Fin vs History - Stagecoach W*anker (with James Buckley) | Dick Turpin & Highwaymen (Part 2)

Episode Date: November 27, 2025

The show for people who like history but don't care what actually happened. Brought to you by Peter Christian- for free shipping on high quality British Tailoring this Christmas, go to www.peterchristian.co.uk and enter the code FVH at checkout  For weekly bonus episodes, ad-free listening and early access to series, become a Truther and sign up to the Patreon ⁠https://www.patreon.com/fintaylor CHAPTERS: 00:00 Essex Black Tie 05:09 The Gregorysphere 11:24 Turpin’s On One 17:00 The Hunt for Dick Continues 21:19 Tracing a White Horse 26:37 Turpin Flees to Yorkshire 31:31 Orange Roles for Orange Actors 36:08 You Couldn’t Write It 42:01 Dick’s Execution 47:42 The Kryptonite of a Highwayman Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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tables, or join a live dealer game to feel the thrill of real-time action, all from the comfort of your own devices. Why settle for less when you can go for the gold at Golden Nugget Online Casino. Gambling problem call connects Ontario 1866531-260. 19 and over, physically present in Ontario. Eligibility restrictions apply. See Golden Nuggett Casino.com for details. Please play responsibly. Welcome back to Finnverse History. I'm joined by Horatio Gould. Your money or your wife. And, well, we have a guest, James Buckley. Look at this. Afternoon. A British icon in the studio. Look at this. Thank you for wearing the suits. We always comment on our guest suits. This is Essex black tie, I believe. It doesn't look court appearance

Like most people look court appearance But this actually looks a bit more Stolen money Yeah, yeah I don't mind to see It's stolen money Yeah, it's Brinks Matt I'm not allowed to wear this suit very often

Because my wife said And I did wear this I bought this for a wedding And I did wear a shirt and tie I wore a burgundy tie And my wife said You look like Mr Bean Yeah, that's fair

And it ruined it I was like, how do I look Yeah And she just absolutely destroyed me But you do a podcast with your wife Which I find insane Because I mean I mean that's the opposite of

For me I do a podcast to To not spend time Yeah Yeah She's my favourite person Yes well alright You can be gay about it But yeah

I'm sure she'd say the opposite Yeah Yeah But um Finn's wife's his least favourite person No that's not fair But she's in the top three favourite people

But we're talking about Dick Turpin Now do you You were saying before that you You've started a podcast with Joe Thomas and near between us Yeah And he's a history guy And you were hoping that he would come on with you.

We were supposed to both be on. Right. Right. And he's also got a degree from Cambridge in history. Yeah. Really? So I thought, oh, I'll just be able to kick back and just enjoy myself. To be fair, we don't like degrees in this room.

No, we're anti, we're anti-intellectuals, to be honest. I'm your guy. I'm right out of your street. This is history fan TV. But I do know with the suits and stuff that you guys like to keep it classy. Yeah. So I got myself a little, just one of these. Oh, that's nice.

That is very classy. Do you know what? I thought you'd like it. So I got you guys one as well. Are you joking? I did, yeah. They're brand new. They're not been used or anything.

It's post-COVID. So I got you one. That's nice. I kept it in its bag so that you knew that it's not. Yeah. I didn't just get it from a charity shop. You got a pipe sheath. Oh, that's very nice.

I've got one for you as well. Slightly different vibe. That's a lovely bit of business that. That's a lovely bit of business. Right. You're not much of a crack pipe kind of guy. I'm not a crack pipe. guy no as pipes goes it's probably one of my lesser um but yeah it shows the difference in um

what a pipe can mean you know because you say like a pipe this is the the symbol of sophistication in class yeah if harold wilson in the 60s is like talking to the sobies yeah it really changes yeah it does change the vibe once you put crack crack crack in your pipe crack in front of anything makes it bad baby crack whore whore's already it's already pretty fruity stack I tell you so the press love the word crack. Yeah. It's some tabloid, you know. You know that stuff that you can suck out of a balloon?

Alascrack. Charlie's just Google ass crack. Thank you. Just to complete the crack riff. I like that that one there is a box around the crack. Have you seen John Lennon and Yoko Ono's arse? Type it in. This is phenomenal.

Have you seen this, James? John Lennon and Yoko did a naked shoot, and it's the greatest range in lengths of arces I've ever seen. What the fuck? Zoom in. and zoom in, zoom in. Crazy. Look how long that crack goes on.

Wow. And look how short... Now, they need to split the difference. She needs some of his ass to be my normal ass, and he needs way less ass. Look how big his ass is? How are I just finding out about this now? Isn't that?

Now, you think about when he... Guys, go over to the video. I don't normally say this, but you have to see this. When he wipes, he's doing... He's going up half his back. He gets through some papers. He needs one of those window cleaners or skyscrapers.

He needs one of those... Fucking give piece of charles. Look at that. And then her ass is way too small. Way too small. His ass is genuinely above his waist. Fuck. He could shit in a trough.

In the entirety of a trough. The press love the word crack. You know that balloon stuff? Yes. Laughing gas. I used to do uni. It's legal, right? Hippy crack.

That's what the press call it. No, no. Is it not legal? Well, it's legal for like hospitals. Or whips cream. Oh, I thought. I don't think you don't get prescribed. You can buy it.

And you can say, like, I just love making whipped cream. But I think if you're doing it as in balloons, it's illegal. It is illegal. I just love how that's turned into hippie crack. Yeah. Watch out. The new... I think that's the only way that I would have a downfall is if I got caught

doing hippie crack and my audience would leave me, I can't believe he's succumbed to hippie crack. The footballers love it, don't they? They're always doing it just before a big match and stuff. Oh, they're always like, oh, this footballer was caught doing hippie crack last night. All over East London, you have all the canisters. People like drive with them. People like go joyriding and do hippie crack and then do donuts.

Yeah. Not me. It's good stuff. Well, I don't think Dick Turpin was on hippie crack. Dick Turban. Dick Turbin, maybe. Before we knew you were doing this, did you ever think about Dick Turpin at all?

Not much. I do enjoy, I do like history. And what was really weird was... What do you like about it? Sorry, that's interesting. Really threatening? What about then? Go on then, mate.

Go on then, mate. I improve it. What'd you like? It's quite interesting, isn't it? Dick Turpin was around in the early 18th century. He meets his end in 1739. And what we like to do for us, thick, many of listeners,

is place 1739 within the context of something either side of it. You can choose any time. So just say it was after this and before this. 1739. I suppose it was before the Range Rover. Yeah, it was before the Range Rover. Comprehensive to smash that. Let's get a date in there.

Let's make sure we're sure. 1970. Wide birth, but let's go. Lovely tour dee deeer cushion. And after, I suppose, after chariots? After chariots. Okay, he's gone quite quite a range there. I think that places it perfectly.

It's right in the middle there. There's a good 4,000 years. And you've, Dick Turpin, bang in the middle. Bang in the middle. So post chariots pre-range brother. Do you think people in ancient Rome had a stigma around range driver drivers. No, I think, well, yeah, maybe show off.

What, in the way that the range rover driver? Because nowadays in London, you can't insure a range rover. I'm not even doing it here. Because it's got such bad, um... Get Nick's all the time. Security gets the easiest ones to Nick, right? I think it's just they're so attractive to Nick. Right.

So I've got something, I've got quoted, I haven't got one, got a fucking cash guy, but apparently it's like 30 grand just to insure it for a year. Really? Madness. Woke nonsense. So what is the, stereotype of a range rover driver then? I don't know, James, you must know some.

Is it like new money? I've had a range rover. There you go. That's what I was getting at. It's sort of, um, flash? Yeah, a bit flash.

I think it's quite classy, I thought. I think it used to be classy. Land Rover. Your new money, that's the problem. It's true. Land Rover.

It used to be classy when you, you know, chuck the dogs in the back of the ranger and head off into the countryside or something. I hated being a range rover owner. Right. Did you feel it? It's so Route 1. It's such a boring car. That's it, isn't it?

It's you go, I've got money. What's the car I need to have? Mine was that I had kids. Right. And I was like, I want the biggest car that Britain has. So if I have a crash, I'm still... Women's bodies change when they're pregnant. It makes sense.

It makes sense. They get... Their hands get fat. Crazy. Did you know that? Hands get fat. Madness. Anyway, sorry.

So Dick Turpin was mainly stage coach. Stagecoches. Stage coach, I guess, would be. the That would be a bit of fun Yeah You enjoying that

I think that's where we got that joke from So now in our previous episode We dealt with He was a butcher And

he then turned to crime He was fencing Venison Which is what In Essex They used to launder deer That's right Yeah

Did you run around A lot of crime You don't have to say That's right Like What's that? What's that? That's right

That's right Like you knew that It's fine Yeah that's right Yeah I knew that So the Essex gang have collapsed. Yeah.

So that's what we did in our last episode of the Essex? The Gregory gang. Now, do their name still haunt the streets of Dagenham? We still talk about them. Really? Yeah. Because there's been a lot of gang since. Absolutely.

I don't know how much. They're all just trying, because that's the problem, really. The Gregory gang really sort of romanticised all that sort of thing. And you get these young men in Essex now. Yeah. And they want to live up to that sort of. Original kind of Andrew Tate stuff really. Yeah.

The Gregory sphere. Yeah. They're very alpha male. Is it possible? up around a lot of crime. A little, there was a little bit of crime. There was always a little bit of crime. There was one day where I was taking my young,

this is not, this isn't a completely true story. There was one day where I was taking my, you're using it backwards. I'm middle class, James. I don't know how to use. My instant would be to shove this up my arse. That's what I think it would do. History fans, this episode is sponsored by Peter Christian,

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No. So the gang have been shattered. Smash the gangs. Starm will smash the gangs finally. And so Turpin and his companion, is it Matthew, Rodden, Roudon, Thomas. Turpin and his companion, Thomas Rowden, take to the roads. And they rob travellers on, these are all areas that are like now in London, but they're all like villages. Finchly common, Hounslow Heath, Epping Forest.

So Turpin gains notoriety. because the reports suggest that his ambushing is chaotic, opportunistic, incompetent. His ambushing is opportunistic. That's interesting. I mean, that kind of goes without saying he's a highwayman.

Well, I don't know how much opportunistic is. I mean, you're planning an ambush because you think this is a good part of the road or whatever to ambush. As opposed to like an improv. Oh,

fuck it. Fuck it. How much you got? Yeah, go on. I think he was a bit like that, though, wouldn't he? Because he was just an idiot. Everything he did,

he managed to fuck up one way or another. I mean, he survived quite a long time for an idiot. Yeah, I think he... You're saying that when he poiled a kettle of boiling water over an old man He was actually trying to make a cup of tea It just got away from him Oh shit, I'm really sorry, mate

He's trying to make a cup or in it Is it back out first? Old man or fuck, sorry It's like a little naked gun film Yeah So apparently one report describes him as robbing a driver for only a few shillings Is there quite a high risk to rob someone who's only got a, what's a shilling pence? He's doing it for the love of the game though

And also, you don't know how much is in there. No. I guess it's quite exciting, isn't it? I'm not knowing. So the first report that links Turpin and Rowden to Highway robbery is July 1735. Turpin thinks he recognises the man

they are trying to rob and then tries to kill him but Rowland talks him out of it. So he's clearly a hot head. Yes. However, the violent exchange is enough to up the reward for their capture to £100, equivalent to several years' wages. Right.

So by October, 7035 is where he's on one. He's fucking on one. Yeah. This is peak turpin. This is peak turpin. he's around like the northern bits of london what's now what the a1m or something and he's um he's fucking everyone up right he's jumping out in front of them stand and deliver but we don't have that he's getting cocky now he's getting cocky yeah he's also he's absolute

menace he's not the image we talked about last time the image is that he's like yeah there's a no fielding fucking apple tv show coming out yeah it's all whimsy but he's you know he's pouring he's making old man tea and shit and he's um well there's a lot of sexual assault to put it to put it i don't think he did that though did he did he do that specific Or was it the... You was lawyer? I don't think you can prove. He was in the vicinity, but you need to...

Not all highway men. So the pressure becomes too much for Rowden and he goes to Gloucester to start counterfeiting again. And he gets convicted of it and then recognised the robber but he avoids the noose and is sent to the colonies. But again, the noose is tightening around Turpin. in more ways than one

what you're suggesting he's a spixie-wanking I was trying to add drama to it he's got an orange in the mouth the noose is tightening there's a plug up his ass and a bag on his head anyway

the police are after him is my point so this was funny the podcast series I listen to they say he goes to the Netherlands for about a year and a half and then he resurfaces and they go

got no idea why he's in a pub with his wife we can't know why he comes back. Maybe you wanted to see his wife. Maybe. That can't, surely, that can't be why he came back. No, you was trying to start a podcast with his wife.

Maybe. Meet the Turpins. You're going to meet the Turpins. At home with the Turpins. Is that what you're called? I think it's just called the Buckley's. The Buckleys. It took quite a while to get the podcast now.

You really, you really search for that. I don't know. Considering it's my name. It's not my finest moment. Me and wife. Do you turn the cameras off? And then are you like, do you and your wife have a shtick on the pod? No, it's all...

We turn the cameras off and I carry on making her angry. Yeah. Because what we were saying was great, is because your wife doesn't even particularly seemingly want to be that famous. She's kind of take it or leave it. She sort of hates it. She's genuinely quite annoyed. That's probably why it's been so successful.

Basically, she married a successful actor. Right. At the time, making a load of money. Yeah. And she could just pot her about. And she's the greatest mum. in the world and she loves being a mum and stuff like that and then the old acting work dried up and I was like I've roped her into sort of forging a podcast career yeah and I think she's

quite beer about it yeah I think she's quite nice because everyone's so desperate these days as you were saying yeah everyone's so colloquially desperate for like any attention you mean you're not you're not going to you're not going to your guests aren't going to guest on your pot no no we've done we've actually made a point of making sure that because it's a seal once you open that oh you can't because my kids are you They're 12 and 14 and they're two boys. And at that age right now, all kids want to be YouTubers. I mean, me and my wife, Claire, have got a YouTube channel.

And they're always like, can we be on it and stuff? And we're like, when you're old enough to decide whether you want to do, go down that road, then I'm not going to put this on you now. Well, this is a new conversation for parents, right? It's the sit down. Are you sure you want to become a YouTuber? Dad, I'm a YouTuber. No, you're not.

Get in the bin. Christ. He comes back from Amsterdam and he gets spotted and in. and they're accosted. It suggests someone's informing on him. So he's famous at this point. He's like, he's the thing held up in Parliament. They're talking about, it's not knife crime.

It's not Asbo's, it's highwaymen. You know, that's like the moral panic of the age. Turpin escapes, heading 40 miles north to Cambridge. His wife and friends are released, but the hunt for dick continues. I bet you enjoyed writing that in the script, didn't you? Filthy, filthy researcher. It's disgusting. Wash your mouth out with soap, Phoebe.

Disgrace. You just made me say that on a podcast. listened to by millions of people the hunt for dick continues what you're doing your own time

Phoebe is not should not come into the absolute disgrace who do you think I am I'm a father of two the hunt for dick

well you've been caught a couple of hunts for dicks perhaps my dick London Hudes caught you're to catch a dick you know London Hughes

has a Netflix special out called to catch a dick she caught was a fin she was just I was flapping I was flapping

and ill luckily she threw you back into the ocean yes yeah I was in Epping forest found an Epping forest in a net London Hughes

is a dick trap floundering and a net yeah I took MDMA once and then cheated on my then girlfriend with London Hughes in the same room yeah dick twirping dick twerking um anyway

Christ so my point is Phoebe you're fired for that sentence the hunter dick clean out your desk now sorry night it's just another euphemism you haven't done MDMA since have you

no because my dick was cool that doesn't happen Every time, you don't get caught. I don't know that. My data is telling me that I take drugs and my dick gets caught. I don't, I'm not a drug person. No.

Right? Famously. Yeah. So I can't tell when the crack pipe in his stuff. Famously, Charlie, I'm anti-drugs. Anyway, so we're now in March 1737. He's come back from Holland. He's fleed up north to Cambridge and he forms a partnership with a guy called Matthew King.

So he's come up from. from Hollande, he's probably got a very boring story about taking mushrooms to the Anne Frank house, then going to a brothel. Now, the Anne Frank House was telling you as if he's the first person to have done that. But he was probably there. An Frank house was there, but it wasn't called the Anne Frank house. It was just the house. And Anne Frank wasn't even, it could have been like Nigel Frank's house. Yeah. Because I don't know how long the Franks have been there. Let's find out when the Anne Frank house was built. And when it got called the Anne Frank house, well, I know when it got called the Anne Frank house, but when did it? Charlie, are you searching for

Anne Frank? No. I know, I can tell your face. You've Googled Anne Frank porn. Have you Googled An Frank porn, haven't you? No. Yes, you have. And I bet it exists and actually I'd quite like to see it. Yeah. Charlie!

No, no, Charlie. Charlie, Charlie, we've got a guess. This is kind of anime Frank porn. Don't, anime Frank porn. An anime Frank porn. Anime Frank. Look, Phoebe's absolutely redeemed herself. She's washed her mouth out with soap.

And she's come back and said, the secret rear annex of Anne Frank House was replaced with a large one in 1739, the year the Dick Turpin dies. Oh, the rhythms of history. So Turpin orders this well-dressed traveller I haven't even said what's happening On the London to Cambridge Road

Right which I guess what's that M-11 I think the M-11 was a round No I'm saying I'm trying to translate it I'd say yeah I'd say something like that What's the bit after the M-11 when the M-11 It goes to the A-1 don't it And then M-1 Two dads chatting

It's like a Google and Alexa talking A1 M-A-1M A-1M yeah It's a scotch corner Yeah Lovely bit of this Not enough services on the M-11, though. Doesn't drive.

So, on the London to Cambridge Road, a lone well-dressed traveller rides towards town, an easy target. Dick Turpin's hanging in the trees. He's been caught by hundreds of years. Is he in the net? To catch a Dick Turpin. To catch a Dick Turpin.

That's my rebuttal. A caught dick answers. Oh, Christ. I'm still holding a crack pipe. Turpin orders the man to halt and the traveller, unfazed, approaches calmly. Now, Turpin threatens him and the man laughs. Well, doggy, dog, come, brother Turpin.

If you don't know me, I know you and should be glad of your company. Because, you know, rapists were quite jolly back in this time. Well, that's one of the pubs in this story. The jolly rapist, of course, yeah. Sorry, that's where they meant. You have a quick half down the jolly rapist. Quick half.

He's Matthew King, who is a successful highwayman who's looking for a buddy. Because it's like buddy cop. It's like good cop, bad cop, except they're both robbers. Right. Bad robber, bad robber. Yeah, bad, yeah.

So Turpin prefers work. It's easier to work in tandem, I guess. Hmm. Because, I don't know, numbers. Lonely, otherwise, it's a lonely. It's a lonely. It's like being a stand-up comedian. In many ways,

where you think the mental health of a highwayman is. Thank you. I'm glad you brought that up. I think that's where we should, you know, talk about our sponsor, Huel. Yeah. Or better help. Better help, highwaymen.

Are they in anxious people, do you reckon? I imagine they got quite like a stressful life It's not like a It's not a chilled lazy life You have to go up and get quite angry It's like people who work at service stations I think where do you live Do you know what I mean?

They stop existing Yeah It's like a sort of limbo land No it's like they're like NPCs in the game Yeah they go press X And then they come to life And they talk

But once you're not looking at them They don't exist So they really But then they've got a commute Anomoto I mean that must be rough You ever thought about that I've not I'm gonna think

You know, I'm going to think about it probably for the rest of my life now. It must just be so bleak. No, I reckon you get quite fond of your station. Well, you'd love it. Yeah. You'd love anything. You'd love anything. Wasn't there a documentary years ago called, like, the service station or something like that?

About George Michael. What's that? He's saying that the... His cottaging, famously, it was cottaging. And that's the service station. That's what careless whispers about. Yeah. The fatal mistake is that King and Turpins steal this racehorse called white stockings.

now horses at this point are named quite sexy things like white stockings as black best it's sort of all you know fires you up it does fire me up a bit the Lorraine Kelly his horse easy now

easy now oh shh I am a Lorraine Kelly whisperer the white stockings the horse's owner reports the theft to a landlord who uses his contacts to trace it to a pub

tracing a horse that's a strange thing isn't it like a credit card again I just feel like back in those days there was only like a dozen people in the country. Yeah. So you knew what horse it was.

Yeah. Oh, that's their horse. Yeah, because there's 12. And you knew if someone's wearing a certain jacket, you'd be like, right, well, that's Dick Turpin. Yeah. So Dick Turpin's got a grey blue coat. Yeah, because I guess there was no brands as well.

Yeah, you wouldn't have like North Face puffers. No. It'd be like your nan made your blazer. So the horses, they traced this white horse to a pub, and a mob then goes into Fine Turpin and Matthew King in the pub, King's brother is found inside blah blah they question him but then they

at the sight of the mob I don't really understand this bit Turpin shoots King somehow Martin Luther King not Martin Luther King no there was a there was some confusion wasn't there

and he went to shoot the guy that was coming after him but he shot his mate by accident but he was shot twice so it's sort of but it's very hard to shoot someone twice absolutely in these days yeah especially with

that's where you got two guns though yeah with those little pistols Yeah. Very inaccurate, right? They were inaccurate, but to shoot him twice. So it's been disputed. It's always said that Dick Turpin killed his mate and then fled. It went up north or something.

Yeah, yeah. But a lot of people said it's nearly impossible. To accidentally shoot him once is impossible. To accidentally shoot him twice. This is like a sort of 9-11 conspiracy theory. Jet fuel doesn't melt steel beams. The first one thing is an accident. The second one, you knew it was a terrestrial.

Yeah. When Turpin's second bullet hit, he'd go, right, well, he meant that. He clearly meant that. Um, so turpin flees, right, uh, King dies later, because in this day and age, if you got shot with like, they're marbles, essentially, marbles and guns, you get shot by it and then it, you basically die of sepsis. Maybe he thought, you know, when you spill red wine and people put white wine on it. Yeah.

Maybe that's what was trying to do after the accidental first shot. Knock it through. He was just like, oh, sorry, right. Let me try and, you know, let's clean it up, maybe. What, like those Newton's cradle, or you get a bullet, and you get another one to get it out. Or you shoot that bullet out of you, fuck. Sometimes if you've got a nail that you're trying to get rid of, so you just bash it further in, and then it's gone. Then there's just the wall. Yeah. You go, right, well, that's just the

wall now. That's fine. Right. So then, then in May 37, Turpin's on the back foot now, I'd say. Right, so is Robin Hood in. There's a Robin Hood in. He fears being recognized. He goes into a cave in the woods, and he gets followed by Thomas Morris, who is a servant of the keeper of Epping Forrest. He's armoured two pistols, and Turpin calls out, and then Morris, this is in nighttime. He fires both pistols kind of wildly at the noise, but obviously misses, because I think he's I think basically, pistols are around, but people have swords because it's just way more accurate. Pistols are like EVs of today. Yes, exactly.

They've got range anxiety about their pistols. Absolutely. It's not going to hit him. Yeah. I can't you. My dad's got an electric car and he generally just doesn't drive anywhere. Why? He's just terrified.

He's got crippling range anxiety. So he just can't get back again, yeah. He just gets cabs. It's crazy. Diesel cups. Explain it to me. Well, it runs out, doesn't it? It runs out of battery.

It's not a fuel. Wouldn't that? Wouldn't that be the same thing? with a normal car. No, because you're a petrol station because it's very rare to have a charging place. And apparently only one in three

actually work. Oh, right. So there's a crippling mental health crisis amongst electric vehicle drivers. I've got a lot of other stuff going on if you're getting an electric vehicle. Yeah.

Because it feels like they're worried about everything. Yes, they are. Oh, no, something's going on and fucking God knows where. So, it's great to be Jeremy Clarkson who can't drive.

So Morris fires the pistols wildly. Turpin, skilled pistol marksman, one shot, one kill. More than just dead, Turpin vanishes. And now 200 pound reward is offered nearly 10 times a skilled worker's annual wage. Because you could just fucking disappear. That was like 60 grand.

You could just disappear back in the day. You can just fucking go. Change your coat. No one to know you are. Genuinely. Oh, is that a grey blue coat or no, it's blue grey. Oh, right. That's not Dick Tupper.

Is it? Yeah. I do miss that a bit, the idea that you could just fucking disappear. Yeah, there's a feeling now. If you get in trouble, there's nowhere to hide. There really isn't. You can't go anywhere. Forensics has ruined the crime mystery, isn't it?

But you used to, I mean, people have started travelling now, but if you go back 100 years before this, 200 years, you just moved to the next village and no one would ever know where you've gone. Yeah, you put a different hat on. And your wife's like, that's not yet. We'd never have worn that. Crazy.

You just grow your beard out. Yeah. You're done. Done. So Turpin supposedly flees to Yorkshire. Now, there's an apocryphal tale of things. him murdering someone in London and then riding 200 miles

in like 20 minutes or something his horse dies from exhaustion apparently and it was to give him an alibi right? Because back in the day you'd because then he'd say hello to the guy and it was like when he was up here if you make sure you're seen by the mayor of York then he's like well he can't have he's here there he wasn't in London but that must have taken I mean

how long is York to London if you're cycling that 20 hours so if you buy horseback Horses are faster than bicycles? Do you reckon? What are they? About 40 miles an hour? I don't know. Not downhill, I reckon the bike's faster. Horse versus bike.

Yeah, come on. Horse versus bike. This is what you're not. That's what you want. A bike is faster for long distances is, but a horse. Requires less space for storage. Thank you. Out of you.

Yep. Don't have a bike stable. Hors is better traction on difficult terrain. It's true. And the roads weren't particularly good back then. What's the top? Go to the top speed. Because if this is true, then it's not, he's not done it.

You can't do in 12 hours. No. Okay, fair enough. Fair enough. Yeah, 45 miles an hour. Right. Nowadays, it'd be absolutely fine going up the M1. Yeah, yeah.

The amount of fucking smart cameras on that. Yeah, any smart motorway stuff, he's just leaving it. I just don't know what it is. Don't even know. Doesn't, can't relate to it. It's a motorway, it's 50 mile an hour. Pretty much all the way. Yeah, it's crazy.

Absolutely killing my right foot. Doesn't affect me. You wanted to call me a slur just then, I feel. I did. I was searching for a slur. I was searching for what is the slur for a straight man who can't drive. I was just going through my roller decks. my library of slurs.

It's a bus wanker. It is. It is. It's right there. How often do you get that, James? Just whenever I leave the house. Really? Fine.

If I stay indoors, it's fine. My kids only say it a couple of times. Right, yeah. You're not getting it. But you have somebody... Might get it from like Amazon delivery drivers, maybe. If I set foot outside the house as soon as I... But you need into it.

I think it's kind of a joy to... You lead into it so much. You know, it's really embarrassing. I just still think it's funny. Yeah. But it is, though. I watched it. the other day before you, because we knew

we were coming on, because I watched in between us when it came out. Of course, we all did. We all did. But then I actually watched the scene again and I was like, well, that is, I was like, oh, is that it? That is funny. The scene where you just lean out of window, shout a bus because I'll be waiting for a bus. Do it twice. And then that's your life. It's very funny that that's caught on that much. Have you ever had a day where you're just not in the mood and somebody does it

and have you ever snapped? No. You know, you're a fucking wanker, actually. I'm driving this bus. How do you find getting recognised? It's weird. It's really odd. You need to be knowing it for a while. Sorry. Where did you get your ideas from?

Just with all these great questions for asking, James. You know, I did a lot of research. Yeah, no. Sorry, go ahead, James. No, it's fine. Yeah. But seriously, where do you get your ideas from? Where the fuck do you get your ideas from?

When I'm on the Lou, that's when I do my good thinking. So somehow he ends up in Yorkshire, whether he goes out there over a night or not, I doubt that But I don't think that's even I think it was just That's myth It was that bloke that wrote the book

Yeah So what we haven't said actually yet Thanks for bringing us on Keeping this on track James is that A book gets written In the 19th century Called Rookwood

And that That sort of turns All these different Highwaymen Into Dick Turpin And that's where the myth comes from When actually he was a guy Who probably raped people

And poor boiling water Over a man Over your gangman And where are the police? We send them last episode, there are no police. Oh, so it's lawless. They're informal police. Is there anyone who's just like trying to help people out?

Yeah, the human cry. It's just, yeah, it's all vigilant. Everyone's Batman. Everyone is a pedos. Everyone is a pedos arresting everyone. Everyone's a pedo hunter in a car park. For a long time, the public were against having a police false, weren't they? Yeah. They were just... It was overreach. Yeah, we can do it ourselves. Yeah.

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Right. Now, locals thought him eccentric, but not criminal, and he dresses well and blah, blah, blah, he joins hunting parties. It's all like new money, alibi, whatever. David Lloyd. He's stealing... Don't have a go, David Lloyd. He's stealing horses from another county and... Yes.

That's right. Go on. So, yeah, tell us about this. That's the information. That's as far as my brain goes. I think what he does is he works on a farm and he is selling horses on that he's gone and stolen. I think it, yeah, I think it's like Lancashire or something like that. He goes to Lancashire, steal some horses, takes them back to Yorkshire and sells them.

Yeah. And he poses as a horse trader. Yeah. And then in October 1738. This is mental. This is very funny. This is what I was saying about how he's just an idiot. Yeah.

Like every moment where he could have gone. done, should I be an idiot or not? Yeah. He's like, oh, I'll shoot him. Well, might as well shoot him again. Yeah. So, but he's fine now. Yeah.

He's got a new name. Yeah, he's sorted. He's making good money. He's done it. Selling horses. He's selling horses. Knicking horses and selling them. Yeah.

And he can always go back to being a butcher as well. He's got a trade. Anyway, in October 1738, his whole hidden identity collapses because... Does it's not remind you of the Fettie Wap song? What was it called again? She my trap queen and is a track queen, Fettie Wap. Because every time I'm reading this, I just hear it. Do I look like someone who...

Do I look like someone... I said, what's a whole word for me? Fetty Wamp. Play it, play it. Tell me if you recognise this. 17-38. It is a banger. It's a banger, but I don't know.

I don't think... Is he referencing this? He is. It's a Dick Turpin inspired piece. Really? 38. It feels like these guys are Americans. There he is.

That's not Dick Turpin. Turn that off. Can you Google Americans what happened in 1738? I imagine it's something to do. Yes. Wreffing cognac. 1738. So maybe the cognac that a lot of trap rappers drink

was started in this very, very year. We can't know. That's the least tough thing to name your gang. Cognac. Cognac. No, cognac now is, that's what they all drink Hennessy. Caprican would be less hard. Yeah, but you can make it hard if you were hard.

Sunny D. Yeah. Drink it like every scene. Tango. Yeah. You know when you've been tango. Ice blast. Shock.

To be fair, those adverts did get banned. Did they? Those tango adverts. You know when you've been tangoed? Yeah, because when I was a kid in the playground, it became a thing. Because it was a great big orange hand that would slap people. Oh, of course it was. These adverts.

Wasn't that Dom Jolly? And we would go up to each other in the playground and just start slapping each other and go, you've been tangoed, go it. Is that Dom Jolly? That's no, that's Trigger Happy TV. No, but is it Dom Jolly that... Isn't that Don Jolly? Is it? That looks nothing like him.

No, that does look like Dom Jolly. No, it doesn't. That looks like Barry from EastEnders, painting an orange. That's Barry from EastEnders for Extinction Rebellion or whatever Just up oil Peter Greaves Who played the orange man

It's just the orange man It does It does look like Dom Jolly though I don't think it does You are right Is this even a podcast anymore It's the spitting image of Dom Johnny I don't think it is

I think you should not be encouraging him James People say this is not real history podcast Oh no it doesn't Thank you No it looks nothing like Don Dray You're right Mythbusters I tried to help you out there

Although I appreciate it thank you I wish I was doing that I'm slightly closer in spitz That's a complete funny looking eye though Yeah I guess What's that expression It's the only job he could have done really

Yeah I guess When he got the call from Tango They were like finally Hank fuck Let's see what he's doing now He'd been pitching him He's been pitching him over years For ages

Imagine how much of a stink You'd kick up if a white person got that role Because it's ridiculous Having my people's stories Being told Clearly orange roles for orange actors Do you reckon there's a white guy

He did orange up for him It's like, oh, fucking hell, work nonsense. The orange guy, went to the orange guy. It should be, who's the best for the job? It's called acting. Do you reckon the impalumpas were white, and they orangeed up for it? Yes. Yeah, I mean, I guess it, I guess it, that kind of was pre-werexed in Palumper.

He hasn't worked since. Oh, that guy next to, I'm obsessed with that guy. The window, the safe style. Yeah, who's that? 508, 507 now. 407 now. I said, you bow on, you get one free. Oh, yeah, yeah.

You bow on, you get one free. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But what was Fappy Wuss then? Did we get to the bottom of that? Fappy Wuss. Fetty Wap. Fetty Wap. Fettie Wap is basically a bussy.

It's a kind of caved in bussy and it's covered in plasma. Right. Guys. History, come on. Come on. These people are trying to follow the story of Dick Turpin.

They're dandies. They're thick. They want to know what happens. We're getting to the exciting bit. So Turpin's fake. He's called John Palmer. He's living in Yorkshire. nicking horses

and then he gets angry and he shoots a game cock which is a chicken in the street after a bad die dick shoots a cock Dick shoots a cock He couldn't write it Couldn't make it up

Couldn't make it up Imagine that though What? A dick shooting a cock? No but he's He's got a clean slate Yeah he's assumed a new identity He's still on the nick a little bit but he's getting away with it.

Unprovoked shooting of a chicken in the street. Crazy, isn't it? He loves it. That's when the neighbour goes, that's a bit odd. Maybe we should look into this guy. It's in the film. It's the character,

you know, he tries to escape the game, but the game can't escape him. You know what it is? It's what I mean? It's when you're, they put me back in. When you're playing GTA

and you're like, this is fine, and then you're like, oh, fuck it. And then you just, you know, you just run over people. Old woman and a prostitute. Yeah, exactly. And then my cryptonite.

And then the police come on and you're like, oh, I'm dead now. Not fun, you know. You caught, yeah. Charlie, what, this is, this is fucking relevant. It's not relevant. It's a cutscene from my... James mentioned GTA.

I think. I didn't. I mentioned it. Well, James, James requested porn. No, he did. James manager emailed in before. James manager is watching in saying, can we have more porn, please. Can I stander and more porn, please.

Just get rid of love. London Hughes. Why is she's still on the screen? It's traumatic for him. His dick got caught by this woman. I don't want to talk to a therapist. I don't know who London Hughes is either. Count yourself lucky. Is it another porn star? No. It's a lovely woman who... She's a dick catcher in chief. I'm not up on my porn these days. I'm old school. I think porn's very lazy nowadays. What do you like? It's just like you say... I've always said bonnie. It's just like

your body. Come on love. Make an effort. No, but it is just like how many men... A thousand. What are you prude? That's it. How many men can you do in the short space of time? Where's the cable guy? Where's your pool cleaner? Yeah. It would be funny to be in the body boot queue as dressed as a pizza going, no, this is just a pizza.

I've heard there's a lot of blocs here they must be hungry. Deliveroo driver. Yeah, it's a big bag on. You must be starving. I've seen what's going on. I've got a round in. Right, for fuck's sake, we'd be talking about this

for 20, he shoots a chicken in the street. And then he threatens the bird's owner because the bird's owner's like, oh, that's my chicken. And he's like, well, you fucking want, some. Right. I was there. Yeah. Really. And then Turpin threatens to reload and shoot him

when the labour challenges him. Yeah. So this then brings in justice of the piece, which I guess is like the early early police, I suppose. He's threatened to reload. Okay, it's like EVs. I'll reload. It will take me 45. You give me 45 minutes, mate. I'll race you. I'll be there.

You just wait here. So keeping the piece is like a standard legal measure. So basically, if someone gets caught causing trouble, a magistrate could order them to either promise good behavior. Promise. Promise? Do you promise? Promise to put that gun down.

I wonder if anyone got out on that when they said, do you promise good behavior? And he's like, I can't. I can't promise. Sorry. You're going to have to take me in. Hang me. Hang me. You know, I'm many things.

I'm a murder. I'm rapist. I'm not a liar. I'm a lost cause. I won't lie. I've got some moral. So you can put down money, which is called assurity, which means that it's like a deposit, I guess, for being naughty, maybe.

To posse-wasi. And then if they cause trouble again, then they forfeit the money. And then if they can't do that, they're sent to a correction house. Anyway, Turpin Palmer refuses to keep the peace. And I think you need like a reference for renting a flat. You need someone to be like, yeah, he's all right. Right, yeah. A guarantor.

Yeah. Garantor, but he doesn't have one because he's obviously in Yorkshire. And he's a good character, good moral standing sort of thing. Yeah, he's got lovely coat, right? He's got no other. So he gets sent to a house of correction, which I guess is an early. Bridgett Osmond show. That's not House of Games.

Now, justices of the peace begin digging into Palmer's finances and inconsistency start to pile up. You know, he's making unexplained trips to across the Humbold. You promised for good behaviour, but then you've been doing bad behavior. Yeah.

Something I'm right in. Didn't he not promise? Yeah. Didn't he do what you just said? No, I did that. I'm not going to do that. Yeah, false pinky. You can't trust these highwaymen.

Fool me one, shame on me. He had horses that he didn't have receipts for. No one could say how he earned his money. Suspicion starts to shift Then he gets moved to York Castle Which is for really naughty boys Then More Clues surface

The horse theft Maybe he's nicking sheep as well Anyway John Palmer then gets wanted for sheep theft Because that's another thing as well He called himself John Palmer When he was selling the horses And he also called himself John Palmer

When he was nicking them as well He's in the nick in York And then he What does he do? He writes to his brother-in-law Who's in Essex still And he says... But he signs it

John Palmer, right? Yeah. And this was during the time where you didn't get your mail through your door. Yes. You had to go and collect it from the post office

and pay for it. Crazy. So it wasn't the sender that paid for it. It was the receiver. Remember reverse call charge? Yeah, 800 reverse. Yeah.

Used to do that and then you have to accept the charge, then you pay for it. Fucking out. There's a lot of politics going on there, I imagine. I did try and read a little bit about it and they wasn't sure

whether his brother-in-law just went, I don't know, a John Palmer. Yeah, so I'm not paying for this. Yeah. Or if he was like, oh, that's that fucking dick again. Yeah. No. I'm not paying for that either.

So he refused to pay, which means the letter is still there. And then the letter gets diverted. And this seems like crazy, but this has actually really happened. A bloke called James Smith, who had taught Turpin at school, finds the letter,

and then recognising his handwriting immediately. Yeah. And then goes, that's Dick Turpin. His old teacher. would become like a postmaster or something. Fucking snitch. Yeah, grass him up.

Smith travels to York, identifies Turpin, and then he receives 200 quid. And then basically, they realised that John Palmer is Dick Turpin. And then there's this huge, like, I don't really want to get into it.

It's quite boring, but like Yorkshire and London are arguing over who should get him. Right, right. Like what jurisdiction it is. Yeah, it's like sort of when Eileen Warnas got arrested and she had to sort of,

she got about eight deaf sentences Because it's all over. Because every county wanted a piece. Yeah. And at one point it's like, yeah, yeah. And she was just going, do I have to do it? Can you not just kill me? You're already killing me seven times.

Do we need to go to an eighth place? Yeah. I did it. I admit it. Anyway, so on one side, in the column for York, you've got multiple horse theft. And then in the column for London, you've got multiple robberies and rapes. Somehow York wins out. I guess horses are pretty, they're held in high regard in this day and age.

And he gets tried. in York for nicking horses which is a... 1739. Which is a that's an offence in itself. That's not theft.

Horse theft is separate. Like, grand theft horse. Everyone knows he's Dick Turpin but he still gets called John Palmer. It's like what's quite funny is it's like when people talk about how crime's going up because of like phone snatching.

Yes. But more people are phones. Yes. It's like horse snatching has gone way down. It just depends which one you choose. But also horse gnatches much harder than phones that's like logistically.

Yeah, to snatch a horse. You can't just. If you're walking down the pavement not looking at your horse on a lead and someone just nicks it on a moped and drags the horse on behind the moped. That's fucking crazy.

He sent us to death, right? Because the jury takes minutes to convict him. And then, you know, he's cocky the whole time. He was like, yeah. You should probably mention actually that the reason he wrote

to his brother-in-law was to get that good character reference. Yes, sorry, he wanted the reference. Yeah. Because that's what they did in the trials was like, I'm a good bloke, I promise. Yes. yeah um but he didn't have

anything and then he gets sentenced to death pretty much immediately he has a behaves with a strange cheerfulness um and then uh the jailer made a hundred pounds selling drinks to visitors because a fucking tourist attraction uh i guess yeah it's a big big event and then he's

executed on the 7th of April 1739 where it's like a spectacle right and you had to there's a thing called dying game you hear this no if you they wanted to it's when you riz up the the person who's hanging you?

No, no, it's like, well, maybe. He's got a dying game. He's like, yeah, as you go down like that. I don't mean it's more like flirting. He's got good game. No, it's dying in a way. What are you doing after this? Game for dying.

It's called die if you do be rough. You're up for it. If you die game, it means you put on a bit of a show as you die. Yeah. Because this is before the iPhone and stuff like that. Yeah. There wasn't really much to do. There wasn't much entertainment.

This is the original brain rot. Yeah. is watching people get hands. There'll be kids watching it and the parents going... I don't know if you should be watching this. Yeah, no, this is going... Can we put some filters on this?

You should be doing some reading or something, surely. And then in like the 1740s, they blur it and you have to sign in and then you can watch... Anyway, he climbs the ladder with apparent confidence does turpin.

His left leg trembles and then he stamped it down defiantly provoking gasps. She's just a boredy age, isn't it? Right. Yeah. Now, it's like short drop execution, which is where you...

It doesn't break your neck. It's like... Oh, wait, so he kills himself on, he just goes like, fuck it. Without before the execution. Yeah, so the noose is around his head. And then they're going to say some bit of like drama, like, oh, I'm the, I'm the dick and the hell. And he says, fuck it and just do it live and just jumps.

That's pretty good. Well, do it dead. And just, just jumps off the thing. Drogba! Dragba! Yeah. Backstick, drogba hangs himself. Yeah.

But he died after several minutes of choking. Yeah, that takes away. It does take away from the kind of bold, like. He must, I bet he was, because he died thinking. Fuck, I thought it was going to be so fucking bad ass. Yeah, fuck you. For ages, yeah, yeah. Are the crowd like applauding?

What are the crowd doing? Cheering, bane for blood? No, they love it. They love it. They love it. Seven minutes. What's like, minute one's like, but surely after like. Come on.

Seven. Yeah, it gets awkward. It definitely gets awkward. Change the record. Fucking out. It depends how. Yeah, boom. It was like, you deserved it.

Get on with it. Right in hell. And then it's fucking. It depends how I need to it. Some of the guys are in the, you know, they could. By seven minutes they could really They could be going for it What do you mean?

I was just wanking Wanking You know Yeah I could easily get the job done Within seven minutes Oh twice with a break Yeah

And if you're Two sessions Two sessions drinks Morning and afternoon Morning lunch and afternoon Um So

Just go over a little execution tug Yeah brilliant So You've got a rope around your name Exactly, yeah. There's everyone on the gallows. They're all waiting. We're all right here with you.

Do you reckon people dressed up as him? I don't know. People do now. Yeah, yeah. So he gets buried the following day in Fishergate and then body snatchers dig him up for medical dissection, which apparently is quite common.

Yeah. And then a mob intervenes gets the corpse back and buries it again. Oh, really? Interesting. But basically, that's kind of the end of the actual man. But then, as we've said, a guy writes... So we've done the man.

What about the myth, the legend? What about the myth? t-shirt. Yeah. The man, the legend. The man's done. Now let's do the myth the legend. Then the end of the highwayman era is sort of, comes in with the enclosure act of 1773,

which basically fences off open fields. So the fence. The fence. The invention of the fence. So this is before the fence. Right. So that's what the, the, the kryptonite of a highwayman is a fence. It's a fence.

It's like they say how women's toilets, the sign, will stop people going in, wrong people. Yeah. I can't go in there. Yeah, I can't go in. It's like a vampire needs to be invited in. I know I'm a sex pest who's transitioned in order to have a second, but I can't go in there because it's a fucking sign saying women's toys. If you draw a line with your finger around a chicken or something or an ant or something

like that, it doesn't leave the... Really? I think there's something like that. You draw a line around a chicken, the chicken might be the line. An imaginary line. If you just sort of go like that round of chicken, it just sort of goes, oh, fucking hell, now what my... Yeah, this, yeah, you could do that with, like, ants. is that one is?

If you get like a felt tip marker and nance you can draw a thing and then they'll maybe not Oh no no it's chickens Is it chicken

Is it? Are you joking? Oh yeah That's it It's a straight line And then they just sort of go Fuck What the fuck is that

And they just What like a drunk drive test For chickens No wait hold up But I want to see them What they'd be like Without the line Well you've seen chickens

They're just Unable to move I think it's I think that Dick Turpin Had seen one of these TikTok videos tried to do it on a chicken Got angry

that it didn't work and shot it. Shot the chicken. That's how he got caught. I don't understand that. That's how you hypnotize a chicken. Draw a line in front of it and he goes, I don't know what's going on. Yeah,

it thinks it's like a big wall maybe. But that's how we get you as well. Yeah, I can't leave the office. So the highwayman, the age of the highwayman is sort of over by the 70s and 70s really. And because of the fence. Yeah.

That great invention. A reminder about how lucky we are to live in a world where there are walls. Yeah. I say build more walls, that's what I say. There's not enough of them. James, thank you so much for coming on the pod. Thank you for having it.

Are you going to take around for our patron? Yes. That would be great. We're going to be a patron episode with James Buckley. Thank you so much. Now, do you have some things to plug? Yeah, you've got two podcasts. I've got two podcasts.

One podcast I do with my wife called The Buckley's and another podcast I do with Joe Thomas from the tweeners. And what's the premise of that one? Very loose. It's very loose. Because you have to, you're not allowed to just say, oh, can me and my mate just talk. Pollocks on a couch for a little while.

Absolutely not. No, no. You have to do a lot of research. You have to go through a lot of research. Our podcast is called Joe and James Facked Up. And you're going on tour? Me and Clara are going on tour. Yeah, thank you very much.

Happy, cheers. Yeah, we're doing a tour. There's tickets for that as well. We're going up and down the country. Amazing. Where are you going all over? Yeah, everywhere. Scotland, all of it.

All of it. Link below. Link below. Oh, thanks, guys. James, you gave us some gifts. I'm going to give you a gift. These are my Christmas crackers. Look at this.

You can have at home. I can't wait. You know what? 14 year old boy, they'll love that. They will. Absolute rot in there. Christmas crackers are on sale as well. Links in there.

All your stuff's in there. Thanks so much for watching. Thanks for coming on, James. Thank you for having me. We'll see, if you're a patron subscriber, James will stick around. We're going to talk about the Hatt and Garden Heist. Lots of fun there. And if not, we'll see you next time for a new topic.

Bye. From that first coffee of the day, to dropping off your dry cleaning on the way, from stepping onto the subway to opening your doors to your first customer of the day. We're here to power you along the way. Maneris, powering Canadian commerce. Visit us at manares. slash commerce.