Founder's Story - Building Trust in AI: Liran Hason CEO of Aporia, Ensuring Safe and Transformative AI | S2: E52

Episode Date: August 15, 2024

In this episode, Daniel Robbins interviews Liran Hason, the co-founder and CEO of Aporia. Liran shares his journey from a young coder to leading a cutting-edge company focused on making AI reliable and secure. With the rise of generative AI, Aporia is pioneering solutions to address the challenges of AI implementation, particularly in ensuring that AI systems are safe, consistent, and trustworthy.Liran discusses the current sentiment in the AI industry, the gap between AI potential and real-world application, and how Aporia’s guardrails platform helps companies mitigate risks associated with AI. He also shares his excitement about the future of AI, especially in healthcare, and the importance of responsible AI development. Liran provides insights into how AI can transform our daily lives and the role Aporia plays in this transformation.Key Points Discussed:Liran’s early passion for coding and the inspiration behind founding Aporia.The challenges of AI implementation and the concept of the "AI chasm."How Aporia’s guardrails platform ensures AI systems are reliable and safe.The importance of addressing hallucinations, inconsistent behavior, and other AI risks.Liran’s thoughts on the future of AI, particularly in healthcare.The impact of AI on society and the potential for transformative change.The role of AI in everyday tools and productivity.Aporia’s recognition as a technology pioneer by the World Economic Forum.The ethical considerations of AI development and deployment.How to connect with Liran Hason and learn more about Aporia.Relevant Links:AporiaOur Sponsors:* Check out PrizePicks and use my code FOUNDERS for a great deal: www.prizepicks.com* Check out Rosetta Stone and use my code TODAY for a great deal: www.rosettastone.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Deep in the ocean, an orca pod is on the hunt. But these aren't your average orcas. These guys are organized. Marketing team, did you get those social media posts scheduled for the seal migration? Aye, aye, Captain. We even have an automated notification for all pod managers when they go live. They use Monday.com to keep their teamwork sharp, their communication clear, and their goals in sight. Monday.com. For whatever you run. and their goals in sight. Monday.com. For whatever you run, even orcas, go to Monday.com to dive deeper.

Hey, everyone. Welcome back to Founder's Story. If you have not used generative AI, you might be living under a rock or you might be living on a ship somewhere in the ocean that doesn't have internet access because generative AI is everywhere. I mean, the last few years, it's just been insane. So we wanted to bring in an incredible expert, Liran Hasen, who is the co-founder and CEO of Aporia. And we're going to dive into your story, all things generative AI. So let's just kick it off with you. What was your story like? Why did you get into this? And why did you want to found Aporia?

Thank you, Dan. Thanks for having me. Yeah, so the reason we started Aporia really was from first-hand experience. I personally started coding when I was 10 years old. Fast forward, when I was 24, so I worked for a startup company where we've had the core component of our product, which was built on AI. Obviously, back then, it was more machine learning than generative AI, but still same concepts. And every time we released our software to production,

we had some issues with our clients saying, hey guys, like something isn't working, can you check this out? And it was always rooted in the very same thing. We had issues with our AI workloads, right? So what we've realized is on one hand, AI has a huge promise and can change the lives of all of us like it just did in the last two years. So that's on one hand.

On the other hand, unlike traditional software, it's non-deterministic. And this challenge is enormous. And this is going to make or break whether we as a society are going to use AI. And for us, this was a cue that, hey, this is a super exciting problem to work on. We have experienced it on our own. Let's spend the rest of our time in trying to solve that

and help other AI teams overcome these challenges. I was reading some stats recently that a lot of corporations, businesses, people, they're disappointed in how AI has not yet transformed their life in the ways that maybe they thought it was going to be. And I wonder if it's because of these issues that you are solving. So what are your thoughts there around the sentiment currently of how companies and businesses are leveraging AI? Yeah, so that's 100% true. Like when you speak with the average AI team at an enterprise, what you'll hear is they have mapped somewhere in between 200 to 300 potential use cases for you. Right, so that's amazing. It's like a big, big number. However, when you ask them like,

how many of these projects are live in production, whether for your employees or your customers, then you start to see like different range of numbers to be zero, could could be one two could be very very advanced right so there's a huge gap i like to call it the genii chasm right like there's a massive drop in amount of ai projects so when you ask them like hey what's what's going on like where where are all these projects so what we usually hear is, Hey, listen, we've built something. It's kind of working, right?

Like when we played around it locally on our own computer, it worked well. But when we got into pilot phase and we tried it out with 10 to 20 users, so we started getting all these weird and funny behaviors, which we just cannot allow ourselves, you know, as a significant brand, as a public company. And that's what is keeping like hallucinations, inconsistent behavior of AI.

That's what's keeping these AI project in pilot and not getting live or allowing us to enjoy the potential value of them. Yeah, I could, I mean, I've had my own personal experiences where I'm relying on it. And if I didn't check and edit and work through, I might be giving wrong information. Then other people are going to get mad at me, companies. So I could see how people need to really inspect what you expect, I guess. So your company has been named a technology pioneer by

World Economic Forum, Forbes next billion dollar company. I mean, what is that like thinking that this company you have may be a unicorn, may be the next big thing, something that's going to completely impact society? Hey, everyone. I'm not sure if you've heard, but our show Founders Story is now available on the iHeartRadio app. So check that out, iHeartRadio online, or you grab the app. It's super easy. You can listen to all of our episodes wherever you enjoy your podcast, whether that's iHeartRadio, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and many more, But check it out.

Yeah, so obviously it's super exciting. To be completely honest, it's not about the valuation of the company. It's more about the potential impact we're able to make. I strongly believe that there are massive use cases, massive places where AI could change our lives, really from thinking about healthcare, your banking system, like really on our every day-to-day lives. And being able to do so in a responsible way is really, really crucial. So getting the notion of, hey, what we're building is really at the cutting edge of this technology.

We are getting kind of moving forward with our vision and delivering on the promise of, hey, we're going to make AI reliable and secure. Yeah, this is like super exciting. That's what gets me and the entire team pumped on every day that we get and go to the office. So tell me, I'm curious, from your personal perspective, what are you most excited about? Whether you're starting or scaling your company's security program, demonstrating top-notch security practices, and establishing trust is more important than ever. Vanta automates compliance for ISO 27001, SOC, GDPR, and more, saving you time and money while helping you build customer trust. Plus, you can streamline security reviews by automating questionnaires and demonstrating your security posture with a customer-facing trust center, center all powered by Vanta AI. Over 8,000 global companies like Atlassian, Flow Health, and Quora use Vanta to manage risk and prove security in real time. Our audience gets a

special offer of $1,000 off Vanta at vanta.com slash founders. That's V-A-N-T-A dot com slash founders for $1,000 off. Now back to the show. Your company and the things that you're doing and you're solved, what are you personally most excited about when you think of maybe we'll be at AGI or maybe one day ASI, you know, the future, five, 10 years from now, how AI is going to transform. What are you personally excited about? So on me personally, I'm excited about health care specifically. I think, you know, in health care, there is really just so much potential to save many lives, to identify, you know, disease or illness at the very early stage that today, unfortunately, we cannot do that. Find cures for different type of cancer and other diseases. So I think

seeing that kind of area evolving, that's what I'm personally most excited about. We had another guest on that with their organization, they're trying to help people live past 200 years old. How do you feel about that? Would you want to live to 200? Or if not, what is an age that you'd want to live to healthy? So yeah, I think it's a good question, right? So it depends if in these 200 years, do you feel like 200 years old or do you feel younger than that? I think that's kind of the question, right?

That is true. Yeah, that's a good point. My number is like 140. 140, interesting. If I feel like maybe 60, 70 to 140, I think I'm good. But if I feel like 140, I don't want to live to 140. So let's dive into guardrails. Can you explain more about that? Because I'm very interested to hear. I haven't

really heard this before. And I want to learn more about what this is, what I need to look out for, and how are you solving this? When thinking about AI, and I think in the past few years, we are all experiencing with ChatG GPT and others AI-based solutions, what's happening is we feel as if we're talking with a real human being. However, it's not as consistent, it's not as reliable as you may make up facts and be very, very confident about what it says, right? So our thesis and the way we see how the human society can actually use AI technology is not by blindly relying on the AI technology, but rather having AI or being overseen and guardrailed by human beings.

Now, it doesn't mean that there has to be a real human being constantly monitoring every input and every output of these systems, but this is really where an automated system like Aporia, a guardrails platform, comes into the picture. So imagine a system that observes every interaction that you have with an AI chatbot or something like that, right? Whether what you're sending is, I don't know, out of place or non-compliant. And how is the response that you're getting from that system, right? So essentially what our system is doing, it acts in real time.

It's capable of detecting hallucinations, incorrect facts, profanity, toxicity, and so on, and mitigate these issues before they reach the end user. So the system can actually change the way the LLM or the AR response. I mean, I would think that's very needed, not only just by the experiences that we're having, but I'm this gives those protections and there needs to be something that is going to keep us in line in a sense when it comes to the use of AI. Because we know how humans are. We're going to take something that could be amazing and we might turn it into something not great. So I'm glad that you are solving that. So last question for you on this, is there a specific tool

or something that you are using AI for right now, besides your company and what you're doing, but is there another way that you are finding AI as been something that you can't live without in your life, maybe a productivity tool or something like that? It's a good question. Obviously we use a lot of AI in our daily work. Me personally, I just use it sometimes in rephrasing email.

However, I will mention, I would never ask an AI system to craft an email for me. Just kind of more rephrasing and getting kind of different wording ideas and stuff like that. I like that. I like the ideas. It really is great for coming up with ideas, but I might be getting lazy and using AI too much for my email. So if I ever send you an email

and it sounds like AI, it's probably AI. It's AI. But no, I really appreciate it. If people want to find out more information about your organization, maybe they need your help. They want to learn more about you personally, how can they do so? Absolutely. Happy to connect on LinkedIn. Send me a message.

Amazing. Yeah. What's your website? It's aporia.com. A-P-O-R-I-A.com. Amazing. Well, congratulations for possibly the next billion dollar company. I know you said it's not about the valuation, but I feel like if you get to 100 years, just because I want to see what comes about from AI and what it does solve and how it does help people and, and organizations and everything. So the future is just going to be incredible. And we're here in it. So congratulations on everything. And thanks again, for joining us today on Founders Story. Thank you for tuning in to Founders Story. Keep exploring, keep dreaming, and join us next time for more inspiring entrepreneurial journeys.