Founder's Story - Tony Hawk: "They Offered Me $500K For Everything, I Said No!" | Ep. 449 with Tony Hawk

Episode Date: October 1, 2026

Daniel opens the conversation inside Tony’s skateboarding room by asking which item he would keep if he could only hold on to one. Tony points to one of his first signature skateboards from 1982, a board he rode in competitions, gave away to an amateur skater, and eventually received back decades later. He also shares the story behind a prop skateboard from the movie Hook, used by Robin Williams’ character. Pasted textThe episode then moves into Tony’s early years, when professional skateboarding existed but was not a reliable career. Tony explains that when he started skating seriously at 11 or 12, being a professional mostly meant having your name on a board and maybe winning $100 at a contest. For him, skating gave his hyperactive energy somewhere to go and quickly became the center of his life. Pasted textFrom there, Daniel and Tony explore the business side of his career: starting Birdhouse in 1992 when skateboarding was struggling, taking out a second mortgage, living lean, and learning how to protect his name after seeing low-quality products and even a toilet paper mockup with his branding. Those lessons shaped how Tony approached Activision, where he insisted on creative approval before attaching his name to what became a video game franchise with nearly $2 billion in sales. Pasted text Pasted text Pasted textKey Discussion PointsTony shares the story of one of his first signature boards from 1982 and why that piece of history still matters to him decades later. Pasted textHe explains why skateboarding did not feel like a career choice at first, because in the early days, even professionals were barely making money from competitions. Pasted textTony breaks down the risk behind starting Birdhouse in 1992, including taking out a second mortgage, downsizing his life, and living on instant noodles, Taco Bell, and peanut butter and jelly while keeping the company alive. Pasted textThe conversation explores brand control, including how a bad licensing deal and low-quality products taught Tony not to sign away his name without creative approval. Pasted textTony explains why he said no to a $500,000 buyout from Activision, choosing instead to let the video game royalties ride because he no longer felt desperate for cash. Pasted textHe reflects on landing the 900 after more than 10 years of attempts, describing it not as emptiness, but as relief after years of injuries, falls, and relentless pursuit. Pasted textTakeawaysTony’s story shows that obsession can build greatness, but it can also cost relationships, time, and physical health. He says skating demanded complete focus, and that kind of hyperfocus can cause someone to lose sight of everything else. Pasted textBrand control matters. Tony learned that if someone else controls your name, likeness, or creative direction, they may not protect the values or quality that made the brand matter in the first place. Pasted text Pasted textThe Activision deal worked because Tony protected the integrity of skateboarding. He wanted approval over anything carrying his name, and when the game resonated with both core skaters and mainstream audiences, that trust became leverage for future partnerships. Pasted textEntrepreneurship is exciting, but it does not always work. Tony talks about successful brands, failed bets, and learning the hard way that getting into a business you do not truly understand can create major risk. Pasted textThe 900 was about perseverance, not just spectacle. Tony says the move took more than 10 years of attempts, injuries, and painful falls, and finally landing it represented what skateboarding is really about: trying something until you make it happen yourself. Pasted textA “steel mindset” means not giving up through pain and difficult attempts. For Tony, that mindset changed his life, but it also came with sacrifice, especially to his body. Pasted textClosing ThoughtsTony Hawk’s Founder’s Story episode is about far more than skateboarding. It is the story of someone who turned obsession into mastery, risked everything to build a company for skaters, protected his name when others tried to cheapen it, and helped bring an underground culture to the world without losing its core. Tony’s journey captures the cost of greatness: broken bones, failed deals, financial risk, relentless practice, and the constant question of what comes next. But it also shows the reward of a steel mindset. A skateboard, a dream, and the refusal to quit can change not just one life, but an entire culture.Today's sponsor:Turn live shopping into a real business with Whatnot, where sellers build relationships, move inventory in real time, and reach buyers across collectibles, electronics, luxury, beauty, and more. Search Whatnot in the App Store and start selling today.Stop losing deals in spreadsheets and switch to Pipedrive, the AI-powered sales CRM built by salespeople for salespeople. Get an exclusive 30 days free with no credit card at https://www.pipedrive.com/foundersWhen you need a legal hand, visit LegalZoom. Go to https://www.LegalZoom.com to get started. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

A skateboard and a steel mindset can change your life. You don't give up. I had put my body on the line so many times with that move for over a 10 years. You threw out my back, broke my rib, came away, limping every session without coming through. When I finally did it, it was like, oh, yes, I can put that behind you. Tony Hawk, the first man to land a 900, the name behind a video game friend, video game franchise that did nearly two billion dollars in sales then he put everything into building a business for skateboarders you risked your house

start bird house when skateboarding was dying conviction or insanity a little bit of we were so full of our previous success that we felt in vizant and that was the hard lesson what was the darkest moment when you're so hyper-focused wasn't like that you lose sight of So Tony, I mean, this room is incredible. What is one thing in this room that we're in right now? If you could only hold on to that one thing, what would it be? Oh, wow. That is...

I didn't think it was going to be so heavy out of the gate. Good question. I would say probably this board right here because it was one of the first signature models I had and one of the first ones I wrote in 19... So this is one of the first skateboards with my name on it and I actually rode this in two different competitions then Wow. Wow.

And then I gave it to an amateur skater at the time as a hand me down and he gave it back to me about 10 years ago. So this one has like come full circle. Wow, that's amazing. So I know we went deep, we went deep right away. That's okay. I mean, I don't, I guess if I'm looking around, that's the one. What is that thing? This is a prop that they used in the movie Hook for Robin Williams.

Oh yes, I remember that. Robb Williams character rode this board and then fell off of it and it shot up and went through a basketball hoop and landed back on him. Wow. So it's not incredible, but I just love how it. It's a band-blue. It's such a great prop that they put time and care into making. I mean, it stands out.

It stands out for sure. Yeah. Let's go back to your history, because I grew up. I wanted to be a skater, but I was horrible at it. Roller blades were my thing. I was doing on the curb, getting injured every other day, and I realized this isn't going to be my profession. Okay.

When you told people around you, your family, friends, that this is the thing you're going to do, do they think you were crazy? I was so young, it wasn't even really a concern that I'm choosing a career because, and I guess if I had to put it in the context of inline skating, like inline skating in the 90s was a viable career option. People were making money at it. People were professional at it. When I started skating, yeah, people were professional, but that didn't mean they made any money. It just meant that they had their name on a skateboard and that they might be able to win $100 first place in a skate competition. Like that was peak skateboarding in 1980, 81.

So when I chose to do it, I was only 11, 12 when I got serious. You know, I just didn't feel like I was choosing your career. So they didn't, I didn't really get, I mean, people made fun of my skating, my skate style, but my friends and family just thought, thank God he's got somewhere to focus his energy because I was like just a ball of hyperactivity, as they used to say. That was the term in the A's. No ADHD then. It didn't exist.

They called you hyperactive. And most of us wore that as a badge of honor. Was that always been a passion or do you have any other passion? Skid boarding? Yeah. Yeah, in board sports in general. So I was surfing as long as I've been skating, not nearly as accomplished at it, of course, but, and snowboarding, when snowboarding was created, basically. And the only other hobby or passion that I had before that was play violin.

And I played violin until I was about 12. And that is when my violin teacher got upset with me because I would go off to skate competitions on the weekends and not play in school concerts. And he told me I had to choose. What do you think would have happened if you... I mean, I don't think I would have been, you know, some maestro violin.

Just like, um... Could you imagine if you stopped skating for violent? Like, there's part of me that regrets listening to him because I miss being able to do it. Like, I tried to pick it up and it wasn't like, run a bike. It's hard. There's so much nuance and there's this, you know,

there's just obviously playing an instrument something, but the fact that he made me choose was seem mean to me, you know, but, maybe he was, Maybe he was right. Do you still remember that teacher? No. No.

I'm wondering. I'm curious what he would think of it, like making you the decision at that point. Maybe he thinks he helped. You choose the right path. Maybe, yeah, yeah. He takes credit. But also, I mean, sometimes I literally couldn't play some shows because I was injured. So for him, it was like, that's just a non-negotiable.

You're out. At some point, I read that you were making more than your teachers. However, though, you, then went to living on $5 day Taco Bell because of the changes in the industry. Were you close to quitting? I was never going to quit skateboarding, no, because, I mean, look, I started doing it when it was the furthest thing from cool you could do. I started doing it when my classmates would make fun of me for skateboarding.

It took the point where they said, haven't you all grown that yet when I was 13, right? So I was already used to the ridicule, and I just loved doing it. Like, I didn't do it for accolades, obviously. I never, I didn't get into it because I thought I was going to be rich or famous, because nobody was rich or famous. So when it took a downturn in terms of an industry, a business, and in popularity, I just knew I had to find a way to make a living, but I was never going to quit skating.

You risk your house to start birdhouse when skateboarding was dying. Conviction or insanity? A little bit of pub, I think. I knew I wanted to be still in the scape world industry business, whatever you want to call it. And I think I had enough experience and belief that I saw skateboarding come and go already two times. By the time we're talking about 1992 is when I started Birdhouse. And I thought, well, then that means it's cyclical and maybe it will come back around again. and obviously my time as a pro must be coming to an end because I'm old now.

I was 24. And so I was considered old for a pro skater. I was considered outdated as a vert skate as a half-pipe skater. And so I thought, okay, I'm going to start a business and be behind the scenes and then curate a team and aesthetic and just do our own thing. And that's what we did. But it was hard. Like the first four years of birdhouse were not profitable.

And I did. I took a second mortgage out on my house and ended up selling that house for what I owed on it, moved into a much smaller place, and scrimped and saved and, you know, ate instant noodles and Taco Bell, peanut vegetable sandwiches for you. for years. But I never, you know, when I looking back, it wasn't like I was,

felt like I was struggling or felt like I was trying to figure out where my next meal, it wasn't like that dire. It was just, I had to cut back. If I wanted to keep skating, I had to cut back. And I, at that point,

it was provided for a family. So I was doing everything I could to make up for that by doing, I learned how to edit video back when video was just coming into digital form. So I was kind of headed with game. And so I did freelance video editing for about a year to make ends meet.

If somebody was to ask you to become a legend pioneer icon that you are, is it possible to do without such sacrifice? What would you say? I don't, that's tough. I feel like in my time, no. I mean, I was completely obsessed with skating and really with my own skating and focused on it and wanted to just keep getting better out of, you know, probably to a fault because I was, I had success, but I was never resting on my accolades.

And it wasn't about that the trophies anyway. getting better, getting better, getting better at it. And when you're so hyper-focused and something like that, you lose sight of everything else, relationships, and how to prioritize your time, and, you know, you get obsessed, possessed. Possessed, I like that. But I think with what I know now and how I can allocate my time

and prioritize it, it was something I had to learn the hard way, but I feel like if you're asking me, is it necessary? There are probably resources available now that I definitely didn't have that could make, that could help you to balance that out. Active Vision offered you half a million dollars to give up future royalties. Why did you say no? only because I luckily found myself in a position that I was not trying to, that I wasn't living paycheck to paycheck anymore and that had just, I had just turned that corner.

And I had a new house with a mortgage I could afford and when they offered me that money, yes, that sounds fantastical. I mean, I never heard anyone even speak numbers like that. In front of me, because I mean, say half a million dollars, it sounds like half a gazillion dollars, but I realize that I'm doing all right. And I don't absolutely need this money. So I'm going to let it right. And that's my risky gambling side, which is definitely part of being a skater, is putting yourself at risk. I know before that, you had a bad licensing deal, correct?

I think you even saw your face on toilet paper. I did. Yeah. Not face, but nice thing. Oh, your name. Yeah. Your name. That would have been cooler, though.

That would have been, have you ever tried that? You know what? The Tony Hawk Tolladdle Paper? T.T. Let's talk after this. T.HT. There's going to be live on Amazon Prime. There you go.

TikTok shop. Those are for the true haters. TikTok shop. Yeah. Whether you hate or love. Yeah. No, well, what happened was I just, I learned the hard way that I can't just sign my IP way and give anyone approval to put my name on products that I would

and see. And it came to a head when I went to this company that was doing licensing, they were doing fingerboards and watches, wallets, just accessory type of stuff. And it just wasn't of the quality that I would have approved. And then I saw that they had this sort of, it looked like a test unit, like a toilet paper with my name. And I was like, what is this? And they said, oh, one of our accounts jokingly said, well, you can put his name on anything, no sell. So we made that for them. But, and yes, I understand that that was funny, but at the same time, it was at the expense of my actual name and liked us.

And I realized in that moment that they didn't care about the quality of stuff with my name on. They just wanted to sell product. They just wanted a product. And I actually had to pay a lawyer to get me out of the contract. because I said, you can't just put my name on this stuff. And they said, actually, we can't. It better be Continental. If they put my name on something,

I only want Continental to the paper, because otherwise I'd be very insulted. You know, like, it better be the comfortable, three-ply. It's a thread count. 155, Egyptian thread. Do you think, though, of this happening to you, because that was before Activision, correct? Way before, yeah.

So do you think that experience, though, led you into when Activision came around? you had a slight knowledge. It was one of the stepping stones. Yeah. I think the time that I really, the most profound time for me was years later when skating started to come back around

because this is what the year I'm talking about was like 88, 89. And then we kind of went through the downturn of skating as a business. And then in the late 90s, it started to come back around with X games and stuff. I did a promotion in 1997 for a serial brand in New York. And I thought it was the biggest.

It was the biggest thing I'd ever done in terms of being like a brand partnership, a brand endorser. They did this huge event in New York City with a ramp and with an announcer, and they brought in a crowd of people. And we had to basically. talk about the serial mascot as if he's our real friend, and we're so glad that he's into our sports now. And the whole time I just felt, I mean, obviously it's dishonest and silly, but it just fell like to cheat, and it felt like we were losing the integrity of our sports to, to fit in

with marketing, to fit in with, you know, the ad-Asian. of Madison Avenue or whatever it is in New York City. And I was like, this is not staying core to our values. And then I did it. I was contractually obligated to do it, kind of slyly made fun of it in the way when I was doing it. Because I had some other, I was with other people, like Dave Miro was there and Johnny Moseley was there.

I mean, all this stuff is not hard to find. But, and we were all kind of feeling. feeling silly about it too. But right after that, I got the Activision contract. I got the Activision offer. And because of my experience of that commercial promotion, I was like, whatever they do, if they're going to put my name on it, I have to have approval over it. And that was the best timing for that. And luckily, Activision didn't have high hopes for this game. They knew it was going to be a fun project. And so they let me have that approval. they agreed to my contract.

And that was, I mean, beyond obviously getting offered crazy money for a buy-out, that was the best thing about it. Because then when the game came out and it was proven to be something that the core community liked, but also the mainstream community liked, I had a lot more leverage when I would do brand partnerships after that because they would trust my voice. And that continues to this day. Tony, what advice would you give to a talented content creator nowadays to protect their image and business?

Keep control your brand. I mean, as soon as someone wants to either license it or buy it or whatever it is, merge, and you don't have that creative control, they are not going to do it in your voice. They're not going to do it in the value system that you've created. Do you like being an entrepreneur? Sure, yeah. Well, I mean, when there's success. I actually met you here in Sunday, in 2015, for the Entrepreneurs organization.

You were a keynote speaker. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I mean, yes, being an entrepreneur is fun, and it feels, it feels like you're always in something new and there's exciting and there's build and, um, you know, you're building, helping to build a brand or a direction or whatever, but it doesn't always work. And I would say more often than not, it doesn't work. What was the darkest moment of your entrepreneur or the maybe even the lowest?

We had a successful skate brand, Burthouse, we have a successful skate brand, but we also had distribution company attached to Birdhouse. We were doing other skate brands and other skate accessories at some point, surfboards. And we decided to help fund a high-end denim brand because we thought the designer was amazing. And he was. And he had a really good eye. And we were into that time.

I mean, this is like early 2000s. and we were wearing the gear and we thought that the look was cool and got way in over our head, had way too much at risk in terms of loans to this company to, we didn't understand the cost of production. We just didn't, you know,

and also like people don't want to spend $200 on jeans. Crazy. But we were so kind of, euphorically approaching it because of everything, all the other success we have. And at some point, it was like, oh, we, this company is dragging us down as a distribution company. And we're barely going to get out of this.

You know, even if we sell it, we didn't end up selling the brand for what we owed the bank. So I would say that was the darkest because it pulled profits from everything else. and other people that weren't associated with the brand felt the pinch. And it was unfair to them. Reminds me of Janko. You remember Janko jeans? Sure.

Yeah, this was on a much smaller scale than Janko, but yes. I remember I had one pair because it was so expensive. I saved up for like three months to buy one pair of jeans, and then they just eventually disappeared. Yeah, these weren't gigantic. That wasn't the look. I know. My jeans were the size of this table.

We're just kind of coming around again. Yeah, that's almost retro and cool again. It's definitely hard opening a new industry, new category, and it requires a lot of capital doing into the luxury. It is, but like I said, we were so, we were so full of our previous success that we felt in business. Yeah. And that was the hard lesson. Like, no, if you're getting into a business that you're not familiar with or you're not confident with, it's probably not going to work. Do you have people constantly coming at you with?

ideas or things they want to do. I imagine it would be hard to, with this experience, then you have all these other people coming to you, like, I have this idea, do you want to get into this? Do you cautiously approach things? I cautiously approach things, yes. That's probably the best summary of what you just said, yeah. But I do get a lot of it. And I, to be honest, I get a lot of sort of side door offers of things where this is already funded or we're over subscribed. But if you want to come in, we'll let come in and if it's something that I think has a lot of potential, I will. But I definitely have spread myself thin on investments in recent years and not everything is hitting or, they're moving

along. They're not failing, but I was in a lot of ways expecting, like, are we going to get a turn? Is there an exit here? But that's not to me. And obviously, I have the same thing where I've had some great successes as an investor, and you get used to that, and that's not the norm. And I know that now. Yeah, they said, like, invest most VC, but invest in 10 and 2 will get lucky. And so that's about...

I'll go with that. That sounds like pretty good. That sounds maybe better of Oz than I have going to do with now, but yeah. Tony, you help build a video game franchise with nearly $2 billion in sales. Should Tony Hawk have owned more of Tony Hawk? Oh, I would never complain about the royalties that I made from video games. Sure, I could have maybe gotten a better contract somehow,

but I don't think I could have at that time, because activism was relatively small at the time I signed up with them. I didn't have any other options. So we had, I mean, I think the partnership was beyond, anything I could have dreamed once it started being successful. And so to answer your question, I don't think so. And I'm so thankful with my relationship with Activision. Like, we had the best run ever.

It was crazy. You know, I would be insane to complain about that. When you hear $2 billion in sales, and I imagine they're also very thankful of you, because I remember Activision at the time, I don't know if they got bought by Blizzard or their, I know over time they've become something. Their biggest hit, but when I connected with them was pitfall. I don't even remember pitfall. I will because you're not that old.

Or maybe I do. So, I mean, so they must have been the same thing. It sounds like they're probably as thankful to you as you are to them. Sure. And I've had plenty of honest conversations with them about it. I mean, what comes to mind when you think like, wow, something like my name, my likeness, my hard work, turned into two billion dollars in sales? Well, that just sounds outlandish.

I can only speak to how it affected me in terms of my career. Yes, my finances, but more just like, when people say Tony Hawk, half the time they're talking about a video game, which is wild. And I'm honored. But I never imagined that that would be

my brand, so speak. When you hit that 900, because I imagine you did it over and over and over again. When you hit that, were you like... The attempts? The attempts. Yeah, I tried it for more than 10 years. Often when you hit it, when you

did it, did you feel empty after now that you achieved it? No, it was just relief. Not empty. No, not at all. I mean, I think what people what people saw in that moment obviously

just the determination and the grit of what it takes to skate but more like that is what it's about for us is trying something you've never done before even if it's someone even if you're trying to learn a trick that exists

a kickflip or whatever when you finally do it like the only person responsible for that is you and it was because of your absolute determination perseverance endurance, endurance that you made it happen.

So I think what people saw in that moment was what it takes to be a skateboarder, to do a skateboard trick. For me, it was more just like I'd put my body on the line so many times with that move for over 10 years about that point. Threw on my back, broke my rib, you know, came away, mimping every session without coming through. And I had kind of given up at that point. So when I finally did it, it was like, oh, yes, I haven't put that behind me.

But empty, no, it was more like, and that's, you know, probably a detriment to me and my mental health was, what's next? Because after that, I was like, oh, I got this now, variations of this. I want to do it, indie, I want to do varial. And I tried. and failed, but that's more my mindset. And is that still worth with all the injury? Yeah.

I mean, yeah, the injuries, the injuries suck, but I would never trade them for what skateboarding brought me in terms of my sense of self. You don't look injured now, so that's good. It's good, yeah, well, you haven't seen me try to back at my car. How's the knees? No, I mean, I definitely have been.

You always wore pads in a helmet. That's one thing I liked about watching you. Yeah, well, generally you're going to do that if you ride big. I mean, my ramp is 14 feet tall. So if you're going to ride something of that stature, you're going to probably do it with pads. But really, the nature of my injuries mostly, yeah, I broke my elbow and my leg and my cul-vis and my thumb and fractured my skull and all this other stuff.

But really the biggest ongoing chronic issue is whiplash. Because when we fall, especially if we think we've made something, and you shoot out, so you get this like snap of your neck. And that's what has kind of plagued me the last 10 years or so. But I actually got proactive, and I went to bioaccelerator in Columbia, and I got stem cells on my neck and my cervical spine, and I got basically 20 degrees of range back in all directions of the neck. And, you know, I'm not.

some paid endorsement. I'm just telling you the truth. I've been thinking about getting it from my knees, because when I walk down the stairs, I can hear Krispies. Krispies. Like Rice Krispies treats in my knees. Yeah, you have the crunchies. I have the crunchies. I mean, I got the crunchies elsewhere, for sure, and like my elbow and stuff, but this is what was preventing me from skating to my fullest. Ah. Skating was, at least when I, when I think back to my time,

it was an interesting culture of, like, not selling out. Like, there was this whole thing of like, almost an underground. round feel. When you got bigger and you got more popular and you were doing more things, did people come to you like, oh, you're a sellout? All day. Yeah, absolutely. It's still. But, you know, I never, like, I didn't get into skating because I was trying to gatekeep it or covet it. I did it just because I loved it so much. And if I was able to make a living at it, all the better. And so when you asked me, like, for instance, since I did, obviously I did some big campaigns.

I mean, Activision is a gift they kept on giving, but I did big campaigns for fast food restaurants and for snacks and things like that, cereal and whatnot. I wasn't warping my values to get there. It's like if those companies had reached out to me when I was 14, that would have been amazing. If they reached out to me when I was 22 and barely paying my mortgage,

that would have been even better because I was still, like I was eating at those places. I was eating those products. I was participating in it. You know what I mean? It's not like I was like, I only eat organic, do, do, do, do.

And then I got an offer like, oh, never mind. It was never like that. So I don't know if that answers your question, but it's just more like, we didn't have a chance to sell out. Yeah. because the opportunities weren't even there.

And then it was like, when I got the opportunity to do big campaigns and big endorsements, I made sure that the quality control was there. And so when I was presenting skateboarding to a bigger audience, maybe a TV audience that had never seen it, it's going to be of the best quality and integrity about skateboarding. So, yes, the creative could be all over the place and do some of it's silly and whatnot. But if you're going to show skateboarding, it's going to be in its realest sense. And I feel like I did a good job doing that.

Did you eat your weedies? I, well, yeah, but I have frost place. In fact, Tony the Tiger was on my ramp two years ago. That's cool. Which is wild. I mean, that's this kind of thing that's like, I ate frosted place my entire childhood. You know what I mean?

And now that I'm, I mean, I'm on a box. Like, it's crazy. That kind of stuff. stuff, it's just super fun to me. So I don't think about, or I don't even consider that, is that compromising my values? Absolutely not. It's like celebrating where I came from. Skateboarding and AI, what do you think of the technology? Honestly, AI has not been able to replicate skateboarding properly, so I don't really consider it at this point. I mean, it's unfortunate that maybe at some point it's going to fool people

that they think, oh, that person actually did this trick or whatever it is or this trick exists. But I don't really see it benefiting or degrating skating. I see you have something over here. It's the Olympic flame. I don't know if that's what it's called. But the Olympic torch. The Olympic torch. And I read that it's when the Olympics brought on skateboarding.

What was that moment for you like? It was cool. I mean, I was helping the process along as much as I could through the years, through the early days too, of what are all the hoops you have to jump through, you know, what are the connections you have to make? And then I went to LaZan. I pitched skateboarding as a discipline. And then when I saw that it was going to be actually included in the Tokyo games, I backed off of my involvement. because I didn't want anyone to think that I was manipulating it, that I was somehow making the rules.

You know what I mean? I just like, I didn't want to be responsible for the decisions they were making like that because I also didn't have the bandwidth to help in the minutia like that. So it was more like, okay, it's in the Olympics, as far as I'm concerned, my work is done. And I mean, it should have been there all along.

Like, you know, that's my attitude. they needed our cool factor more than we needed their validation. I know, like they have that... How is breakdancing made... That's true, right? Yeah, but I... No, the weirdest one is... You know, I understand what happened with grape dancing,

the viral and stuff, but, you know, I grew up in the 80s. I grew up in street culture with skateboarding. Break dancing was happening. It was cool, you know, headspins, like, it was at the Reagan inauguration. Like, it was sick. sick, so I was kind of excited that it was going to be there. I just, then something else happened and it got weird.

The worst one is the ice thing where they're like, it's like this, the curling, yeah, what is that? Well, that's what is curling? I didn't want to, I think I used that as an example long, long time ago where I was like, curling couldn't have that much audience or couldn't have a bigger audience than skateboarding would have. You know what I mean? But I don't, I'm not there to throw other sports into the bus.

I'm just saying, if you're going to have all the stuff, you should have skateboarding. It has a way bigger audience and way more excitement to watch on air. And that was my pitch. It was just like, you put this on TV and people are going to see it and they're going to watch it and appreciate it. And yeah, and so it finally happened. Now my, the last piece of that for me is getting vertical skating as a discipline because right now it's only street and park. And park is, has vert elements, but it's not what you guys consider

vertical half pipe skating. Like, let's put this way, no one's in a 900 in the park event in the Olympics. Because everything's too small. But you got a good place to the Olympics right here. Oh, I have offered my ramp up for L.I. 28, yeah. You don't even have to pay for, like, I will bring it there.

We'll put it up. but it cannot, I know the rules deeply enough that it cannot be a discipline in I-28, but it could be in prison. I feel like there's a resurgence in skating, but it's almost alongside music. Like you're saying, music, culture, skating, even hip-hop now, like Lil Wayne was always talking about skating. There's an interesting resurgence, I feel like, where it's shifting among different groups of people and that are picking it up.

Are you seeing this? And I imagine, are you seeing, like, different people that are coming to you and more attracted to the Tony Hawk brand? Well, I'd say I have seen that. I'm more, you know, I'm more closer to the center of skating, obviously. And I've seen it attached to street culture, to hip-hop for a long time. Only in recent years has it been so connected

that you actually see these rap artists skate for real. And Lil Wayne has always been a great advocate for it. But there are plenty of other artists. I mean, Tire the Creator and I just think, Vic Mensa, they actually are good at skating. And they grew up with those that as a touch point. So I think that's what you're seeing now, is all of that kind of emerging into adulthood.

And skating goes right along with it. Yeah, I mean, that... Or, you know, on the other side of that, I've heard plenty of people say, like, I didn't even know about skating until I played your game. And I lived where, you know, I lived in inner city, or I lived here where there was no access to skating, and then we started doing it.

And that's the, I mean, to me, that's the biggest thompin I had ever received. Tony, finish the sentence, A blank and a blank can change her entire life. Foo, let's see. I mean, for me, it's as easy as a skateboard and a dream. Change your life. I'd say the more realistic version of that is a skateboard and a steel mindset.

Can change your life, but both in different ways. What's a steel mindset? You don't give up through pain and arduous attempts. What's the biggest sacrifice of a steel mindset? I mean, besides fractured relationships is your body. I don't care about getting hurt. It's different now because obviously there's more a mold, so, you know, more frail. But in terms of when I was skating, when I was trying to learn tricks, invent tricks, whatever,

getting hurt was just a hurdle. It was not something that was going to stop me. And I didn't, you know, I didn't, I didn't, like, I didn't have a death wish. I wasn't trying to, you know, I didn't, it wasn't like I was chasing pain, but I didn't mind enduring pain if it meant that I was going to get to this goal of learning something now. We've talked to athletes. I think it's a very common thing the athletes will say. They're very, you know, hyper-focused being the best, being number one.

at the expense of relationships, at the expense of their body. And then many times when they retire, it's almost scary for them because they don't even know. Their identity was in it. Sure. And I, well, I think I've learned to transition my focus and my energies and my, um, my obsession into healthier outlets. Still skating. I mean, I was on the ramp

less than an hour ago trying to do some new thing, but it was something that wasn't as life-threatening as it once was. But yeah, I agree. And but also at the same time, and this is kind of specific to skating, but when I come away from the ramp

and I'm bleeding or if, you know, something's swollen. I'm kind of like, still doing it. Like, it's the thing of pride. It's a good addiction. I mean, I don't know if that's a great addiction. I'm just telling you, like, the deep down feeling is, like, still out there.

Yeah. Tony, how do you want to be remembered? Um, I think, uh, selfishly as a, as an innovative skater. Because that was the focus of what I was doing for so many years. but I hope someone that made skateboarding accessible to a new audience. Tony Hogg, this is amazing. I mean, legend. I appreciate it.

Thank you. I hope legends are never forgotten. Because I feel like as time goes on, I think right now, everyone's so focused on what they see on social media is what they remember, what they think about. And I have this fear that legends and as people continue to age, people are just focused on who's now popular on social media. I don't want the people that I've been really doing it for a long time to be forgotten versus the people that you're just seeing on your feed. Sure, but at the same time, we stand on the shoulders of giants. Like, there's evolution in every activity and every interest. And the same goes for skateboarding.

Like, you know, you're focusing on 900. There's a kid that did 300-9-hundreds in a row. Sorry, there's a kid that did three-9-hundreds in a row recently. now they're doing faking to faking 9-hundreds. I mean, we're probably going to see one no-handed soon. That's the evolution of what we do. And in the context of the pioneers, sure, they shouldn't be forgotten. But the same time, their legacy lives on through what is happening now.

And you can either acknowledge that or not, but I'm just excited that I get to witness what's happening now because it's the best time for skateboarding right now. You can get into it, you can have support, parents encourage it, there are parks everywhere You can be in the Olympics. I might pick it up. There's a chance for me For sure. I mean you've already know how to be in motion. I'm afraid to step on it So I think this I gotta get over that fear. Yeah, get over with fear. Right. Chris crispy knees Rice crispy knees you know, it's very scared but Tony thank you so much for joining us today. This has been great. Thank you