Financial Feminist - 24. Exposing the Entertainment Industry with Model Ella Halikas

Episode Date: June 14, 2022

We’re spilling the tea on the entertainment industry. In this episode, Tori is joined by Sport’s Illustrated model Ella Halikas to talk about her experience as a curve model, influencer, and content creator. Together, they deep dive into how the industry exploits and takes advantage of talent, and what can be done to change it. An excellent episode for anyone hoping to be a part of the entertainment industry (whether behind or in front of the camera), or anyone who wants to learn more about how to handle inconsistent finances, build a side hustle, or monetize content creation. Pre-Order “Financial Feminist: Overcome the Patriarchy’s Bullsh*t to Master Your Money and Build a Life You Love”: https://bit.ly/3PpHvlC Episode show notes: https://herfirst100k.com/financial-feminist-show-notes/  Follow Ella on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ellahalikas/ Our HYSA recommendation [affiliate]: http://sofi.com/herfirst100k Follow Financial Feminist on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/financialfeministpodcast/  Follow Her First $100K on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/herfirst100k/ Looking for more actionable money advice? Take our FREE money personality quiz! https://treasury.app/herfirst100k/money-journey-quiz  Leave Financial Feminist a voicemail: https://www.speakpipe.com/financialfeminist  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello, hello, hello, financial feminists. Welcome back. Welcome back, welcome back. So excited to see you as always. Thank you for being here. We are taking a short break from hashtag stock girl summer and going back to the OG, the default, hashtag hot girl summer.

Because this episode, oh my goodness, this episode, y'all. I can't even begin to describe how good it is. If you have ever wondered about how the entertainment industry works, about how the modeling industry works, about how the influencer industry works, you are going to be floored by what our guest shares today. She brings the heat. She literally tells us stories that recording live she said, oh, I don't even, I've never talked about this. Am I supposed to say this? I don't care. Fuck it. So it's so good. And I'm so excited for you to hear it. Today's guest is small town girl from Walnut Creek, California turned 2021 sports illustrated swimsuit model, Ella Halikas. As a curve model and an influencer, Ella has built an online

community on both Instagram and TikTok with the goal of spreading confidence and inclusivity. In addition to being a world-class model, girl, she's so good. She looks so good in every fucking photo. She's so talented. Ella's mission is to share her insights as the CEO of confidence and to inspire people around the world to live confidently, positively, and unapologetically. The self-made model and entrepreneur hopes to inspire others with her journey and online community. We're going to take a peek behind the curtain today of the modeling in the influencer industry. We're going to talk about confidence. We're going to talk about the true costs of being, quote, beautiful, how to financially prepare when you make an inconsistent income. We're dropping that shit

today and so much more. Don't forget to check out our YouTube channel linked in the show notes for behind the scenes and extra footage from every guest interview. We're dropping at least like five to 10 minutes of every interview so you can actually watch the video as well as listen. So without further ado, Elohalikas. I'm so excited to hear. I mean, this is the shit we're going to talk about today. And I'm so excited. Can you tell me your backstory of getting into modeling? And was that ever a thought of like, oh, I to do this was that part of the plan yeah funny when I was a kid actually I would always get like dressed up and take like just iconic shoots in my backyard with my older sister but I just you know I never my parents never pushed me in that direction none of my parents really did that so like it was just kind of a thing that I like love to do and then as I got older, I got thicker and curvier. And after high school, I gained like

20 to 30 pounds. And I just I but I was always athletic. And I never had like the stereotypical very thin body anyways, to begin with. So I played soccer and sports and modeling was just never in the cards. And then when I went to college, I went to University of Hawaii, and was just on the beach in swimsuits taking photos. And people were like like why are you not modeling like you like clearly know what you're doing camera turns on there's like and I was just like I don't know like it's just fun for me I just did it for Instagram just like for fun and then it was more of like my friends honestly kind of pushing me like you should actually do this and I was like you guys are crazy like I'm a size 14 like no way and then I saw Ashley Graham blow up with, you know, Sports Illustrated

on the cover and like all these other plus size models. And I was like, wait, there's a huge market now for this. And then an agent reached out on Instagram. And that's kind of how it all unfolded was like my last year of college. Then I moved home and I was like, well, it looks like my goal now and dream is to move to LA and do this. But I wanted to like save money first and like served at a restaurant to save money living at home and then moved here May of 2020. Can you define for us what is considered quote unquote plus size in the industry? And is that the term you prefer or is it curve model? Like what do you find is the difference?

So interesting because there's not one like concrete answer or like concrete like box. Like everyone could say, oh, if you're over a size eight, you're plus size. Someone else could be like, Oh, absolutely not. If you're over size 16, you're plus size. So it's like, there's always different explanations and whatever. But for me, I've, what I learned throughout the industry is that there's like this range of like midsize that doesn't really get represented. And that's a whole different story. But if you're, you know, usually below a size two or four below, it's called straight size modeling. And that's like, you know, what we were growing up and watching and seeing.

And then there's like that midsize. And then after size like 10 to like 14 or eight to 14 is more like curve. And then after 14, 16 is plus. It's kind of how I learned it to be. So I'm like kind of at that cusp. I don't, whatever someone wants to call me is what they're gonna call me. I would say I'm more curve than plus size,

but also people will look at me and be like, no, you're a plus size model. Like, so I don't know, just same, same, but different kind of thing. You know? Do you find that plus size has like a certain negative connotation to it? What's funny is when I first got into the industry, I didn't like it.

Like I didn't want to be called plus size. And I think that's what we were like, so ingrained in our heads that like, right. Yeah, a hundred percent. And that's just kind of what I was like, we were all just grown up in society. So yeah, at first I thought maybe it was insulting. And now I'm like, I don't give a shit. Like, you know what I mean? Why is that even insulting? It does literally not matter. Like, so yeah, I'm not insulted by it. I think there is still a negative connotation to it. Because it's also like, you don't say straight size models, like people don't say that they just say a model and then plus size model. So why are you giving me an extra name and not just like model? And that's what I've had a hard

time because I've even noticed myself. I'm always saying on Instagram, curve model, tick tock, hashtag curve model. And I'm like, I'm actually having a hard time breaking out of that. Cause my friend sat me down and was like, dude, enough with like the whole curve thing. Like you're a model, like just say you're a model. And I'm like, Oh yeah, I guess I could, but I, you know what I mean? But I've always, so, and once when I meet someone at a bar, like I'm talking to a guy, oh, what do you do? I'm a curve model. Like I can never just say I'm a model because immediately they're like, Oh, are you and look at me up and down. And I'm like, Well, there's curve. Okay, like, or there's plus size. Right? It requires you to like instantly apologize for something you don't

feel it's like when people go, you know, like entrepreneur and then they go, oh, you're a female entrepreneur. And I'm like, no, you know, it's the same thing with girl boss, right? It's like, I'm a boss or you're a girl boss, right? Yes, that's so true. That's so true. I didn't even think about that. Yeah. It's like you can't even, you have to justify like what you do or who you are with like, yeah, you're just trying to justify something. Like, why can't you just say I'm a freaking boss? I'm a leader. I'm this, you know, I'm a model. It always has to be like an underlying like explanation. It's like annoying. Well, and for curve model in particular, it's almost could it almost feels like an apology for who you are, right? It's almost like a justification, you know, especially in

that example of like going out on a date, it's like model, oh, really? Like, and then looks you up and down. It's like, oh, well, I'm a curve model, right? That's like a justification. And also, what other industry, right? Do you have to tack on how you physically appear in order to be taken seriously? You know, it's like, it's a justification plus like almost in like an apology or like a descriptor that you don't even need right because you're you're almost like well this is going to be uncomfortable because what we were grown up to think is a model is skinny or that a boss is a male or like you know what I mean so we're so accustomed to think these things that we're going above and beyond to like explain why we are that how did we become that

and it's just it's weird like even like engineers like I've seen like hashtag female engineer and you know woman in real estate I'm like you're a realtor like or like you know like we always have to add the gender it's like wait what like oh yeah and I get it from a marketing standpoint right because you're trying to help other potential people find someone that they either, you know, feel more comfortable with. Like, for me, you know, it's very much like, yes, I'm an entrepreneur, regardless of my gender. However, I know that for, you know, for many women hearing about money from another woman is going to make the experience, you know, better or more inclusive or whatever that looks like. But yes, on the on the point of like, why are we immediately justifying or bringing in gender or bringing in size to Yeah, immediately like asterisks ourself? You know, it's like, entrepreneur, but female entrepreneur? Yeah, right, right. But I do think that is a good point. Because especially with like hashtags and whatever, it's like, it's, it's helpful, because then people can, you know, find you in other ways, or if they're trying to search for like, you know, size 14 clothing, like, you know, it's like, it's helpful because then people can, you know, find you in other ways. Or if they're trying to search for like, you know, size 14 clothing, like, you know, it's

like, it helps when you have that. But sometimes it's like, why do I even have to say it? You know? Right. Well, and that brings us back to inclusivity, right? Because if I'm looking at clothes to figure out how I should dress, if I just type in model, I'm probably getting a bunch of stuff that A, will not fit me. B, will not look good on me.

Versus if I type in midsize model, right? Or curve model, I'm more likely to find, of course, content from other people who have a similar body type to me. So all of this is very cyclical, right? So yeah, we can say like, oh, why do we have to put curve in front of it? And I agree as an industry, like that makes no sense, right? But it's also like, if you're trying to create a community around these sorts of things it almost does it there's an additive thing that happens when you do put the yeah put the asterisk on it because yeah I know if I'm searching I don't know if I'm searching like recipes and I type in vegan recipes right it's going to be more specific to what I actually want or the content I actually want and this is an algorithm problem too but it it's really interesting. Yeah. It's more of like a niche. And I think it's interesting you say that because I have to give credit to you because I was just thinking the other day, because I've always found

like financial literacy so interesting and I've always wanted to study and learn more, but I was learning all from men, but they all had such different feedback and advice. And then it's so cool that you are like the financial feminist, because now I know I'm going to go to you to get such a different array of like, like insight and just it's a knowledge that like a man I don't know. So like in this in this regard, it is nice to have like a female entrepreneur and like a financial feminist because it's like, we don't get that all the time in this, especially in that industry. So you definitely do stand out in that way because I'm like running to your podcast to like learn as much as I can. Like when I've just feel like I've been getting so much different, you know, advice from men. I appreciate that. Well, I feel the same about you. It's the same sort of thing

of like, you know, it's the whole representation matters thing, right? As it's like, you know, for me, I've only started just coming to terms with, you know, my body and with my curves and with all of these things. And of course, looking at you out here fucking killing it, I'm like, yeah, great. Let's go. Right. There's there. Let's go. Right. You know, so I feel the exact same way. I love that. So maybe it. Yeah, it's interesting. And maybe it's more about, you know, if you're calling yourself that versus somebody else calling you that like that. I'm trying to figure out like what the actual distinction is between when it feels like, you know, like you're niching in an important way or in a helpful way versus like when you feel like this some bullshit, you know what I'm talking about? That's so true. I don't know what it is.

Yeah. Cause if you say it yourself, it's more like, yeah, I can call myself a financial feminist or a female entrepreneur. But the second they're like, this is Tori. She's, you know, a female entrepreneur. You're like, I'm an entrepreneur. Let's get to the point. Right. Right. Or like, you know, on this hypothetical date where you're like, I'm a model. And he's like, are you sure about that? You're like, oh, curve model. Right. Because you're having to justify it to him. Yeah. And if I was on a date and they're like, yeah, she's a plus size model. I'd be like, bro, just say I'm a model and an infant or whatever. Like, fuck off.

Like, keep it short and sweet. God damn. Yeah. Yeah. No, that's exactly right. Yeah. No, it's really interesting. And I don't know if there is an answer.

But yeah, it's funny because some of the time, you know, I'm super pissed off. But I understand if you're going by a hashtag or if you're trying to find other people, you know, to inspire you or, you know, think the same way, or at least, you know, give you some sort of representation, then sometimes you need that specificity. Totally. And it's how we brand ourselves to, you know, we branded ourselves like this. Right, back to the algorithm and the Instagram, right, right, you're doing you're doing hashtags. And those are the whole point is to, you know, to compile all those different things together. So, and, you know, the algorithm's hoping that it can feed you what you want or what

you're looking for, right? So the more specific you can be, you know, the better, in theory, the better the content is or the more accurate the content is. For sure. Makes perfect sense. What sort of hidden costs come up for you if you're a model? Like, I'm not a model. I think the vast majority of people who are listening are not models. What for you, like, what are the costs of modeling that people are surprised that you have to foot the bill for?

Like, if I'm just an average person and I'm like, you pay for that? Like, what are those kind of costs hmm interesting I would just that's a good good question um I would say it's all just like self-care and like maintenance and like hygiene everything it's like like what we all pay for but like I literally always have to get my nails done because they always have to be a certain way for a shoe and it's like oh you're getting your nails done again like you're so I'm like no I literally have to for my job like they have to be a certain way for a shoe. And it's like, oh, you're getting your nails done again. Like you're so I'm like, no, I literally have to for my job. Like they have to look nice. And then, you know, you have to make sure your skin's nice. You got like, then you're paying for I'm getting spray tans all the time because when I'm doing swimsuits, I want to be a little bit more golden. Like, it just becomes a lot more of those type of appointments. And like

now I'm fucked. I'm hooked on blowouts because I'm like, well, I don't have to do my hair for shoots. It's just blown out and it's just done. So it's like that's an extra fee every week I'm hooked on blowouts because I'm like, well, I don't have to do my hair for shoots. It's just blown out and it's just done. So it's like that's an extra fee every week I'm doing. I would just say it's more stuff like that, honestly, because modeling is just appearance, honestly. And it comes down to how you take a photo. So it's like stuff like that that I feel like when I didn't have that job, I wouldn't get this all the time. I wouldn't need to, you know, always make sure I'm doing this or, you know, I have, I have a personal trainer, like, but I, but that's also a personal choice. You don't have to, but I would just say a lot of it is just like maintenance and appointments like that. And just

getting your makeup done, booking photographers, stylists, creatives, like, you know, styling your outfits. There's so many people on set when you're setting up a test shoot, that model is paying for it. So I'm paying for the photographer, I'm paying for the makeup artist, the hair artist, sometimes a creative director on set, it's like a lot is coming out of the models, you know, check. Yeah, and I'd say a lot falls on the model. When you say a test shoot, what do you mean? So test shoot is what you do like a photo shoot for your portfolio. So there's obviously like shoots that you do that's like paid work through a brand, this brand booked you and this is your rate. Or a test shoot is like, hey, we need more photos of lifestyle in your portfolio. Well, looks like you got to set up the shoot and that comes on the model. Yeah, so that that's like

a test shoot where no one knows like, I'm not getting paid, but I'm having other people help. Some people want to collab. Like, you know, photographers like let's shoot and you collab, you know, makeup artists. I want to do your makeup. Let's collab. That's fine. But majority of the time when you're doing a test shoot, it's the model has to pay for all of it. Yeah.

It's almost like actors doing headshots, right? Because it's like you're paying, you're footing the bill in order to get more work in theory. Well, and I'm thinking about, we'll talk about this later, but obviously like the Sports Illustrated cover or the Sports Illustrated photo, i'm thinking of like the waxing right and the like literally you in theory unless it's unless you are trying unfortunately trying to prove a point they you know you have to you have to largely be hairless and all of the places they expect you to be hairless no i have a shoot after this and they're like make sure you're shaving because we're doing swim shots too i'm like well now after I have to go

like shave every inch of my body, like it's, there's always, yeah. So I'll, I just started doing laser now because with swimsuit too, it's like, I don't want to have to keep, you know, shaving. So I'm going to try doing laser. Yeah. There's, there's a lot of little stuff like that, that people don't realize. And it's weekly too it's it's a lot it's a lot right because you can't be you can't have the five o'clock shadow or like I'm you're not gonna be able to see this but like I my nails are grown out you know like I've got shellac nails and they're grown out so this would not be allowed right and they still look relatively fine but like they're grown out so it'd be like you know I can't I can't wait the week or two that I normally would

I would have to go in and get them right and it's crazy because this industry is so last minute so you always have to be prepared like even if you don't have any shoots this week you can get a call and you have a shoot tomorrow in New York or you have a shoot in two days in San Francisco like you do I don't know my schedule ever like it's really hard to plan anything more than like three days in advance because everything is changing yeah it's very inconsistent. Like I just got my nails done before this because I have a shoot after and they were super outgrown. This one fell off this morning like it was a mess.

But I knew I had a shoot where sometimes I don't, but I just always have to be prepared. And then you can't get them too long. You either can do all nude, like they actually should probably be nude, but I just did a white French tip. But you can't get colors. Like I used to love getting like browns and pinks and like fun spring colors and summer. No colors, like all nude or white. Like nude toes, you would have to get a pedicure.

Like nothing could be chipped. Everything has to be like shaven and tan and hair has to look nice. And usually there's a makeup artist, but if there's not, you have to do the makeup. So then you're also buying all the makeup products. It's a makeup artist, but if there's not, you have to do the makeup. So then you're also buying all the makeup products. It's a lot. Well, we've talked a lot about the show on the everyday cost of being a woman and the expectation of how you look. And especially it's worse for women of color, right?

And we know this. But if you're a model, oh my god, that is amplified to the nth degree of everything has to be shootable. It has to be picture perfect. Which I think also going back to how inconsistent to this lifestyle is, I think that like, I was so excited to talk to you too about this today because of how inconsistent our income is. And that's something that I've struggled with. Talk to me about that. Yeah. It's like you literally could book like five shoots one month and make great money or whatever. And then you might not book another shoot for two months.

And it's like, you have to be so good with your money when you do get paid because you do not know when your check's coming next. And that's really hard. And I've been trying to find different avenues and different streams of income that I have more control over, you know, cause I do want financial freedom. And when I, and it's hard for models to like save and like learn how to, you know, what to do with your money, like manage your money because you get such a large sum at once sometimes if you're lucky and whatever, and you're, you know, we're blessed, but, but then you sometimes go months without it and it's a dry season or, you know, you're waiting 90 days to get paid from a client like what the you better have all this money backed up for the next like two months just in case so right that's been like I think a challenge but something I've always been really

good at saving I'd like to say and like be proud of myself for since I was a little kid so I feel like I've been able to manage it but I've also seen models you know go broke really quickly because they have to keep up with this lifestyle, like always getting everything done, but also going out to the nice dinners and whatever. And it's like buying themselves that nice bag, which is all great and treat yourself. But it's also like fifth, you might have a dry spell or like sometimes not the industry, like the modeling industry doesn't want, I don't know how to word this. Like, like sometimes you're not like a hot commodity in the modeling industry. Like I've had

a dry spell recently too, because I'm having a hard time with my body where I'm not big enough for a lot of jobs, but I'm also not small enough. So I'm in this weird ground of like, I'm not what the industry is really looking for right now. Like they want someone actually edgier looking than me a little bit more diverse looking than me right now. So and the industry is always changing what they want. It's so interesting. So it's like I have to be prepared for the industry might not want you as a model right now. Can I model the clothes so great? Yes. Can I still get a great photos and all this? Yes. But it's literally not personal to me. It's just what the industry wants at the time. So you also have to be prepared for that. Like there's so many things.

Does that hurt your feelings? Does that make you, does that make you feel bad? I would say at first I was more, it's discouraging and it's, yeah, it is because you go into a casting and you get shot down. You're getting told no so many times. Like I've literally never been rejected more. Like I've been told no so many more times, but I know that one yes is going to be huge and it has, and I've seen it. But, but I have to understand that all of this isn't personal, like, and and it's hard to like, get there. And for so long, I struggled with that. I'm like, well, what should I do? Should I and I would tell my agent, like, what can I do better? Should I get extension? Should I, you know, should I lose the weight? Or should I gain more weight? Like,

what do I do? And it's like, at the end of the day like do what's best for you and what makes you the happiest and like be the best version of yourself is what I always kind of preach or try to be the best version of yourself is kind of my like motto and then if they want you great and if they don't like you're still going to find a way to make it work and because it's always changing the hype is always changing what they want is like um trends styles everything's always changing in this industry it's always changing, the hype is always changing. What they want is like trends, styles. Everything's always changing in this industry. It's like being patient because your time will come. And so that's kind of how I've had to look at it.

Yeah, Kristen, who's our podcast producer and myself, we both come from theater backgrounds. And I'm finding a lot of what I have experienced. And I'm sure she is too. She's probably in the background snapping her fingers. It is very much like you put yourself out there very vulnerably. And then, you know, there's, there's a million reasons why they might have told you no. And, you know, you have very little control actually over the reasons. It's, I think if, you know, if you're talented, like you, it's very often, you know, the reason that you are not

getting booked for something is like yeah you and the other person that they're going to cast don't have chemistry or you know you uh are too tall for the other person they're trying to cast or like you know they already have somebody who quote-unquote looks like you and they're trying to find somebody else right so it's like it's very rarely oh you don't fit the part because you're not good enough right it's not that. There's a million other factors. And it's so easy to take that rejection personally, one, when you really care about your work, and two, when it's often your physical attributes,

right, or like the way you present yourself. Right. 100%. And it's hard. Like I said, at first I was very upset and I didn't understand it. And it made me feel like I needed to change myself. But I think once you realize that majority of things in life in general, honestly, aren't personal to you, the happier you'll be and the more confident you'll be. So I just try not to take almost anything personally. But especially in this industry, I have to understand that, you know, it could be something as small as like, we just really wanted a blonde for this role. Or it could be something like, you're so great and beautiful, but we wanted someone like a few inches taller than you. Like, you know what I mean? It literally could be the smallest thing. So it's like, I just don't fit like this exact what they're looking for, for this exact job. But there's so many

jobs that will come. Like, I'm not worried. Yeah, what you touched on, I think a lot of people experience, regardless of whether they're models or not, of this like inconsistent income of, you know, making bank one month and then having a dry spell for three months or six months. I have my own strategies around how I teach people to kind of manage that. What has worked for you in terms of, you know, budgeting, paying your expenses, you know, both for months where you're killing it and there might be an impulse to spend more versus months where not a lot of work is coming in. You know, I'd love to hear your advice before mine because my advice is not really that knowledgeable. I mean, a lot of it is about reserves. A lot of it is about understanding

that just because, I mean, we do this actually as business owners. Like I'm doing this right now is actually, a lot of people might not know this. We're recording this May 2nd. We're in a dry spell right now at HFK. And like, we're still doing fine. Like we'll be fine. But yeah, we're in a dry spell. Like April was our lowest month of revenue in about a year, like a long time. And so what I've had to do as a business owner is be strategic. And the months where we were making bank, I just held a lot of money back. And you know, it's called reserves, right? You put money in reserves for, you know, investing in the business further, or for, you know, when when you don't have such great a month, and you still have to make payroll, and you still have to, you know, pay, pay your pay your bills. So that's, that's,

you know, the thing that's strategic for me and then we also i also when i teach it i call it like your ramen noodle number of like what is the bare amount of money you need to make in order to afford your life like bare bones expenses and you know making sure that you have at least that that amount you know for for expenses every month is is the other thing I kind of am strategic with for business owners, but I would love to, I would love to hear what you do. There's no shame or judgment here. And I love how transparent you are because I think a lot of people like wouldn't even admit that. And I think that's so lame. And I think that's so cool that

you just said that because I also went through a dry spell with like modeling agencies. Like I'm still trying to find an agency in LA and I have some meetings lined up, but I've also been rejected by a ton and people might go on my Instagram and think she's killing it. She's with this person, this person, she's shooting every day. And I'm like, I've actually had a very dry spell and I'm having a very hard time to like find a good fit here in LA. And like, no one would know that unless they're listening to this right now. And I think that there's so much power in being vulnerable and open because so many people can relate. Are you kidding? Dry spells happen all the time. Totally. Well, and for me too, it's a lot of realizing like to your point

about like, I'm not getting paid for 90 days or 60 days or 30 days. It just happened to work that a lot of our invoices, we invoice during April and won't get paid till May. Totally. Right. So that's the other part a lot of people don't think about when you're running your own business. Right. And you are, you're running your own business as a model, right? You are running your own company. You're running your own business. So when you're running your own business, right? And you are, you're running your own business as a model, right? You are running your own company. You're running your own business. So when you're thinking about like the dry spell, isn't just because like, you know, there's a couple of factors for us. One of them is the fact that we just build a lot in April. So we won't actually receive it till May or June. So we'll have bigger months in May or June, but it just

happened to work out that April was not a great month for us. Totally. Same thing happened. January killed it. Best month I've ever had because I had all this back order of money coming from November. So January was a fat month. And then same thing, February we invoiced and whatever. And my biggest income right now is actually influencing. So I've been lucky enough to have a great social team and do a ton of influencing as well for different brands. But yeah, the whole waiting 30 to 60 days, sometimes 90 is just so ridiculous. But what I do honestly is kind of the same as you. I just know when I have a great month, I see it, I respect it. I'm super happy and grateful. And then I know to save like a huge chunk of that. And then also spend, you know, like a little bit

at a time. Like I don't, I rarely go out and just drop like a huge bag. So I've been, I've been, I've been pretty good at like knowing that and seeing that. And then also holding back a little bit when I get to a point where I don't have to hold back as much and I want to treat myself more and whatever, that's great. But yeah, I would say I'm pretty good at it. And I always invest back into my career and invest into myself. I feel like there's one thing I've struggled with is not really knowing exactly what to invest in. And I'd like ask my dad and I'd ask all these other financial gurus and listen to podcasts and read all the

books and listen to Gary Vee and Grant Cardone on real estate. And I just didn't know where to invest my money. And my dad always just say like, the number one thing is invest in yourself. And I, and I, and I'm literally where I'm at today because I did that. And I took the risk and I moved to LA and I saved that money. And, you know, but it's it's a challenge. Some months are harder than others, for sure. Totally. Do you get paid for a commercial shoot or a cover shoot? Like, do you get paid for those kind of opportunities? It depends for what. So I've never had a cover. I've never had a cover shoot. Like SI was just in the magazine, but it was a full page. We got paid for the shoot with them that

day. You did. That's what I was wondering. Yeah, we got paid. It's not as much as you would think probably either. But I think sometimes you get paid less for a bigger brand and a bigger opportunity because it's the name. Right. Which is so funny. A lot of people don't realize that. Like the amount of times Amazon has been in my email asking me to speak and they have the most minuscule budget, if they have a budget at all. And, you know, Amazon has a shit ton of money. All these brands have a shit ton of money, but they're like, oh, we know that you want us on your resume. And they use that to their advantage. So you're probably going to take it. Totally. But then the small brand and the small business that really is like respects you and your craft will book you for your rate, if not more, because they value you so much. But it's

like they're the ones that don't even have the biggest budget. And here they are fronting all this money, where someone like a huge brand, like you said, Amazon or all these other big companies will get away with paying you literally minute because they know you'll do it. Or anyone would do it for free, basically, is how they look at it which is so much bullshit do you feel do you know or either know or feel like you make less money as a curve model or is there less opportunity funny enough i actually heard from many of my smaller friend models straight size models that they actually get less for a rate than their curve model competitor, or I don't even want to say the word competitor, which I found really interesting

because I didn't know that. And that's such another thing that you talk about how money is so taboo to talk about. I don't really talk about rates with my friends really, because it's just this weird thing you don't talk about, which is bullshit in itself. But I didn't realize till recently that brands actually pay curve and plus size more because I think they I think they need it more and there's less of a what's the word competition or pool of like a market clientele. Yes. Whereas like straight size models are everywhere you look in LA, there's one like everywhere. Whereas curve and plus size, there's few and far between. And that like fit their size and their clothes well and model it well maybe.

So it's like harder to find a great curve plus size model that the brand always wants to book. So they're willing to pay more because they offer such a different diversity to set than just a straight size model is kind of like what we see a lot of them, you know. Do you feel like there's a plethora of straight size models or do you feel like it's a lack of plus size models? I think there's a plethora of straight size models, especially here in LA and New York and those big markets. I think there's a good amount of plus size and curve too, but I think this industry is newer. Like we haven't seen curve plus size until what, five, six years ago, six, six, seven years ago. So there's been like, if you got in at that time, like the Ashley grams and you know, the

other big time plus size models, like they got in at the very right time where that that shit boomed, right? And they popped off, right, became mainstream, right, right. And now when you want to get into it, I would recommend anyone and everyone like I, you know, always want to motivate someone to do it. But it is harder now because there is more competition. But yeah, I would recommend anyone and everyone like I, you know, always want to motivate someone to do it. But it is harder now because there is more competition. But yeah, I would say there's probably more straight size models, honestly, still because it's still a newer market. Yeah. Well, and if it's supply and demand, right, and you're 100 people going after one job versus 50 people going after one job, yeah, you're more likely to book the job, right? If there's a bunch of straight size models going after one job, and there another job for you know plus size and there's only 50 or so you know

only in quotes but there's 50 you know plus size or curve models you know yeah you're you're more likely to book the gig you know if there's less of you know your your body type going for the same role and there's a lot of brands too that get more hate for not including the diversity of like body inclusivity. And, you know, so brands are getting, you know, that pressure from society as well to include that more. So I think they're willing to front more of the money into that person. Whereas a straight size model, people aren't like, why aren't you putting more size twos in there? Like, that's not what the message is right now. You know, times are always like this. The industry is always like that, but that's not what the message is right now. You know, times are always like this. The industry is always like that.

But that's right now is necessarily not really what they want. So they're willing to front more of their budget into a curve plus size is what I've noticed. Yeah. Myself as a creative, we've had multiple musicians and different creatives on the podcast. And I know as a model, we are all paying agents and or managers a cut of everything we make that comes in for us. So can you talk to me a little bit about the process of getting an agent and what that cost is to you before you actually see any money that comes in?

So it's pretty standard across the board of 20% that a manager or an agent would get. I would say that it's kind of confusing because so modeling, there's also mother agents and a mother agent is when they help you get signed to an agency. So like I have a mother agent in New York, she's helping me get signed to other agencies in different markets. Once I sign with that agency and let's say New York or London or LA even right now, she then my mother agent will get 10% of every job I do with them because she put, she placed me with them. I know. And then that agent will then get only 10 rather than 20 because they split their 20 with my mother. So they're both getting 10. I just signed with an

agency normally, like I signed with elite Miami, they get 20% because that's just the normal agency standard fee. The client then pays the agency. The agency then sends the check to us. There's a lot of hidden fees in there. There's a lot of website fees. They're charging models. If you want to stay in a model apartment, they're charging you for that. You know, printing fee for printing your comp cards, which is like your portfolio card. There's a lot of fees that they put in there. And what's interesting is a lot of agents don't really like me because I feel like I'm a boss in itself. We're like, I'm asking the hard questions. I'm asking what those fees are. And a lot of agents don't want to deal. As you should.

Exactly. And you'll appreciate this. And a lot of agents don't want to deal. As you should. Exactly. And you'll appreciate this. And a lot of agents don't like dealing with models like me because they just want a model to show up, look pretty, take the photo, and you're done. Yeah, that's called exploitation. That's called them having knowledge about something that you don't and then them getting upset when you have the audacity that's yeah predatory exploitative yeah oh my god mic drop I could literally go on about this for so long you have no idea but yeah it's literally manipulation we got an hour baby let's go literally it's so messed up how agents like manipulate and take advantage of models because

they think that these models are just pretty faces that aren't going to say anything. And I'm like, that's not me. You have the wrong girl. And I think a reason why I've also been rejected by agencies lately too, is I think I come off very strong when I have meetings with them and I don't think they like it because one, it might intimidate them too. They don't want to deal with me because they know I'm going to be a lot AKA on my shit. What's up? What are the castings this week? What do we have going on where's my payment from 60 days the contract said 30 like i'm looking at this stuff and they hate me for it so like yep can't wait to one day have my own agency and pop the fuck off but we love it it's just yeah it's really hard to like get taken advantage of in this industry and see other

models just kind of be like oh i don't know my agent just said it was this way. I'm like, wait, what? So you don't know if that was their budget. Like, like, did you like try to like, come back with a higher rate? Like no one's negotiating for themselves. Like, I'm like, what are we doing here? Like, and no one teaches the same way. No, I feel the same way for creatives because I only just signed with an agent late last year because we had actually our agent brokered our podcast deal and it was like I could not have gotten the deal we did unless I had an agent but prior to that I had like I could have gotten an agent far before I actually did but I knew that that wouldn't have

been the smart move because I was going to advocate for myself arguably better than anybody else could. A and B, it was like I saw so many creatives, so many people who were very like right brain, you know, actually, you know, defined as both, you know, capital C creatives, but also as the attribute creative. Right. Who were just good filmmakers or just good actors or just good, you know, influencers, but didn't understand the business side. And so they'd hire an agent or, and, or a manager to do it for them. But what would happen is, yeah, to your point, like they, they wouldn't know the type of questions to ask or, you know, they'd have people. Right. Or like the small print, like, oh, like there's so many things. Oh my God. I, I've had agents that don't have my best interest in mind. And I got into like this huge,

I kind of just want to say it. I've never publicly talked about this, but I got dropped from my last agency here. And this woman, the owner, is a very unlikable woman in this industry. Define unlikable because I hear unlikable and I'm like, that's a word that's weaponized. So yeah, define it for us.

Okay. Very fat phobic, very manipulative, ego driven, does not have the model's best interest in mind. Very demeaning, puts the models down. Like she would make girls weigh themselves back in the day and step on a scale when they when they walked in. And she's she's cut throat. And I, me and her did not see eye to eye. And I had every right to ask a question about a contract I actually did not sign in which they thought I did. asked her a question. And it triggered her ego so bad because it made her look bad in front of another agent because she was wrong. And I was right. I asked her one question. And within one fucking minute, she dropped me from the agency. Within two minutes, my photos were down from the website, completely gone and vanished. And she emailed me

back and basically said, wishing you all the best. I think it's best you continue on the path without us. Thanks so much. XOXO. And I never heard from this woman again. And she dropped me. Got some girl. Wow. With no notice. Wow. No 30 days, whatever. No. And that's what's fucked in the modeling industry because we have no rights. We don't get any type of like notice of like job removal and getting fired, like basically fired for no good reason at all. By the way, I was so respectful. So nice. I told everyone what I wrote

in my email and everyone was like, dude, you said nothing wrong. Like you literally just asked a question about what you signed. Right. Well, and as much as that experience sucks, she showed you true colors, right? And you probably would not have wanted to work with her anyway, right? So it's like as much as that sucks, do you, and this might be my own naivete, like, you know, again, with acting, we have,

you have unions, right, that you get and you have equity, right, that you get to at a certain point. Does that exist for models? Like, no. And if it does, I haven't heard of it. There's no union for models? Oh, who do we have to call? Ella, let's go to Washington, D.C. That's such bullshit. There's no union. There's no rights for models at all, at all. No protection. How, how is that legal that I got literally dropped because I triggered her ego with no notice dropped like it was nothing unfollowed off Instagram photos off the website done. Like I didn't exist there. And I'm like, and literally I have not been signed in LA since that happened. So she like really fucked me over, but it's the best I've ever been doing with other

social and other incomes. So I'm actually doing great. So she can, you know, go whatever. No, go ahead. I appreciate you sharing. Well, it is, I mean, you could argue like I'm, I'm playing devil's advocate of a listener who's going like, you know, at most corporate companies, you know, especially like depending on the state for me, you know, I'm based in Seattle and like, you know, it's an at will employment state, right? You can, you can get fired or let go with, you know, no particular reason and no particular notice, right? It's like at will employment. But yeah, when you own your own business, it's, it's more, I mean, I don't know if you have a legal case against her. It's more just like, that's not how you do business. Like that's just super, super not cool. Oh, but then like

the natural extension for me is like, is there some sort of protection out there? Like, you know, if, you know, with, with Broadway, I'm in New York right now, you know, recording this, right. If you were equity, if you were, if you were SAG during the pandemic, a lot of people still got support during that time because they were part of a union, right? If that doesn't exist for models, what the fuck does that mean for you all? Yeah, no, no, no. Models did not get any help at all with COVID, nothing. And it's like, it was just one day your work was gone. So that's why I'm always trying to think outside the box of just building out more of a brand for myself and other streams of income because F relying on just one, especially something

so inconsistent like modeling, you know. Talk to me about those streams of income. Like what for you have you established besides modeling gigs that are bringing in money for you that you can control? This one I'm not as much in control of, I would say, but I, I mean, I love it. I have a great social team. So I have like a manager that pitches me to brands and all that stuff. Kind of like you have the TA. Yeah. So I have a talent agency. That's great. And I would say that's probably my biggest stream of income is doing brand deals. And then I have modeling. I do want to get like, I want to create something where I have more control over where it's under my name and my brand. Um, so I'm in the works of building out more of like confidence coaching.

Cool. But I've never really talked much about it. But yeah, I'm in the works of building that out and just kind of building out more of a community feel. I really want to build like a safe space community for my followers and audience to just literally try to become the best version of themselves and help me, you know, work with them and grow that community out more. So I've been working on that. I've done like some entrepreneur stuff with another swimsuit company, which that didn't turn out that great. But that's a different

story. But I did like design a line with them, like stuff here and there. But I would say mainly, it's just social media and modeling right now. That's my biggest dream. But I'm always thinking of ways whether it's like selling my my clothes or like, I feel like I've always been an entrepreneur at my spirit, but more stuff's in the works, I think. See my business coach, the business coach in me is immediately like, sell a $10 ebook about how to pose. Literally. Okay.

Sports Illustrated. okay sports illustrated this is like this this is this is like you my new york times feature feels like your sports illustrated thing where i have been chasing the new york times especially a feature for years i have been like squeaky wheel until i got the grease and i feel like that's how you were with sports illustrated like you wanted the thing and you were like, I am going after it. Can you talk to me about the perseverance to get it? And also like, what was the process of like trying to pitch yourself until you finally fucking got it in 2021? Okay. Congratulations, by the way, about the New York Times. Thank you. Congratulations. You look so good. I was looking at the other day. I'm like, God, she's fucking hot. She looks so good. You look so good. Thank you. I was so I was so happy. I was so happy. No, it was it was a journey. It was about three and a half years

of trying out. I first started in Hawaii. I was working at a restaurant and I actually got fired from my restaurant job and I was heartbroken and it was like so political and stupid and I just didn't get along with the manager and I it was just horrible and I remember just being like you will regret this decision and I'm gonna blow the fuck up and I was like I'm going for sports illustrated and I wasn't even a model I had no followers wasn't an influencer I had maybe a thousand followers at the time. And I was like, I'm going to get Sports Illustrated. Never modeled a day in my life. Took photos.

Like the video was blurry. It was like, it was the worst video ever, but it's so cute to look back on. And obviously I didn't get it. But I put myself out there 2018. 2019 comes along. I actually had been doing some modeling jobs on my own. Just, you know, freelance stuff in Hawaii for bikini companies. Had more experience modeling and posing in front of the camera. And I had more of a message about

confidence and body positivity. I hired my friend to do the video. It was a great quality video. It was actually a great, I like, I'm so happy with this video till today. I didn't get it, but I remember sitting at a restaurant in Hawaii and I saw that as I posted my video. And at this time, like I said, I had no fault. This is huge exposure. I literally remember dropping my phone, bawling my eyes out. Everyone at the restaurant's like, are you okay? I like ran out of the restaurant. I called my family. I was like, Sports Illustrated just posted me. Oh my God. Like literally shaking on. I was like, I think I got it. Like that kind of just showed me like, I literally thought I was going to get it. Fast

forward. I didn't get it, but I didn't stop there. I was like, there's no way I'm going to get this. So last minute they said they're doing an open casting in Miami. And if you want to come like whatever it's dimes on you, just come out here, whatever. I had maybe like a thousand dollars to my name serving at a restaurant in college. And I dropped probably $700 within a day's notice, dropped everything, went to Miami, got the hotel, did the whole thing, waited in line at 4.30 in the morning. The whole line wrapped all the way around this massive building, this hotel in Miami, waited in line, had a comp card, which at the time I wasn't with an agent. So I had no idea how to do it. I went to like your local

like printing station in Hawaii to print out four photos next to each other to make a comp card, which at the time I wasn't with an agent. So I had no idea how to do it. I went to like your local like printing station in Hawaii to print out four photos next to each other to make a comp card. So cute. Waited in line, got to the front after like six, seven hours. And I had my meeting or my, my interview. And it was just like, not the most genuine interview. This model had like her phone out with the timer on. you only had two minutes to sell yourself and then the timer goes up. Wow. And I just like couldn't sell myself. I was so nervous. I was freaking out. I kind of like lost it a little bit of like an identity of like, I don't really know. Like, I just got to my head. I overthought it all. I don't think I did well. I left. I was pretty upset about it. And I didn't get it. So fast forward to 2020 COVID hit. So everything gets pushed back. I don't even

know if they're doing it this year, but I'm like, I'm going to get it. It was on my vision board three years. I know I'm going to get it. It's just a matter of when. And then they ended up announcing that they were doing it, but online, I was like, great. So I, I, this time I had, I just moved here, invested even more money into a videographer, a makeup artist, hair, invested even more money into a videographer a makeup artist hair did the whole thing shot the whole video great audio great video footage and then I didn't really hear anything but I kept pushing on TikTok I was tagging them every day every single day for the last like four years I think I've tagged sports illustrated in every photo not anymore now because they know me and they've noticed me but for them to notice me it probably was three years of tagging them and like Ashley Graham, Hunter McGrady, Tara Lynn, all these big time plus size models. So finally, I got more of

a social media presence. They knew about me. They saw me on TikTok. They would comment on my stuff. And at this time, I was like, my time is now like it's gonna happen. It took so long to hear. But then I finally got a call back, freaked out, cried, did the whole thing. I could not believe I was going to sit face to face and talk to them, talk to them, thought I crushed it, was super nervous. Don't know, you know, whatever. It's not in my hands anymore. Didn't hear for another two, three months. Finally found out I got another call back. I'm like, what the, Oh my God, no way. Freaking out. I have another call back. We get on the call back. I want to say it was either March or April of 2021 last year. And I was leaving for Hawaii that day.

I changed my flight, obviously had to be here, figured it out, whatever. I get on the call and it's with like 15 other girls. And then the editor, the editors and MJ is the main editor. And MJ gets on the call and she starts it with, hi guys. I just want to let you know that you're looking at the top 15 finalists of sports illustrated 2020 and we're like oh I'm screaming I'm like bawling everyone's crying like and that's how I knew I got it it was like crazy and that's four years summed up in like five minutes I'm like I'm riveted I'm like you look so That is like, literally that was my mom told me all the time is like squeaky wheel gets the grease. And granted you be polite, right? You be polite and you don't like

push people. But like, if you want something, you chase it. Like nothing was stopping me. Like nothing. I was like, I'm getting this. And you'll, and I literally, I was like, at this point they almost probably had to, or I was just gonna keep hounding them in their fucking dms and tagged posts like right right you get to the point you're like I don't care how I get in here I don't care how if it's slightly annoying you so you get me to shut up fine fine that's fine you've given me grease I don't care how I get it like I don't care and that's that's the persistence that you need for like anything that you want in life is just like that persistence and consistency. Like I said, I never missed a day of like not tagging them. I never Yep, you know, I was really consistent. You can say that. And then that's when

Ashley Graham followed me on TikTok. And she noticed me which was huge, because she's like my biggest role model. And that was like a really big moment for me. And it was actually really cute on my shoot day in Atlantic City, we were shooting because COVID, we couldn't go abroad, unfortunately. But we shot in Atlantic City. And that day, I had stayed up all night the night before watching Ashley Graham's YouTube videos of her modeling to like learn from the best, basically. And I remember sending her a message.

And I was like, she'll never see this on Instagram because she didn't follow me or anything. And I was like, I just want to let you know like you're my biggest inspiration and like I'm literally staying up watching your videos like tomorrow's my biggest day ever it's like I'm shooting with Sports Illustrated or whatever she literally sent me a voice message back when I was on my shoe and I literally lost it like I showed MJ I was crying MJ got emotional and it literally was, an audio and she was just like, I am so proud of you, Gabrielle, you should be so proud of yourself. Like, your time is now I'm so excited for you, like, go out there and kill it. And I was like, bawling. And I was like,

to hear from your role model on set for the biggest shoot of your life was something that like, I will never forget, you know. And I didn't want to like tell the other girls because I wanted to keep that very private for me. And I, you know, and it was just so special to like hear from her. And I just went out there with insane confidence. Like it gave me such a different level of confidence to know that my idol just said that I deserve to be here. Yeah.

I'm tearing up. I'm like, well, cause she paved the way, right? Like she, and you know, many others, like, tearing up. I'm like, well, cause she paved the way, right? Like she and, you know, many others, like, you know, unfortunately, like, would you have been there that day? You know, obviously so talented and beautiful and all of those things. Right. But it's like so much of this industry has been, you know, usurping what it, what we define as beautiful, right. Or what we define as, as, you know, worthy, quote, unquote, of putting on a magazine, right? Or putting in a magazine, right?

She totally paved the way. And I think what's really cool is to see how full circle a lot of it is. Because now I have people saying, like, I'm their Ashley Graham. And I've been on like, a lot of girls vision boards, which is so cool. And like, girls telling me that, like, you know, I paved the way for them to do this and for them to wear the bikini. And it's like, that was Ashley for me. So that's cool that I can be someone else's Ashley in a way. So it's such a full circle moment, the whole experience. And I'm just so glad to be able to say I did it. And it was such a great experience. And I hope to work with them again. But every year, it's kind of situational and who they choose that year. I feel like I did it. Like, I feel like I won. Like, even though I didn't

necessarily get rookie, I still feel like I did it. Like I'm in the magazine. Like, you know, so it was crazy. It's so wild. Um, sports illustrated was largely for and by men for a long time. And it seems like now women are embracing the magazine. Why do you think this is? And do you feel like it's like a positive direction that we're moving into? Yeah, I do. I think for so long, it was like what men wanted to see. And it was just tailored towards that audience. And I think now it's very male gaze. Yeah, for sure. And I would say it's now way more inclusive. And it has been for the last, I would say, six, seven years, way more so now than before. But they were like the start.

And that's why I wanted to be an SI so badly. I never wanted to, let's say, necessarily really be in Playboy at the time because I didn't really see them doing much of like a, you know, inclusivity thing. But it was like the SI magazine was like a team that always preached like confidence and inclusivity. And, you know, they had the most beautiful diverse models. So that's why I was like, I want to be there. Like I want to be where those people are doing it. So they have been doing it for a while, I would say way more now than before, for sure, the times and everything. But I think it's awesome what they're doing. And I think they really are making a change and taking a stand. I think with that comes a lot

of hate and backlash. And I've seen a lot of, you know, on the on the flip side, a lot of haters and a lot of guys saying, what is this? And this is not what a model should look like. But I think they know what they're doing. But I think, yeah, I think it's moving in a positive direction, for sure. Do you feel like you've quote unquote unquote made it? Oh, that's a tough question. That's deep. I would say I'm super proud of how far I've come in a short amount of time, but I feel like I haven't even scratched the surface. That makes sense. Like there's so much more inside of me that I want to share and give and do that. Like, I feel like I really am just getting started. You know, I feel the same way. Yeah. Yeah. And I don't, I don't want

to settle. And I think that's like such an amazing aspect of a lot of entrepreneurs and stuff is like, you know, I'm a dreamer. I have all these big dreams and stuff, and I'm so proud of where I've come and I'm, I'm trying to learn to be more present and be very appreciative. But I just have such big, crazy dreams that I'm like, OK, buckle up. I'm just getting started. And I don't want to just accept this as my end goal. So I would say I've made it far quickly, especially from where I came from. And I never came from money.

And I never came from fame. especially from where I came from. And I never came from money. And I never came from fame. I never came from, you know, financial stability, really, or connections or a famous boyfriend, like I've really just been doing out here alone. But I think with that build so much character and strength. And I think you talk a lot about it on your other episodes, too, is like, I never wanted to rely on someone for financial stability. And I'm single and I like, and I love that. I'm just so focused on my career and I never want to put like all my eggs in one basket and have to just like rely on a man ever for that because the second they might break up with you or leave you, it's like, I never want to be stressed. Like I want to have my own.

I want to have my own. Or you have the option of leaving them because you have money, right? You have the option of getting out of a relationship. Yep, totally. Totally. So I think that's really cool with being, you know, a boss, I'd like to say. And I think even with my parents, like I think I never had that like stable like support financially from them as much. So I think I at a younger age, I learned to be independent

and like knowing like, okay, if I want something, I'm getting on my own. Like daddy's not just going to give me the money. Like we got to do it. So it's been, it's been cool though. And I'm like grateful for my journey. You mentioned that you're getting messages from girls, from women saying that you're their Ashley Graham. If they're listening, what message do you have for them? they're Ashley Graham, if they're listening, what message do you have for them? It's a good question. If you could send each and every one the voicemail that you got from Ashley Graham, what are you saying to them? I would say just knowing that you are so enough and that you have everything that you need already inside of you. You don't need to seek for external validation

or seek anything outside. Everything you really need in life is within you. You don't need to seek for external validation or seek anything outside. Everything you really need in life is within you. And I think just knowing how special and unique you all are individually, I think is so powerful and to try so hard to not compare to anyone else because the grass isn't always greener and everyone always has a struggle on going through something. So I would say focus on yourself, you know, take it day by day to focus on becoming like the best version of you. And that looks so different than everyone else. And just know how we all have a purpose within all of us.

And there's a reason why you're here listening to this today. And I just like want to give people that like motivation to go after what they want, go after their dreams and like be that confidence badass bitch that you are because literally no one else is like you is what I would say to them. I love it. Where can people find you? Where can they learn more about your confidence coaching? Plug away. Yeah. Right now you can find me on Instagram and TikTok at Ella Halikas. And I will be launching some fun other projects, hopefully very, very soon that I'm working on. So if you are someone that wants to join my community, hit the follow because there's

some special announcements coming up with Confidence Coaching. And I just would love to work with you guys more as a group and one-on-one. Amazing. Thanks for being here. And thank you for your vulnerability. Yeah. Thank you so much for having me. You were great. it was nice learning about you and like meeting you so fun thanks for having me thank you oh i love this episode today it was so good thank you once again to ella

for joining us and sharing her story and her experience so candidly. The story about her messaging Ashley Graham gives me chills every fucking time. It's so good. We love when women, it makes me so happy. Make sure to follow Ella on all of her social platforms. We'll have her links in our show notes. If you're loving these conversations or if you have a topic you'd like us to cover, or again, no one's said they've spotted Timothy Chalamet and I know one of you has. So feel free to leave us a voicemail, leave us a review. Reviews are one of the best ways to support the show as well as we just love hearing your voices. We love hearing you engage with our podcast and ask us good questions and they've inspired future episodes. So we really appreciate,

again, not only your support, but also your questions, your reviews. It makes the show better. Feel free to share the show with your friends, your family, and on social media, and make sure to tag us at Financial Feminist Podcast on Instagram. As always, we have so much information in the show notes. So if you want to engage further with some of the topics we've talked about today, if you want to go further with some of the topics we've talked about today, if you want to go back in the archive and listen to old episodes, all of that is available either linked in our show notes or just by scrolling back on your favorite podcast platform.

Thanks for being here as always. Catch you later, financial feminists. Have a good one. Thank you for listening to Financial Feminist, a Her First 100K podcast. Financial Feminist is hosted by me, Tori Dunlap. Produced by Kristen Fields. Marketing and administration by Karina Patel, Olivia Koning, Charisse Wade, Alina Helzer, Paulina Isaac, Sophia Cohen, Valerie Oresko, Jack Koning, and Ana Alexandra.

Research by Arielle Johnson. Audio engineering by Austin Fields, promotional graphics by Mary Stratton, photography by Sarah Wolf, and theme music by Jonah Cohen Sound. A huge thanks to the entire Her First 100K team and community for supporting the show. For more information about Financial Feminist, Her First 100K, our guests, and episode show notes, visit financialfeministpodcast.com.