Financial Feminist - 141. Fighting Stigma and Finding Stability in Single Motherhood with Kim Williams (Single Black Motherhood)

Episode Date: February 27, 2024

“The biggest thing I didn't expect as a single mom would be that I had to learn how to rely on strangers.” In this episode, host Tori Dunlap sits down with Kim Williams, founder of Single Black Motherhood, to discuss the challenges and triumphs of navigating single motherhood. Kim shares her personal journey, from making difficult decisions about relationships to moving across states to provide a better life for her daughter. Through candid conversation, they explore the stigma surrounding single motherhood, the importance of community support, and practical resources available for single moms. Kim's insights shed light on the resilience and strength of single mothers, offering inspiration and guidance for listeners facing similar circumstances.  Read transcripts, learn more about our guests and sponsors, and get more resources at https://financialfeministpodcast.com.  Not sure where to start on your financial journey? Take our FREE money personality quiz! https://herfirst100k.com/quiz Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

It's funny you say this because somebody sent me a video the other day about this lady saying that people were better off not having kids, raising them by themselves. And I was just like, where does this whole thing come from? It's like there have been so many single moms that have raised successful children, but you don't see that in the media. Hi, financial feminists. I'm so excited to see you. Welcome that in the backlog. So welcome back from the break. I hope you had an amazing week.

Today's guests were so excited to welcome on the show. When Kim Williams couldn't find the single mom community she was seeking, she took it upon herself to bridge a significant gap. Kim is the visionary behind Single Black Motherhood, a purpose-driven community dedicated to empowering single mothers through education, resources, and practical tools to enhance their overall quality of life. Her belief in the importance of community support drives her to offer various opportunities for connection, both online and through in-person events, retreats, and meetups. Thanks to her dedicated service, mothers from corners of the globe have found a platform to connect, inspiring lasting transformation in their lives. A couple of things we talk about in today's episode, the stigma around single motherhood, especially for Black single mothers. We talk about being a single mom by choice.

We also discuss finding work as a single mom that supports parents and how to advocate for yourself in the workplace as a mother, how non-parents like myself can best support the single mothers in their life, and how single mothers can find community with other single moms. We're so excited for today's episode. Regardless of whether you're a mom or not, this is a good one to listen to. So let's go ahead and get into it. But first, a word from our sponsors. I'm digging the wallpaper behind you. That is wallpaper, right? Yes. Yeah.

It looks like Dalmatians and I really like it wallpaper behind you. That is wallpaper, right? Yes. Yeah. It looks like Dalmatians and I really like it. Thank you. We're so excited to have you. Thank you so much for being on the show. One of the things we like asking our guests that work in money and talk about money is to describe their first money memory, the first time that they remember thinking about money. And I would love if you could share yours. Oh, that's hard. The first time I can remember thinking about money was probably when I asked my mom to buy me something and she said she had to wait until the first. I was like, the first? What does that even mean? You're like, but I want

it now. Right. What did that teach you about money looking back on it? Or what was the conclusion of that money memory? So I never really wanted to have to wait until a certain period of time to get what I wanted. I was really young. I don't remember how old I was, but if I think back to my first memory, that's definitely it. And I think I started working really young because of that. I started working at the age of 14. What was your first job? My first job was working in Subway. I think the title back then was a sandwich artist. I think it still is. Yeah. As a kid,

you could only work like so many hours after school and you had to get a parent to sign for you to be able to work. I think it was around the child labor laws or something like that. Yeah. 14 is really, really young. That's an experience. So you were, how many hours a week were you working while going to school? I don't think you could work over like five, maybe 10 hours. It wasn't a lot at all. Yeah. Cause most of them would be on the weekends, you know, when I didn't have school. I think there was a set time you could work during the week versus what you could work on the weekend. Yeah. I think after 15 and 16, the rules are a little bit more

lax, but before then. Yeah. We found in our research about you that you had your daughter when you were 21 and finishing college. What surprised you the most about becoming a mom and on top of that, becoming a single mom? Ooh, I think becoming a mom, I just didn't know what to expect. Like growing up, we never had conversations around what it actually took to be a mom, what it took to provide for a child. actually took to be a mom? What it took to provide for a child? So I just had no clue. I think that would be the biggest thing for me is just like, what do I expect? And how do I provide for this kid? I'm a kid. I'm barely like taking care of myself. Right. Specifically being a single mom, right? Because I think it's difficult enough, of being a mother but there's an added element if you're doing that by yourself like that is that's significant yeah probably the

biggest thing I didn't expect as a single mom would be that I had to learn how to rely on strangers you know like people that I didn't know to actually help me and like building that trust and yeah or just for sure. Yeah. Trusting people that you don't know anything about. That's really scary at times. Yeah, for sure. Do you feel like that feeling of like not having a clue translated to financial, like your financial life? Do you feel like that translated to your money? Absolutely. I have no financial like knowledge at all, especially going into motherhood. You know, my mom would use credit cards for a lot of things.

So I don't know. There's a saying about you do what you see your parents do. Not necessarily like you being taught to do something right. You just sort of pick up these behaviors. And when my daughter was born, like I didn't really have a real job. So I was buying her all of these designer things, just putting them on credit cards. Because that's what you saw your parents do? Because that's what I saw my mom do. Yeah. When you started your blog, you said you were looking for resources, but there weren't really any for Black mothers. What kind of content were you finding?

And what felt like was lacking from that discussion? Like what was being missed? I felt like everything was lacking, but what I was finding was a bunch of statistics, like data around how little we make, how much we rely on the government. There wasn't really any inspiration, especially when you talk about single Black mothers. I couldn't find anything. And I'm like, I know there has to be somebody out there that is like young, single, Black, trying to figure out how to escape this check to check cycle. And they made it out of this. I know there has to be somebody out there, but I could not find it. I went looking for podcasts, blogs, you know, people's Instagram pages. I could not find a thing. Do you feel like the content was geared mostly to white women? Was it geared to like women who didn't have children? What do you feel like the demographic was versus you said all these things were missing, right? Like I wanted somebody young. I want somebody black. I wanted somebody who was a mother. Like who was the content geared towards that you were finding? So some of the things I couldn't relate to because maybe they had alimony or they were getting child support.

I wasn't getting child support. I didn't have any alimony. They had communities. They had families that were really big on supporting them. I didn't have any of that. And so some of the things I did take from some of the blogs that I found out there, but other things I just really couldn't relate to. found out there, but other things I just really couldn't relate to. Yeah. It's interesting you say this lack of community because I'm not a mother. If I choose to be like that part of my

life hasn't happened. And, um, you know, I think one of the things that I have discussed though, with my friends who are parents and especially mothers is it's just like, I mean, we know the phrase, right. It takes a village and it's just like, it's so difficult to raise children, but it's so, it's just almost impossible to do it without that sense of community. So what was that feeling like for you? You said, you know, having to rely on strangers, but like, how did you figure out how you were going to make this work for you if you didn't have that community and you didn't have that support and you didn't have alimony? How did you navigate that? You know, I think I've always sort of grown up with this mindset of you have to do what you have to do and you will figure it out. So I just developed that sort of mentality. But as I got

into listening to podcasts back then, I learned about community and how these moms were meeting other moms. They weren't single moms, but they were married moms or they were the white, you know, single moms. They were building communities and they were having meetups. And I'm like, maybe this is it. Maybe I could actually find people that want to do what I want to do or that have already done it and we can sort of help each other. And so that is where I got the idea to create this community. And, you know, first I started off with the podcast because I'm like, I have to tell my story. How else will people connect with me if I don't share like what I'm going through? So I started there and then I started building this community and people would reach out and say, thank you.

You know, like they were afraid to even share. There's a lot of shame, you know, especially with all that you see in the media around single black mothers. Some people are still even to this day afraid to say like they're a single black mother. Like they hide behind that, you know. Well, let's talk about that stigma for a second. Cause in our research too, there's just, I mean, I didn't even know how deep this shit goes, like stigma in terms of, you know, applying for jobs or not being able to get housing in the same way. So what are some of the areas of stigma that single moms face that you've either seen firsthand or in stories from your community? Yeah, I think, you know, career is one thing. It's like most of the times they aren't in leadership because of what they have to do at home. And or they're afraid they're afraid to go

after, you know, the higher paying jobs because they fear that they won't have the support that they need to, you know to continue climbing that ladder, so to speak. Income is also a big thing outside of the career, just in general of making the money. And I think that just goes back to being able to climb the ladder or do the things that they need to do. I think relying on the government, that's a big stigma. Honestly, I haven't even met a lot of single moms that

get access to government. I think one of the biggest misconceptions is that we are all, you know, relying on the government for financial assistance or housing. Most of us don't even qualify for it because we are right over that poverty line and we can't even get access to any benefits because of that. I know even for me, you know, when I became a single mom, I would have loved to have got some type of funding, but it was like, you don't qualify because you have one kid. And I think back then maybe the income was like $28,000, but because I made $30,000, I couldn't get any type of help, you know? So I think that's another misconception.

It's like, it's so crazy. Yeah. Well, and that lack of support, I mean, always on the show, we talk about, you know, the lack of individual support, but also at a societal level, like it's very hard for anybody in a minority group to succeed, you know, it was just bootstraps mentality. Like we all know this. And then when the policies fail us, it's so difficult to navigate. When we're looking at motherhood, specifically single motherhood, what are some of the extra costs associated with being a single mom? And to go even further, a mom of color, as someone who's not a mother, if anybody's listening who maybe is a mother but has a partner or is child free, like what what does that look like in terms of actual costs to motherhood and to single motherhood? Yeah, I think, you know, probably the biggest cost is like child care. Right.

Because we don't have anybody to, you know, drop our kids off in the morning before we go to work or pick them up after they get out of school. You know, the school hours don't align with our work schedules. So that's one of the biggest added costs. And a lot of moms, again, can't even get help with child care funding because of the whole income thing. So that's one big thing. I think just two is just having to provide for the kids like on our own, especially if you're a single mom

you don't get any child support you know you're not co-parenting you have to take care of all of the kids needs if you want to do you know extracurricular activities for your kids you know school like whatever their expenses are like you're taking that on versus being able to share that load with somebody yeah i think the child thing, we have to spend some more time talking about because I live in Seattle. The cost of childcare is as much as rent typically double. Like how is that sustainable? Like how is that sustainable? So like, how did you manage that? How did that work for you? Yeah. So back then, you know, my daughter, I want to say when she first started going to school, like obviously her dad and I,

we created this agreement to where, you know, he'd reimburse me for half of the expenses. So that is how I did it back then. But today she actually goes to like after school that is done by the hospital that I work for. And so I believe it's subsidized for workers. So it's not as expensive as it was, you know, when she was growing up. So I just do it that way. But I know a lot of moms don't have that same story. And so honestly, I don't know how they're doing it, because it's way more expensive now, you know, than it was back then. And I think I was just putting stuff on credit cards, to be honest. I couldn't even afford to live, you know, making like $30,000 with all the bills and debt that I had.

So, yeah, I just I think thinking back, I was just living off of credit cards, to be honest with you. Well, and this is again where policy has to come in right universal child care at least subsidized child care like and continually policies fail to support moms yeah you don't want to put your kid in like any type of well at least i right you know any type of child care so i was thinking you want to make sure it's safe and healthy and yeah and then if you're thinking like if you're for thinking about like their development it's like well the basic daycare that's like the cheapest is not teaching them anything especially as babies right

right so then the more you want your kid to learn it seems like the more expensive it is so yeah that's something to consider also. Well, and to your point about extracurriculars, right? You want a well-rounded kid who, you know, is doing things that they love and who, you know, takes piano or goes to soccer practice and like all of those things cost money. All of those things cost money and time and, you know, the emotional labor of scheduling. And so, yeah, it's a lot. It's a lot to think about. Yeah. And I see a lot of moms now, like, especially in my community, that they put extracurricular activities before their own, like, financial needs, if that makes sense.

And I have to remind them that, like, you don't owe your kids these extracurricular activities. It's cool to just have them do one thing, but I sometimes feel like they're overcompensating because the other parent is not there or they didn't have this when they were growing up. And so it's a huge thing. We talk about this a lot. If people are in a financial position to help pay for college, a lot of parents end up sacrificing their own retirements to take care of their kids and to, you know, try to get them to at least graduate with less debt or graduate debt free. But the issue for that is like, as much as student loans suck, like you can take out a loan. You can't take out a loan for your own retirement. Right. And like, if you're trying to, you know,

do this really great thing, which is set your kid up for financial success, but they're going to end up paying for you in retirement like that's actually not as as good of a decision as you think it is and so like it sounds like a different version of that yeah for sure and they they do that too and in our single mom community you know and it's oftentimes like are you saving for retirement it's well intentioned yeah and they're like no they're not saving for themselves for their future but they're saving for their kids future i think the you know the psychological um you know if i had to interpret that i think it's like we have taught women and specifically mothers to be so self-sacrificing right and in order to think the you know the psychological um you know if i had to interpret that i think it's like we

have taught women and specifically mothers to be so self-sacrificing right and in order to be a quote-unquote good mom right you have to give your kids the life that you didn't have and sacrifice your joy and happiness and stability for them but that's really you know if you look at it in the long term that's really difficult if you grow up as a kid and you realize oh my mom was never happy my mom is not financially well off and now either i have to pay for her or i have to deal with that in terms of like the emotional impact that that had so it's just like it's a it's again really well intentioned but i think it ends up having these negative consequences yeah and i think to go a step further is not

only does it impact them financially, but also mentally. A lot of moms have struggled mentally because of the decisions they've made financially. And that transfers over into the kids and they don't really realize that a lot. Yeah. We found in the research, the statistic that's just absolutely awful, which is that 70% of Americans believe that single women raising children on their own is bad for society. Do you have any? I know. Do you have any thoughts on why this belief is so persuasive? And if there's anything we can do to dismantle that kind of thinking? You know what? It's funny you say this because somebody sent me a video I believe it was on Instagram the other day similar to this about you know this lady saying that people were better off

not having kids raising them by themselves and I was just like where does the whole thing come from and it's like there have been so many single moms that have raised successful children, but you don't see that in the media. And so I think, you know, if we all work together to share those stories of those, you know, women that have come before us that have raised successful children as single women, I think it would help. But I think, you know, just growing up, you never really heard about single women raising successful children. It was always like the family unit. But I think now in today's time, there are so many like single moms in the world. There's like single moms by choice now. That's becoming a whole movement. And we could, you know, talk about that later.

But I think the biggest thing is just awareness. You know, a lot of people are not shining a positive light on what's happening with those children that grow up to be successful that are raised by single moms. Right. Well, and I think it's over 90% of single parents are single moms. So it's this feeling that like, it's not single fathers are bad it's specifically single mothers are bad for society right right yeah they have nothing to say about the thing oh no nothing if anything it's applause it's just like you they are perfect can we talk about the single moms by choice we can we can talk about. The first person to pop in my head is like Mindy Kaling. Like that's who I think of.

That was a story for me that I think was really, really great and impactful, especially as her being a woman of color is like, yeah, I want children and I'm not going to wait for a man or I'm not going to do this with somebody else. Like, do you feel like these stories are getting discussed more? And like, what are your opinions on like, how we how we talk about single motherhood by choice? Yeah, so it is becoming more and more popular. I think when I first started my community, I didn't really see a lot of it. And then I came across this one mom, I don't know if she started following me first or how we connected. But she was sharing that, you know, she was almost 30 or maybe she was over 30.

I can't remember. She had dated so many guys and she really wanted to be a mom, but she knew like her biological clock was ticking and she had no prospects in sight. And she didn't want to put her dream of becoming a mom on hold. And so she went the donor insemination route. And to that, I say, if you are financially capable, if you have the support system that you need, I'm not against anybody doing what they desire. But I think on the flip side of that, the average person is not really able to do that. And I would not recommend somebody just going out there and having a kid like single motherhood looks like, OK, it could be easy or I can do this on my own. But like nobody really talks about like the emotional strain, the financial strain, like what you go through mentally, especially if you have a limited support system. I just don't think we talk about that enough. And so, again, my opinion is

that if you have all the resources and tools available to you, be my guest, you know, but then also I think about too how that impacts the kid, right? And so I don't think there's a lot of studies on, you know, how do you explain that to a kid when they're at the age where they want to know who their dad is? Do you explain that? Like, you know, and some dads sign up saying they don't want to be contacted, right? And they donated their sperm to all of these banks. And, you know, so it just gets really, I don't know, murky. So, I mean, I'm not against it. Personally, I wouldn't do it because you asked for my opinion. And since I've lived through single motherhood, I think, you know, it's definitely becoming more

popular now. Well, and I mentioned Mindy Kaling, right, who has a ton of financial privilege, right? Like she can afford child care child care and yeah it makes a lot more sense yeah yeah yeah do you feel like there is a stigma or maybe like an exclusion because someone chooses to single parent as opposed to you know like it's it's more you know if someone is making an active choice of like nope i'm gonna do this on my own, does that hold its own stigma? So I do, to be honest, I think society does sort of categorize single moms, right? Although I do not do that personally in my community, I know that it's being done. So, for example, if you co-parent, they say you're not a single mom because you have help, right?

if you co-parent, they say you're not a single mom because you have help, right? If you decided to, you know, do this on your own, like you don't really know what it's like because you didn't have to struggle, you know? So there's just a lot of like things that people say about it. And you maybe look differently because of the route you became a single mom. But again, in my community, I don't try to categorize it. I'm like, we're all in this together. We're all trying to raise kids on our own. Whether you have a dad that helps out 50% of the time or 10% of the time, you know, or 0% of the time, it's just like, we're all here on this journey together. And we connect in more ways than than one, right? So it's okay. Like, I don't try to make anybody feel less than or more than

just because of how they you know got to the journey right one of the parts of your story I think is really fascinating is that you picked up and moved a lot oh yeah you moved from Mississippi to Houston and then Arizona like what precipitated that move or those moves for you? Can you share what this process looks like? Because like moving is fucking expensive. And like, is there anything you did during this time to make that transition financially easier for yourself and for your family? No. So this was back during the time where, you know, I was in my early 20s. You know, I had my daughter at 21. And so shortly after I turned 22. And so her dad and I, we were trying to work it out. But honestly, we were two kids with no tools and resources around

relationships. And so in my mind, I grew up working at an early age. And so I was like, I'm not going to be with a man who is not going to work as hard as me. So I was working two jobs. Her dad was working one. He was going on to finish his master's. We were both in college when I got pregnant, by the way. So I decided that I would end the relationship. And only if he, you know, was to do things differently, would I get back with him. If that didn't happen, I would leave. Right. So I think maybe I gave it three to six months. Things did not get better. And so I had some family living in Houston, Texas, and they told me that they thought that I could do so much better and they would help me out with my daughter. And so although I didn't know that family very well, it was just like that looks like a ticket out and a ticket to a better life. And so I didn't act on that thought right away. It was

probably almost a year before I decided, okay, you know what? Things are not improving. I don't have anything to lose here. At that time, I was in a one-bedroom apartment. It was low-income housing. It sucked. But I was just like, you know, I had a bed, a small little probably dining table. I didn't have a lot. OK. And so I either sold what I had or, you know, gave things away just to get some money. I rented an SUV. I put in what I had and I drove to Houston.

I did have a car in the time, but I left it behind because it was raggedy. And I just started my life over, to be honest. I lived with that family about six or seven months. And then I got my own apartment and I struggled for probably two or three years until I felt like I was on my feet. And then I started to build community and all of those things. So the second move was because I graduated with my MBA and I was like, I need a return on my investment. You know, like they say, you know, you go to school, you get this degree and then you automatically get paid more. But that's not happening because I'm doing all these interviews and people are telling me I don't have leadership experience. And I'm just like, I just got this MBA. So I said, you know what, I'm not going to limit myself here and staying

in Houston. I'm just going to apply wherever there's an opportunity. And whoever allows me that opportunity, I'm just going to move. And that is what I did. Long story short, I got an offer here in Arizona, and I took it, you know, I negotiated and I was well on my way. And I'm like, if I go back to Houston one day, that's fine. If I go somewhere else, that's fine too. I'm not like limited to one place. Again, there, I was just like, I don't have anything to lose. I didn't have really any family outside of that family that I had. And, you know, like some things happened. We really didn't have a good relationship anymore. So again, besides the community that I built there, which I felt like I could always reach back out and connect to should I need it, I didn't have anything to lose. Obviously, I told you I sold my stuff. I didn't have really any money in the bank, maybe $100 or $200. But the second time I moved, the company paid for the relocation. So I was able to move

fairly quickly. Was that something you negotiated or was that just part of the benefits package? I asked for it. Yeah, there you go. I don't know if it was going to be initially included, but I was just like, can you pay for relocation? And they gave me, I think, up to four thousand dollars. So I didn't even spend the whole four thousand because I didn't have a lot of stuff. But they had me to use like a moving company. They came and picked up my stuff from my apartment and then I shipped my car and I was pretty much it. And I took a flight and they paid for that to me and my daughter.

So, yeah, That's great. Yeah. Obviously in your work, you work with single Black mothers, giving them resources to make more money, get more money. What are some unique situations for single mothers that we probably don't think about? And in your opinion, what's the best job for a single mother? Oh, that's a, that's an interesting question. So things that we don't think about that come up is especially like the PTO. I think because when the kids get sick, you know, we are the ones caring for them. And so what I found is that a lot of moms will not take time off for themselves because they're trying to save time for the kids. So I think if you can find, you know, like an employer that is flexible with time off or allows you to make up time if you're not salaried and they can understand like what it's

like to be not just a single mom, but a working mom, right? Even in like, I think marriages and partnerships, the moms usually take on the load of taking care of the sick kids. So I think that's a really big thing, especially for single moms. And so I'd say the best job for them would probably be something if they can work remote, I work remote before going back to like the office or hybrid. I think that's good because you don't really have to take off time because you're at home, you know? And then usually the remote jobs are more flexible.

I don't know if there's a specific title that you want to talk about as far as like the best type of role for them. But I think just remote work in general is better. Now, I do know some moms that work in tech. And I think depending on the role, sometimes those can be more stressful because of the workload. But yeah, I just say like when you're going through your interviews, really ask about the workload. See if there's anybody on the team you can talk to. Just really interview the companies like they're interviewing

you. It's really important, I think, that we take the time to interview the companies we're going to be working for. I asked a lot of questions before I moved here. And even when I came to do my site visit, I met with some people in the C-suite and I got to ask real questions, even down to race and diversity, equity, and inclusion. What does that all look like? So it's not just about the PTO, but I think, too, if you and inclusion, like what does that all look like? So it's not just about, you know, the PTO, but I think too, if you're a single Black mom that also,

you know, plays a role in that as well. In terms of specifics, what are resources out there for single moms? And if someone is listening, who's a single mother, where can she turn? What helped you like where to go? You know, I always encourage people to go to Emma's. I think she goes by the wealthy single mommy. I think that she houses a lot of like great resources like in one place. But what helped me was just really finding people that were doing what I was doing. There's no one specific thing. There's no one specific agency that I used. It's just being open to the tools and resources that are available to you and how you find them is just like Google.

resources that are available to you and how you find them is just like Google. I think that's what I did a lot of. I wasn't like, can you please tell me what resource, you know, I can use or go to, but I do know like the Salvation Army is very helpful in like, you know, providing resources and things like that. I actually worked for them at one point. And then what are some other I know there's a working mom website that has a lot of resources for jobs. And I can't think of these off the top of my head. I will have to get you a list. Would that be okay for like the show notes? Yeah. And we can link those down below. Okay, because I'm like, this is happens to me to put together a list for you. But no... It happens to me too. I wish I would have put together a list for you, but... No, it happens to me too.

And somebody asked like, what financial books do you recommend? And I have a list of like 30. And then of course, whenever somebody asks me, I'm like, mine, this other one, and this other one. I'm like, that's what I got. And I'm like, I know there's more than that. Now, if you did ask me for books,

I could tell you like the top two would be emma emma is also an author right yeah i know emma kristin also just told me the mom project is that what it's called that that's it that's it there we go out of girl kristin thank you a lot of moms recommend that i haven't personally used it but i know i can attest to it from them. But Kimiko, I think is her name. She goes by thebudgetmom on Instagram. Her book is so simple, like for those moms who are out there and they are trying to get their money together.

It's so good. And she has a lot of free resources on her website for moms that are trying to get their money together. So those two books by you know, by Emma, I can't think of it. I think it's called the kick ass single mom or something like that. I know she has two. I have them both,

but those are good. I don't really know any other single mom authors like that, honestly. And then Kimiko is no longer single. She got married. So if you want inspiration too, there you go. Yeah.

What can we actually do? myself and people listening, to help single mothers or single mom friends? Like what can we do? I think the biggest thing, if we can all figure out some way to help with child care, I think that's the biggest issue. But on a smaller scale, if you have any single mom friends, you have any single moms in your community, like volunteer to keep the kids for, you know, a day or a few hours. Like moms do not like asking for help, especially single moms. And so if you can do that for them to where they can just sit in silence for, you know, an hour or two where they can just sit in silence for an hour or two, where they can go and do some things that they haven't had a chance to get to do.

I think that just goes a long way. Like the health is the biggest thing. When I talk to my community about like, what are their struggles? I think the three biggest things are money, support and time. They don't have a lot of time. They don't have a lot of support in like community

or they're afraid to ask because of fear of being turned down. And then they don't have a lot of financial resources. So those are the biggest things. If we could figure out how to help them increase their income, I think that's huge. And then, like I said, just the being there, the support, you know, even if you have any resources that you don't think they've had time to look up, you know, share that with them. Like even just the resources go a long way also. I think the one thing that I am more and more conscious of as a child-free person is like, just asking my friends who are moms how they're doing. And I even know I can be better at it, but just like offering them

space of like what do you need do you need me do you need me to do a school pickup do you need me to send you food do you like do you need to just talk like just check it in and I feel this is like my own personal thing that I guess I'll work out in therapy at some point but like there is a certain like difference you know and my friends who have had children like it's just a such a different world than the world I'm in and I often like don't know how to interact in that world because it's so different than my life and so I'm trying to like actively fight the impulse and like still reach out and still have conversations with them because I know how important that is yeah and. And I think even going a step further, instead of saying, well, how can I help you? Just ask, can you send them food? Can you take the kids to school? Because, you know, again, I go back to that thing of like,

they don't really like asking for help. They, you know, think that they have to do it all when there's somebody like you that can't support them. Right. So just offering that, like, I think someone, someone, you know, offer one day to send me food. And I was like, Oh my gosh, that was the sweetest thing that really made my day. But it was that little small thing because I knew I would be working all day and I would have to take time away from doing the tasks that I needed to do just to go and get food for me and my daughter. And so that simple thing of them saying they wanted to send me food was so like sweet to me. And it just really made my day. And it was small, you know, literally going to send one of my friends food. Oh, I love that. No, that's really and I appreciate you saying that. No, but I appreciate you saying that. Because like, one of the things that drives

me crazy is when men in my life will be like, well, what do you need? Like, it's like it's better than I guess not asking at all. But it is like I need you to anticipate what I need because then I have to figure out how like in this moment, like, yeah, what does that support look like? And of course, I'm going to be like, no, you don't have to do anything. I'm fine. So, yeah, I appreciate you saying that because you you know what moms need right right right to feed themselves and the kids they need time alone like there are just some things they need a spa day they need a spa day send a gift card you know or book the spa for them tell them you book them because you know if you're their friend you pretty much would know their schedule right

or you can ask like hey what days you have available even though it might be none or they already have things planned but at least you know it's really the thought i think that counts and just you going a step beyond the thought and saying like let me do this for you totally so in addition to like individual support of you know spa days and like sending food, like we talked about this before, but like you said, I think that one of the biggest struggles was just like this lack of community. So like if you are a single mom out there, like how do you get a community? Like how do you, how do you find a community? How do you actually, you know,

find support in this very difficult place to be in as someone who's just trying to figure it out by themselves? Yeah. So I think back when I was building my community, it was a bit harder. I feel like there are a lot more resources now. But I just started off, you know, of course, with a podcast and building an Instagram community. But now what I recommend moms in my community even to do is to, you know, connect with moms if their kids are doing extracurricular activities. If they go to church, there's usually moms there online like Instagram. You'd be surprised like if you do follow a single mom page, like how much you have in common with another single mom that you could DM. I try to do these like check ins often where, you know, I tell moms to comment like what city and state they live in. And then if there's another mom in their same city, they can DM them. Right.

But if you're on Facebook, there's a lot of single mom groups on Facebook. And a lot of them might not be like the most productive, but you can find some decent people in those groups. And then to go a step further, there are local like city mom groups in your area. So they may not be, you know, single mom groups, but they're still mom groups. Like I think there was this one group, Black Moms of Houston, that I joined, and I met some moms in that group. And even if they're not single moms, they are still moms and they will still be able to be a support system for you and they will still help you. I like this quote by Patrice Washington, and she says that there's always someone out there that has the power to bless you. Right. And maybe that's not exactly how she quotes it. you, right? And maybe that's not exactly how she quotes it. But I truly believe that there are strangers out there that want to help you if you allow them to and if you open up yourself to meet

people, right? So outside of social media, there's also meetup.com. Like that is still a thing. And they do have meetup groups around your interest. So you'd be surprised that you can meet moms also in those groups as well. So quite a few different ways to, you know, make mom friends or meet single moms or moms in general. But I definitely think that isolation is not good. I know like our natural instinct is to isolate, especially as single moms, I feel like we have to do it all on our own. But we don't, we don't have to do that. And there's so many people out there that are going through what you're going through. And they also like are looking for other people

that can relate, or there's somebody that has gotten over that stage where you are and they can show you and tell you like how to get out of that. So you just have to open your mind and be willing to put yourself out there. And I truly believe that you will not regret that. I just, yeah, 100% agree. And I will also say slightly different situation, but I have realized like I haven't had a lot of in-person community, especially post pandemic. Like a lot of my friends have moved away

and live in different cities. And like, you know, our whole business is virtual and I see, you know, our team every day, but it's not the same. And so I realized I was lacking our in-person community. And literally this person that I saw at bar classes that I was going to just looked really kind and fun. And we had had a couple of social interactions, but nothing crazy. And I literally like, it's kind of scary. It's like asking somebody on a date but I like reached out to her on Instagram and I was just like hi you just seem like a really good person and like have really good energy and I've been trying to find more in-person community would you like to like get coffee and she was like oh my gosh yes

I would like I don't have a community either and now she's like like we've become like immediate friends like we're like shout out to Julia like Julia and I are like so close now and we've become like immediate friends like we're like shout out to julia like julia and i are like so close now and we've really only known each other for like two months and it's just like if you are that person out there who's seeming like i can't reach out to people that's terrifying like i promise just like a little bit of vulnerability like just it's like asking somebody on a date like it'll and i i promise you like women are really generous and really kind and so yeah if you are that person they are single mom or not who just like needs more community just like yeah that

person that you admire that person that you saw at that thing once get coffee go and yeah have dinner invite them over and like i just i mean it's a scary thing to do, but I just, it was so great to have that in my personal experience. And like, I want all women to have that community, even if it seems like scary to approach somebody to ask. I'll tell you a funny story about me moving here. So right now I'm currently living in a mountain town, right? It's predominantly white.

When I looked at the stats, I think there was point zero one percent African-American people here. Wow. I went looking on Instagram because I was like, there has to be at least one black mom there. Right. So I went down this rabbit hole of like looking at all the like local businesses and things using like the hashtags for the city. So that's another way. Hashtag city moms, whatever city you live in moms, you might be able to find some moms that way. But I found this one black mom, she had ended up doing a photo shoot, personal brand and photo shoot with a local photographer. And so I DM her on Instagram, I had no clue if she was gonna respond or not. And I told her I was like, Hey, you know, I'm thinking about accepting a job there and was really looking to connect and see if you'd be open to sharing more about the town, you know, how you like it,

so on and so forth. And so she responded back probably like a few hours later. And like, we've been connected ever since. And so when I got here, she offered to like watch my daughter, like a stranger from the internet, because I had to do the site visit, right? Because I was, I wasn't sure, like, you know, how I was gonna work that out. And, you know, because my daughter at that time was like, eight. So I wasn't gonna leave her in the car, you know, by herself. And again, I told y'all earlier learning how to depend on strangers, right. For support, because how else would I have done that without this person that I met on Instagram. And so she just happened to have two kids of her own. She

had a husband at the time, crazy because now, you know, she's about to go through her own process of not being married anymore. And at that time, we didn't know that was gonna happen, right? But now she's seen me live my life as a single mom. And so it's just crazy how things come full circle. But just again, being open, sending that DM, I think can really be like a game changer for anybody. Totally. Yeah.

Where can people learn more about you and your work in your community? Yeah, so you can find me on Instagram at single black motherhood, and then you can check out the website, single black motherhood.com. Everything is there. Amazing. Kim, thank you for your time. We so appreciate you coming on and thank you for your work.

Thank you so much for having me. I appreciate it. Thank you so much to Kim for joining us for this episode. You can go to singleblackmotherhood.com to learn more about her work and to join the Single Mom Collective. As always, the best way to support our show is by subscribing, by sharing with friends,

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