Follow Him: A Come, Follow Me Podcast - Doctrine & Covenants 109-110 Part 1 : Dr. Brent Rogers

Episode Date: September 25, 2021

Those first moments in the Grove in 1830 led  up to this revelatory event--the Kirtland Temple dedication. Dr. Brent Rogers relates how the spiritual building and the physical building of the Kirtland Temple parallel our preparation. Also, the  Saints unify to build a magnificent house of the Lord and prepare themselves for the Lord to manifest Himself.Shownotes: https://followhim.co/Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/followhimpodcastInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/followhimpodcastYouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/FollowHimOfficialChannel"Let Zion in Her Beauty Rise" by Marshall McDonaldhttps://www.marshallmcdonaldmusic.com/products/let-zion-in-her-beauty-rise-pianoPlease rate and review the podcast.

Welcome to Follow Him, a weekly podcast dedicated to helping individuals and families with their Come Follow Me study. I'm Hank Smith, and I'm John by the way. We love to learn, we love to laugh, we want to learn and laugh with you. As together, we follow him. Hello my friends, welcome to another episode of Follow Him. My name is Hank Smith, I am your host. I am here with my wise co-host John by the way John I was looking in section 109 and

The Lord says to seek out words of wisdom and to me that's just the words of John by the way Oh, yeah, right. Yeah, like the old owl in Winnie the Pooh, not the old owl. Just the owl. No, I think the old part, you got it right there. You are not old. You don't count as old. What'd you say, Hank? Yeah.

Okay. Hey, we want to remind everybody that you can find us on social media. We would love for you to come find us on Facebook or on Instagram and make comments. We love to see what you have to say, especially if it's positive. You can come to follow him.co, follow him.co for transcripts, quotes, references, all that you need. And of course, please take the time to rate and review the podcast.

That actually helps us quite a bit. rate and review the podcast. That actually helps us quite a bit. John, we are on a seminal two sections of the doctrine covenant. Huge sections of the doctrine covenant. And so we had to get someone who could could live up to those sections. So tell us who's with us today. Yes, thank you. Today we have Dr. Brent M. Rogers. He's a historian and a documentary editor for the Joseph Smith papers. And that right there tells you something. He earned a bachelor's degree with honors in history from San Diego State and Masters in public history from California State University Sacramento and a PhD with emphasis in 19th century United States history from the University of Nebraska Lincoln He's he's been everywhere

He's the author of listen to this title a distinction between Mormons and Americans Mormon Indian missionaries federal Indian policy and the Utah war Which was in the Utah historical quarterly andke I, the Western History Association's 2015 Aarrington Prucha, so you say that, prize for best article on the history of religion in the West. And he's also a co-editor of the journals, volume three of the Joseph Smith papers and the documents volume three of the Joseph Smith papers. And so when I just think the Joseph Smith papers project has been amazing and so glad to have you here, Dr. Rogers. Thank

you for joining us today. Thank you. Thank you both for having me. It's an honor and you know, you guys know how to put people at ease just, you know, with your calm approach. So thank you. Dr. Rogers comes highly recommended by his peers. Dr. Harper, Dr. Dirk Mott, all said that this is who we need to talk to for sections 109 and 110. And we've said before, John, on the podcast that when you're studying the doctrine, and covenants, and studying history, I don't think you and I realized how much of a science history is, and that you need to be trained in history.

Yeah, there comes a reliability when you know people are using the tools of scholarship, and you'll hear a precision in their language when they describe things. And so that's a real wonderful thing we've had on this podcast, is we have people that are acquainted with those tools of scholarship and history, and they'll separate an assumption from, you know, and those kinds of things are great to have. So this has been wonderful.

They can be source critical too. So Dr. Rogers, were you all out historian? Did you always want to be a historian? No, actually, I can't say that I really took a liking to the study of history until my sophomore year of college. I was actually probably one of those, you know, kids in high school that thought history was boring and had, you know, kind of a bad attitude about it. I remember, you know, taking some road trips as a child and stopping along the way and seeing

some historic markers and always thinking that that was kind of fun. But then getting into history when you're when you're in school, it seems a lot more about wrote memorization and this date and this thing happened on that particular date, and it's just a kind of a series of chronological events. And so I could say for a certainty that I was not really into history. And I had to take a US history course, my second year of college. And I was like, well, I'll take an American history course. It's one of the courses that you have to take to meet a requirement. And so we'll get it out of the way.

And there was just something different about history in really studying the wise and the motives and the decisions that were made that caused those critical events that happened and that dates get associated with. And so saw a little bit different dynamic to history as I studied it in college and particularly interesting to me was was the people dynamic and and how people related to one another and That was something that just seemed a little bit detached from from other you know events whether or you know other study that I had in high school and just going to markers.

There might be a name of somebody mentioned, but getting to know more about the ordinary people was fascinating to me. Yeah, we're hoping to do some of this dynamic that you're talking about here, Brent. Today, let's jump into these sections. Sections 109 and 110 of the Doctrine Covenants. I don't think the importance of these two sections can be overstated in the Doctrine Covenants. This is huge. I've heard, I think it was Steve Harper say before that 1836 may well be the best year of Joseph Smith's life. So why don't you take us as far back as you want to go and Tell our listeners what they need to know to get to lead the what leads up to March 27th

1836 Well, how much time do we have in the podcast? I think we could, I mean, really, these are five years in the making at least. If not, you can go, in fact, maybe I'll go back even further at some point, but these revelations that we're talking about today are sort of the culmination of the first five and a half, six years of the organization of the church. And then if you want to go back to, you know, when Joseph Smith saw God the Father and his son Jesus Christ in the sacred grove, you know, this, this is all building to these momentous days in late March and early April 1836.

And so this is where Joseph learns that they would be endowed with power from on high. Right. And that they were the amendment to move. Right. Yeah. At the Ohio. That's where they're going to be endowed with power from on high. We could then jump forward to, you know, Dr. and Covenants 88 is talking about establishing

the house, the house of prayer, the house of fasting, the house of faith, the house of learning, the house of glory, the house of order, a house of God. And so we can move forward again to section 94 that talks about laying out and preparing the foundation of the city of Zion, the state of Zion, excuse me. And he says, beginning at my house, this is where we're going to build the temple. If we were to look at a plat of the central space of the city of Zion, the state of the state of Zion, the temple is right in the middle. And it's from that focal central space that the beauty and the power of the temple was going to that the beauty and the power of the temple was going to be a beacon and radiate out to the members of the church and be a constant reminder in their lives. This is part of the pattern that the Lord is giving. And so, you know, some of the words like order and glory and prayer,

and these are things that are building up to where we find ourselves in spring of 1836. And one other section maybe just to hint at here to start is section 95, which I've long found to be a very fascinating section, but the part that the Lord says to Joseph and the saints that ye have sinned against me a very grievous sin in that ye have not considered the great commandment in all things that I have given unto you concerning the building of minehouse for the preparation wherewith I designed to prepare mine apostles to prune the vineyard for the last time. And so there's two things that I think are really important about that part of the revelation. One is it's been through the winter and just a few months into 1833 and the Lord is like, why aren't you guys building that house that I commanded you to build in section 88. Like, you know, let's go.

It's time to get moving on that. And the, just a few days later, Hiram Smith writes in his journal that, you know, they start digging out the trench for the walls. And they get going. I mean, they take the section 95 revelation pretty seriously. The Saints do and they really start. That's when work begins in earnest on the temple in Kirtland. I remember from an earlier, maybe when we were talking about section 95, wasn't Hyrum

the first one to throw a shovel into the ground or something and said he wanted to be the first. Yeah. Yeah. And he goes and he grabs and immediately begins digging out those areas for the foundation. And it's pretty remarkable to see how quickly they respond to that physical act of getting the temple going.

There's a great lesson there for me is sometimes, sometimes we wanna wait until we feel like we've got everything in place, right? We're going to, well, let's just wait a little bit longer and we'll get, you know, what about the windows, what about the roof, what about this? And hire them, Smith, let's get started. Let's get started. The Lord can start bringing people in.

I've noticed that. And maybe we can talk about a little bit about this as you as you preppist for 109, but it seems to me once they got started, the Lord started sending those who could do windows, who could do furniture, who could do plants, but they had to get started. Yeah, acting on that command, if you will, that revelation, that prompting and doing it, not maybe knowing where it's gonna go

or how you're gonna get some of those things accomplished. And those ways come about because of the faith taken to get started, I think. Yeah, I think that's a great point. The other point I wanted to make about that line in section 95 is about preparation. It says the building of mine house for the preparation, wherewith I designed to prepare. So you got preparation and then prepare these, both in the same line of that revelation. And it's fascinating to me to see how Joseph Smith goes about that preparation.

And so we'll fast forward into the fall of 1835. In the time between when they first start digging for the foundation walls in June of 1833 until the fall of 1835, quite a lot happens. You have a science camp camp. That expedition happens, and of course that's tied to the temple as well. If you're reading in section 105, where it says that this isn't going to happen, meaning the taking over of Zion, or taking back of Zion, excuse me. But the elders needed first to be prepared and taught more perfectly and obtain that long promised endowment of power in the Kirtland temple. And so when they get back from Zion's camp, they go going all in on finishing the physical construction of the temple. And what Lucy Mc Max Smith writes about that time frame from 1835 through

early 1836, she says there was but one main spring to all of our thoughts and she's talking about the church members, the saints, and she says, and that was building the Lord's house. And I think if we were to look at a lot of the you know, the sources of that time period, you would see that that's exactly, she's exactly right, that the main spring to the thoughts of the saints is we need to finish building the Lord's house. But the so physical construction is one thing and then spiritual preparation is another. And that's where coming back to section 95 where you know the Lord says that he's going to prepare his apostles to prune the vineyard. There's a lot that happens with Joseph Smith's, the direction that he takes with his teaching and counsel in late 1835 and into 1836. He really emphasizes spiritual preparation. He focuses on themes like unity and humility. There had been some disunity in the quorum of the 12

and also between members of the 12 and the first presidency, this stems from the first mission of the, as a quorum for the quorum of the 12 apostles, there had been some reports that were sent back to to Kirtland that had some suggestions of the 12 weren't maybe doing what they were supposed to be doing. And then there were letters written back from Kirtland to the 12 that took those rumors or reports at face value. And there was upset feelings on both sides.

Now they weren't far away, right? Brent, this was like an Eastern States mission. Is that correct? Yeah, a lot of what I'm thinking about it happened in New York, kind of close to where the church was organized in upstate New York and Palmyra area. You know, kind of close to where the church was organized in upstate New York and Palmyra area, but

Yeah, they go to Maine and Massachusetts on that on that mission and so The part of the the issue was the Delay and communication that Happens with letter writing in the 19th century and so without a quick ability to send a text and say, hey, I think we got our lines crossed and, you know, or to get on a video chat and clear the air, this just kind of festored for the remainder of the mission for the 12.

And then they return in September. And there's some pretty hurt feelings among members of the 12 and between the 12 and the first presidency. So they get called in February, leave on this mission in May, come back in September and there's been some hurt feelings. There's been some hurt feelings that happened.

And there's an effort made when they first return to try to clear the air. And it seems to have helped briefly. It doesn't last as what happens sometimes with humans, right? We hold on to some feelings and we're not totally ready. I'm just gonna say, Brandon, I'm happy that this never happens in the church today, that there's never feelings and words and things that are all figured out. Yeah, I'm glad that that doesn't happen today. It definitely happens and that's okay. I think the lesson maybe to learn as I keep talking

through this is that, you know, if the forgiveness doesn't happen right away, that's all right. Just still got to work through it. Joseph holds a meeting in October of 1835, and he tells the 12 apostles that they must prepare their hearts in all humility if they are going to receive the endowment of power from on high. So again, you have that kind of preparation, is this real key word that keeps coming up to get us to the temple. I like how you're doing this. We've got the physical temple being built, but it's being prepared, but the spiritual, the people are also being built.

Yeah, and they need to be just as ready as the plaster on the outside of the temple walls and those kinds of things, right? So the instruction continues in November where Joseph gives a discourse that he really is urging repentance and humility and preparation. He says, we must have all things prepared and call our solemn assembly as the Lord has commanded us that we may be able to accomplish this great work. And it must be done in God's own way. The house of the

Lord must be prepared, and the solemn assembly called an organized innate according to the order of the house of God. And he says, and in it, meaning in the house of God, we must attend to the ordinance of washing the feet. So he's preparing them for that ordinance. And then he says, this is calculated to unite our hearts that we may be one in feeling and sentiment and that our faith may be strong, so that Satan cannot overthrow us nor have any power over us.

And so he then kind of, I don't know if this is the conclusion, but part of his continuing words on that November day was, all who are prepared and are sufficiently peer to abide the presence of the Savior will see him and in the solemn assembly to be held in the temple. And so I think that it's a very, it's a strong teaching, it's a specific telling the 12,

but also if we want to say that he's teaching all of us that we need to be United we need to have unity And I think that has continuing relevance for us today. We need to have our hearts clean and and be prepared so that Satan won't have power over us and and instead we'll be able to feel the presence of the Savior manifest himself. And that's particularly strong in the temple if we're able to go there with clean hearts and to be prepared to be prepared spiritually. The idea is that everyone has to look at themselves. The idea is that everyone has to look at themselves, right?

And that's not easy to do sometimes. It's a rather clean someone else's heart than my own. Do you know what I love about this too? Is, I mean, there's an expectation that he just created. It's almost like another one of his prophecies because as we're going to find out at the dedication there were amazing people saw amazing things and he was right. If you're prepared, you may see some incredible things and I just thinking, wow, that's kind of a prophecy in a way. I just thinking, wow, that's kind of a prophecy in a way.

Yeah. And the idea of unity being so essential to, um, to being ready to be able to see the, the savior, to be able to feel of his presence, reminds me a lot of, uh, sister UBanks talk that she gave, uh, I think that was in 2020, it was one of my favorite talks from recent conferences where she talks about the need to create unity and to have mercy and to see differences, to be able to turn those to advantages and that unity takes work and that it sometimes can be uncomfortable. I think that's what Joseph was telling the members of the 12 and if we want to extrapolate to us as well as that this is work. It doesn't just hear, hey, have unity with everybody and all of a sudden,

hey, I'm unified, let's go. It takes work and I think what being unified or having unity means is feeling unified in Christ. And through his teachings, he gives us the blueprint of how we become more unified and more kind and more loving as people. And to hang to your point, you know, how we can look inward to to clean ourselves up, you know, to, he gives us that just as much as he does, how to do that with

other people. So I think that there's a real, a real importance to thinking about spiritual preparation and unity. As we think about this section 109, it's not necessarily, you know, if you were just to read the section, you wouldn't maybe see that just in reading the verses. But knowing some of the background and some of the efforts that it took to get there, you can see how preparation and unity, spiritual preparation, and being unified is essential to the dedication of the temple. It's the definition of Zion, right? The one heart, one mind thing. It's all the same. I wonder if having this project, this building helps that.

You know, you would hope that as they're doing this together, that they're becoming, I would think that they're becoming closer friends, they're talking more, they're communicating. But I just don't know which one was harder, building the temple, which is incredible, right? And we can talk a little bit about that Brent, the actual construction, or becoming unified. I don't know which one is going to be more difficult, just because they're both tremendous, tremendous projects. Well, yeah, let's see if we can, I sort through that a little bit, because the physical construction of the temple was a huge challenge from getting supplies to getting the right

people, which we already sort of alluded to, to having enough people and resources to get it constructed. It took the sacrifice of a lot of people's time, money, the cliche blood, sweat, and tears, right? It took so much to just get that physical building done. I think that maybe if we're thinking about this from our present-day lens, we think we hear our beloved Prophet talk about the building of several temples every time conference is announced, and it just seems like it's kind of a, you know, every day sort of thing now. Well, we have the means and we're just going to, you know, build new temples all over the world. And it's fantastic that we're in a position as a church and an organization to be able to do that.

We got to like look back on those early saints and know that one they had, they had barely enough means to stay alive. There don't have any of these modern conveniences of, we'll just create an extra shipment of lumber this time around and we'll be okay, there isn't that same ability to get materials first of all and to have financial means. The early saints give every scrap of extra money or materials that they have to help do this. So, going back to Lucy Maxx,

Ms. Quote about there was one main spring to all of our thoughts and I was building the Lord's house. It's not just in their thoughts and we're going to go out and give the effort to do it. We're going to find ways to donate any means that we have, you know, the several sisters are finding fabric to knit together or sew together so that the veils are properly done inside the temple. And the curtains are properly done inside the temple to get the wood to build all the pews that they had to build and not let alone the outside edifice. I mean, they're scrapping together what they can and they end up creating

this beautiful structure. And so that physical construction is demanding and it's a major sacrifice. But I would say I think the spiritual is just as if not harder. And I would say for us today, the spiritual is significantly harder. We have means to build and to do physical work in a way that I think, at least from my observations, when the ox is in the mire, there's people that are going to come running and they're going to help. We've had up in where I live in

Farmington, we've had some windstorms and some weather issues that have created some need for people to get out with some chainsaws and cut down some fallen trees and we have so many people that will come out and help with that. And it's that project, having that project allows them to come out and they see there is a real need. Sometimes I don't know if we see that same need if there is a leak in our spiritual dam or something like that, we kind of find ways just, paper it a little bit and then move on as the, the, the dem might crack a little bit more and more.

Yeah, or a grudge, a grudge is festering, right? Yeah. I don't know if we notice that as much. This is fascinating stuff. I mean, I've been to the Kirtland Temple many times and you're right, if you view it in 2021's standards, you're going, oh, it's a nice building, right? That's great. But if you think of it for 1836, this had to be the biggest building within hundreds of miles. They were thinking a log cabin at first. Joseph said, no. You're're gonna build a house to the Lord out of logs.

We're gonna build something else. And the fact that they did it is incredible, physically incredible. But the fact that they were able to come together as a group and unified, it's also equally incredible. But I'm glad you're pointing this out, Brent. This is good stuff. The thinking about just ordinary people that may have been of a number

of different occupations or farmers. Because today, when President Nelson might announce we're building more temples, well, I don't physically go there. It's contracted through the tithes or whatever. But boy, back then, it was like whoever you are just come and start working. And whatever skills you have or don't have, we need you. I think it's a really good point that now the spiritual preparation is probably harder because we're not expected to go start cutting logs or hewing stone out of the quarry like they were back then. Good point.

I was living in the Sacramento area when they were finishing construction on the Sacramento Temple and there was an opportunity to help with some landscaping and you know that that was an awesome thing and I'm not trying to to discount, but that was what was an opportunity or available for members of the church in the area to contribute to the temple is pretty small when you think about the other work that it might take. But I mean, it was a fulfilling couple of hours to be able to help with some of the landscaping, but that was all that we could do. So, it just kind of shows the difference in what the physical energy and sacrifice that

early saints had to make. I can imagine those Curtlyn Saints. Oh, you helped with the grass, did you? Yeah, I helped with the grass, did you? Yeah, yeah, I helped with the grass. Oh, I actually built the stairs, right? I was just, if I showed up, John, if we showed up at the Temple site today, they'd say, get away from here.

You're gonna mess it up. You're gonna mess it up. Yeah, you're not building it to code. Yeah. And the fact that the Kirtland Temple is still standing, is it pretty incredible? Pretty incredible miracle, right? It's still there. I mean, it's been almost 200 years, and it is still there. That's a testament to them. It shows that excellent

worksmanship that was done to construct that building for sure. And then efforts of people along the way to make sure that it was kept up. And so we need to acknowledge that as well. I think Sydney Rigden, two and a half hours, and we all know Sydney eventually fell away, but I just don't know how well any of us would do had we been dragged by our heels with our head smacking against the cold ground, right? But I read something I had never heard before

about Sydney Rigden. Listen to this, hebercy Kimball said he Sydney Rigden frequently used to go used to go upon the walls of the building, both by day and night, and frequently wetting the walls with his tears, crying aloud to the Almighty, to send means whereby we might accomplish the building.

I just love hearing that about Sydney, that he was that invested, that he was weeping next to the walls of the partway constructed temple asking for help to finish it. That's pretty cool. Have you heard that before? I hadn't. No, that's wonderful. That is Times and Seasons, 6 April 15, 1845, 867.

That's in Carl Anderson's book, The Savior and Curtlyn. But I loved hearing that, because I don't want to only remember about Sydney that he eventually left. The first presidency and members of the 12 have a meeting where they bring everybody together and Oliver Cowdry is there as well. There's this meeting that's held in middle of January of 1836,

it's January 16th, because there are still kind of these lingering hard feelings. Joseph and his brother William, who's a member of the The Cormor of the Twelve, had had a pretty nasty fist fight that left Joseph unable to, you know, even sit up in his bed for a couple of days because he'd been beaten so badly by his brother. And so there's still still still going to make mothers of sons fill a whole lot better when they hear that Joseph Smith and his little brother William got into a pretty big fist fight.

Yeah. Yeah, we could get we could get into that if you want. I mean, it's kind of a kind of an aside, but there was a verbal disagreement that led to a physical altercation, and William apparently beat him pretty good. Yeah, the idea was Joseph couldn't get his coat off, had his arm caught or something, right? And that's what he said. If there anything like my kids, you observe the whole fight, sometimes the one that comes out on the end

where maybe they didn't do so well, they have some excuses. But no, I'm not trying to besmirch Joseph's character. I know. This is maybe something that we, I like talking about this merch, Joseph's character, I know. But this is maybe something that we, I like talking about this actually, Brent, because William isn't mentioned all that often. You talk about Hyrum and Joseph.

We talk about Samuel. We talk about Alvin. But we don't mention William all that often. And that's because he was more of, he was difficult. He was a difficult member of the family. And I think for families out there, they might go, oh, right, all families may have some difficulty and the prophet and a member of the 12 got in a fist fight.

Yeah. Yeah. William, I would say, there's other people that know a lot more about William Smith. But I would say that I think that he was very human and he, you know, he kind of went with his feelings and passion. And in some cases went pretty hard with him. And I think that, you know, that's okay. He had a good heart and his relationship with his brothers was generally pretty good, although there's,

as is the case with a lot of families, you have times when the emotions run high. And this was one of those times and it was hard on the family. And there was some reconciliation that was needed. But it might just be kind of a point to say it's a bit symbolic of there's sort of this underlying tension. And if we want to take them outside of their roles as brothers

and say there's still an underlying tension between members of the first presidency and the core of the 12 apostles, it's still there. And so they have this meeting in January to air the grievances. And everybody who wants to speak gets a chance to speak. And there's some pretty passionate talk that's made. And after all of the members of the 12 speak,

Joseph, he acknowledges that he may have expressed some too harsh language at times, and he asks for forgiveness for hurting their feelings. And it's interesting, if you read the minutes of that meeting, that's kind of all it took was his acknowledgement of the wrong and his sincere desire to seek forgiveness and to forgive on his part. And that's something that, as I've studied Joseph Smith's life, I mean his ability and desire desire to forgive and extend forgiveness is quite remarkable to me. And so, you know, the sounds like a big let's air out. Let's let's talk about it. Right.

Yeah. Yeah. Wow. It takes that's a lot of courage. And for the president of the church to apologize and say, you know what? I'm sorry. And I like how you said this, that's what it took. And that's a tribute to all of these men that they were able to forgive. Kind of see a bigger picture about keeping the temple and its blessings in their sites. We talked, I mean, just the impression,

ever since section 88, and in those 90 sections, just how anxious the Lord was, the sections in some of the 90 sections, 95, about which it just build the temple, the Lord just seems so anxious to give them the temple blessings. It's just a feeling that you get, and so it's good

that we've got to do what it takes, including forgiving and getting unified to make, to get in a position where we get this done. Not only the temple, but ourselves prepared for the temple. Yeah. And they exchange some promises to each other and express confidence in one another. There really seems to be a feeling of unity, unity in Christ and focusing on that kind of bigger picture that you alluded to, John. And I mean, Joseph, or the minutes of the meeting say that there was a perfect unison of feeling

on this occasion in our hearts overflowed. And that's kind of how it ends. And then why I think that that's such an important moment in getting us to the temple dedication is the things that happen as a result of that. It's just a week or days, I can't remember the exact timeframe about five days later that they're in the temple and doing the

The ritual washing and anointing for the first time right doing the The ordinance of of washing and anointing in the the manner that was shown by Moses right who stood who who Who did that ordinance in ancient days, and that after Joseph gets this ordinance done, he is being blessed by his father and other church leaders are there. And this is when Section 13 know, section 137 is revealed and he has the vision of the celestial kingdom, the individuals that would dwell therein. And so I know you this is not for our our time here, but that that happens in the temple as they've

become unified in in their feelings with with one another and they are in a place of spiritual preparation. So it, in the chronology of events, it happens before the dedication of the temple, but we, we've read it as section 137, which is, which is down the road a little bit. Right. Yeah. I'm looking at the date. Yeah. You said this meeting was January 16th, and here it is, January 21st, 1836. I didn't know that it was just after this big reconciliation, this vision opens up, that's beautiful.

And of course, I mean, we all appreciate what is taught in this about, especially as it pertained to Joseph Smith's family with Alvin, and all who have died without a knowledge of the gospel who would have received it, if they had been permitted to remain on the earth, will be airs in the celestial kingdom. That's beautiful. And that's something that is, you know, answers a lot of questions for us. It's like theological dynamite. That's amazing to have that, to have that the Lord knows how to judge hearts and those who would have received it.

And so 137 was given before 109 and 110, what we're studying today. And it was after, yeah, after a meeting where they got that feeling of unity, there was some forgiveness, some promises made to each other. And that's when that revelation came. That's great. Yeah. And now I can't say that, you know, that's the cause and effect, but the timing of it. But it was after that, yeah. Yeah, that it comes after that, you know, there's, I think that there's something to that as Joseph

is continually teaching about preparation and unity and humility and that after they have that airing of grievances that they're there, and that I think that it shows that they really are there, and they really are in that place of spiritual preparation, and that this is when the vision of the celestial kingdom is shown to Joseph. You know, what's interesting about all of this is I'm sure this experience has happened with both of you, but having been to dozens of youth conferences, I can remember more than once having just very fine testimony meetings and for kids getting up and

really a Zion feeling kind of coming and kids saying to each other, if I've ever each other, if I've ever offended you, if I've ever offended anybody here, I'm sorry. Because there was such a wonderful spirit there. And that I've always thought of that as kind of a Zion feeling, one heart, one mind. And while even in your own ward, you go through ups and downs with people, but there's this feeling of, I just want to and downs with people, but there's this feeling of, I just want to clean slate with all of you

if I've ever offended anyone I'm sorry in. And that precedes, I love that idea. I wish we'd have those kind of Zion moments more often. That's what the, kind of the influence of the spirit, it's what it does to you. And I personally, and Brent, you can't say that, obviously, there's cause and effect here, but I love that William and Joseph have this falling out,

they reconcile, and then there's Alvin, right, in the vision, almost as if that, you know, the family was able to connect with him through the reconciliation with each other. I just, I think that's a beautiful idea. Yeah, I like that as well. I never thought about it like that. And that makes, you know, it gives me the feels.

Let's say, let's say, I like that. I don't think of, think of the word of, of somebody pointed this out the other day, a family reunion. What were a union, unity. It's a reuniting for the family reunion, and that was a little reunion there. See, their brother there must have been so huge for them. And I suppose just kind of an understanding of,

well, I guess if you didn't get baptized in this life, sorry, but know, sorry, but there he was. Yeah. Yeah. The evening before the dedication, March 26th, Joseph and Oliver Cowdry, Sydney Rydin, Warren Parish, and I think Oliver Cowdry's brother Warren Cowdry is there as well. They meet in the attic floor of the temple in what was called the president's room to prepare for the dedicated to our event. And while there's not a whole lot known about the preparation outside of the fact that, that, you know, Joseph says that the prayer was revealed to him,

Oliver Caldrey wrote in his diary that at the meeting he assisted in writing the prayer for the dedication of the house. And so what that means exactly, I don't know if he acted as scribe and wrote it as Joseph spoke as a possibility, but it's kind of an interesting phrasing of says assisted in writing a prayer

for the dedication of the house. And so, but it's a revealed inspired prayer. And the men in that room decided that they wanted to have, have it printed. And so they put together all the type and get printed off a broadside, you know, a big sheet of paper so that Joseph has a nice printed sheet to read the prayer from the next day. And so this is a lot of work to do.

Yeah. I mean, are you talking like setting type that kind of printing? Like that's that kind of printing. Wow. Wow. This is a long section too. It's it's quite long. Minding your peas and cues and all that stuff and setting type. This is a lot of work. So so those are a lot of work for them to do that and then the next obviously the next morning is the Sunday morning March 27th and you know, the, the saints are so excited about this event. And they, they rush to the, the temple before the doors even open. And there are throngs there that are, that are waiting to get in. There are some

that, that go to a secondary location that, you know, I guess, was they were still able to hear. And then others, I mean, there was such, such interest in it that they actually decided later to hold a second dedicated couture event so that people could, you know, hear the prayer read out loud again. But it wasn't just the prayer that happened. But there's, you know, Sidney Rigden starts the meeting at nine in the morning, gives him preliminary remarks and then there's a hymn and then Rigden, you know, he holds forth for two and a half hours. I mean, he just, he just goes, just keeps talking, just keeps talking. From the Saints book, I just loved this kind of personal, someone Lydia Knight. This is on page 235 of Saints Volume 1. From her seat, Lydia could watch church leaders take their

places behind the three rows of ornately carved pulpits at both ends of the room. In front of her on the west end of the building were pulpits for their first presidency and other leaders in the Milkezic priesthood. Behind her along the east wall were pulpits for the Bishoprix and eronic priesthood leaders. As a member of the Missouri High Council, Newell sat in a row of box seats behind these pulpits. As she waited for the dedication to begin, Lydia could also admire the beautiful woodwork along the pulpits and the row of tall columns that ran the length of the room. It was still early in the morning and sunlight poured into the court through the tall windows along the side walls, overhead hung large canvas curtains which could be rolled down between

the pews to divide the space into temporary rooms. When the ushers could squeeze no one else into the room, Joseph stood and apologized to those who were unable to find a place to sit. He suggested holding an overflow meeting in the nearby school room in the first floor of the print shop. A few minutes later, after the congregation settled into their seats, Sydney opened the service and spoke with great force for more than two hours. After a brief intermission during which almost everyone in the congregation stayed seated, Joseph stood and offered the dedicatory prayer

which he had prepared with the help of Oliver and Sydney the day before. As you were saying, Brent, they have been looking forward to this. This has been a lot of time, a lot of sacrifice. Now here's the question. Okay, we're gonna hold an overflow. Okay, what are they gonna do?

Pipe sound over there? What are they gonna run notes like King Benjamin's speech or how are they gonna do that? That's the, I don't know. There are no records that I've seen that speak to how that was to be held. I don't know. I'm gonna overflow back then.

Someone's writing it down. And someone's pretending to be held on. I don't know. I'm an overflow back then. Someone's writing it down and someone's pretending to be Joseph Smith in the overflow and just five minutes later he's reading what was written. I don't know. One thing that we can try to do more is encourage and share the voices of the sisters that we don't always get to hear. of the sisters that we don't always get to hear. But this is an aside story, but I had one of my colleagues tell me that I had to share this and I agree. It's kind of a good story. So, and I think it starts with the importance

that the saints placed on attending the dedicatory event and wanting to be there for the dedication. So the story goes and this is according to writings from two Latter-day Saints, one's name Benjamin Brown, and then the other is one that I'm sure our listeners probably know a little bit better, but her name is Eliza R. Snow. They both write these accounts that talk about an unnamed woman. They don't mention a name. But at least the Benjamin Brown writing of this is just days, maybe weeks after the dedication. And so, you know, there's, and that there's corroborating stories suggested

that something along these lines happened, right? But this unnamed woman could not find anyone to leave her two-month-old child with. She really wanted to attend the dedication, but everybody that she knew that would watch the child was also going to the dedication. And so there were temple rules that had been created that prohibited children from assembling in the temple in times of worship. And so as there was nobody that she either could or felt comfortable with leaving her child with, she takes this two month old to the temple that morning. And some of the doorkeepers that were there turned her away, you know, citing the rules.

But Joseph Smith Sr. was apparently also one of the doorkeepers and she approached him and implored him. And so please, I mean, I'm filling in the words here, but she said something like, please, I want to be here. Let me, my baby will take care of the baby that won't be a distraction. And she asks to allow her and her baby to enter the house of the Lord. And so Joseph Smith, senior, reportedly said to the doorkeepers that were at this particular door,

it said, quote, brethren, we do not exercise faith. My faith is this child will not cry a word in the house today. And according to Benjamin Brown's account of summarizing what happened next, he wrote that after this declaration by Joseph Smith Sr., the woman and her child were admitted, and the child did not cry. This is Benjamin Brown's writings. The child did not cry a word from eight till four in the afternoon. And this is the part that my colleagues, and I especially, especially find fascinating, we'll say, when the saints all shouted Hosanna, the child was nursing, but let go and shouted also, when the saints paused, it paused, when they shouted,

it shouted for three times, when they shouted amen, it shouted also for three times, then it resumed, it's nursing without any alarm. And so it's kind of like, I mean, sort of a miracle, I like this story for a lot of reasons. And mostly I think it's the demonstration of the faith, both on the part of the woman who felt so strongly to attend the dedication. And Joseph Smith Sr., who said, hey, let's exercise faith. And he has the faith that the child would not cry a word. And according to this account, the child only made a noise during the Hoseanna shout.

And that's pretty incredible story. And really just speaks to the priority and that woman placed on attending the the dedication and the the spirit that she would feel there and and just faith and anyway I just like that story. It's a great story. Yeah. We don't expect any mother who's listening to have perfectly quiet children. I know I'm going I should have had a lot more faith in it. I should have thought 100 sacrament meetings because my kids couldn't go 40 minutes Not four hours. Well, I used to pinch him to make him cry so I could I could go out with him. I used to go we called it the

The the branch in the foyer I'd be out there with three or four the other elder circling and strollers You know the dad dance, you know the bouncing the dad dance, the bouncing. Yeah, fortunately we don't have those, you know, that we've lightened up the rules in times of worship. Having children around is a good thing in times of worship, no. That's true.

That's true. Please join us for part two of this podcast.