Finding Peak w/ Ryan Hanley - A Brain Dump on Digital Insurance Distribution Part II

Episode Date: March 3, 2022

Spartan philosophy, built in the black-ops lab of business: https://www.findingpeak.comFinding Peak podcast: https://linktr.ee/ryan_hanleyAfter a 3-week hiatus, The Ryan Hanley Show is back, with a deep breakdown of the trends and ideas impacting the digital distribution of insurance products in 2022.This is Part II of a two-part series.Don't miss this one...Episode Highlights:Ryan discusses the Reuter’s report, “Insurance Distribution: 7 Key Trends for 2022” (3:06)Ryan talks about trend number 1, M&A activity, and explains that increased M&A doesn't necessarily lead to increased distribution. (5:18)Ryan explains that acquiring the right agency or set of agencies can be an enormous way to increase your distribution. (8:20)Ryan discusses trend number 2, the resilience of intermediaries, and what's in their books. (10:17)Ryan explains trend number 3 which is ecosystems openness, and the drive to circularity. (13:33)Ryan mentions that the innovation train is waiting for no one and innovation is already happening.(18:15)Ryan explains why embedded insurance, trend number 6, is something that we brokers should be most scared about. (24:07)Ryans shares trend number 7, customers are driving flexibility. (28:39)Ryan provides two different options and or ways how you can run your business successfully. (30:08)Ryan shares how he wants to deliver and be different from the rest. (33:17)Key Quotes:"The most opportunistic brokers are going to be the ones that can step forward and take market share from the competitors." - Ryan Hanley"But from a communication standpoint, flexibility is a key driver to scalable growth, in my opinion." - Ryan Hanley"I tell you today, our process isn't perfect. It's certainly not everything that I want it to be. But I know where we're going." - Ryan HanleyResources Mentioned:Reach out to Ryan Hanley--Recommended Tools for GrowthOpusClip: #1 AI video clipping and editing tool: https://link.ryanhanley.com/opusRiverside: HD Podcast & Video Software | Free Recording & Editing: https://link.ryanhanley.com/riversideWhisperFlow: Never waste time typing on your keyboard again: https://link.ryanhanley.com/whisperflowCaptionsApp: One app for all your social media video creation: https://link.ryanhanley.com/captionsappGoHighLevel: It's time to take your business workflow to the Next Level: https://link.ryanhanley.com/gohighlevelPerspective.co: The #1 funnel builder for lead generation: https://link.ryanhanley.com/perspective--Episodes You Might Enjoy:From $2 Million Loss to World-Class Entrepreneur: https://lnk.to/delkFrom One Man Shop to $200M in Revenue: https://lnk.to/tommymelloIs Psilocybin the Gateway to Self-Mastery? https://lnk.to/80upZ9This show is part of the Unplugged Studios Network — the infrastructure layer for serious creators. 👉 Learn more at https://unpluggedstudios.fm.Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

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It really helps the show grow. From all of us at Believe, have a Merry Christmas, everyone, and a happy holiday. Hello, everyone, and welcome back to the show. This is part two of our two-part show on Digital Distribution in 2022. What it means, how to dominate the world. I don't know. When I started talking in part one, I didn't really think about what the title is.

So who the hell knows what I'll title this. Hopefully I titled it something similar to what I just said. But quick shout out to a couple sponsors. Cotery insurance guys, I get asked all the time, like how are we able to place business as fast as we do? One of the tools that we use is codery insurance. Cotery is awesome. General liability.

They have bought products. They're coming out with new stuff. but they're just so fast and it's not a good fit for every risk but for what coterie does man they can throw some professional in there for some classes really really well done i love codery i love what they're doing happy to partner with them coterie c-t-e-c-r-i-e-c-t-r-i-e codery insurance check them out get appointed write business faster uh also want to give a shout out to Tarmica, T-A-R-M-I-K-A, T-A-R-M-I-K-A dot-com. Tarmica, guys, Tarmica is another tool that we use to quote business faster.

Quote business faster with Tarmica, commercial business. I'm sure they're coming out with PL this year. They got like 30 carriers. And instead of going to all these websites individually and all these portals, everyone's got a portal, every portal's different. The way they ask the questions is different. Everyone thinks their portal is best. Some are good, some are not good

who the, you know, I guess that's personal opinion. Tarmika solves that problem by pulling it all into one space. You can get multiple quotes. Tons of classes of business, tons of lines of business. Great people. Great product. Just so thankful for Tarmica at what they've done. T-A-R-M-I-K-A, T-R-M-I-K-A.

And finally, Pathpoint, kind of doing the same thing as codery, changing the game in the E-N-S space, allows you to get quote-bind issue, E&S quotes for general liability, property, lots of lines of business. E&S is part of this business, especially if you're going to do commercial, and PathPoint is making that very easy to do. Go to Pathpoint.com search Pathpoint Insurance in Google or DuckDuggo or wherever you do Google searches.

Huge fan of Pathpoint. We do a lot of business with Pathpoint. Love them. Happy. They are a sponsor. Okay. So let's get into this insurance distribution. Seven Trends of 2022.

This was done by Reuters. and I think I mentioned in part one, Mark Syke, S-E-I-C-H-S-E-E-H-E-C-CH, I have no idea how to pronounce Mark's last name, but he looks like a good dude. He's the chief customer-experience officer of Berkeley Fire Marine, Craig Wealth's Chief of Distribution and Marketing Officer at Westfield, Bobby Colley's VP of Strategic Distribution at Grange Insurance, and Tim Riley, Senior Director of Digital Distribution at Tokyo Marine. They were the contributors to this report,

and I found this report very interesting and wanted to talk through the trends and give you my opinions on this. If you Google the future... What the hell is the name of this? Insurance Distribution, seven key trends of 2022. You'll find this white paper. I think you got to pop in your email or whatever.

They didn't... You don't have to do that. Just listen to this if you want to. But if you want the thing, you got to go there and you put your email in and then they're going to send you a bunch of marketing stuff for this event they're having in June, which you can just unsubscribe to if you don't want that

or go to the event. It's probably cool. But either way, I want to talk through this because I thought it was a really good. If you listen to Part 1, kind of got a little heady, a little deep on some concepts. This is going to be a little more lighthearted as we talk through some of the insurance distribution trends that these guys pulled out. I want to talk to them and then talk through some of my thoughts in addition to what these trends are. So the introduction goes in 2022, insurance across all lines of business looking ahead, plotting their distribution models for the landscape potential integrated and integrated.

There's a bunch of marketing and like consultancy words in here. Whatever. Insurance distribution is important. We pretty much put that nail in the coffin in part one. So if you're listening to this part and you haven't listened to part one, maybe you want to go back and listen to part one. But all right, so let's get in these trends. Trend number one, M&A activity and moments that matter.

So basically, both Bobby and Craig both believe that M&A is going to continue. I think that's a fair statement. We had over a thousand transactions, I think for the first time ever in the history of our industry, we had over a thousand transactions in 2021 and we're on pace to do that again in 2022. I do not see that slowing down at all. I will say that increased M&A doesn't necessarily lead to increased distribution. Because when you buy an agency, when roll-ups take over agencies, there's a lot of funny business that happens, right? There's a lot of book rolling.

There's a lot of – it doesn't necessarily mean that when you acquire a new business, that all of a sudden you're going to have more distribution. It just means you're buying policies, which isn't a bad thing. I mean, that's not a knock. You know, we've, at Rogue, we've looked at a couple agencies. We've had a couple conversations. Nothing's happened yet, which is fine. But, you know, as Craig mentions in here, digital or not, you need to provide a quality experience at the crucial moments, like the claims, billing, that kind of stuff.

I couldn't agree more. You know, billing is a major, major problem in our space. We use Ascend for E&S billing stuff, but what we really need is a portal for billing that pulls all the carrier billing systems together into one tool. Kind of like a tarmica, but for billing because, geez, guys, if you're at a carrier, just understand that your billing process probably blows. It's just so terrible to, you know, especially if you're working in commercial because like we might have one policy, you know, we may have the bop and the workers' comp with

Hanover, but the commercial auto is with guard and the D&O is with Berkeley, you know, management protection or whatever. I mean, it's like you could have three, four different carriers in one program because that's how you properly set up a commercial insurance program. And then you have four different billing experiences. And the customer's like, oh, my God, did I pay this bill? Did I pay that bill? I have no idea.

And I'm sure there's ways to invoice it and all this kind of stuff. But as an agency, how involved in handling customer money do you want to be? and trust accounts are bad enough, which is a freaking bananas concept that we're actually holding premium payments in our agency and all the liability and fiduciary liability that comes on. I've talked about that with Ascend before. Go back and listen to that episode that I did with Stevie Anderson and Andrew Wynn and Peter McDonald for Wonder Right. Andrew Wins from Ascend.

And we talk about Ascend a little bit in there and what they're doing for E&S and why they've kind of gotten, they're allowing agencies or helping agencies reduce their trust account, that they take on. But kind of, that would be a tremendous product. That would be an absolutely tremendous product, a tarmica for billing. I'm sure carriers wouldn't allow you to do that because they think their experience is the best experience and doing a lot of banging on carriers in these two parts. I don't mean that.

I like a lot of the carriers that we do business with. It's just our bar for these things is so low compared to other spaces and it just drives me nuts. It drives me nuts. But those problems are slowly getting fixed. Okay. So kind of talking to this trend, is M&A a digital distribution? Yes and no.

I mean, I think done right, acquiring the right agency or set of agencies or whatever can be an enormous way to increase your distribution and to increase your ability to write policies and grow. But, man, there's a lot of stuff. And, you know, I haven't bought an agency. but I have a lot of friends at Abbot, A, Cesar, or Ben bought themselves. And it just, done right,

it's a 1 plus 1 equals 3. Done wrong, it's a to swallow a bullet kind of moment. And I think you just have to be very careful. But what's true for sure, especially if you're thinking about this from the carrier perspective or from like the agency network perspective, is that M&A activity is going to continue and is going to disrupt things,

constantly. There's just going to be lots of stuff happening. I do think that one really positive thing for agencies in particular brokers or whatever is that the MNA activity is throwing off a lot of really good talent into the pool. And while if you only are willing to hire local people, that may not help you too much, if you're willing to extend your hiring to the broader, you know kind of united states or or super regionally man there's a lot of really good people out there really really good people and um you can take advantage of that because some of these roll-ups they're they're brought into p situations or you know they don't want to work for you know international national whatever you know they just don't want to work for those organizations and those people

get thrown off or they get downsized and they're out there and you can scoop them up so i think that's a good opportunity which can help with distribution i guess all right trend number two the resilience of and what's on their books. So basically in this intermediaries, brokers, rogue, if you're a broker you, intermediaries as a whole continue to be extremely resilient. We learned about that in part one. And they continue to add an immense amount of value

to insurance providers. We add the value to insurance providers. We add the value. Carriers are the product. Brokers are the value creators. Carriers are the product. Brokers are the value creators. So I would have to agree with Mr.

Mr. Riley here, the Senior Director of Digital Distribution at Tokyo Marine. Resilience is a really good word to use, though. I like that word, resilience. I think you have to be resilient because this market is so crazy. And as of recording this, you know, Russia is invading the Ukraine. So who the heck knows what's going to happen? Where our country is run by a freaking moron. And he's surrounded by even bigger morons.

who would rather have conversations about masks than our economy, jobs, our place in the freaking world. Who the hell knows what's going to happen? Sorry, I got political for you the second there. I mean, he's basically the worst president that we may have had since, like, Hoover. And if you didn't see that coming, then maybe you need to reevaluate some life decisions.

But that all being said, I think we have some crazy times coming, and it's going to be stressful and emotional and you have social media crap to deal with and all the interpersonal shit that goes on in your personal life and your culture, your company and you got to deal with all that stuff and you got to deal with inflation and what's going to happen with that and increased rates. We have to be headed towards a hard market, right? I mean, I guess we've done episodes in the past where we talked maybe we're in a hard market,

whatever. Like we have to be headed towards a hard market with everything that's going on. and it just, I feel like resilience is the key, right? Brokers, brokers are the value creators, and the most resilient, the most opportunistic brokers are going to be the ones that are able to step forward and take market share from their competitors who decide to hunker down and play it safe.

This does not feel, I feel like you have to be smart, right? You don't want to just take wild risk because it is a more tumultuous time. but if you can walk that chaos and order line, the little Jordan Peterson for us today, but if you can kind of walk that line, that yin and yang of chaos and order, if you can have one foot in each bucket

of both thinking about the security, sustainability, profitability of your business while managing an opportunistic mindset that can take advantage of things as they materialize in front of us and deploy resources and grow, that those are going to be the brokers who stand out. those are going to be the organizations that rapidly push forward and create space between themselves and their competition.

I feel like this is a moment where people aren't going to bunch, they're going to separate. The primetime players, the PTPers, as Dickie V used to say, they're going to separate themselves. And that's exciting because I don't know. I'd like to consider myself one of them. Maybe not bootstrapped. I probably have to take a little bit of cash if I want to do that. but certainly interesting. Something to consider.

All right, trend number three. Ecosystems, openness, and the drive to circularity. Just a freaking weird word. So in this trend, I'll just read you some of this. So if there's anything that the pandemic called out, says Mark, I'm not going to butcher his last name again, the chief customer, experience officer, specialty property underwriter at Berkeley Fire and Marine,

is that the days of doing business in a linear fashion are numbered. Amen to that mark. The insurance ecosystem of the future is going to be way more circular and more connected than it is today. And how the insured interacts with everybody on that spectrum is going to drastically change. If there is more circularity of data and insights can be shared between carriers and intermediaries. What I think is funny about this is that digitizing brokers have been, yes, from the mountain tops for more access to data and more connectivity for what a decade now and carriers are like no now now you don't need that pat you on the head you know you just go sell your policies and you know you should be happy with the franchise value of your appointment and um and you know

so marks right on the button but carriers need to freaking open up and brokers you you know you got to be willing to to play the game right you got to be willing to use the information now that's not an easy thing to do. So we could do a whole 10 episode series on how to actually take in data, deploy data. It's a very interesting, you know, there's all kinds of concepts there. When is too much data? What is enough data? Which data is important? How do you actually use data? How much is data work? I mean, there are a million. Probably got to get Billy Vanjura on here to understand all those things. Some of those concepts go even beyond me. My brain just starts to come out my ears a little bit. But I do think that if what Mark is saying is that carriers and agents and brokers need to be willing to mash their data up together more to better deliver on the value proposition of the independent insurance agency channel, then hell yeah.

I mean, I think that that was the whole thing behind Neon, right? that's what ARIUS Analytics is helping us do, is take in data, analyze that data, and redeploy the information and executable opportunities that we find in that data to create a better experience for our customers and ultimately drive more revenue, right? I mean, that's the whole game. So, yeah, circularity is a freaking weird way of describing it. I don't necessarily think that it's wrong, but I just never heard it describe that way. and I don't particularly like saying that word circularity.

But I do think that those of us who can figure out which data points matter, how to take in that data, turn it into opportunities and then execute on those opportunities, that is the winning strategy in the digital space. It is so incredibly difficult to do. I mean, just what system exists that actually allows you to do that? That's like question number one. Like, do we even have the tools in place today to be able to do that? Yes and no, but not out of the box of anything.

So very difficult, but I have to agree. I have to agree with this trend. And good point by Mark. Bobby actually get in on this one too. Before we really crack the nut on the ecosystem model, and a lot will depend on how open data rich big players are about working together. That's right, Bobby. What she's saying there is, hey, don't be a menace to South Central while you're drinking your juice in the hood.

Right? Play the game the right way. Stop being so fascist with your data. Big data, fascist. All right. Trend number four. Bobby didn't say that last piece. Fascist part was me.

trend number four the innovation train is waiting for no one i don't know why that makes me laugh but uh yeah true true that double true if anyone's ever seen that skit lazy sunday true that double true um kind of losing my mind here 54 minutes into this solo episode but uh i completely agree innovation is happening so incredibly rapidly and what what i think is fun about that though What I think is interesting and fun is that, yes, innovation is happening faster and faster, and it is definitely a snowball that has its own momentum and is flying down the hill. But I also think you guys, us, brokers, the independent agency channel in general is becoming more okay. I don't know that that's proper English, but more okay with adopting tools that haven't been in the market for some period of time.

Like five years ago, if the tool hadn't been in the market for 20 years, we're like, you know, technology comes and goes and marm-bram, well, now people are like, hey, if I want to run my business, I need this thing. I don't care that it just launched six months ago. I'm willing to deploy it into my agency because I need its functionality, even though it's only six months old. I'll deal with some of the, maybe the warts that come with a new product as they work them out, but we need that functionality.

I think that is exciting. I think it's absolutely a positive trend, and it's absolutely a trend that will continue. and couldn't agree more with trend number four. I didn't mean for that to rhyme, but I'm so glad that it did. All right. What's up, guys? Sorry to take you away from the episode, but as you know, we do not run ads on this show.

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Trend number five, a new era of insuretech. Ugh, insuretech, barf. I'm just so sick of insuretech. Let me put that another way. I love insurance technology companies, and I love a lot of insurance technologists. A lot of them are my friends, companies I support, companies that support this podcast and I read ads for and talk about freely despite the ads,

and a lot of companies that don't pay me that we talk about. But the like, the hashtag insuretech. God, it just barf, the pompous douchebaggery, especially like some of the commentary in InsureTech Twitter or insurance Twitter. There's like these people that tag insurance Twitter. Like that's a thing?

I don't know. I guess it is. And it's just like, oh, so holier than thou. like these people that have never done anything telling us why this is how this should be or that should be and oh god i just i can't take it maybe they probably think the same thing about me i just hate hashtag insuretech i love insurance technology and insurance technologists i love the people who are putting you know who are going out and raising funds and bringing new technology into our industry and trying to move us forward i just can't stand insure tech hashtag insure tech

Like that culture just drives me fucking nuts. It just does. That being said, I think the trend here, and they're talking about how Metro Mile and Hippo and Lemonade and Next and Bold Penguin and I, Ivins is in here. Jesus, could you imagine?

Ivins is in SureTech. Ivins has been the anchor holding our industry down for 30 years. my God. I mean, it seems like, you know, they hired Reed, and I'm sure Reed is going to get that thing moving in some direction, whether it's positive or negative for the space as a whole. Who the hell knows? I mean, that will yet to be seen in the actions that they take, although, you know, I think Reed is a guy who can make positive change, but we cannot today say that Ivan's is in any way been a... net positive to the industry after what 2004 i mean it's technology that's been it's

extinct we still use it because they have this monopoly and no one's had the balls to take them down so um or at least create a competitor so oh my god it makes me sick to see ivan's listed in here it just does it just does and god i'm rooting we all are forced to use download so i'm hoping that ivan's transforms and opens up and gets more people using it and data's flowing and we're all happy and right in business. That would be great. But to pretend like that has been their history. Oh, God, man, I feel like I've got to take a shower now. All right, so, there's a bunch of gobbly cook in here about insureTech headline companies. Here's what I'm to tell you. InsureTech is only additive if used, insuretech companies and tools are only

additive if used the right way. If you purchase something, you never use it. It's not valuable. The tools. They're tools. We don't need to, I don't want to, insuretech isn't the future. It's not our savior, right? This isn't Jesus Christ come back to save the insurance industry with an, you know, hashtag InsureTech and a bunch of thought leaders and influencers. That's not what it is.

It's a group of smart people trying to build tools that help carriers, brokers, distributors, reinsurers, whoever do their business better. And if you pick the right set of tools and you deploy them in the right way for the customer said that you want to work with, insure tech is. wholly additive, incredibly valuable, and so important. It can also be just as big of a time waster, money-waster, experienced destroyer, if not used properly. So we have to be very, very careful. Then sure tech. Have to be very careful. But again, like all things, if you use the right way, awesome. If you use the wrong way, terrible. If we let companies take entire

important business segments, allow them to create monopolies, and then never push against them, then we'll just be miserable for another 20 or 30 years, which I hope isn't the case. Okay, let's keep moving. Two more trends. Trend number six, embedded insurance holds potential. This is true. This is also the thing that you should be the most scared about as a broker. Embedded insurance scares the shit out of me.

Embedded insurance, think Tesla insurance. Now, say, Tesla, don't care. Don't give me the purest thing. I'm talking high-level concepts, right? We're not going to get all the way down to execution on this particular concept. Here's why embedded insurance should scare you, is if every Tesla comes with an insurance program matched specifically to Tesla and the coverage is good.

So let's work under that assumption. Not that the coverage is terrible. Maybe today the coverage isn't great, but let's assume the coverage is good. Let's say they figure out how to write a well-done auto policy on a Tesla, comes with the purchase, it's built into the purchase price, and you have 10 years of Tesla insurance when you purchase your Tesla, right? Just bam. Never have to pay another auto premium. It operates the same way with underwriters and claims and all the things. That means every Tesla that's sold, broker doesn't get paid. That should scare you. What happens when that happens to

homes? When you purchase a home from remax, real estate, or probably better yet, through, you purchase a home through a mortgage broker, part of your mortgage payment is just embedded in the home purchase and the mortgage payment is your homeowners insurance not through a broker, right? It's just, bam, here it is. Here it is. You got it. It's just, boom, there it is. Seventy-five bucks a month in your mortgage payment is your homeowner's insurance. For as long as this mortgage exists, you have a full-blown, fully operational home insurance policy. Broger never touches it, never gets to him. That should scare the crap out of you.

From a business insurance standpoint, this is one of the places that Rogue is playing. We have different partnerships that we're working on where, you know, there's going to come a day with embedded insurance if we don't, you know, as independent insurance agencies, if we're not careful, if we're not building and digitizing and building brand, all the things that we talk about all the time, where the insurance opportunities don't even get to us. That's the thing that scares me. all this stuff that's happening in our space. The thing that scares me the most, the true potential disruptor is embedded insurance. It's the business. We never even get a shot at the business. We never get a shot at it.

They start their business. Their LLC formation comes with an insurance policy. They do this. You know, they hire their first employee. It comes with a workers' comp policy. You don't have to buy it separately today. All those platforms have brokers and, you know, whatever MGAs, who are working with them to place the business.

What happens when there's no broker? It just comes with the thing that you buy. The workers' comp just comes with the payroll. You sign up for gusto, and workers' comp just comes with it. It just comes with it. You don't even have to think about it. Just automatically included. Bam, there's your workers' comp.

That should scare you. It scares me. I shouldn't say that. It scares me if I were also you, which I'm not, I would be nervous about that. Now, granted, nervous, is this something that's going to put you out of business? No. This is a long-term trend.

And if I were a carrier, I would be spending an immense amount of time here. Probably I'd have two buckets if I was a carrier. I wouldn't be going direct because every carrier who tries a direct model, I think, is moronic and stupid. And I just kind of go, oh, that's, you know, when you hear someone say, oh, yeah, we're testing, we're testing our direct models, see if this. Come on, guys, let's be serious. invest in well-run independent agencies and digital brokerages who are going to believe in your product and write your product and find people who are doing embedded insurance

and build products to help them distribute that. Which, you know, those two things conflict. I get it. But if I were a carrier, that's what I would do. Those would be my two channels. I would just press those buttons over and over and over and over and over again because I have no idea which one's going to win. But to me, the biggest competition isn't a freaking lemonade.

It's gusto. it's gusto having built-in workers' comp. It's Ford having built-in auto insurance. It's remax or rocket mortgage having built-in homeowners insurance. Built-in. Not a referral partnership, built-in. That's truly embedded. That is our biggest competitor, in my opinion, long-term.

Okay. I don't know how that fits into all this, and if you can find a way to be the embedded partner, which would mostly be a referral partner, but if you can find the way to do that, do that. Okay. Tread in number seven, our last trend. Customers are driving flexibility.

Comparing a retail purchase of a taxi ride to an insurance policy may not be like for like. The way this is written is fucking crazy. Just the language is, it's like it's written by a computer, which maybe it was, who knows? This is Reuters, so maybe they just use one of their bots to write this. But there is no denying that COVID-19 has shifted online shopping patterns and expectations across generations.

Significantly, 96% of independent agents surveyed by Auto-insureTech ClearCover say their customers are looking for more digital tools now than they were pre-pandemic. Yeah, that makes sense. That makes sense. Basically, you have two options, right? You have two options here. And this is a good one. I think this is a good trend to finish on, a good topic to finish on.

Give a shout out. I'm not going to name all their names again because I don't want to. but to all the people that contributed this, gave us this content. I highly recommend you go Google it. It's the insurance distribution, seven key trends of 2022, Craig Welsh,

I'm going to say them anyways, I'm looking at this year right here. Craig Welsh, Bobby Collies, Tim Riley from Tokyo Marine, and Mark Sech. That's what I'm going to go with. Berkeley Fire Marine. Lots of good comments, lots of good content.

Go Google that, put your email in, get the white paper, read it. Maybe it'll be worth their time. Okay. So let's finish with this last one. You really have two options. You can choose to do business the exact way that you want to do business,

which drastically limits your market, but allows you to streamline a process and work with a set of customers that do business or want to do business the way that you want to do business, which makes things very easy for you, very easy for them. The problem is that today so significantly reduces your market segment that I find that to be a tough model to support. But it is an option.

And I'm not hating on the option. It's just not an option I would necessarily choose. But I do think it's an option. And if you like doing business and build a model around a certain way of doing business that has a large enough market segment and you can support that market segment, then you can do serious business.

And that's a really good way to do it. And it's a really good way to grow fast and grow efficiently and effectively at a low cost and high margin. So I don't want to knock that hustle. But I struggle with outside of finding a true embedded insurance option, going back to trend number six, I struggled to think that there are markets big enough

for enough brokerages to do business that way for it to be a strategy that we would support on a wide scale, if that makes sense. Okay. So let's talk about the flexibility piece to this trend. So my belief is you got to, we're, Carruthers is this going to kill me. It's the Bruce Lee model of insurance.

You know, be water, right? Water takes the shape of whatever vessel it's in, so be water. Your customer is going to come at you from all different angles. They're going to have different needs, different wants. Some are going to want to text. Some are going to email. Some are we on a call. They're all going to want to do different stuff.

and all of them are going to expect you to do business the way they want to do business. That's their expectation. You can reset that expectation or try to. I think you're going to struggle with that. But, I mean, this is why all the D to C in Shirtex end up, you know, kind of, kind of just being like a dry fart in the long run. Because they shove everyone down these funnels because they believe everyone wants a digital process. when not everyone wants a digital process. And most people actually in the insurance transaction

want to talk to a human or at least interact with a human at some point. And that's why I think it's a cautionary tale to do business that way. So what I think is a much better model is to say, okay, we prefer to do business this way. We prefer to do business in this funnel. Okay, let's just say that way.

But we can talk on the phone or we could text or we could email or we can do business some other way. I don't know. you can use our chat we you know we use chat chat works for us to there's a lot of different ways to do business why not just build out the five or six main ways that people like to do business and just have all those as available options and then train your people to communicate that way I mean this isn't rocket science there's not that that much different between texting and

live chat or email and talking on the phone or sending someone down a funnel if that's what they prefer. So I think being flexible, it doesn't mean you have to change your process, your methodology outside of the communication, right? You can still believe in coverage and compare options and, you know, all these different things. But from a communication standpoint, flexibility is a key driver to scalable growth, in my opinion, because the market is so diverse in the way that people like to communicate and a lot of people, a lot of people want to be able to communicate in multiple different avenues in a single transaction. They're going to start the conversation via email or a form fill, but then they want to talk on the phone, but then to validate a few pieces of key

information, they want text, but then to confirm that they want coverage, they're going to email you. And can you handle all those communications? And can your people handle all those communications? And can you set expectations to your customers that you're going to be able to hit all those different methods of communication and then deliver on the service on the back end. That is a major, major key, major driver, major trend. Be flexible in your communication. I just can't, it's just, it's really important. It's really, really important.

I'm running out of gas, you may be able to tell. But I think it's very important to be able to do that. There's tools that can help you. We were on agency Zoom. We've recently moved off of agency Zoom to HubSpot and have gone all the way in our we're all in on HubSpot. Absolutely love it.

Building it out the way we want. It's not inexpensive. It's more expensive than Agency Zoom. But I don't want to be hamstrung to do business the same way that every other insurance agent can do business. And if you're using the major AMS systems and the same major CRM systems, then you're limited by the same thing

that all your competitor agencies are limited by. And I don't want to be limited by those things. I want to be able to do whatever the fuck I want to do because I want to be able to deliver an experience to our customers, which isn't today what I hope it to be. So if you're like, go secret shop me, don't like hashtag insurance Twitter me

and go, hey, look, Rogris. Look, I'll tell you today. Our process isn't perfect. It's certainly not everything that I want it to be. But I know where we're going to be. going and I don't want to be hamstrung by the tools. I want to be able to do what I want to be able to do and deliver our experience in a way that our customers want and more important my employees can and want to deliver it. If you're going to have happy employees, then, you know,

what are you going to do? So flexibility is a major key. Major, major K. Guys, I hope you enjoy this two-part series. I don't know. I just hopefully you got something out of this. It's been fun to share these thoughts with you. They've been kind of in my mind for a while. I'll say one more time. I said at the beginning of part one of this two-part series, I apologize for kind of being an MIA for a while, but growing an agency is tough, as some of you know. And I just, I'm going to try to be more inspired more often for you so that I can deliver on this podcast. But I appreciate you listening. Hit me up, LinkedIn, Twitter, Instagram, wherever. You can always email me.

you know, wherever you prefer, if you got thoughts, comments, whatever, love to hear from you guys. I appreciate you listening. I love you for listening to this show. This show is a labor of love. Has been for a very long time. And I just appreciate all you guys. I wish you nothing but the best. And I hope that some of this stuff sinks in.

I hope something connects for you and that you're able to build the agency that you want, build a career that you want. I love this. I love this industry. I love what we do. I love you guys for listening. I'm out of here. Twice as many deals by this time next week. Sound impossible, it's not.

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