Follow Him: A Come, Follow Me Podcast - Doctrine & Covenants 12-13 / JSH 1:66-75 : Dr. Scott Esplin : Part I

Episode Date: February 7, 2021

What do you do with the sections of the Doctrine and Covenants that repeat themselves? What do you do with the sections . . . . okay, you get it. Dr. Scott Esplin joins us and helps us understand the specific circumstances that surround the Knights, the Smiths, the Whitmers, and the Stoals (aka Stowells) and their desires for callings and personal revelation. Learn how we can also build the Kingdom of God--even if we don’t currently have a calling.

Welcome to Follow Him, a weekly podcast dedicated to helping individuals and families with their Come Follow Me study. I'm Hank Smith. And I'm John by the way. We love to learn. We love to laugh. We want to learn and laugh with you. As together, we follow him. Hello my friends and welcome to another episode of Follow Him. We are so excited to be with you. I'm here with my co-host John by the way. I think great to be back. Yeah we learned so much. This is such an incredible opportunity. It's a pleasure to introduce Scott Esplan. He is a professor of Church History and Doctrine at Brigham Mill University. He's the author of

numerous publications on the Doctrine and covenants, the history of church education and Latter-day St. Historic Sites, including an award-winning book on the restoration of Navu. He also serves as the publications director for the religious study center at Brigham Young University. Scott is married to the former Janice Garrett. They live in Linden or the parents of four children. That's the most important part, isn't it? Definitely. Thank you, John. I just on a personal note,

I've known Scott for goodness over a decade. And he is one of the most genuine, good, kind, and humble people. I know. Sometimes that humility thing, just I have been working on it and it's but man, I don't have conquered it. If I could have an ounce of, if I could have an ounce of the humility Scott Esplan has, I mean, just incredibly brilliant yet incredibly humble. It's, it's, it's really

a friendship by treasure. You're kind, Hank, thank you. It's good, it's good to be with you. I, I feel like wise, I'm grateful for our friendship and, and look forward to visiting with both of you. Thank you. Yeah. So let's jump right into the to come follow me material for this for this week. We're going to start in section 12. So as I was reading and preparing for our interview today, I noticed that we run into a name that if I'm a first time reader of the Doctrine and Covenants, I haven't seen this name before. In the heading, it says it's May of 1829 and Joseph Knight,

believe the Declaration of Joseph Smith, concerning his possession of the Book of Mormon plates and the work of translation of then in process. So Scott, can you tell us about Joseph Knight, his family, and how they, how they came in contact with Joseph Smith, who these people are? Sure. Thanks, Hank. So, the Knight family lives in Colesville, New York, which is located about 30 miles north

of where Joseph and Emma are currently living in Harmony, Pennsylvania. Joseph had become acquainted with the Knight family, even prior to marrying Emma. So the story goes back multiple years before the receipt of this revelation. As early as 1825, Joseph Smith was hired to come work in this area of this area of New York and bordering on Pennsylvania by a man by the name of Josiah Stoll. And I think previous episodes have talked a little bit about that. He came to the area under the auspices of Josiah Stoll looking for a Spanish treasure, a supposed rumored Spanish treasure that was reported to be rumored in the area.

Joseph eventually persuades Mr. Stoll to stop looking for that treasure. But that introduces Joseph to the area of Colesville and Harmony, where, as some will comment, or say, he finds a different treasure in his future wife, Emma. Emma Hale. So Joseph remains in the area to court Emma and and in 1826 in the fall of 1826 he hires on with a prosperous farmer by the name of Joseph Knight. And so Joseph Knight, senior and his wife, Polly, live in Colesville, they are a prominent landholders, wealthy farmers, and and respected citizens in the region. In terms of age, the knights are approximately the same age as Joseph's parents.

So Joseph Knight's senior is about a year younger than Joseph Smith's senior. So these could be somewhat like fatherly or motherly figures for Joseph. Joseph at this point is 24 years old or will be 24 years old later this year in 1829. And so these are our friends that take him in as an employer. But maybe more important than just being an employer, they're believers. Joseph confided in the Knights, some of the earliest

people outside of the Smith family to whom Joseph told the story likely of the visit of the Angel Moroni to them, and the coming of the plates, actually, because the encounter with the Knights occurs before Joseph acquires the plates in 1827. So he's working with them in the fall of 26, and then Mary's Emma, of course, in January of 27, and it's at the encouragement of the nights and Josiah stole that Joseph and Emma get married. And so the nights are intrigued. The nights believe. One of their sons later said that we were the first family outside the Smiths to have believed the story of their son Joseph. So I think we should keep in mind the knights are prominent in early church history. They aren't what we would consider today general authorities or something like that.

None of them are, they're not members of the three or eight witnesses, but they are the first believing family outside of, outside of the Smiths themselves. Some historians call the Smiths the first family of the restoration, and one historian calls the Knights the second family of the restoration. And so they join the church and they remain loyal to the prophet the entire of their lives. So Joseph Knight is a prominent supporter of the prophet. Of course, he facilitates Joseph and helps facilitate Joseph and Emma's marriage. And then interestingly, in 1827, when Joseph receives the plates from Moroni and from the Hill Camora, Joseph Knight is there. He makes the trip up to Palmyra together with Josiah Stolle and the two of them are having

a sleep over at the night home, at the Smith home, the night of September 22, or September 22, when Joseph goes to the hill. And so these are people that are believers, followers, supporters. Joseph then, of course, moves back down to harmony and working on the translation. The nights will periodically bring him paper, food, supporting him in the translation, money. And so we can't diminish the role that Joseph Knight played in the restoration. And so that's who he is. I love that.

I love that because one of my goals with doing the podcast, I know John and I have talked about this, is helping our listeners come to a great love for some of these lesser known names, right? When we think true history, we think Joseph and Emma, Brigham, hebercy Kimball, Wilford Woodruff, and those are names that we do need to talk about and tell their stories. But there's the there's the Joseph Knight, senior and Paulie Knight, Joseph Knight, junior and new all night, you know, the Whitney's, you know, there's some of

these luster, no names that I think this year can be, can be it a year that we, that we kind of give them a, I don't know, a big hug from the church of, you know, 20, 21. Well, they have, they have posterity in the church today. The like I said, the night stayed faithful. They came west and Joseph night himself dies in Mount Piska, Iowa on the trail west. His wife, Polly, dies shortly after the Saints moved to Independence Jackson County, Missouri. So the Knights were, their little family formed what some call the first branch of the church in Colesville, New York. And then that Colesville

branch relocates to Kirkland or Thompson Ohio just outside Kirkland and then eventually took to Independence, Missouri. And so these are some of the most faithful of the faithful. And I loved your list of people. We think of Joseph and Emma of course, but then you mentioned Brigham and Wilford or others. The names you listed aren't people who knew Joseph

in the 1820s. Those are people who would have known Joseph just a little bit later after the church is organized. And so that's, I think, one thing that makes the Knights unique is these are people who are in the church before there is a church. They're in association with Joseph Smith before he's married, shortly after he's married, while he's working on the translation, as we'll see in just a minute, while the priesthood, when the eronic priesthood is restored, these are people who are eyewitnesses to the earliest events of the restoration. I was thinking of Oliver Granger too, which I'm sure we'll get to, because he's mentioned so prominently in one of the sections.

Could I read something that Joseph Smith actually wrote? This is August 22, of 1842. He said, I am now recording in the book of the Law of the Lord of such as have stood by me in every hour of peril. For these 15 long years past, say, for instance, my aged and beloved brother Joseph Knight Senior, who was among the number of the first to administer to my necessities while I was laboring in the commencement of the bringing forth of the work of the Lord and of the laying foundation, the foundation of the Church of Jesus Christ

to let it a saint. For 15 years he has been faithful and true and even-handed and exemplary and virtuous and kind, never deviating to the right hand or to the left, behold, he is a righteous man, may God Almighty lengthen out the old man's days, and may his trembling tortured and broken body be renewed, and in the vigor of health turn upon him, if it be, I will, consistently, O God. And it shall be set of him by the sons of Zion while there is one of them remaining That this man was a faithful man in Israel therefore his name shall never be forgotten What a tribute I would I and I think thank you John for sharing that I I've always loved that statement

I in some small measure maybe we're fulfilling that today His name will never be forgotten. I love how that statement ends. The next sentence says, there is his son, Nuel Knight, and Joseph Knight Jr. Hank referred to them, whose names I record in the book of the Law of the Lord with unspeakable delight for they are my friends. And I would love to have the prophet someday say, these are my friends. Scott was one of my friends, Hank, John, they are my friends. And I would love to have the Prophet someday say, these are my friends. Scott was one of my friends, Hank, John,

these, they were my friends. And to be called a friend of the Prophet Joseph Smith, that's Joseph Knight in his family and their legacy. Oh, I love that so much. I think that, that home, if I remember right, that home is still there. It is. It's not owned by the church, but there is a group who keeps it up and visit it.

Yeah. Yeah. And there's some of the original wood and flooring and everything is still there from the 30 miles from harmony, about 30 miles from harmony. And yeah, it's the these are important characters. I will you will talk about this if you go into their the eventual departure out of New York in sections 37 and 38 of the doctor and evidence, but, but the nights leave that farm. I, I, there's an ad advertisement in the local newspaper, the, I think the broom county Republican, it says farm formerly occupied by Joseph Knight, available for very liberal terms, a contact Mr. Waterman, they just, they follow the profit.

They go west to Kirtland and then eventually west to Missouri and, uh, and, and do what this section says. So, so section 12, turning to the revelation, um, hints at some of those things. Uh, in some ways, it outlines, um, what kind of person Joseph Knight is and what kind of person he should be as he serves in God's kingdom. I gotta say this is where, as we get into the section, I've heard Daniel Peterson say this. I wonder if either of you have heard this.

It's kind of funny. Daniel Peterson will hopefully be on our podcast one day and Daniel Peterson's a descendant of the Knights and he calls them the Lord's backup plan because you've got Joseph Knight, senior and Joseph Knight, junior who would if the if he says if if the Lord finds out Joseph Smith and Joseph Smith, senior can't do what he's been asked to do. He can go over. He can go over to the Knights and he can get those two Josephs. I think the book of Mormon said something about Joseph's names. So there you go.

They would fulfill that prophecy perfectly. They go. They could have got to go. Well, again, great souls. And so that's who he is. He is in proximity of the prophet. In this case, in May of 29, he visits Joseph. Joseph is now working on the translation.

So all of our Caldary has come to Harmony, Pennsylvania about a month earlier in early April of 1829. And he and Joseph are in earnest working on the translation. We don't have all the details of what exactly brought Joseph Knight to do Harmony on this occasion. It may be that he's bringing him food or paper to continue working on the translation. There are some scholars who wonder if he's coming in company with with a high room. High room has come to Harmony, Pennsylvania, also in the revelation right before this. So there's a, you'll notice it doesn't give an exact date. It just has

May of 29. So we're not exactly sure if they're in in in company of each other or if they're separate visits. But in any case, Joseph Knight comes down to Harmony and and this revelation is received. One thing I like about the revelation, you'll notice is that it It sounds very similar to some of the other revelations. And so if we could if you want to talk about Why is there repetition in the text? Why do some of these verses mirror those of Those that had been received in February of 29 or Joseph Smith senior or

or some of the verses in section six for all of our Caldary or section 11 for high on Smith. This is great. We understand a little bit more than who Joseph Knight is, how helpful he's been. And let's talk about what is the Lord's message to Joseph in in section 12, which similar to some of the others who have asked for a personal message from the Lord. Yeah, John, so thank you. You'll notice that some of the phrases and words that are used in this same section mirror those that appeared in section four to Joseph's Missyneur, section six to Oliver Cowdery, section 11 to Hiram Smith, and they will continue in section 14 to David Whitmer. A great marvelous work is about to come forth among the children of men, thrusting in your sickle with all your might. And so the God's Word is quick and powerful, sharper than a two-edged sword. All of those phrases appear in other sections as well. I love the fact that

these are repetitious. There's something in the section heading for section 15 that I've always smiled at. It says, in that section, speaking to one of the whitmers, the message is intimately and impressively personal. These sections are intimately impressively personal, but they're remarkably redundant. They are identical whether your name is Joseph Smith Sr or Joseph Knight Sr or Hiram Smith or Oliver Cowdry. There's some things I love that. I love that the Lord is no respecter of persons. And if a 56 year old Joseph Knight asks a question, a 57 year old Joseph Smith senior asks a question, or a Hiram Smith in his mid 20s asks a question,

if their question is the same, the Lord who is the same will answer the same. And I love that. That allows Scripture to apply to us. It's the fact that there is repetition that allows scripture to apply to a revelation and this bothers people sometimes in the doctrine of Calvinists as they study it. They say, well, how can I apply that revelation to myself? I'm not Joseph Knight or I'm not Oliver Cowdery. Well But God is the same and what he said to them, he would say to me. And so the repetition I find helpful,

I also love the fact that Joseph included it in, originally the book of commandments is where this revelation first appears. And then in the doctrine and covenants, Joseph doesn't seem to apologize for the repetition. If it were me putting together a book, I've written books, John, Hank, you've both written books. It doesn't go over well if you repeat yourself

multiple times in the same chapter. Tell the same story more than once or whatever. You said this before. Yeah, I've read this somewhere. Joseph doesn't, and that's what I love the sincerity of Joseph Smith. For him, God said it. And if God said it, he's not going to apologize

for the fact that he said it the same way to someone else. It's God said it. And if God said it, he's not going to apologize for the fact that he said it the same way to someone else. It's God's words. And that to me is a testament of the sincerity of Joseph Smith. And so I love the repetition in the text. I was just going to say, I remember, President Hinckley used to say that all the time with that hand up in the air. Do you remember repetition is the law of all learning.

I remember him saying that repetition. If you want to learn something, you repeat it over and over. It's almost as if the Lord is aware, not only of these individuals, but he's also aware of his dual audience that he's going to have readers. Yeah, future readers who are going to need to hear the same thing over and over and over. Well, this is not in any way to be inappropriate. I think every Sunday I go somewhere and hear something repeated. I can't remember the last time I've been to church and heard the sacrament prayers different than what they were the week before.

They better not be different. And so in that regard, the Lord knows something about repetition. We do things repetitiously in the church and don't apologize for it and shouldn't apologize for it. And so the sacrament is something that's highly repetitive week after week, and yet I love it. So. We talked about this before.

I think in an earlier podcast, we mentioned the Whitmer's that both the, what does the Lord have for me? And it was like identical. And what I love about section 12 is, and of course, you know this, but section, or verse seven, behold, I speak unto you. And also to all those who have desires to bring forth and establish this work. So there's that repetition consistency of the message. And I like also the the Isaiah phrase of a marvelous work. It was just sounds like that's code for, oh, that's the restoration. Yeah. Now that's great, John. And I think that's that very phrase is why it's in your doctrine and covenants. This is not just for Joseph Knight senior. This is to all who desire

to bring forth and establish this work. And that is not limited to people who were in the earliest days of the church that still goes on today. Other phrases that I love in the section, I've, I mean, I'm intrigued by this one in the end of verse three. Of course, at the beginning of verse three, the field is wide already to harvest. That would have been an image with which he and other farmers are familiar. But, but the end of verse 3, the field is wide already to harvest. That would have been an image with which he and other farmers are familiar. But the end of verse 3 is an interesting one that he may treasure up for his soul, everlasting salvation, and the kingdom of God. Joseph Knight is using his treasure to forward this work. He's bringing money to the prophet.

He's bringing food to the prophet. He's bringing paper to the prophet. And the Lord has something to say about what real treasure is here. Also, you all remember, bringing paper to the prophet. And the Lord has something to say about what real treasure is here. Also, you all remember, it was treasure seeking that brought Joseph Smith Jr. to this area in the first place. It was Joseph Smith looking for treasure

with Josiah Stoll. And so I love that the Lord maybe, and again, this verse is also in section six, it's also in section 11. But I love the fact that treasure is discussed with Joseph Knight because that is what brought Joseph to the region, Joseph's junior to the region, and Joseph Knight is using his treasure to forward the work.

There's another one at the end of verse six. And again, this is in some of the other sections, but it talks about establishing the cause of Zion. And at this point, Zion is a cause. That's how it's described in section six and 12 and others. Very quickly, it'll switch over to Zion being a place. In section 25, Emma Smith will be told that she will receive an inheritance in Zion. You don't typically get an inheritance in a cause. We're switching over to something else. And I think we're setting the stage possibly for then

a year or so later, when Joseph will learn where Zion is, and then the Knight family will be among the first two have moved there. And so maybe this reference design might be foreshadowing also the role that the Knights would play in trying to establish Zion in this dispensation. And it also shows that the Lord is kind of holding back all the information at first, right?

We're just going to build here for a little while. Yeah, you're not ready for the city yet. Let's just call it a cause for now. It's a cause. It's a cause. Yeah, that is excellent. I like, when I read section 12, this idea of, if you want to be called, right, who soever will thrust into sickle and reap the same is called of God.

So the Presbyterian idea is, wait until you feel God calling you, wait until you feel God saving you. This is God saying, no, if you, if you, you know, use your agency, come forward and you'll be part of the team. I've kind of flies in the face of maybe mainstream, pro, uh, Presbyterianism, which maybe a lot of these people practice. I don't know about the nights, but, you know, this miss had been, uh, Smith had been Presbyterian, at least, abortion of the family, the portion of them. Yeah. Yeah. You know, that's an interesting comment, Hank, because, um,

it's almost as if the initiative is up, is up to you, Joseph Knight. Um, the agency is yours. And, and the reason I, I find that your comment, uh, intriguing. Thank you is in section 23 of the Doctrine and Covenants, Joseph Knight will appear again. And this is now after the church is organized. And Joseph Knight seems to be dragging his feet a little bit. He others in the in section 23, section 23 is given to five different individuals. It's given to all of our Caldary, Hyram Smith, Samuel Smith, Joseph Smith, Senior, and Joseph Knight. And each of the four previous individuals, it says you're not under condemnation. All four of them have been baptized.

They've joined the church. But for Joseph Knight, that phrase is conspicuously missing. And it says his duty in verse six of section 23 is to unite, to take up the cross, to pray vocably, and in verse seven, it is your duty to unite with the true church. It's what you're getting at that, that if you want to be involved, it's up to you, Joseph Knight. Don't wait to be called, make a commitment. And he does. He joins the church and then remains faithful the rest of his life. But I think you're hitting on an important principle that's in both of these sections about Joseph Knight.

You know, I'm always thinking, okay, how am I gonna help my kids, right? With this and my students. And I like this idea of helping my teenagers understand the Lord likes a little gumption, a little self initiative, a little, hey, let's, I'd, almost like the Lord is saying, I'd rather have to hold you back than, than get you started, right?

It's like that idea of never suppress an impulse to do good, to be kind, to do the right thing. And I was thinking as Scott was talking, that he mentioned section four, that also has the field, you know, ready to harvest, but also has, if you have desires to serve, you're called to the work. And there's that idea of desires and being called again, which because interesting, because sometimes you might be tempted, well, I don't have to talk to that

person. I haven't been giving a calling to do that. But in application for our families, yeah, it doesn't have to be your ministering brother or sister for you to go over and say, I really enjoyed what you said today in study school or whatever, you know, the Lord is watching saying, okay, who's who wants to who wants to calling who wants to be part of the work? I'm going to wait to see who jumps in. Yeah, and we're obviously not talking about going up to your bishop and volunteering to be the young men's president or anything. We're talking about as you're describing John and Hank, there's lots of ways to serve. You and I, we should suppress the prompting to do good. I've never felt a tinge of regret for being a little too kind. There's lots of

things I can do. I love another one in this same section in section 12. In verse six, as you have asked, apparently he's asked what can I do to help with the work. And the Lord's response is, I say it to you, keep my commandments. If you don't have a formal calling, I've served on campus here at BYU in a variety of capacities. And sometimes our students, especially as you're reorganizing

award early in a semester and trying to get all the callings in place, people say, well, I'm not getting a calling fast enough. What can I do? Well, you can keep the commandments. All of us can do that, even while we're waiting for a formal calling to serve in some capacity. Keep the commandments. There really, Elder Maxwell once said, that's it. There really is nothing more important. Collings in a formal sense will come and go, but not the calling or the commandment to keep the commandments. I liked it. This verse we've been looking at about verse seven, if you have desires to bring forth, well, it comes right after that. Speak to bring forth and establish the cause of Zion. That's very, very broad and very general. And I like what President Nelson has said about,

you know, the work of salvation. Anytime you do anything that helps anyone, take a step closer to making covenants with Christ, you know, you're, you're doing, you're gathering Israel, you're doing the work of salvation. And so it can be that broad of keeping the commandments and bring forth the cause of Zion. That's interesting, because it seems like, you know, Joseph bring forth the cause of Zion.

That's interesting because it seems like, you know, Joseph Knight is like any of us. What, what calling am I going to get? Right? I'm ready. What calling am I going to get? I want you to keep the commandments and bring forth the cause of Zion. And if that's almost as if the Lord is anticipating, if that's not what you were looking for, you can't verse eight, no one can assist in this work except he shall be humble.

We were talking about humility at the start of the podcast. Won't we, Hank? There you go. I'm so grateful that I have the gift of humility that I think I've conquered that. So I like what the Lord says here, humble, full of love, faith, hope, and charity. If I, if I'm at a time in my life where I'm like, well, I want to, I want, I'm ready to jump in and, and be the, the, the leader of the war, the leader of a stake. I think this might be a good reminder. Why don't you work on this first humility being full of love, work on increasing your faith, temperance in all things, right?

So, to me, that's the Lord saying, yes, I want you. Yes, yes, I want you to, I'm going to use your gifts in part of this work, but you've, this is where we start. Humility, love, faith, charity. That's where our focus should be. Well, and if you think back to the quote that John read, the tribute that Joseph Smith wrote in 1842 to this man, these are the qualities he, he, he, he remembers. It's not Joseph Knight.

He was a great young men's president, a great scout leader. He took the kids on every camp out or whatever it was. It was Joseph Knight had these qualities. He took to heart these attributes and he was true to them. And I love him. That's why I love the Knights. They are fabulous, fabulous people in the restoration. One of the things that kind of makes me, gosh, I hope if someone writes about me, they won't mention my tortured trembling broken body. I won't mention my tortured trembling broken body. Very bad, but you know, he's, he's,

the 1842, so how old is Joseph Knight then? Oh, he's 56 and 1829, so what is that 13 years later? So 69? Yeah, late 60. Late 60's almost 70. And he'll live another five years after that. I think he dies in 1847 if I remember right. Right. On his way west still going. Yeah, his face pointed towards Zion. He's he's headed west. When I think about establishing the cause of Zion from

verse six, and I read the manual, this question pops up, what does it mean to you to bring forth and establish the cause of Zion? And in essence, how do we do that today? I wonder if the people in 1829, Joseph Smith and the Knights, what they would think of the tools I have at my hands to establish the cause of Zion. Just think of what we have in our hands when it even just comes to technology

from family history work to social media that can establish the cause of Zion. They'd probably say, you know what we'd give for those resources and those tools? I think it's absolutely beautiful. What we can do to establish the cause of Zion, there's more available to us than we could possibly use. And Joseph Knight was bringing paper and potatoes and money, and I think he brings

Mackerel down to the profit, Joseph. And man, what do we have available that we could use to establish the cause of Zion? Well, I just think a lot of things we take for granted and just the availability of paper of being those supplies. And what else did you say, Scott Paper, Potatoes? Money, there's times where he clearly indicates he's helping Joseph pay his bills,

which I think is really important. In terms of an application setting, this allows Joseph and Oliver to do what they only can do. And that might have application to our lives. There's, I served for a long period of time as an executive secretary to a stake and then in other capacities. I had someone teach me this principle. They said, Scott, your role as a secretary

or as a counselor is to take all of the burden you can off of the person who has responsibility keys in this case, because there are certain things that only he can do that if you will take the burden off the paper, the potatoes, the macro, the, the, the paying of the bills, whatever it is, if you will take all of those things away, you free up the person who's right and responsibility it is to receive revelation, to be able to do so. And maybe that's what Joseph Knight is doing. He's taking away all of the things that Joseph Smith Jr. doesn't absolutely have to do so that Joseph Smith can do the thing that only he can do. Only Joseph can translate the plates. Only Joseph can bring forth the Book of Mormon.

Anybody can bring the fish and the potatoes and the paper and the, and I think in our words sometimes, there are certain things that only a bishop can do. But we've all been in words where the bishop got tied down doing a lot of things that other people easily could have done. And he wasn't free to get the revelation he needed. And that applies to a bishop or a release society president, a stake president and others. If we will give them the freedom to do the things that only they can do by way of keys and revelation, we'll be blessed because of it.

Wow. That is, that's, that's an important, important principle. And it comes back in verse eight to humility that to be a, a background worker, um, helping the, you know, the one that can do this in this important work, um, that takes humility, but it's a, it's a beautiful, a beautiful idea. I am, well, I was really. I was really touched by that. Anytime we can relieve the burdens of somebody's responsibility for another, what a blessing to them that can be.

I think we've seen some of that in our wards recently. I think they've almost empowered Elders corn presidents, ward councils, Elders corn presidents, relief councils, Elders corn presidents, Relief Society presidents. There's a lot of things that they can do that frees up the bishop to be able to do what only he can do. And by association, we can assist in that regard as well. I probably don't need to call the bishop

to get a phone number of someone in my ward. There's other people I can ask for that information thereby allowing the bishop to do the things that are essential in his ward. There's other people I can ask for that information thereby not thereby allowing the bishop to do the things that are essential in his calling. I love that and I want to just say that listening to elder bednar roots tech talking about the new youth program that he says imagine what's going to happen. I'll paraphrase elder bed narrows best I can when the relief society presidency and the Elders' corn presidency and the Aaronic priesthood, and the young women's classes are all focused on the work of salvation.

And it was a stunning moment when he talks about that. What if all of us are doing what we can to bring forth and establish the cause of Zion, not just saying let the Bishop and the Ward mission leader do that, you know. And it can be little things as well. I want my children to know that the creating a little more unity in their core and reclass is bringing forth the cause of Zion or any time you do anything that helps anyone. Yeah, posting something about your family or the gospel or the temple on your social media accounts. That's bringing forth the cause of Zion. And, you know, isn't that what Zion is defined as

in the book of Moses and the Lord called his people Zion because they were of one heart, one mind, they dwelt in righteousness, there was no poor among them. Anytime I do those things, anytime I'm united, anytime I'm righteous, anytime I'm helping and caring for the poor and the needy, I'm establishing Zion. So, this is great because we've got Zion as a cause. Zion later becomes a place. What you just mentioned, Scott, is where the Lord called his people, Zion.

There's a few definitions of that. And I suppose that we'd like to be in all of those at one time or another. I'm gonna teach my kids that cleaning your room establishes the cause of Zion. I- Certainly might bring more unity in the home. I know that's my house.

There you go. Back, if you really, if you really, yeah, I'll use that to- Do you think there'sett, you really, if you really, yeah, I'll use that to... Do you think there's garbage in Zion? Take out the garbage, son. All right, my friends, let's move into section 13. And the last, what, a few verses of Joseph Smith history Scott, so you can take us wherever you wanna go.

We come to one of the more and most important events in Joseph's mislife and in the history of the Church is the restoration of the Aaronic priesthood. So what can you tell us? What leads up to this? How, what can you give me the background that'll help me help section 13 in this event? It'll help me understand its significance for the prophet and for Oliver. Thanks, Hank. I think I liked your reference to Joseph Smith history. We need to keep that in mind. Unfortunately, sometimes we read section 13 and forget that there are verses at the back of the pearl of a guy price that give the historical context to the section. So I would start probably in Joseph Smith history. Joseph and Oliver are working on the translation.

It's now mid-May of 1829 and they're making good progress by all accounts. They have been working since the first week or so of April. Oliver I think arrived on the 5th of April and they start two days later. And so they're moving along doing well. And I sometimes ask my classes here on campus, does anyone know what sparked section 13? And it's clearly a question about baptism, but unless you've read the Joseph Smith history and then the account by Oliver that follows it, my students will speculate,

oh, maybe they were in Alma because Alma talks about, or Mozaya talks about baptism, or maybe they were in second Nephi 31, which of course talks about baptism. Oliver Caldry tells us in his account of this instance the right answer. So Oliver Caldry says, no man in their sober senses could translate and write the directions given to the Nephites from the mouth of the Savior or the precise manner in which men should build up his church and especially when corruption had spread and uncertainty over all forms and systems practiced among men.

He says here in the account that follows Joseph Smith history, it says, after writing the account given of the Savior's ministry to the remnant of the seat of Jacob upon this continent, that's in paragraph one, two, three, four. So the start top of paragraph four, after writing the account given of the Savior's ministry to the remnant of the seat of Jacob upon this continent. And so he tells us, I got to third Nephi. So that is an important marker because it tells us where they are in mid-May in the translation. But they're already into third Nephi. And as you know, as we all know, in third Nephi 11, one of the first messages the Savior says, upon speaking to the Nephi, it's he calls Nephi 11, one of the first messages the Savior says, upon speaking to the Nephites, he calls Nephi forward,

gives him authority and instruction concerning the manner of baptism. And so it really isn't 2 Nephi 31, it isn't Mosiah 18, it isn't any of these other places we think talk about baptism. All over Calgary tells us it was 3 Nephi. And when we read about the Savior's ministry, we knew we had to be baptized. We realized we weren't and we knew we needed the authority to do it. So I would always start there in terms of the context. And so they they were tired to the woods. The church has done some really

good work on this lately, helping us understand what the farm was like in Harmony, Pennsylvania at the time that Joseph and Emma were living there. And so, uh, and frankly, what was going on on the river at the time? So the church has done some really good work in helping us understand the frequency of riverboat traffic. Um, there are, one person estimates, maybe as often as, you know, every seven minutes, someone passing on that river on a boat on the Susquehanna. And so Joseph and all of her are likely not kneeling down at river's edge, praying and visiting by, visited by John the Baptist. They, they probably went to a wooded area away from the river.

There is a wooded section of the farm away from the river away from the home that, that would be more secluded. And so they, they, they go to a secluded place to pray and on an instant, I think is how Oliver Caldary says it. An angel appeared from heaven. And I've always wondered about this and smiled, what is this like for Oliver? We always, and rightly so, focus on Joseph Smith,

but at this point, is seeing an angel become old hat for Joseph? Yeah. How many times has he seen Maroni? And what's, but what is this like for Oliver? Is this his first time seeing an angel? Like, there is, he's had some revelatory experience in Palmyra that caused him to even come to harmony. And then we don't know all of those details.

But, but wow, he clearly is impressed by the angel. And, and again, think about how Joseph Smith described his verse visit with Moroni. He goes in description of the clothing he's wearing and all of that. And, and, and maybe Oliver's doing the same. Hey, that was an angel. And we're not just talking any angel now. We, we should pause and recognize this is John the Baptist. I mean, that's a of all the people

the Lord could have sent the individual who baptized the Son of God and and and to have him appear from the heavens is spectacular. I love that. I love that when you teach Matthew, Mark, Luke and John, just the the preeminence of John the Baptist, every account and how important he is. the preeminence of John the Baptist, every account, and how important he is. And then to have him here also is consistent, isn't it? Yeah, I think the Bible dictionary said he is one of the few prophets who has had a role in multiple dispensations. They call him the Bible dictionary, calls him the last of the Old Testament prophets, which is interesting. We often think of Malachi, but Bible dictionary dictionary, it calls him the last of the Old Testament prophets, which is interesting. We often think of Malachi, but Bible dictionary says,

no, John the Baptist was the last of the Old Testament prophets. He obviously is baptized as the Savior, and then takes part in the latter day dispensation. He's bridging dispensations here. I think what did Jesus say about John the Baptist? Among them that are born of women, which I think that's everyone. Among them that are born of women,

there is none greater than John the Baptist, the outstanding, what is the Bible dictionary calls him the most outstanding pre-erronic priesthood bearer in all history. John, I would give you second place. Second, most outstanding, eronic priesthood holder in all history. But imagine being first, first place,

the most outstanding Aaronic priesthood holder in all history. I just think, you know, when you think about the restoration and how it could have happened, you know, and it's so fun to, the first vision, a theophony, incredible, but then the list of others who began to come incredible and in the Kirtland temple. And I think if you have a hard time believing the first vision, oh, wait, till you hear the rest, listen to who else came,

one after another, and then you kind of see the elegance, the symmetry, and also, no, they would need to, uh, who had keys for the gathering of Israel, who had keys for for sealing, who, and you put it all together and so, well, of course they would come. And what I love is that after the first vision, so many were shared visions, Other people were there witnessed it and testified of it. And yeah, to have that be John the Baptist is just, can you think of anyone better to bring back the authority to baptize? Then someone who has it in his name. I mean, I know that's not his last name. I know his middle name isn't the, but man, he is always associated with that ordinance. And, and, and like you said, John, who else would you send? You're going to send Moses with the key to gather Israel. You're

going to send Elijah with the ceiling power. Well, of course, you're going to send John the Baptist with the authority to baptize. But then back to this humility discussion we've had, I love how John the Baptist draws Joseph and Oliver in upon you, my fellow servant, in the name of Messiah, to be called a fellow servant with, as you said, Hank, one of the great among those born to women, none greater. And to have him call you a fellow servant, I feel a long, a far way away from being a fellow servant of John the Baptist. And to have him encircle me and take me in, what would that have been like? Wasn't it John the Baptist who said, you know, about Jesus, he must increase and I must decrease. Yeah. And yeah,

an insight into the character of John the Baptist. And then I love, thank you for saying that Scott. You are my fellow servant. And this, I just a question I've always had down on Temple Square. I think it's all been, this part's being excavated right now. Yeah, it was a Vard Fairbanks, I mean, gorgeous statue with both hands simultaneously because section 13 sounds like, if these are the actual words he said upon you,

my fellow servant, sounds like Hughes ordaining both at the same time. Other paintings I've seen are John the Baptist, one at a time, which seems more like the order of things. Did you have a comment on that? You know, I, that's a great question. And there's another beautiful painting also, er, sorry, beautiful statue at the site itself now. The church has restored the

beasted restoration site in the year. Beautiful. And there's a stunning statue there. I like how you said that. They restored the restoration. Restoration. Yes. And, and it was President Nelson, I think, who dedicated it. But, uh, I, I think that's artistic life, John. I really do. I'm not sure that we know for sure, is it one hand on one, and which one got the right hand, which one got the left? I don't know that we know.

I joke that I have a son who is left handed, and so he's the odd ball in our family. I don't know. And then I've seen, of course, both the same way. I do know that in Oliver of our Calderos account, he says, who would not have bended the knee for such a blessing as this? It seems like they bended the knee if that's literal.

They knelt in John's presence. And again, you're my fellow servants, but man, who wouldn't kneel in the presence of John the Baptist when you think about all that he did and all that he is across the station? So that's the coast I can get. I'm looking at Joseph Smith history here and those little section afterwards. Most people probably never read because yeah, it's it's in such small fun, but you've got to read it. Well, that's I don't need to read that. That's why I'm wearing glasses. That's, that's, that's why. I think I counted once and now I can't remember. Is it seven exclamation points or I can't, because

you don't count in count of those very often and it's so fun to see how excited Oliver was. I never thought about this, but it almost as you read Joseph's history, it's almost like he is describing it as kind of like something that happens all the time to him. Yeah, yeah. And then you get Oliver's account and he's like, this is amazing. Right. This is incredible. So I would encourage everyone to sit down and read what is it? Just a two pages here, page and a half of Oliver's account of this. It really expands, expands your view. Get your glasses and read it. I had one of my professors, you both know Joseph Fielding Maconkey and he would say, Joseph always undertold a story. And so he, here's section 13. Now let's hear Oliver describe the same thing. And Oliver,

it wasn't just John the Baptist, you listen to Oliver and what else is going on in there. They heard the voice of the Almighty. Listen to this phrase here, uncertainty had fled. Doubt had sunk. No more to ride. I mean, that is that is beautiful language and it is it's it's it's, it gets you excited to read all of our words here. He says, I can't even attempt to paint to you the feelings of this heart. Yeah, it's beautiful. If you've never read it for our listeners, boy, please read it because it is, yeah, like you said, Hank, you can't help it.

But in fact, it reminds me of a quick story. I just love this elder Glenn Pace said when he was a missionary, I think this was in his book called Spiritual Plateaus. He said it was a college student, they were teaching my memory as it was back east. And after hearing the story of the first vision, this investigator said, wow, that is the most incredible story I have ever

heard. If I really believe that, I don't think I'd be able to sleep. I'd be running up and down the streets telling it to everybody, how come you guys aren't more excited about it? And and elder pace is like, that was a penetrating question. And I just love the e-acc account because Oliver cannot hide his excitement here. And so yeah, I hope people will read it if they haven't had a chance. And to me personally, I have heard from critics who say, oh, Joseph and Oliver made this up years later. They made it up years later. You read these paragraphs and you tell me if you think Oliver, if you think, Oliver Cowdry,

if you think the character of this man is to describe this in this way and have it be an absolute fabrication, I just, once you read it in his own words, you realize, you can't fake this kind of excitement. This kind of this, he just, he can't, he tells us over and over he he cannot he cannot describe Yeah, that's brilliant

In three of our right. I just think it's Instead of you know jumping on Google and saying what other people think about this event Why don't you just read it from the people who were there and Decide for yourself if you think they're describing something that actually happened that really did happen. It is beautiful. Well, I think we should keep in mind, Hank and John, well done. We should keep in mind when these were recorded does influence how they're telling it. So the Oliver Cowdery account is 1834 in the Messenger and Advocate, which is a

church-owned newspaper, and the other one is 1838. So that's four years later, and it's a very different time in 1838 for the Prophet Joseph Smith. As some of your other presenters have mentioned, that's the most difficult year of the Prophet Joseph. And there's a reason why there's a defensive tone to Joseph's myth history that doesn't quite exist in the 1834 Messenger and Advocate Oliver Caldrey version. So part of it is person and their own feelings and ways of using words, but part of it also is time and influence and impact and how and what their purposes are in telling it. So that's two differences in the accounts. Please join us for part two of this podcast.