Fin vs History - xG (Expected Genocide) | Pol Pot (Part 3/4)

Episode Date: November 10, 2025

Now in power, the Khmer Rouge get to work eradicating everyone with glasses with a strike rate that is truly Aguero-esque    The show for people who like history but don't care what actually happened.  For weekly bonus episodes, ad-free listening and early access to series, become a Truther and sign up to the Patreon ⁠patreon.com/fintaylor CHAPTERS: 00:00 Jungle Peter Pan 03:54 Year 0 09:57 Cambodia Becomes Hackney 13:46 Your Life is Your Spoon 18:47 Impure Intellectuals 21:34 Agüero of Genocides 23:57 Original Squid Game 31:00 French Cricket Originates Here 37:10 I Was Going Through a Rough Patch 44:16 Pol Pot Emerges Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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grab an O. Henry bar to satisfy your. hunger with its delicious combination of big crunchy salty peanuts covered in creamy caramel and chewy fudge with a chocolatey coating swing by a gas station and get an oh henry today oh hungry oh henry welcome back to finn'n'n'n'r History. I'm sorry, Charlie, you've opened a can. As I'm fucking introducing people.

I'm here with the ratio goals. Hello. Oh, and this is part three. Sorry, Charlie's been especially frustrating in the break. Charlie's been very frustrating, boast of replacing this series. He's getting worse. He's not getting better.

No. You think a big part of setting up a company like this is you get people young and you train them up. Yeah. And you reap the rewards of investing in. talent. You have trained me. We've invested

to the laws of you, Charlie. No, you're not. And he's getting worse. You're not learning on the job. You're giving me chocolate. He's getting more complacent.

I mean, you were asking about wanking in the new chair. We've got a new office with a lovely chair that Finn has bought from his uncle's house. My wife's uncle's house. Wife's uncle's house,

nonetheless. You can't wank in that chair. You can't wank in that chair. He says if I wank in that chair, if I bust in that chair, I'm fired. And if he does, and if I'm fired,

I will kill myself. So it's a bit of a, Mexican standoff because Charlie is refusing to back down on the busing in Finn's chair. I'm going to say puku myself if you fucking find me. It's part three of Pol Pot. Sorry. It's the juiciest this gets. It is. It is. And we spent the

first two minutes talking about why Charlie wants to wank in my new chair. I know. Because I want to feel like I'm you. But genuinely But genuinely... But genuinely... I'm not wanking in the chair. I want to be you. Part three. Right. Welcome back to to Finn versus History. This is part three.

of the Pol Pot story This is the big one This is what we've been waiting for It's part three It's the Cambodian genocide This is a bit where you don't need A lot of it's like You need to understand

The content and stuff like This is more like You don't need to know that much To really get what this is about It's quite like clear That's what says in the tin Oh what was he thinking Oh right

Okay fine Now we left off Pol Pot had and his boys The Lost Boys Similar to Peter Pan Yeah They're in a forest, they're in a jungle, right? They're in the jungle. It's jungle

Peter Pan. Yeah. And they walk into Phnom Penh. Pol Pot, Peter Pan. A lot of peas in the story. Yeah. And now it's a Pido refuge. Pido Palace. Yeah, it is a Pido Palace. Pido Palace. Pido Palace. Is that Livia is that? I don't think it is that. It's the B-side. Is that what David Harbour was doing? Is that why she left in? I wouldn't be surprised. No, that bloody pig of a man. Right. Um, anyway, Pol Potts boys have stormed Phnom Penh. The capital of Cambod

dear and they told everyone to fuck off inside two hours right everyone's got to laxative yeah everybody out now fuck off colonic knocking the door hello fuck off fuck off you're right mate fuck off fuck off fuck off how about you fuck off i'll tell you what would be fun is being the people kicking everyone out well i was just thinking i'd love to do that yeah you i don't care wouldn't you love to go out someone's house knocking the door and go fuck off it's my house you heard me fuck off that does sound really fun yeah it's like the opposite of a jehovah's witness you knock in the door you tell them to fuck on. Can you leave me alone?

When you fuck off? I'm knocking on people's doors. Can you stop fucking bothering me and get the fuck out of your own house? This is my house. I know. Fuck off. It's mine now. Now, to get you back up to speed, he's a Marxist brackets. He's not, he doesn't understand it. He's an atheist. He's a Cambodian nationalist, but even the idea of Cambodia is not really a thing. There's a Gaddafiism here. There's definitely a good doubt. He's very thick. Yeah, the green mixing. There's a lot going on.

The fruit juice. He's vibing it. The smoothie of ideology. He renames the. country, Democratic Campagia. Gaddafi move as well. Again, blah, da-da-da-da-da-da. And on April 17th, 1975, the day he kicks everyone out of Palom Pen. Pol Pot declares this as Year Zero.

It's never good. Year's never ended up being good. The clocks have gone back. There's never once been a good year-zero. Hard reset. Yeah. Basically. Finger up the ass, finger in a mouth.

Remember when Charlie wasn't recording that one time? Yeah. It's like that, but for 5,000 years of history. Yeah. Year Zero. By the way, I wasn't recording. going to have to start that all over again. Literally, it's 1975, knocking your door.

It's zero now. What? What? So if you set the clocks to Cambodian time. But I was, you were what? Nothing happened before. Yeah. But I was, just what?

How could you? Fuck off. This is the first thing that's happened. Ignore all that. This is it. This is it. This is all that's ever happened. This is the start now.

Start again. Start again. Let's start again. Start again. I hate it how that started. Yeah, let's start again. Let's start again. So his idea is that the old society is rotten because it's corrupted by capitalism.

Fair enough. And people, even though it's not really... Colonism. Education. Yep. Corrupting. Education. Corrupting these poor innocent rice farmers. Yeah. Don't tell them how to read. Yeah. It's like, don't give Charlie too many computers.

Yeah. He'll corrupt it. He's pure of mind. He's pure of mind? Yeah. I belong to the soil. You belong to the soil. You do. Fuck the soil. Now, Pol Pot wants to erase history.

Delete. Class, money. Religion and family ties. Imagine. And just start again. John Lenin's imagine. that deleting family ties i'm on board with yeah every day i go back to my family this is year's hero who you get out my house who are those kids fuck off fuck off go to the country start start working

yeah go on out fuck off now what what i think's interesting is normally when you have these like it would be like some institutions or something this bullet point here all institutions and traditions were dismantled yeah everything everything everything start again to be fair and they're right it's all gone it's all gone surely no it's gone maybe there's no schools Done. Corts. Done. Gone.

Banks. Gone. Music. Gone. And don't even talk about music. Music is abolished. Yeah. Now, what was Cambodian music before this?

Not very good. I'll tell you what. Look, I'll tell you what. For the whole region, you know, I have frequent to sell these days a lot. So he's my father now abodes there. He's a sex resident. Sorry. He's a sex resident visa.

He's on a sex resident visa? He's a sex resident. Oh, congrats. Has he got his sex citizenship? Oh, fair play. He's a citizen. The music there is terrible. Yes.

You know, I think it's a great culture. There's a lot of great stuff, but they cannot make music. Get any Vietnamese pop music is some of the terrible. You say that, Kranben are Thai funk influenced. Now, the Thai funk's in the 70s, that's quite good. Okay, maybe some Thai stuff, actually, to be fair. It's not, it's not, no, it's, no, it's, there's a lot of melody, not a load of rhythm. It's not any fat bass.

No. Fat bass actually was a member of the communist project. I think he changed his name to Fat Bat. Fat Bat. Do you know what, actually I'm getting into it Okay, fine Yeah, the music's not good in South East Asia But then their voice, their language is very musical

Yes, but their music is very languageable Yes, exactly So, he changes the national anthem To something that's probably just as bad Currency, private property And the concept of trade Gone, gone, out Destroyed, the concept of trade

Well, a lot of people are saying how, like, you know, the Trump's second term, he's doing, he's acting fast. He's actually getting, to be fair, he's getting stuff done. Yes, yeah. Like a lot of times, a new, they pitch a lot in their manifesto, and then it just stays the same. He is doing a lot of big changes quick. No, but normally a government comes in and they build on what the last government did

and maybe they reverse some things, but he's undoing quite a lot. Yeah, but he's crossed out everything. He's been dynamic in a way. Very dynamic. Yeah. No one can accuse him of not been dynamic. You know, if you look at the Northern Powerhouse

where people were trying to put more jobs into rural areas, he did that in two hours. Yeah. Northern Powerhouse. Fuck off. Open the door.

Fuck off. Go. Move. HS2. I'm in. Fuck off. Trains are banned. Fine.

All right. Well, that's that done. Yeah. Because what I look like is the inertia of not knowing when HS2 is going to happen. You won't be waiting

for a train because it won't ever come. Yeah. No trains. Trains will never be delayed again because they don't exist. Well, you got rid of train delays.

Brilliant. Well done. Families are separated because you're meant to be loyal to Angar, which means sort of the organization. Is that a tool linked to Angkor work? Yeah, it is. So your parents and your spouses are...

This is a classic communist move. Yeah. Destroy the family unit. The family unit threatens the state unit. Basically, you shouldn't have a family because your family is the state. Yeah. We're all one massive family.

Yes. A family is basically like private property in a way. It's seen... To some of us, yeah. You're sitting... Like, the head of a family is seen like a landlord in a communist sort of mindset. Abolished landlords.

It's a private holding. Abolished dads. Yeah. Is what you're saying. Kill all Das. Yeah. Dads of landlords. Yes.

Oh yeah. I mean, literally did. Fucking, now, this is how much language is policed, right? Talk about pronouns. They delete the first person pronoun. Right. You can't say I. You can only say we.

So Charlie wanking in your chair. We wanked in my chair. Yeah. That takes away the power dynamic, right? So you wouldn't say like, I'm a he, him, you or she, her. You say, we, we, we, we, we are we, we, we are we, we. and you're a wee-wee. No, there's no yore, is there?

No, it's not, it's we, us and them. It's we, it's just we, us and them. It's we and what, is, it's all, we and we. No, it's we, we in Vietnamese, and we kill them. They can't call the parents' mother or father, because Pol Pot says mothers shouldn't get to attach, because familial love is selfish and sentimental. I agree with him on some points.

Yeah, the bollocks. What, it's bollocks? Familiar love. Yeah, it's bollocks. It's bollocks. Daddy, I love you. What a load of shit. You're chatting, complete shit.

Fuck off. Go on. In the countryside, go. Fuck off out of here. Join the queue. So time is literally reset. So stop all the clocks, wind them back. Everything before 1975 is considered meaningless or sinful.

Right. Again, you know, I would say, historically, before 1930, I sort of agree with that. The Khmer Rouge have a vision of a utopian society, which involves the total abolition of money, as we've said. So there are just piles of money everywhere. because it's completely meaningless. It doesn't mean anything.

It's just burning. It's burning piles of money. It's fuel, basically. So one official says we must burn the old grass so that new grass can grow. I guess, yeah? There's logic there. Yeah, and agricultural peasants

are deemed the only economic force of the revolution. They want to become totally self-sufficient because there's been this whole thing about them constantly having rice from Thailand or Vietnam. They're always buying rice from their neighbors. Totally self-sufficient, but everyone makes rice.

Yeah. So the only thing they'll have self-sufficiency over is rice. Right. Yeah. So as soon as, within days of them storming Pnom Pen, everyone's fucked off. They empty all the banks. They burn all the money. They shut down all the markets.

So no wages. Every citizen receives food and supplies directly from communal stores. And so life becomes purely based on barter and collective distribution. Now, you know how Mao at this time is doing the Great Leap Forward? Yeah. Pol Pot says, well, I'm doing the Super Great Leap Forward. Really? It's called the Super Great League forward.

Yeah. The number one best policy ever. Number one, super great leap forward. Super best fried policy of all time. Extra, extra good, great leap forward. Yeah. So he's trying to outpace Mao's China by going even faster. This is when he meets Mao in Beijing.

And Mao's like, brother. Brother. Just chill out a little bit. Yeah. Because Mao's going like, that's a bit nuts. Yeah. Because Mao's in his old age and Mao's looking back and he's thinking, if I have any a price, I went a bit fast.

Yeah. Too much too soon. Yeah. And Pol Pot's like, fuck that, brother. Nah. Fucking foot to the accelerator. It's the recklessness of youth, isn't it? Yeah, it is.

But he's doing this all from the jungle at this point, or is he now in Phnom Penh? He's now in Phnom Penh, but no one knows who he is. Still no one knows. And this is why he's a hard dictator to love because he's not that much of the character. We don't know enough about him. He's just got a big smile. Is he still got a good schizierkeek? Yeah.

I guess he staccaneos everyone out of their house. Yeah, he scissik's two million people out. So the economy collapses overnight, obviously, but it doesn't really matter because there's no, there's no, there's no. economy right what the financial times oh no it's down oh the markets are down right we've got bigger fish to fry the markets are closed so cities are emptied all commerce ceases medical supplies disappear there's no mechanism for exchange yeah so when people are like oh it's never you know what if we just abolish money man yeah it turns out that what the currency then becomes your reputation right so everyone just starts going he's gay or whatever or he's annoying and blah and then

talking and it becomes like the stars again everyone's just tatel telling so they start basically going oh I don't like him he said something bad about you yeah and then he gets killed classic moves and so basically money just gets swapped for fucking killing people

foreign observers later call this the only modern attempt at total economic demonetisation yeah because I guess anything there's not anything is extreme this anywhere no this is a logical end point this is your first year uni student at Luffra go and fuck it man we don't need money yeah let's just go for it

fuck it what if we didn't have any money pot described money as a disease of urban society yeah it is very uni saying that the revolution would cleanse the people of selfishness and corruption well in a way if there's no people there is no selfishness but he makes everyone wear black he makes women cut their hair short

and he says that you can only have he bans beer and you have to have artisanal Cambodian plum wine so it's basically turning everyone into hackney right he turns the country into fucking Everyone's a non-binary. Everyone's non-binary. Everyone wears black.

Everyone gets their hair cut. Got to drink wanky coffee. They shop from cos. That's basically it. He just makes the entire country hack me. Terrifying. The only possession anyone is allowed is a spoon.

Fair enough. I mean, so he shows a little bit of vulnerability there, a little bit of weakness. Yeah. He's trying to go the whole way, but he's still... You've got to have a spoon. So basically, you're leaving the house, Cambodia,

in the 70s. Spoon, yeah. If I was trying to get rid of Pol Pot, I'd use that against him. I'd be like you don't actually believe in the revolution you're giving them spoons If you were a real communist

You wouldn't even have a spoon Yeah Communion has never been tried properly I'd say he's an enemy of the people For giving a spoon So everyone had a spoon And clothes were communal So yeah all you had was

A spoon That was it That was it That was your spoon So you had a house No furnishings You had a house with like a bit on the floor And a spoon

And that was your stuff I'm moving house I forgot everything You get removal's in No it's just a spoon, isn't it? What do you think Cambodian...

It's just putting a spoon in a different room? Cambodian episode of extreme hoarders. What would that look like? Fucking cut the redraw. Yeah. Antiques road show

in Cambodia. This is a fucking spoon from 20 years ago? Yeah. Go on, Charlie. What is your item you're going to keep? If you can only have one thing

forever. If you're... In charge. Yeah. Well, so this is the only thing that I can own. You can have one thing. Whoopy cushion. No, but I mean,

Imagine you got a whoopie cushion and it's like you're on the queue everyone's about to die and then you manage to bring a lot of levity. Every day. Well, there's nothing else. I love farts.

That's a lot though, isn't it? Yeah, I mean, I think it's spilled and funnyness. It's very tragic about one person living on his home with a whoopi cushion What other comedy is there? What other comedy?

On his own and a house. Well, I'm not doing it on my own. But if you didn't have a spoon... I'm not sitting on it on my own. If you didn't... A spoon and a spoon, you didn't get to eat. You couldn't even eat with your hands. Yeah, I've got a spoon.

No, you're not allowed to both. No, this is instead of a spoon. You can't eat with your hands, though. No, you can't. You're not allowed. Foraging, fishing and hunting a band, even if you were seen to be picking up a piece of fruit off the floor, don't drop anything.

A 10-year-old, listen to this, a 10-year-old gets caught digging up a sweet potato with his hands, he gets put into a hut, and the hut gets set on fire. Oh, for them. No, no. I mean, that's fucking mad. He what? He digs a sweet potato out the ground,

because he's probably quite hungry. he gets caught doing it is he gets put in a hut and then they burn the heart down for digging up a sweet potato yeah that's a set out punchline it is quite funny why am I just in the heart

oh the hut's on fire women are accused of stealing rice right to eat it and so to prove that you know judge during executioner they go right I reckon you've eaten some rice

she goes no I haven't they go well let's have a look cut open her belly cut open her stomach there's no rice in it so she goes well fair enough you're innocent

but then she does yeah she's dead oh no an innocent person died now the Cambodians had always been had an element of brutality to them yes because in what in the also they've been through like 20 years of civil war the philip short book he says that the cambodian people they firstly they don't see uh lying as a moral thing they see the truth

it's not like immoral to lie it's convenient it's like the truth is the truth is the concept again this is what his opinion is cambodian people so who knows yeah he also says that they are very um genial and non-confrontation in general in general and then but then when they when it gets bottled up or the anger it gets released in these insane moments of violence it was done through the civil war was throughout the whole entire history that whole thing with the eating the person's kidneys livers livers so they in the 60s they kill they start lynching police officers they kill they kill they kill two MPs and cut the livers out and cook them yeah in the street but in general

they're quite sweet that's their equivalent they're quite mild-mannered in general but then it all comes out yeah exactly so the equivalent here is when like Prescott got egged or something Farage gets a milkshake. In Cambodia, they would have cut his liver out and eating it in front of them. Less silly. You've only got a spoon

that your life is your spoon. You love your spoon. Yeah. Everything you own. In here it's Wollockhke's phone. In Cambodia, it's a spoon. Right, let's go. You got your spoon?

Oh, fuck, where's my spoon gone? Can you ring my spoon? Don't even have a bowl to chuck your spoon in when you go through the door. No, you literally just always, do you have pockets? I guess.

You have pockets, but then you don't own... What's like laundry? What's happening with like... Because you don't own the clothes? But it's where they're getting it from? Everyone is forced to dress. The state. The state, do it.

In pyjamas. Yeah, basically. Black pajamas and sandals that are made from car tires. And the red and white, the Kramer, Kramer, cram-ar scarf, whatever. So basically, the more poor you look, the more pure you are. Yeah. So the more proper you are. And you're working all day with these tire sandals.

It is kind of the original hipsters, really. I guess so, yeah. Burkest stocks. Yeah, dressing up as holas at uni. Yeah, that's genuinely, that's the Khmer Rouge. That's the Coz-Kermer Rouge. range. Yeah.

Oh, nice. Yeah. That's literally what they look like. Yeah. How much are they selling that for? 75. 75, just for the trousers.

Yeah. Yeah, just for the trousers. Yeah, so all in, that's probably like... 110? Yeah. Yeah. And you were getting that for free and... Yeah.

It's not too bad. And a spoon. Oh, with a spoon. And you've got a spoon with it. Yeah. Now, intellectuals are targeted because they represent the urbanized. And therefore,

if you're urban, you're impure. Because the Khmer Rouge are all about jungle commies. rice farmers rural purity rural purity so factories are shut down hospital schools

universities anyone who's qualified threat yeah so to be fair what's interesting is that Khmer Rouge was led by intellectuals

right so it's from that class relatively speaking yeah so that they were the threat to the regime they overtook so the reason why they viewed them such a threat is because they knew what they did yes so if there's going to be any

you know revolution it's going to come from the... Can you read? Yeah, right, in the bin. Get in the bin. Yeah. So you can really do well as an idiot. Charlie would do, I believe.

Do you know what I mean? That's what I mean. Of all of us, you would have survived this. Yeah, you'd be, like, you'd be promoted. Your brother number two. Yeah. In no time. I was born in the wrong time.

This is the purest man I've ever met. They were an unthinking person who is happy to just have a spoon. I mean... And also, the way that every time we eat anything, if it's a nice meal or a terrible meal, Charlie's like, this is banging. You'll be eating a tight, like a thimble of rice being like that...

You've said this before that Charlie eating is the meme of the dog eating dog food for the thousandth time, but he's unbelievable. Yeah, Charlie eats like a dog. He cannot believe it. How has he done this again? He never misses this guy. He opens the tin and he never fucking misses. Yeah.

This tripe. I've only ever seen you defeated by ham salad. That was the old time. You were ham salad once and you were so sad you had to leave. Yeah. Yeah. I love everything. I love eating pretty much everything.

Yeah. So you would have been fine Is it the ideal citizen They would have gone right They would have gone rice And you were like fuck I've got my spoon And my rice

I fucking love this man Fucking brilliant I've got a spoon Isn't it great This is unbelievable Living it I've got my own spoon You know

Life is just so fucking great Isn't it You got a spoon You get rice Maybe Probably not Probably not You know

They put me up in the countryside I fucking love it out here It's great What a treat What a treat Thanks Paul so all formal education is stopped children stop going to school

and they're separated from their parents and they get put into labour camps banging that's crazy and they become soldiers essentially because a lot of the Khmer Rouge are just, it's like child soldiers and he forms of secret police

called the Santibal I mean any communist regime has a secret police function yes yes I just don't know how good the Cambodian version of that is because a lot of the time communist secret police there's quite a sophisticated organisation right

yeah but I guess it's like It's quite easy. They're listening in, but they're using those baked bean can with a wire like that, go, what's he saying? Yeah. And now we crack into the genocide. Oh, lovely.

Steak is served. So this is over a four-year period from 1975 to 1979. Extraordinary statistics. Yeah, I just say. Over a short period of time. Remember, this entire four years, no one's in Phnom Penh.

It's less than four years. It's three years, eight months. Okay. Right. Extraordinary numbers. Right. So even better. goals per game ratio.

The XG on this genocide, expected genocide, is phenomenal. Yeah, because we obviously talk about Mao being the goat because of his pure numbers, but he was like a Shira figure. Yeah. Shira got 260 whatever goals, but he did that over 500 games. 260 goals are such a big number. And then... I reckon it's more like 80s.

You're Shira course tonight. 260 Shira course. But then if you look at Aguero's goals per game, he never won Golden Boot once, but it's better than Henri. He's, he's, this is, Pol Pot's the iguerro of genociders. Right, okay. Like, the underlying stats are quite unbelievable, but he doesn't quite get the flowers he deserves.

Yeah. So, let's go through the numbers. Nearly two million Cambodians are killed by the Khmer Rouge under the leadership of Pol Pot. 81% of all violent deaths are male, a tragedy. So he's, yeah. People say there's a patriarchy. You know, it's complete bollocks.

70% of Cambodian's working age men are killed. So 70% of the most important kind of productive economic class. Yeah, are destroyed. Nearly 20,000 Vietnamese people are forced to stay in Cambodia after the Indochina War. They all are executed. The Khmer Rouge also break across the border into Vietnam several times. They kill around 30,000 Vietnamese citizens.

So just spilling out. It's like a bar fight spilling onto the street. Exactly. Yeah. There's the Bar-Chuk massacre, which sees over 3,000 citizens murdered in 12 days. That doesn't read as that shocking to me. No, it's a drop in the ocean, I just found out 2 million people

died 3,000 over 12 days I mean obviously they've got to keep these numbers up yeah so I've seen that's kind of what's going on every week yeah in the eastern zone the area's the border Vietnam around quarter of a million are killed on the basis that they had been contaminated by Vietnamese people so this is when you have

if you have Vietnamese tendencies which I don't know what on earth that is you like a barmeet or something if you're seen eating a barmee dead out out so they wouldn't be saying stop the boat stop the foe stop the foes yeah So we get to the sort of, I guess, the, what would you call it? Badong-Badong-Belso.

You could call it that. The kind of, the concentration campbell of this genocide. So this is, yeah. Bidong-Badalcum. But is this like the Mengler? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So Mengler who was doing all experiments. The Angel of Death.

Yeah. Facts of experiments on Jewish people during World War II. This is Cambodia's version. So there's a guy called Comrade Doik. That's how you say it, right? Kang Keck Liu. Is it an eye or is an eye? Cankechew.

He doesn't see in that evil. Yeah. I also, I really like, in all the photos you see, the war criminals, I really do like their double, double breast pocket shirts. Yeah. Because they look like my granddad. Yeah. I used to wear starch, white shirts with two pockets. Okay, so there's a nice, pen in them.

Yeah, a nice aesthetic. They all look like my granddad, basically. I'm voting war criminals. Anyway. comrade doyke oversees this prison called doyke it looks like they stole is when you steal someone's spoon doyke

um yeah he does a bit more than that he runs the S-21 sounds like a boy band yes oh it's a K-pop band it's a Cambodian pop S-21 now this is in an old school no it's not Brian Harvey

running himself over from 17. He went to his granny's house and he had too many potatoes and then ran himself over. What? Did he have too many potatoes? Brian Harvey went to his nans and had two many jacket potatoes. He ran himself over? No. He was so full he was trying to throw up out his window and then... Wait, wait. He had so many jacket potato. Is he...

He accidentally pressed the accelerator and he was driving in a cul-de-sac. felt sick because he went to his grannies and had too many jacket potatoes filled with like beans and... I didn't know. So it's quite extraordinary accent. That's a very rare thing to happen. Yeah, the stars are hard to do. The stars have really got to align for that time. Jacket potatoes.

I don't know of anyone who's ever eaten so many potatoes that they've had like a drunk driving accident. That's what's phenomenal. I didn't know, I knew he ran himself over. I did not know the potato angle. Crazy. He ate too many potatoes. I think, I personally, I would say,

and I'm a fat fuck of the best of times, I would say one jack of potato is arguably too many. Yeah. It's too much. They're big fucking units. How many jacketas do you think you did? Yeah. Four?

Four jacket potatoes. They're huge, those things. Yeah. particularly if you're stuffing them full of shit so be careful out there guys shattered pelvis and was in a cone for weeks my god he might he uh he has since

recovered and he still loves potatoes well it's a happy story I guess anyway so be careful so I don't know how on earth we got there but we're now talking about the the kind of the Auschwitz of the Cambodian genocide called S-21 yeah 20,000 people go through its doors

of them only 12 people are known to have survived right So it's sort of like a squid game. Yes, it is squid game. You're right. It's literally, this is the original squid game. Takeshi's castle. Instead, it's...

Pol Potts' castle. Pol Potts Torture School. Yeah. So it's... The school is adapted into S-21 and about April 76. Classrooms are converted into cells, interrogation rooms. Now, and you had to... If you're a prisoner, you had to go to the toilet in ammunition boxes.

And when they overflowed, the guards made you lick it... and drink it and eat the shit and stuff Is that self-sufficiency In a way I guess, you know Eco-friendly I mean you've got your spoon

So Oh I'd absolutely hate that I'd hate that Yeah Charlie's making this mind up Charlie, Why are you typing in flights to Cambodia You know it's already

It's cheap, lads It's cheap And where is this I've already got a spoon I'd fit right in this is brilliant first right now my own shit my own shit

I fucking love this place can I live here yeah it's a prison brilliant fucking brilliant so what you'd have to do they hate you they're trying to do torture methods

and nothing so what they do is if you're in the prison you're an enemy of the regime and they get you to write a forced confession of alleged crimes right so you have to describe your personal background which is I'm I don't know maybe I read a book once

yeah fuck you fucking idiot idiot. Yeah. Right. Um, they then have to chronologically retell their crimes, which are all fabricated. Then they confess the crimes. A list of the names of other people, their from mates are also. Yeah, they've got to dobb in. And then they were then brutally tortured while they, while they were either shackled to the floor or their bed. Right. Right. Now, bullets are too expensive slash there aren't that many of them. It's true. So all of this is done by hand. You know, DIY back to basics. It's back to basics holocaust. It's the artisanal holocaust. It's, you know

Organic Organic farm fed Smallholding Small batch Yeah it's small batch stuff Yeah You know The mass

Sort of mass consumer produced holocaust The McDonald's The McDonald's You know The tasteless capitalist Drive through McDonald's genocide Mom and Pop Yeah exactly

This is small business Just get it Support local businesses my bare hands so it's just it's guards right with their fists just beating two million people to death right right

just bare hands so they're just at it constantly so sticks pipes pickaxes tree branches uh electric shocks testicles ears charlie's guy's searing hot metal he's going to fuck this place is amazing guys they would suffocate

them with plastic bags hang them they put out your nails they'd sleep deprived and then this one just feeding two or three spoonfuls of shit oh my god uh force feeding water torture they'd like they'd put them in tanks of water and then they'd even they were in the records they were recording how long it took a body to float after it drowned like they're doing all these kind of experiments and that sort of sense collecting data they'd force prisoners to raise Raise their arms for full days. Do you know what I mean? I do that with my personal trainer.

He gets me to do that. But for like a minute. Do you call it, so you mean your David Lloyd is like S-21? Yes. I say, who are you? Pol Pot. Hanging prisoners upside down. That's one of your exercises as well.

The Pol Pot, yeah, yeah, it is. Well, there's that thing of like a Turkish get-up and a Bulgarian and a Russian twist. If it's an exercise that's got an Eastern European preface, you know it's going to be really bad. Yeah, sure, sure. So this is just a Cambodian get-up, which is where you're hanging upside down and then it'll electrocute your balls. And all that's excellent.

I guess it's your core strength. What we're doing today, Tyreek? Cambodian get-ups. Oh, fuck. All right, then. I guess you're going to really electrocute my balls again. Babies and children are separated from their parents, transported to the killing fields.

No, I'd avoid those. Yes, I again. Can I go to the living fields, please? I'd like to go to the living. And the killing fields, you know, what I find, when my dad was going to Cambodia a lot, not in the way your dad was, he um he would talk to me about the killing fields and i'm kind of i must be in this sort of like

14 15 and i'm like it sounds so romantic yeah the killing it sounds like a country and western song sure yeah take me back to the killing fields is it does killingfield sound romantic you know it just i don't know if killing fields does sound romantic i just think of sting i think of sting do you know what i mean fields of gold yeah but that's not the same i know i think killing fields is dramatic i I don't think they're romantic. But it feels, you know, you've got the industrialized source

of the concentration camp. Powerful word, horrible, ugly. Romantic. The killing fields. So what they do, and this is pretty gnarly, is they throw babies against trees. Which is not cricket,

although they're clearly trying to approximate it. And again, they're bowling babies against trees. And, you know. So they're doing nets with babies and trees. But what I would say is that if this is the French, the French didn't introduce cricket Right, well there's French cricket

That's exactly it The French cricket originates here But if it had been the English The Brits, they would have given Cambodia a cricket set They wouldn't have had to do this Right Because they would have had a ball and stumps But in the absence of that

The Cambodians are like, you know, it's Indochina They're near India They're like, what are they doing over there? That looks fun Right Anyway, go on I sometimes worry about Like if I was a guard here Yeah

I can sort of see how you get to a point where you're, like, doing mad shit. Definitely. Because you're just in control. You'd start thinking, like, they are nothing. You could, you know, it'd be fun to play with them. Yeah. No, definitely. I mean, this is the case.

All these things. It's Lord of the Flies. It's complete. It's mad how quickly you could just turn into this, like. It's not that all Cambodians are evil at all. Or even the people who did this. It's like a mass. If that's the world that's now been, that's become norm.

It's a big brother. It's you delete everything. Yeah. Social experiment. But also it's like. You put Jade Good. You put Jade Goody in the house. But also, if you think about it, all currency and reputation and status has been flipped.

So the only state is, if you're a cadre with the power, suddenly all of, that's where all the currency is. Because if you're the one deciding where the rights is, of course you're going to get an absolute killer. Yeah. Well, what Philip Short says in his book is that Cambodians are just, they have that in them in the society. Because they live in the jungle and they have a kind of, they have this bubbling undercurrent of like extreme violence that lashes out. Yeah, that bit did seem a little dated. Yeah. Yes, it is dated.

It's an old book. It was an old book But the guy who did S-21 In the same way that There's a discussion How you know in China When there is We did it in our Mao series

There's the famine In the 50s And people resort to cannibalism Yeah There's something about cannibalism In Chinese ancient culture As like The worst thing

Or it's like something that happens In hard times So it's like not as shocking in the Chinese sense of themselves. Or it's more like a touchstone of a bad time. Right. So in the same way that I think what Philip Short was trying to say

is that the sheer violence of this is for the Western, you know, enlightenment long, we're like, this is not cricket. But there's none of that, they don't have that same thing in Canada. It's maybe what he's trying to say. Yeah.

Because it, but they're also... It comes from a different, yeah, a different route. The ideology grows on a different... Yeah, different tree. Different tree. They also even, I think this, chronologically, this would have been in the last episode. There's a moment where they get some kids who they find doing something.

And they cut their heads off in public with the fucking severed fronds of a palm tree. Yeah. Which must have taken ages. Well, in that documentary we watched enemies of the people. Yeah. They get the guys who did it to reenact it, right? Yeah. And yes, they pull the head back as tight as possible and they slice the neck so that they can't scream.

Yeah. Because if you're holding like this, when you cut the neck, you can't. There's no sound. Your vocal cord. Yeah. So everyone's, their hands are bound and they're lying on the floor and you get on top of them. Like you would for a massage. Yes.

But said you get their head and then you slice it. Time massage. Good. Cambodian massage. Yeah. Very bad. Sad ending. Now, the medical unit at S-21 would just...

Medical? Yes. Right. Not in our sense of the word. Okay, fine. They would kill people just by just trying something. This is like free jazz. Right.

Modal jazz. Modal jazz. where it doesn't really make sense, but it's still technically jazz. Yep. So they'd... Is there a rhythm section keeping this all together?

No, there's not rhythm. That's the problem. Okay. There's no baseline of thumping bullets. Right, right, right. So a guy, they just cut people open. They just cut people or just let them bleed out

and see how long it took for them to just completely bleed. So they've got like a stop watch. They're doing a lot of... Yeah. Time trial. This is horrible. Hey?

It's like a bleep test. I told you, it was bad. And I wanted you said the last episode? I love this guy. No, I don't like it anymore. Yeah, I told you. that's why we said wait till you get to this bit

the romance of the killing fields in the killing fields organs removed without anaesthetic because Charlie does no research for any of this it's like you'll hear this for the first time you get a live reaction but didn't you go to the killing field you've been to Cambodia

yeah but none of this was happening when I was there well I know yeah but then you go to a museum or something or see loads of skulls yeah do you see the skulls I think I saw some skulls I saw the trees that they bashed the babies into Right. Yeah. Fucked.

The stamps. I saw the stump. Fuck. Okay. Tortures so atrocious and heinous. The prisoners tried every way to commit suicide, even using the spoons. I mean, that's all they've got.

Yeah, God, Kelly. You can't slit your wrist with a spoon, isn't that? I mean, the, like, resorting, how desperate a state that humanity has been brought to where your own desperate to spoon and your life's so terrible.

Charlie's run up to lava at the image of sometimes spoon they're artery. Can we get on the guy who is behind S-21? So who's the Mengler? Deutsch. Go on, Doge. Has he been whacked? Has he been...

No, no. He's one of the only people to ever face trial. He's the first person to face trial for all this. Here we go, here you go. I am responsible for the crimes committed at S-21, especially the killing of the people. I take responsibility for the crimes committed there. I'd like to apologize to the survivor

and the founders of the victims. So he's not a bad guy. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, it's crazy, isn't it, though? you do all that but forgiveness is an important thing right he said sorry you'd use the same language if you were wanking in my chair i say responsibility for the cun sorry read this out and let's pretend that you've been wanking my big chair i am responsible for the crime committed for the cum i did in your uh throne especially for the cum on the floor i take responsibility for coming in

your in your throne and i'd like to apologize to you and your family and your children yeah it's what he says. He also said during the testimony, I do not justify what I did. I ask for your forgiveness, though I know it's impossible to forgive me. That is quite unique, don't you think? It is unique. We've covered a lot of awful stuff. Most of the time people don't stand trial, but any sort of Nuremberg,

Nanking, whatever, you never have the kind of one of the main figures basically go in. Yeah. Sorry, but that would piss me off. The fact that he would piss me off more than him. I'd rather him, I'd rather him, I'd rather him double down, I'll say nothing than like, I'll say You want it to double down?

You've changed your tune. Do it again. I do it again. They got away lightly. But you've changed your tune because the last episode when we were saying that Pol Pot at the end of it going, yeah, do you know what? I didn't know what was going on. I read that book and I had a crack and I'm too stupid as I understand it.

You went, oh, I like that because being honest and vulnerable. And now he's saying this and you're going now, fuck him. No, because he's talking to like almost kind of form. I don't like how formal and like calculate it is. No, it's just because you know the story now. We were telling you not to side with Paul Pop two episodes ago. And you were saying you like him because he can do Cizekis.

And you were saying, wait till he Cicicke's babies into trees. That's, because you've not got any foresight because you are a dog. And you jump up a cliff. If he didn't fucking tell you not to. If he's really sorry, he should say,

I am so, so fucking sorry. I don't like how he's like, oh, take full responsibility. He's like a fucking football manager after a last three. He should be like,

I honestly, I fucked it. I can't believe. what I'm done. I'm so, so sorry. Charlie, type in yes to chat, GB, it's going to bring out more quotes. They are canker worms in our flesh, which must be removed. I committed all kinds of serious crimes.

Nobody committed more crimes than I did. So it's gone a bit Trumpy there. No one commits more crimes than me. No, but he's being, you know, he's saying, look, yeah, I did a lot. I did a lot. The objective was to reach cruelty. I taught the interrogation methods.

My own responsibilities were as follows. Obtaining concessions, preparing reports, educating on how to interrogate and strike people. So they took him around back around S-21. Yeah. And he says that, yeah, it all came back to me. I was quite shocked actually what I was doing. At the beginning, I only prayed to ask forgiveness for my parents,

but later on I tend to pray for forgiveness from the whole nation, for all the people who died. I'd like to emphasise that I'm responsible for the crimes committed, especially the torture and execution of the people there. I'd like you to please leave an open window for me to be forgiven. That would piss me off. Don't use a fucking metaphor. Be like, I'm fucked it.

I'm so, so sorry. So if you were the guy behind S-21, you're the guy who's doing it. This is the criminal court, and you're standing trial and we've gone like right, your comrade Doick So you've done all of this stuff You've done all this right

You've electrocate you killed them You skin them Do you agree that you did this Do you yeah 12,000 people you've overseen them died I'm really guilty Right okay And do you have anything to say

To the victims of the families I'm so fucking so I don't know I was just having a really mad time I don't know I'm really really really fucking sorry What's your excuse Mental health

Mental health Wow you're gonna Greg Wallace this You're gonna Greg Wallace this You're going to Greg Wallace Can I'm loading genocide I've got autism And I've got a bone Well, have you got a bono?

No, moment He goes I'm really sorry I've got a bone No, he's already apologise for that And then he has to apologize For something else

I am pooed I have pooed I have pooed Don't let my throbbing erection Take away from my apology I'm so sorry I'm not It doesn't mean I'm not taking it seriously

It's just a bodily function. I have a condition called pre-apism where I have a constant term permanent erection that does not mean... You know in the Calicular series when you said wouldn't it be great to have a permanent erection? And we're like, no,

because there's several opportunities, several times. This would be a terrible time. This would be a trial for war crimes. You've got a throbbing erection. I am sorry. I do... Please don't look at that.

I'm really sorry. I do mean it. This does not undermine that. This is nothing to do with how sorry I am. I'm not horny. It's just flesh. The blood flow's gone. Please don't read into this too much.

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Save on insurance by switching to Bel Air Direct and use the money to fix your car. Bell Air Direct, insurance, simplified. Conditions apply. Yeah. So you would say that I'm sorry, I've got autism. That's what you would say. Yeah. Right. And I was having, yeah, I was having really weird time. No, he's just going through a rough patch. Um, right. So it's quite interesting though. It is fascinating. It's quite unique when you agree. Yes, it's very unique. And even there's a documentary that we watch called, um, enemies of the people. Yeah. Uh, where brother number two, new on cheer he's the last surviving

member of the high ranking Khmer Rouge So it's going to be When this podcast goes down I'm going to be that guy You all have died And when they do a documentary For our crimes

Yeah yeah I'm going to be the last You're number two And you're being interviewed By a listener Who's not going to tell you That he's a listener And then he's going to

And then you're going to be like Listen they said I didn't know what was going I was sick I didn't get to the end of the dock No me neither Right But

It's true Yeah Not word said wrong in the bits I watched he was like listen they wanted people who were intelligent

at the top of society he picked me but I don't know anything I'm genuinely thick as shit because they said Paul Pot was the intellectual that's why he was Yeah but even Paul Pot was like

mate I didn't understand about that book was But how much is the high command So Paul Pot did get involved in a lot of the detail but how much are they are they seeing this are they walking around the killing fields

or is it like edicts that are sent out into the countryside Well this is Paul Potts's defence Paul Pot says that he was a big picture guy and that he wasn't getting involved in the nitty grissy. Right. I don't know how much you can really say that.

But we haven't even got to... Type in Paul Potts' defense for the Cambodian genocide. This is the GP. Can I just... I'm not going to take it. Fuck, I missed it. What was the GP calling you about? I don't know, but I've been trying to get a fucking... I've been trying to get them on the phone for like three weeks.

About what? You said this is the GP, let me answer... Oh, fuck, it's gone. I'm trying to change my details with them and find out who my GP is. Right. Who he is. Why?

Who's the man? He's like Pol Pot. He's an enigma. He's in the jungle. Right. So he's been power for sort of 10 months. And he... What a 10 months?

Big 10 months. Here for a good time, not a long time. Seenook, by the way, is still about. Yeah, he's still being propped up. He makes King Seenook a sort of figurative head of the government. Yeah. And then Seenook the whole time is like, oh, boys, I don't know about this. Yeah.

I don't like how you're using my face for this. Yeah, the babies against tree things. I'm not sure about that. Brand rights and stuff. Yeah, it's like, I don't think, I think you're bringing the brand of disrepute by throwing babies against trees. And you know, Chairman Mao said to Sienuk, he was like, don't worry, he won't get you to work in the fields,

but you might have to pick up a broom once in a while. Yeah. So getting him to, like, do something. So Sianuk at some point resigned, saying, I shouldn't have, I'm no longer the king. Yeah. And again, most peasants are very confused by this. And so when that happens,

so it's political deafness and his ability to maneuver, it's ground to a halt now. It's, it's jungle Blair, yeah. Getting stuck in Afghanistan, Iraq. Yeah. That's exactly what's happened. Quagmire.

Now, it's when Sienuk resigned, that Pol Pop basically is forced to come out from the shadows and he gives a five-hour opening speech. That's his first announcement to the Cambodian people is nearly two years after he's taking power. It's like a Joe Rogan episode. Yeah.

This is all happening and no one knows who's in charge. So Pol Pot only comes out of the shadows, you know, once the fucking S-21 thing is set up, people are in the fields, you know, they're in the nets throwing babies at trees. Then Pol Pot's like, Yeah, by the way, I'm in charge. And then he sort of starts going on tours of countries,

goes to meet Mao and Beijing. That's where Mao's like, chill out a bit, maybe. Baltimore people don't know the scale at this, really, do they? At the time? Yeah. No, but I imagine it's pretty bad. Yeah. In that you've got your spoon, you've got your black clothes,

and you've got your rice, maybe. Because there's no rice, though. The killing fields is about that journalist, right? The film, The Killingfields. Yeah. It's about, and the guy who's in it is actually playing one of the, A doctor who had glasses, we didn't even talk about the glasses thing. Yeah.

If you're cool, if you had glasses, you were killed because only intellectuals had glasses. Yeah. And an actual doctor, I forgot what his name is, but he won an Oscar. He had glasses, took them off, couldn't see, but pretended to be a peasant. Wow. So a lot of people managed to escape, not a lot, few people, intellectuals managed to escape, pretend they were a peasant, survive. And then he paid the role in the film, the 80s film, the killing fields, as himself.

Wow. So his whole story was done and then he won an Oscar and then he got killed in like LA, I think, in like a homicide. Weird. Weird.

But that's quite funny in that if you're really clever, you wouldn't have glasses on because you would have realised I'll take my glasses off. So I'd probably be in that middle space. Well, people think you're clever but you're not

because you've still got your glasses on, you idiot. Take it off. I mean, I'm going, so Charlie's making it the whole way. I'm first against the... In this sort of genocide... Charlie's throwing you, against the truth? Yeah. Yeah. Nazis,

I'd probably end up all right. He's a good Bombian genocide, I'm first to get. He's good bowler, Charlie. He's fast. He's fucking fast, Charlie. I've played cricket with him. Not Cambodian cricket, English cricket. But that's what we, you know, we've been saying, because we were reading the same book, that's what we've been saying is that they are, they have taken, like, the bare minimum aspects of communism, and they've tried to impose it on a feudal society. way even like a jungle feudal society

not even feudal like pre-fudal so you have like you know you have Russian communism is Marx German Marx is German Okay so he's like To be honest Marx thought that communism

It was designed to happen in Germany Right Because Germany was the most technologically advanced country in the world at that point I was heading towards there And so if it was going to be successful He'd kind of planned it industrially to work in Germany With an industrial class

Yes Instead it takes off in Russia because of the collapse of the, you know, the Russian monarchy. Russia has some industry, but not as much as Germany. It's got a huge fuel thing. So they're like, you know, we have to do build up to communism sort of slowly. It has to be socialism, democratic socialism, then full communism. Yes, exactly.

And then you get to China and Mao's like, you take this one. Ship to China and Mao's like, well, the peasant over there. And then we need to get their peasants. It is not about what? It is not about the industry. It's about the peasant. Yeah. And then you gets to Vietnam and Ho Chi Minh's like off.

fuck a US. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's to Cambodian. It's like, just fucking kill everyone with glasses. Fuck it. Kill everyone. Who care? He got glasses.

Die. Yeah. You know, it's completely perverted to the point it gets to Cambodia. And this is why when you hear that argument about how communists have been tried properly, you're like, to be fair, they've tried several different extremes of it. And here, they really try it. Yeah. They really try the, let's just cancel it.

Let's just cancel it. Start again, no money. What's going to happen? Fucking Pat Cuffin's, Pat Cummins is. steaming in with some babies in his hand, that's why that's happening. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, I do know what you mean. Next episode, we'll be talking about what happens, the fallout.

It's the concluding part in our Pol Pot series. I hope you've enjoyed this. This one's for the strongest stomachs. Charlie's just looking to me lost. Well, this is, let's make this year, this is episode one at the podcast. You're right, just right. Let's start again. Year zero.

Year zero. What have you learned, Charlie? Let me start asking you what you've learned. This is episode zero. Next episode, part one. What have you learned this episode, Charlie? From history. Because you've actually been more engaged historically than you can't ever have.

If you say sorry, you have to really, really, really, really mean and you can't have a boner. We'll see you guys next week. We'll see you guys on Thursday. We'll see you guys on Thursday. That episode's on the patron right now. But until then, goodbye. Bye. Thank you.