Finding Peak w/ Ryan Hanley - The Secret to Scaling Trust with Brian Fanzo

Episode Date: September 20, 2019

Spartan philosophy, built in the black-ops lab of business: https://www.findingpeak.comFinding Peak podcast: https://linktr.ee/ryan_hanleyInternational keynote speaker and social influencer, Brian Fanzo, joins the podcast to share his thoughts on scaling trust and future of business. Get more here: https://ryanhanley.com/--Recommended Tools for GrowthOpusClip: #1 AI video clipping and editing tool: https://link.ryanhanley.com/opusRiverside: HD Podcast & Video Software | Free Recording & Editing: https://link.ryanhanley.com/riversideWhisperFlow: Never waste time typing on your keyboard again: https://link.ryanhanley.com/whisperflowCaptionsApp: One app for all your social media video creation: https://link.ryanhanley.com/captionsappGoHighLevel: It's time to take your business workflow to the Next Level: https://link.ryanhanley.com/gohighlevelPerspective.co: The #1 funnel builder for lead generation: https://link.ryanhanley.com/perspective--Episodes You Might Enjoy:From $2 Million Loss to World-Class Entrepreneur: https://lnk.to/delkFrom One Man Shop to $200M in Revenue: https://lnk.to/tommymelloIs Psilocybin the Gateway to Self-Mastery? https://lnk.to/80upZ9This show is part of the Unplugged Studios Network — the infrastructure layer for serious creators. 👉 Learn more at https://unpluggedstudios.fm.Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

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space 80 at talkspace.com. Today I bring you Brian Fanzo. I wanted Brian to be on the show because of his career journey, which is very much a ground and pound. He's worked for every inch of success that he's gotten. He has earned it just through putting it. and hard work and doing all the things you need to do.

This episode takes a turn. Topics that we get into, into things that are very near and dear to my heart, in particular how we treat each other online. All the anger and hostility and division that is inevitable with an election like the one that's coming, how we can focus ourselves to stay positive and hold love and compassion.

passion in our hearts, even when we run up against people that we may not enjoy their perspective. I think it's incredibly important for us in life. And it's certainly incredibly believed Brian Fanza. With you and a new job. It's good, man. It's good. You know, trying to find my legs. It's an interesting, it's an interesting situation.

You know, a whole new industry. I don't know anything about basically most of what I'm doing. So I'm just, you know, it's, it's. It's interesting how much, what I'm learning is what the network that I had in the insurance industry meant, one, two, how little, once you learn the basic principles of growing a business, marketing a business, selling, like the core principles of business in general, how little like intrinsic industry knowledge actually means to early stage growth. that's that's basically yeah i think you know i think middle and late stage growth having the

knowledge of the intricacies and nuances of the marketplace to separate yourself are very very important but early on it's what's your value proposition can you sell it can you reach a market can you tell a story based on what you're trying to do and who you're trying to help and that's going to get your your early adopters that's what's going to grow the business in the early stages and you know I think eventually that you have to dig in, you have to know what the space that you're operating. And I think that's very, that's core. But it's been interesting that knowing nothing about fitness, not having one network connection in the fitness industry, how far we've been able to get already. That's a fun test.

You're going to have to like write some freaking or do some crazy like just story about that side of it. Right. Because I mean, when you said that originally, I was like, holy, like, holy, like, holy. Holy fucking pivot. Like I've heard, like, I know lots of people that have pivoted. Like, that's like a legit pivot in many ways. But that's kind of fun to hear because, you know, it is one of those things you don't know until you hear people like yourself that

have done it. Because, you know, I won't even have thought of that, you know, in many cases. But you're also right. Part of it's like, if you're good at conveying trust, the trust, what's underneath the trust, there's a little bit of a layer of like, hey, I can trust you no matter what you're working with. And then once we figure that out, you know, we better deliver in the back end, right? Yeah.

I think, you know, I was listening to, have you listened to Naval Ravakantz? He did a podcast based on a tweet storm that he created. It's called How to Get Rich or How to Be Rich or something. It's like a, it's a clicky headline, but what's underneath it is absolutely amazing. I think you dig it only because it's just an interesting format as a podcaster. It's basically like it's two minute episodes,

like two minute to three minute episodes. Oh, really? Yeah, he basically takes each. tweet and he's got another guy that's with him and the guy like gives him the core context of the tweet and that says hey can you explain this and and he just goes into and like no five minutes an episode basically what he was thinking about so there's like 50 episodes make up this podcast and um it's yeah really really really interesting yeah yeah and yeah and oh yeah so So it's super interesting.

One, the content is tremendous. And two, just the format and how he launched it and got it out and like what he was trying to do with it. And since then, he's added more of these kind of short form episodes. But it's it's really, really cool. And yeah, I have to check that out. I just put up the website. So that's super cool.

Yeah. One of the, you know, the, and then the point of my bringing him up is one of the sections in there that he talks about is trust in particular. And he basically says like, it, you know, as everyone knows, like it, it takes being around for a while to build up trust. And then once you have that, you can make a mover too, but there is a diminished return. And eventually, if you hop too much, people stop trusting you because now you just, you move around too much for them to, to trust you.

So it's, it's interesting. But yeah, long story short. I think it trusts me once, you know, trust you twice. And then like, wait a second. I got to re-evaluate that trust. I think that's yeah. That's cool. Yeah, I'm not to check that out.

I'm always looking for, I love creative ways of formatting, especially podcasting. I think like podcasting is such an interesting medium and sense of like even for what people are doing today. We still haven't even like really ventured in like all the different ways you can use audio formats. You know, just even like, you know, documentary styles and stuff is such a fun, fun media. I wish I have like the time and resources like a team to like do that kind of like testing and research. But not to check that out for sure. Yeah.

I think that will come as monetization comes to the platform. You know, like you just said, like right now, there's no, no one's going to come to you with a, with an amount of money that, that will allow you the time to go out and actually put that project together.

At least it's rare. Yeah. And when they do, they usually handcuff, you know, because the medium is so weirdly, like I just did, I'm not right a blog post on it,

but I just did a presentation at a military, uh, influencer conference this weekend. I was on podcasting. And I said, you know, I've got, I've gone,

six figures of podcast revenue in the last 12 months without sending download numbers once. And everyone was like, what the head? And I was like, because I don't sell downloads because I couldn't figure out how to sell downloads. Like I sell like alignment with brand and I sell like, you know, direct business value. And I sell, you know, like, hey, I'm going to drive this many people to whatever your initiative is, but you need to give me the bandwidth and time to do it. But part of that's because like when I was trying to sell the other thing, the medium, you know, the monetization hasn't hit the platform in a way that, you know, is scalable or

relates to like different like trying to I worked with three different Adobe teams and all three different Adobe teams had a whole different idea of what podcast advertising was and like how it worked and I was like I ended up convincing all three of them to do it my way but at first it was like God I can never work in this media yeah it's and it doesn't translate to what they're used to though the language it's different languages um that's for sure but all that being said I appreciate you being on the show man and you know one of the reasons that I wanted to have you on this show and and and we'll just kind of get into it. You know, it's another, it's an interview show for sure.

I'm going to do probably a lot of other stuff besides just interviewing. It's really, I guess the thing that drove me to make the pivot that you initially asked about was my desire to help people find peak performance in their everyday life. And whatever way, shape, or form that means for them. Like, you know, whatever that means for you, how do I, I, I, I, like helping them find the little hacks sharing things that I found mistakes that I made articles I found whatever it is it's kind of a menagerie of concepts and ideas with the idea that one of them might help you get a little bit better find that thing you know so in in

watching your career and and we've known each other for a while now in terms of just being in the same ecosystem and yeah you know the thing that's always impressed me about you was kind of your ground and pound methodology. You just started doing the work, showing up, turning the Facebook live on before anyone else was or before it was kind of, I mean, I guess still people aren't really using that platform well, I guess you could say.

But you just kept doing it and kept grinding and kept pushing and kept telling your story. And if you go back in the archives of your work, which I did in getting really, ready, you know, for this, for this interview, you know, it just kind of brought me back to some of the things that you were in watching the evolution. Like, it's just so iterative. And, and, and with each, I don't know, episode or, or era of your development, it gets a little more refined and a little more tweaked. And then, and then you can tell you kind of, hey, I'm going to shelf this

idea for a while and now I'm going to attack this. And I guess, I guess my first question for you Well, what I'd love for you to kind of kick this off on is, you know, early on, like, what you just said, like you just said, hey, I made six figures in podcast revenue. Like, for most people, that's the headline. Wack. You know, there was a day when it was zero. And, you know, that's taking you a long time to get there. And you've earned every one of those dollars.

What kept you going in the early days? Like talk a little bit about, you know, everyone. kind of starts, but I'm not so much interested in the start as I am the dip and what got you through the dip. So yeah, you know, and for me being, you know, like we were talking a little bit about your pivot, you know, like I went cybersecurity to a data center to digital marketing, right? Like, and like in like the weirdest way, I think the more I reflect, the more I realize that collaboration, like the element of collaboration is the root element that is the thing that links everything I've done since, really since high school. High school,

It was for me, you know, I was the only one, you know, like my family owned a frozen yogurt shop. I was a lifeguard. I tried out for plays as a thespian. I was a baseball player. I played hockey. I was like the only one that kind of like was the surfer dude that was also the sports dude that like computers that also worked at a family business. And then that kind of transcended in a college where I was the only one that was a fraternity guy.

The only one was computer science and the only one on the hockey team. Like no one on the hockey team was majoring in computer science. And nobody majoring computer science is going to join a frat. And I think for me, like, being able to bring groups together was always like, man, it was the thing for me. Like, it's always been like the root piece of it. But, you know, I worked in a government contracting company, giant 25,000 person company, left to go to the data center, which was at the time, I was a 256th employee. And then within two years, we had 612 employees. Like, we were hiring like 12 new hires a week.

It was insane. And then I went on my own. And I think the interesting piece for me, I guess, like, the dip was like, I always knew I want to. to do something bigger. And I love how you kind of put that out there, like, understanding that. Like, for me, it was like, I always say, like, I want to connect great people with great people to do great things, right? Like, but there's no modernization on that. There's no, like, business. There's no, like, how do I package that? And I remember, you know, Jay Bear, a good friend and mentor, like one day. And this was probably four and a half

years ago and where I was kind of like, I don't want to be an agency, but I don't want to be a consultant. And like, where do I fit, like, who I am? And, like, how do I put some, you know, modernization around it, but also how do I, like, grow and learn this space. And I remember Jay said a, he said a statement to me, and I don't think he knows how, like, much it stuck with me, but he was like, Fanzo, I love what you're doing. Everyone I talk to loves what you do. My problem is, I have no idea what you do or how I would sell you. And I was like, yeah, that sounds like a problem. Like, you know, and like, for me, like, I think that was part of, like, that piece of it was, you know, and I would read things,

like you have to package things, or maybe you need to sell stuff online. And I had to had this love for building community without the desire or need to monetize the community. Like in my weird big picture, like I remember, like I tried the agency thing after the data center didn't really like the agency model. I just wasn't an agency. I deliver. I deliver. I ground and pound.

I'm a, hey, what's our goal? We're going to crush it. And the agency model just didn't really fit that, right? I kept my, the one that was working the agency with, you know, we were business partners. He's like, dude, everyone you bring on. They work with us for six months and they move on. And it's not because they're not happy. It's because you've solved so many goals that help them do it.

Like, they don't need us anymore. And I was like, yeah, that's what I'm good at. And he was like, well, that's going to be a, we're going to turn into a business development team more than anything else. And so I think, like, for me, like, it was this weird piece where I remember saying, people would say, well, what do you want to be when you grow up? And I would say, you know, and this was within the last five years. And I was like, well, you know, I was successful in everything I've done. But there's not one of these things was a path. But I would always say, like, I would have.

to be a CEO of my own company. I just don't know what that company is. I don't know if it's software. I don't know if it's hardware. I don't know if it's online. I don't know if it's offline. I was like, because I knew that, I was like, I'm going to build community from the sears sake of caring about people and engaging as much and as hard as I can. And for me, that was like, well, I got to try out every medium, like from live video to podcasting. Like, I had to figure out what worked. Like, I can say, like, I never thought of myself like, wow, I'm going to try out live video because I want to be a live video expert. It was,

is live video going to give me an opportunity to build community not only stronger, but kind of allow me to scale? I think the hardest, the thing I've always known was scaling trust and scaling community was always been something that scares me because I really do,

like I love the idea of like, you know, intimate groups and I love connecting great people, but I've learned over time that, you know, as those groups grow and I, you can go everything from business to church group to sports group, whatever it may be.

Like that scale is really, hard and I think so for me that was a big fundamental piece and then because I didn't want to monetize this community I was investing in I was like well how do I how do I make money as I'm going through this and when I say I didn't want to monetize I didn't want I didn't want people you know it's the Gary V jab jab jab right hook right and Gary made a joke with me via Twitter a long time ago he was like Fanzo you remember the right hook part exists because I was really going to jab and giving people things without like having that right hook and part of it

was because I kind of learned and this was something I think was one of those things that got me out of that lower, I say that entrepreneur stuck that I was in was that I could monetize and work with enterprise size companies and big brands because they would want access to the community I have without having to tell my community to buy an online course or by my book or to hawk some webinar. And so when I found that out, I was like, oh, well, that's my whole background. My background was enterprise tech. And I was like, well, now I can tap into this network from a business perspective while still growing a community

with my underlying goal of reaching kind of the masses. And for me, that was like that, that's been like the path that's got me where I'm at today. But there's definitely been, like, it's taking a lot of, I can tell you, self-awareness is the thing that I,

I would always say, like, I'm confident, I'm proud, I would say be yourself, I would, but in the last three years or so, and really a lot of it had to do with my divorce, I was like kind of forced to become self-aware. And now that I'm becoming more self-aware, I know what I'm not good at, I know what I'm good at. But I'm also been able to look back at my decisions and realize, wow, if I'd only been aware of why this didn't work because of who I was, I would have made so many different things

along the way. And so it's been a heck of a journey, but I think that hopefully answers the question on that. We both have a very interesting thing going from crazy different careers, but I think there's also that underlying element of what drives us. You know, it's really interesting. think without really knowing it until you just said it that, you know, that might be one of the things that has always enamored me to your work is I've struggled with that same thing my whole life. I always say to my wife that I have a job to support my willing, my desire to create. You know what I mean? Like I've never, I love like I'll tell you what I love more than anything. I wake up at 4.30 every morning and I write an Instagram micro blog every single day,

we'll call it six days a week. It's the 2,200 word limit. Sometimes I fill it. Sometimes I don't even come close. But it is whatever I learned the day before, whatever I came in contact, whatever idea I think can move people forward. I do it every single day. And I don't know why that platform. I just like the constraints of the 2,200 characters or whatever. It kind of gives me something to work towards, which I could easily duplicate someplace else. But I don't. And like I have said to to my wife before. And this is probably even, this is probably before the job I have today. But like, she's like, why do you, she's like, you like, you like to do all this other stuff. But then you do this work over here. And I'm like, because that work pays for me to be able to do

this work because I have no clue how to monetize this work in a way that just like you said, isn't courses and ebooks and, you know, paid webinars and all that nonsensical stuff. that truthfully, even when it's done with the purest intentions, I can't stand it. Like, I just can't. It just rubs me the wrong way. As soon as I see the sales copy, I just start to barf. And I know that that, you know what I mean? Like it's, and I know that that's a weakness in my, in my marketing game. And I'm not willing to go copyrighter, even though I can do it. Like, I just, it just makes me feel weird. So I never, yeah. So I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, It's funny. I never heard you say that what you just said it to me before. But as soon as you said it,

I was like, wow, that sounds super familiar. I've had that conversation in my head before. It's funny, too, on that element of like that weird, like there's a sales element, right? Like, I have no problem convincing people to give me the money that I know that I'm worth. Right. Like, that doesn't, that doesn't has never bothered me. But selling something like this idea of selling something in either a forced way or, you know, it's a skill set. And also there's a skill set or a mindset of the people. that purchase those things right and when you're neither one of those like which I think both of us kind of fall in neither one of them it is it's like I love the marketing space and I despise both you know and I used to get so mad at the people that were the marketing it that way then I started like flip

my brain I'm like well if no one was buying it they wouldn't keep doing it and then I started to get like kind of like psychoanalyze that that layer I loved to really study that like the human condition and what makes us do those and then I realized like oh it's just not my personality on either time But you're right. It's a funny mix because there's kind of the beauty of the world we're living in like you can find your own ways But when you kind of jump into a space where you know the short easy way is this way that like everyone's doing It can get extremely frustrating that like the end to your point like I mean like I've done an Instagram story every single day since Instagram stories was released and it's like my favorite thing and you and you you like feed copy I love like I wake up and I start the day and like I kind of go through this like weird program thing in my head of, okay, what does my beginning, start, middle, end look like? And then I'm like,

what should I show or how should I show something to educate people or bring them along on my journey? And I don't do it, like, written out. It's like this, it's just like weird process. And I can feel it. I can feel it. Sometimes it hits me like 10 a.m. sometimes it hits me at noon. But like you, like, I mean, I've invested so much time and I, and I study the analytic. I love the piece of it. But at the same time, like, nothing about my Instagram stories is monetizable. or like I'm not using it to like and everyone's like oh you have the swipe up feature and I'm like yeah I usually use that for like an article or a podcast and I'm like don't use that for gated content I'm like I don't have gated content I'm like what you're a marketing it's just it is it just

kind of in different ways yeah yeah it's funny you know so one of the things that you that you talked about too in there was was scaling trust and this is one of the topics that I've written about I've talked about. It's something I think about all the time. I think it's probably the reason that we are neither the person who buys the fancy copy course or that creates the fancy copy course is that I feel like anytime you inject Mad Men style copy into advertising, which I think that's what the break in that is,

you're going from trust to convincing, right? You're kind of almost bullying someone into it. You're bludging them with reasons to trick their brain into clicking a button versus, hey, you trust me so much that I'm just going to tell you what you're going to get and you can choose. Like those are two different things for me because, you know, Seth Godin sells courses on a Kimbo. He's the farthest thing from a huckster marketer, even though he is a brilliant copywriter. Right.

So talk to me a little bit about how you, how you scale trust. And really, I'm interested, maybe start with what that actually means to you and then how you do it. So I think this is one of those areas for me where I've never looked at like, you know, and I think it has a lot of do of my personality as well. Like when someone tells me what to do and my poor parents, like I'm the guy. Like, I mean, even if I wanted to do it and they're telling me to do it, like I've always pushed back. And I'm not like the fight the system guy. I've always just kind of been like, hey, I want to like, let's come together and do this or let's work in like in this similar path.

And I think when I looked at like, okay, in this digital world, like I never looked, I remember like, and I've thought about this a lot. I've always looked at social media and digital and like the internet as a whole as this vast opportunity to become connected no matter where we live, no matter what our background is, no matter of sexual orientation, no matter what it is, like you can find your people. And I think it had a lot to do with, like, I moved in third grade from Pittsburgh to Virginia Beach. But my, like, my roots are Pittsburgh. I bleed black and those sports. We still had season tickets for the Steelers. But because of my dad's medical condition, we had to move out of the cold weather. And, like, the Internet came and it was like this, like, oh, my goodness, the people that think sports like me, I'm connected with.

Right. And I remember it being like this, like, this pure joy. And I wanted to be a sports center anchor. Then I realized you had to know journalism. And I was like, or begin at grammar and like, it wasn't my thing. And I kind of like pivoting in computer science. And I think really computer science for me, even like if I look at that element where I was like, I like result oriented type things, but also loved trying things out.

Right. And it was like, oh, well, nobody that's done this could do that. I'm the person that does it. Like, I really like that piece of it. I think when I started like in this digital space, I put myself out there. And I know the date because the day I started on social media, but it was a date, second 2013 was the date like my mom questioned on I think I was vending to her on the phone something about like social media posts or she said she liked the post of mine I was like

what like you don't spend them a time on like what you don't spend an hour total on your homework and I was like well I wanted to make it this this and this and she said like you know the basic words of she's like well Brian I hope you remember what made you great and and who you are offline she's like you're unapologetically yourself and she's like it's been something I tried to change as a mom, and then I just kind of realized Ryan's going to walk his own path and do his own things, and people are going to, for the most part, take it or leave it, and those that leave it, because I have that desire to put everybody, I'm going to try to kind of come back around and then to see that. I think when my mom said that, I mean, it was like a, I got hung up,

I was like, sure, mom, of course I do. And I hung up, and I just, like, sat there and was like, oh my goodness, like, I am not, like, I didn't have a hat on in my profile picture, right? I was, like, I had, like, this, like, weird persona. And I remember, always being like, what do other people want to hear from me rather than saying, what can I share to help other people, right? Like that little ducks. And for me, that was that that was that moment of like, you know what, I'm going to be myself. I'm going to put myself out there. And those that judge me based on my appearance or dug me based on maybe the way that I come about things, I'm going to build trust with them over the long term of caring and being a positive person. I don't,

I don't inject negativity in anything I do. I don't support. negative people like someone screws me over um you know i don't post about it publicly i just remove them from my circle right i don't amplify their things i don't talk about them um even like going through my divorce uh my ex was not one that was um on social media posting publicly and she posted 32 times publicly about our divorce and i posted zero and it was because it was like well hey she's a great mom she is still a great mom my daughters are great because of her because of this you know disagreement of who we were we we kind of grew apart and uh whatever that may be like I've always looked at it with like, I can grow, I can grow trust through being very transparent,

which is what one of like my core pieces of. And I always say, like transparency and oversharing are two different things, right? Like, oversharing and airing dirty laundry about my force and things that people didn't really need to know, would have been the other one, right? But being very transparent in who I am, you know, what I've gone through. And then I've also kind of looked at things and said, you know, beyond like transparency, I'm going to care about other people just as much as I want them to care about me. And I'm going to do it at the maximum that I can, right?

And I think when I looked at what that meant, like, online was just the easy path for me, right? Like, I know that you can put me in a room, a networking room. And as extroverted as I am, I don't like, like, forced conversation. Like, you know, it's the dad's, like, birthday party and all the dads are standing by the grill. Like, back to Spock gives me, like, gives me the creep. I hate forced conversation. I don't even like it on the airplane. But, like, put me in a room.

room with a bunch of people, I don't shut up. I don't mind talking like, I'm when it's not forced. And I think when I looked at all these pieces, I was like, wow, I can do this online and share content, my conversations, who I am. And I think caring is so easy online, right? Like, I mean, retweets cost nothing, amplifying, you know, calling someone else. It's all, it's like, it's so easy to do and yet so rarely done still that it was like, okay, well, I can do that in a way that build trust over time. And I can tell you, like, some of my biggest, I would say haters or those that like maybe we had a biggest disagreement with. I just recently had a phone call with somebody that was like the first person I ever blocked on social media. I remember being like,

wow, like this was bothering me. And it's come full circle with that person not only has apologized, but made up to the person alienated that really turned me off. And we ended up having a great like 45 minutes Skype call. And it was like, man, Brian, I do have this like please every one mentality. But I think there's also that idea of trust is like, I don't want to force you to trust me. I'm not going to tell you to trust me. But if you have a mind, said are your open perspective enough to, you know, learn for me or just listen to who I am and what I talk about, I believe you will trust over time. I think that's that element of, you know, I think that when people say I trust is a long-term game, that's true, but I think there's also

an element of it's a long-term game with someone that is going into it more often than not wanting to trust you, right? But for those of us that approach a lot of relationships, very trusting you begin with. Trust can be an immediate game if you have your, if you, you know, created your network and your community to kind of enable that. And I, and that's kind of what I'm trying to embody now. And I'm testing it. Like, you know, as a full-time speaker now, like that's my full-time revenue, you know, it's a business development game. Nobody really hires you back-to-back years. So everything is like, okay, you have to trust to see me, have to trust to work with me. Well, my speaker agent is like, Brian, you can

run in this business speaking for four years, you know, without a CRM, without all these like back-end things, like as a team of one. And I was like, yeah, I work hard on establishing trust today so that they might be able to hire me a year from now. And that's how I've always done it. And I did it as a team of one, right? So I started sharing articles for events that I wanted to speak at two years from now. I started sharing them today so that when it comes about in that event,

they asked me six months out and go, Brian, you've been in our network, sharing our stuff. I got to know you. Would you like to speak at our event? I'm like, oh, matter of fact, I would. Little do they know like that was my strategy, you know, two years earlier in the process. And I think that's kind of like fun of how this all works. Yeah, it's almost like what I hear you saying is that trust almost has like a like a compounding effect.

Like as you build trust with with one community and become kind of seen as a trustworthy person, more people are brought into that and maybe they're willing to to trust what you have to say and who you are quicker than they would is if they hadn't heard from you or you hadn't established yourself. So it just kind of compounds over time. And I think that's where I always look at the difference between like a community and a network.

And I think that's always like a fundamental piece for me. And I can't really remember who even like kind of open my eyes to this and maybe there's a couple different people. But I always like, you know, like a community is our people coming together because of a shared purpose and a shared passion. They're not connected to be a one individual, right? And a network is the idea that you are in, invited in because of the people that you know. And yet if there's a couple of people that are

removed from that network, your attachment to that network might no longer be there because the person removed. But you can remove people oftentimes from a community and the community is powering on because they're joined by that purpose and passion. I think that's also why like the words like monetizing community don't go together, right? Because it's like, wait a second, like we're bringing people together. And I think in the online space, like you can build followings on social networks. Very, hey, we all know how that works. But I also think building a community that will follow you where you go is where the magic

happens. That's the beauty. But there's no recipe. There's no online course. There's no like one, you know, one hit wonder to make that happen. And I think even, you know, you can use the extremes. You know, using Gary Vee is like using Apple and technology. There's only one of him and he did his own way.

And I don't like using him as an example, but there's lots of people I think are. that are understanding this idea of building through trust and those relationships and putting their passions out there. And ultimately that community ends up going to store, you know, the telling for them. And it's amazing because sometimes people will call them a podcaster. Like, wow, they're a YouTuber. But if you look at like the fundamental core, it didn't matter the medium they were delivering their message on.

It was more about the message that they were delivering. And it just happened to be that medium was the vehicle to get it to the people to bring the community together. Yeah. One of the things that you said in there was, you know, retweets and sharing of other people's content has become rare. Now, I remember, you know, I was active blogger, content creator in 2008, 2009. And that was the currency of the internet. I mean, that was how anyone found anything was, you know, I know you, I know the stuff that you like,

you retweet someone else's stuff and now I get introduced to somebody new. And I'm with you. Like, that doesn't happen anymore. Like, people just do not, they don't link to other people's work in their articles. They are not retweeting other people's work. They're not sharing articles into their feeds from other people anymore. Even still in people's quotes and not putting people's names under the quote. Like, this is like, this drives me nuts.

What you just said is drives me nuts is quote from someone alive with a Twitter account on Twitter and then not at mentioning them on, I'm like, it drives me crazy. And the worst part is it does you more benefit. Like the idea, and I think this is that weird, and this probably goes back to like a whole other piece where we lived in a mentality and a life. And I think this was a lot to do with like,

let's say before the internet boom and just the lifestyle that a lot of people are living in was like you hold on to what you know. And if you get hit by a bus, everyone else is screwed. and you are defined by what you know and you are rewarded and the salary you have and I and we no longer live in that culture right and that culture is completely but there's still like fundamental little pieces that trickle in and when I see people do that right they don't mention a person that or they're stealing quotes that majority of us know or from someone else and then I'm going to

put in that person's name underneath it and I immediately are like wow it's it's this idea that if I put their name underneath it, it somehow devalues what I currently own. It's like, actually, no, it now connects us with someone else that we can be inspired by. And if that person ends up being someone we trust, we now have up your level of trust by like, wow, I was connected by that person by that person, right? Like, it's so weird that we kind of got away from that. I think there's also, I think a lot of people are still looking for that shortcut, right? And I think in, like you said, the early blogging days, the early social media,

days, even, you know, Twitter, let's say Twitter five years ago, I don't think the shortcut was the answer, right? There was no shortcut successors, therefore there was no one to be like, oh, we're going to find that out. And then like this idea of like growth hacking and then like all these like weird things where you were getting rewarded for vanity metrics. And all of a sudden people started trying to like make excuses for these bad behaviors. And and I, you know, and it's weird because like my dad's giving me so much amazing business advice. And for the long, for there was a good period of time that I was like dad that's great but I worked on digital and like you hate internet and you don't like email and you sold peanuts he sold peanut brittle he owned a peanut brittle of

a global peanut brittle company on that he owned and like now when I circle back I'm like man like everything my dad told me about business and sales and trust and your word and you know over delivering that he was like ingraining me through everything that I like shunned is the is the core values of what still works. It's just that, you know, unfortunately, some people still see an easy button or looking for that shortcut. And, you know, I think that's been, if I don't, like, look at anything for me on, like, what keeps me going to, which I think was, like, the first question of you or everything they asked me, was like, I've never looked at anything that I do today as a need or desire for it to be short-term immediate success. Like, that, I almost, like,

like immediate success almost like scares me because like what happens when that goes away like you fall like building this like long journey and path that we're building failure does not scare me because i won't settle for it and i got plenty of things to roll back on that i that are in my life and in my journey and so i think it's i have like kind of like the flip but there's a lot of other people that are like oh my goodness i could get that million dollars tomorrow or i could go viral or i could do what you know i could be interviewed on this show or whatever it may be and i've never had a desire to that i even look at it and say if that's a show I want to be interviewed on or I want to be up on the podcast. Let's just say something on that.

I'm like, you know what? I'm going to earn my keep. And if I get on it in five years from now, that to me is so much more powerful than me, like, you know, going around some back door to get something that I want, like, immediately. I think that's, that that is such a unique value that good news is I feel like people are getting exposed today at a much higher rate. Like we're finally at this like pivot point where like taking it to making it. selling unicorns and rainbows and not, you know, having actually the products or the

services that you've been promising. Yes, they're still winning right now, but they're, they're starting to get exposed slowly. And I think the people that are like, you know, 10 years behind us are like, wait a second. I might not want to follow those people that are now kind of, you know, including like the Me Too movement. There's so much of those things that were like, hey, this is just the way things were done. And now, thankfully, we're at this pivot that are kind of changing our society, which let's hope it changes sooner than later. Yeah. Well, there's a lot in there that I, want to unpack. You know, I, I, uh, you know, for me, the trust isn't a zero sum game, right?

Trust is trust is, you don't, me showing, putting you on a pedestal or having you on my podcast. It doesn't decrease my trust and increase your trust. Exactly. The whole pool gets bigger, right? And I, I honestly believe that there are many people that just intrinsically do not understand that idea, that your win is their loss. It's that scarcity mindset. You know, Seth Godin calls it the lizard brain. You know, everyone has their own, their own way of describing it. But it's such a, it's such a toxic mentality because it does get you chasing that short term. And that isn't to say that everyone doesn't have moments of it. You know what I mean? Like, it's not like I don't look at my Instagram stats and go, you know, what the hell?

like this week. I didn't, you know, I mean, that happens. I mean, obviously, you have these moments, but it's being able to come back to the idea that, you know, there's a, there's a, there's a, there's a group in the insurance industry and their whole slogan is better together, better together, everything they've been saying that for years. And to be honest, when I first saw it, I was jealous because I was like, that is 100%. I had to, it was just a perfect, it was the perfect way to describe what I believe is exactly how we have to operate. you know and it actually takes me back to something you said that I wanted to comment on and then get your feedback you said you know the internet is a great place for you to find to find

your people and though and I agree with that at face value but I actually think that the internet I think that what I hope and you kind of alluded to this in the next wave of the internet and as the next generation kind of washes in and um and some of the mentality of the of the non-internet world kind of washes out of the internet is that it's not about finding your people it's about understanding that everyone has a piece of you in them yes and um because uh you know i i i got a piece of advice from somebody because i do not comment on politics but i do keep an eye on what is happening i try not to participate in the negativity um because it's don't because it's almost just tough to get away from

but I do follow it. And I had someone say to me, you know, I just was talking to them offline about a couple of things that were bothering me. And they said, you know, it might do you some good to follow people who at face value you don't know if you agree with them or not. So like at face value, you may say, you know what, I don't want to follow that person. I don't agree with that. But what this person's advice to me was, was if you do that over time, if you actually

actually give them a chance. Yeah, there's always probably going to be some things that you don't align with, but there may actually be some things that you do align with. And if my mentality could be, could go from what it is today, which is if you disagree with me on one thing, you're against me, too. If you agree with me on one thing, we have a chance. And I think that that shift is really what I hope happens. And I don't, that just triggered that thought in me. But I feel like as we roll up on this next election, holding some of those ideas in our head is going to be more important than ever. And I mean, I think like that to me kind of embodies what like my life's war. Like I use the phrase digital empathy and I don't think digital empathy is kind of like

the piece of it. But what I always looked at that was like, you know, removing toxic people or negativity and hateful people out of your life is important. That does not mean you remove the people that disagree with you, right? And I've always believed in this. And this for me has been a huge one. I was diagnosed ADHD at 31 years old, later in my life. And the first time I shared that on stage, and I remember the day, I remember the lady, I had a lady come up bawling and she had me FaceTime her son, and her son was struggling with an illness.

It wasn't even ADHD, and it was just the fact that I put it out there in front of these thousands of people that, like, connected me. And it was like, the more that we realized that our vulnerabilities, not only become our superpowers, but the things that link us in so many ways that, like we as humans are so much more aligned. I think this is where that,

I love the way you're saying it. It's like, hey, I disagree with you. You're out of my life rather than saying, well, we agree on this. And I think this is where, like, it's a skill. I tweet this out this weekend and it got a lot of play. And I was talking about this idea of compartmentalization.

And this idea that if you can compartmentalize certain things or prioritize, deprioritize how you evaluate them, it allows us to kind of open up new doors and things that we maybe have always, just siloed off. But at the same time, I also believe in having kind of like a backbone and your own morals and ethics. And like for me, like I'm very, I have a few that are just like things that, you know, and it's weirdly, it's like the same thing. Like when I got suspended from school, my high school year,

I remember my freshman or sophomore year. And my mom was just like so mad at me. And she's like, you're finally turning things around. And I remember my mom being like, she's like, what happened? And I was like, mom, I had like three things that I just, if these three things happen, I don't have rage. I'm not a person I wants to fight, but I have, like, three things that, like, it's just at my core that I don't settle for. I will not back down. I will not stay quiet. And it's funny, those three things still, like, are existing today, right? It's like, I don't want, anyone that attacked my family, I have a defense from a mechanism. Anyone that bullies anyone from a place of power has always been a thing for me. And then anyone that hits a woman, right?

And those were, like, my three, like, and at their core, like, they've expanded at a higher level now where, you know, I do a lot of work in the LGBTQ community and I have a lot of passion for this idea of treating everyone equally as long as that person isn't harming other people, right? I don't care what their love or beliefs are and I have, like, that's at my core. But, you know, I also grew up right-wing Catholic, right? And so, like, I had to learn, like, how do I bring this along? And, like, trying to hit my dad to, like, come on board with me in high school on some of these thoughts that I had, like, beliefs that I had was a lose, lose battle. And I would bump him with my dad and I would realize we get nowhere.

But over the years, I realized, well, I'm not having introduced to my friends. He's going to get to know these people. And then slowly he's going to realize that, like, some of his beliefs that these people fall into were things that he just wasn't exposed to, right? And it's been, like, an amazing thing where my dad has come that full circle. But I think it goes back to this idea of, like, compartmentalization in the sense of, like, you don't have to agree with the other things. If they're not, like, part of that moral compass of yours and they're not, like,

like stuck in stone, you can kind of like, hey, I'm going to let that person have that, but I'm going to agree with him on this side, right? And I think it's like that weird alignment of a brand and mission and message. And I think it's important, too, to always reevaluate that. Because, I mean, Marcus Sheridan, you know, our mutual, like, I mean, like, I had three and a half hours with him at the airport two weeks ago. And we, we joked that we literally talked 500 words a minute. And like, well, at one point, we looked around and, like, the entire restaurant.

in the airport bar, like, could hear, like, because we're just loud and fiery. And, but we, like, spent, like, the three hours together, and majority of that three hours was our passion to worry about society a year from now, right, at the next election. And it has had zero to do with politics. I don't think either one of us brought up Republican or Democrat. It had zero to do with that. It was more about, like, the divisity and the toxic element. And how we as, like, business partners and leaders,

that have been aligned for years that are all of a sudden going to have to, you know, are going to, quote unquote, be forced to pick aside and what that's going to do to startups and businesses and things that are going on. And I think we both, like, we both were scared.

We're both passionate to figure out ways to not allow that to happen in the arenas that we, you know, live in. But to your point, like on the idea where it's like, you know, it's that one thing that bonds us. And I think a more, and this is probably part of my whole empathy thing is that, like, my slogan is that empathy starts with, me, but I mean it was backwards. And what I believe that is that like we can't make the world a more empathetic place until we start putting our story out so that people can be empathetic

towards us. You know, and part of that is like realizing that there's people on cultures and beliefs that like were not open to me until I started sharing some of these other things and all of a sudden connecting at these core values. And you're like, I would have never thought of myself as someone that would be connected with a Buddhist monk and someone that was that was truly in this like spiritual spirituality like moment like and their entire life is that yet we we connected on something else that we both agreed on and all of a sudden now he's opened my doors and my life this is Jared and he has his great podcast no edic no edic nomadip or the podcast i'll have to give you the exact one but it's all about spirit and we connected on like our love for podcasting

only to share our stories as an intimate as you could have ever shared thanks to, you know, a couple, you know, adult drinks. And all of a sudden it was like this worlds that were open up to us. And our singular bond, you know, like, we started to realize, like, wow, we both grew up completely different worlds, but we have these same beliefs. And I think that's why when I say it on stage every time, I believe we're living the greatest time in history. That's hard to say when you have mass shootings and as, you know, we're recording this

on September 11th, you know, on this day, you know, 18 years ago, you know, like, but I truly do believe unity is the byproduct of where we're at, we just have to get to that pivot point or whatever, whatever slogan you want to say. And hopefully we get to it without it being something that destroys us so much that it takes too long and kind of rebuild. Yeah. I, you know, I have, I have, I have a lot of thoughts on what you just said. I think I completely agree that we are living in the greatest time in history. We're also living in the most equal time in history. We're living in the safest time in history. We're living in the best time in history. That being said, it's far from perfect. And I think, I think what I, how I, how I would rather frame the people who,

who, who would stand and say, you know, this country is, is, is, you know, a lot of negative things. I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I understand their frustration and wish that it could be framed in maybe a more positive way. The problem is the media doesn't write stories about positivity. So unless you're, you know, blasting, you know, blasting the president or blasting someone else, you know what I mean? Like, or, you know, someone on his side blasting back,

you know, no one picks it up. That all being said, what I think it's important to remember two things from my perspective on this topic is that a lot of misconceptions are formed based on signaling when we're trying to signal the tribe that we would like to be part of or that we feel gains us the most points, that creates a lot of misconceptions in the world about who we actually are. So I would just, anyone who's listening to this, that cares. I think we need to be very careful about how we signal in the world and why we're doing that.

There's a difference between having a belief structure and feeling the need to signal that structure, into the world for a given reason. And I may have jump in on you on that, but like that signal oftentimes either we don't realize that we're doing it or we don't have a desire to do it yet we feel based on like cultural norms to do it. Right. And to me like the easiest way to link this into like the business world is I've been very blessed.

I get to interview a lot and have conversations with a lot of CMOs, CEOs of really big companies. And I'm also the guy that wears a backward hat, crazy shit. and doesn't wear a suit and tie, right? Like I have, and people, I mean, the amount, and this is happening a lot more recently with like, Brian, like, I'm starting to figure out, like, how this works for you. They're like, you treat everyone with the same amount of respect and trust. Does it have a title or they don't have a title?

And the people that are, that have the title when they see that, they respect that at a deeper level than us signaling, well, I'm just as equal as you and trying to either, you know, it's not even piss and butt. It's more of like this idea of like, this idea that I have to prove to you that I belong to be able to have a conversation with you of meaning or to be a part of your business or life. And it's amazing for me where I connect people.

I mean, and these are high-ranking executives and I'm connecting the dots. And the biggest piece of it was like, well, Brian, you hung out and talked to me as if I was a normal person and I built trust with you the same you would have built with an entry level. And so I think that is that piece of like you don't have to signal or you don't have to become,

either something that you're not or even weirdly enough feel the need to be something that someone values, right? And there are people there are plenty of people in the world that value title and value a lot of that stuff, but those aren't people that I'm playing the game with and if they are I quickly, and this is probably

one of the other fundamental principles I think for me and this is one like I call myself a change evangelist and it was a title that when my CEOs that I used to work for, one of the smartest guys have ever worked for my entire life, he gave it to me because he was like, Brian, you can't, you're not a technology of Andrews. That's the job peddley

I pitched him and he gave it to me and we put it on business cards and he hated it. He was like, you're not he goes, because people assume that you want technology in all these places. He goes, you remove technology just as much as you install technology. He's like you will identify a problem and look at it and say, does technology make it better or worse?

And if it makes it worse, you have no problem removing technology of the equation, which he was right. And I think that element of like, quote unquote, change evangelists of what I looked at is one of the things that I think we also make a mistake on and I'm guilty I was being guilty of this many times in my career is that you can't change the game unless you're playing in the game and oftentimes we're like well they're not

going to agree with us or they're wrong and I think like I hate putting generalizations out there but the millennial generation um for all the stereotypes of millennial generation is being given that's one that is probably the biggest one was well they don't understand us they don't they're not they don't live in our world like screw them I'm not going to play in their game and I was like Like, that's quickly how we just become two worlds that are working in two different arenas and no one's kind of crossing over. And now, like, kind of even funneling into that compartmentalization thing, there are plenty of conversations, groups that I am a part of right now in the sense of knowing that me

being there might just change one person or one narrative. But the fact that if I'm not showing up there has the opportunity to change nothing. And changing nothing in things that I'm passionate about scares me more than anything else. I think that's such a fundamental piece of, and one of like most popular tweets I've had this entire year was I was just a simple tweet that just said, if your social media feeds sucks, it's not social media's fault, it's people you're following. And I said, embrace the unfollow, the block, the mute button, right? And that was my tweet. It was just like, you know, a simple tweet. And a lot of people who put it and ran with it and they loved it. And then there were a lot of people that were like, and I had to end up putting a second tweet. And I was like, hold on a second. This does not mean you remove people that disagree with you. It does not mean that.

that people that have a different opinion or sharing, I was like, I actually believe to be empathetic, to be well-rounded, you must understand all vantage points, right? I think that's, I mean, when we look at politics,

that's the problems on both extremes. It's like, neither extreme is willing to stop to understand even the place where other extreme is coming from. Therefore, they just keep making it more diverse. But I think for me,

that's where like this kind of come back to and I was like, you know, you remove toxic people that are attacking and that are saying hateful things that are full of negativity, But by getting rid of them, now you have some people that you can get your mind to be open new possibilities. You'll have all these new things.

And I think that's where, you know, not being part of the game, like saying like, oh my God, I hate social media or blaming social media for like the Me Too movement or all these things that exists. Like, no, wait a second. Society and mankind have been bad for a long time. Social media has exposed it. And we can either blame social media and continue to live in a society that allow these things to happen or we can fix society and amplify the good. with social media. And I think this goes back to you and I, like, on our core beliefs of like, there is this element that together we can, you know, the tide, you know, rise the tide, but in this world we're living in it still is, unfortunately, rare in the, in the space we're at.

But I believe the businesses that are doing it well are the ones that see that. Yeah. I actually think, and this is, I think, a good topic for us to close on because I want to be respectful of your time. You know, I actually think, that the negativity is the minority and that when we see the hardcore negativity what we're hearing is a very small portion of the population on both sides who their identity is that negativity and that's just the role they play and what we what I hope that we hold in our minds in all in all things when you're having disagreements at work or disagreements with your family or friends or in

your community is that the the loudest most, or most negative voices in a conversation are often the vast minority. And not that we shouldn't hear them, but we shouldn't, we certainly shouldn't hold them up as the banner for what that, you know, quote unquote, side of the argument actually believes. Because I know a lot of, you know, pro-gun who are also pro-gender rights. And, you know, if you were to, you know, if either one of the far-exha, were to hear that you were one or the other, they both would kick you out and then where do you go? And it's like, that goes for every disagreement. You may be pro hierarchy and work, but also

want your people to step up and question in what you do. And it's, it's this, you know, I think the easiest example is always is always impotis, I think for this particular issue, but, but the idea transcends every aspect of our life when you're disagreeing with your spouse or your partner or someone in your family, your friends. If you're having in particular, I think this is coming more and more into work as people get into these, you know, I just had a discussion the other day with someone about flat structure versus hierarchies. And I firmly believe in a hierarchy.

I just do. I believe that you have to have a hierarchy to get things done. That being said, it places more intrinsic responsibility on the leader to allow their people to be value ads all the way up the chain. Now, that may not, with a weak or a selfish, self-oriented leader, that system falls apart, which is why people say hierarchies are the problem. Hierarchies aren't the problem. I'm way off on a tangent, but I don't believe hierarchies are the problem.

I believe shitty leadership is the problem. So, you know, so we've gone back and forth and ultimately, I think we both understood their sides. And basically the person I was talking to side was, how do you know if someone's a shitty leader? You know, and once they get to that position, how the heck do you get them out? And I said, that's a fair point. I think that's what we have to work through. But I guess my point is like, you know, if you can, if you, I don't ever think we should

shut anybody up. And I don't believe in banning people because I just, I, unless they're really, unless you say, really hateful, whatever. But, but I think we need to hear what the extremes are saying. I think we just always have to hold in our mind. Remember exactly who they are and why they're doing. It's, it's like you signaling as a Pittsburgh Steelers fan and me as a Bill's fan. And it's part of who they are is hard to one side and negative.

And everybody else is in the middle. And those are the people that I hope, I hope they just find one thing in common because when you find one thing in common, everything else seems to fall into place. And you'd be amazed, too, if you'd like looked at, you know, because you do have the extremes, like you said. But I think if you looked oftentimes at negativity that is in your life or in your feed or in our world today,

the negativity is rooted in a desire to, to know that their voice is heard, not the negativity that the message is pairing. And I think this goes everything from kneeling on the football field to, you know, like, there's a fundamental principle. And there's also, there's a difference here of knowing that I'm heard and knowing

that you have to listen to me, right? Like, there are two different worlds. And I think we have this like weird thing where if we acknowledge someone that, hey, we hear someone, that means we ultimately have to do exactly what they're telling us. And I think that's complete fault. And that's, you know, the amount of times I've had these conversations with leaders on social media and then coming to me and Brian, putting vulnerabilities out there and doing all this stuff.

But yet, how do you respond to this comment or this statement? And I was like, well, you have to acknowledge it. Like, there's no, I don't, you know, I don't, you know, I don't bet it. You have to acknowledge. And they're like, what, I'm like, because the lack of acknowledgement will now just spur the hate and the, and the, the ingredients is more. Right? And this idea of like, hey, I hear you. I'm going to take it for the value that it has, but I'm going to decide how it's going

to be implemented, but I do hear you, right? And it's amazing where I think even to your point with your, the friend of you had a discussion on the hierarchy, if you weren't willing to listen to the fundamental, like, hey, this is what you were arguing? Wait a second. Like, you argued that? You're an idiot. No.

You're arguing. And then the root comes out to be, oh, yes, we realize that shitty leaders have been rewarded for a long, freaking time. And it's really hard to get rid of shitty leaders. How do we prevent shitty leaders? There's not really a recipe. And I think this is where I think, to me, it excites me about where we're at because there is, like find that one commonality.

But at the same time, also, if you don't see the commonality, but they won't stop chirping and they won't stop making sure you hear them, maybe it's time to take a different perspective and a different mindset to what they're, even who they are and what they're talking about. And I think that's where that one piece comes in, like, some of the coolest moments in my life, I feel like are, you know, and it has to do with a group of speakers that opened me to this world of people that are doing the same profession of me, just do it differently. They have like different passions and goals and they've come to come so many different lives than I have.

And then there's like these core things that like, I mean, I feel like in the last two years, I've become a much more well-rounded human. I don't, I don't, and this is like, you know, not saying I don't judge everything, but I don't judge. I look at every opportunity as a learning opportunity. I'm willing to listen. And oftentimes people look around me like, Brian, why did you just, why did you keep listening there? And I was like, because they have that passion that's rooted somewhere. And if I, even if I don't agree with it, but I understand it better by listening, I improve. And maybe I can help them improve even telling their story. And I think that's, I think that's where you and I

even agreed. I think part of the route where you and I connected with early on was just like our desire to help people, but also a desire to realize that like everything's building to a performance level that we can always grow on. And you made the same in before. And I just literally ordered these shirts yesterday. I have a shirt coming out that just says, we are greater than me, betterment time, because if we can embrace that and realize that we're all connected by those one things, the world's been a much better place. My man, it is always a pleasure to spend time with you. Thank you so much. I know you're traveling. Life is hectic. You're an in-demand speaker and you got places to be. So I appreciate this time. It's definitely been fun for me. And you got my mind going and I got a page full of notes, which is always amazing. Where is the best place for people listening to this? They want to learn more about you. Maybe they want to hire you to speak. They just want to be part of your ecosystem and kind of take in more of what you do. Where do they go to learn more? So, you know, I'm a big believer in, you know, consistency.

Consistency is extremely important. Probably one of the most underrated things online today. So I'm I social fans. So the I social F-A-N-Z or a Z at the end on every social network. So I always say, don't follow me everywhere. I create a lot of content and a lot of noise. Follow me on your favorite channel. I would appreciate that.

And then I'm speaking. My new speaker site is Brianfanzo.com. Brianfanzo.com is where all of my speaking stuff kind of goes through there. And if you want a podcast, I think that we probably relates to your audience the most. I also a weekly podcast called FOMO fans, where I try to cure your fear of missing out around entrepreneurship, marketing, business, technology. I'm a solo podcast. Literally, it's me talking to the microphone for 30 minutes.

But it's kind of my, it's definitely my passion project where I just love being able to share what's on my mind. And I think I rolled out episode 118 this week, so it's a lot of fun. But yeah, anywhere and everywhere, Ryan, it's a point. pleasure for me. I'll tell you what, I, I love that we can come from two different industries and walks of life. Social media was the link. We ended up having some mutual friends that kind of united the trust we have together. But, you know, I've been cheering for you as you were pivoting, and I think we've both been cheering for each other, which I think is a whole lot more fun with the

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