Fin vs History - White Girls Manifest, White Guys Manifesto | The Battle of Little Big Horn (Part 1/4)

Episode Date: April 6, 2026

Introducing Custer & Little Bighorn.. Thanks lads, you’ve made my wife cry!    The Battle of Little Bighorn (Part One)    The show for people who like history but don't care what actually happened.   For weekly bonus episodes, ad-free listening and early access to series, become a Truther and sign up to the Patreon  ⁠patreon.com/fintaylor    This episode of Fin vs History is brought to you by Surfshark.     Secure your privacy with Surfshark! Enter coupon code FVH for an extra 4 months at https://surfshark.com/fvh  Chapters: 00:00 - Supplies!   04:48 - Climate Change Is Gay  08:50 - Is Everyone Trans?  14:37 - From The Barracks To The Bin  21:09 - You’re Mentally Ill   25:05 - Compliments To The Chief  28:41 - The Worst Of The Whites  32:40 - Dunga Dunga  36:06 - Miss Lizzy  39:47 - Digital Nomads  44:06 - He’s Robust!   47:36 - Secretaries Have Agency!     Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Yeha, moment in the wild-wow west. What are you doing? Cowboy. It's Cowboys in Indians' Week. Yeah, but you can't dress as a cowboy. I think that's very, very culturally and sensitive. To who? Well, the Cowboys, I mean, that's a whole way of life that doesn't exist anymore.

And you're sort of, like, neglecting those years of pain and experience by just sort of trivializing it into fancy dress. I mean... Well, yeah, I mean, when you put it like that, I guess so, but... I just think it's disgusting how today we just fetishize these communities, but don't even invite these communities to be part of their own... I feel like you're doing that. I mean, there's no need to be that angry.

You're not part of this community. That's not even the right one. What is going on? You're just being called out for being offensive. You're being offensive. Offensive? Oh. Welcome back to Finn versus History.

I'm joined by Horatio Gauls. Yihar. Uh, huh? Yihar. Yihar. Today, I thought you'd done an Native American, but you did. You ducked it.

I was on the other side. I thought, I generally thought you said, Nehau, and I went, that's so far from where we are, but I love it. The Japanese native American.

There was Chinese. There was Chinese building the railway. Yes, yes, that's part of this story. You know, there's that joke, right, the classic joke about, there's an Englishman and Irishman

and a Chinese guy building the railways. Chinaman, do it properly. Chinaman building the railways. And there's like, this American guy who's running it all. It says, English guy,

we need you to get like all the wood right and he goes brilliant brilliant irish guy we need you to get all the steel girders right and then chinese guy you need to get you to get all of the the supplies yeah right he's like brilliant supplies and they all go off and they come back like five hours later english guy he's got all the wooden planks right uh the irish guy's got all the steel girders brilliant but the chinese guys know it to be seen it's like he should have been here like we've all what's going on and then behind uh behind a final I know what's coming. I'm so excited. So, go on. He jumps up and goes, supplies! Hadn't heard it before. Worked out the punchline about three seconds before we said it. Very excited. Very excited.

What a treat for the listeners. So there is Chinese people in the frontier. Ni-ho. And that's my historical source, is that joke. So today we're talking about Custer's last stand, the Battle of Little Big Horn. It's cowboys and Indians, except they're not cowboys. They're the might of the American army. And they're not Indians either.

We don't know what they are. They're not called Indians. It doesn't have the same sort of romance as it, Cowboys and Indians as it does as a child. Yeah. The politics really brings it down a little bit. The actual history makes it actually very sad. And it's sort of like playing,

it's a bit like playing Germans and Jews when you're on the, that's a three-year-old. And then you find out what happened. You go, fuck me. I don't feel bad. Are they let me play? You let me play with a Playmobile Germans and Jews.

news. I had a little cowboy Indian set and then I realized, I only realized about a few years ago that the cowboys were all

dressed in Confederate Army. It was a Playmobile Confederate Army. When I was like four, my parents

bought me Southern American troops to play with Indians. And I was just la la la la listen. I think it

probably did imprint. Maybe it absorbed something. Maybe if we're blaming nurture, maybe that's where I am. You have to see

that was the good guys have always been representative with the Confederate flag. Yeah. That's the good flag. That's me at gay pride, but the Confederate flag. I'm an ally. I'm one of you guys. Yeah, so we're dealing with Custer's last stand,

which is probably, I think it's the, people might not know about it, but it's probably the most exciting prism to discuss the Native American US struggle. Because it's like all of, it's kind of like an end point of certain things. Yes.

And it's sort of like the coming together of hundreds of years of history. sort of all come to this one moment. It's Yankee Doodle Rourke's Drift. Yeah. Yeah, it really is. It's also the first time that America gets a bloody nose and overreacts. So it's a like, you know, it's a 9-11 Pearl Harbor, Big Horn.

Yeah, that's on the-on. That's on the lineage. So let's do a whistle-stop tour of where we are at this point in history. So Columbus obviously arrives 4092. You missed out Leif Erikson there. Who is Lefe Erickson? I don't care who Lefe-Rexon is. It's disrespectful to leave him.

about Leaf Erickson, that's been kindly put in the research. Right. Leif Erikson established a short-lived settlement. Leaf Erickson. Is there any more gayer name than Leaf Erickson? Yeah, I suck cock, Ball. I suck cock, balls. I suck, balls.

That's right, okay, fine. He's from the Bulls family. Sorry. His name's Issaqq. So Ed Balls' brother is called Issaacock. That's a gayer name than Leaf Erickson. Yeah, you're right. Just in terms of like a sort of, you know, green, Scandinavian.

But is that gay? Leaf. Green. Yeah. Yeah. Well, yeah. Climate change is gay. Yeah.

100%. Hybrid change is gay. Yeah. 100%. 100%. That was in 1100s. So he actually discovered America. Clarkson, you know, Clarkson sort of throwing plastic packaging into the big bin is straight.

So climate change is gay. Clarkson's in the worst fitting jeans of all time. Yes. Yeah. They somehow don't fit. They go over his ankle and yet they're high-waisted. Yeah. I find it amazing with Clarkson.

He seems unhealthy, but. always working and on the move and getting up early. It's like a weird thing. Do you know what's amazing? I learned this recently. Clarkson is younger than my dad. Now you've met my dad who looks younger than me. And Clarkson looks like he's on death store.

Yeah, he's an advert. He's someone who, because he thinks any cosmetic stuff is gay. And it is interesting. You realize how many people in the public I must be doing basic cosmetic stuff. He's what happens if you don't. Don't touch anything. Don't touch anything. Literally just cold water.

Barely brush your teeth. Yeah. Okay, so Leif Erikson. There we go. Start at Leif Erickson. Right, 1100, a gay guy who found some kind of settlement in Newfoundland. But he didn't call it that. Yeah. He just, I don't know. And it was short-lived, so he didn't.

So who cares? Yeah, okay. So I was right, really, to go to Christopher Columbus in Fortune 92, who discovers America, which is a politically loaded term that I agree with. We're politically loaded into a gun that I'm firing. He's looking for India. and he thinks he's found it. Yes.

And he calls the Native Americans Indians. Right. Along with some other fruity terms that, you know, as a British man you can enjoy. Sure. It's a racial fight that you're so far away from and so uninvolved in. It's a rare time where it's like we can sort of take a step back and let someone do the races. Yeah. So Florida gets found by the Spanish in 1565.

You know, it's tacky from the off. Yeah. Well, Disneyland is there. Exactly. Dittina. then Virginia, English, America starts 607, Virgin land, Quebec, French Canada, you know, gay, gay, that was founded a 60808, blah, blah, blah. America declares its independence from Britain in 1776.

So it starts going downhill from here. This is where it really starts to go downhill. They get their fanny packs on, they have their big sippy cups and the visors. And then irrelevant to, now America at this point is very, very small. It's just the Eastern Seaboard, basically. Was it 13 colonies, something like that? Then in 1803, Napoleon, who is at this point controlling quite a lot of North America, the French Empire. He sells all the French possessions to America to fund the war with the Britain.

That gets known as a Louisiana purchase. And this either doubles the size of the US overnight. So I guess this doesn't really happen anywhere that you just like, you just buy. Has anyone bought more land? you just fucking buy a third of your country. But it's crazy that overnight the country doubles in size. Just, yeah, it's a big, I mean, we've done some big purchases recently on the suit front, but this is like...

Oh, nothing like they're easy. I'll purchase, no. It was close, though. No, yeah. But in order to get our suits, we don't have to clear a native population. Well, that's your view. I still think we might need to. It's not a zero-sum game.

I think there's some gymnastics we do to justify it. Sure. So this means that And then they start finding gold The further west they go Gold rushes in 1849 This starts the policy of manifest to destiny So it's like white girl manifesting

Pinterest boards Yes I suppose it's white male manifestation Which is that's my land fuck off Yeah Rather than what do I want What holidays do I want this year? Yeah You know how big sippy cup do I want

In five years When it's white guys manifesting it's terrifying. Terrifying. Straight white guys manifesting is bad. That's manifesto is what it is. Yeah, you're right.

Yeah. White girls manifest. White guys manifesto. And the manifesto is you can all fuck off. That's our land. We're Christian. And it's all juju nonsense.

So purchase from Napoleon, Thomas Jefferson, friend of the pod, he buys it for $15 million. So Mississippi River to the Rocky Mountains is suddenly now the US. Charlie, what was that? This is a fat, stoic, one-eyed Native American man.

Is that an AI or is that like of just a high-read? You've just, that's AI. No, it's not. You're on an AI website. Am I? Crayon. Right. So did you make that?

I didn't make that. Look, look, did you just type fat, stoic, one-eyed Native American man photorealistic into Google that's talking up with that? Yeah. Yeah. So Manifest Destiny, white guy manifestos. This means that they, they think. think it is their destiny to spread Christianity and...

From the river to the sea. From the river to the sea. It is the original from the river to the sea. I mean, from sea to shining sea is literally what they... Yeah. And it is the mindset, the settler colonial mindset is very much. From the river to the sea, Missouri will be free. Free of Native Americans who were there in the first place.

The US starts wars against native tribes and Mexico to expand their control. and they come into conflict with several different tribes. Now the Native Americans will get into properly who they are in the next episode but they're similar to the Aztecs and they're not like one thing

there's several different tribes and they're fighting all the time they're fine all the time it's like viewing the French and the English is the same just if they came over. Yeah you can't you can't do that you can't.

Christianity, democracy, civilization you put that in quotes take those quotes off you're fired so now we're dealing with Custer, is Custer's last stand. So George Custer is a, is sort of a swashbuckling general,

and he's a, I suppose he's one of the first main American military celebrities. Yes. And he's born in 1839 in Ohio. So to place the year 1839 for our thick listeners, this is, it's after American Independence, 76. Right. And it is before postcodes. Postcodes.

only came in in the 70s. Did you know that? Really? I found that out yesterday at the postal museum. Who, wait, were you, what? Were you at the postal museum?

I was at the postal museum yesterday. I have two children. What were you doing yesterday, Charlie? I was, I was awake all day. I was, I didn't sleep. Yeah. Because the night before

was your 30th birthday party. Yeah. We were at Charlie's 30th birthday party and you said, you described it, you felt like you felt like you. You felt like that. And to be fair, it was kind of like that. Terrifyingly,

Charlie had a 30th birthday WhatsApp group, as many of us do. Check it, 250 members. I was like, immediate archive from me. 250 members. Fuck that. Fuck that right off. He organised a talent show where he, over many different genres, performed five songs, opened by performing five of his own songs, which is, I guess, was kind of awesome, getting like 100 people there in party hats to watch you perform. So it's sort of like an EP launch. And so, yeah, it was a big session.

I think we all left about two and then... I left significantly before that. Yeah, you saw enough godlessness. It's more just that, you know, it was in a... Firstly, it was in like a sort of cafe in the middle of nowhere. Like grotty, like unisex toilets because there are... And it's sort of a hole in the ground kind of thing. And then I just sort of had this, you know, I went to the bar and then suddenly you're like,

oh God, is it like, is everyone trans? And you're like, that's fine, but then you're like, am I weird for, you know, I don't know what to do. weird for shouting, are you trans? Yes, but you are. Triumph, no. It's more just like, oh God, I feel like Mark from peep show, and I just wanted to just stand the corner. What was terrifying, though, was we met your friend, Rufus,

lovely guy, and he said you listen to the pod, and he's waiting for your big hitters to come out in terms of fucked up stories. Yeah, everyone thinks we've barely scratched the surface, which is terrified. Absolutely terrifying. Quaking in my boots thinking about that. Anyway.

But you, sorry, you were up till 7 p.m. last night. Yeah. So you were all the way through. So while you're at, when you're, When were you at the postal museum? From about 10 a.m. till about 2pm yesterday. Charlie was at his afters.

I fell asleep in the cab and the guy was just having to like, shake me awake. No, I was going on a little train underground. They used to be, they had a postal railway just for post from Whitechapel to Paddington. Right.

And yeah, my son absolutely lost his shit. Loved it. Loved it. Absolutely loved it. Anyway, we're talking about General Custer. Sorry, you were going to say that the postcode just before. Yeah, postco.

Post codes, what I learned was that post codes came in in the 70s, which was shocking to me. So who invented them? Is it a British invention? Yeah. That's pretty good. Yeah, pretty good, isn't it? But is now everyone using post codes? Well, the Americans would use zip codes.

Right. And is that completely different? Well, I guess it's the same thing, isn't it? But they weren't, they didn't have zip codes when Custer was looking for the Plains Indians. Fine. Now, it should be said also that we'll be referring to the Plains Indians as several different words because I mean...

Other? Yeah. That lot. Red backs or whatever. Yeah. It's an opportunity for some new slurs. Sure.

So George Armstrong Custer is born in Ohio in 1839. Blue eyes, blonde Ohio. Supplies. He had blue eyes and blonde curly hair and he would perfume his curly hair with cinnamon oil. Yeah.

It's pretty fruity stuff. Yeah, I guess that's what you did in these days. Pre-brill cream. Yeah. And he's always been ambitious. A quote, when I was verging upon manhood, my every thought was ambitious,

not to be wealthy, not to be learned, but to be great. Yeah, he sees himself as a great figure of history. Yeah, he wants a legacy. He's the eldest of five, much as Charlie is. And I can imagine Charlie dying in a similar way.

Somehow incurring the wrath of their Native Americans. So he goes to West Point, which is like American Sandhurst. Yes. But he's also probably the worst cadet they've ever had. I think, like, statistically, the most punished cadet. What is it? He's holds his record for the most amount of demerits ever.

Someone like 700 demerits over the course of, I don't know how many, four years. How was your, how is your disciplinary record at school? Well, it was quite, yeah, it was quite bad, yeah. Especially when, because the headmaster apologized to me in my second term, because he publicly shamed me after I did a debating competition and filled it with toilet humor. Fat shamed. Not fat shamed. He didn't publicly fat shamed me.

Sorry, everyone. I just have to intervene. You're an absolute disgrace. I know you're 13 and I'm responsible for your pastoral care. You're an absolute disgrace. I can't have you in my school anymore. No, I wasn't. By this point, the great stretching had happened.

And also there was a friend of mine who I'd latched onto. You're a frontiersman. I was a frontiersman. There was a friend that I'd latched onto who was significantly fatter than me. So you looked. I made friends with him instantly in order to try and soften my own gut. So I thought proportionally he's doing me a lot of help But then I imagine that you both encouraged each other

Into worse habits Because if you're trying to hide behind this fat guy I wasn't hiding behind him I was running in front of him going look I can actually run And that makes me Where were you guys running too? Oh the tuck shot Anyway

So No I once I got in trouble for Because I was forced to play rugby And I didn't like it And so I would just I was a prop. Even though I was too tall

but I was fat so they made me a prop so I would just charge like a rhino with the Serengeti I'd just charge at people and knock them over and then I'd get sent off and sinbind

and I'd have a go at the teacher of South African so I'd have a go at him but you'd bring up some history yeah yeah yeah I'd be like you can't tell me what we're to do probably voted for apartheid sick fuck

yeah no I got quite cock because my dad was a teacher there and it was politically difficult He explains everything. Politically difficult to have a go at me. You're not someone who has felt the wrath of consequence culture. I'd never been punched in the face. Anyway, yes, my authority figures don't really mean anything to me.

Some of his demerits are for failing to have his haircut, leaving rubbish outside his tent, being late for nearly all required events, snowball fights, throwing bread at people, defacing walls with pencil marks, and swinging his arms too vigorously while marching. I mean, that's, yeah, he's taking the piss there, you know. You can't be...

Yeah, he is. He's like, oh! I'm a soldier. Yeah, I guess you can't do it sarcastically at Santos, can't you. But he's very cartoonish stuff. Very clowny sort of like, you know, you know, naughty schoolboy. He loves pranks, does Custer. He once stole a chicken at night from an officer

boiled it and left a trailer feathers from the barracks to the bin. From the barracks to the bin. Palestine will be free. That's what I... Yeah, from the river to the sea. From the barracks to the bin. Wait, I don't really get that as a prank Well, I've taken your chicken and I've boiled it

And then I've left your trail of feathers And you follow the feathers And it's in the bin that's cooked So it's like, ha ha, I've killed your chicken Prank But it's cooked, so It's boiled, you know Okay, it's a bad way to cook it

Yeah There's no seasoning Is that not a good way to cook it? Do you boil whole chickens? I have boiled a chicken, yeah I tell you what I don't know if that would work as a great prank But it's more like

The amount of effort that's gone into it It's like... The only time I boiled a chicken was following a very, very convoluted up its own ass Mexican recipe for enchiladas which, you know, takes like five hours.

You know, like, this is fucking nonsense. I just wanted you to slowly boil the chicken in like whatever... Yeah, and it tastes nice. Yeah, but it takes all day. It's not, I could have just fucking got a rotissory chicken,

just shredded it with my hands, just beat it to a pulp and then shoved it around. Yeah, exactly. Do you know what I mean? Anyway, this, I quite like this. He wants, because this is me at school. Right. do this. He once asks his Spanish teacher, how do you say class is dismissed in Spanish? When the

teacher replies, Custer just leave the classroom. I mean, that's good stuff. That's the kind of thing I would do. His luck started to wane his third year when he gets treated of a gonorrhea. I mean, how is he getting that? I suppose if is, if is West Point mail only? Is he dabbling? Maybe. Is he sipping from the devil's cup? Is he bumming the man's arse hot? Is he bumming? Is he Not that's not quite a work, is it? Is, um, yes. Is he, is he exploring the barracks to the bin? Proster shoots.

Thank you, Phoebe. He's boiled chicken. Anyway, he graduates last in his class from West Point in 1861. Yeah. So he's not a, um, you know, he's not someone who obeys orders. He's not a scholar. He is a racist, though. Although he fights on the side of the side of the,

the union. Now, we will obviously do a big deep dive into the American Civil War, but, you know, plotted history of that, basically, you know, original woke nonsense. The northern states going, you've got to stop slavery. The southerners alike, but that's our entire economy. Yeah. That's my personality. And also we quite like it. Um, that's my entire. But if I'm not that, then who am I? And then, uh, that's my thing. That's my thing. Yeah. Yeah. It's like telling Charlie can't go to sex clubs. Is that? No, that's, what? What I do then? I work and then what I just go home So he becomes a very very young

Like war hero He's like in his early 20th through the Civil War He fights on the side of the Union He has known He gets a reputation for his bold Perhaps reckless cavalry charges Personal bravery Although he reported he wouldn't send his men to do a task

That he was unwilling to do himself So by 23 becomes a brigadier general And the New York Herald Start hailing him as the boy general with the golden locks. And this is when, similar to Goering, he starts designing his own uniforms.

Right. So big hat. Yeah. Black velvet jacket. Bright red cravat. Sailor shirts. He's got a star quality to him, for sure.

Definitely. And there's a lot of generals who are very kind of mundane. Yeah. He's got something about him. He's a number 10. Yeah. But then he's,

he's very racist, but he's on the side of the union. Well, he's a product of his time. Yeah. But I don't think he even cares that much about slavery, right? It's just, he just was on that side of the line

and was one of the glory of being a military hero. I think he was anti-slavery, or rather he saw slavery as a kind of something that was in the way of his patriotism. Right. But I definitely think he's got some fairly fruity opinions about Native Americans. Sure.

Yes, Charlie. How do people respond back then, you know how like if you... You're tearing up or you just still hung over? I'm still hung over. Right, okay. If you speak out about racism nowadays, you get called woke.

Yeah. At that time, is it the same? response or is it like you're just mad? You're mentally ill. You're mentally ill. You're mentally ill. You're brain damaged.

You're mad. I don't know we should free these people. You have brain damage. Well, I think you should be institutionalised because that's an insane thing to say. That's mental. You're saying you shouldn't enslave black people. Oh, this is crazy.

This is insane. Leave the table now. You've upset my wife. My wife's crying now. My wife is crying because you said we should enslave me. Oh, brilliant. Well, look what you've done.

Look what you've done. Not in front of the women. Can we all have a nice dinner for once as a family? Say the aggressive politics. You bring your mental, mental ideas in. Christ! Haven't even got to the dessert. Sharia's crying.

My God. Yeah. No, you couldn't, that was not, you couldn't say that at the dinner table. No. You've lost it. You'd have to go to the toilet and talk to yourself in the mirror about how you thought slavery was a bad thing.

So, do that stuff to yourself. He's given command of the Michigan, Michigan Cavalry Brigade. which sounds like a slur for some gay people but anyway these were known as the Wolverines and a Gettysburg in 1863 this is the big one right this is the big one

he plays a key role in preventing the last big Confederate charge is this the big battle at the end of the war this is when Lincoln does that big address but this is the last time that the Confederates could feasibly have won the war maybe or this is the turning point

because it doesn't end until 1865 I don't think but at at this point the war then becomes the unions hunting down the Confederate troops like they're on the retreat and is this the final this is this is as far as they get the confederas I think because Gaysburg is in Pennsylvania is that right or is this is the turning point yeah Stalin grad basically there'll be American listeners twitching but also they're twitching the fucking go for a run yeah pause this and go for a run you fat fuck I know you're probably in a car because you can't you built it

you can't walk in. You've got like a stairlift for a city. You've got a massive big gulp. You're drinking a drink that is... In America, even the blocs drink big sippy cups. Yeah, the fat people from Wally. Yeah, that's who they are. That's you watching our podcast.

I mean, that is one of... That's how people consume our podcast, too either. Yeah. Just potato chips. Like, there's a time lapse of their day, and it's just, all it is, they're on the sofa and then just crisps moving. Moving around.

The only movement is their belly slightly, like... Twitching. And then the odd belch. So... He plays a part in this. He plays a key role. And he shouts, come on, you Wolverines, before leading a mounted charge. And his horse gets shot, but he just gets on another one, carries on fighting.

And yet, the final pursuit of Robert E. Lee, friend of the pod, Custer distinguishes himself. Well, you had him as a plane. Yes, he was one of my figurines. The figurines, yes, Robert E. Lee. Again, I thought at this point, he's just a cowboy. Which maybe he was. Anyway, age 25, Custer has made the youngest major general in the Union Army. That's pretty good.

Crazy, 25, Major General. And now he's obviously, you know, when the Civil War breaks out, he's mates of a lot of people from West Point who are on the Confederate side. So he exchanges mocking letters with classmates. And when he captures them, he takes a photo with them. And we're looking at them now. And I must say, these are absolutely amazing photos. So the one on the left is Custer with someone he's captured on the Confederate side.

And he's just like, he's sort of sitting there. But the guys that sort of loving it as well. Yeah. He's like, oh, I've captured him. Then the other one we found is the same pose. And it's the same pose except a small black boy is sat next to the Confederate side. And Custer's face is the most kind of like anti-racist performative thing I've ever seen. Oh, yeah.

Oh. Is that what that image is trying to say? You enslave people, do you? Look at his face here. Look at how he's sat. Look. But is that what the, so is that what the image is trying to. He's positioned the black boy next to the Confederate soldier.

And he's just going, yeah, well, this is what, this is what a, this is what a family looks like. It's the original. This is what anti-racism looks like. Yeah. That's the original woke smug face, I think. Is that what you were trying to do, though? To me, that's the only reading of the photograph. I don't know what else it could be.

Yeah. We get to the American frontier after the Civil War. So the Union tragically emerges victorious in April 1865. America can now refocus on their westward expansion and their manifesto destiny. The only problem they have with, this destiny is that there are several people in the way. Sure.

The Plains Indians. Now, we'll get more into who they are in the next episode. But there's Native Americans across each different, or the many different terrains of the west, right? But it feels like the Plains Indians, that's like our archetypical understanding of them. The great roaming bison of Montana, that yellowstone, that sort of backdrop. The Great Plains are just a very, very flat, massive. It's a step.

It's sort of the Mongolian step, but it's in... What is it, Charlie? You know, like people say, you're right, Chief? Yeah. Is that descended from the Native American? Is Chief originally only Native Americans? That's a good question, actually. It is a good question.

Let's look up... And why do we now say Chief? It's not. I don't think it is. Because I imagine all our language for the Native Americans is something we've imposed on them. Old French word, apparently. Because we don't know anything.

We can't understand what they're saying. From Chef. Meaning head. Yeah. Oh, interesting. It's like, it actually is a play on chef. Probably, I'd imagine, it's because the French are knocking about in North America and they see a Native American guy cooking and they're like,

compliment to the chef. Give them into the chef. And then someone misheres it. And that's how we get chief, probably. Anyway, so Custer becomes commander of the seventh cavalry. And he is tasked with enforcing the US laws against the Native Americans in the Great Plains. So what this basically means is he's hunting He's on a big

He's on a red skin hunt Yeah but he's treating them like Like their bison always Yes so there's buffalo everywhere Yeah All over the Great Plains But at this point you know The railroads are going

And they're sort of getting in the way All of Native American life is built around The buffalo Yes Like that's like the hunting culture That's their whole meaning But only recently actually It's not been because

No they still did it before. No, but hunting buffalo has only been a fairly recent in the long history of Native Americans only in the last 100 years or so, because they've got rifles from the American. Modern ways of hunting, they used to still hunt but just with greater difficulty, mainly

trying to push them off cliffs. Really? That's what they did before, but it was still a big part. So sneaking up behind a massive cow and just pushing off a cliff. Yeah, just intimidating them off a cliff basically. We used to go look over there. Yeah. But the problem is cows can't go downstairs, can they?

They can be kicked downstairs though, can't they? Yes, they can. They can be kicked downstairs, but they can't... You can chuck them down the stairs. So you have to... That's that why it would work is that you'd get them up the cliff. Yeah.

They'd be like, oh, fuck. Well, you just chase after them and just, you know, funnel them till they're on a cliff edge. But then pushing a cat... I mean, that's like, that's like rugby stuff. Or you scare them off?

You can't scare a cow off. But we're not talking about cows. What is a... I don't know what a buffalo is. It's pretty amazing. Buffalo wings are chickens? Get bison up. Is that because there's a city called Buffalo?

And a buffalo. and bison the same thing. Oh God. American listeners. Well, do you know what? Fuck you. You're too fat. I don't care.

Buffalo and Bison are not. It's the bison. But they call them buffaloes, don't they? Yeah, it's confusing. But it's bison. It's bison. But bison, these are fucking huge amazing creatures, but they're like

99% of the population's been decimated. But it used to be the entire planes was just lit with these massive fucking... And what would happen is that white Americans, when the railroads opened up,

they would take guns on the train and they just shoot them from the train. Is that how rapidly America's expanding it's just completely out of step with the Native American way of life. Because they keep finding gold like at West and then people are always coming away

from the Eastern Seaboard trying to set up a new life. You have the wagon trains which is people, these big trails that go across the country. But the kind of people who are doing it, it's sort of like the Brits who are leaving.

in here to go to Dubai. It is very similar actually. It's a gold rush, but it's not going to be the most upstanding people. No, it's cunts. It's a cunt magnet. It is a cunt magnet.

Yeah, the gold rush is. Yeah, and they get there. They're wearing a Jivon Shi t-shirt with fake teeth going like, the West is falling. It's great, actually. It's so great. Yeah, it's just so much easy.

I feel so much safer here. It feels so much more free as a slave is building a skyscreen. And they're like, you know, they're hiring a Lamborghini. guineas have a photo taken and then they don't even fucking gain it. These are the kind of people scumbags. The worst of the whites

are hurt. The worst of the whites If a gold rush happens, if a gold rush happens, the worst of the whites are going to come by it. Yes, yeah, yeah. Sniff it out. Yeah, exactly. With the biggest nostrils will come after you. But yeah, it's I mean, it probably would be quite fun if you're getting a train ride. Imagine getting a southern train. Oh, yeah. And then you can just

go out the window and just fucking take pot shots. That'd be amazing. It'd be fucking brilliant. anyway so in the seventh canvary Custer meets a guy called Frederick Bentine who will become very important he's another army officer and he'd served through the Civil War

but without any kind of celebrity whereas Custer is flamboyant theatrical prankster probably gay Benteen is dry blunt and deeply skeptical of showmanship so if Custer

why are you laughing Oh sorry just are you trying to make make out the line cap for Benton Deeply skeptical. I am deeply skeptical. That was you at Charlie's parties.

No, it genuinely was. Tri-blooded deeply skeptical. Is everyone trans? What's going on? He, yeah, so,

you know, if Custer is Rivaldo, yeah. Benton is Dunga. Okay. You know, you need some. Great era of references.

Well, I'm trying to, I'm trying to keep it all in the same ballpark. I don't know if I saw Dunga play. In 2002 World Cup, right? was the manager, no? Yes.

Dunga. Dunga. Thanks, Charlie. Dunga was the one... He's the one... He's the one Brazilian who was like, well, I'm going to play normally

so the rest of you fucking gay boys. He seems spiritually British. Yes. Yeah. Every Brazilian team needs one British guy behind the midfield. Pretending. He's like, well, I'm actually going to play

and the rest of you can fuck about. So he initially, Benton, when they meet in 66, he dislikes him because he thinks he's all flamboyant and arrogant and a brown. And, you know, he thinks he's sort of egotistical.

Braggot's too close to... For my liking. Yeah. I feel you can get away with it. And also the way that you... The emphasis on braggat, I feel sometimes it can... You're a brag. You fucking brag.

Yeah. I don't know. God, you bunch of braggots. Like, it's a bit like, it's a bit... Whoa. Yeah. Easy, Tiger. No, but funny to be a gay pride,

calling them all braggots, being like, you're just too showy. Yeah, because that is like a fair. Criticators, that's not like... You're too ostentatious. Yeah. For me personally, I'm not a fan of braggots. Yeah.

Especially if you're saying fan of braggers. That's dangerous, isn't it? I'm not a fan of braggots. I'm not a brand of... Anyway. Yeah, no, they are braggots. Anyway, um... Bunch of braggots.

So, although there is no insubordination, a professional coldness develops between the two. Okay. He's professionally cold. They're professionally cold. So in 67, have been Custer was promoted to the Western Frontier. And this is part of General Winfield Scott Hancock's campaign

to chase down native raiders. General Winfield Scott Hancock. Yeah. To chase down native raiders and to force them into reservations. Now, reservations are basically like, I guess, sort of camps. For center parks? Yeah, four center parks.

That's where it did feel like when I was going on a Native American reservation. Yeah, when I went center parks at New Year, I was free. Yeah. And then I was hounded onto a reservation. where I was just being repeatedly fleeced. Although, funnily enough, when we went to Centre Parks, because every time you sit,

because it's like a little community, like a little town, you go there, and it's all like all the restaurants, the restaurants you don't have anywhere else. They're like big, big gyms house of syrup or something. They're stupid,

like a pancake house, or whatever. And they ask you for your lodge number. So I basically assumed that I would pay at the end for all these meals. first day I walked out of like four restaurants without paying and then found out, oh no,

you have to pay at the end. So you just dine and dashed? Yeah, but I just thought, well, why are they asking for my lodge number if they're not going to put it? Anyway,

I then had to go back with my tail, to my legs to afford, I had to go in like a pub crawl without eating anything to pay for it all. But they all said, no, thanks for coming back. Thanks for being honest.

Yeah. Because they're all, you know, they're all fucking thick window lookers. They don't care how much money center parks, mate. They are window lookers.

They are window lookers. They are window lookers. I'm sorry to say. They are. I'm sorry to say, you're a window liquor. I'll tell you what, the windows have never been

as clean as they are. I've got some clean windows as a setterbox. Yeah, tell you that much. Anyway, so yes, the government policy at this point,

I believe the president is Ulysses S. Grant, I think. He is. Someone, if we need to get, he's a big deal. He is a big deal.

And a terrific name. Yeah. Ulysses S. Grant. He. Very pragmatic guy. Republican? Yes. Republican.

Oh, yeah. This is important. Republicans, Democrats switched. Yes. This is when the Democrats are like the nastiest, evilest racist in the world. Republicans are blue-haired. And I can already see in the comments,

they're still racist, the Democrats are racist against white. We don't care about your shit. Yeah, I don't care. We're still building HS2 over here. We've got our own things. We've got bigger fish to fry than whatever you guys are fighting about over that.

But Republicans at this point are the woke anti-slaid party. Yeah, they've all got blue hair. Yes, exactly. but it's insane I don't know how that yeah there's some switch I believe it flips in the 50s 60s just after

yeah and then Nixon's the one that really brings it home yeah I think it's something to do with finance yeah and everything anyway it was Andrew Johnson who was president at this point I was after Lincoln yeah who was seen as a bad president overall

Andrew Johnson but then Grant comes in later on the story who isn't Andrew Johnson the pedophile right winger for Man City Adam Johnson Adam Johnson sorry friend of the pod wherever you are

I hope you're doing all right Where is he? Is he in jail? Tough to be a Mascadro and not have Not been famous enough to go to the island Isn't it? Yeah Adam Johnson's new life After prison as wife's business

Goes bust and he sells off his mansion God, can't catch a break Fucking out What a left foot though It was a good player Decent And again it's a very English melancholy Isn't it?

The only player Who has been able to solve Our persistent problem With the left side of midfield is a paedophile. It's just the most sod's law, only in England. We finally found someone

who can go outside a left back and he's a fucking paedophile. Christ. Give that man a knighthood. Give that man a knighthood. Is there anything more English than a paedophile with a good left foot?

God, it's like the forbidden fruit. For years, you have to cope with Joe Cole, cutting inside. Yeah, he's not fucking nod to anyone. We've already got Lampartan and Gerald in there. We can't. It's too crowded. We need a pito in here

to fucking mix up. out. Yeah. Anyway. Put the cat amongst the pigeons. So bitters sweet. Put the pido amongst

the CDOs. Bido amongst the pigeons. Anyway, so Custer's employed to chase down native raiders. This becomes a guerrilla war. So a lot of the time people

are doing this for adventure. I guess it's like a big part is that it is kind of it fires you up, right? Oh, definitely. Yeah. Now during the conflict, Custer is missing his wife.

And so he forces his men to charge on a 50-hour march back to a fort where his wife was living. And he gets court-martialed for this. Now, we should actually take a moment. That is not bringing all your mates back just for a shag. Yeah, we should say he's a massive shagger.

Yeah. And we should talk about his wife Libby, a Libby Custer who, I believe he, they call her cunt Miss Lizzie. Right. Her name's Elizabeth. Right. So, yeah, I don't think we should be calling wives' private parts like shortened versions of their actual first name. Yeah. What on earth would you call BB?

It's worse than, call. Bebe's little boob. Well, I probably, I actually, you know, Bibi's actual name is Elizabeth. Oh, right. So I probably call it Elizabeth. Are you making more formal? Yeah, that's quite funny. Elizabeth.

It's more formal down there. Elizabeth, please. Not now, Elizabeth, not now. Bibi, please do not invite Elizabeth to dinner. Yeah, I think long-named. I don't even shorten it. So hang on, so someone's at the dinner table. They've said they're anti-slavery and for some reason, Elizabeth's crying.

So Libby is following Custer on deployment, riding with the cavalry. And they're always, they're at it the whole time. Fucking rabbits, these two. But he does love her and he clearly does, but he can't help but cheat on her. He loves cheating her as well. Well, he's a cavalry charge. Yeah.

You know what I mean? And also in this day, you know, the front, out west. I mean, cheating back in these days is fucking easy. I don't know. If someone's like a hardcore cheater now, it is so much more dexterity you need logistically. Yes.

Social media, Snapchat, find my friends. Ironically, you have to have a, female brain in order to get away with cheating as a man. Yes, because you've got to think as them. Yes, exactly. Think as the natives do. Yeah, exactly. I could not do it because personally, my WhatsApp is stressful enough as it is.

I don't need hidden. So there's a friend of my wife who had this insane story where her boyfriend of five years, she came back, he came back from a work trip and she went through his stuff because she suspected something. He had like a fucking photo album of like a holiday, been on for like three years. Don't go sappy snaps. Hard photos, you fucking idiot. Custer would have been caught with that.

Exactly. Don't be caught in ways that you could have been caught in the day. And he'd be having an entire new life. Like two relationships at the same time. But the chat was saved as a, in an WhatsApp archive. Right. Crazy.

Yeah, I don't know how you do. WhatsApp archive is not for, that's what I do when Charlie invites me to his party. I see this 250 people. I've been that. No, absolutely not. Too much information. From the barracks to the bin. From the barracks to the bin.

Yes. My first WhatsApp chat. his barracks. It's just soldiers waiting for orders. And then there's the bin. So Custer is charging out the planes with the 7th Cavalry looking for Native Americans to smash. And he's looking

them to put... He's trying to smash the gangs. Smash the gangs. Smash the gangs. And he's trying to move them all into Center Park style reservations. And they're saying, listen, the log flume alone is great value for money. Yeah. Get on the tandem bike. It's a laugh. It's fun. You know, the kids could go biking, the zip lining.

Every restaurant has a soft play. So you can actually have a pint and relax. Anyway, so in late 1868, the Cheyenne, who are a Native American tribe who will deal with in the next part, they attack a white settlement in anger over a corrupt U.S. reservation agent. I mean, this sickens, me. This is terrible, absolutely terrible. Unprovoked, entirely unprovoked. And reservation agents acted as intermediaries, and these people are trying to

distribute rations, control the trade, force the transition of native communities towards farming. And these are, you know, they're nomads, the Native Americans. They're always on the move. They're chivalrymen. Yes, they're digital nomads.

Dissus citizens of nowhere. As trust will call them. Yeah, yeah, they do a marketing job from Lisbon. Yes, exactly. Because the Portuguese government are paying them to move there. There's a reservation. There's a, at this point as well,

we should get to at the start of November 1868, there's a treaty called Fort Laramie. And this is where they basically say to the Native Americans, you can have the Black Hills, which is this very sacred site in Native American history. Which is in modern day, I think South Dakota maybe or Montana. Anyway. And so around this time,

the Americans are saying, okay, you can have, no whites will go in here, this area. Right. But just after, it's a classic white guy moved.

Just after they sign that treaty, they really fuck them up. Yeah. And this is the, what's known as the Washita attack or massacre, depending on whose side you're on. This is probably the less

romantic side of custer, maybe. This one takes, because the story has like a lot of, there's a lot of dash to it, there's a lot of courage, but this part. does.

Yeah. It's harder to see this as like, this is you're on the carpet, you're playing Germans and Jews. And then your older

brother goes, do you know what actually happened then? You went, oh, what? And you've built you've built the showers

and stuff out of Lego. I thought the Jews were just really clean. No. No. That's not what the showers were for. Anyway, so a chief,

a red Indian chief, a chiant chief, a chef called Little Black kettle. Is a peaceful chief. Pot calling the kettle black. Potchalling the kettle, little. It was a peaceful chief

who had not attacked American forces. Indeed, he had actually been working with the Americans and received a peace medal and an American flag from Abraham Lincoln. He is charged on by the 7th Cavalry in Custer on the 27th November 8th and 68. And with help from scouts, Custer's men kill about 100 Chayenne. Bentin was commanding a battalion to block escape routes. So basically they stumble onto a Native American village. Who are minding their own business. Yeah, they're just, I mean, it is the village people. It's the original village people. But they're all in the headdress.

Yeah. Yeah. This is the long road to the rich people. They all turn up and been like, well, someone should have been, how have we all turned up as this? Surely you need like a fucking builder and fucking...

Exactly. And it's from this point on that they actually start to... Diversifying. Yes. They get right. Someone has to be a builder. Someone has to be a police guy. Someone has to look insanely gay.

It's funny how they're all, they're all gay, but one of them is really going, you know, there's the guy in the black leather. Like the denim fucking cut off. Yeah. And everyone's like,

I mean, I mean, yeah, we're gay. but like, come on that way. You know, it's the 80s. You don't hide it a bit. So Custer divides his cavalry into multiple detachments,

which is a, something you're not meant to do. Divide your forces. Okay. But at this point... You're also not meant to... Sorry? You're also not meant to like,

you know, do this, massacre. Well, no, no, he has been explicitly told. Right. To... I'd just say that's not the worst of his crimes. The Native American... No, it's not.

No, it's not. You're not meant to do that. I can't believe he split his forces. he's a criminal no the I'm trying to set the scene I'm trying to

I'm trying to introduce the relevant seeds for the crescendo at Little Bighorn right right does your little big horn

ever have a crescendo anyway disappointing crescendo so Bentine who remember is professionally cold he questions Custer's wisdom

you're not meant to split forces in hostile territory right but Custer goes no, we're going to surround this village and we're going to fucking smash the gangs. And so, you know,

after the battle, Custer's like, I was right because they basically just massacres a bunch of women and children. What happened, yes, that's the thing, is that because they split the forces, all the men have gone out to meet one half of the forces. Yeah. And then Custer's forces or the other half

have gone in where all the women and children are. Yeah. And then you've got basically their entire village. So they take a load of hostages, women and children hostage, and then they butcher. or the other, there's like a decoy

force. Yeah. The Indians meet them. They attack them and then they see the hostages and they go, oh, shit. And then they move back and then, yeah.

Anyway, it's an absolute bloodbath. Yeah. And it is contested to this day as to whether we call it a massacre or an attack. Yeah. You know, the revisionists would say it's a massacre of innocent Indians.

You know, other historians would say he was robust. Yeah. He was robust on the planes. You got to have a firm hand. Now, but, But this is important the Washita massacre because it's where Kusta learns a tactic about how you defeat these nomadic Native Americans.

You rifle tower them. You rifle tower them. You take their women and children and you rifle tower them all. Now, supposedly, after the Washita battle, Kuster marries Mona Sitaa, who's the daughter of Chief Little Rock, who had been killed during the battle. now Chey in oral history which we may call indigenous gossip

that says she had two children with Custer but it is believed that Custer was sterile because it was gonorrhea so him and Libby never had kids but then his brother Thomas could have been the father there's a lot going on there's a lot going on that's the problem with oral history yeah but again the problem

I guess this is an oral history is it not is this not an oral history but yes I suppose it isn't I guess that it's if you took all your history from this basically yes yeah yeah yeah well our podcast, yes,

it is oral history, I suppose. But, so Custer is gains fame, even more fame after his expedition of the Black Hills.

Hills of color. The hills of color, as we should say now. And he has smashed, he's, you know, committed a massacre at Washita. He's maybe got

a Native American sort of side piece. Yes. Whose name is not sidepiece. Which I think in the Me Too, like revisionism of the power dynamic, I feel that's probably

quite problematic. What? I feel like the power dynamic between them, maybe it was like, you know, when like, maybe like a boss marries a secretary, it's like even if she says yes,

it's like you've held a lot of power over her. Well, yeah, but then I think, you know, you're stripping the secretary of all agency, aren't you.

You're saying you should stripping the Native American whose dad was killed by Custer. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And then she goes, well, new dad.

New dad. Daddy. I want to stay. Daddy, you know. Yeah. That's a good point. You know,

I mean, you can strip people of agency by talking about power dynamics. This is my point. You know, secretaries have agency. This is a meet cute, actually. Secretaries have agency. Yeah.

You know? And often they do work for agencies. Yeah. Because it's not a stable job anymore. No, not anymore. It's like temping is what it is now. And AI is coming for it. Yeah.

So really, actually, you want to marry the boss. No, but AI is coming for it, but you do need an attractive face in a lobby. Oh, yeah. So that's never going to go. No. A. I can't. Well, they probably could get a sex bot.

Yeah. Sex doll. Sex doll in the lobby. Hello. I'm here to. Yeah, it could be like, you know how second-hand car dealerships have that thing? Yeah. You just have that in like corporate, the bottom of J.P. Morgan, you just have that.

Yeah. But it's a big part of like how a company, if you're going in somewhere, how the lobby is, you want a hot woman who's fucking mean to you. Yeah. It sets up a nice. Big red lips. Yeah. And just is cruel. you anything,

hoop earrings and makes you go Gypsy? Do I watch for you? Yeah. Anyway. Gypsy. Um,

um, so Custer has committed a massacre perhaps in 1868. Custer's busted. Custer's busted all over Native Americans. And the black hills, the hills of color have been designated as a Native American

reservation. They're just for them. Yeah. Okay. This ends up being one of the main causes of the Battle of Little Big Horn, the Yankee Diddled Rourke's Drift, which we are fast approaching.

In our next episode, we will deal with who are these Native Americans? Are they actually Indian? Maybe they are. And we will build... Send bobs. Send bobs. Send bobs was a chief.

Chief Senbobes. Hull. A hole big are your bobs. Chief British Princess. Oh, can I see your bobs? Anyway we'll do it the next episode

and we'll build up to the battle and big horn and the little big horny more like Bob horny little Bob horny

anyway where an army of hawny Indians finally defeat the Americans which is probably coming finally someone actually sends

Bob's to these fucking yeah the cut the cut customers bobs off anyway the entirety of this

four part series of Cowboys and Indians is on our Patreon and on our patron this fortnight we'll be dealing with the history

of Mormonism we'll be tackling a major religion for the first time obviously that's behind a paywall so that's on the page where for three pounds

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if not we'll see you if not we'll see you next time as we delve into some absolute voodoo nonsense with our Native American friends. Ben bobs. Ben bobs.