Follow Him: A Come, Follow Me Podcast - Doctrine & Covenants 84 Part 1 : Dr. Barbara Gardner

Episode Date: July 24, 2021

Do you wonder how both women and men hold priesthood authority and priesthood power? Dr. Barbara Morgan Gardner returns to teach about how women and men have priesthood authority, responsibility, and duties. We learn how the early Saints were being prepared for temple covenants and learn the difference between how the priesthood operates within and without the family structure.Shownotes: https://followhim.co/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/followhimpodcastInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/followhimpodcastYouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/FollowHimOfficialChannel"Let Zion in Her Beauty Rise" by Marshall McDonaldhttps://www.marshallmcdonaldmusic.com/products/let-zion-in-her-beauty-rise-pianoPlease rate and review the podcast.

Welcome to Follow Him, a weekly podcast dedicated to helping individuals and families with their Come Follow Me study. I'm Hank Smith and I'm John by the way. We love to learn, we love to laugh. We want to learn and laugh with you. As together, we follow him. Hello everyone, welcome to another episode of Follow Him. My name is Hank Smith. I am your host. I am here with my indomitable co-host, John, by the way. We want to mention that you can find us on social media. Please come over to our Instagram, Facebook accounts. You can get show notes and transcripts at follow him dot c o not calm john follow him

dot just dot c o just co dot co and of course we'd love for you to rate and review our podcast that makes us very happy when we get good reviews. Um, john, who's with us today? Yes, and worse, I'm so excited about this because we had so much wonderful feedback when we had Barbara Morgan Gardner on before. And last time I read a bio from the BYU website, this time I'm going to read one from the back of her book. It's a little shorter if that's okay, Barbara. Great. The priesthood power of women in the temple, church, and family. And this was, oh, I want to look this up real quick, published in 2019. So it's kind of hot off the temple, church, and family. And this was, oh, I wanna look this up real quick,

published in 2019, so it's kind of hot off the press. Barbara Morgan Gardner is an associate professor of church history and doctrine at Brigham Young University. She holds a master's degree in education leadership and foundations and a PhD in instructional psychology. And she did post doctoral work at Harvard University. She was institute director in Boston, Massachusetts,

serving more than 100 universities and colleges in the area and acting as chaplain at Harvard and MIT. She continues to serve as the chaplain at large in higher education for the church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. She also serves on the BYU Interfaith Outreach Council. She and her husband Dustin Gardner live in Utah, and we're really so excited to have you back.

Welcome. Thank you for coming back. Thanks. It's such a pleasure to be here with you guys. My life is better being with you, so thank you. We're grateful you would associate with us. It's rough. It's rough, but's rough, I believe.

John, that book, what's the title of it again? It's called The Priesthood Power of Women. And Barbara didn't ask us to do this, but I just want to say this book has changed a lot of lives. I just, just giving people, well, I think it was Elder President Oaks who said his favorite talks, where someone took an old topic that he already knew about and showed him new things about it. Well, the priesthood is an old topic in the church, but Barbrus will show you new things. And it's page after page of new things you've never known. So we're just going to

throw the follow him stamp of approval on on on her book. I think what you're saying, I like how you said that, hey, but it's kind of like you read something and you go, no, you just go, oh, of course, I should have known that type of a thing and it settles inside. I like that. That's it helps you know, yeah, that's true. Yep. So it started to gush there, Barb. A little bit. Well, thank you. I never intended to write a book. I was, I was, I was intending to help people find answers to questions and help them stay strong and active in the church and understand the priesthood, especially how it relates to women and the book ended up being the result. Just kind of formed out of that. A lot of books start that way.

Well, let's jump into our lesson this week, Barb. We have a single section. We are in section 84 of the Doctrine and Covenants. Why don't we back up as much as you want? When I think about Section 84, having taught seminary and instituted in BYU, when I think of this section, I immediately think priesthood. I mean, it says right in this section heading, this is a revelation on priesthood.

And so, traditionally, anytime we're talking about a revelation on priesthood, we have thought of men. And there's a reason for that as well in section 84, because this section actually comes in September of 1832. And just nine months earlier in January of 1832, Joseph receives a revelation and he sends from the Lord and he's sending all these missionaries, 24 different missionaries throughout the United States. And if you guys remember just a few sections earlier, we had these missionaries just listed one by one,

and here's your companionship, and this is where you're going. And sometimes good luck and figure out where you're going. But now these missionaries have all returned, and they are in Kirtland with Joseph Smith now, and they're basically kind of giving their missionary homecoming discussion with the prophet. And so it's in this setting that Joseph is going

to receive this revelation now known as Revelation on priesthood. It's important to know though that this revelation, section 84 is actually a compilation of three revelations. So it's received on September 22nd and then 23rd. Joseph calls it again, the section heading is the season of joy. But actually what you're seeing is three revelations eventually tied together. So the first part of this revelation, section 84, goes from about versus one through, got about through the oath and covenant of the priesthood. So you're going to be looking at one through about 43, 44. And then the next two revelations are going to be received the next day,

and they're going to finish up the rest of this section. So a lot of times when we look at this, there's kind of a break in this section as you're reading it, and that's actually purposeful because it is three revelations combined into one. So Joseph's receiving this revelation in front of all these elders, and it's interesting because you have the writings

of some of them later saying, this is what we saw, we saw Joseph's countenance and they describe his cadence and how everything was being received by the Lord. But none of them were actually writing it down. So in the process, Oliver Cowdery comes in and he sees this revelation taking place and he's like, wait, is anybody writing this down? Because this sounds pretty important.

Nobody was. So at that point, Oliver kind of takes up his pen and starts being described for this revelation. Or I say, these revelations. Somebody should do some writing. That's somebody. All right. And you were going to, you tie this usually to section 75, isn't that right? I tie this section to many sections of the doctrine of covenants.

I mean, if I were to look at the doctrine of covenants and I were to say, okay, what do you need to know in preparation for this revelation? What sections should you read before you read this? I would say strongly that you need to read section two, because section two is going to be talking about Elijah and the temple and the work of sealing. You need to read and understand section 13 because now we're talking about the priesthood being restored, right?

We could read section 25, which President Nelson told the women of the church to study as they're trying to understand more about priesthood. You could read section 27, and you could go on and on. You could read section 36, where the temple is first mentioned in the doctrine of covenants, and then 38, where we're talking about being in doubt with power. I mean, there's so many section 76,

you're talking about the great vision. And then 82 right before this is going to be a great revelation. Also, it's going to be mentioning priesthood and Zion and temple work. But then this section, and the reason why I bring up all those other sections before this, is because this section is a temple section. So when I teach this, and when I study this, it's

absolutely imperative that we understand that Joseph Smith was receiving revelation regarding the temple. So if you see right off the bat, verse one, we're seeing that he's talking to these six elders, but verse two, we're seeing Mount Zion and New Jerusalem. Then you turn the page, this New Jerusalem is going to be built on the temple lot. That's verse three. Then verse four, you see even the place of the temple, which temple shall be reared in this generation. And then you start seeing verse five, built into the Lord, the Lord's house, and you continue on this, and then it talks about this holy priesthood. So it's absolutely imperative that we're talking about this holy

priesthood, that we understand that we're talking about the patriarchal order of the Mokezetic priesthood. So often we talk about the administrative function of the priesthood, and that's going to be section 18 of the doctrine of the first presidency in the quorum of the 12 and the administrative function. That's Peter James and John coming to Joseph Smith, right, and revealing or giving to him the keys of the Mokezetic priesthood. This priesthood, the Mokezetic priesthood, the keys of the Melchizedek priesthood. This priesthood, the Melchizedek priesthood, the highest or the Melchizedek priesthood, the keys are going to be received in the Kirtland temple.

And so this is going to be following this revelation where Joseph receives these keys, is a patriarchal order that priesthood, referring to husband and wife, women and men, going to the temple and receiving their priesthood together as President Benson would talk about. I've heard you talk about this before that there's two, not two priesthoods, but two priesthoods. What is your structure? Structures per se. Two priesthood structures. Yeah.

Just for right now, I think it's important that we just understand that there are two priesthood structures. Adam and Eve go enter into the patriarchal order of the priesthood. This highest order of the priesthood continues on Abraham to Sarah and that it continues on through Moses. And as we know from the book of Exodus, and we're going to see this in this section as well when you look at verse 23, for example, he talks about this priesthood. And he says, Moses plainly taught the children of Israel and the wilderness and sought diligently to sanctify his people that they might behold the face of God, but they harden their hearts and could not under his presence. Therefore, the Lord and his wrath for his anger was kindled against them, swore that they should not enter into his wrath

well in the wilderness, which rest is the fullness of his glory. Therefore, he took Moses out of their midst and the Holy Priesthood also. So, referring specifically to this Holy Priesthood, it's the highest order of the Mokezidic Priesthood, it's the patriarchal order of the priesthood. So we have to understand going into this section that this patriarchal order of the priesthood was taken away from the people during the time of Moses. It returns again during the time of Christ, although during the time of Christ, according to Elder Maconkey, Christ set up his church in the administrative or hierarchical function

of the priesthood. Or in other words, he has first presidency, quorum of the twelve, so it's a hierarchical function of the priesthood. Or in other words, he has first presidency, quorum of the 12, so it's a hierarchical function structure. In the patriarchal order, you're going to see family. You're going to see Old Testament. You're going to see more temple. When you're talking about administrative or or ecclesiastical function,

you're gonna see a first presidency, a quorum of the 12, and you're gonna see bishops and in our day state presidents. So when Joseph Smith is now restoring the gospel of Jesus Christ, he is receiving both simultaneously. He's receiving the hierarchical or administrative order of the priesthood. He's going to be called as the prophet of the church, first presidency, quorum of the 12,

we're going to be established, et cetera. But he's also going to be told by the Lord that they need to gather Israel and that they need to move to the Ohio. And the purpose of moving to the Ohio is to be gathering and establishing the temple there. And he's going to do the same thing as he's moved into Missouri and then the temple is going to actually be built. And then down this, we're going to be received in the Kirtland temple.

So there are two administrative structures, structures of the church that are going to overlap, which is why in our day, you see the public is going to be the administrative and you're going to see more of the private, which is the patriarchal and it's the temple. So I should in my mind, I'm trying to, I'm not slow but I just got to make sure I get it. I feel like I'm saying, yeah, I feel like there's a there's a priesthood structure that runs the church. And then there's a priesthood structure that is going to be involved in my home and marriage and my temple covenants. And I can, knowing me, I could probably get those confused. And I bet people do that sometimes.

Easily. Yeah. In fact, Elder Baller, one of the things that he talks about is as the church right now is the scaffolding What we had in the pre-mortal life is going to be the patriarchal heavenly father and heavenly mother heavenly parents rain in this pre-mortal world What we have on the earth is a structure of church that is supposed to be for the purpose of strengthening the family What you see in the home is a patriarchal priestess structure, right? So, President Oax talks about how there's a difference between how the priesthood functions at church and how priesthood functions in the family. And that becomes extremely important. And then in this this life, we have a priesthood structure that's public. President Ballard would say that this is

this is a scaffolding right now that in the eternities we will be using at the order of the priesthood, patriarchal priesthood. And this scaffolding right now is to help us prepare to live in families for eternity. We already kind of started there in verse 2. We talked about temple. And I think also as we talk about this, you know, a lot of people, I shouldn't say a lot, there are a number of people who struggle with the idea of women and priesthood. And this becomes extremely important because as we understand, the role of priesthood and understand those different priesthood structures, it helps answer a lot of the questions that

people have. So today we don't have time to go into all of the intricacies of this, but for a simple answer to a lot of these, as President Packer says, true doctrine understood changes attitude and behavior. And I am one who who studied the doctrine of the priesthood for many reasons, but one very important reason was because I heard enough people that were confused and disgruntled that I knew if they truly understood the doctrine of the priesthood, they wouldn't be. That's just that's just kind of my philosophy. There may be some, but the majority are going to say, oh my goodness, I had no idea.

Women really do have priesthood power. Women really do have priesthood authority. They aren't ordained to a priesthood office in the church structure, but when they enter the temple and they receive their endowments, when they make covenants with the Lord, they are endowed with priesthood power and priesthood authority. And understanding the difference between those two priesthood structures answers many questions that women have. So when a woman says, yes, when I go home and somebody will say, aren't you so sad that you don't have the priesthood in your family? And she's a single woman, his president Nelson said recently.

She says, oh, actually, I do. I do have the priesthood in my family. If a mother, for example, her husband may be gone and there's a son who's been ordained to a priesthood office and say he holds the eronic priesthood, who presides in the family well when the husband's gotten the mother of course. She is presiding because she's the mom, as she has made covenants with the Lord, and even if she hasn't made covenants, the Lord, the relationship between a husband and wife puts them in a leadership position with the children.

So understanding a lot of these things answers the questions of presiding, answers the questions of power and authority, why we do these things. But also helps us understand that the purpose of the priest is for the salvation of souls. That it's not a war or a battle between men and women. It's a synergistic approach that God has given to women and men in this church, to unite together for the purpose of bringing all of our brothers and sisters

back to our heavenly parents. So when we understand the priesthood and the responsibility behind it, all of us then are working together for the same purpose which is to bring to pass the immortality eternal life of all of God's children. That's the purpose of the priesthood. I love that. I've got two sisters who are single parents. And it's happened. It's been said to them many times, right? You don't have the priesthood in the home. When my sister's son finally became a deacon, it was like, Oh, the priesthood's back in your home. But yet she was endowed. She had the priesthood in her home the entire time, the power and authority of the priesthood. I think that's a... Maybe it's because we

barbed and you could probably speak to this as we go through the section, but maybe it's because in the, I don't know, the last, I don't know how ever long, we've said, we've just made men priesthood. We've just exchanged those two words. The men in church are the priesthood of the church, right? But there was a time in the church where not every man got priesthood, became an elder of Bishop John. John didn't, someone teach us earlier that you would have an entire congregation and two elders in a bishop, right?

Or two elders in a teacher and the whole thing. Thank you, Hank. And I remember, was it in the, when Elder Oaks is talk, when he said, it'd be improper to say, well now have the priesthood pass the sacrament? Was it, was it, he who said that? Yeah.

Because no, that's not what happens. There's people who hold the priesthood might pass the sacrament, but referring, and that's, those kind of things are very helpful. Men are hold the priesthood might pass the sacrament, but referring. And that's those kind of things are very helpful. Men are not the priesthood. And I thought that talk of Elder Oaks was wonderful where he said, we talked about this phrase where he said, when a woman is set apart to do her calling or as a missionary, she is set apart with priesthood authority. And then he said, what other authority

could it be? And that was one of those moments where it will of course, if you're doing God's work, you're using the power of God, what would you call that? You know? And John, that becomes important because again, that's the ecclesiastical structure that we're talking about. When President Oaks says when women are set apart to a calling, they have priested authority and they have power because of their righteousness. Well, what other priest authority would it be? That's the authority of the priesthood that comes through the keys of one who is either a bishop or a state president or in some ecclesiastical role. You don't receive priesthood authority and priesthood, you don't receive priesthood power in the

temple through priesthood keys. You receive priesthood power in the authority of the temple through your covenants. So it's very different when you look at how this process is moving forward. And so understanding again, that relationship is important. That's why, for example, you're getting into, you look back to section 84, we're talking about Moses and how he receives this priesthood. And you see this whole father-to-son relationship.

And I remember one day I was asked to explain this and I could not explain it. This patriarch, the idea of patriarchal order for some women is very difficult because patriarchal seems a little bit patronizing as if men again are in charge. And I love President Benson where he says we call it the patriarchal order of the priesthood because it's passed on from father to son. But that does not mean that it's not a family priesthood. He actually says Adam and Eve together entered into this patriarchal order. Both of them have the power and authority associated with the patriarchal order of the priesthood.

And he says a better term for it would be familial governments rather than patriarchal priesthood, which is really a beautiful statement from him. That comes right away from a great talk that I highly recommend anybody who is studying this subject. It's what I wish you would, you would teach your children about the temple from President, President Benson. Elder Bednar quoted heavily out of that talk and his last, and his last talk on the temple and trying to help us understand the temple better. That's, that's a heavily quoted talk. It was given the Logan temple years ago

or Logan Tabernacle, I believe years ago. But it's a phenomenal talk on this topic. I can't be exalted without my wife. She can't be exalted without me. This is all about family, and so no one or Satan is trying to divide so much because we need each other. The talk is entitled, what I hope you teach your children and grandchildren about the temple. It's April 1985 in the Logan Temple. And he says this, Adam and his descendants entered into the priesthood order of God. Today we would say that they went to the house of the Lord and received their blessings. The order of the priest has spoken of in the scriptures is sometimes referred to as the patriarchal order because it came down from

father to son. But this order is otherwise described in modern revelation as an order of family government, where a man and a woman enter into a covenant with God, just as did Adam and Eve shield for eternity to have posterity and to do the will and the work of God throughout their mortality. It's similar to what President or elder Maconkey teaches about the Abrahamic covenant. He says there would be no Abrahamic covenant if there was no Sarah. It's a couple, it's a family relationship. So, I mean, we could say it's the Abrahamic and Sarriott covenant if we really wanted to,

but scripturally we say it's the Abrahamic covenant. When you're talking about the patriarchal order of the priesthood and you're talking about sections of the doctrine of covenants, we're talking about family. We're talking about the gathering of Israel. We're talking about creating Zion. We're talking about becoming. We're talking about the gathering of Israel. We're talking about creating Zion. We're talking about becoming gods and goddesses. We're talking about, as we get into sections 128 later on

in the doctrine of governance, they receive their exaltation, meaning husband and wife. They become gods and goddesses. Husbands and wives together become that. And so, regardless of myrtle status right now, for a man or a woman to enter into the patriarch or the priesthood and become gods and goddesses, they have to make and keep these covenants, whether in this life or in the next, which is absolutely significant.

We're looking at section 84 because these promises that are going to be given to both women and men are only associated with those who enter into this order of the priesthood. It's it's that understanding that order of the priesthood is a lot more important than people realize. You have to understand the temple in order to understand this section. But as, as, as, bring the priesthood president Nelson says to spend time in the temple where the Lord does his teaching, it's critical to understanding section 84. Yeah, I, I, this would change everything. It changes your paradigm because you would say, Oh, you know, just like the bishop presides over the award,

the father presides over the family, and that's not the case. You're taking the structural priesthood, the administrative part, and moving it over into the family. And that's, you're saying, no, that's not how it works. Um, you need to understand this patriarchal priesthood, this familial government. Yeah, I mean, you look at some of these things, and again, this is a little bit hard because some things we would like to discuss in the temple that perhaps are sacred and difficult to discuss outside of the temple. But if you carefully look at this section, for those of you who have received your endamans,

and for those of you who haven't, you can still see through Temple I, some of these things just from the Old Testament and from the Probe of the Great Price in other areas. But when you think about verse 19, for example, President Nelson says that both women and men are not using the priest of privileges that could be theirs, and then he tells them to study 19 through 22 specifically. It's not just men aren't understanding the priest of privileges, women aren't, and where do women receive their priesthood privileges in the temple?

So this is all temple. So you ought to verse 19, the greater priesthood administrative the gospel and hold it the key of the mysteries of the kingdom of God, or the kingdom even the key of the knowledge of God. So some people would look at that and say, well, we're talking about keys, so that's definitely gotta be men, right?

Because keys are men. No, keys are not men. This isn't talking about, this isn't talking about a position in the church. They're not called to be an apostle. They're not called to have a presiding stewardship. They are given the key of the mysteries of the kingdom of God. In fact, President Benson in that same talk says,

both women and men receive the key of the mysteries of the kingdom of God in the temple. So this becomes extremely important in verse 19, for example, because this talks about this priestess structure, and we're talking again about this patriarchal priestess structure, but we're talking about in verse 19, where President Nelson recently asked both the women and the men of the church to study section 84. In fact, to the men of the church and the priestess session of the church, he actually said to the men that both women and men do not understand their priesthood privileges.

And he asked them to study, and if you go to the footnote, he specifically asked the men to study section 84 versus 19 through 22. Then in 2019, President Nelson gives the same invitation to the women of the church and asked them to read section 84 to better understand their priesthood power and authority. So this becomes extremely important. President Nelson in the last couple of years has invited, last few years has invited both the men and the women of the church to study section 84 in regards to the priesthood.

So what are these privileges that we may be missing? Well, in verse 19, the prophet, the Lord, talks about the key of the mysteries of the kingdom, even the key of the knowledge of God. So for many women and men, sometimes we think about keys, we think about presiding. In this case, we're not talking about presiding at all. We're talking about a blessing that comes from one who makes and keeps temple covenants. And so, for example, in verse 19,

that key of the knowledge of God, President Benson actually says, when you attend the temple and perform ordinances that pertain to the key of the knowledge of God, President Benson actually says, when you attend the temple and perform ordinances that pertain to the house of the Lord, certain blessings come to you. He gives a few. And then he says, in the temple, you will receive the key of the knowledge of God. You will learn how do you can be like him, even the power of godliness will be manifest to you.

So when we look at this, I hope that we understand in the temple, and you think about what the prophets and leaders of the Church have taught about the temple, the temple is where we receive the knowledge of God. It's where we receive and have the key of the knowledge of God, and where we learn to become like God and have them, therefore, the power of God in this in our lives. And then we continue on talking about the ordinances and the authority given specifically in regards to the temple. And then you see in verse 22, for without this, no man can see the face of God, even the Father and live. And where we taught to see the face of God and where we taught to be in his presence, again, this is the temple, right? So this whole section is things that we're missing,

we're talking about the temple. And that's why we continue on where we talked about before. I've got Moses. Moses lost these temple ordinances. Moses lost this power, the people lost this ability to see the face of God because they lost the patriarchal order of the priesthood. They no longer had the ability to enter into the temple and make and keep those sacred covenants associated with this highest order of the Melchizedic priesthood.

So then it's the lesser order of the priesthood than that we have when he's talking about that, starting in verse 26. Barb, how much do you think Joseph Smith? It's just you can see the Lord laying the groundwork here. And I wonder if he's saying these things, not quite understanding what they mean, right? Because he's not going to have the Kirtland temple for another, you know, this is, we're four years away from the dedication of the Kirtland temple still.

So I wonder if he's saying some of these things and he's going, I can't wait to find out what all this means, right? I don't want to say poor Joseph, but talk about a mind-blowing experience on a regular basis. I mean, it's so fast dating and he just keeps saying, you know, we need to learn more, we need to learn more. And then Joseph actually says, we cannot learn more about this higher order of priesthood until we build a temple.

We have to build a temple in order to learn this. But then I think for women, this becomes extremely important because the men receive their endowment in 1842. It's six years after the keys are restored in the Kirtland temple, right? Then finally, we are starting to move to Navu and Joseph and some of the men, some elect men are receiving these keys, but Joseph says we

cannot still have the fullness until the women receive this priesthood. And it was because of that that their relief society has started. And the relief society is what prepares women to be able to enter the temple and use you go through those early resusciting minutes. Joseph is clearly helping the women to enter into the order of the patriarchal, enter into the patriarchal order, they're priesthood with the men. And he says, the men can't have it without the women, the women can't have it without the men. And therefore, we need both to enter into the temple. He was, he was so forward thinking. So Joseph talks about, and in the book, Daughters of My Kingdom, Joseph, Joseph has a statement, first of all, the key of knowledge. And then he says, the purpose of organizing the society was to give, this is from daughters

of my kingdom, was to give the women the responsibility to help each other prepare for greater blessings of the priesthood, found in the ordinances and covenants of the temple. If I wish I could pull out all these quotes right now, but this is a great place to find, find quotes and understanding on this is the book from the Church History Department. Well, actually, I would give you two references. One is actually I can give you three references. The book taught us in my kingdom is one source. Okay, that's one source. That's a great reference. Daughters of my kingdom, that's an official church. Yeah. And then the other one is Women of the Covenant. It's a story-relief society. That's another place where Joseph talks very specifically

about the purpose of relief society and women and how they have to come in together to have the fullness of the priesthood. Actually, there are so many. President Benson actually talks about that same idea there. And then in the early minutes, Joseph Smith talks, Joseph Smith's, what do they call them, minutes, I just say the minutes of the relief society, Joseph Smith's accounts to the Women of Relief Society. You can actually find the minutes on the Joseph Smith papers.org. There's also a great book by Sherry Doe and Virginia Pierce Hinkley Cowley that also goes through carefully and discuss the minutes of that book as well that I would recommend. What, okay, can you just kind of one more time restate the, the, the gist of that we can't keep there.

There are two ideas. The first one is in order to receive the fullness of the priesthood, we must have a temple, right? So we have to have the temple in order to receive the patriarchal order of the priesthood. We cannot enter into the patriarchal priesthood unless we have both men and women together. And so the purpose of the relief society was to prepare the women to enter into the temple, which is why in these early days, the relief relief society they were called, these women were actually called priestesses, and they were actually given that responsibility. These were women and men coming together in order to enter into the fullness of the priesthood. And if you, I mean, you,

even just studying the scriptures, you can find so much more on this topic regarding women and men together. Section 132 of the doctrine of covenants talks about what we talked about before. Then she'll be gossed because they have no end. Therefore they shall be from everlasting to everlasting because they continue. Talking about husband and wife, this whole section is about husband and wife and being sealed. Again, a man can't be sealed and receive the patriarchal blessing. The patriarchal priesthood unless he has been sealed to a woman, either kind of woman to a man. It's all throughout the scripture section 131 of the doctrine of covenants as well. Talks about verse 2. In order to enter into the highest,

a man must enter into this order of the priesthood, meaning the new and everlasting covenant of marriage. And then another name for the new and everlasting covenant of marriage is the patriarchal priesthood. covenant of marriage, and then another name for the new never-lasting covenant of marriage is the patriarchal priesthood. And if he does not, he cannot obtain it. He may enter into the other, but that is the end of his kingdom. He cannot have an increase. So it's this continuing on of this, this holy priesthood is impossible for a man to be saved in ignorance, and it talks more about the priesthood there.

If you go throughout the doctrine, covenants, and you just follow through temple ceilings, marriage and diamonds and authority and things of that nature, and it talks more about the priesthood there. If you go throughout the doctrine of covenants and you just follow through temple, ceilings, marriage and diamonds and the authority and things of that nature, you're going to see the progression between women and men and receiving their priesthood. Ordinances. Sorry, their priesthood covenants

and ordinances associated with it. I recognize it and talking about this, I get kind of excited about it, but when you start really looking at it, it becomes very clear what the Lord is trying to do. The Lord is trying to create eternal families. And the patriarchal order of the priestess is how God creates eternal families.

And so section 84 is a temple section regarding how to create eternal families. The women who were referred to as priestesses in some of the meetings. So women were actually referred to as deaconesses, priestesses. On the early days, it was known as the anointed quorum, both women and men together who had entered into the patriarchal or the priesthood were known as the anointed quorum. When referenced to the temple, you're talking about women, they are being given positions

in the temple that allows them to have this temple authority and this temple power and this priesthood power. And so that's what we're really, section 84, that's what we're really talking about here, which is a little bit difficult to talk about outside the temple, but it's important to know that this is patriarchal priesthood. So Barb, if a young women's leader or a leaf society teacher said, oh, the lessons on the priesthood this month, we don't really need this. How would you feel about that? Would you be? Gee, let's take a guess. Wow, I would say,

you know what, I appreciate that, but you know that you, you as a teacher have been given priesthood power and authority, first of all, right? And I hope that you recognize if you're teaching young women, they have all made covenants with the Lord's Rebaptism, and therefore, just as it says in verse 30, they have received the blessings of the Lesser priest, including the key, they have received the blessings of the Lesser priesthood, including the ministering of angels. They, in this case, they haven't received the key

because that is specifically related to the Lesser priesthood, but they have received the ministering of angels because as President Oaks again says, any person who makes a covenant with God receives the blessings of the priesthood and those who have made the baptism of covenant specifically are promised that they would have the Holy Ghost with them. Angels speak by the power of the Holy Ghost

and therefore they have the ministering of angels. So what a difference it would make in the lives of these young women, if a young woman leader would say, although the, although the, although the eronic priesthood has been ordained or given the key of the ministering of angels, keys open doors. And so what do you have when you take the sacrament, you have the ministering of angels. The key opens the door to the ministering of angels, but when you make and keep sacred covenants with the Lord, including the baptism covenant, and therefore every time you're taking of this acumen, you're renewing the covenant, and therefore God

is blessing you with the ministering of angels. So what a difference it would make for us, you know, a 16 year old young woman going to school knowing that not only does she have this ministering of angels, but as it says later, on verse 88 of the section, um, and who so receive with you, there I will be also for, I will go before your face, I will be on your right hand and on your left and on my, and my spirit shall be in your hearts and my angels round about you to bury you up. So women and men both have angels on their left hand and on the right hand round about us to bear us up. That, that's critical for a young woman going on a mission for the right hand, round about us to bear us up. That's critical for a young woman going on a mission for the first time, leaving her family for the first time, going to a movie theater,

going on her first date, babysitting at someone known house for the first time, just walking down the street to know that because of her covenants, the Lord has promised her angels to be around her. No young woman is ever alone. My daughter is on week two of her mission, my second daughter right now. So of course, angels are on your right hand on your left ear, a missionary. And that's true, John, except I will say that even for me as a young woman and many young women that I've talked to, they don't know what doesn't, doesn't apply to them. Yeah.

I'm going to try to summarize here. If I take part in an ordinance and make covenants through the priesthood, I then have priesthood power regardless of my gender. Absolutely. Your priesthood power is associated with a covenant that you make and your righteousness just like for a man and a woman or the same thing. So a woman, if a woman is, is going to the temple, and she is making covenants in the temple. But she comes home and she's abusive and yelling and fighting just like just like a husband maybe. She loses pre-stead power based upon her righteousness and her purity. But if a woman goes to temple and makes covenants with a Lord, just as a man, who goes to temple and makes covenants with the Lord, and does his best to be Christ-like.

As he becomes more righteous, his priesthood power will increase. It's the same thing with women. Women's priesthood power increases the same way men's does, it's through righteousness. The authority is what's different. The authority men receive authority through being ordained to a priesthood office in the church, as the ecclesiastical structure. So a deacon does receive priesthood authority to be able to perform priesthood functions, participating in the passing of the sacrament would be one of those priesthood functions. Baptism, baptizing someone would be a priesthood function. A woman will receive priesthood authority through her calling given to her by someone who holds priesthood key.

She is not ordained to the priesthood. So therefore, a 12 year old girl does not have the authorityained to the priestess, so therefore a 12-year-old girl does not have the authority to be involved in the sacrament like a 12-year-old boy. Nor can an 18-year-old girl perhaps baptize because she hasn't been ordained a priest in the Aaronic priesthood. That is something that he has only been given authority to do, but she can participate in the saving of souls. She can participate in bringing people to Christ. She can participate in all that she needs to do under the authority given to her by the keys of the Bishop or State President. And in addition, she has authority of her covenants that come through her baptism and through, in this case, it could be her temple covenants at this point.

So as we continue making and keeping sacred covenants are power increases as we are obedient and the authority comes through the covenant and especially the ecclesiastical, through the person who has priesthood keys. Very good. And that makes sense. Absolutely. I think, yeah, this is making perfect sense. And so just because my son has the Aaronic priesthood, when I'm out of town, he's not presiding

in the home. He's not going to call on. He's not not gonna be the one calling on people to pray. He's, right, my wife is presiding in my, in my home together, right? It's not just when I'm gone. Well, Hank, you have to be a little bit careful with that because yeah, I want to be. I want to know what you think about that. Right. When we're talking about presiding, there is it's it's we're very specifically taught in the family proclamation that the man presides in the home. But often what is confusing with that term is what does it mean

to preside? So, um, Elton Perry has a has a great quote where he says, remember brethren that in your role as a leader in the family, your wife is your companion. Since the beginning, God has instructed mankind that marriage should unite husband and wife together in unity. Therefore, there is not a president or a vice president in a family. The couple works together eternally for the good of the family. They are united together in word, indeed, and in action as they lead, guide, and direct their family unit. They are on equal footing. They plan and organize the affairs of the family jointly and unanimously as they move forward. So then you say, okay, well then what is presiding?

Because the world teaches us that presiding means you're in charge. Well, I don't find a single place in the scriptures or in any of the teachings of the prophets where it says, the man is in charge. Traditionally, you can see some of that in the world, and traditionally, you could even see some of that in the church, but the brethren, especially of late, have been very clear that presiding doesn't mean you're in charge.

In fact, recently, Elder Holland said, presiding is to love, to serve, and to sacrifice. So when we're talking about President Benson, I say unto you with all soberness, Jesus Christ is a model we must follow as we take the spiritual lead in our families, especially this is important with your relationship with your wife. So we talk about the spread presiding. We're not talking about somebody being in charge ruling over. We're talking about two people that are equally yoked that are to love and serve each other and their children.

We talk about nurturing that. And we talk about the same thing with the family proclamation, most of them, what is nurturing? Well, a lot of people would say, well, nurturing means that you are in charge of changing diapers and making sure that they're close on your children. Well, President Iring in 2018 actually says that women are to be the principal gospel teachers in the home. That's what nurturing is

That's very different if a woman's primary responsibility is to be a gospel instructor That's a different definition of nurturing than the world gives So again, when we're looking at these definitions is extremely important that we say not what is the world teaching about the We're presiding in nurture and important that we say, not what is the world teaching about the word preside in nurture and priesthood, but what is God teaching about priesthood presiding and nurturing? Could we go with that to, does that fit nicely with the Strypling Warriors mothers? Yeah, absolutely. Because that's, it wasn't just they, they changed their, did they have loin cl- the strip ling worries have loin clod sank.

Uh, loin cloth diapers. I don't know. It was the, no, it was they, that's exactly what it says. They, they taught them, they taught them the gospel, right? So I like that. So President Iring 2018 said nurturing is the primary gospel teacher. Did I get that right?

I will actually find you the exact quote, because I love this quote. When he said this, he was talking about President Nelson and the same conference talked about how we as women need to have the courage of mother Eve to make decisions that would impact our family for eternity. Which, again, this is a very Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints teaching that we have a prophet

who is trying to tell us to become like Mother Eve, to have the courage to make decisions. That's very, right? That's very uniquely us. Extremely uniquely us. And then just the idea that, and then he basically says in that same talk, that Adam was wise enough to partake, right? Follow her, yeah.

To follow her. And so she's nurturing, in this case. This is her nurturing role to recognize the importance of what she's doing to understand the gospel of Jesus Christ and act in accordance that will save for eternity God's children, our Heavenly Parents' Children. That's nurturing. So now we see and Adam was wise enough to partake, right? And that's presiding in nurturing at its finest.

They're working together as a couple. She didn't just nurture her children She nurtured her husband. Oh look at Moses that person was it Moses five like 10 and 11. It's like It's so funny to see to see what both of them say and how Eve Seemst to have a bigger picture than Adam does and Moses Moses five, is it Moses five, 10 and 11? Because of my transgression, my eyes are open. And he was like, because of our transgression, we, and she sees the big family picture. I mean, you read it and she has a bigger,

and Elder Oaks has talked about that too. Her special perspective or something that in that episode of the fall. But I'm glad you mentioned that. I just finished a class for my students on I call it our glorious Mother Eve. And I said yes. Go find me that phrase anywhere in traditional Christianity. Our glorious Mother Eve. You'll find it here. That's what God called her. Yeah. That's I mean, that's not just some that's not even I mean, I don't want to minimize Joseph Smith. That's not Joseph's words. That's that's what God called her glorious mother Eve. I mean, and a prophet today saying that we'd

have the courage of mother courage to make decisions like, God, I love I gotta I'm gonna put that in my my lesson. I can find that for you. That's again, that's 2018. But this is a quote from President, President, I read that I was referring to. He says, part of the Lord's current sharing of knowledge relates to accelerating his pouring out eternal truth on the heads and to end the hearts of his people. He has made clear that the daughters of Heavenly Father will play a primary role in that miraculous acceleration. One evidence of the miracle is his leading his leading his living prophets to put far greater emphasis on gospel instruction

in the home and within the family. And we're definitely seeing this in COVID time. Who knew when the prophet was doing this? This was going to happen. So then he continues, in the proclamation, he gave sisters charge to be the principal gospel educators in the family. That's that's a pretty strong statement. So when we're talking about nurturing, we're talking about principal gospel educators. We often talk about how the how the fathers need to take this role in teaching, but the father and the mother are a team. I mean on a personal note, I miss my parents, but I if somebody would say who was the principal gospel instructor, I would say both.

I don't, I remember one time coming into my mother's room a while after she had passed away. Her scriptures were still by her bed and her glasses were on top of it. And I remember walking over there and seeing dust. And it was the first time in my entire life that I ever saw a speck of dust on my mom's scriptures. She studied the scriptures and she taught us from them. And I think about my dad. You know, recently we've gone through my parent's scriptures and we're kind of dividing them out between brothers and sisters.

And you open them up. My mom has probably a lot more writing in her scriptures. Typically, my dad's scriptures are kind of highlighted here and there, but there's no question that they were a team in their use of the scriptures in order to help our family. She was nurturing, my father was presiding, but together they were completely united. Neither was in charge. They were a team.

They were a husband and wife that were preparing their children for hopeful exaltation. That's what the patriarchal priest is about. That's what section 84 is about. It's people working together in order to bring us back to Christ. So Elder Talmich has one of my all-time favorite quotes. He has a few regarding women, but I love this. Again, referring to Temple and the covenants that we make and women, he says, in the glorified state of the Blessed Hereafter, husband and wife full administer and their respective stations, seeing and understanding alike,

and cooperating to the full in the government of their family kingdom. I love that terminology, family kingdom. And then he says, then shall women reign by divine right, a queen in the resplendent realm of her glorified state, even as exalted man shall stand priest and king. Unto the most high God. Mortal, I cannot see nor mind comprehend

the beauty, glory, and majesty of a righteous woman made perfect in the celestial kingdom. This is just this whole idea of husband and wife reigning together and the glorified state of both of these people. And I just, the beauty of this eternal family, I just don't, we have, there is so much more as President Nelson says that

God is trying to show us and teach us. And this, this idea of this glorified state of the Blessed hereafter. This is what we're talking about. This is why we're here. The glorified individuals. I have a question then relating to this. And then, um, John and I both received this question before from wonderful, faithful women. It's how I think I think this new view could change the not only the answer to the question, but even not even. Not a question. Yeah, it would change the question.

Yeah. Which is, how do I get my husband to preside to gather us in family prayer, to teach us? How do I get him to do that? I've received that question before, and it seems like what you're teaching here is change your question almost. Yeah. Yeah, it's not you're trying to get your husband. It's, what can you do as a couple to draw closer to Christ so that together you can help your family?

Yet I've known some women in the past that they're almost nervous to become too righteous because they think in so doing they're going to lose their husband or they're going to leave them behind. Nothing could be further from the truth. The more righteous a woman is and the more she tries to draw closer to the Lord, the Lord will guide her and give her through the spirit, through the power of the priesthood that she has, through the covenants that she has made the ability to know what to do. I mean, that's a promise again from President Nelson recently was we will know what we will should do, right, through the priesthood.

And so, so when you're talking to this woman and saying, you know, how do I get my husband to do this? You're not trying to get your husband to do things. You're together as a couple trying to be united. And so maybe a question could be, how can I better be united with my husband so that the two of us can draw our children into Christ? That's a different kind of question. It may be that it's not a matter of just sitting back.

There are so many answers to that question because every couple is different. My husband is very different than my father. My mom would respond probably different to my husband than I would to my husband. But my husband will respond differently to me. It's a couple and that's my reason why that's such a private relationship.

It's two people who have been, in this case, sealed in the temple with all of the promises associated with what we are talking about in section 128, that when that couple is sealed in the temple, they have started an entirely new kingdom. And so it's that couple working together, those individuals coming together as a couple to figure out how they can make that happen. You're not just trying to get your husband to preside. You're trying to create an eternal family. You're trying to create an eternal couple. And so that takes a lot of humility. It takes a lot of patience. It takes a lot of faith. It takes a lot of honesty. It takes a lot of becoming like

Christ for both the wife and the husband. Christ had a way to long time for us too. I can't tell you how many times and it has gone both directions that my wife will say like, oh should we let's gather everybody to pray? Or I say it, you know, she's like, hey, let's go get our pajamas on them. Like, oh, should we get everybody together to pray? And it's not like she's reminding me of my job or I'm reminding her of her job. It's, we're trying to help what we do. It's what we do at the end of the day.

Yeah. I really like, because I've always understood preside, but when you use that phrase, it's not a president and a vice president. That is really helpful because because I don't see it that way in our family at all. And I get the word preside, but if you equate it with president, then it does sound like there's a vice president. And that that's not what what we're after. We're equal partners. And sometimes it will be, oh, we got to have family prayer for me or sometimes it will be we oh, we gotta have family prayer for me

or sometimes it will be, we gotta have family prayer from my wife and that's how it's supposed to work. We're both doing this, the vice presider. I'd never thought of that before. You know, I've thought about this a lot and some people have asked, no, what does it look like? And this sounds like almost a cop out,

but I will just say it like this. When you see it, you know it. When you see it, you know it. When you feel it, you know it. You know what it's like to have a righteous man presiding in your home or in your family. And if you don't know, then find it for a man or a woman. Both, both genders can be looking for examples, but we know what it's like. I can imagine what it's like for President Nelson to be presiding, quote unquote, in his family. He's married to a very strong woman who has very strong opinions too, but I promise you that those guys, those two are, he is presiding and she is nurturing

and loving righteousness. When I think about this, I think about a time when I was on a church history trip with my family. And we were going across across Spartans Cove and we got up to the Rocky Ridge area and coming back down and we went to the grave site where you have the big wheel and the body's buried there. I remember looking at the stone and just seeing the numbers of genders that were buried. For whatever reason that caught my attention as a young teenager. And I remember asking my mom, mom, why are there more men than women

that are here? Like the men are stronger. Men have bigger muscles and they could have gotten across this plane so well. And my mom said, and to this day, it is, it rings so true. and my mom said, and to this day, it is, it rings so true. Because men, righteous men will always sacrifice

for others. There were more men passing away because the men were giving their food, the men were pulling these hand cards, the memory, and so were the women. But the men who presided gave their lives for their families. They weren't trying to be in control. They were trying to save.

They were trying to exalt. And that's what a presiding man does. No woman would be afraid of the term preside or find a demeaning if she really understood what a true presider is like. In my life, I have been blessed by that. And I almost hasn't to say that because, well, frankly, I wasn't married till I was 40,

and I didn't have a husband in my family, but I sure watched a lot of righteous men, home teachers, bishops, my own father, people that I taught with. Presiding is a very holy sacred responsibility for men, and it's not what the world would have as believe and frankly Satan would love to make us hate that word. It is a very right our Father in heaven presides, but I don't think our mother in heaven is just Doing whatever he says they are a couple united for the purpose of exalting their children. It's righteous, it's powerful.

So I think when we talk about these words and we talk about the section of the doctrine of Covenant again, I think the Lord is really trying to help us to see. These people are brought into the presence of God. When you're bringing a husband and wife into the presence of God to see his face, they aren't just standing and pride, they're kneeling in righteousness. And that's why they weren't ready yet. They weren't ready to kneel and see God's face yet. And that's part of this couple coming together is, as we are trying to become God's and God is as we have to lose all of those sharp points in our lives and become like Christ, which the priesthood gives us that opportunity to do. Now, I priesthood in our covenants, right? Yeah.

So I've always loved this quote. It's tying in the patriarchal priesthood with a temple. Joseph Smith says, go through and finish the temple, and God will fill it with power. And you will then receive more knowledge concerning this priesthood. There is only one place where the order of the priesthood, which is patriarchal authority, is made known, and that is in the temple. You enter into an order of the priesthood in the temple. I just love here where Joseph Smith is very explicit and instantly saying, we're talking about

the patriarchal order of the priesthood and the patriarchal order of the priesthood is only found in the temple. And that's why we need temples built. And again, that's why we need temples built throughout the world today is because it's all about creating eternal families. And eternal families are made in temples. Well, and I think, you know, we talk about the ironic priesthood and how important it is. I hope in all of this, we aren't dismissing the importance of the ironic priesthood, because there would be no repentance, there would be no baptism, there would be no remission of sins if we did not have the ironic priesthood.

So all of this becomes important as well. But I will continually say that remember in all of these things, although the young men have the key, or have been blessed with the key, although the bishop has this key in this case, all women and all men are receiving these blessings. All of them are able to repent. All of them are able to be baptized. So again, President Nelson says that, oh, how he wishes that the women would understand how relevant the restoration of the priesthood is in their lives. Well, it is just as relevant to the young women it is to the young men. Sometimes traditionally, we teach that. It's kind of skewed. I mean, sometimes we'll have the priesthood camp and we'll have a father's and son's outing and call it the priesthood

overnight or something. There's no different, frankly, than having a woman go with her daughter. We could call that the priesthood overnight or two, depending on the definition of priesthood that you're using. Okay, so in the introduction to the 2020 handbook, there's actually been a change in this introduction, which is extremely significant. There's not a change in the doctrine, the priesthood itself is the doctrine,

but this is a change in our understanding of this doctrine. It simply says this, the priesthood is the authority and power of God. That is the same. It has always existed and will continue to exist without end. Now note this, through the priesthood Heavenly Father accomplishes his work to bring to pass the immortality and turn life of man. God grants authority and power to his sons and daughters on earth to help carry out this work. And until 2020, I have never seen the word daughters in there. But there has been a very strong emphasis from our prophet today to help the young women and the women of the church understand that they have priested power and authority.

So it is therefore related and kind of gone through that in their most recent hampic destruction, no longer does it say man as if man could be both genders. It is actually specifically stating sons and daughters so that the women understand that they also have this priesthood power and authority. That's a critical point for our women and men of the church to understand. Exactly. And I think if we don't, there's a danger here, Barb. If we don't understand this, we're gonna end up teaching,

we're gonna pass down some false traditions. One of those could be, and what would you say to this, that somehow a young man has it in his head, that because he is a holder of the priesthood, and he's 14 or 15, and the young woman in his ward, who are also his same age, 14 or 15, that somehow he has more decision-making authority than these young women.

How do that seems to me a pretty damaging result of not understanding? Again, that's something that's very traditional. I mean, we teach so much the importance of keys and priesthood responsibility and authority and that is so traditionally tied to men. And it's true, women, men preside in the church, there is a prophet and he is a man. And that is, that is the way God has organized it. President Hinckley was one time asked, why is it that men are a danger priesthood office as a not woman?

And his answer was, I don't know. We don't know. And I love that answer. There are so many bad answers to that question. And I hear it. So many times. I appreciate Elder Oaks' statement where he says, one of the biggest problems we have in the church is giving answers to questions that God has never revealed. Amen. So let's not give the reasons. So yeah, traditionally, you see, not just traditionally, but in the church, you do see in the hierarchical

structure of the church that you do have men who are presiding in specific responsibilities. So the first presidency, Quarment XII, you know, presidency of the 70, president, stake president, bishop, those men have keys. And they do so, hopefully in great righteousness, wield an authority and have great influence. But if you look at these righteous wise men, President Ballard has spoken so much regarding this. A very wise priesthood holding man who holds keys will turn to their leaf society president

and ask for her opinion on things. And take her opinion very carefully and very seriously. So we look at a young man. Well, the young men traditionally for some reason have thought, and you brought it that before, that if a young man is the one in the home and he has been ordained to a priesthood office, then he presides.

Well, of course he doesn't. That we know, President Oaks recently has clarified that very carefully. But in the church sometimes we think that if a man is ordained to a priesthood office, therefore he is going to preside over the women at church. It's not the case. If let's say a 17 year old young man

and a 17 year old young woman were called for whatever reason to be in charge of the trek, the stake trek. And no one else was in that room. Who presides in that meeting? Well, both or neither. Both are either, yeah. Because the presiding comes from one who has priest of keys.

The bishop could have said, you know, Jenny, you're going to be in this meeting with John and you're presiding. And that would have been fine because the presiding isn't a priesthood office. It isn't related specifically to the priesthood unless the priesthood holder, the key holder is actually making that delegation. If two of a husband and wife are called to be teachers of a Sunday school class, say that they were called to work in a primary, well, who presides in that class?

Well, both, because this is a calling, they're no longer at home, right? So now they're at church, they're both called by one who has pre-stead keys the bishop. And so they are both given equal authority. It's extremely important. In fact,

I've asked many, many students over the years, similar questions to this and most of the time until recently, they've been very wrong. So it's a tradition that we that we need to work on. You feel like we're we're turning a corner, though, we're starting to. Yeah. And just and just for the purposes of our discussion, I hope we recognize this isn't a problem just in the church of Jesus Christ on our day of saints. I don't even want to call it a problem. This isn't just an issue.

This is, I mean, I strip as a chaplain. This is a tendency throughout most religions. This is a tendency throughout the world. I mean, we have been working on women's rights and women's issues for years and years and years and years. And like I've said, Joseph Smith was very forward thinking. We have a prophet day who is very forward thinking. We have a prophet today who is very forward thinking. President Nelson has opened the doors and turned the

keys to women in ways that we have not seen in years. But this is not a problem of just our church. This isn't the struggle that just women of the Church Christ of Latter-day Saints have. This is something that is very cultural. And I think our prophet is helping us to get out of the culture and into the gospel. And how would you explain to a young woman why it didn't start out this way? Right? Like why didn't it? Why didn't one write when the church is organized? Did the Lord, you know, it's pretty much here. Here it is in 1832.

But I get that sometimes from students is if it's the Lord's Church Why does it have to Learn right? The Lord could tell me that I should use calculus today But unless I started with basic one plus one Mathematics I would never be able to do calculus So even though he could reveal calculus to me,

I still need to practice basic mathematics skills to get there. Line upon line. Line upon line, precept about precept. We talk about this so often, and people say, well, why didn't the Lord just tell the woman, well, what would have happened in that day? And what would have happened in the 1860s? And what would have happened in the 1920s? I mean, you think about the world and progression. God is very wise in teaching line upon line. These doctrines and these principles that are set here are in the scriptures. This is straight 1830s. It is so there and it is very clear. I mean, he is establishing their leaf society with the intent that women are going to receive their endowments and receive power and authority. It was taught in Na'avu in the 1840s, very clearly to these women.

They understood it. They pass it along, the lies are snow passes it. You see these, all through these women of the church. But it's as if we as a culture are trying to catch up to the gospel of Jesus Christ. It's been there all along. We're just finally to the point where we're really figuring it out. And we have a prophet who is making it a key emphasis today. Right. President Nelson in the last three years has asked the women of the church

to study priesthood power and authority two times consecutively in general conference. He doesn't do that typically, repeat himself, but he actually says, I repeat my plea for the women of the church to study priesthood power. That's uncommon, and then he gives him specific instruction on how to do that. That was 2019 and 2020, President Nelson has done that. And sometimes women struggle with that because they think, well, if women are studying priesthood power in authority, maybe they're trying to be ordained to a priesthood office. There are a number of reasons why women don't study that, and many of it is just because there's a culture of if women try to study it, then they are trying to be ordained to a priesthood office. There are a number of reasons why women don't study that. And many of it is just because there's a culture

of if women try to study it, then they are trying to change the profit. No, the profit is the one asking. So it's important for the men to help the women also to understand, because if there is not a support of a man behind us, a woman who's trying to follow the profit, it's very difficult. If a man says to a woman, why are you studying the priesthood?

Are you trying to be ordained to a priesthood office? Well, he just slammed that woman down pretty hard, even though he may not have intended that. The smallest nuance of negativity in this topic is extremely damning to women, because it has been a hot topic, and many people have struggled with it over the years. So in this topic, as we're studying section 84, it's extremely important that questions are allowed and asked for, that testimonies are born, that we understand that we have literally a prophet of the church today who is pleading, using the word pleading coming

from him, for the women of the church to understand their role in the priesthood. So it's important that the men understand that. That is the direction that the women have been given by the prophet. Please join us for part two of this podcast. you