Fin vs History - Dropping the N-Bomb on Israel & Palestine: Clement Attlee (Part 2) | Post War British Prime Ministers, 1945-1979

Episode Date: September 4, 2025

Clement Attlee’s Britain left India like a man with IBS who’d just seen the restaurant’s hygiene rating. Could Clement have done anything differently with Palestine?   The show for people who like history but don't care what actually happened.   For weekly bonus episodes, ad-free listening and early access to series, become a Truther and sign up to the Patreon ⁠patreon.com/fintaylor 00:00 The Special Needs Relationship 07:09 British Night Night Bomb 12:09 David Ghandi 18:59 Blame the Bossmen 25:25 Attlee’s SuperNonce 33:23 1949 Devaluation Crisis 38:53 Kids Take The Lightswitch 46:14 Knight of the Garter Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Excuse me. Bloody heck. That's a dad burp with that. You can only have that burp if you have kids. Yeah. Powerful. None of your single nonsense burps. How do you burp?

I bet's faint. I started burping like my dad Do you burp it like your dad? Yeah, but then it's like You grow up with it so much Then you start to become your dad And all of the health things that he does You start doing you realize you kind of got the same sort of body

As you slowly turn into it Do you ever notice that? Like all the stuff that was on my dad's medicine cabinet I was like what the fuck's that And then suddenly I'm like having to build it One by one myself Wow Have we got the same shit we're doing with

Hair pills, Viagra Yeah, Viagra So it's like loads of firework build it up one by one. And it's like, oh, I know, I understand. Yeah, my dad's got those sort of got the bird-like wrists and neck that I have. Yeah. But the beer belly.

Yeah. So I have a real, real struggle on my hand to avoid the comic relief bod. Fat and weak is a brutal combination. Yeah, that's what I'm struggling against. That's my natural type. Fat and wheat. Weak, weak will as well in all the senses. Because if you're massive, if you're like a fucking unit, you can kind of pull it off as a bloke.

Yes. It's like you're a big boy. You're a fucking... If you can't even open the door, off it through that door. To the fridge. It's devastating. Anyway, welcome back.

You're listening to Finn versus History. This is episode two. Yes. Of our epic, our epic romp through the meadow of post-war British prime ministers. La la la la la la la. We're frolicing.

Yeah. We're frolicking through a field of pale, stale males. Yes. I'm having a love for time. It's rationing still. It's rational. It's been a brutal winter. It's rational.

It's been a cold winter This is part two of Clement Attlee This is as ugly as Britain Kind of has got for a while Yeah, this is pretty ugly It's one of the least horny ages The 40s is not turning me on Forties in Britain

is probably one of the least horny ages has ever been anywhere Pre-fab houses It's fucking There's nothing to get a rock on at this They're building tower blocks Yeah They're ugly

Yeah Everything's ugly Now we ended last episode Talking about The sort of end of American money Yeah And we were just saying I mean, America really fucks us in this period.

Going back over this stuff, it almost not talked about enough that kind of the people who really fucked us in this period were America. And I'd like to start a sort of historiographical movement, which is that stop blaming Britain for India and Palestine and start blaming America. Yeah, the special needs relationship. This is the special needs relationship. They are our carer and whatever they make us do, they are culpable of. Well, they're our carer and they're more stupid than us, I feel.

They're our carer and they're taking our money. Yeah. And you're right. No, actually, we're just their grandparents. Right. Well, they're embezzling us. Yeah. Yeah.

Well, so we're in a chair like this. And they're, and they're making us pull out of Palestine. You know in Breaking Bad, the one with the bell. Yeah, that's us. There's nothing we can do. We're hecked, Uncle Hector, or whatever's called. Yeah. Ding, ding, ding, ding, yeah.

So when's our big moment where we blow up the hair home? Well, that hasn't come yet. Oh, what? We're still waiting for it. We're still waiting for it. Really? yeah what no tell you what that is

that's Hugh Grant in love actually that's Hugh Grant standing up to Billy Bob Thorntons when we go which is on its by itself is pretty humiliating as well we've got Richard Curtis to play out a fantasy of us standing up to America

you can't do that in real life no God no can't afford to no we'll get Hugh Grant to be sort of like Tony Blair standing up to America yeah Richard Curtis wrote a fantasy of like an alternative history of Tony Blair and that's the best moment we've had since 1945

The high point of British democracy is Richard Kirstis' film. But they did it on purpose. They wanted the British Empire to completely collapse. They could take over. And we are the 52nd state, or was it 51st state? Isn't that Hawaii? 52nd state. I've got no idea.

At the time, there's a lot of kind of anti-American sentiment within the government. Yeah, also, not just about the policy, but the lifestyle. This was the last time in many ways, sort of the early 50s, late 40s, the last time that Britain was recognisably British. yeah because after that it's all consumerism it's McDonald's yeah it's the supermarket it's rock and roll it's miniskirts it's filth miniskirts are british invention but i know you mean they wouldn't have come without the godless godless american as andrew mar says it's the victory of this of shopping over politics yes that's what he we become shoppers he that's what he phrases this whole

he frames this whole period that we're discussing now as the victory of shopping and it feels like right now a lot of the pushback against globalization is like now everyone's trying to refragment off because everything's got so samey right that's what a lot of the movements are trying to do yeah but we all we know what shopping is like so it's hard to go back but that's the tough thing is we've already seen what's out there so it's hard to go back to more traditional british sense of things when it's like I can have a massive telly yeah no I mean but you can have big tellies but now but now shopping's dead thank you now shopping's dead because it's all amazon yeah I think what people want is they want a high street that's not

just Argos Williams, William Hill, S-E-X, yeah, C-E-X, not S-E-X. No one that C-E-X is getting out, you're having any S-E-X. It's quite ironic, if anything, it'd be great to have some proper British sex shops back. Like, have you ever driven up the A-1M? Charlie, you must have done that.

I don't drive. You don't drive. Has anyone ever driven you down the A-1M? Probably. Yeah? Probably a bit asleep in the back. All sex shops up that road. Peterborough, Grimsby, Hull, that road is just all British sex shops.

to go back to... I think that should be the high street. Right. It's like that bit of Soho, the really naughty bit that's still there. And that should just be every village is local. No, I just think, I just think rather than having an Argos and a William Hill and a KFC and a Starbucks and it's

like every high street is a model village for consumerism, why not have some independently run businesses that are mucky sex shops? Yes. With also like a butcher and... Yeah. Because interestingly, I've always had a theory that like, you know those really boozy areas of London like Stoke Newington and whatever that voted remain. Their communities are essentially

the 50s, but it's just a gentrification. Gentrification is now a luxury. Now, if you're going to a butchers and a fishmongers, you are a pretentious middle class. You're wearing a beret? Yeah. And it's more dress up and let's pretend

we're in the 50s because it's sort of a vibe. Exactly. It's butchers as a vibe. Yeah. Yeah. And the people who actually would, you know, benefit from a community have to go to ASDA. They have to drive out of town to the big ASDA.

Yeah. Can I have a steak from Azda? I live in Peterborough. That's most of the country. That's most of the country. Right. Whereas the Stoen Newton's not are like, oh, I go to the independent butchers.

Yeah. And then I go home and I'll sock off my neighbour or whatever because it's a real sense of community or whatever. Exactly. I'm paraphrasing. Anyway, we, in the last episode, we dealt with Atley's domestic law reforms, which as we've said is an extremist,

it's overwhelmingly extremist. The NHS has founded. You could argue he's sort of like, he's a kind father at home, but he, Outside of the home, he's fucking going, he's chimping out. Yeah, he is, yeah.

It's very different sort of vibes because it's very left wing at home, but he's fucking building atomic bomb. He's fucking causing chaos everywhere. This is all America. This is our carer telling a very, very sad, old disabled man to build an atomic bomb. It's not right.

But basically, because quite quickly, the Cold War starts to happen. And Britain essentially realizes that if it's going to still be a big power, which it thinks it is, even though it's in a chair with oxygen tube. It thinks it's

the VRR man it once was and so it goes well we need to keep up with armaments and in this post-iroshima post-night-night bomb world you don't have a night-light bomb you can't send anyone to bed.

Yes. He's had the authority to send people to bed. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. It's like if I as a parent can't reach the light switch to turn the light off

because you're so fat? No, because I'm so small. Okay. All the lights were just too high. then I can't send my kids to bed because I can't turn the light off yeah you don't have any authority if you have to get a step ladder

to turn the night exactly if I said get into bed right now turn the lights off wait and I'd go and get a step ladder and go and reach turn the light off then they'd be like this guy doesn't fucking know what he's doing I'm gonna stay up and around new ice cream even though a lot of British scientists

were part of the Manhattan project they helped build a lot of atomic bomb we shed so much information during the war America as soon as the war ends cuts it off you're on your own and we had to work out again, worked out quite quickly, but put a lot of money into the atomic bomb. But it's also, the America has given us so much money, and we've spent that all on the

NHS and on house, shit houses and railways and we didn't pay that back that loan till Blair. Yeah, exactly. That's how long it took to pay us to pay it off. So Britain essentially secretly approves building a British atomic bomb in 1947 because it's like we're getting excluded from the new world order. Yeah. It's all based around the night night bomb. Yeah. At the moment we've got a step ladder to turn the light off The kids aren't listening So Atley backs this

But then it later kind of splits the party Because then you obviously get Who's against it? So an uran, Nybevin Anurin, pissy ann, he hates the atomic bomb He hates the atomic bomb Yeah

But this is actually tested under Churchill But Churchill was very against the bomb He called it the hell bomb He doesn't think we should have made a atomic bomb He just thinks that Well Churchill will get to it But he was operating in a reality Where Eisenhower was just wanting to use

tactical nuclear strikes in Korea and China. I mean, that was a lot of American foreign policy. Any of these little kind of CIA covert operations, there was always one guy saying, we could just fucking nuke the cunt. Should we just wipe them off the map? There's always one guy in a room.

Like, why don't we just fucking... Yeah, it's the board guy going, why don't we just fucking nuke him and go and have dinner? Yeah. I'm with them too much. Because there's a small period where only the US have nuclear bombs. Yeah.

So they literally could just fucking trolley dash. That would have... Supermarket sweep the world. Just fucking everybody. Done, done, everything's done. In many ways, that would be... That's how we'd make our map we made in the Dunkirk series.

Sleeper Stan. Yeah. We just nuked all the bits and so they just had to form. What, you mean, it changes the... It becomes like Pangaea. Basically, yeah. We'll do a Patreon on Pan Gea.

Definitely. This is a post-Pangier pod. Atley backs the bomb and this basically means that Britain has to spend a lot of the money America's giving them on keeping up with them. Yes.

It's this real bullying sub-dom relationship. A lot of big armaments on the West German, we've put it, putting a lot of money to keep troops in West Germany. Yeah, because you cannot trust these fuckers. Yeah. They'll be at it again.

What it is, do that picture of the guy in the suit with the lingerie in the back. You know that meme? Yeah, yeah. This is sort of like, we're trying to get this front that we've got clothes on. Yes. But actually, until Suez, it's that.

That is literally, that's Britain. Yeah, we've built on the bomb, we've got troops. We're spending so much money there. They don't realize, home we've got nothing we've got basically nothing on yeah and and the u.s is only paying for us to have half a tuxedo yeah yeah so atly backs the bomb this proves quite controversial and again it bank it basically banks up the country at every point in this period that we're doing it's 79 you know when trident comes in because all these systems get they they're out of date pretty quickly so we're

just constantly pumping money half of the lend lease that britain had negotiated goes on the atomic bomb Was it the right move then? Have we ever used our nuclear weapons? Yeah, but is it just, is it just people just take you more seriously? You got to have them. Yeah, I guess so. Everyone says you've got to have them. It's like when you're at school and it's like, someone's got a Pokemon shiny.

Well, I got one. You've got to get it. Otherwise, I'm literally nothing. I've only got four pounds and I've got to spend all of it on the book. I can't afford to eat. Well, fuck it. You've got a shiny. Yeah.

At least starts this, the real story of this era, which is packing up, leaving, see you later, sorry about all that. It's the end of Glastonbury. Should we leave the tent? Fuck it. Fuck it. Burn it. So there's been moves to, for India to be independent

for years. Allegedly. Allegedly. We'll do a whole series on it on India and the Raj. Don't you think it's interesting? It's also because we couldn't have held on to India, right?

We had to give it back. India can barely hold on to India. Crazy. But then Gandhi gets a lot of credit. Yeah. But it was like it was, when you look at it through at least perspective and the British government,

Gandhi doesn't even play a part. it because it's like we've got no money we had to not David Gandhi Mahatma Mahatma yeah his granddad yeah David Gandhi's granddad yeah David Gandhi's granddad

be funny you know what I mean Mahm Gandhi's on the when you learn about Gandhi Tube adverts yeah Gandhi jeans when you learn about

Gandhi at school and stuff it's that he like caused his whole the British to get out of India yeah but when you look at it just from the government's perspective away from India

we have to leave we had to leave we had no money we couldn't afford to do it. So the fact that Gandhi was doing that is kind of by the by, right? But Gandhi just whips it up, whips up the Indians.

But we were going to go anyway. Yeah, of course we were. So there was nothing, whether he was non-violence doing it, it wasn't like, right, you're back to us to a corner, we've got to leave now. It's not like,

oh, that paedophile on his pajamas and told us to get out. Now, Gandhi did have some prudy. I mean, what was the thing where he used to sleep? We have to do a big episode on Gandhi. It's so fucking funny.

He used to sleep. He used to sleep next to. I always want to save it. It's so good. we'll give you one little snippet about Gandhi but there's a million hilariouses about Gandhi Gandhi to prove his chases he got obsessed with chastasy

he's also a big proponent of the nofap he's one of like original no fap he does believe that the only way to resist the British Empire one of the main ways was to not masturbate they're trying to take our seaman and we've got a seaman retention is where the power of India comes from yet we all get into it there's so much there

but to prove that he was so chaste he got a 14 year old girl to sleep in bed with him and he would be like, every morning, it'd be like, didn't even fuck her. Yeah. And it's like, you shouldn't want to. Gandhi, you know, that means you're a paedophile.

And also, didn't choose his wife. Yeah, it's a good point, actually. It's so funny. Imagine being his wife. It's like, why aren't you using me? Oh no. Hated his wife. There's so much for Gandhi.

How would you know I'm Chase if I'm sleeping with my wife? No, 14 year old girl. Yeah. And it's like, you're a paedophile. But I didn't have sex though. You shouldn't want to have sex with her candy. That's not impressive.

No, it's amazing to say that I'm... No, but I'm the opposite of a paedophile. I didn't have sex with it. Yeah, but you're using it as... Yeah, now... Now we'd call Gandhi a non-offending paedophile. That's what we'd call him. Yeah, but just so funny to be so smug.

Not a paedophile? Didn't have... Had it in bed all night? Not a paedophile this morning. I went to bed of paedophile. Work up... No, sorry. Went to bed of paed paed.

Went to bed a pedophile. Anyway, Atley announces at 47 that the parliament would transfer powers with Indian leadership by 48 to the latest. Lord Mount Baton is the new Viceroy. Mount Batty. Mount Batty Crease. So the Mount Batty crease. So that's like the Mount Rushmore of British Prime Minister.

Who gets fucking detonated by the IRA? Mount Batty. Is this guy? Mount Batty. Mount Batty is Batty blown up by the IRA. Yeah. Obviously these have really complicated things that are still flaring up.

I don't think they're that complicated. Right. I mean, that's the problem. Is a man with your accent and your suit said, I don't think it's that complicated. Guys. Because the definition of it was just like... No, no, no, no.

you're it's really simple right there's a line so this is the two british guys discussing yeah right there's a line yeah muslims go on that side yeah everyone else on that side i don't really understand how you choosing the line huh how you choosing the line that's not your concern right well someone's got to choose the line so should we just yeah there you go there we go done and then there's also there's also bangladesh i don't know it's easy fine fine done everyone stay in your lane right amnesty to get to behind the line Off you go. It's like a public school game.

Three, two, one, and you're off. Why are you killing each other? Okay, there's a lot of killing going on. Stop killing yourselves. Stop killing everyone. Just stay behind the line. So 15 million people are displaced, which they shouldn't be displaced

because they know where they should be going. Yeah, there's the line. Go to the right side of the line. Immediately the line goes through some people's houses. Move house. Move your house to the right side of the line. Or just move to the other side of your house. Or if you've got Muslim family members,

they can go in the kitchen and whatever, you know, divvy up the house as we developed. sectarian riots erupted leading to the deaths between 1 to 2 million people I don't think the Brits can be blamed for this The Brits were trying to organise

people into the relevant areas Partition disrupts trade Agriculture and Industry But the late government Well the government at the time View it as a success Because it's no longer their problem Which is what all foreign policy successes

In this era is because well It's not our problem anymore It really is not a problem No, it's not our problem. I mean, we must remember they're 1947. But it's a lot of people's problem. You must remember.

Yeah, but you can't blame the Brits on that because you must remember in 1947, it was very, very cold in Britain. It was very chilly. It was very chilly. We had an hour's fire for a day. So people are like, I don't fucking care. I've never been to India.

Sort it out. Stay in your lane. Whatever. Go India, Pakistan, doing the dance-off thing. You know, that thing they do. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love it. The peacocking.

This is like the ramifications of the Brit. Everyone is, we're a small, poor country at this period. but the ramifications of what's going on is so global that's why I find so funny about this period we're shivering in fucking woking and then some guys in a meeting have caused like the biggest countries in the world

to do this every year just because of a line that was drawn by a fucking drunk lord Are they competing or are they celebrating together? It's sort of it's like step up But both sides have nuclear weapons It's sort of like yeah The one time that someone accidentally falls over

And goes onto the other side The other one will nuke the other one almost. It's probably the highest stakes dance off there is. And this is every day, is it? The closing of the border or the opening? Is it every day? I think, is it every border?

I know, it's Independence Day, so, yeah. But there is something like this every day, but they're just facing each other the whole time with guns. Yeah. So. I mean, it feels like, just maybe just don't do that. But also, it feels weirdly like you guys seem quite, like you guys could get along.

From a distance, it's like. Yeah. I think you guys could form the same. same dance trick. The dancers look quite similar. Yeah, I mean, you know, from where I'm sitting, people on either side of the gate look quite similar. Look at this, fucking go for it. It's diversity.

Redcoats. It's Indian stomp. Whoa, that's pretty sick. That's nice. Hello, I'm Elizabeth Day, the creator and host of How to Fail. It's the podcast that celebrates the things in life that haven't gone right. And what, if anything, we've learned from

those mistakes to help us succeed better? Each week, my guests share three failures, sparking intimate, thought-provoking and funny conversations. You'll hear from a diverse range of voices, sharing what they've learned through their failures. Join me Wednesdays for a new episode each week. This is an Elizabeth Day in Sony Music Entertainment Original podcast. Listen now, wherever you get your podcasts. So I guess the reason that maybe it ends up quite badly is that it's sort of like a fire sale, the empire. It's so cold and we're so skin.

and we're on oxygen and we're ringing the bell that we just go fuck it we're getting out we're getting out and this it's probably best seen in Palestine which we'll obviously deal with we'll do a history of Israel at some point well we might need to deal with it

because it's still I think we need to go in there and sort it out what now well we need to deal with it it has yet to be dealt with and I thought that they could sort it out between them no but I think the Brits need to go back in I think it's the opposite of kneecap

it's Brits in one state solution Britain takes it back Britain is the solution Britain is the final not the final solution Britain's next solution Britain's next solution yeah it'd be great to do

an Israel Palestine like PowerPoint and go the final solution yeah probably right right sorry the last solution the last solution is that Britain comes in and just cleans up

you have made a mess of it I will say to anyone listening in Israel Palestine this is this was the plan yeah a bit of context so again I would like to propose

a new historiographical argument where we don't blame the British we blame the fucking Turks okay the Turks are running it the Ottomans yeah the body men sorry the body men the body men the boss men yeah the boss men are running

Palestine the boss men collapse their shop closes and then they give it to the British Bossoman empire sorry no I'm just trying to watch out Bumfirk Bumfirk the bossaman the bossaman empire it just kind of work

yeah boss man boss man boss man Bossaman, Bosman Empire ends, and they go, please, my friend, please. Very good, Palestine, very good, very good, many Arabs, many Jews, very good, very good price. Very good price, free price. And in Britain, it gets mandated it, which means that we are looking after it for a bit. Yeah. For a bit. It's your inner library, can you watch my laptop while I go to the toilet?

In a cafe, yeah, it's exactly that. In a cafe, I'm writing, but I need a poo. Do you mind look out of it? Of course. Of course, yeah. And then it's... You come back and the laptop is being. tugged by two different races

and you've shacked yourself that's what's happened so now what the Brits do is we're just trying to please everyone we're people pleasers famously famously I think that's how we're described by the subjects of the British Empire

the people pleased the problem with the British Empire they were people pleased so in Switzerland at some point in the late 19th century the Zionist movement begins where says that after the Russian pogroms of Jews there should be a Jewish

homeland. You're a fucking Zionist. Sorry? You're a fucking Zionist. Balfour is a foreign secretary at some point in 19, I want to say, 12, 13. Is he a Labour man or a Tory man? I don't know. He says, he writes a letter saying that he thinks he agrees that there should be a Jewish homeland

in Palestine. But they also promised the Palestinians that it will be an Arab land. People pleases. People please us. People pleases. we've got a girlfriend, we've got a wife it's tough to juggle both so I mean there's a lot of Jewish immigration

after that declaration and there's a lot of kicking out the Brits actually go quite quite hard in the 30s in Palestine they go hard they shoot a lot of people in British control Palestine in the 30s because there's a lot of like militia armies

on both sides and they have this plan to say that there'll be like trickle a trickle of maybe it's 75,000 Jewish immigrants over the 10 years to try and manage the two populations

but it'll be one government in the 30s they say it'll be one government power share by power sharing Northern Ireland World War II basically changes this you know

the scale of the Holocaust allegedly means that you know the politics changes and lots of Jewish immigrants just flood into the area and then they start you know Britain

has promised both sides that it'll be their homeland. Yeah, one man, two governors. Basically. Atley is actually campaigned in the 45 by saying he's going to revoke the restrictive

Jewish immigration policy and he's going to like unopposed Labour are quite pro-Arab they're like they're kind of bedfellows with the Arabs. Yeah, but at this point

obviously in 45 the party backs the level of Jewish immigration that would then make the Jews the majority in Malmastown. So people, because of the Holocaust. Yeah.

Because it's like, it completely changes the Realpolitik of the area. Anyway, essentially what happens is that it gets to 47 and the Brits have tried

a couple of solutions and whenever they try and say anything. What solution? Not the final one. That's been tried. Right. This is the post-final.

Post-final solution. So it's the final-final-final solution. Final, final solution. Last one. Final, final, final. And it gets capitalized. The only saving a document. Final final.

final last one edit draft yeah and then essentially it's quite similar similar to it is now when anyone ever says anything about either side it all kicks off so much they go fuck it right i'm going i'm leaving yeah and they fuck off in 47 or eight and they give it to the u.n so basically the same time as the india stuff's going on it's all the same time because it's very very cold in britton yeah it's so cold as winter ever whatever just get out just get out pat your bags let's go so February 47, Bevin refers the issue to the UN. So then essentially the UN supports partition.

Britain goes, I don't care what you do. We're off. Anglo-American relations suffer. Truman recognises Israel 11 minutes after the British mandate ends. Atle and Bevin are furious. Yeah. Because they've fucked us. They've completely fucked us. And essentially, the British

go, right, well, we're off now. So you deal with it. And as Horatio said, it's not been dealt with. No. And the solution is that Brits go back in. Yeah, I think so. It's the only solution. But Atley, I mean, Atley's role in that, I guess, is I guess he's just being buffeted by the different

wins, and they're proposing things all the time. But his, apparently, Bevin's role, his bluntness and humour fed accusations of anti-Semitism. Humour? His most, yeah, I mean, it's a very funny topic. Yeah. His most infamous comments. Is he making Jewish jokes and stuff? I guess so. Yeah, like old school

Jewish jokes. I'm a schmuck. Anyway, it all kicks off. But as I would like to propose, this is mainly the Turks' fault. Yeah. Because it was actually fine when the Turks was looking after it. Yeah, the bossy men.

Boss men. Everyone loves a boss man. Yeah, they gave us a fuck situation. Yeah. Yeah. We were played a bad hand by the boss man. They all take care of that.

Oh, for fuck sake. Oh, for fuck sake. I mean, like, there's never a fight. Can you look out of my laptop? The laptop's got child porn. The police had come in. Yeah. It was, it was here.

That's exactly what happened. Yeah. Look after my laptop. I need a shit. You come back. Why the police got my laptop? Because there's child porn on it. you gave me a laptop

with child porn on it exactly what happened what is it Charlie in exchange for everything being sorted over there yeah would you take everyone thinks

that you're a paedophile an active paed everyone thinks I'm a paedophile I'd do it but if posthumously they find out that you know I'm the most heroic

paedophile of all the time well no I took the burden of people thinking my paedophile to solve is Rob. The white man's burden. Big pedophile.

If that happens, I'd do it. Okay. I mean, what's your answer? My answer is, I'm thinking practically, I'm thinking, is this working because everyone in the Israeli military hears about a pedophile so big that they think we can't, the scale of it is so daunting. They think, do you know what? Six million kids.

Six million kids. Can't be that, man. That's such a big number. That they then turn their attention to hunting. Horatio. No, what it would be is Israel and Palestine unite in the fight

against my paedophilia? Right, yeah. Because they realize there's a common enemy and it's your nonsense. So you would do it on the condition that afterwards

everyone finds out you're not a paedophile. They make those really moving Oscar-winning film about my life. Yeah. The most heroic pit. I don't know what it would be called

but it would be like, you know. Super nonce. No, I don't know. Especially this moving portrait of a man who's... Super nonce. The Israel. time, sorry.

Are you in favour of one stage, two-stay solution? No, I'm in favour of super non-s. Let me amend it quickly slightly. You actually have to do pedo stuff, but you do sort it. You are super nonce. Now, I probably wouldn't do it, but that's very selfish of me, because, to be honest, the ethical thing to do. I mean, I'd say that's a win-win. Well, it'll be a trolley-dash paedophile.

I get to be a pedo, and that's all the gaza issue. Well, fucking two birds run stone. Yeah, ethical pedophilia. Yes, I suppose there is, yeah. You're one of the most heroic men who's ever lived, and you're one of the most heroic. I guess that is the only way to be an ethical paedophiles if you solve the Israel Gaza crisis. I think so. Because you are

you just sacrifice your life and some other kids futures, but about the amount of kids' futures that you save by sorting out Israel Palestinians. Is ratio ethically non-bonogamous? No, he's an ethical pedophile. He's an ethical non-consent. I wouldn't do it, but a more ethical man would.

It's because of my selfishness that I wouldn't be a mass pedo. Okay. Will I be a pedophile to stop Israel Gaza? Yeah, I'd also be a pedophile. I'm a paed apart now. And to you honest, it hasn't helped one bit. I've been following this logic for ages. And to be honest, if anything, it's getting worse. The problem I have with your questions is not realistic

because I've been a pedo for years. And it's still kicking off over there. Guys, don't you know I'm a paed by and they're like, so? Stop fighting. Guys, I'm a paed. I'm super nonced. Stop fighting. What do you mean you don't care?

What do you mean you don't care? What do you mean this issue is not about that? yeah now I I guess you're right Atley did have other options didn't he send in the super nonce

send in super nonce why doesn't he press the red button he should spam the super nonce button but the problem is they've been developing an atomic bomb not a nonce bomb right if he dropped a nonce bomb

on Israel end bomb the end bomb well to you honest I don't think dropping the end bomb on the Israel Guard's situation is going to make things

any better I don't care I think you're all end bombs is that what Atley says fucking hell that's probably what Churchill would have it's getting pretty hairy out here

isn't it fucking up fucking hell there's a lot problematic stuff going on in this region we all like edgy humor

but this is a bit rich for my blood this is crazy this is crazy clement a guy called clement dropping the end bomb I don't think anyone

called Clements ever dropped the end bomb no well I do think they've dropped I do think they have it private said privately

they've done it in a non problematic manner I do think they drop the nonce bomb though I think it's a nonce bomb though

is it clement's a nonce name I think how you found out that 98.9% of Clements are men. I think about, I think about 98%

of pedos. Clemens. Like, you know, there's more billionaires than there are female billionaires

or like, you know, that stat. Oh, there's more CEOs called John or so of female CEOs. Yeah,

there's more pedos called Clement than they are. I said how you sold that is start naming your women John. Yeah, it's nominal determinism.

It is. Yeah. More likely to be cool to get a CEO. Pull yourself up by your name straps. By your by your name badges.

Anyway. Anyway. That's Israel Palestine soved. Atley does not press the end bomb button. Sorry, have you seen that in Yahoo on the Nelk boys? You show me a few clips of it, but I haven't seen all of it. But does he go on and talk about Burger King? Yeah, yeah.

He makes a very convincing argument for Burger King. And the Nelt boys do say in response to him bringing up Burger King, they go, that's your worst take so far, dude. it's one of the most kind of dystopian things I've ever seen in my life because they have no idea what's going on at all at all he just uses it as a massive platform to justify all his things

but then he does on the Burger King front I was listening to it in horror and then the Burger King thing I was like okay I mean you do seem quite passionate about fast food well I've always said that I am you know if you could if you could make a fast food restaurant that was McDonald's burgers with Burger King

shit no other way around Burger King burgers with McDonald's chips well you're a Net and Yahooist in that respect When it comes to fast food, I'm pro-Bibi. I'm Bibi King. Isn't it funny that my girlfriend's name is Bibi's like pet name? Bibi Netanyahu.

Yeah. Well, Bibi Netanyahu, that's just when he's, that's when he's not at work. Well, we've had Bibi on the podcast. And she's arguably more genocidal. We've had the wrong Bibi. Yeah, we actually were booking Bibi Netanyahu. We got Bibi K on. Yeah, you're your girlfriend, Bibi turned up rather than Bibi Netanyahu.

It is a fascinating entity. He didn't realize he's doing podcasts now. But it's like, they say, Burry King sucks. And he goes, you're wrong. You're wrong. And he, like, really, like, passionately defends Bergking in quite, like, a, quite a moving way. It is, it is, um, I think it might be the, the final, the time that the internet culture has ruptured mainstream reality. Yeah, like, Adam Curtis is going, well, what's the point?

Adam Curtis is like, I don't fucking know anymore. What's the point? What do I say about this? Yeah. What does it, what does any of this mean anymore? Yeah. I mean, it's like, it's like getting Hitler on to fucking rate Schnitzel during Nuremberg rallies. We're doing a podcast where Hitler's rating Schnitzel.

it's fucking crazy it's absolutely crazy the knelt boys are fucking idiots but they've got a huge following who the fuck is listening to the knelt boys but they're morons and they had Trump on

it's the most softball questions they don't know what's going on at all and because they had Trump on and it did well for him BB's best mates for Trump and that's how they're girlfriend's best mate for Trump yeah wow

and also she's behind what's going on in the Middle East yeah she's at the UN right now pitching a ground invasion of Gaza Which is why if you were a super nonce, it would solve everything. Because you're going out with Bibi Netanyahu. Right. So if Bibi Netanyahu's boyfriend was a supernance, maybe he'd lose confidence.

In himself. And himself. And the grounded version. Anyway. Anyway, we got mired in Israel, Palestine. As many people have. As many people have. Because they're not willing to call them all n bombs.

Which I think would, if not... Because the Jews and the Arabs would be like, what? What? Now, it wouldn't solve it, but it would stop it for maybe half a second when they went, huh? And then he went back to it. Anyway, let's get to the 1949 devaluation crisis. And if that's just whetted your appetite for our eventual history of Israel series, I'll tell you now that'll be the final series we do before the podcast ends.

Ever wondered what doom scrolling does to our brain, or why haven't they opened up an actual Jurassic Park yet? I'm Emma Kennedy, and this is Why, the podcast for Curious Minds from the team behind Oh God What Now and The Bunker. We're back with the brand new season diving into lives weirdest, wildest questions every Wednesday joined by Top Minds from Science Tech and Beyond. No topic too strange, no question too silly, if it makes you say, wait, what is that? We're on it.

Subscribe to Why with me, Emma Kennedy, wherever you get your podcasts. in 1949 facing a US recession that cuts the demands of British exports Atley and his advisers conclude the pound must be devalued

to address trade deficits now this is all quite crunchy dry stuff from Chancellor Stafford Crips it does read as Stafford Crisps yeah but I don't think the British the British love affair

with crisps hasn't started now no that comes in with the meal deal revolution which is a British is that Thatcher's revolution no that's Marks and Spencer's I believe it's the 70s.

Meal deals in the 70s. We should place this. Just as a British invention to be proud of, the refrigerated sandwich in a box is a British invention. Well, thank God for that. Yeah. And I think Marks and Spenters came up with it.

When Marx and Spencer come up with the refrigerated sandwich. If you told me that was Italian, I would have jumped out of this window. 1980. So it's 1980. It's Thatcher. Yeah.

Thatcher takes the handbrake off and some wild cunts thinks, you know what, I'm going to put a sandwich in a fridge. Well, it's the birth of you don't have time to have lunch. You need to be on the move, making money.

Yeah, exactly. because that's when we actually work. Yeah. And now the devaluing the pound, as you said, I don't really know what that means, but what it would, what they hope to do, because this is a recurrent crisis

during the term we're speaking about. What they're hoping to happen with the devaluing the pound is that it will mean that British exports are cheaper for other countries to buy, which business will go up. Business will go up

because more people will buy exports. Did it? Probably not. Yeah. The pound was devalued by 30.5 But does that, that means that everyone who has savings, you just have that slashed? It fucks you for middle class. The middle classes gets completely cunted.

So, emergency secret meeting of ministers is arranged by Attlee to try and stop any leaks about the devaluation. So Wilson describes how some ministers wore fake moustaches while the minister for agriculture, James Scott, wears his farmer's jacket and trousers and a somewhat garish sports shirt. Yeah. So are they walking into... Why are you just as a rastafarian?

But they're always walking the same way. There's no Jamaican at this point. Atleys like Earbreadder Minor Clemens But they all walked into number 10 Don't they So you know when you have now You have those photos

Of like news cameras Was it like the YMCA When they were walking in The village people Get the village people up Cowboy This is this is Atley's cabinet Talking about devaluing the pound

And the news cameras are like Why the fucking Why is there red Indian Walking into number 10 Why is there This is them discussing Are they having a building work Building work done it

Downing Street, what's going on? I mean, that's crazy. So in 1949, the pound is worth $4.3. And then overnight, it goes to $2.80. That's crazy. How much is a dollar worth now? I think it's one pound, $1.30, I reckon. No, it's, oh, fuck me.

$1.34. We're in the toilet, aren't me? Yeah. And we're finding out how this is just getting deeper and deeper into the toilet. This is the story of Britain's descent into the toilet. So again, this is a kind of, if you're looking for, for symbols of our decline. A lot of them start in Attlee.

So, on the 25th of June, 1950, the Korean War kicks off. Now, again, this is a huge thing that we will do a series on. And part of the reason we're giving Atley two episodes is because pretty much everything happens in the first six years. North Korea invade South Korea, beginning a three-year war. The British send troops to this. This is where the famous... But we're not happy about it.

We're not happy about it. But there's nothing we can do. Because we're America's bitch. The carer is pushing us in. The carer is saying, if you want us to keep feeding you through the tube, you're going to have to go send all your sons to war. So this is where the famous thing happens where there's that mix-up, where the Brits are being absolutely mowed down.

Well, this is the difference between American and British culture laid bare. Even though we speak the same language, there's a different culture. So the Brits are being mown down by the Chinese or the North Koreans, and they're asking for American backup. And they do this by saying, well, we're in a bit of a sticky situation. We're having a bit of a pickle. understatement. Yeah, and the Americans go, oh, everyone likes pickles.

Oh, you're having a burger? Yeah. And they just don't come and then the Brits just get an eye later. Well, it would be rude to ask again, wouldn't it? Yeah, I've already said we're in a pickle. I can't ask twice. They definitely won't come by ass again. I don't want to seem needy as men are bleeding out to death.

So, you know, potted history of the Korean War, Korea had been divided along the 38th parallel after 45, communist China and the US side controls the north, the US sort of back to the south. Yeah. Again, Britain disagree with this policy of going into the Far East, but it has to back America because that is one of the conditions of all the money that Americans is given them. So the Attlee government approves troop deployment, defense spending rises again. And you're in Bevan, pissy Ann, voice is concerned.

Let's just call them Ann, can we call them Anpiss just for the ease of it? In December, Atley meets with President Truman, again, hoping to like influence and moderate U.S. policy. but Truman ruled, they rule out using the atomic bomb in Korea. Yeah. Which is crazy that that was even an option. Just fucking... But I guess if you're America and you've nine-night Japan, you go, just like, switch the nights off.

Yeah. Striots the lights off. They look, is that the Japanese again? No, it's Koreans. Oh, right. Sorry, okay. I thought we all the time's to go to bed. I thought we already told you to go to bed.

No, that was... Stay in there. Oh, it was a new... All right, fine. So, we get to the 1950 general election, and at least government had, of course, had a lot of success. Rations are still going on. The economy's still in the toilet.

Life still... pretty bad. So I think people still want a change. And Churchill, in opposition, we'll deal with that next episode, but he's

obviously mouthing off. Yeah. But interestingly, the conservatives are supporting the welfare state. Well, you can't really go back on it because that's universally

popular. And it feels like the 50, 60s, the support that Labor and Conservative have for each other is a lot better. Well, it's the post-war

consensus here. There's a lot more polite. Oh, you chose, it's your turn. Well, it's my turn now. It's your turn. So the election

results in 1950, Labor wins a narrow majority of five seats. society is divided, but not, you know, not hostile. Support for Labour falls in the middle classes because life's been pretty bad. All their savings has been devalued as well. Yeah, savings are gone. I mean, I don't know who has savings really after the war.

Yeah. So Labor's second term is increasing. Now, it's very short, obviously. But they're increasingly defined by managing the decline rather than advancing reform. This is the problem. This is why Labor doesn't really get back until Wilson is in every other election. They don't have anything new to say. Because they've done everything.

They've done everything. They did it, and they didn't even just do it in the first term. They didn't it the first two years of the first term. Yeah. It was so short when they did everything. And now that you, if you're having like a radical progressive government, if they do all the stuff, there's not much of your stand on. Rearmament basically is straining the country and the economy.

Yeah. And so, for example, one of the, one of the things that brings down the government is on NHS prescription charges and for dentistry, which is crazy. Imagine a government being brought down by just the dentists. But it's like, do you want to pay? for the dentists or do you want an atomic bomb? Yeah. That's the decision

that British people have, really. And that's why we have such bad teeth. Because we have... We have nuclear submarines. Yeah. Literally, that's the fork in the road. Yeah. We could have...

We could look like we're in L.A., but we'd have no nuclear deterrent. Yeah. We'd have no teeth on the international stage, if you will. Yeah, we're giving America a gummy, a gummy blow job in exchange for nuclear submarines. Some new teeth. So, but again, the reason they have to introduce...

charges is because Korea and the bomb bankrupts us even further. We brought up the economy with our bomb. Yeah, exactly. Again.

The type bomb is what we do to our economy. Yeah. And now we go to, we turn to Iran again as we've done

many times in the podcast. If you're interested in Iran, we did a three-part series in the revolution. We dealt with it slightly in the CIA series. Muhammad Mossadegh, an extremist,

democratically elected. He nationalizes the Anglo-Rane and all company, BP, blah, blah, blah. Yeah. Again, this triggers another massive oil crisis. And then in a defensive move, we... The defensive move, we invade and get in the shawl.

And the rest is... It all goes fine after that. But Britain has cut off oil exports from Iran. And again, like the Anglia Renewa Company is like all of our oil. Yeah. That's BP, by the way. The Suez Canal is so important because that's how Britain gets all of its oil to Britain, just to flag that for now.

And now this new world where oil is so important. now the kind of European colonialism doesn't run the Middle East. Suddenly, these countries with their nationalist rebellions, and they now have a tap where they can turn the West on and off. Genuinely, they somehow, the kids have got control of the light switch because it's too low down, and now they're turn the light on and off. They're just turning off. They turn the power on. They're turning our lights. They go on to our room.

And in the 70s, they just fucking, they turn our lights off. Oh, they, yeah. No, they unplug the house. In the 70s, they unplugged the house. But what I think strange about this period is how does Germany, Japan, France, they all have a boom before Britain does, even though we were won the war? Germany wins the peace. Yeah, I know. So it doesn't quite make sense.

I mean, is it because America feel that they can build them up more because they're less concerned about them having a global empire? Well, yeah, because also Britain, Britain. So they get a fairer deal from America than we do. Well, it's also, they're starting from absolute zero. Yeah, but that surely is worse. No, but it means you get modernity. Britain is still an old sclerotic country. Not all of it's been bombed.

I think we've got the oldest housing stock in the world. Yeah, we're bankrupt, and yet we control the entire world. And so we're in this weird position of having no money. Yeah. And yet, like, you know, we're the first to industrialize. First to de-industrial. That's what I mean. If you're the first through the gate, you're the first out.

As my theory, if you invent something, you eventually become bad at making it, and we basically invented everything. as we become bad at making everything. Yeah, because as you said, the Scottish invent the toilet. Yeah, and it's terrible toilets up there. They're awful. It's like the opposite of Japan. Yeah, because they're like toilets from the 1800s.

They're still the first toilets. Because they're like, we don't need to prove that. There's a hole in the ground. We invented trains. And then Japan got sent to bed, slept on it, woke up and meant what if they played music? And washed your willie. Yeah.

Well, there was a tentacle that fucking washed your... What if a giant octopus was in there and just stopped fucking you in the ass? And we went, I think you need to go to bed again, Japan. When are we going to send Japan to sleep again? Because they're making some crazy things. They got cocky with the toilet. But the post-war British story is also, it comes up with us.

We come up with a lot of ideas that we never perfect. Someone else does. The fucking, I don't know. Right. I don't know. Like what? Like what are we coming up with? Well, we came up with the, I think we invented the radio.

That's not post-war though. What was it? Oh, I know what you mean. It's motorbikes. Motorbikes. So British motorbikes in the 40s and 50s. Yes. Like the triumph,

maybe the Austin. Yeah. Like that's what hell... We get a head start and a lot of start. That's what Hell's Angels are riding in America. It's British bikes. Yeah. And then in...

Yeah, pretty quickly, by the end of the 50s, Japan has shot out Honda, Kawasaki, whatever, Yamaha, all those. Tannos, bikes, TVs. We invented TVs. Well, Scottish did. Yeah. All of that sort of stuff. Scottish television is fucking rubbish.

Rubbish. But it feels like the story of you have... Suddenly how Andrew Moore pitches it is it's kind of like the eccentric lone British inventor is like a thing. A guy in his shed comes up with something genius. And then we go, oh, we don't need to change that. Yeah. And then Japan and Germany, they develop it. They finesse it.

Yeah. And then make money out of it. It's the same with all of our sporting stories. Yeah. We came up with it. Just don't finesse it. And so at least government refuses to accept the Iranian nationalization plans. They debate military intervention, including seizing the Avedan refinery.

And as much as this is bad from us, obviously looking back on it, especially if you're left, you look back and say, this is a sign of we just want to stop people be able to turn our lights off and eventually they do it's what happens you can see why they do it

it's not pure it's not just pure evil it's like we had an opportunity here to get the light switch away from the Iranians and from the Saudis and whoever else

the thing is when we packed out and left Palestine we left the light switch there and it does come they do come back to Baitas because we left in a hurry we left the lights there

just remains phone fuck just get out get out get out the crisis remains unsolved during Atlee's premiership

and so Churchill comes in and hardens it but in 1951 another election is called because it was it five they had a majority of so it's got a tiny majority. So it did like a Theresa May style snap election to increase the majority and it backfires.

So we're reaching the end of Atley so let's just sum up where we think Atley stands that's what we'll be doing with this whole series is ultimately trying to rank the post-war British Prime Ministers. Well I think in the popular imagination he's probably viewed as Britain's greatest and maybe even least controversial pick for prime minister because the problem is picking

anyone on the greatness is a controversial what did you type in? Does that have a fat knob? No, he's not Clement Fat Knaub. No, I don't think he did. I don't think he did. He had the confidence of a man who had a just slightly above average penis. Well. The opposite of you.

No, it's not the opposite of me. It's exactly why I am. No, you're slightly below average. I'm slightly below average, yeah. For my height. How tall is Clemente? It's not. We're not going to go back here.

I'm just going to find out. How tall is Clemente? This is this podcast, Palestine, is you talking about your smaller, the small dick? Just drop an end bomb and I'll stop. Why are you on his Wikipedia page? Just scrolling down.

He's 5.11. He's 5.11. We probably got quite similar size knobs. If you were 511, you'd have an absolutely throbbing hog. Well, really throbbing and we're slightly above average. Right, yeah. Clemente.

Yeah, exactly. So, Clemenatley is, yeah. But viewed within the context of my six-foot-two frame. Get out. Get out. Forget the crystals. Get out. Let's leave Palestine to sort it out.

I can't be asked. So, and as you say, in the popular imagination, it's basically Churchill's first term and Atlee, I like the top two British prime ministers ever, basically. That's what they say. They're the two sides of it, yeah. And I suppose for the pros... The greatest peacetime prime minister of Britain's ever had is the general thing, because even like some of the Victoria ones.

He's also definitely the most boring. 100% the most boring. As an actual person. Yeah, I mean, we haven't even talked about. how he was so anti-PR and spin that during the election campaign someone stops from the street and goes do you have any comments make on this election race

and he goes, no, he fucked off he installed a ticker tape in Downing Street for the county cricket results and then got annoyed when people started putting actual news through there he was like, no, I want to hear how Somerset have got on type in Atley's poem about himself Oh yeah

this kind of sums up his own view of himself So he you know in the pro He writes a little ditty about himself Yeah. I mean, he's such a boring man, but in some ways, you know, when you've lived through Truss and Johnson and Blair, that's how you get stuff done in a way. It's just by being completely like personalityless. Yeah. I think just this type of leadership is, it's so, it's so far from what we imagine now because they've got so much done. Yeah. Nothing gets done. No changes seem to happen. No, I mean, he... And having it done in two years just seems kind of crazy. There were a few who

thought... Yeah, here we got it here. Oh, this is it. So this is clear. and Atlee wrote this about himself, which is quite funny. Yeah. Few thought he was even a starter. There were many who thought themselves smarter. But he ended PM, C-H-N-O-M, and Earl and Knight of the Garter. Yeah. I mean, if you were a Prime Minister and you're writing self-deprecating limerates.

But that's his like... It's not so, that's his kind of... That's his rap, like game. That's a mic drop. Yeah, that's his mic drop. Night and a garter. So that's Atley, who's a strong... sender for number one post-war British Prime Minister

but we will be getting through it. We'll be doing all of them up to 1979. I mean, the cons, I mean, what, yes. The cons, to be honest, so even he had amazing domestic policy, economically was not his strong pursuit. It wasn't even that interested in the economy. So we were quite uncompetitive economically and undynamic

and that's why the French, even the fucking Italians had the fucking Italians. Economic miracles before us. Yeah. And he does. So he made us undynamic. But he also does set the stage for, 30 years of compromises with unions and nationalises companies and like he starts the consensus

because you're living at these Britain till Thatcher but that's only how long is that 30 years? Yeah. We're still in Thatcher's Britain. Yeah. And that's like 45 years, 50 years. Pretty much. So it's like it does eventually grind to a halt. Yeah.

Which is what this series is about. You look at what survives, the NHS, which is obviously kind of the British religion. Yeah. The welfare state, national insurance, education. Yeah. But this is all stuff that they, of national parks. National parks, that's a not lovely little one. Oh, yeah, the National Trust and all that.

The National Trust start in that holiday time. Yeah, they do because they seize manor houses. And they seize all these old country homes. Well, the aristocracy can't afford to keep them up. No. So they have to. But so they get seized and gets put into this national trust. Yeah.

That all starts under Rattley, which, again, it's like the idea of a great country that's now almost been gentrified into a tourist attraction for itself. Yeah. which is what I think happens with Bond and with the National Trust. It's like, we can't afford to actually be this country. So let's like make it a museum that we live in. That's kind of what's happening with Attlee. That's what Europe is now, to be honest.

Europe's a museum for itself. Anyway, next episode, it's Churchill's second bite of the cherry. It's the Mao Mal Rebellion. It's peacetime Churchill. It's head hunting scandal and it's a gay spiring. Oh, yeah. This is a gay spiring. This is a gay spiring.

Anyway, if you'd like access to that episode now, it's already on our Patreon, along with the first half of this entire series. Add free. Add free. You get a bonus episode every week, and you can chat and commune with other similarly down-trodden, down-syndrum to people like you.

We will have incomprehensibly solved the Israel-Gaza issue. We will see you next time for Peace Time Churchill, as this series, This effortless romp through the meadows of prime ministers continue to pace. See you next time.