Fin vs History - Justice for Naughty Francis Bourgeois | The Eichmann Trial: Jerusalem, 1961 (Part 4/4)

Episode Date: May 8, 2025

The sesh has officially ended for Adolf Eichmann, as he is put on trial by his wife and kids and forced to reckon with what he did on the Big Nazi Stag Do of 1939-1945 The show for people who like history but don't care what actually happened.  For weekly bonus episodes, ad-free listening and early access to series, become a Truther and sign up to the Patreon https://www.patreon.com/fintaylor?utm_campaign=creatorshare_creator Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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business. That's why they have a dedicated small business advice hub on their website to provide tips and insights on business banking to entrepreneurs. No matter the stage of business you're in, visit TD.com slash small business advice to find out more or to match with a TD small business banking account manager. Welcome back to Finn versus history. I'm here with the ratio Gould. We're gratis for little children. It's part four of our Eichmann blockbuster series.

Give me the Ick man, more like. Yeah, Adolfickman. Icky guy. There's something a bit up with this guy. Yeah, there's something weird about him. You go on a date with him and go, mm-hmm. Yeah. It just gives me bad vibes.

Yeah, it gives me boring vibes. We left off on the cliffhanger that I once ate 24 mites We're now going to stand Finn for trial for who ate all the mint pies And it was me

I plead guilty And ask for You the jury's mercy So it was It was the Christmas period Right I hope so Yeah Okay that's a bit less fat

Because outside that's real fat There are some foods that you can't They're seasonal Mint's one You can be so fat That the season This is what I mean You can be so fat

that you're eating food regardless of season like if you're eating mashed potato in the summer you're a fucking idiot that's the most winter food possible you know if the sun's shining you're outside and you're ordering a bowl of mash you're an absolute disgrace yeah well we got a little sweet treat

um toad the hole yeah winter sport yeah surely um what are you talking about sweet treats we're hungry again we got some sweet treats after after lunch and then you wanted m&Ms yeah and I said there was something fat about that about the M&M choice and it's because

Charlie says it's old school so it implies someone's been eating chocky for a long time what kind of my condition is that what's it old? I don't know why Eminem's is funny You're not calling me facts

just calling me old No it's a man who knows his chockey What are you saying they're good Yeah they are good But you have to let them I think they're very good actually Eminem's Well firstly you didn't

You left before I could tell you what type of eminem I would like I would have peanut butter at once. I mean, chocolate M&M's are good. Eminem's like, cool. I think, well, like Eminem World.

Yeah. I'm going Eminem World, most weekends. That's why you do your weekly shop. Name another chocolate that's got that kind of real estate behind it. It's true. No, no. Hey, look, I don't get it. It's like Taylor Swifto.

It's not for me, but you have to respect the scale. What are you getting for a chalky tree? For a chalky tree. Oh, what I got today was a Buenna. know, because I'm gay? That's gay as shit. Fucking woke Bueno, piss off. Yeah.

That's woke nonsense. I love a Maltiser for a packeted chocolate. I'd go from Maltese. Rebels are my, they're my thing. Why are you like, enjoy, the thing about Rebels, I was just like, why are you like, oh, what is it going to be? Like, that's great. It's a surprise in a bag.

Two of them are shit and there's four of them. Yeah, it's Russian roulette with rebels. It's great. It's chocolate Russian roulette. It's safe Russian roulette. Well, one of them should be cyanide if it's Russian. Yeah, you're right. One of them should be.

Do you reckon that's what happened in the bunker? the Hitler just had a coffee Reveld. What pieces me off about Rebels is there's four of them. Two of them are great, turned them suck, and they're always sold

next to full... There's more than four of them. There's 34. It's chocolate, orange, coffee, coffee, toffee. And there's minstrels. Check how many types are in... I think this may be up to eight rebels. Chocolate coffee,

raisin orange toffee Malteseers. Oh, right. I didn't know there's so many. Yeah. Anyway, we're talking about you. So this is Mint's Pie story. Yeah. So it was Chris.

Christmas, um, and my parents were having a dinner party. I'm eight in the story. I'm big. I'm, I'm a sort of, I'm, I'm, I'm like, you know, possibly as big as I, it's probably possibly my big era. Prime. Possibly in my fat. Young Ronaldo. Yeah. Brazilian Ronaldo. Yeah. Fat, yeah. Fat Ronaldo. Um, when he wasn't fat. When he wasn't fat. This is fat fit. These are my stepovers. I'm bamboozling. I'm, um, I'm the king of Syria. at this point and I've got a stupid haircut so my parents are having dinner party

they've got people around for dinner and I'm eight so I'm allowed to stay up but they don't want me the dinner party because I eat all the food or I'll say something vulgar or you know so what they do is they plop me in front of the TV and they I've recently got a VHS

of Chelsea's review of the season 9798 brilliant the raising straight bloke yeah lovely Mark Hughes against Valoringa in the snow orange ball Halcyon days They have left in the room

A tray of 24 minutes pies And in my head I go Well that's nice of them They must be for me What I then found out Was that actually That was what they were going to serve Their guests for dessert

But they left it in the room with me It's a bit like that Fox chicken in the grain You're like the fat kid Chelsea review of the season A tray of 24 minutes pies how are you going to get them all out I'll find a photo and bring it

I'll try and get one for the edit I'll find a photo Oh that would be brilliant I'd love to see I saw one of me and I was just absolutely ashamed I saw one of me on holiday in France and I was like God

I look like someone stretched some clothes over a cheeseburger It's horrendous Absolutely horrendous It looked like I'm on a mobility scooter In like fucking Midlands or something It looked awful I'm so ashamed I was like you let me look at you let me get like that

to my parents It's like, you don't mean like that. You didn't do anything. Disgraceful. Anyway, I ate 18 mince pies. Right. Pretty much, pretty much in about half an hour or something. Without really coming up for air.

And then I thought, oh, I feel a bit weird now. Anyway. They're so rich midspoys. Stifled that, carried on. Right. What, these shop bought ones were like, okay, yeah. And then they weren't in the foil, which I think makes it easier to lose track of how many there are.

Well, you would have eaten the foil on the one. because with the foil you see you know it's like six circles so you're like okay there's 24 circles there I've eaten 24 mint spires without the foil you think I've just eaten a pile of mint spice that's fine isn't it

so I then go to bed I remember dad like dad was reading a story or something and I'm like I feel a bit weird I don't feel well and he was like well yeah that's because you ate all the things we were meant to give it or I guess dessert it's read to do like an impromptu I don't know gave some cheese or something

anyway I then now my room in that house was at the end of a very long corridor and the other end of the corridor was the bathroom and I remember I got out my room and I was sick and but because there was a slight slope right as a rake. The sick eventually

got to the bathroom right but I did not make it there so I basically I threw up and it got through like the entire corridor the long corridor right covered and sick are you collapsed on the collapse at one end

and then and then quite quickly we moved house what because of that I think so I think my mum got another job but I think she started looking because I'd thrown up

and thrown up in the house crime of the century crime of the century I ate 24 mince pies in one go anyway we're talking about Adolf Eichmann this is not a man

who ate 24 men's pies yeah he doesn't seem like a he's not greedy when it comes to food I don't think no swap mince pies for Jewish people and you get a sense of the scale

getting carried away, I think, is a similar theme in both of these stories, the Eichmann and the Mintz Pie story. You'd say that Eichmann in Hungary. Yeah. That's my mince pie story. That's you when you're hungry. Well, I'm hungry. Yeah. So we left off. Eichmann has been kidnapped illegally by some Israelis. Yeah. It's a shocking crime. And it's shocking. And now the Israelis, we brought to justice for that's what this trial is. He's suing them. He's suing them for wrongful kidnapping. No, the Israelis are going to put this man on trial, and it's going to be the trial of the century. It's one of the first televised trials, and it's piped into homes around the world.

Well, it's made with a thought for a global audience. This is a huge thing to one justify Israel as a state, bring people back to the idea of the Holocaust, but it's built for an international audience. Well, let's place this, actually. So the Eiffman trial is 1961. Right. So do you want to place this for the Donald? I'll just off the dome. This is after Pele scores a hat trick in the World Cup final.

Yeah, 58. 58, Sweden. Pele's on the scene. Pele's burst onto the scene. It's before the high street shop the works. Fucking hell. That's a very, very boring thing to say. I think that's the most boring shop you could think of.

981. Could have been a little closer, but it's not. I mean, what do you even get in that shop? That's the whole point. You're just Stuart Lee's bit about it. It's very funny how it's just like, it seems to be a nominally a bookshop staffed by people who have a deep seat suspicion of books. Yeah.

And it's like, I would. You get a three for two on like a paper mashet build your own concentration camp. It's like a children's bookstore for, with books you'd never give to your kids. No one knows what's in there, though. It would make them thicker. Yeah. Also, if you had forced to explain to someone abroad what. It's a bookshop of people who can't read.

that's what it is anyway Eichmann is on trial in Israel he's been brought to Israel and he will now face well he'll face it's not a jury it's three judges three Israeli judges

the jury's still out the jury's still out no the jury's very much in the holocaust happened and it's a no from me no thanks never again never again even though it has happened again

one more time a few more quite actually one more please another one more please just a little thing to finish me off so now as I was saying in one of the other episodes the Israeli attitude to the Holocaust in the 50s is quite funny

it's really funny is really really funny let's get a marker for any jokes because I'm allowed two more of those every episode then we have to stop well I had it with Shiite yeah yeah yeah I'm like give me two more and then I'm banned

so what the Israelis do is what they think, so one in four Israelis are Holocaust survivors, and they, basically, the Holocaust survivors don't have any family

famously. Oh, I don't slag them off? No, they don't. All right. They've all been killed. We have a very different understanding of what the Holocaust was. Okay, allegedly they've been killed.

They've gone missing. I don't know where they've gone. Six million Madeline McCanns. We'll just never know. We'll never know. Although in both instances, I suspect a German. Yeah.

So one in four Israelis are Holocaust survivors, And so other Israelis, they don't, they're kind of like, there's this idea that the Jews in World War II went to their, went to the concentration camps, quote, like lambs to the slaughter, like sheep to the slaughter. They were kind of passive. And they went along with it. And the building of Israel as being such a tough state is probably the culture of Israel is so much. It goes completely against the 48, but forged in the fire of like heroic muscular, settler peoples, fighting off the British and the Arabs, finally making it homeland. for Zionism, blah, blah, blah. And then you've got these images of like skeletal Jews

passively filing into camps to their murder. It doesn't compute with the, hey, hey, hey, I don't know what an Israeli accent is. You're struggling, you're struggling. You're fumbling around the Middle East for an accent there. I don't know what, it's hard to take. It's a tough one. Really tough. Because it's sort of white Middle Easterns.

Hey, man. Yeah, because I know the New York Jewish one. Hey, I'm walking here. I'm a mensch, schmucks. Bologna. Bologna. Fucking get Iceman out of fucking Argentina Operation Bagel,

whatever they call it. So, Operation Bagel, get him home. Grocery shopping, cha-ching. Ordering food? Cha-ching.

Filling up on gas? Cha-ching. Commuting. Cha-ch-ch-ch-ch-ch-ch. Using streaming services. With your RBC Ion Plus visa, earn three times the Avion points on groceries, gas, dining, and more.

then redeem your points on gift cards from over 200 brands your idea of rewarding happens here conditions apply visit rbc.com slash ion cards anyway so basically the the holocaust in israel is not really front and center of the culture there and what david benguhrin the prime minister wants to do is he wants to do a sort of essentially a show trial where they will use witness testimony Survivor Testimony from survivors of the Holocaust He wants them to say it to Eichmann's face Who's like the face of the Holocaust In a way to try and help young people

Who've grown up without the Holocaust Understand what it is, what it was Because also, you know The Nuremberg that weren't really in Survivor Testaments It's been 15 years since the... It was arguably quite a rushed trial The Nuremberg trials Yeah, it wasn't a fair trial at all

there's no due process that was trial by public opinion that was due process this is due process let's get the Jews to process what actually happened but so what they decide the prosecutor's guy

called Gideon Hausner he's pretty you know I've got when lawyers go on one I'm putting their hands I love a prosecution lawyer like an opening statement I fuck it I love it

I'm some of my YouTube passion for justice I love it lyricism and the conviction and the righteousness, I'm watching compilations of opening statements on YouTube. What, like Premier League highlights? Yeah, yeah, Torre, 16-17 season. This is opening statement.

When I stand before you hear, judges of Israel, to lead the prosecution of Adolf Eichmann, I'm not standing alone. With me are six million accusers. In one room? Yeah, big room. He says they don't have a voice, so I'm here to speak for them. There's no understanding about analogies or anything. You what?

There's like, there must be like 400. people in it Christ I thought I was quite good at working out if the judge just kept

undercutting him oh no right left for sorry sorry I'm really bad with that

sort of stuff so so what they decide to do is they decide that they're going to get a different

they're going get a witness from every area of Nazi occupied Europe and they're

going to get them to tell their story to Eichmann and the whole thing's

televised and they're going to try and prove Eichmann's complicity in the origins of the Holocaust in the actual policy. That's what they want to do. Right. And they want to show that all these different things,

the Einzance Gruppen, the free jazz like murder on the Eastern Front, and the big industrial slaughterhouses like Auschwitz and Treblinker and the death march and the forced labour to death and all these different ways of killing that they were all part of a

a final solution, a policy, a top-down implemented thing. It wasn't just a bunch of random, bad things that all happened to happen. They're trying to paint this picture, which is how we now understand the Holocaust. Yeah, this is what I mean is that if you don't know about the Eichmann trial, it's still completely shaped your view of the Holocaust because it's, it feels like... Unless you're a denier. Yeah. In which case, it's done the opposite.

It's had the opposite effect. Yeah. It's just pure fake news. It's just like, it's the drama. Yeah. It's Judge Judy. Judge Judy You imagine Judge Judy

Doing this Right So it starts in April 61 And it will go on for Eight months I think I mean there's some very funny things About his defence as well I mean that's a tough

Who's doing Who's the defence Robert Servacious He's a German guy Right He defended some of the ones At Nuremberger

So he's got a bit of a specialty That's a big fuck He's a big fucker He's a big fucker He's a big fucker Look at him What the fuck is that Well what's his politics

I think you can probably have a stab. It's what's strange about the legal system is that, yeah, you can, someone who's clearly guilty, you still need a defence. Well, this, this guy's defence, he's not defending Nazism. Yeah. His defence is based on, this is an illegitimate trial because you've kidnapped someone and Israel.

Is that it? Yeah. I mean, what else you got? He's not being like, to be fair, you are all really annoying. That's not his defence, is it? Guys, you're really annoying and you don't integrate. Oh, I have an age ago. My dad died.

This was fucking 15 years ago. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, just like, guys. No, he wasn't defending the Holocaust. He wasn't being like, guys, come on. Yeah, that's just a tough one to take out. I'd have to get paid a lot. Because then people are just going to hate you

when you're just doing your job. Because someone's got to defend it. He does a lot of his own defense, Eichmann, in the trial. Because you can watch the whole thing on YouTube in sessions. I've watched... It's like cricket. Yeah, it is. I mean, it's pretty meaty stuff.

I will say that. Dry at times, potentially. I mean, all the testimony are pretty awful. But I would recommend it's pretty amazing.

Yeah. In terms of like... And so you've seen Dr. Savatius? Yeah, yeah. But in terms of like... You've seen his defense. You saw him actually do it.

Yeah, there's clips of him doing it. He's just like... His whole thing is that, well... Small cog in a big machine. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Classic. He was just following orders,

but that was like the same shit they were wheeled out in Nuremberg, right? Yeah, but this is where... That's the go-to. This is where the just following orders thing really starts come in um right in april 61 we should paint the scene and you can watch it on youtube and i would recommend it is amazing the i he put eichmann in like a pope mobile box right because they're like

we don't want him to be assassinated by a jewish guy who can't take a joke can't take a joke yeah jewish guy is a terrible sense of humor yeah we can't we can't have him being assassinated on the basis of someone you know but of the stag do that happened 10 years ago um so they put him in a glass box and they have two policemen sat either side of him and then there's a courtroom filled with maybe like 500, 600 people. Right. And it's a community theatre that they've built into a courtroom.

So it's a massive audience. It's amazing. It's a custom built room. Yeah, they build it just for this. And it's amazing how like respectful and quiet and civil the whole thing is when you're talking about the worst crime humanities ever. I guess it was the whole point.

It was to like, it's to be the civilized, civilized counterpoint to the most. And Charlie would have different ideas how to deal with this. Dip him in poo Yes I mean there were several options on the table

For what to do with that Eichmann One of them was to have a trial The other one was to drown him In a mountain of poo You know This would be a very different episode If I've chosen that one But one of the amazing things about this footage

Is that you have Survivors telling the most awful stories Like you know I saw my I was holding my kid Like toddler Shot in the head Put into a pit

and then I go, oh, I'm going to like, can you shoot me? And they're like, nah. And then they just walk away. You know, just awful, awful stuff. And they're saying this to him in the box. And he's just like, what is he? Yeah, well, you can read it on his face.

We'll get some close-ups. Like, whenever I see his face, it's, it could, you see it and it's like, is that just a bloke waiting for a bus? In a box. But, yeah, I mean, he does look, he looks, he looks very bored. Yeah. Like, do I mean? Like, if you didn't know that this is the Eichmann trial, this could be

That's literally my resting face He's almost going like Fucking oh Jesus Christ This is boring as that He's been there for eight months Why are you got this smirk Why are you looking smug at Eichmann

So he has a little He has a twitch Oh right fine Because yeah he looks Fucking getting Cookey Brother's cookey No this is the big testimony

By the way The one that we're watching now This is a French guy And so this is when the trial starts to break And so there's testimony And at all points They're trying to link Eichmann

To these individual things And his defence is like listen I organised trains he Himmler he told me to run them from trains I ran some trains what happened at the other end I wasn't I don't no idea I'm just a train I'm not going to tell you what to do

do the trains run on time yes they do I've done my job leave me alone that's his defence they find there's this episode in Paris where a bunch of French children like young children get shipped to Auschwitz and Eichmann's signature is on the order to send the specific group

of like 100 French kids to Paris and then this guy tells the story and then they go and did you see any of the French children alive in Auschwitz and he goes obviously not he says it like that obviously not it's a death camp and then you can see Eichmann during that

that's the thing that starts to really break like the you know the deference and the calm in the courtroom and Eichmann's like sort of just complete passive boring Yeah, he's been Jeffrey boycotting. He's been boycotting everything and suddenly something whistles passes off and he just just a flicker of like, should I go for that or not?

But he suddenly started, you can see on his face, the close up on his face is amazing during that testimony because he's just sort of going like, oh, that does, you are making it sound quite bad actually. Then this guy, they were about to show. Danu Zetnik. Yeah, so he's a, he survived Auschwitz and he became like a Jewish writer. But he starts delivering this very lyrical, poetic. speech he calls it Planet Auschwitz

and like I'm fallout from planet Auschwitz and I wouldn't go to that theme park no exactly you got Fort Park you've got Alton Towers and you got Planet Auschwitz if you buy a Merlin Pass you can get into all three and the great thing about Planet Auschwitz is you don't have to be this

tall they'll let you in whatever whatever height you are but he basically says this kind of weirdly like poetic thing and he brings his pajamas in as well and then he just does the most insane faint like it's so melodramatic and then he he faints

falls off the stand he gets stretched it out so why does he faint well I guess because he's so overcome with emotion right right right because Eichmann's dad's died if you're still listening to this

I really admire your constitution is what I'll say you're still with us God bless you God bless you but it is I genuinely recommend it's fucking

it's one of the you know if you're a history fan and you know like me you struggle with the middle age

it's just not vivid and it's just really boring and smell it this is you've got Holocaust survivors saying their

stories to a Holocaust perpetrator and you're seeing him try not to show any emotion and does he break not really he

so Hannah Aaron the political philosophy yeah well this is the big philosophy that comes out of she writes a book called Ikeman in Jerusalem, the banality of evil. And that banality of evil is where that phrase comes from. And because she's sort of grappling with the fact that this guy is not

some cartoonish, hitherish villain, he is just anyone who was given orders and just wanted to follow the orders and didn't even question the orders and the morality of them. And it changed our whole idea of evil could basically be so contextual in the sense that any one of us could commit huge crimes of evil. Because there's a brilliant book on the Einzatz Gripen called Ordinary Men, which is called by a guy called Christopher Browning. Was that group again?

Einstein's Group and that's one of my WhatsApp groups. But it's also the groups of roving murderers in the Eastern Front. Christopher Browning wrote this book called Ordinary Men and his thesis was that basically a lot of the people who did the Holocaust, the Nazis, were ordinary people. They weren't these villains. They were just people who had been pushed

inch by inch, you slowly like a frog in boiling water to the point where they were committing these heinous things. Every British school kid has a vague understanding of that concept because it's what's taught in schools and it's a prevailing idea of moral philosophy. The Milgram experiment by Yale was a series of

social psychology experiments that measured the willingness of participants to obey an authority figure who instructed them to perform acts that conflicted with their personal conscience, notably inflicting electric shocks on another person. So... Yeah, do you remember how they did it? So there'll be in one room

Is someone in a white coat And it's also because of the authority figure Of someone in a white coat Just trusting what they say Because they've got that kind of badge of authority And then you'd press a button You're told they administered like a small shot And every time you do it

You'd hear a shout for the other room Because there's a bloke with a fucking pop ring on his ass Oh Push a button Yeah And another! John Motson had a dildo up his ass He was sat on a Sibian in the next room

And you were pressing the button did you hear the awful stories have come out about Motson being sexually pretty inappropriate No no Watson I know Mottie Where's this on the Upshot podcast, it's a great podcast check it out Motson he um we will get back to the Ikeman trial is this the trial of Motson Apparently With the like young female journalist he'd like he was meeting her in like a cafeteria during like match day or something Right and he goes he gets a Viagra out of his pocket

it says do you know what this is yeah and she says I can have a guess he takes it and he says you have 20 minutes to make your decision how fucking creepy is that and then also

he um every which completely changing of you oh oh no yeah and then um he'd always have a a kick cat and this one's definitely definitely true four finger kit cat

is his ritual half time cup of tea four finger kit cat and once an intern got my kit cat chunky and apparently he completely hit the roof he goes, Mottie doesn't do chunkies. Mottie does not do chunkies. Oh, God.

So it's more like in a position of power, men can do awful things. That's crazy. So sorry, go back to the Milgram experiment. Yeah, so build it up and then you'd see this happen. Some people would walk out, but a lot of people just out of like,

people-pleasy, politeness would keep going. And all the doctor can say, all the best of the white coat, is to complete this. test you must carry on and then I'm sure it's like please just carry on we'll deal with crashes afterwards eventually the script

Charlie's eating the M&Ms Charlie's trying not to be sorry are we boring you Charlie eventually if he was in the iceman trial he would have started eating Eminem through the testimony hurry up love he's got popcorn there come on then

he's got a tango ice blast yeah what happened after he got on the train I missed the first But what are you talking about? You know when your girlfriend's talking to a film. Is he bad then? Is he?

They broke in a box. Is he bad? What's he done? I missed the first 20 minutes. Basically, the screams eventually stop. Yeah. Implying that they get, do they get more powerful? They get powerful and then they stop.

And you keep going. Yeah. So you don't know if you're... So, but this comes out of the Eichmann trial and this, and Arant's book and the idea that people will obey authority and do heinous things. Jobsworths. It's jobs worth. I always have a deep distrust of Jobsworths.

It's the Jobsworths on trains telling to Shush and a quiet carriage. If they have too much power, they're Eichmann. I have a deep, deep suspicion of Jobsworth. Yeah, because they, yeah, go on, Charlie. I understand the kind of idea of, you know, keeping it civilised,

but you know what I think they could have at least humiliating but, like, gunge him a bit. The guns, do you say gungim? Yeah. Or like Nickelodeon slime. Dave Benson Phillips, get your own back. Yeah, just something, anything other than just like. Eichman, get your own back.

And Dave Benson Phillips just. Because I still think they can maintain their sort of, you know, this is civilised, but fuck you. They do, not to spoil the ending, they do hang him. Yeah, but that's not, that's kind of... You can still maintain your dignity. If you're a Nazi sympathiser, you could still project dignity onto... But the whole point is not just about justice being done. It's being seen to be done.

And it's about Israel as a, you know, there's people still talking about Israel as a legitimate. And this is a, meant to be a whole, like, state show. Yes. It doesn't make you look legitimate, it makes you look like a... How proper the country is a... country is yeah you know all that all that stuff anyway so the fact that all these awful stories are being told to him people are breaking down people are fainting and i've been the whole time it's just like he's got this unfortunate smug little kind of smug twitch like like it looks like he's just farted in the box and the fucking policeman there's another one then so i mean there's

fucking hours and hours i think there's 110 Holocaust survivors that testify all of them with their own story at some point it's quite funny one of the there's a woman talking about her experience and the judge just goes yeah yeah yeah like come on Robert we get it we get it we don't there's a boring hurry up um anyway so then oh that's right in in june this is when they get on to the van zay conference and they're like you were in the room and he was like I was taking the minutes and they were like you heard from all the big boys that it was about killing now it was about fully extermination and they were you going to gas and he was like, I don't, I don't, I don't think I'd remember that. I don't know. And they're like,

you were there. You can't deny that you knew this was policy. And he's like, nah, I don't remember. Sorry. Maybe. I don't know. I was just taking a minute. I'm a civil service. All right. Sorry, we asked. And they're like, okay, you know, courts adjourned. And then they show footage of the, of like, Jews being shot and put into pits and stuff. And they get up deportation orders that are signed. They try and correlate people's tattoos because all the prisoners of camps have

their numbers on an arm they try and correlate that with he had these massive spreadsheets and like forms of like people's numbers and it's before XL as well before Xcel so he was a real fucking admin king

there's even a story someone's testifying and they're testifying about this thing they saw in I think one of the ghettos maybe the Warsaw ghetto they see a boy who's whipped 80 times on the floor like a 12 year old boy

and then the judge goes and how do you know what happens what happens that boy and the guy goes well he's here in this room and it's the fucking it's one of the

prosecutors prosecutors there are moments like that of like a bit of sort of legal flair where you see Eichmann kind of be like yeah you know he's clearly on the ropes

yeah then we come to one of the funnier bits of the trial which is his defence because the guy's got no fucking defence yeah he's cooked it's like uh uh

You're all really annoying. He didn't mean it. I didn't mean it. It was a joke. He had his fingers crossed. I was not. So he basically, Eichmann, his whole defences, I was all like I was just doing my job, just like you guys doing your job. I was following out my orders.

All the Holocaust stuff, that was all orders. I was just, I was just all about transportation. And he said, it's very regrettable that I got involved at all, but I was just focusing on transport. I'm a cog in the machine I was following orders I'm a robot what shall I do I'll do this you know

that's his whole defence but he has this ego and then when there's a moment where he comes out and there's a big map of what Nazi Occupied Toshi there was and he has a big stick and he starts to get a bit excited

about all the little train you see you like it comes back and then I will move some there and so that you can see it retrospective yeah totally through an artist's work when they get to when they get to Hungary

yeah he's completely he's fucked I mean that's it That's him at his worst when he was literally being told from above. He's being told stop to killing Jews. Yeah. We've done it now. Can we stop? And he's like, no, no, no, no. Yeah.

So that's when he's completely undone. They then found him guilty of not everything, not all the charges, because the prosecution sort of failed to really demonstrate that he's responsible, that he's like instigated the Holocaust. Right. And, but they kind of be. Beyond reasonable doubt, prove that he carried it out, you know, he disobeyed orders to carry on doing it in Hungary. What doesn't help is when he does have a quote that says, to sum it all up, I must say that I regret nothing.

Yeah, I mean, he stands by it, I guess. It was actually an achievement that was never matched before or since. And that was about the deportation of more than 400,000 Jews from Hungary. I guess it's more about perspective. Successes relative, isn't it? Yeah, he's a glass half full kind of guy. Yeah, he's a glass half full guy. Yeah.

There's also these quite damning tapes from when he was in Argentina, he basically had. had these mad Alan Partridge-esque sessions where he wrote his memoirs with another Nazi over bottles of wine like every Sunday for three months and he just spilled it all out and he was like I'm I'm bouncing back you know he's in he's in hiding basically writing his memoirs right well yeah because they they interview him for ages and he gives a crazy amount of information yeah he's got reams and reams and memes this stuff they tell us that's what's interesting as he feels he does tell them so much yeah he tells them everything yeah because he's sort of proud of his work.

Yeah. Like he's, he's arrogant and thick and a Nazi. He's a triple threat. Triple threat. Thick, arrogant Nazi.

Yeah. So, let's wrap this up. The judges find him guilty. They sentence him to death by hanging. He appeals. As is his right. Yeah,

it's your right to appeal. He appeals. We've had another look at it. You're free to go. The court rejects his appeal. Right. He then, um,

Appeals to the Prime Minister for special treatment. Because his dad died? His dad died? My dad just died. Don't kill me now. The Prime Minister pretty much instantly goes fuck off. Fair enough. And then on May 31st, he's hanged in Ramallah prison in Israel just before midnight.

They build a crematorium in the prison just for him, which is a nice bit of, you know, what goes around and comes around. And there's an amazing story of the guy that hangs in, the executioner, who I think recently died. He sees like the ashes from Eichmann that comes out of the crematorium and then he remembers being in Poland and seeing this mountain of ash. And what they used to, what

the Nazis made the Jews of the Labour camp do was they spread the ash over the icy road so they wouldn't slip. And then he never, he's only just really puts together when he sees Eichmann's ash pile. It's like, oh yeah, every bit of ash was a person and that's just shows how many fucking like hundreds of thousands people. These is grit for the roads.

Yeah. That's crazy. Which I hope they've stopped doing. But they spread his dashes across the Mediterranean so he doesn't have a grave or a shrine. They get in a boat and they drive six miles outside of territorial waters of Israel and they plop them in there. So, you know, there is a possible tour you can do where you see Eichmann and Bin Laden. Yeah, I guess if you're really opportunistic tourist trapper, you could really try and... I'm dying as submersible that's looking for Eichmann and bin Laden. So at the end of it, Israel now absorbs the Holocaust into its kind of cultural memory it's having heard all these testimony a lot of them from like the people

who were saying it wasn't that bad actually it was yeah sounds pretty bad some of them were three stars yeah um they weren't all one star um basically they now they have a hot national holiday called holocaust and memorial and bravery day i can't remember quite how they worded it but essentially the bravery of a lot of the resistance fighters that they hear from starts being absorbed into that very masculine Israeli alpha identity yeah the identity right and Suddenly the Holocaust is kind of writ large as to what it actually was. And the, you know, this is, this is streamed in Britain for an hour every night for months. On Twitch.

On Twitch. Thumbs up. Thumbs up on Twitch. When Ikeman testifying, and they're like, nah, nah, nah, nah. You know, the journalist is going mad. The press are like, this is the most insane trial. I can't even recount the testimony. It's too unbearable for people watching.

but Eichmann throughout all is just staring, passive. Yeah. So I guess the end of the story is that Eichmann's a bad guy who killed a lot of people. But the upside... Hot take. Yep, you heard it here first. But the upside is that everyone sort of found out

what the Holocaust was and he was executed. Yeah. So, you know, every cloud. Every cloud. Well, that brings us to the end of our epic four-part. Our first four-part. We've gone on the journey. on a real journey

obviously the main victim was at Eichmann's dad who are going to dedicate this episode We're now going to end on a minute's silence for Eichmann's dad If you'd like to have a patron special We will be dealing with the life of Eichmann's dad Who was he before his life was tragically cut short Find out

We're going to probably do a patron episode On the theories of Hitler still being alive Conspiracy theories about Yeah we will And then we'll do another one Hitler and Brazil Hitler and Brazil Did he go to Brazil?

the answer is no but it's quite fun it's quite a fun story but yes if you've enjoyed this sign up to the Patreon for more and if not thank you so much for stopping by and we will see you next week

for a brand new topic Off you to see in Cheers Thank you.