriately, we've got our July episodes. We're three a week in July and then five a week from August through December and We're getting into the divisional breakdowns. Well, they begin today with the NF the AFC North So we're gonna get that kicked off here in just a moment our quick question of the day is from Matt he says do you focus on best player or best value when deciding a keeper? For example, should I keep H-Han at 210 and gain a little bit of value?

Which Jason and I, we talked about H-Han being right on the edge of that first tier, kind of into the top of the second tier. But that's value, right? He's going to go ahead of 210. Or do I keep Rashi Rice in the seventh round which is several rounds of value? I would say that the most common question we get for advice in the offseason is keeper questions like this. It's this guy in this round, this guy in that round, how do I look at the value proposition versus the player I want? You know sometimes you just want a certain guy on your team.

In this situation, what would you do? And then how do you view that question in general? Usually I'm looking for a difference maker. I'm looking for someone, like if this is my keeper, I want someone who's great. And if I can get any kind of value, like sometimes I'll prefer to keep Jamar Chase for a first. You know, it's like, that's no value, but also I get Jamar Chase. It's very good value. Right, exactly. And I think, you know, the goal here

is to get the best players. Sometimes a value can be good enough, where I go, okay, this is still a good player, and my better player is not Jamar Chase. So this is a legit question here of like 810 or 210 or Rushy Rice. I know my answer on this one's pretty easy. Yeah, in this case I'd take Rushy Rice.

Wow. Oh, wow. Whoa, what just happened? I'm not really sure. I'm on the 8chan side. Wait, what? You're Mr. Anti-Rushy Rice. You hate Rushy Rice? You're 8chan? Yeah, I'm on the 8chanchan side. Wait, what? You're Mr. Anti-Russell Rice. You hate Russell Rice.

Yeah, I'm on the A-chan side. No, I mean it doesn't make sense to me to be on the A-chan side of this one. And because he's a mid-second round pick already. And the way I always look at it is who do I get in lieu of that pick? I mean at two 10 I could take Josh Jacobs. I could take Bucky Irving potentially.

And then I'm not getting Rashi Rice in the seventh round Or anything close to him value wise so to me that one is Yeah, put it fairly clear on my side, and I don't like Rashi Rice as much as you guys putting names to the Like basically the the two players looking at who you would get in each round in lieu of Khalil Shakir is who I'm gonna get instead of Rashi Rice if I If I don't take his value, I mean I'm always factoring like it's a keeper. So The the names yeah, the ADP names were a 210. Those guys are gonna be up at the top of the second That's true. So but yeah, your opportunity cost. I think that's kind of the

The starting point of I like to put the names like you did for Shakir or so in the 7th. Or Ridley in the 7th. And positional value matters as well. So it's not just a, along with everything else in fantasy football, this is, I'm not focusing on one thing. I have a homebrew concoction of things that I'm factoring in. And sometimes, like we said at the top, sometimes I just want that guy because that dude's cool and

I want him on my team. Yeah, I think there was one we got yesterday in the footcast, Jason, it was Jamar Chasen the first or Trey McBride in the fifth. Right. And we both went McBride on that one. Because we felt like you're getting a big time difference maker much later. You probably miss out on Chase,

because it'll probably go one on one. But I wouldn't have blamed anybody to go Chase there. So yeah, it is a brew, like you said, Mike. It's nuanced. It does depend on your league. How many keepers, right? We know it's a keeper league. Is there more?

How many players are off the board? When it comes to value, I mean, maybe A-chan here at 210 is a tremendous value because there's four or five keepers. Well, and knowing your league's tendencies. So I know when we used to, we've changed kind of the rules of how we keep keepers in our league,

but it used to be everyone kept all the running backs. So like if you're not keeping a running back, you're just, you're really screwed. It's not like, oh, well, H-Hands and the 210, I could get Josh Jacobs or I could get these other guys. If everyone kept the other running backs, then that makes it more difficult. Okay, yeah, yeah, there you go. There's a lot of ways to think about it.

We're going to, we don't have any big time news really. I mean, we had the Panthers talk about Chuba Hubbard getting all the carries. I like Chuba Hubbard. We've talked about Chuba Hubbard getting all the carries, but we'll jump right into our divisional breakdowns. Let's get divisional breakdowns. Let's get divisional. Well this is our first divisional breakdown show. It's an opportunity to kind of gather all the data from the offseason and give you a

general overview of teams, our expectations for them, offseason changes regarding players and rookies and coaching changes, how things could function in their offenses this year as it pertains to fantasy football, and then just some personal takes of where we think these teams are headed. So we're starting with the AFC North last year. Baltimore won the division at 12-5, Pittsburgh 10-7, but lost their final four games. Ravens won their final four

and then the Bengals were nine and eight. They needed help in the final week, if you remember. They won their final five, but didn't get enough help. I believe, wasn't last year the year they lost to New England in week one? That sounds right. And boy, they are such a slow starting team. And you see that bad loss and then it came to bear

in the final week of the season. They didn't make the playoffs, but they won the final five and then the Browns, they lost their final six games. The final three games were started by DTR and Bailey's zap, zap, zap zap under center and here we are going into we're trying to win it it's unique I think because we'll go through we'll start with the Ravens but first divisional breakdown show first team we

talk about is my Super Bowl champion that's who I think will win this year so I'm I'm extremely bullish on what the Ravens have put together and what I think they're going to do this year. They were 12-5 last year. Their projected win total in Vegas last year was 11-1 half, so they beat that. And it's 11-1 half again. A friend of the show, Warren Sharp, has their Strength of Schedule for 2025 at 21. So we're not intimidated by, most of the time when I'm looking at strength of schedule, there's a lot of turnover in the NFL.

There's a lot of change on defense. I'm not putting too much emphasis on it. But if it's extreme, I might pay a little bit of attention. If you're projected with a top five easiest, top five best, that's kind of the way I look at it, Jason. I know about you. No, I agree. That's kind of the way I look at it, Jason, I know about you. No, I agree. The outside edges of the strength of schedule

are what matters. And the nice thing is the way that specifically Warren Sharp does his is it's not just looking at like pure, well, last year's ranking versus this year's ranking. He factors in a lot of detailed work with future projections. Which is a much better way to go about it. Mike, last year they were the third ranked offense in points per game, number one in yards per game. Lamar was a league winner. Henry was a league winner. Your initial perspective on Baltimore,

I'm sure it's fairly positive, but do you have any initial thoughts? There's not a lot to add there. Like if you project that the Baltimore Ravens are, I mean like Andy said, a Super Bowl, they're gonna win the Super Bowl. I can't imagine anyone out there saying that they don't, they aren't one of the favorites for a

Super Bowl run that means they're gonna win a bunch of games. That means Derek Henry will continue to be absolutely incredible I think the the Question for me is just it's with Lamar of what do you do with a guy who? through 24 touchdowns two years ago and then threw 41 this year and surpassed 4,000 passing yards for the first time in his career? Are we anywhere close to 41 passing touchdowns

or do we get all the good running stuff but then now we're back down to like 31 because that makes a really, really big difference. If you're going to talk about Detroit and the NFC as a team that should regress offensive efficiency wise, it's not fair to not talk about Baltimore in the same way because they're one of only seven teams in the last decade to average 3.8 or more touchdowns per game.

So they were definitely an outlier offense in terms of how effective they were. Number one in yards per game, like I said, number three in points per game, number one in rushing yards per game, a bin don't break defense, but they bring back basically everybody. Everything.

So the- This is what is the most impressive thing to me for the Baltimore Ravens is usually on these shows, what we are discussing is what has changed from last year. It's easy to just look at last year and say, well, that's what's gonna happen this year. That's not what happens.

No, it never does. Because there's so much turnover, offense, defense, special teams, coordinators, head coaches, there's so little change for the Baltimore Ravens. Personnel-wise, like they brought in DeAndre Hopkins. Okay, as youwise, like they brought in DeAndre Hopkins. Okay, as you know, like whatever. He's going to be their wide receiver three or four.

They paid Rashad Bateman? Yeah. He is, I think, I think he's the most fun guy to talk about. They're from the Ravens. To try to find... They're going into year three with Todd Monkin. I mean, there's just... Their offensive lines rank the same year to year. Yeah, they gave another contract extension

to Derrick Henry even. So it's like, you just expect more of the same this year. A Mark Andrews catch away from maybe winning it last year. And I do not expect Lamar Jackson to be able to throw for 4,040. But he doesn't need to throw for 4,040 to be the number one quarterback again this year. If he were to throw for 3835,

he's probably still the number one quarterback. Top two questions then. You talked about the regression potential and how it doesn't necessarily, he can have some variance and still be an impactful fantasy player, but the number two question to me is who's gonna be second on this team in

targets, uh, Zay Flowers probably going to lead the team and targets. Yeah, he should. But you have some tight ends in the mix and how do you handle them in the draft? Because Isaiah likely younger, more, uh, athletic at this point in his career, faster, but Mark Andrews still has an alarm that goes off when he's around the red zone that Lamar Jackson pays attention to. And rumors did not turn into them moving him. He's a Baltimore Raven. So you talk about running it back. How do you approach those guys in the draft and then Mike, I guess to your point,

the Bateman stuff, is he that second target or is it one of the tight ends? The most likely outcome is just sad. Was that a pun? Oh, okay. No, no, no, no, no, it's sadness of, you don't have a true number two target. The tight ends, I feel like this is an area where I'm just okay watching it

happen because I don't want to bet on Mark Andrews at this point with the experience was pretty rough yeah I know he caught all those touchdowns but do you guys realize he had 15 red zone targets that turned into 11 touchdowns? Like that is bonkers, off the chart efficiency. Mark Andrews is a great touchdown scorer historically, but even that is playing above his pay grade. That's his career high, wasn't it, in touchdowns? It was. It was the first time he's been double digit since 2019 where he had 10. Yeah. It was the first time he's been double digit since 2019 where he had 10. Yeah, so, you know, this is the guy who had

He's had his his numbers have declined year after year in terms of effectiveness, but point being He's still there. He's still gonna be a part of that in the game plan and we all Like saw what happened in week one with Isaiah likely and we're like, holy crap like saw what happened in week one with Isaiah likely and we're like holy crap drop the entire fab because he took over for Mark Andrews he did not I know we're getting you know puff pieces of the coach saying I likely should be a pro bowler or but I don't know that I want to jump into those waters when there's when there's two potential tight ends,

it feels like I don't, you're gonna be playing roulette of who actually gives you fantasy points, so I'm gonna try to find someone on a different team. If Andrews was a double digit pick, if he's in round 10, 11, 12, I'm happy to take that on. Sure. But he's a seventh rounder, and so, to me, you're touchdown or unhappy. The target totals were actually very close last year

between the two players. I think it was 69 targets to 58 targets. And I do feel like somewhere somebody will be like, should I take them both and try to figure that out. No, don't do that. Goodness, no. Please don't do that. What's insane about that is, you know,

likely was 12 targets in week one And you know we had those like we had the back-to-back goose from Andrew so that's what I mean I Expect something somewhat similar in terms of fantasy output and this team's goal is Unfortunately not our fantasy teams production It is to win pretty selfish win a Bowl, which they got close to doing. And so, you know, Bateman, 45 for seven, 56 and nine last year. He's a best ball player to me.

Yeah, or an emergency start in the right match up, hoping for a home run. He's not someone I'm looking to draft in any of my redraft leagues. I don't wanna deal with it. No, you don't see a world where he becomes the true number two? Nine touchdowns.

I mean, he was the number two last year. He was second in targets on the team, and is still was, on a year where Lamar threw 4,040, he was mostly irrelevant for an every week player. You're not gonna plug him in and be happy, but I agree he's someone you could always take a shot on. As the season goes on, injuries happen, you need someone to play off the waiver wire. I think Bateman is that guy. Yeah, nine touchdowns on 45 receptions is a little Westbrook-Kinay of him.

Yeah, well, Kinay was like one catch, one touchdown per week. Yeah, yeah, but I think, I mean, I think those are the major questions is do you think there's going to be some aggression? Do you pass on players because of it? None of us are, I mean, I would say Henry is pretty, like people are not hyper aggressive on Henry in drafts. If anything, he's the guy that kind of gets kicked down a little bit.

I mean, Mike, you took CMC three times over him. I mean, it's one of those things where I don't know why we do it. It doesn't make a lot of sense. They paid him again. He's gonna score a million touchdowns. It's all about passes and like, because everyone else in the world,

not named Derrick Henry, to hit that true ceiling, they have to catch 40 plus receptions, and Derrick Henry's just not gonna do that, but. They were leading or tied on 81% of his carries. That makes sense. And they will be again. It seems like that's what they will be getting. They do, we will get a very fun opening openings matchup because you'll get the Sunday night game in week one against Buffalo. Oh baby. Which NFL already makes me very excited and then

Cleveland Detroit at home so they're in in Buffalo and then at home for a couple games then Kansas City and week four so it's going to be I mean Detroit Kansas City Buffalo in three of the first four weeks. Those are some tough matchups. Are you guys good with the Flowers ADP? I know, I don't think any of the three of us are in love with Flowers. That's fine. You have fifth round, Widers here 24,

somebody that's a guaranteed, like I'd be happy to flex Flowers all year long, I mean. Yeah, if he's your fifth player that's that's fine I'm not in love with flowers but he is still a young guy with a great quarterback talented if he were to step up on target percentage you know 2% he could he could be a weekly relevant starter. How was he last 25% last year? Was he that high? Yeah. And I mean cuz because you had a couple games. He missed some time, didn't he? No, he played every game, but the final

week he only played 20% of the snaps, which is, that's week 18, so we don't really count it. The one real clunker would be in week 7 against Tampa Bay, where he only had one target, but he played really the whole game. I counted on him in championship week. I guess that's not his only clunker. That didn't work. But he was a little bit banged up. Did he miss a playoff game then? Yes.

Okay, that's what I'm thinking about. I think he got hurt in the final week and then, what's up, Kyle, are you there? Do we have Kyle today? Kyle, come in. I'll look it up. Over and out. Oh my goodness, Kyle, are you there? Do we have Kyle today? Kyle, come in. I'll look it up. Over and out. Oh my goodness, Kyle, you're supposed to know this stuff.

Is he coming in on a ham radio? Yeah. Okay, any other? He didn't play in the playoffs, it looks like. Yeah, any partying thoughts on Baltimore before we move on? Partying thoughts? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think Super Bowl party is the thoughts for the Ravens. Thank you Jason.

You're welcome. Really appreciate that. We'll take a break and come back with a team that is just there. I don't know what they're doing. All right, I don't know Jason if you have partying thoughts on the Pittsburgh Steelers, but they were the number two team in the division last year, 10 and 7. Their projected win total last year was 8.5, but of course they surpassed it because they won six of their 10 one score games. But they ended in a really depressing way for Steelers fans, and they lost their final four games, then they lost in the wild card game.

The story of Tomlin, and they haven't won a playoff game since 2016, so you're talking about what, almost 10 years at this point. The projected win total this year, it's 8.5 again. And the division's tough. They were playing with Russell Wilson. And those final four games they lost, do you remember their schedule? It was the Philadelphia Eagles, the Baltimore Ravens, the Kansas City Chiefs, and the Cincinnati Bengals.

I mean, it's like, that's tough sledding. Obviously they play in division, two of those, but the other two were the two teams that got to the Super Bowl. So are you excusing that? I am, I'm saying like, I don't think it was. Because I mean, that's the Miami Dolphins can't win games against good team situation.

But those aren't just, Miami Dolphins is against above 500 teams, teams just with a winning record. These were, the Eagles and the Chiefs were literally the Super Bowl. Okay. They still didn't end the year well. Five straight losses. Aaron Rodgers is a better quarterback than Russell Wilson.

I would agree. What? I mean, this isn't a pro Aaron Rodgers take. This is an anti-Russell Wilson. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, so far. They were 20th in points per game last year, 20, 30 yards per game. So when you look at the bar on offense, it's set very low, 28th in passing percentage.

You've got an Arthur Smith issue, because one of the things coming out this week, Aaron Rodgers and Arthur Smith are gonna talk about how to balance the offense, the running game versus the passing game. I mean, okay. It's not, I mean, the running game versus the passing game. I mean, okay. It's not, I mean the running game versus the passing game, it was, it literally, it's Arthur Smith versus Aaron Rodgers.

Like they're already in battle, like Arthur wants to- It's gonna go great, guys. Arthur wants to run the ball way more than everyone else in the league and Aaron Rodgers doesn't, he's not coming back to hand the ball off. He's coming back to chuck it. There's an aspect here, and look, it's hard not to give Mike Tomlin a tremendous amount of credit. He's had 18 seasons and 18 seasons of over 500. So if that's your bar, amazing.

If it's winning a playoff game, it's been a while. It does feel like some of the moves this off season, Ramsey, Rogers, um, the big changes that wide receiver DK Metcalf coming in, big contract pickings out the door. Now John new Smith. It does feel like, okay, it could work. You could be going all in and you could get a good year. You got to avoid injury, but it also feels a little bit like the son's traded for Shaq, you know, and Kevin Durant.

And you're spending the money and you're going all in, but you're, you're kind of at a breaking point. Like nobody in Pittsburgh is going to be okay with this off season coming back and re-rolling what got them five losses to end the year and losing another playoff game. So you had to do major things. Yeah, they're shaking it up, man. This is very un-stealer-sy. It does feel that way. And look, I liked the move for Ramsey, personally.

Ramsey's older, but Minka's done to me. Like Minka's, he wasn't the guy he was previously. He hasn't been an all-pro for three years. He was beat a ton last year all over the field. So to me, I like that move. I think Aaron Rodgers is a better quarterback. I like DK Metcalf and fantasy drafts. No more Najee.

We didn't even talk about the backfield. That's completely redone. Caleb Johnson, Jalen Lauren. Their second pick overall, as they didn't have a second rounder, they brought in Caleb Johnson to replace Najee Harris. So you're hoping for a lot more juice, a lot more breakaway plays, breakaway runs for the offense. And you can't stack the box as easily against Aaron Rodgers

as you could with Justin Fields and Russell Wilson. I feel like looking at this team and their ADPs, I know you guys like DK, but. Loved, loved, loved. Oh you love DK? Oh, I apologize. Yeah, you misspoke, I forgive you. Well, I'm about as the opposite of that as possible.

The only guy I really wanna draft from this team is Caleb Johnson. And I don't know what, his ADP, we're quoting it right now, I assume this is from Sleeper of a late eight, that won't happen. Right. Like that's when we get to August. Rookies will fly up.

And the casuals come back and the fever is in there. Caleb's gonna go up. So where does he land? I think that's my biggest question for the Steelers. On my team. Yeah. that's where he's gonna land Yes, we we know so love love any monologue shows coming up cuz loves Caleb Johnson I need a I need a full refresh on loves the Steelers, but he's really the only guy that I have true Interest in if the other guys have thrown my team I got backed into it

Yeah, I mean I This is a fantasy show so yeah, I like DK Metcalf in the fifth round I was wide receiver 24 who is the clear number one target here for Aaron Ross like he just downgraded from love You love DK Metcalf I like DK Metcalf and Mike dislikes DK Metcalf. He has disappointed his ADP for like four straight years. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And a move to Pittsburgh with Arthur Smith and Aaron Rodgers does not give me super confidence in... I'm fascinated to watch how it happens because DK Metcalf, he could still be a dominant player out there, but this is not the... like Aaron Rodgers is a general who demands that you be exactly where

you are supposed to be, exactly when you are supposed to be there, and like Rodgers likes a tactician and that's not who DK is. DK is just a bully. You can have what you like, but you only get DK. Cause they don't have anybody else to catch the football. It will be- Well, I got John who now. I mean, you don't, they don't make a trade for John who unless they plan to give him, you know, at least a good 600 yards or so.

Oh. For sure. I mean, yeah, we call that a, yeah, I mean. That was not an endorsement of John Who, by the way. No, I realize it, yeah, and Friar Muth is there, and they'll run two tight ends, and we talked about it on Tuesday. But no, I like Metcalfe, I'm still unsure

of what the work distribution's gonna be with Warren and Caleb Johnson. Yeah. That's still an issue. I think you will start the season with Warren as the starter Give him that that he's a better pass protector for sure You know, they're they're going to Aaron Rodgers is gonna love Jalen Warren But I do think as the season goes along Caleb Johnson and his ability to have

Explosive plays out of the backfield will just be too important for the offense to keep on the side. I'm looking at their schedule, they'll probably start three, you know. Who do they got? Well, they're gonna play the Jets. So, Aaron Rodgers. Oh, revenge. Revenge. So they're gonna play the Jets on the road,

but that's a very winnable game. Then they're gonna play at home against Seattle and Sam Darnold and whatever they've got figuring out in Seattle. And then they're gonna go to New England in week three. So. Yeah. Oh man, a loss to the Jets in week one would just be.

Oh my gosh. It would be. Oh theater. Oh theater. Like the Steelers, I'm not wishing ill upon you, but. Yeah. For the sake of fire. The media would lose their minds and it would be amazing.

Out of curiosity, because I get accused for some reason of hating the Steelers, despite endorsing DK Mecha. Strange, yeah. But I just, maybe the Deucer's Alley crew can give me, like after that conversation about the Steelers, did it come across pro or negative? Or I mean, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Did that come across as we were anti-Steelers or pro-Steelers? I'm gonna say anti. Okay. Yeah, is that did that come across as we were anti Steelers or pros dealers? I'm gonna say anti. Okay. I was I was leading pro. Okay. Well, I know how it will come across the Steelers fans I think Ted Jason with your point I think the easiest thing to spot for the Pittsburgh Steelers is Caleb Johnson will be drafted before Jalen Warren Warren will be used more in the first couple weeks. Everyone's going to lose their minds. They'll be like, I drafted Caleb Johnson to be, you said he's going to be.

And just, hold on, man. Hold on. Wait a second. And let the rookie cook. So long as Aaron Rodgers doesn't do what we all know he's going to do and change the plays at the line to throw the ball all the time. I mean, the reason that I have, over this off season,

bemoaned Aaron Rodgers and said, this is gonna be the Steelers' first losing season in forever, because I love Mike Tomlin, is because Mike Tomlin, with this roster, and a different quarterback who's not changing plays and throwing it like crazy at the line, will just win games. This is adding Ramsey, and I'm sure they will come

and sign TJ Watt, they'll get a deal done there. But if you've got TJ Watt and Jalen Ramsey, that defense is going to be really, really good. So now if you've got the running game going with Caleb Johnson, with two tight ends, you're gonna have a bully offensive line, really three tight ends with Washington there. Oh, that's a man. That all works well when you're

winning the game. That's what I'm saying. But they don't. I mean, the problem with the Steelers over the last, I mean, it's the problem with Baltimore. The problem with with the Steelers the last few years is picket. It's Russ. It's great when you when you're winning at the beginning of a game, you can't come back and win a game. That's been the problem. They don't have an explosive in their offense to like get back into a game and give Aaron Rodgers the shot.

I mean, I love what Rodgers did for Adams and Wilson fantasy-wise last year. That's why I like DK, because he's one guy. But I mean, this is gonna be a wild year because you have to compete with Baltimore and the next team we're talking about, the Cincinnati Bengals. And the Bengals were nine and eight last year, they went on that big run,

they started the year one and four, and all of those games, they were the opposite of the Chiefs. The Chiefs just kept winning games by any means necessary to the point where we rolled our eyes into the back of our head, and cursed the fact that they were gonna go to another Super Bowl, which they did.

The Bengals just kept losing games and finding ways to lose games. You know, seven of the eight losses they even had last year were against playoff teams. This was the most bad luck season ever, and you know, maybe bad luck's the wrong phrase, but tough luck. Yeah, that's fair.

So where are the Bengals on the, I mean, you're not gonna sit here and talk about their defense, Gia. I know that. You're not gonna talk about their defense. Oh, I'm gonna here and talk about their defense, Gia, I know that. You're not gonna talk about their defense. Oh, I'm gonna very much talk about their defense. But not like the Steelers. It's the best part of their offense

is the fact that they're gonna have to score 33 points to win a game. So what's the chance that Burrow has to do exactly what he did last year, and go 35 plus touchdowns? I think the chances are very high. The Bengals, I don't know that they have changed their defense enough to make it good. They might have done some stuff to make it not one of the worst in the league,

but they are going... When people play against the Bengals, they know they've got to score a lot of points. They're more aggressive because of Joe Burrow. So the combination of bad defense with this great offense, bringing T. Higgins back. There's also been some nice buzz around Burton, their rookie last year who was a knucklehead and just missing practices. And now he's like putting in the work this offseason. Chase Brown became a revelation the second half of last year after the Zach Moss injury. When they started winning those games, I think they're going to utilize him a lot.

The Bengals offense is like, this is the team I want the most. Are they, and are we even gonna have a first round defensive pick signed or a, or Hendrickson? They probably will sign Hendrickson. They probably will sign Hendrickson. They'll probably sign both. Trade him. I was gonna say for fantasy purposes,

you'd like to see them throw like seven guys out there. 100%. Yeah. So look, Burrow, upper rational line of fantasy quarterback. And when, like when's the last time we had Burrow actually be really healthy

in the offseason never like I think it's been why they start slow in part in forever yeah right now he's he's been healthy says it's the best he's ever felt to be fair training camp hasn't started I expect him to pull something in camp you still hate Zack Taylor Jason yes very yes I think this team would wild man I think this team would do much better without Zach Taylor. I think he's a great coach. I think he's a good enough coach

to keep them where they are. Seventh in points per game, ninth in yards per game, second in pass percentage, we love that. It's gonna be really difficult for, it's just difficult for any fantasy wide receiver to repeat at number one. I mean, Jamar Chase will have as good a chance as anybody, but it might not be him. But he's going to be your best odds. And that's how you draft. That's what rankings are about.

Exactly. We don't rank players because we know they're going to finish at that spot. We rank them there because they have the best chances. And it's not if Jamar Chase like has, if Jamar Chase plays the whole season, like has, if Jamar Chase plays the whole season, even if he doesn't finish number one, he's still top four. I mean, like he will not fall on his face. Like he's just too good.

And Joe Burrow is just too good. Which that's why the pick is, feels, it feels good. Yeah, no one's gonna be sad with Jamar Chase this year, even if he's not the number one wide receiver. And I don't think anybody's gonna be sad with Jamar Chase this year, even if he's not the number one wide receiver. And I don't think anybody's gonna be sad with T. Higgins. You know, T. Higgins, we've talked about it for years. The issue has always been health. Will he be on the field?

If he's on the field, he's great. If you look in 2024, the numbers between T. Higgins and Jamar Chase, Jamar Chase is like literally the first pick in fantasy football. T Higgins was right with him on almost every metric. You look at the target percentage. You know, it's 26 to 23%.

You look at targets per route run, 25% to 24%. Yards per route run, 2.4 to 2.1. Like first read targets. Yes, Jamar Chase. Two games played. 34% to 29%. We're getting high T Higgins this year, man. Higgins is always, he's always been an amazing splits guy. Yes.

That's T Higgins world. He just needs to be healthy and on the field. Do you believe that T Higgins will finish his career never playing a full season? Yes. Really? Yeah. I don't think that.

It's rare for people. His rookie year makes you look real dumb. Why did they not play 17 in 2020? No. No, they didn't, right? When did that change? No. See, that was kind of a dunk, Mike,

but also you said his rookie season. Yeah, that's right. So it's kind of like a reverse dunk. You know what I mean? I like you dunked on the wrong basket I am speaking literally of just going forward. I don't think yeah It's very unlikely to me just based on the injury history and the way he comes off the family He's he played 12. He probably limped through three of them. So no, but that's not, I'm not saying T Higgins, I'm not counter pointing any of your stuff. That's just if he played every week and had the same numbers as Chase, he would be drafted where Chase is drafted and he never is and never will be because he doesn't and won't. That is the very end of what you said is the only thing that I take umbrage with, where I don't believe

that past injuries are indicative of future injuries in most cases. I mean, we have so many examples in the past of injury-prone players that then all of a sudden aren't injury-prone players. He's a good example of an injury-prone player that's always injured. That's what he is.

He's an injury-prone player that's always hurt. When you leave. He's never finished a fantasy season in the top 17. Jaylen Wadda gave you a wide receiver seven year as the wide receiver team. When you leave the draft, only to have right at the end of the draft, they're like, oh, T Higgins injured his hamstring.

So. It's rough. I think the 303 for T Higgins is scary. It's a little bit, we did it too hot to handle up is that he didn't come up. It's a little it's a little bit on the edge for me. It's, I can see all that and what makes the 303 difficult is that Chase Brown is also going in the third and Chase Brown running back 12 right now he's one of my favorite picks in all of fantasy football this year. I don't think there's anyone who's gonna get in his way and he was absolutely electric from week 9 on he

was the running back 5 in total fantasy points scored only Saquon saw more total opportunities in that span like Zach Moss I guess he's he'll be back and then it's like P Ryan and then they drafted Brooks late like there's no one there we talked challenge chase we talked about chase on the footcast yesterday Andy and I did and with that depth chart it's so clear that Jamemar Chase, that Chase Brown will be very, very involved. And what he did for Joe Burrow specifically

was very important. I mean, when they were winning games down the stretch, a lot of that had to do with Chase Brown and the receiving work that he was doing. If you wanna be a top fantasy option, like you said about Derrick Henry, you almost always have to have the receiving work. Well when the injury to Zach Moss happened in week eight, the second half of the season, the last eight games that Chase Brown was basically the full-time

starter, he was on pace for 93 targets and he caught 86% of them for eight yards of reception. I mean, he was just so valuable to Joe Burrow in that check down game and I don't see that going away. It's like from week four through 17, because he didn't play the final, he didn't play week 18. From weeks four through 17, he has one game under 10 points. And you have multiple smash games in there. I love Chase Brown this year. Just circling back to test my theory here

and get your opinions. All right. T Higgins' current ADP relative to some of these other players, you like Garrett Wilson more or you like T Higgins more? Higgins. Oh man. Garrett Wilson was slightly better in consistency last year

percentage-wise, but is a couple picks later. You like Higgins, Mike? I think we'd all like him over McLauren. Yeah. Who's going later? Marvin Harrison Jr. is going later. I'll still take Higgins. Evans, Devonte Adams, a couple of the older guys,

DJ Moore, Rashi Rice. Yeah, it is. It doesn't seem, when I look at these names, I don't- It's high risk, but very high reward. Yeah, I don't see a bunch of wide receiver names behind Higgins that I like more than Higgins. So maybe that is, maybe he's not- Going in the right spot, but he's-

Maybe he's just the right temperature to handle. He is hot and you might burn your hand, Going in the right spot, but he's just the right temperature to handle He is Hot and you might burn your hand or if you're cold this might feel real nice It's funny cuz this is it's a hand warmer. It's like a Mug he's just like Goldilocks in this thing. Look, this is the highest he's ever gone his career That's where ADP. Yes. That's worth saying. Yes, that's worth saying. Like T. Higgins has never gone higher. So when you talk about laying the palm fronds over the hole.

The end of the year was very good for T. Higgins. And the contract. I mean, and when you look at like one of the questions about Cincinnati too is like, what happens if one of these guys gets hurt, which has happened. In fact, it's happened to one of them a lot over the last few years. It's like, is there a third one?

More one than the other, but you know. Yeah, I mean, is there a wide receiver in that Tyler Boyd third position that you like a lot? And to me, it's more, look, they gave Mike Gissicky money. So, Gissicky is not somebody I target until one of these guys gets hurt, and then I'm looking at him on free agency and saying, I think I might be able to start him

with a team that passes at the level that they pass with the defense that they have. To me, Gassicki is the perfect pivot when one of those, if one of those guys gets hurt. Sure, yeah, I'm before that. Any other thoughts about the team in terms of, you know, range of outcomes for Borough or anything else you wanna mention?

The NFL did its best to try and help the Bengals get off to a strong start with the Cleveland Browns and the Jacksonville Jaguars just trying to say like, come on, of course they did it last year with the Patriots. I'm just saying, going into Cleveland, that's setting them up. For the old 0-1. I mean, they went into New England a lot,

setting them up to go into Cleveland, but yeah, we have Cleveland, Jacksonville, Minnesota and Denver, three out of four on the road. So you talk about slow start potential, that's a little worrisome actually. Two and two maybe? I don't know. Yeah, it sounds like they gotta throw a bunch.

It does sound like they gotta throw a bunch. We'll take a break and we'll talk about Mike's favorite team on the planet. I'm just getting this piece of news after the break here. Kyle letting me know. Burrow has won 39% of all games in September. That sounds about right. Feels like hot. It feels like a high number compared to our experience. Man, Cleveland was 3-14 last year. And their projected win total going into the season was eight and a half. Sean Watson, that didn't work.

Got hurt towards the Killies. I heard he's on he's on track for like October or something. I don't know why that was in the news, but it was. If I could block the Sean Watson news from my feed, I think filtered out if the Cleveland Browns could block Deshaun Watson news. I think they would so I bet Stefanski on Twitter. Oh, he's got Always got a muted. Yeah. Yeah, he doesn't let Deshaun know but he's got a muted 2025 Vegas went hold it down to five and a half

You know down to five and a half. Ooh. Uh, you know. That sounds like they don't think Joe Flacco's starting. We also talk about the outside edges of the strength of schedule. They have the 31st ranked strength of schedule coming up, so. Wait, does that mean it's bad or good? You don't know for sure. Yeah. I can see.

I can see. I assumed 31st ranked. I didn't bring it up. It is bad. 31st see. I have to. It is 30 years ranked. I thought that. OK, it's bad. Yes. OK. Like bad like Michael Jackson. Bad. So bad is good. It is so difficult. They have a difficult schedule. And that's bad. You did freeze. I froze for a second. You made me question it for a second.

Look, I didn't know the answer. I couldn't remember how we put it in. They're favored in one game so far. Against two. Yeah, put them on blast. That I need to know. Yeah, Kyle, let us know who they're favored against and what fan base should be. Is it their bye week? Who do they play in week 14?

They are favorite in their bye. Week their favorite in week 14? Yes. Oh yeah, one and a half point favorites. That's gotta be New England or something at home. Who is it? Tennessee at home. Tennessee at home.

Okay, yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well look, here's where we're at. Thirty second in points per game last year. So we could go up from there. 28th and yards per game, and yet number one in pass percentage.

So they passed a ton. Jamus, thank you, Jamus. It's wild that you get the number one in pass percentage and number 32 in points per game. Like that is the Jamus experience in some ways. But Stefanski, we'll give it a go again. They got a new offensive coordinator. Jamis is no longer a part of this team.

Neither is stalwart Nick Chubb, who had been there forever. No more Elijah Moore. But Joe Flacco's there, and Kenny Pickett, and Deontay Johnson. Ew! Oh man, did you guys read those Deontay Johnson comments? Yes, about him not wanting to go play when it was cold out. Yeah, of like him explaining why he got suspended, almost like.

Did you see Anthony Richardson replied and was like, I hear you. Bro, I get it. Are you tired or cold? You should probably take a break. But it was just so hilarious. This is Deontay Johnson talking about like, no, no, no. Here's what happened. I didn't want to play because it was cold.

Are you guys with me? Are you with me? His, what he was trying to explain was that he felt that his body was cold and he was going to be bad if they put him out there. Right, because he was looking out for number one. Yeah, so. I'm gonna put bad tape out there if I go out there. Right, because he was looking out for number one. Yeah, so. He's like, I'm going to put bad tape out there if I go out there.

That's probably true. Sometimes you just be like, I don't really want to talk about that. Cleveland has a great defense. They should be able to be in games if they could do anything on offense. We don't know who their quarterback is, and it changes everything. I would say that sentence will be uttered weekly Yeah But it changes everything for this team like because of the who their different quarterback options are

It's so wildly different if Joe Flacco is there He's gonna air it out a ton if Joe Flacco was the starter week one Jerry Judy David a joke who these these are good Options if it's Kenny Pickett week one. Yeah, but options. Let me try, let's reframe this. Let's try an experiment here, Jason. Because this has been, every time we talk about Cleveland, it's like the quarterback, it matters so much. But that might be the trick. That might be the lie.

That might be the problem. It's not going to be the same guy all year. So then if we think it matters a lot, and it's the guy we like to start the year, and that means we draft the players that we like because of that quarterback, it will not necessarily be that quarterback for very long. Right. So in that case-

Trade them. Yeah, but that you don't get, if you know that Kenny Pick is taking over, Shadour Sanders or Dylan Gabriel, you don't get to trade them. I'm saying if you get the first three weeks of Joe Flacco and Jerry Judy's riding high. Yeah, maybe. You put him on the market. Maybe you could do that with Judy, I agree. But maybe, my point being, maybe we wanna just avoid

and not do the dance. I am fine. Maybe sometimes you just do that. I am fine avoiding the players on this team, minus Quinchun Judkins. I think he is gonna be excellent. He's the Nick Chubb replacement a very big You know athletic a real super

Who you talking about Judkins? Oh, yeah, you Jason do you like Let's say they both end up. I don't know. I'll put them both in the fourth or the fifth whatever Yeah, like Caleb Johnson or Judkins, which direction would you prefer to go? You know it is funny because you hypothetically said I'll put him in the fourth or the fifth. That makes the difference for me. I'm saying I'm putting them both there. No I know but I'm saying if they're both in the fourth I lean Judkins and if they're both in the fifth I lean Caleb Johnson. The reason why is because I think Judkins is the clear week one starter. He's going to get the volume and if I have to draft them in the fourth round,

this is a starter on my fantasy roster from week one. I do think towards the second half of the year, Caleb Johnson has the more explosive, better overall fantasy finish, and so if I can wait and have him be not necessarily one of my two running back starters, and he's my third running back drafted, I'd rather have, those two guys though are my number one and number two

currently ranked rookie running backs. One of the reasons that I don't necessarily get on board. You say without Genty though. Yeah, yeah, we delete Genty from the conversation of rookie running Vex. Yes, don't take that clip and run. Oh, yeah We don't count Genty as a rookie. No one does. You're just like he's the top five guys. Yeah, that's a good point Yeah, when we talk about rookie running Vex. We bypassed him in those discussions so many times because it's a presupposition. Yeah Thank you for that

because it's a presupposition. Yeah, thank you for that clarifying statement. I think everybody understands that, but if you don't, now you do. Wow, okay. Do we like Najoku? I do. I'm so torn on him. But again, if you wanna just bypass the experience

and the exposure to Browns, I don't care. I do like Najoku for where he's going. I think that he's one of the later round targets You know, that's he's an eighth he's like at the eight nine turn so He doesn't cost you much. I know but I mean like he's like he's going right next to evan ingraham I would rather have David no joku. What about and he's like right next to like Mark Andrews Yeah, I think I would take Najoku over all of those. I was starting to say that one of the reasons

I'm not in the Cedric Tillman is a sleeper category is because Judkins, Judy, and Najoku, I like them all more on a team I don't like. And so at that point, I'm getting further down the list of potential week-to-week success. I mean, he had a good three game stretch and I don't think he's a bad player. I just don't know what he's gonna represent

for my team on the year. And I don't think the ceiling's very high because of where he falls in the pecking order. And this team being so bad on offense that I think I would try a better upside offense when I'm taking a dart throw, but I know you guys are kind of, or at least Jason's been a bigger fan.

I like Cedric Tillman, and my issue with Judy is we saw four and a half years of Jerry Judy, and that it wasn't until Jameis Winston took over and was throwing him the ball 10 plus times every single week. And that is part of Cedric Tillman. We haven't seen as much Tillman to know, is he truly a starter or a fantasy starter?

It's a confusing situation. At least Judy had finished in the top 24 at the position on another team with another quarterback. Yeah, that's fair. That's one of the reasons why actually, and the draft capital and the explosiveness, I mean, you can be on a team with Jameis Winston, but you still have, I mean, putting up 190 catches

or whatever is the least. The production was incredible, but man, for, Judy had that one year where he was wide receiver 21, but I mean, other than that, it was rough. Like really, really rough. Yeah, he's... 8.2 games as rookie year, 6.6 per game next year. You're talking about points per game?

Yeah, points per game. Next year, the 11, great year. He was traded for, though, like he was better than his numbers when they made the trade. Oh yeah, they made a gamble. Because they're really good at acquisitions. Yeah. They make the right calls on acquisitions.

And that's why Kenny Pickett. They start the year Cincinnati, Baltimore, Green Bay, Detroit. Oh no. Yeah, okay. That adds to the don't mess with them. That's, yeah, that's, Flacco starts four games and then everyone's just pissed off and we got a bench or I vice versa I mean, that's the hope at this point. I'd hope picket stars for games because then you can get flack over more

How about this or should door starts game five? How about oh and four and I bet my life on it You're oh, you're oh man. I would bet on that Cincinnati week one. Your life is too valuable for betting on the the Bengals opening hot. Okay, that's fair, but they should be $20. Yeah, so I'm going to amend what I said earlier of you. You have the first month of great value and then you put Jerry Judy on the trading block based on this schedule. You get week one. Okay, you get that Cincinnati Bagels game. You're going to have awesome, you're going to throw it a ton, you're going to have to keep up, you're going to have to score

30 points. So, Judy and out. Judy, one week out. Put him on the trading block once he has 18 targets. By the way, apparently last year on these shows we predicted the division winners and Mike predicted the most. He got five of eight division winners correct. Yes. I don't see any statistics around Jason and I's performance. I bet it was insulating us from the damage. It was just probably almost as good as Mike. Mike apparently also had the most teams in the correct order. I don't have any proof of this. I mean, it's just what the doc says. Don't worry about it, man. Did you put this in the dog, but I will go Baltimore

Baltimore Cincinnati Pittsburgh Cleveland Baltimore says a Pittsburgh. Yeah, I like that. I hate it That I have the same order so same order for all of us. Yep boring. I know so I got it out quick I held out maybe the pressure to change is get to you guys I'm I would I'm not even gonna hypothetical Ravens not number one I got it out quick. I held out maybe the pressure to change when it gets to you guys. I'm not even gonna hypothetical Ravens not number one, but the Steelers could they second? It's Ravens one and it's Browns four, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Those are done. And so then the only... Really? Cincinnati's in contention for the division, yeah. You think that, okay. Yeah, I do, cause they've done it, right? I mean. I don't know, they can't do that with that defense. Yeah, I do cuz they've done it right. I mean, I don't they can't do that with that defense

Yeah, I agree and with how good the Ravens are I? Think that the Ravens are are kind of locked there. So it so to me It's just do you think the Bengals are better than the Steelers? I think we went chalk. I think we went Vegas. That's fine Sometimes they know what they're talking about. All right, a lot which is all the times and all the monies all right we are done that is the end of today's divisional breakdown episode a reminder the ultimate draft kit available right now at ultimate draft kid calm with the draft analyzer go check that out get ready for your drafts make sure you win your drafts goodbye

thank you for listening to another episode of the Fantasy Footballers Podcast. Join our fantasy football community on jointhefoot.com and follow us on Twitter at the FF Ballers.