Fantasy Footballers - Fantasy Football Podcast - Super Bowl Reactions + 2025 Draft Steals - Fantasy Football Podcast for 2/11

Episode Date: February 11, 2025

Fantasy Football talk for Feb 11, 2025. Super Bowl recap and value picks for 2025 on today’s podcast! Which disappointing players will be steals in 2025 fantasy football drafts? Plus, offseason debates and mailbag! Puka Nacua’s future outlook, pass interference rules, and more! Manage your redraft, keeper, and dynasty fantasy football teams with the #1 fantasy football podcast. Get the lowest price on the 2025 UDK at UltimateDraftKit.com - Order before March 1st for an entry to win a Listener League Spot! Connect with the show: Subscribe on YouTube Visit us on the Web Support the Show Follow on X Follow on Instagram Join our Discord Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

When you sit on your aeroplan points, it's like you're sitting on your next trip, like a sunny getaway by the sea. But instead you're sitting on your aeroplan points. So the only sea you get to sit in is a sea of traffic. Use your points and go from smelling your ocean breeze air freshener to smelling the ocean breeze. So stop sitting on your next trip and start enjoying your Aeroplan points. Welcome to the Fantasy Footballers Podcast with your hosts, Andy Holloway, Jason Moore, and Mike Wright. Ah, welcome in.

What do you got going on over there? I just thought you might throw in it's baseball time in there. You know oh Stop it. I Would rather die Thank you Mike and do that I? Knew you wouldn't do it actually no no It's free agency time a pretty much is welcome into the fantasy footballers Tuesday February 11th

Welcome into the show Jason Moore Mike Wright Andy 11. Welcome into the show, Jason Moore, Mike Wright, Andy Holloway. Baseball time. How dare you? Yeah, I mean, as I've sold its football time to some other things in my life, like what was it? Was it Foreman? Was it the answer, Foreman?

Oh, yeah, I think so. And then he went and he had a great game, so it was awesome. So I'm not above it, but baseball time. No, I just. Goodness gracious. Kyle, I'll confirm, yeah, it was Foreman. Oh, that was some good times with Deontza Foreman. Welcome in, one and all.

We have completed the 2024, 25 season. It's over. We did it. It's done. Congratulations, Philadelphia. Goodness gracious. It was a drubbing. Them behinds were slapped red. Yes, yes they were.

I'm sure you know the answer to this, Mike, but how many times did the Eagles defense blitz the Chiefs? Oh my gosh, is it zero? Zero. Yeah, I mean that's the full, that's the New York Giants path. If you can get there with four dudes, why use anymore?

Oh, I'm just saying, you're nearly unstoppable. Yeah, Seth Walder tweeted out, according to ESPN research, there's been six times in Super Bowl history where a quarterback has not been blitzed for the whole game, all six. The other team won, obviously. Because if you don't have to,

the only reason you blitz is because you need to generate pressure. If you don't need to blitz to generate pressure, you're gonna win. Well, and this was how Patty Mahomes lost his other Super Bowl. This was the Tampa Bay recipe. If you remember, it was just a man handling of the offensive line.

The pressure, you know, it builds, right? You just put a quarterback in a position, especially if you do it early in the game to where they are now having to speed up the clock. Didn't get the kinds of plays he needed around him in this game and Philadelphia, redemption. I mean, we were there three years ago when it went the other direction late in the game, although you start to play the what ifs

of these scenarios where it's like, that one was a down to the wire, holding call, one holding call on a juju touchdown in a game where Jalen Hurts outplayed Holmes. Sorry, Super Bowl MVP Jalen Hurts. There we go. And here you are with the redemption story. So it was, you know, it wasn't a close game at all.

No, and the 22 points that the Chiefs got are, I mean, that's insulting. That's incredible work by Kansas City. Because if this, it was 40 to 6. So I mean, your final score of 40 to 6 is, that's thoroughly embarrassing for the all history of time. In a few years, we'll forget some things about this game. 40 to 22, oh, maybe it wasn't as bad as I remember.

Do they test, I have a couple thoughts, do they test guys after the Super Bowl for anabolic steroids or performance enhancing drugs? Because it certainly seemed like that defensive line was- Was juiced? I mean, it was, the other thought, the actual real thought I have is related to Jaden Daniels and the Washington Commanders who just played the Eagles. And yes, the Eagles, they had a great end of,

it was the opposite of this. The end of the score looked like a beat down, but it really wasn't that way through the game. Jaden Daniels was able to get out. They just had offensive players keep fumbling the ball to the Eagles afterwards. But I don't know, man. It made me think there's a bright future. I mean, not that we didn't already think there was a bright future for Jaden Daniels, but how he dealt with that pressure and that defensive line of the Eagles that was so dominant. I mean, that's who should have been, not to

take anything away from Hertz, but if you have given like the the Super Bowl MVP was the D line of the Eagles they completely owned that game Yeah, and it's it's a wild season for Philadelphia that had some tumult early on Nick Sirianni was getting criticized He was yelling at his own fans. You had himself a year AJ Brown seemed AJ Brown seemed as unhappy as anybody could be throughout the season. Now he's the Super Bowl champ, had the big play from Devontae Smith. They kept Saquon away from getting the record.

None of it matters now. Well, yeah, you're like, you better win the Super Bowl if you don't let him, and it was worth it. And I believe because of his playoff performance, he now has the most yards in history in one season when you include the playoffs, past Terrell Davis. So congratulations, Saquon, congratulations Philadelphia, congratulations to the world, no more Chiefs on top.

And- They'll be back. And look, I did it on Twitter, but I'm gonna give my flowers to Jalen Hurts, who, you know, for whatever reason, and I'm part, I was part of the problem, but I've always doubted Jalen Hurts and his ability to enter the elite category. And I'm not saying this Super Bowl win where you just gave the MVP to the D-line and Saquon's contributions this year means that Jalen Hurts is the elite of the elite, but this is a Super Bowl winning

multi Super Bowl quarterback who has had his best moments in the most important games, which frankly means a lot more than having all the prolific numbers in the regular season. Everyone can go say that, you know, whatever, Joe Burroughs got amazing regular season numbers. You win games like this, this is your legacy. I mean, he deserves so much credit for his consistency in the locker room and on the field and when it mattered the most. And I've never given him enough credit. I've always looked for peripheral reasons

why it was others that lifted up Jalen Hurts. And I think it's worth a moment to say, this team does not get here, this team does not win, without him at quarterback. Sure, and you combine in, Saquon Barkley had a long run of 10 yards. He was 25 for 57. So this is not, this wasn't,

and I know you're always taking the attention, they gotta try and stop him. Yes, that's true, but Barkley's not beating him up, and then Jalen Hurts gets to capitalize on that. There was no running going on from the running backs. But Jalen Hurts was. But Patrick LeVolums threw for more yards than Jalen Hurts. Stop it.

That's because of one bomb touchdown that they had to air out to. Shout out to Andy's Draft Kings. Oh, my gosh. Which was dead. It was just, that thing was, we had the, Jason and I, we were five feet. That casket was lowering the thing down.

And then you had the Holmes Worthy stack. I won by like a million points. Scores a bajillion points. That was great. Of garbage. I will say this, that play which was forced upon them, right? They're down by four or five scores and they've got to just, and there's minutes left so it's basically snap the ball and no matter where you are on the field,

I've got to get a touchdown this play. Shocking. James Winston style. And it came, you know, it was an awesome throw, awesome catch. Yeah. But when that play happened I was like, you could do this effort, you could do this all the time. I, that was, I was messaging. He's so fast. He's the fastest man in the NFL. I was messaging you guys of like, please let this be the thing that we're like, Mahomes goes, oh yeah. I remember when I threw for 5,000 yards and 50 bajillion touchdowns. That's who I am in my heart. It's time to let it rip. And next next year we get enough of this dumb we win by three points bull crap you scored two touchdowns and win.

Unleash the fury. Give it to us. This is why I wondered what the implications will be for Rashe Rice because the breakout for Xavier Worthy end of season on through the, proved to be a very special talent, and he was the only player that put up prolific numbers yesterday. By the end, because I think it was like going- Eight for 157 and two.

But going into the fourth quarter, I think he had just a handful of yards. So that'll be interesting. This weekend also meant that we announced the UDK pre-order, so the Ultimate Draft Kit. You can go and pre-order at the lowest possible price at ultimatedraftkit.com. If you order before March 1st, which I recommend you do if you're user of the Ultimate Draft Kit or if you want to win your league, you have a chance to win a

listener league spot to come and play with us if you order by March 1st. Like I said, it's the lowest price. And if you pick up the UDK Plus or the Ultimate Footclan subscription, you get access to the dynasty pass right now. A lot of you have asked what's in the dynasty pass. That's all of our rookie rankings, startup rankings, production profiles. Yeah, which if you're unfamiliar,

production profiles, we are comparing a player's market share of their team's offense. So like running back, you know, they were this percent of the team's carries, this percent of their rushing yards, receiving yards, all of those things. Because you're using that as a tool to compare to guys who are successful in the league right now. We can look back, what did they do in college? What was their market share? What are good indicators of?

Good benchmarks. Are you like, oh, someone might be a good pro? And you go with market share because there are some wacky college offenses, I think they're called Mickey Mouse offense or something, where these teams just put up incredible overall totals, but it doesn't work in the NFL. So maybe their market, you're like, oh, he's got a bunch yards, yeah, but he's't work in the NFL. So maybe they're marketing, you're like, oh, he's got a bunch of yards.

Yeah, but he's actually only 20% of the receiving yards, which is not that great. He wasn't dominating the offense. So that's a huge part of my process of if someone stands out there in green, they should be on your radar. And if you already have it, or if you don't have it and you want it,

the team opportunity pages, check that out. If that's something you haven't looked at before, the team puts in a ton of work on that. All 32 teams, we show what the opportunity is, what they're for coming. For rookies to land. Yeah, for rookies to land, what kind of draft capital do they have, free agencies coming in and out. It's a real good lay of the land tool to get you ready for the season. Yeah, and our initial pass at the rookie rankings, dynasty trade targets, dynasty life cycles, free agent tracker, everything is in the dynasty pass

and there's three separate releases of it that you get pre-combine, post-combine, post-NFL draft. Our number one rookie right now, it might shock you. It won't. It won't shock you, I was just saying it might. Yeah, that would be, you're gonna spoil that one? Yeah, it's Ash and Gentile. So ultimatedraftkid.com to check that out

and be a part of the giveaway, we're really excited. Thank you to everybody that supports the show by picking up that product. Who has enjoyed the show this year. We are a year round podcast, we're not going anywhere. We got two shows a week. And then the Foot Clan extra episode as well, if you're a member over there.

So you can follow the show on socials over on X at the FF Ballers. You can go to Instagram.com slash fantasy footballers and the Discord community free to join. Ballersdiscord.com become a part of the greatest community free to join ballers discord.com become a part of the greatest community on planet Earth we talked a little bit about the Super Bowl we got other news to talk about news and notes from around the league

Jason big surprise for you Jay Glazer reporting Aaron Rodgers the Jets are moving on. Yeah, when I saw that report, I didn't see it was from Jay Glazer. I just saw it, just said sources say, and I'm like, you don't need a source? Like obviously they were not going to, like the source is your brain. Just watch the team, watch the, you know, Aaron Rodgers and it's, that was not a long-term situation there. So you'll be on retirement watch for Aaron Rodgers, or maybe it's Cleveland Browns watch,

or something of that nature. Yeah, or Raiders. Devontae. Or maybe injury to preseason quarterback. What if he's not there, and then it's like, we're going to go get Aaron Rodgers. Yeah. Devontae Adams, ESPN reporting that he'd be open

to signing with teams in California. The Rams, Chargers, and 49ers, that's where he went to school, that's where he'd love to be. If the Jets release him, which we do not know if they will. It sounds like that's gonna happen. Adam Schefter reporting the 49ers have granted Debo Samuel permission to find a trade partner.

He's 29 years old, he's in the final year of his deal. But Samuel permission to find a trade partner. He's 29 years old. He's in the final year of his deal. But they do not find a trade partner. It's a big cap hit. 15.8 million? Yeah, he... 31 million dead if they were to cut him. So it's a trade or stay.

It's really... Look, it's unfortunate watching our superstars age, but it's hard to watch what Debo Samuel did last year. And I guess if you're a different team, watch his footage and go, yep, then we need to get him on this roster. And with that type of a cap hit, it seems like a big ass. Debo's superpowers yards after the catch,

breaking tackles and unstoppable to get to the ground. And if you look at his yards after catch by reception per year, 12.2, 10.8, 9.6, 8.7, 8.2. It's like he's getting older. Yeah. They need to, if you use the thing you did with Rogers, your eyeballs, you can tell what to do there. The Jaguars have decided to stifle our optimism

by hiring Shane Waldron, formerly of the Bears, the Jaguars have decided to stifle our optimism by hiring Shane Waldron, formerly of the Bears, as their now passing game coordinator. I love to see this. We have a coaching changes episode. Why do you love this? In two weeks. Well, I.

For the chaos? Yeah, a little bit for the chaos. Well, the thing is, is Liam Cohen, you know, Duval. Oh yeah, we know him. I was, I officially. Duval. Thank yeah, no we're, you know him. I was, I officially. Duval. Thank you. I officially came on record, like I said

that I'm rooting for him, that I want him to be good, and then I realized I was not being honest. Yeah, okay, yes. I was not, because I, so goobery, I'm like, I kind of. Duval. You gotta let that hate out of your heart. I need that to fail. I need that to fail.

And so this is the best path towards that. I mean, you're telling me you went and got Shane Waldron, who is not good. Well, he is rather famous for deleting players. Is this Waldron's third team in three years? Three years, yeah. It was the Seahawks and then last year, the Bears. Yeah, so I mean, that's good, right?

Third time third times the try Mike Well, I mean look I think JSN was happy to see him go Became a real player after that. Yeah NFL Network reporting that there is a standoff Oh underway between the Falcons and Kirk Cousins. Oh man, Cousins watch. Because he is, well he is under contract for three more years and has a base salary guarantee. You dummies. It's not a standoff.

There's one man with a gun. Yeah, there's no one else. Kirk Cousins got a bazooka on his shoulder and he's just like, what you guys wanna do? I mean that's it, this is a one sided affair. He's got a contract and he's like no I'm not going to do anything but like. That's a. I mean what do you. I'll just write it out. That's fine. What are you supposed to do. I mean what do you blame Kurt Cousins for any of this.

No. No. Now he's been a great teammate. Here's the other side of that coin though. The standoff if you want to find it is because Kurt Cousins doesn't want to be a backup.'t if you don't want to be a backup and you want to give some money back or do whatever To facilitate that then you can do it. That's your choice. Otherwise, you can collect a check put on a headset Yeah, and kick up your feet the he's not going to be the starter for the Falcons Barring an injury obviously that that has already the change has happened They've moved on their franchise is in the hands of Michael Pinnix

So that means the standoff is really he needs a trade He needs another team that is going to take on the contract or whatever and at that point at that point He would need to probably adjust something for the incoming team I'd rather have Kirk cousins than Aaron Rodgers, but I wouldn't want to pay Kirk this amount of money If I was desperate. The NFL Network's Tom Pelicero also reporting that JJ McCarthy will be ready to roll for team activities and in May, there was a separate comment from

Vikings head coach Kevin O'Connell, sorry, coach of the year, Kevin O'Connell, saying Sam Darnold, quote, has earned the right to be a free agent. Kevin. When asked about the possibility of resigning him, I mean. Kevin, don't say these things.

I believe that Sam Darnold will get a contract from the Raiders or somebody. I think he will get paid to go be a starter somewhere else. I think Darnold is a starter next year somewhere. I just don't think it's gonna be in Minnesota. I think that is over with and I think it would have been quite different had the playoffs gone a little bit differently. Yeah I'm not gonna argue with that. The quote of earn the right to be a free agent is hilarious. It's number one it's hilarious. Number two, pump the breaks.

You don't know what your team is going to do. You might end up franchising Sam Darnold. Oh, man. And stepping on that right. Yeah, let me see if you're like, hey, you earned the right. But we're not going to give it to you. Oh, my gosh, they can't franchise him now. They can't.

That's all I meant from there. You can't say that. But this report is also, it's like, you've earned the right to be free, you open the prison door, and as he starts to walk towards the door, you slam it. I mean, with money, with 20 plus million dollars. But the report on J.J. McCarthy, in case you had forgotten, he had the meniscus surgery and then he had to have a follow-up procedure shortly after which is, it's never great when you have to resurgery a surgery. And.

As they say. Yeah. As they call it. Eloquent. So if he's ready by May, that's a positive direction. I guess the only other thing I'd want to get your thoughts on the MVP was announced, it was Josh Allen, it was as close as it's been since I think 06,

narrowly defeating Lamar Jackson. I still don't have a vote, which is ridiculous, but. Yeah, who would you have voted anyway? I would have voted for Josh Allen. Now, what are the rules about betting on futures? If you have a vote? If you have a vote. I mean, look.

I'm guessing that's frowned upon. Frowned upon, but it can't be illegal. betting on futures. If you have a vote. If you have a vote. I mean look. I'm guessing that's frowned upon. Frowned upon, but it can't be illegal. It's not like you are the only one. Kyle, look into this. I do wonder that though, like the Gatorade color. Like there are dudes that know exactly what color Gatorade, there's people that put the Gatorade in the bucket.

I think that those. I love the idea that it was kept secret. Right. There's just a powder. I think those bets are like the real frivolous. I think those are capped. They are capped. They are capped. But like betting on MVP and stuff is like,

you can put big money on it if you want to. Yeah, but you're just one 100th of the vote. Sure. But that's a lot more than the layman's have out there. I think I would have voted for Josh Allen. It was a very close. My slip said I would have voted for Lamar Jackson. Well, look, here's the hardest thing,

is we've had this discussion. I don't remember if it was on this show or another one. I was talking about how Mahomes and Brady, two of the best players in the NFL ever, have a different athleticism than other metrics. They're not the fastest. They have dad bods. They didn't, you know, there's something.

Did you see Brady's? Well, not anymore, Brady's, what is he, what is he talking about? I mean, he just looks like a supermodel. Yeah, but he was a lumbering oaf as a quarterback. But did you see, I think it was on It was on Coward. Coward. I saw his.

I mean, it's an interesting clip, not nothing you didn't know for sure, but just Tom Brady really expressing, like, and him being, admitting, What his superpower was. I wasn't more athletic than everybody, but I studied the tape, I knew what the defense was gonna do just by being lined up,

and you're like, oh yeah, you won that much, it makes sense. The point I was getting at was just that, like, you have different definitions of athleticism, that's what we were debating. Oh, yes. Is we were debating what makes the best athlete and what sport would be the best athlete.

And some might say soccer, because you've got to cover so much ground and run around. That was kind of one of my defaults. And you said basketball. Yeah, because it's basketball. And so we were debating what makes an athlete. And I think there's obviously a subjective debate about what makes an MVP.

Sure. If you want to tell me that it's always going to come down to the stats, then debating what makes an athlete. And I think there's obviously a subjective debate about what makes an MVP. Like if you wanna tell me that it's always gonna come down to the stats, then all of a sudden you get into this unique universe where it's like, okay, we're on the goal line so now we gotta give Josh Allen the tush push on this play instead of the play we wanna call to try to manipulate the stats to make them look like the MVP.

Like if they're close, you to look at other things to me. And for me, it's the supporting cast. Yes. To me, it's not having... Derek Henry. Derek Henry, and having been the higher seed, right? You had a better record, a higher seed. You lost the fun digs.

You did more with less. Yeah. But it's a razor thin like any year this is completely worthy of Lamar and I don't I don't know if Lamar hadn't won before if the votes different like those things happen to those definitely factor and and I think they should. I think they really should. I don't think there's anything wrong with saying Josh Allen doesn't have one Lamar has two. So you know what? At this point, I think Josh Algefinish, his career with an MVP, as a tiebreaker, it's not like that's the only thing. There are

a handful, there's the stats, but they both had great stats. There's the wins. You've got to be on a winning franchise. You can't not make the playoffs and win MVP. They both had that. Then there's the how valuable to their team? Take those players off of the team, what's left? The Ravens had a better defense. They had Derrick Henry, who was an offensive player of the year candidate in his own right. But is Derrick Henry, Derrick Henry if you take Lamar off? Yeah, but I think that that was the primary difference

for me. I mean, Michael Jordan won five MVPs in 15 years. And you're saying he should have had 12 or 13? Yeah, 12 or 15. Well, 13, you can take the Wizards years out. Oh, that's fair. Those count to the 15. But yeah, Mike, your slip said Lamar.

Would you have voted Lamar? I honestly don't care. OK, all right. And I only say that because I say that because this year more than any other year I can remember, the people on Twitter so mad. Yeah, yeah. So mad of like, I don't know why. This is my take. Josh Allen is the MVP. If you think it's Lamar, you're a big fat stupid idiot. And it's like, whoa, man, it's the MVP. It's not a big... Let's just pump the brakes on it a little bit. Well, Lamar was the all-pro.

Yeah, so it's the... And Josh Allen wasn't. So I mean, it's a racer's edge there. Yeah. All right, we'll take a break. We'll get into some mailbag. delivered across the GTA from real Canadian superstore with PC Express. Shop online for super prices and super savings. Try it today and get up to $75 in PC Optimum Points. Visit superstore.ca to get started. Before the break, Jason, I feel like you might

have wanted to say something else about the MVP discussion. I did. In fact, I want- Saquon? Is that what you were gonna say? No, no, no. It was not. it was still going back to the Josh Allen v Lamar Jackson all the debate of who would you vote for why this year 22 whatever throw it all in the garbage You're a general manager Those are the two human beings you get to start your franchise with the age they are the the skills they have right now Now I got a check agent genuinely

Lamar who are you who's your? Who would you grab? They're the same age. Are they? Oh perfect. Who would you grab to run the team? Which player would you bring in? I think Lamar. I think. That's such a hard question. I think Lamar. I think I'd go Lamar too. My instinct, my first instinct was Josh Allen. However, I believe Lamar's playing style will last longer. Even though he runs just as much, he doesn't take the punishment that Josh Allen does. See, I would completely disagree with that. Really? Yeah, because big quarterbacks don't get hurt ever,

even later. No, they don't get hurt, but they break down like Kim. No, but just goes but you're taking Lamar from an 800 900 yard rusher To a pocket pass or later in his career Whereas his superpowers worth 800 900 yards Josh Allen's was not worth that many right? He's 600 yards Is that where he was? 30 think 530 this year 524 the past year. Yeah, I mean I guess in that regard I'm thinking like one's gonna translate longer. So I would think Josh Allen maybe ends up, I mean who's a better passer? I know that was the follow up question. I'm not sure that I know the answer to that. I think it's Josh Allen. They're both top

notch but one of them has a super powered arm that can do things that, like Lamar can, Lamar can bomb it out, but Lamar can't laser beam, you can't see someone open, no, no one can. But Lamar, I think as time goes on, even if you're like, oh, he's more of a pocket passer, he can still move around the pocket and still escape, even if he's not running for 900 yards.

He'll still have enough speed to create bigger windows. This was Lamar's first 4,000-yard passing season. Did Josh Allen have a 5,000? Yeah, I believe so. Josh Allen's always well above 4. It's hard to debate. Josh Allen has not been anywhere close. To 5,000? Yeah, I believe so. Josh Allen's always well above 4. It's hard to debate. Josh Allen has not been anywhere close. To 5,000?

Call 4,500 yards close. No, I wouldn't. I would not either. Rounding would say, by rule. It is 45, 44, so you could round that up. Lamar just went 41 and 4. 41 and 4. With his interceptions?

Yeah. What was the season for Josh Allen? 28 and six. I mean. Yeah it is. Could I have them both on my team? Honestly, I think that the real answer is, just give it to both of them.

The MVP? I know, and I- We've done this before, right? I make such an argument of whenever, if you say most or best, it is only one, but in this instance where it's like, it's so close. Peyton Manning and Steve McNair in 2003. Yeah, like I'm gonna call up my other writers

and be like, let's make sure that this thing is tied, cause they both... Oh, collusion. Yeah, yes, exactly, cause they both deserve it. about one of those old old-school Pro Bowl style throwing contests between the two of them oh I think they know and it's got that all right we're the mailbag right did I hit that drop already we have not oh okay here you go Mike mailbag

Alright, we're going to answer some questions here on the show starting with a voicemail. If you have a question and you would like to submit it, you can go to the website, the fantasyfootballers.com, click the submit a question button or dial our voicemail hotline 302-464-CFFB. Here we go. Hey ballers, this is Sean from San Diego. I have a theoretical question and I was wondering if you think that pass interference yard 2464 TFFB, here we go. Hey ballers, this is Sean from San Diego. I have a theoretical question, and I was wondering if you think that

pass interference yards should count for receivers and quarterbacks. Love the show, thanks. No way. Should pass interference, oh, hold on. So the question is, should pass interference count for fantasy points?

This has been. Well, he actually said for receivers and quarterbacks. Yes. Yeah, yeah. Should we get awarded points for that? We have had. I think those are two separate questions. We've had many spirited debates.

Oh, yeah. Around the office. In the footballers headquarters about should this end? It's a stupid thing. I don't think we've. Have we really debated this on air before? If we have, it's been a while. Barely.

But this is a comment. Like, it's usually a while. Just barely, but this is a comment. It's usually a fight between Jeremy and Andy, because Andy thinks it's the stupidest thing ever, Jeremy thinks that 100% should be there. I'm on the side that I have, I think I would- You wanna be persuaded? I want a point per pass interference, that's it. Not yardage.

See, that's a fantasy. That's why I said they're separate. They're separate. It was this question. This question was about whether they become quarterback and wide receiver numbers in the NFL. No. Which is, that's what the question was. If you listen to the question, that's exactly what he said. Oh, well, I'm reading what the summary was, is should players get fantasy points for it. Well, that is not what he said.

Let's play that voicemail again. Let's go back to the team. Hey, ballers, this is Sean from San Diego. I have a theoretical question, and I was wondering if you think that pass interference yards should count for receivers and quarterbacks. Love the show. Thanks. So I have to imagine the spirit is for fantasy.

We can have that discussion. I'm just saying it does matter on the record books and things like that. That's where you'd go away from like counting them as. Yeah, I'm not adding it to your total. First of all, it's not a completed pass. It's not. Correct. It's not a completed pass. It is correct.

So if we're going to keep track of completed passes, it's not a completed pass. Correct. It's for any sort of yardage. So you talk about fantasy, I've actually been on your camp of saying, look, if you're a receiver and you force a PI, I'm fine giving them a point. I don't care about that.

That's great. You did something to help your team. We're never going to know in this mythical world where there wasn't a PI, whether you would have caught it, whether it was coming down as catchable, whether you stepped out of bounds on the attempt to catch it, even when you did catch it, whether you fumbled after you caught the ball. You do not know all the what if. What an embarrassing drop they could have just had.

So there's an infinite amount of alternate realities post attempted catch. But what is 100% always true is you got them a first down. Yes, yes, yes. Every single time. Yeah, you helped your team. Completely agree. If you're playing and like the Scott Fish Bowl League has points per first down

But that's not awarded there, but that player got a first down. So I don't know. I think it would be fun I hate when I see my wide receiver get whether it's a bomb or even just you know, a 15 yard crosser on the field It's like he gets held up. It's like oh that that robbed me We don't know if it would have came true, but he did help your team. He did get them a first down I think you should get a point or if you want if you're in a half PPR and you want to argue it's it's basically giving them the equivalent of fantasy points for so does that go you're saying give a point to the receiver or point to the quarterback to the receiver so the quarterback is nothing correct okay yeah I mean technically technically the defender did it the defender earned the yards.

You know what I mean? Should you give him a point if you've got negative? I'm just saying, technically, it wasn't the receiver that did it. I feel like something should happen. Because fantasy football is not real football. We play a very different game. Even though it's based on football,

it's still different. So I think something should happen. The more hyper- Something should happen for the wide receiver. The more hyper fair you try to make fantasy because you think that's what you want, the less fun it's going to be. Yeah, I agree.

I genuinely believe that. I think the tragedy and screaming and yelling and sadness and unfairness creates all the fun storylines that we enjoy in fantasy. Now that doesn't mean you can't make tweaks and adjustments and go half PPR like we like to do. And I'm fine with the point. I'm fine with the point to the receiver. Which that is probably why, that's probably why the NFL still has all the

old antiquated like we have chains and we don't have perfect camera angles. Yeah because the NFL knows that us and other big shows, like, we're just gonna spend all that time drawing people's attention to the NFL. Can you imagine this crazy thing that they did? The refs, they love the chiefs. All publicity is good publicity. Oh man, whew, that's.

After that first, yeah, the first fourth down. I tweeted it out, I was like, no, not right off the bat. The fourth down, an important fourth down, and they call a terrible. I was very worried. Oh yeah. Because they don't want that to be the story. It's so annoying. Yeah, it's one of those things that's... I'm one of the people that believes that you should

change the NFL rule for past interference to the collegiate rule. I think- It's 15? It's 15. And the reason being not because, it's not because that, like if you could perfectly apply past interference 100% of the time, the call,

I'm fine with the NFL rule, but you can't. Nobody knows what it is. You have the catch child, right? De you can't. Nobody knows what it is. You have the catch child, right? Dealing with catches. He knows what it is. The catch child has a friend that might know what a pass interference is, but we really don't always know what it is.

Sometimes somebody grabs a little bit, sometimes they don't. You turn your head, oh, I can PI when I turn my head. I can't. We've all watched games where the three of us disagree with each other on whether that was PI. So to me, because of the fact it's so subjective of a call, you'd nerf that by taking away the potential 50-yard penalty and make it the college rule, make it a 15-yard penalty.

And yes, you're going to have more intentional pass interference. Okay, that's your choice. You're giving them a first down, you're giving them this. I think you harm offense overall though. If I'm a DB and I'd be like, oh, this is a huge play, I'm going to play it way more aggressive. You help fantasy. Because none of those yards count for either guy

when you go 50 down the field. You give them 15, they've got to go the rest of the field. Don't take my yards away from me. No, I love it. I would 100% do that. I also think that the holding, defensive holding, should move to, you know, instead of five yards and an automatic first,

I don't know, 10 yards, and then no automatic first. Cause I hate when it's like, oh it's first. Which one is it? Defensive holding? Defensive holding, I hate when it's third and 28, and a five yard penalty gives them a first down. It feels like such a bailout. That's tough.

I agree with you most of the time but what if that holding happens 40 yards down the field on a wide receiver that's wide open and they do it before the ball's released? It's just rare. Okay. Usually defensive holding is earlier. Yeah I think I think some people push back on the 15 yards saying they'll do a bunch of intentional pass interference. I would. It doesn't happen in college. It would not happen. No defenders are This rule's been there forever. No defenders are trying to draw a 15 yard penalty ever. No, I just mean. It does happen sometimes.

It just doesn't happen a lot. I mean, from the point of, I'm going to be far more aggressive and less concerned about it, because the consequence to me is not 50 yards, because I got called on a tiki-tac foul. There's also the other side of where there is a lot of wide receivers selling stuff on the pass interference because of the Value down the field. It's an interesting

Debate but let's start With first down lines that everybody knows whether the ball gets across them. That'd be pretty can we do that? And maybe can they of course will they I don't know maybe upgrade to and this one the chain gang union that strong Yeah, they've been around for a long time hundred years. We like the drama I'm not opposed to having people walk around and do nothing of value just carry chains around. That's fine I would also I just if I was part of the NFL rules committee I would just demand demand that we get I get, I don't know, goal line cameras both directions.

Yes. That's it? Yes. It's pretty simple. Impossible. That seems like you can afford it. I don't even care, use a camera. You know, a camera phone.

Don't you know it? Use an iPhone, just put it on a little tripod right down the line. Yeah, why, have you ever seen a young chain gang referee? You ever seen a young man out there? No. Like, is there anybody growing up, like, they're like they're like 18 19 like this is what I want to do in life no it's the first down markers and I'm I'm in shape and I can carry that chain with like it must be light because these guys are not yeah it's not a heavy

thing it's a small chain you've seen it well give them a big chain that I'll be in shape huge Like a like a titanic anchor size change be so slow to move the man be so funny Like 12 guys we talking about we talk about what we want the seasons over We just we will talk baseball J's are we're saying we want cameras Yeah, just cameras what you don't know about those ends on cameras Is that if two of them face each other they destroy each other? Oh, that's why you can't have one on both ends make sense Jalen wattle question Is that what this is?

No, it's not from Tyler. No, it's not Tyler said Which? That was my answer. Yeah, this is your answer. You're playing Jeopardy over here. I'm not used to having answers in. Just read what you said. Which underperforms? No, no, no, say the name. Tyler Tracy.

Diddy-do. No, I was saying Jalen Waddle. And then I would say, what is an underperforming player of 2024 that will be a steal in 2025 drafts? Jalen Waddle. Yeah, there we go. That was my answer Who is jail and Tyler asked which underperforming player would be a steal? I?

Said Jalen wattle because he finished it like wide receiver 46 and Isn't that kind of a player like he got elite wide receiver money is an elite player banged up that's who the hardest part for Jalen Waddle is, like, he gets hurt seemingly a lot, but he is a really good wide receiver. Like, I think he's talented, I think he's a great player, it just has not... I didn't want to answer this, by the way. It didn't fully work out with Waddle or just the question overall? No, with Waddle because there's so much risk with him. There's so much fatigue and annoyance.

And yet, that was true of DJ Moore. And that's true of Terry McLaurin. Talent does win eventually, more often than not. This was a player finished in the top 10 before with Tua by his side. Yeah, three years before this season, he was 1,000 yard receiver each year. This was a really down season for him.

And I would expect a bounce back. Certainly not all the way down at wide receiver 46. But there is no way to answer this question without risk. Because we're talking about a player coming off of a bad season. There is a problem, whether it's age, whether it's injury, whether it's whatever. My answer to this is Chris Olave. Chris Olave carries enormous risk.

It feels kind of like Tua. Your one hit away from your season is over. Hopefully they get that figured out and he doesn't deal with concussion issues going forward into the next season. It will be a risky pick. They get that figured out and he doesn't deal with concussion issues going forward into the next season. It will be a risky pick. But because of that, I don't think he'll cost you a lot when he's out there playing, especially when he's playing with a quarterback that's healthy and active.

Their car should be good to go. I think that Chris Olavi is a really, really talented wide receiver who can put up wide receiver one type of numbers, but he carries a lot of risk. So he's a bounce back candidate for me. The best ball drafters are agreeing because the early basketball ADP, Jalen Waldo's at wide receiver 30

and Olavi's at wide receiver 31. So both of those guys feel like that is really undervalued for- It's just a rough year for both guys. Yeah, it was, but they're both good. Yeah, you're betting on talent. And young. Yes.

And my guy is not young, but he is talented, and I'm going to be willing to forgive him. It's Christian McCaffrey. So steel. Drafted as the RB1 last year. It did not work. But here's what's going on in basketball right now. Saquon, Bijon, Jamir Gibbs are the top three. I have no issue.

That is perfectly fine. You would do the same thing? I don't know that I would, but I don't have...it's not weird. Or... I would. I would take those three as the top three. You take those three over McCaffrey.

Yeah. But then after that, it's Devon Aitchin, Derek Henry, and Ashton Gentry. And it's like, I'm not saying for sure when the UDK fully releases on June 1st and we're in full projections and everything, maybe McCaffrey is here. Like I like those other guys more. But that's some big question marks, especially H.E. H.E. is a real surprise. The way that he played this year,

I mean, if you don't PPR your way in to extreme value, and it's just like Christian McCaffrey, you're saying Debo is off the team? Not that Debo's taken everything, but Debo's stole some work. I mean, look, it's risk aversion. It's age and risk aversion. And the team struggled.

The team struggled. I mean, is this era of 49 years football going to be rejuvenated? And he's old. Or is it going to be the end? But he's still under contract. They just kind of moved some money around for him last off season before the whole Achilles tendonitis thing

teared down. I will bet though that the real ADP, the true ADP, I'm gonna bet you now, that McCaffrey is either four or five. I think the true ADP in redraft is gonna be different than best ball. I think you'll see Barkley, Bichon, and Gibbs, and then you will see a 50-50 Henry or McCaffrey

in most leagues. I do not believe Gentie or HM will be anywhere close to that. But when you are, often, and it's, you know, these are based off of preseason projections and assumptions, when you are drafting, you know, it'll be, oh here's the big three running backs, because you feel like in your projections and just looking at football, any of those three guys could easily be the running back one. It's not common that you're drafting a guy at the RB5 spot where you go, yeah, this guy could

be the number one overall running back. Of course, things never fully work out the plan and some guys end up at number one and they were not drafted that way. I'm just saying that feeling you get after the draft, drafting the RB five or six, I'm never like, I did it. I got the guy who's going to sneak into the number one position. It's not just other running backs that you have to compare him to. When we're in the draft next year, Jamar Chase, Justin Jeffers to CD lamb all those guys will go over him You're gonna be dealing with do you want Nico Collins and Amon Ra and Puka and Malik neighbors those type of players?

Where I think when people are like the risk of the age Cuz cuz when we saw Christian McCaffrey on the field this last year, he was good for fantasy But he was not he didn't Christian McCaffrey dominant. He wasn't scoring touchdowns one or two a game Yeah, he wasn't right. And so I think there will be some risk averse people pushing him down But as a reminder his career is he finished as the running back three the running back one Injured year 53 injured year 39 comes back the running back to the running back one injured year 70 That was this year. It's just easy healthy or not. That's the only like how many times you said injured here Yeah, I get that but I promise you in 2022 if you took that shot

You were very happy that you had Christian McCavary score. How old is he now? 28 He'll be 29 this season. He's 28.7. That'll be fun one to watch. Yeah, I don't think he'll go I think he'll go ahead of A-Champ because... In redraft? Yeah, cuz you can have news I mean right now he's not on the field right like yeah his papa. His dad is saying he's healthy. He's got a note from dad. Dad says he's healthy. My boy is ready to play. I mean, come on. Please excuse his absence from 2024. We can't. Gentie will, Gentie could easily be ahead of CMC solely depending on the landing spot.

Yes, he could, he could, he could. We'll take a break. We'll do some more questions. All right, Baylor writes in on X, will Pooka be good when Stafford finally retires, or would you look to trade him in dynasty before then? I think this is, can I frame this for you? Yeah, sure. Let's frame this in a Michael Thomas.

I thought you were gonna say like Michaels. Let's frame it in a- They do. Michaels does frames? I see. They do frames. I see. It's a craft story see. Michael Thomas. I was very displeased with their framing job for me. Oh Michael's let you down? You're putting them on blast for a framing job? What kind of framing job? That's my namesake crafts. Hold on, hold on. You had a high stakes framing job? Yeah I had a high stakes framing job and they let me

down because they were trying to do it right now. How do you butcher a frame? What's in high stakes framing? Did it come out all like triangle? What was in it? It's a signed movie poster. I got signed movie posters and so because they were signed, they're like, well, we can't, I don't know what they use, like a glue or something that like flattens it out. Like in the normal application, if you just bring them something to frame, picture you and your family. They do this thing to make sure that it's

real smooth. I didn't think it would matter because it's pushed up against glass, right? Isn't it going to be smooth? They're like, we can't do that. It's like, okay, that makes sense. That's fine. So they framed it. They're the experts of framing. Yeah, they're the experts. Not really. Because I got that thing home and in the light, I mean, it's like it's an ocean of it's like it's an ocean of waves all that you can't see anything But waves you can't even see the poster owl you've seen these right? How terrible are they so bad? Oh, and I'm like there's a lot of air space between the poster. I don't understand it

We see it didn't say it's not a real tight fit no bad job Michael say goodbye to our arts and crafts It's not a real tight fit. No, bad job, Michaels. Say goodbye to our arts and crafts sponsorships. Yeah. Or we've just brought a problem to their attention, and they will fix it. And then if they do, And they will rise back to the top.

I'm happy to promote you. And this is all because I said I was going to frame my argument. But here's the way. If you're not going to go to Michaels to get a frame, where are you possibly going? I don't know. This Hobby Lobby frame? There are framing places.

There are stores. No, it's Michaels or Bust. Really? Well, then it's Bust. That's why they can charge so much, because they know know what no one else does frame frame it yourself, man Yeah, it's good frame it yourself. Yeah, you buy a frame. This is not rocket You know you never do it with your posters where you you just slide the couldn't put a pause the border frame I guess I have a lot to learn about framing

Look what I was gonna say which I'll use different words for. Puka Nkua. Look, Michael Thomas had special years with Drew Brees. Very special, unique. We saw this with Cooper Cup as well. Very special years with Matthew Stafford. Saw it with Robert Woods. You've seen it with a lot of guys.

Calvin would have done it anywhere. But Puka, maybe he gets another year with Stafford. Stafford's time is running out either in Los Angeles, which some have alluded to could happen, or in the NFL. He's going to retire at some point. So the question is, will Puka be as good or would you look at this period of time at 23 years old, entering year three to try to trade him I

Have my answer and now I have presented the question. So this is the time for it I would not be trying to trade him. I had I learned a lesson with Justin Jefferson And part of this question is what do you really believe about puka? Is it puka? Is it Stafford? It's it's the combination You know Kirk Cousins helped make Justin Jefferson better than he was this year. But Justin Jefferson was still really good this year because Justin Jefferson is really good. Pukka Nakua has been better than you think,

both statistically, but as a player. As an actual, you know, you just watch the film, what he can do, how guys can't tackle him, how he gets open, how he's used in every possible way down the field bomb touchdowns screen game handoffs and I you know I would be a little bit more concerned if I knew that if Stafford retires or moves on that that if Sean McVeigh also attached that same year to leave that would be an even bigger hit. Would you like to know what his overall PFF grade was in 2024?

Not really, but I'm sure. You don't wanna know. I don't trust those grades a lot, but what was it? I mean, even if it helps you out. I think it's gonna be good. Well, I imagine it should be. He's awesome, but it could go either way. He really took the air out of that.

Well, I wanna know. Number one. Oh, he was the one. One out of 98 that factored in. His rookie season, Pukinokua, was the wide receiver four. He was obviously wonderful, broke every rookie record there was, and for fantasy football purposes was like, you know, well, he was the wide receiver four. This last season, he went from a rookie year

of 14 and a half fantasy points per game to 16 I'm sorry to 15.2 he was better this season than he was his rookie year you just didn't feel it because he missed you know the five games you know basically the first seven weeks of the season he was gone well you you are gonna have to consider his injury history in your dynasty evaluation of Pukunakua because that's something he dealt with in high school and college and now we finally saw it in the NFL last year. He was dealing with injury, missed games due to injury, played injured.

He played all 17 as a rookie. Correct. That's why I said last year, because it's something where Jason was so frustrated with that experience that he traded him. Jason traded a player he believed in entirely due to injury. I think it was more, and then Jason being sad that he didn't have his guy.

Yeah, I mean, it was tough. I mean, when you go the first two months of the season without your player and you're You've lost games along the way you have to make moves Based on more than just your hopes and I think the feelings to after the rookie year still have Some doubts of like was this just a real fluke this fifth round pick Just he was in the right spot at the right time for everything. Going into year two, I think it was fair to have some questions about it, but now after

what he did on the field this year, just remove his draft capital. Puka is one of the better wide receivers in the NFL, and I'm not trying to get out of guys who are that good, just because I think their situation might be rough in a little bit. It's 23 years old. Situations change. This is Sean McVay. Now, if you say, hey, Stafford and McVay

are both going to be gone from the Rams, I'm a lot more concerned now. But if it's still McVay, I think that he figures out how to get himself a quarterback. These are always tough right? I mean there's a lot of players that we've had belief in their fundamental talent that sometimes it's worked out when a quarterback change has happened, other times it hasn't right? I mean you were sitting here with names like Waddle and Olave who we believe in their fundamental ability but

they keep running up against sometimes it's injuries, sometimes it's quarterback play, injuries for the quarterback position. We saw Malik neighbors begging for a quarterback play. I mean, the thing is all of those things, those are random variables that just go out of control. But that's where the decision of the trade would be though. It's like, do you try to trade Puka Nakua

for an established situation? There just aren't that many. I think- Marvin Harrison, do you trade them for Marvin Harrison? No, give me Puka. I would definitely rather have Puka. There really aren't that many established situations that are long-term, like C.D. Lamb, Jamar Chase.

Those are great. We don't know with McCarthy whether Justin Jefferson is truly established, maybe he really is. Maybe it's a downturn. It would be like, would you rather, this is just positionally, Puka or Nico? Because the long term of Nico seems better, but I think that Puka might be the better player.

I'm on the Puka side, but that's the perfect... Every time I've looked at rankings, my own and others around the industry, those two are next to each other. And, you know, I've got Puka ahead of Nico. I don't have any problem. If you want to see J. Stroud, put him above. What about Drake London? Take the gamble on... I'm still Puka.

...Penix. Okay. Last question for today. Hoping I don't get another I'm still pooping. Panics, okay. Last question for today. Hoping I don't get another I don't care answer. Number one question from Blake on Instagram. As we wrap it up, do you prefer cupcakes or muffins? Don't care. Cupcakes or muffins? No, I was gonna say that a minute.

I've never really. Cupcakes are cakes in a muffin container, right? Yeah. Okay. Just a little cup. Did you just ask what a cupcake was? I was just describing it for myself for the sake of the question.

But I mean, if you're like, okay, what's. You said right at the end. So a muffin is more, you did the. That wasn't the. You did the, hachoo, bless you, thank you. Thank me or whatever. I mean, a cupcake has frosting on top. A muffin will never have frosting. But it's also, I mean the cupcake is spongier. A muffin's more dense, right?

Yeah, and has, yeah, and contents. You don't see a cupcake that's filled with blueberries. No, but you see like confetti cake. Cupcakes. They're filled with- There's not chewing, you don't chew objects. Well, I guess you have chocolate chip cupcakes. Yeah. No, muffins. You can have, no, you can't chew objects. Well, I guess you have chocolate chip cupcakes. Yeah. No, muffins. No, you can have the cake that has the chocolate chips in it. If you were going to a birthday party and they said something else, see, no one ever

says muffins out at a birthday party. No, that would be ridiculous. No, because it's muffins after breakfast. But honestly, I kind of wish they would. So which one do you prefer? If run of the mill, it's a Tuesday, there's no party going on There's a cupcake there the bottom the bottom part of the cupcake the bottom part of the cupcake sucks You know how to fix that right you see the top no no no no Off and you put it on top. Yeah sandwich bingo. Yeah, that's that's a weird thing to be making fun of it

It's a pro move. You don't get messy. You want to know why I'm mopping? This real simple solution that makes it so much better. I'm mopping because everybody who comes up with that thing still the one that originated it. And every party I'm ever at, they're like, watch what I can do. Look how cool this is. Can you do that with a muffin? You don't need to because the muffin's good through and through.

So then a muffin's better. A muffin is better. And you know what? If you want a frosting a muffin, you can do it. I give you permission. Because if that's the only thing that makes a cupcake better is like, ooh, I like that there's some frosting up here. I'm starting to think here,

like a lot of muffins have the sugar on the top of the muffin and that's not throughout. So like maybe we just need the tops of the cupcakes and the tops of the muffins and get rid of the rest. I like the whole thing. And muffins- Can I feed you my muffin bottoms no oh my gosh no push that outro button oh yeah you keep your muffin bottoms away from me I

don't want to eat your muffin bottom we'll see you later everybody ultimate draft kid calm we say cool stuff in there. Goodbye. Goodbye. Thank you for listening to another episode of the Fantasy Footballers podcast. Join our fantasy football community on JoinTheFoot.com and follow us on Twitter at The FF Ballers.