Fourth Reich Archaeology - #044 - BONUS CROSS-POST: COEXIST Inc. ep. 97 - How to Be a Good Conspiracist (Isaac w/ Dick & Don)

Episode Date: April 7, 2026

We are cross-posting Dick and Don's first ever podcast guest spot from the Coexist, Inc. podcast, hosted by friend of the pod, Brother Isaac. Isaac has been censored from the free spaces of the Internet and has bunkered down over at Patreon, so consider giving him a sub over there (https://www.patreon.com/c/user/about?u=6112951). He gets great interviews with a wide range of guests on many topics, making him a real fixture in the noided-left podcast space. In this episode, recorded way back in October 2024 (before the election, let alone before Trump 2.0!), we get into the usual (anti-) Nazi stuff, Gerald Ford, the Ian Carroll psyop, and much more. Check it out!

This is Fourth Reich Archaeology. I'm Don, and on behalf of Dick, it is my pleasure to introduce a special cross-posted episode of an interview that Dick and myself conducted with friend of the pod, Isaac Eager, on his show, Coexist Inc. Isaac was the first person who believed in our little project enough to invite us on his show to, in his words, reach a larger audience and pitch our program. It was a kind gesture at the time and one that we will never forget because here on Fourth Reich Archaeology, as our regular listeners will know, we are all about the love, all about building community, and all about changing the world. So this episode that you're about to hear was Dix and my very first podcast guest appearance, and we had a great time doing it. The subject matter is the evergreen topic of conspiracy epistemology. The title of the program is How to Be a Good Conspiracist, and we dig into a range of fun, entertaining, and also serious topics with our friend, Isaac.

I'd be remiss to leave out the reason why we are posting this episode on our feed at this time. You see, Isaac has, like many others, been censored by the powers that be. His podcast has been tragically, and I would go ahead and say unconstitutionally, removed from the free hosting platform where it had previously been housed, and it is now available exclusively on Patreon. So if you like what you hear, please go over to Patreon and consider giving Isaac a subscription because not only does he have a deep back catalog of largely interview-based episodes covering the news of the day as well as other topics of interest,

but he continues to produce great work over there. In the meantime, we hope that you enjoy this episode. Imagine a podcast where time drifts slowly. A podcast. Where Isaac carries you away. So let me be clear. We tortured some folks. So I'm currently hunkered down in a hotel

directly where Milton is going to hit. But the show must go on, and I recorded this episode Friday, less than a week ago, and I owe it to the Fourth Reich Archaeology Boys who came on the show to talk about conspiracy literacy, how to be a conspiracist. So I'm joined by Dick and Don.

That's not their real names or pseudonyms because they tell the truth. The truth is out there. They can't be known. No, probably because they have real jobs and they don't want to ruin that. I kind of wish I hadn't made that mistake because now this is my life. I don't know how much life I have left. I'm being dramatic. But now, if there's ever a time you considered subscribing, it would be now.

It would definitely be now. I'm going to stick it out in the hurricane and then some. There's going to be a lot of work to do. And I want to be useful. And so, yeah, whatever resources you give me will more likely than not trickle down also if you've ordered merch and it hasn't come yet you're going to have to wait a little while longer all right well

let's hope for the best there's a change that's come over America a change that's great to see we're living here in peace again we're going back to work again it's better than it used to be so glad to have you guys on the show by the way

You don't have to tell me your real names. Totally fine. Don and Dick, which is like the most boomer-ass fucking names. That's my uncle's name. And Dick was my grandfather's name. And so, you know, I feel like I'm with family right now.

Well, there you go. Yeah, I mean, we took our inspo from the two sort of spangalis of the Fourth Reich, as we like to think about him. Dick Cheney, now a proud Democrat. God, damn it. Yeah. And Don Rumsfeld, who I believe sincerely in my heart of hearts that he is supporting Kamala from Beyond the Grave. Well, after hearing that endorsement, I'm actually, I'm going to vote for Kamala now.

You have, yeah, you have convinced me now to vote for Kamala. I actually got the most insane fucking comment on a anti-Kamala post I made today on Instagram. Let me read it to you. I did a show this morning about about Hurricane Helene as a Floridian I'm here in Florida we got fucked up a bit you know it not as bad as

as natural you know I don't live on the beach so I'm actually it was a nothing for us a big nothing it was messy I had if my car was parked five feet over to the right an oak tree would have smashed it I haven't had to deal with insurance before, so that could have been a bad or good thing for me. But here's some of the most libt-hearted judo I've ever experienced in my life.

So I made a joke about the only reason to vote for Kamala is just to avoid the intolerable, like liberal whining that would incur for another like four years of Trump. some rando said brother cheney endorsed harris despite a vast difference in worldview and policy stance because of the urgent need for her to win this election you cannot bring yourself to do the same despite you having a high level of agreement with her because you are being self-righteous and privileged when cheney is making better choices than you it's time to reflect and reconsider that sounds like a computer The commas in this fucking comment were all over the place. It was actually insane. The Dick Cheney understander has logged on. It really is like one of the more insulting things. Like as like a leftist, which is a word I fucking hate so much. For them to like happily cater to Dick, fuck.

Who likes Dick Cheney? What demographic are they winning over by saying, you know, that guy, Dick Cheney? He likes us. That guy that nobody likes in the world. He just said he's cool with me. I have like a superficial understanding of bots and how they work online. But is it possible they've gotten silverfined that they have this sort of hyper-focused messaging built in now? I've been experimenting with that.

So, you know, we have the show, the podcast, Twitter. and stuff, and we get frequently bought followers, most of which are porn bots. Yeah, the 4,000 followers to 100 follow. That ratio is so obvious when you have a porn bot follower. Right, right. Several join 2023, even 2022, many 2024. and so Elon obviously doing a great job of achieving his goal of getting rid of the bots. And so they'll, if we usually follow back any account that will follow the podcast on Twitter,

except for these porn bots, and usually it's obvious, but every once in a while, one slips through. And whenever you follow them back, they always, without fail, DM you like, hey, fourth, You look so great. I can't wait for you to join my chat and all this shit. But sometimes they'll be a little bit more subtle. Like I've gotten a few of them that say, hey, I'm from Manchester, UK. Where are you from? And so I'll answer, like yesterday I got one of these.

This is why it's on the top of mind. And so I responded, you know, being a Frazier fan. Hey, baby, I hear the blues are calling tossed salads and scratch. You're from Manchester. Oh, do you know Daphne Moon? And they didn't answer. So we'll never know if they really are from Manchester, if Daphne Moon is a real person, or what? You got rejected by a bot.

That's also a possibility. You're that much of a nerd, dude. I'm sorry. Ice cold. Putting Cheney on this tier, it's like essentially what they did with W, right? or it's like now trying to make him an endearing character somehow? Yeah. Looking back and making him, maybe he wasn't all that bad.

We need Dr. Jill to kiss him on the cheek. Like Michelle Obama did with Bush. Give him a, she gave him a little candy, remember? A little candy. Oh, God. He gave Michelle a little candy for her cough or something. And we'll definitely be getting into this stuff a bit on this episode. I'm always informal and I never do proper introductions.

So I'm here it goes, okay? This is Coexist Inc. And today I'm joined by the Fourth Reich Archaeology fellas Dick and Don. We've been talking about having a show for a minute. You guys even gave me an exclusive SoundCloud preview of your first episode, I was honored to receive. But here you are, and we're here to talk. And I'm stealing this from whoever emailed me this from your joint account.

Conspiracy Literacy 101, because this is very near and dear to my heart as a proud conspiracy theorist. So welcome to the show, Dick and Don, finally. You're here. I'm Don. And I'm Dick. And we're happy to be here as well, Isaac. Thanks so much for having us on. For both of us, this is our first time being podcast guests.

So we're excited for the opportunity and hope that we don't screw it up too bad. Did you realize it was going to be such a momentous occasion? Yes, I actually have a bottle of champagne here. I'm going to pop at the end of the episode when we. consummate this thing. Yeah, I've been a follower. I don't know if you guys have a joint account on Twitter, but

I've been an avid follower of the James Gis James That's actually a tongue twister. Damn. James Jesus Angleton Orchids Twitter account. That account has occupied

a corner of Twitter that I return to again and again. When you comment or post something, I know it's always going to be true and good. I believe you, even though you're a completely anonymous figure in my life. And in this show, you continue to be anonymous. I don't know who you guys are. We are attorneys at law.

We'll leave it at that. We're friends. We are friends. Yes. Right now it's all about trust. It's about vibes. I'm a vibes guy, okay? I am not, what I appreciate about your show, Fourth Reich archaeology, and any of my followers, if you want to listen to something that is well researched and informed, which is unlike my show, but has the same sensibilities, please go check out their show.

It is fantastic. I'm very much enjoying what you guys have put out so far and excited to see what you continue to put out. There's your ring endorsement. You're welcome. Thank you so much. The other caveat is, I guess, for the next, at least for the near term, you should also be very interested in Jerry Ford. Who is a character I was never interested in for the longest time? My Jerry Ford, Gerald Ford in my mind occupied that one Simpsons bit where he takes over the house of George H.W. Bush after Bart Simpson runs him out of town.

Pleased to meet you, I just moved in. My name is Jerry Ford. Former President Gerald Ford? Potter there, I'm Homer Simpson. Say, Homer, do you like football? Do I ever? Do you like nachos? Yes, Mr. Ford. Well, why don't you come over and watch the game and we'll have nachos?

And then some beer. Ooh. Jerry, I think you and I are gonna get along. Just... I forgot that he was in that. Is it his real voice? Does he do the voice on it? Dan Castanella definitely does the voice of Gerald Ford,

and they both do a dough at the end of it. I'll put a sound bite in, and you guys can steal it for later. I've definitely seen that one. Like, yeah, the Dennis, the Menace thing. Right. He's like, do you like beer? Do you like football? And not to say our show is just about Jerry Ford.

Anyone who's listened to it, I think, has already picked up that. There's so much more. It's just that he's our entry point. Yeah, look, I would say that I think that I wasn't interested in Gerald Ford really either one year ago from now. But if you listen to a few episodes, I would posit Isaac's listener that you will be interested in Gerald Ford because his world is your world. It's our world. You guys blew my... I mean, I'm very much enjoying

listening to Fourth Reich archaeology, Jerry World, uh, Colin Jerry World. Because I did think that he was such a doofus. He was always portrayed to me as just the guy who tripped and fell.

And he even has that, that, like, he looks like Homer Simpson. You know, have you seen the, the AI, like, realistic version of Homer Simpson. Oh, yeah. That looks like Gerald Ford. So he was always portrayed to me as like this bumbling idiot who just stumbled his way

accidentally, fell ass backwards into the presidency. And you guys make that very clear that no, no, no. He is a very cold and calculating motherfucker. And that lines up with my, I'd say, newfound view of the world. itself, which is, as a conspiracist, I used to think back in the day that it was, oh, it's just incompetency. That's what governs the world. They don't know what they're doing.

They're fools. And perhaps... Well, you were a journalist after all, right? I still am tech. I mean, whatever. I mean, they don't take it away from you, but, you know. Sorry. I mean to say, you were, like, in the journalistic mainstream.

And I don't mean to signal that as you having fallen from a perch, quite the opposite. Ascended. I have as, yes, I agree. From those pits. As my star has fallen, my understanding has ascended. Because I got my start at the New York Times, you know. But I was a sports writer. I was a sports guy.

That's all I gave a shit about. I thought sports explained the world, which I still do. I'm going to return to that eventually when I, exercise this conspiracy demon from my body because I think that eventually it's going to play itself out and I'm just going to realize it's not a viable way to live life but for now it's it's fun and that's actually kind of

that's one of the questions I wanted to ask you guys was when did you realize you were into conspiracies like in your life I know you guys are both attorneys at law I hope you're the good kind. But if not, that's fine. You know, make that money.

We got to live. We got to pay rent. But when did you realize you were into conspiracies? It probably was in college. I did a lot of archival research. I was not a very good student in college and undergrad. an undergrad. Because I

because I mean part of that part of it was related to this question because I was sitting through these classes you know which in most respects and I think you know if anybody is in college or free members going to college they're

teaching you the kind of playbook for living in the bourgeois bubble known as America they're teaching you all the fake assumptions that were required to carry around with us everywhere we go. I remember especially economics being grading on my sensibility. Okay, we're on the same path here because I remember I had a full-blown, like, episode in my econ class when I was in college. Yeah, and that was actually, it was the first class that I got a really bad grade in, too, because I,

I remember like writing and very lengthy. I thought it was so good. This email to the professor. It was a class. I think it was international trade or something like that. And it's like, you know, you talk about like countries having competitive advantages. Like you give an example in class and you say Thailand has a competitive advantage in building, in like creating cheap goods or, you know, assembling things. It's like eliminating the political factors that cause that dynamic from the equation entirely.

And so it's like, what are you doing? You're lying to everybody that's sitting in your classroom about reality. You're telling people to assume away the facts of life. And what's the game plan there? And never got a response. And so decided, fuck this. I'm not going to play along with this bullshit anymore. So it started to get a lot worse grades.

Recovered in law school, by the way. But then my studies kind of took a more, an approach to trying to solve that question myself, going to the archives, doing like, quote unquote, independent studies, getting a few professors that were kind of on board with this stuff, to sign off for these things and really digging in and writing and researching the primary sources and realizing that, yeah, there's a lot of shit that we are taught the opposite, and that offends me. You know, I don't like to be lied to, let alone by people that are in positions of authority.

and so I guess that kind of started me down the path that I've been on ever since all these years later. That guy, the Econ professor, by the way, he's dead now, so I guess I win. Yeah, if he's so smart, how come he's dead? That's what I want to know. All right, Dick, how did you get on a Brian Johnson tip? Is it Brian Johnson? Oh, which Brian Johnson, ACDC, Brian Johnson? Is it Brian Johnson?

There's a guy who's trying to. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. All right, Dick, how did you get into, how did you become one of us? So I come from a Middle Eastern background. I was born in this country, but the first generation of my family to be born in this country. And growing up as far as I can remember, there was always talk around the dinner table at parties. I could hear my aunts and uncles. there's this very present sense that like what happened back in home country the you know the British government was responsible or there was someone else pulling the strings or there's this puppet master and that's responsible for our state and so it was like very much a part of growing up was like distrust the government remember what happened back home that's sort of.

sort of stuff, very aware of that happening, very aware of like U.S. involvement in foreign affairs. But I think like a lot of folks is like high school, right? And sort of being that disaffected teenager, my grades also sucked. And so it's a good sign. I trust people who didn't get straight A's. Yeah, because it's all bullshit, right? I mean, it's, it's, it's so for my, in my experience, it was always, I went to a public school, but the gift, the gifted program. And it was like, how good are you at cheating? That's really what it was. Like, can you cheat and get away with it? That's it. Right. Or like, can you just speak the language, right? It's a code or whatever that you can do. And you can perform that way. But especially like your history class, your social,

you know, your civics or social studies courses where they're teaching political history coming from like a first-gen American, you're like, well, this is a lot of this sounds like bullshit. It's not really what my parents have been saying or what the people in my family have been saying. So that was like my entry point. You know, always been interested. Obviously, there's like the JFK conspiracy theory that I think captures a lot of people's imaginations. That might have been an early entry point. for me. But really using that, I think the environment from my early, early childhood is sort of my

starting point. For me, I think I was resistant to a lot of conspiracy, like OG conspiracy theories. I remember Yeah, not really buying into the whole Like the the The er conspiracy theory for millennials Which is 9-11

Being just like No, it's just like Bush is an idiot You know? Like they just They fumbled the ball And just it happened Because they're morons

That was my initial thinking And I'm sure a lot of my listeners Are tired of me Repeating the story But where I live in Sarasota where I'm from I was at the school on 9-11 that George Bush was speaking to the class at that was my school I was there

Oh shit That's incredible Yeah and it didn't mean anything to me at the time Like you're just like oh okay Wait were you in the room or just you're in the school No no no it's just my school I was in eighth grade at the time And that was the elementary portion of Booker I was at Booker Middle that happened at Booker

elementary. But I remember driving to school with my dad. I missed the school bus. So my dad took me to school that day. And there was a big protest zone outside. And I was like, let's go protest. And he's like, no, you're going to class. And but it didn't dawn on me that that was a significant connection personally. But now I'm pretty obsessed with it. I actually want to do in the future a Sarasota double-decker bus tour like a of, of, 9-11 and Sarasot's connections to it which are fucking insane. That's sick. I will come. I'll make a maiden voyage to Sarasota for that. I will put you up man. I will sleep on the couch and you can have my bed.

But I should have known early on that there were signs that I was into this kind of thinking, into this kind of world. And it actually came to me today when I thought about asking you guys this question. I've always been a bit contrarian, which I think is necessary for conspiratorial thinking, is just being like, well, is it really, is it really what they say? But the music video for Pearl Jams,

do the evolution, do you guys know what I'm talking about? I do not. I have. I don't either. Well, I'm 36, so you guys might, maybe you're a little younger than me. But in 1998, Pearl Jam,

which is a band I typically don't give a fuck about, came out with an incredible music video by the same guy who illustrated, I think it was Spawn. And the only way I can describe the music video is an incredible cartoon of the history of mankind

and the people who are pulling the strings. Like they did the, you know, the meme of like the puppet master, like the series of puppets being controlled. Oh, damn. It was in that music video. And I remember, this is before I had the internet. I would turn on MTV, just hoping, praying after school, that this music video would be on because I loved it so fucking much.

No YouTube at this time. Yeah. Yes. We are old enough to remember. So I would highly recommend both you guys and the listeners when you get a chance, go to YouTube, Pearl Jam, do the evolution. Pretty good song, pretty good song, but incredible music video. Like, gives you goosebumps music video. It's so good.

And I should have known, I should have known then that I would be, I would be consumed by this world. And Eddie Vedder. Yeah. He supported Nader in 2000. I was going to say that. Ah, sorry. Eddie Vedder's got, I think, okay politics, right? I don't know it's politics, but I...

They're probably not so good now. But, you know, 20 years ago, probably decent. That's why he mumbles in the song so much, because he's actually spitting the truth, but he didn't want to get capped by the deep state. Exactly. So he just says, He's still alive?

Is he still alive? Yeah, as far as I know. Is he in Sarasota, Florida? No, but Brian Johnson of ACD. is he's here. Ah. I could see, I could picture Eddie better in Sarasota, Florida, late in life. That would be sick.

I would totally try and hang out with him if that were the case. So we've given our conspiracy history together here, which thank you. I feel vindicated in a semi-similar experience with you guys. Like, I do think there is a path to this kind of worldview. You jogged my memory on one thing. want to drop another quick reference of, because I think it will tie into what we're about to discuss, but another one of my early conspiracy points of reference was the movie zeitgeist.

You know that one? Oh, yeah. Definitely. You spoke weed, by the way, when you were younger? Adir. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That'll do it, too. I can't, I'm not as a, as a pure conspiracy theorist now, I think weed is itself a conspiracy, you know, and I won't touch it.

I won't fucking smoke weed anymore. I just hate it actually now, so I won't touch it. But yes, I think smoking weed in high school also lends you to this kind of worldview. It hits different. Yeah, now it's just big business. It sucks. Weed fucking sucks now. I literally cannot.

If you gave, like if you were fucking, like my drug dealer and you were morphious and you, in one hand you had, you know, some fucking dispensary weed and the other hand you had crack. I would pick crack 10 out of 10 times. I would much rather smoke crack than weed. That shit sucks. It's awful. You heard it here, folks, from Isaac. Smoke crack. We support.

I mean, I, I, I. I don't know. We have so many things to get into. I don't want to get sidetracked on the narco-conspiracies. It's hard to find like a sustainable anti-nuclear proliferation weed company that's, you know, divested from Israel. Because of that, I can't, I don't really smoke weed. I won't do Bali anymore because it all comes from Israel.

And who knows what they're trying to put in there, you know? I know my podcast is called Coexist, but I ain't. I ain't trying to coexist with them. But this gets into what I'm going to give you guys credit for, which will probably be the title of this show, which is Conspiracy Literacy 101. I don't think there has been any moment in history when conspiracies have proliferated to the degree that they have today.

I've been ranting about this for a couple of years now that 9-11 conspiracies are boring. No one gives a shit. It's dead. And the memes killed it. And I maybe contributed to that. But now we have

just, the conspiracies abound in such a way that I have to wonder if it's by design. Wonder no more, Isaac. It is. Okay. Right. So, you guys when if you listen to your show you're clearly not one of the and we're going to get into some of the the phonyers i definitely want you to list the people who you despise the most who you think are hurting the cause um but how do you guys differentiate disinformation from the truth because it's very evident and and documented that the intelligence community

thrives in disinformation. I think that is quite possibly their strongest tool. I mean, honestly, a lot of the time, I just don't make the effort to distinguish. I mean, because I just assume as a baseline that there's going to be a huge amount of bullshit on any given topic.

Like, for example, the other day, when the Iranian missiles came across to Israel, right? Made a conscious decision, like, and I'm not saying, I'm not encouraging anybody else to do this, by the way, because certainly people are better equipped than I am to sort through this stuff. But I think for people who have this skepticism

and an outlook that takes into consideration, a lot of the conspiracy. elements of history that our podcast is about and that, you know, I think we're all kind of interested in exposing. There's going to be so much noise in real time on anything that much of the time, a good approach is to give it a little bit of time for the dust to settle. now like I said I mean definitely all props out to the gum shoes

that jump on the case right away but for me it's more like give it a little time and then put on those bullshit detector goggles and look at the tells and I think there's a number of different tells

that disinformation agents or dupes will expose themselves through. So, like, you know, bringing it back to historical discussions, like anything that kind of cleans the hands of the U.S., right, anything that leaves out the role of the single global hegemon and empire of the United States of America and its military in its analysis of a given situation is usually going to be running cover for that empire, right?

That's just one. I was thinking, like, there are sort of fundamental rules of the road to go by, right? Like, when the richest person in the world is telling you that he's pro-free speech, your, like, bullshit radar should start going off, right? When that person also owns the, like, social media conglom, that is now private and is basically the forum for people to have discourse. I think, like, alarm bells should be ringing at that point. It shouldn't be that hard.

I do think that it is uncomplicated, really. And I do think it's the math. America is the death star. And so anything that portrays America in a favorable light, you should probably say, I don't know, let me look into that a little bit. Yeah, and by the same token, look at where the finger is getting pointed, right? If the finger is getting pointed at a particular ethnicity or at a marginalized group or something like that, if you follow the logic of whatever it is you're looking into and that logic leads you to conclude

that, oh, well, then we need to genocide this or that racial or ethnic group. In a way that dehumanizes, right. If they're pointing the finger in a way that dehumanizes a group, that's usually another good sign. Yeah, I mean, you're talking to somebody who, I lived in China for a little while, mostly in Tibet. I was coaching basketball in the Tibetan plateau. So this was, now this was after the SS had left.

I'm not that old, but yes. This was in 2017, 2018. I was in China. And yeah, I was amongst Tibetans, and I had a very strong anti-China mentality. And it took me a. minute to kind of accept some of the historical realities of 20th century and 21st century Tibet. And it is painful.

It's painful to accept that you got it fucking wrong, especially when you argued with people with great assurance that you were right. And so I guess to everybody who's trying to, who wants to. come over to the correct side of history. It can be very painful. It can be very painful to realize you were fucking dead wrong about something. Yeah, I'll, you know, in the theme of confession time, I grew up in a very Zionist household.

Are you Jewish? I am Jewish. Are you Jewish? Wait, wait, how Jewish? What do you want to put my, take out of my? take out my penis. I'm a silver Jew. I don't know what kind of Jew you are.

Oh, yeah. Well, I have been hospitalized for approaching perfection. Nice. No, look, the point being totally understand, and it sometimes requires a questioning of the people have been most influential. on you, right? Like, if you grow up around that stuff, it is, it can be hard. And at the end of the day, you know, do whatever you have to do to reach comfort. Like, I don't think that there's any formulaic way of coming to terms. It will vary from person to person, but, but I do encourage people.

I think it's, you know, I'm sure Isaac, in your case, it has been ultimately rewarding to come around. I know in my case it has been that you just, you've got to smash the idols. And to all the Jewish listeners out there, remember how biblical Abraham got his start out there in his father's idol fabricating store. You know, his father was a literal idol maker and God told him to smash the idols. And he did so. And I think that that's a fair example to follow. Hell yeah. I love that.

Thank you. Even though it was probably a made-up story. Oh, no, no. Jonah was really swallowed by the whale, actually. Dick, do you have any confessions? about being wrong about something or have you just always been right? Yeah, as a Muslim American, again,

first gen, I've been saying it all along. American government's crooked. They're fucking out here, doing some shit, doing the dirt, and welcome, guys. No, but I think, joking as I, I think your point

is, it's an important one, just from a perspective of self-growth, you know, putting ideology and politics, and sort of societal issues, all that stuff aside. Like, it's really important to admit when you're wrong about big things that sort of shift your perspective on the world. There isn't, I don't begrudge people who are QAnon believers. Because I like to say that all conspiracies are true at the bare minimum metaphorically. there's a reason why there's this, this, the sentiment.

It doesn't come out of nowhere. It's not because people are stupid, which they are. Like, I don't pretend like people aren't dumb. But what are you going to do about it? I think that the true goal of every human being should be to be a dumb person with a heart of gold. I really think that the world would be a better place if that was the case. as opposed to these people who listen to, I mean,

Rogan, I think, is a great sort of normie conspiracy purveyor who makes dumb men feel like they have to be smart when it's just like, no, dude, just like get really good at, you know, framing a house, you know, or gutting a fish.

You don't have to know how the world works because nobody does. I don't know if I have such an optimistic, view on Rogan. I mean, we're talking, I fully concede that Rogan is an asset. I mean, to what degree he's even aware that he is an intelligence community asset?

I don't know. But he's clearly, he works in their favor. Yeah. Yeah, he's a real wildcard. I'll just put it this way. I will eat my hat. Well, I'll have a hat made out of chocolate, and then I'll eat that one.

If anybody on this call ever ends up on Roken. Oh, come on. You wouldn't do that? I would say I'd go on Rogen a heartbeat. I wouldn't go on Rogan, but I will say I admit, since in the spirit of confessions, I was a fan of Fear Factor. Oh, dude, I'm, I'm ending this conversation right now.

The poor worms that were eaten for your spectacle. Yeah. I would go on Rogan. No, don't get me wrong. I would go on Rogan. I won't be invited on Rogan. I don't think. And that's a sign.

You know, I think I really do think that the gatekeeping, it's very convenient for a lot of us who want to say the reason I'm not successful is because I'm not the CIA or gay or a gay CIA. You know, like there are like... Enough about contra points. Yeah, exactly. So, again, I think that people are just very primed for this thing. And you can blame the internet or you can blame the total failures of neoliberal society. But people are looking for answers.

And the only people who are giving the really satisfying ones are the people who are saying, there's something underneath this. There's something under, like, the matrix is like, I think, such a perfect cultural tipping point. And it came at the perfect time for people to see, ah, there's something beneath this all. I knew it all along. and the vindication you feel. Being right is a drug in of itself. Being like, aha, I got it right.

Of course, you know, you got a thousand things wrong also. But when you get that one thing right, it is like a hit of heroin, you know? Yeah, it's also a drug in the sense that it tends to stifle your ability to interact with people who are not on that drug in some respects. It's embarrassing talking about conspiracies to people. Like I feel like an idiot when I start going in on, you know, the project for a New American Century. This is part of our role, I think, to the listeners out there to stamp out, you know, using the classic millennial therapy speak, right? stamp out that self-doubt and feel good about it, you know, feel empowered to enter the world with the facts at your disposal and burst other people's bubble. It's them that are living

in a fantasy land after all, right? I mean, we're talking about having done research, about having seen the primary documents and digested that information, like why should we keep acclimating ourselves to a world in which the fundamental baseline assumptions on which people are operating are complete bullshit, total and utter fabrications? Who are... the people hurting the cause. Who are the people who are disinformation agents on Twitter?

I mean, Twitter right now is... Twitter is one of the most racist places. I never fucked with 4chan growing up. It wasn't something I was ever interested in. But now it feels like Twitter is just 4chan. It is incredibly racist, and it is amplifying the most shit-coded ideas of how the world works. And in the email we had together,

I want you to explain this to the listener, you called shit coding as a kind of cultural gladio. What do you mean by that? Well, look, I think... Go ahead, Dick. I want to hear, I was going to say, I want to hear Don talk about, you're referring there to Operation Gladiow

or the Gladiop project in post-war Europe? Yeah, so if, yeah, I guess if Isaac's listeners aren't familiar, I mean, there was a CIA operation called Gladio in Italy, although there were kind of copycat operations in most countries in Europe after the Second World War, and to make a very long story very short, and at the risk of overgeneralizing, the CIA funded these, everything from kind of pamphleteering campaigns to outright terrorism that killed hundreds of people. You know, for example, the Bologna train station bombing in Italy. you could look into the career of

Stefano de la Kiaye that's spelled De La D-E-L-A-E-L-A-C-H-I-A-E-E-A-E, I think. That guy's name has too many fucking vowels. Put that into Google, it'll auto-correct. But the objective was to commit acts of terror using right-wing extremists that were operating on behalf of Western intelligence,

be it the CIA, be it NATO, or be it the Gaelan organization, which was CIA. This is the Nazi intelligence organization that the CIA absorbed in 1949 and was under CIA auspices until 1955, at which point it became the West German intelligence agency, the Bundesnachtrichtendienst, the BND. Sorry, Isaac, too.

offend your listeners' ears there with my German. We get some complaints from time to time about all of the guttural Germanic sound making. I think German is a beautiful language, but go on. Yeah, so the purpose. Yeah, the purpose is that these right-wingers commit acts of terror and then blame it on the left wing.

It's essentially sort of micro-fals flags, not at the national level, but within a domestic sphere, such that the Italian left, right? For example, the kidnapping of Aldomoro, that was the prime minister of Italy who let communists into his government in a coalition government in the 70s, and he's kidnapped and executed by the red brigades at the instruction of right-wing fascist, agent provocateur. So this is the gladio model. Right-wingers engaging in extremism with a mask of left-wing activism in order to stain the left-the-left with the label of violent extremism. And so when I say cultural gladio, what I mean is the same on the social media world. Right. So on Twitter, like you were saying, Isaac, I mean, you open the for you column there. And more likely than not if you are into politics at all, like if you are following the genocide in Gaza, or if you're following the conflict in Ukraine, or if you're even following U.S. domestic politics, right? You are tar. you are targeted, you are subjected to these targeted algorithm-boasted hosts with essentially

Nazi content. I think that's an extremely common experience. And I think that the goal of that content is not to express an individual's political beliefs or, you know, to share some research that a person has done. But rather, I think that the goal is to flood the stream of legitimate, authentic, anti-genocide, anti-capitalist, anti-militarist resistance with essentially Nazi content so that the bourgeois lib perfect consumer will look askance, and not only askance, but will downright discredit and fear and hate any legitimate criticism of the U.S. and of Israel and to conflate it with this Nazi anti-S. racist content that's out there flooding the stream. Sorry, long-winded answer.

But thorough, I appreciate that. I think that's one of the best, not to flatter you too much, but that was one of the better summaries of Operation Gladiol I've ever heard. So thank you. Well, I'll direct your listeners. Don't take my word for it if you're interested. There's a lot of books written on there. I'm not talking out of my ass.

I have my criticisms of the Paul Williams book, Operation Gladiow, but it's pretty good. there's a great book about Stefano de la Chiaye. I think it's called like, well, I'll look it up what we're talking and say it later. I can't remember. This tactic of what I'm familiar with this called shit coding is nothing new either. I think Alex Jones, one of the most famous conspiracists in the world, is pretty definitive. an asset, whether he is a limited hangout or gets his directions directly from the

intelligence community. What Alex Jones did to the 9-11 truth movement was irreparable. He has forever turned the more nerdy, true parts of 9-11 truth to the controlled demolition more more suspicious theories about what really happened there and forever becomes associated with it and discredits people who

do actual work so characters like Alex Jones just have proliferated social media I think the one I mean the most guilty person in this regard today is Elon Musk, not just because of the things he tweets,

but because of what he has done to Twitter, which was a very useful tool as a reporter for a while. Like Google has, is ineffective today. But the Twitter search bar for a long time is a way that I got information that I couldn't find easily on the web. Twitter now is fucking terrible. It is so racist. And as someone who's kind of Jewishish, whatever,

someone who's trying to get rid of their Jewishness these days, it is the most anti-Semitic I've ever experienced in my life. Anti-Semitism growing up was a myth. You know, it was fucking Santa Claus to me. Like, it was like, who really, like, what? You're gonna call me a kike? That doesn't mean shit to me, really. Like, there was no actual threat as a Jew growing up in America.

It's real now. It's fucking super real now. Oh, I wouldn't step foot in a synagogue. I mean, they are, I really don't think it's too much of a stretch to say that there are Nazis, hoping and planning to commit anti-Semitic violence. There are people like Elon Musk hoping that that will happen because it will, you know, escalate their cliques or whatever. And there are Zionists.

There are extremist Zionists who are hoping that that will happen as well. Because it will give a basis to what they're on about. Exactly. And that's where I think, considering Elon Musk's ties to the Israeli Zionist movement, which is well documented. I mean, that video of him putzing around with Netanyahu at the Kabutses post October 7th. And where we had his fucking poor son on his shoulders at the gates of Auschwitz. Like, like. With Ben Shapiro, right?

Yeah. I made a meme photoshopping that guy who took the picture at the gates of Auschwitz with Pickle Rick on his shirt. Like right next to him. Oh my God. It's what's more insulting than Elon Musk at the gates of Auschwitz? Considering that Elon Musk does business with the state of Israel, you would think that Njahou could be like, hey, Elon, could you turn the dial down? a little bit?

Can you maybe not promote some of the most insane anti-Semitic conspiracies I couldn't have even come up with as a joke? The one I...

It's freedom of speech, baby. Got to pay to play. Unless you're Boltzman's booty and you're documenting how October 7th is a false flag and putting and publishing Netanyahu's many social security numbers.

Well, they're not going to tolerate outright anti-Semitism. Exactly. There are lines that we have to draw. The real anti-Semitism. But yeah, the anti-Semitism, it's almost, it's comical. Like, I find the humor in it. One of my favorite ones I've seen recently was a thread by the user, Wyatt with a fucking blue check, of course.

Thread, did you know Kim Jong-un and his family are Jewish? Did you guys know that? I learned it on Twitter. Exactly. In the Agent Far East, which is like, okay. Whoa, that is hot. The ancient Far East. The term Kim literally means gold.

What? That should, I mean, that's the problem. Turns out the entire nation of Korea, in fact, both North and South, there are about, I think that would actually push Jews. If you count all the Kims as Jews, that would push Jews from way down the list of most populace to, you know, we're doing all right. If we count all the Kim's in our ranks. Kim, Kim Possible, the cartoon, Jewish conspiracy. Now this is a fate, according to this, I'm quoting the tweet again here.

This is not me saying this. Now this is a favorite last name of Jews to hear gold. I'm just like, not even really. The entire Kim family was put into power by the Soviet Union, the same Soviet Union that put their fellow Jews into power in every Warsaw Pact nation. I mean like, the effort you have to take to be like, no. It's just nobody has that ability. How many likes does that, do you have it up?

How many, like, what's the stats on it? 2.1 million views, which I don't know what to believe in that regard. Yeah, isn't that just like you scrolling past it? Yeah, impressions or whatever. 4,000 likes, not a lot. If anything, it speaks to the algo boosting, right? If that's showing up on 2.1 million people's feed... It showed up on mine.

Exactly. My posts don't get 2.1 million views. That's because you're not... You haven't sold out yet, dude. You'll get there. If I start posting anti-Semitism, you could bet. Gosh, I mean, Dick and I could clean up if we actually parlayed Fourth Reich. Yeah, it's a good thing.

It's, it's Fourth Reich archaeology. If you, I've noticed you guys have to explicitly tell your followers this, you're an anti-Nazi project, which also shows their comprehensive skills. Oh, yeah. Shout out to at Germanic Aryan, the account who recently apparently had this confusion. Germanic Aryan master race Kang with an A, so slang with that Nazism. So I'm seeing lots of, I mean, again, the effort it takes to explain to people. I saw some AI-generated Einstein speaking to a child or the child is asking Einstein Well, why did they make the gas chamber doors?

Wouldn't that not work somehow? And Einstein's eyes get big in the next frame Being like, oh, I don't know how to explain That, you know, you can trap gas and wood actually Pretty easily. Jesus. Why is this kid asking about gas? chambers. I mean, I mean, it really makes it seem like anything. I do think that Hillary Clinton

will in 20 years be a hero. The ability of social media to revise history is unlike anything I've ever seen. Yeah, one phenomenon that I've been thinking about on this is like the, it's not just social media too, right? Like, it's kind of a combination. I feel like we're in a transitional phase where social media actually compliments rather than fully replaces the legacy media. So, like, the act of watching TV and posting is, like, double stimulus, right? You get double dopamine. Oh, yeah. Especially if, like, Jake Tapper's on. Oof. Dana Bash.

Get me going. So who else? This reflects decades of research. And this actually, I mean, I'm not even kidding. Like, I think that there are both government-sponsored and private, right? I think this is another thing to point out, too, right? It's, we're way beyond the period. time where I'll say two statements and neither of them is true, right?

One, the CIA stopped doing mind control shit in the 70s when Dick Helm said that they stopped doing it. Two, the CIA is behind everything and that it's all run by the United States government. All these siops are run by the United States government, right? both of those statements, I think, described the belief system of many people, and they're both completely false, because what it is now is this public-private partnership, like so much in our world and in our economy, that the private sector makes it possible, right? It's a real force multiplier for whatever minimal and denial.

level of involvement any given intelligence agency might have in anything. And their ability to evade any regulatory bodies makes it so that, yeah, like the CIA now is full of people like Latinas who suffer from imposter syndrome. And all of the MK Ultra Operation Domestic Gladio, stuff is in the hands of private folks like Peter Thiel today. I think it's quite simple. Right. It gives, in a way, it gives cover to the intelligence community that has always kind of leaned

on the canard that, well, we're really concerned with the collection and analysis of intel that comes to us. right and so what the private sector is doing is ginning up all of this intel that quote unquote comes to the intelligence community whether it's the CIA whether it's the FBI and then it filters up so that they can operationalize and instrumentalize both the data itself and the individual human beings that are generating the data in the way that they want to and in a way that keeps an intermediary, a private sector intermediary in between the government and the operation. So yeah, let's let's get into the the suss boy of 2024, Mr. Ian Carroll, aka Cancel My Clothing Co.

I mean he's been a fixture of my social media for I don't know maybe like seven months now where I just how would you guys describe mr. Ian Carroll he joined Twitter in May 2023 a fucking insane and have like nearly a million followers now yeah 7898000 as of this recording. And all he does is green screen himself in front of Wikipedia articles and point to Jewish names. That's it.

It's so wild. How can you knock a tried and true formula? If it ain't broke, don't fix it. It's a classic. Good point. Very good point. Alex Jones really let himself go. He overdid it with the supplement sales. Maybe he crossed a line with the Sandy Hook thing.

He's old. He's fat. He's ugly. His heart is going to explain. I would describe Ian as like a granola tea party guy. He's got Ian plugs. He's very California-coded. Yeah, exactly.

California. America's such a... The United States is such a big place. Such diverse cultures. And there are some California folks that are both into healthy eating and also anti-Semitism. The woo-woo to Nazi pipeline is real. It's strong. So real.

Anybody who starts talking about Atlantis, I know they're just a month away from full-blown Nazism. Yeah, I see Ian Carroll's fucking mug. I mean, to be. fair, good jawline, great hair. I get it. He's not a fucking nerd. He's not as like a, he's not a tomato-faced, like, an alcoholic like Alex Jones. Yeah, he actually looks...

He looks remarkably like if you kind of put a finger over the mustache for a second, he looks a good deal like the guy who plays Dan in Veep. I think he looks like Waluigi. I like Waluigi better. I think he, that's, that's good. Yeah, he looks like Waluigi to me. Oh, yeah, with the mustache especially. Yeah.

I guess I'll look him up. I don't know if I know exactly what he looks like. So he's all over the place and he has gained a remarkable following through the laziest research I've ever seen in my entire life. I actually hit up Whitney Webb. Whitney Webb is from Sarasau. notified the way. She, I hit her up and I was like, what do you think of this guy?

And sorry to blow your cover, Whitney. I didn't say I could say this, but, you know, my show is not that big. You're like, yeah, he seems like untrustworthy is what Whitney said about him, even though he was out there pumping Whitney's Epstein books. He made a very quick turn, Ian Carroll, from, he, from what I understand, he started by being one of those, this is what's in your food at Whole Foods, uh, TikTok accounts. Like, oh, did you know that this company owns this company and that they're like not looking out for your health, which was that before he got on the RFK payroll?

Yes, yes. So that's how he got his start was, uh, uh, the, the, the grocery store, look at the ingredients on the, the, the, your, uh, your, your, uh, your, your, your, uh, your milk shake. bottle type of guy. He, he, I mean, for, I mean, it sounds like you, we all have made a very gradual sort of turn towards the paranoia sort of suspicion worldview. His was very fast. And it quickly turned into just like, it's the Jews.

It's the Jews. Which is also very funny considering, yes, he became a, I knew he was full of shit when he was, you know, talking about. Israel and Gaza and then immediately endorsed RFK Jr. where it's like, yeah, that's square on circle. RFK is an avid,

avid Zion. Like, he, he didn't mince his words and his support for the state of Israel. So it's like, how can you do that? How can you square that fucking circle?

Yeah, for a while there was, yeah, for a while there was the whole, uh, Aaron Good approach of For fuck I bought his book I'm so embarrassed by that Well I mean I you know I I don't know if I would go as hard as others have gone On on Aaron

But for a while he was out there saying right RFK he's just pretending to be a Zionist so that he can get elected president And then do the real Anti-military, you know, and the American Empire thing, which is just, I mean, sorry, it's fucking juvenile beyond belief. Hey, Jimmy Carter got away with it when you were after governor. That was before TikTok, my friend. It's true. So, yeah, he made his, he did his RFK Jr thing, that campaign.

potted out, surprise, surprise that a guy who, whose throat is just string cheese didn't become president. Wow, who would have guessed it. There's a great bit of TikTok research. Some guy did a video on how Ian is a organic coffee drop shipper. What does that mean? That tracks. I could see that. So he was, for a while on TikTok,

he was promoting small businesses, quote unquote. And he's like, check out this great organic coffee company. And this guy did, like, his due diligence and showed that there is a drop shipping for drop shipping, uh, Indonesian coffee company that purports to sell organic coffee beans. And you just fucking, you know, punch your label on. on there and sell it to the masses for $25 for 12 ounces of organic Sumatran coffee beans. That tracks, honestly, it's always the most obvious explanation, right? Like these guys, it's all about what, what are they slanging?

And I bet this is just what the whole ploy is a coffee scam. Now that Alex Jones blew up supplements. Yeah. I mean, that's the money. It's always some sort of supplement. Yeah, right. Not to bring it back to our boy, Brian Johnson, who wants to cheat death. That's essentially his whole thing too, right?

Like, just has supplements. Is he selling stuff, though, or is he just in denial that he's actually a trans woman? That's what I know about. No, he's selling stuff. My favorite thing that he's selling is, so he's like a real big olive oil nut. He's all about drinking olive oil. So he sells olive oil. and guess what it's called?

What is it called? Snake oil. Oh my gosh. Caroline Calloway did the literal same thing. She should sue him. So I can't believe it. Listen, I got merch for sale, okay? I actually sent you guys the bumper sticker

of the 4chan comment that people put under David McGowan. That's real. Yeah, yeah. I'll send it. That's what it's always. about. I'm sending you guys some free bumper stickers after this show. If I were to sell some snake oil, it would be real. I drink chicken feet broth in the morning

with turmeric, black pepper, olive oil, and cayenne. That's my shit. That's my jam. There you go. Honestly, sounds delicious. It's not. It's not great. I mean, it's like, it's medicinal. Like when you render chicken feet for 12 hours, it doesn't, it's not tasty. You know, I don't do it for the taste. But that's just what I'm on. As a movie fan, let me just recommend.

I'm not sure if you've seen this, Isaac, but there's this movie that features chicken feet as a symbolic plot device. And it's such a good movie. and it's about fascism and it's about culture. It's about what we're talking about today. This is the beauty of life. There are connections between everything.

And it's a movie called Kriya Quirvos by Carlos Saura, the Spanish filmmaker. It's from the 1970s starring Geraldine Chaplin, yes, the daughter of Charlie Chaplin, who actually was largely active in Spanish cinema, more so than in U.S. cinema, but chicken feet feature prominently. And I don't know if you'll cut this. Fine to cut it.

I will not. I will not. If not for your listeners, at least for you, look it up and try to get a hold of it because it is a fucking banger. Don, let me guess. You subscribe to the Criterion Collection. I do. Yeah.

Beo, beo, be, oh, I got you. That's awesome. Dude, I love movies. I'm a big movie, Ed. I'll check that out. Yeah, I'm also a big Spain, a big Spain guy. So we'll, I'm sure we'll feature that at some point in the future. The conquistadors cool ass motherfuckers, dude.

For sure. Yeah, I, I remember being on mushrooms and holding my girlfriend's hand, and we were drinking a lot of chicken feet at that time, and thinking that I was holding a raw chicken foot. This is years ago. I was just like almost losing my shit, thinking I was holding her hand had turned into a chicken foot. That would be terrifying.

I didn't let go, dude. I didn't let go. All right. Ian Carroll. No, fuck. I mean, if anybody. I just want to go on the record to say that I like chicken feet. I think chicken feet.

when prepared correctly. Oh, the Chinese chicken feet? Hell yeah. Dude, you better believe that. That shit is delicious. Let's talk before we end of the show about, I think the main thesis of your show, Fourth Reich Archaeology, that America didn't actually win World War II. Yeah, there's this little joke that Dave Emery used to tell back in the 80s.

and, you know, props to the king of broadcasting out there, Dave, all of his life's work on the spitfirelist.com. I'm not like a paid Dave Emery shill by any means. I'm just trying to not pretend to be like Ian Carroll, not pretend to be exposing a bunch of original stuff that nobody's literally ever talked about before. Because, you know, there are people, May, Brussels, Dave Emery, Christopher Simpson, right, that have been on about this shit for a long time. But there's an old joke that it's a good thing the U.S. won World War II because if they didn't, we'd all be driving around in cars called Volkswagen, Toyota, Nissan. and this was back in the Reagan era and the government officials would be called, you know,

Schultz and Weinberger. But yeah, no, I think the U.S. won the military part of World War II, which was to, you know, after a sufficient celebration of markets, as Pinshan describes war, had ensued. They took the territory, right? We occupied Germany.

We got a zone of it. We got occupation of Japan, of the Philippines, a lot of territory all over the place. And then what do we do? We invited in the real brains behind the operation from both Nazi Germany in the form of the paperclip Nazis and the Gaelin organization.

And I would just encourage people to always flesh out because the paperclip shit, it gets floated all the time. But the Gaelin shit doesn't. It should always be mentioned in the same sentence, right? That's key. And in Japan, too, right? All of the one, you know, the Unit 731,

one, bio-warfare unit of the Japanese imperial military. And two, who did we put in charge of Korea? Right. It was the people that were collaborating with the Japanese occupation, which was deranged, you know, extremist, unthinkable. And yet that's who the U.S. made friends with and who the U.S. then incorporated into its whole post-war anti-communist program. For those of you who are fans of the NBA,

post-World War II was like Kevin Durant joining the Golden State Warriors after being defeated by Steph Curry. Does that make sense to you guys at all? Sorry, I might edit that. I think of it as like it's more like corporate acquisitions rather than a winner or loser is just you see it in like banking you definitely see it in law firms where it's new co new co baby exactly that's that's legalese for exactly and it's go ahead when there's when there's a merger right in the merger documents if the if neither of the surviving companies will retain its entire corporate identity, post-merger, all the documents will refer to the post-merger entity as

new co, new company, right? I think the Fourth Reich is the new co of the merger between the American Empire, nascent as of the 1940s, and the Third Reich. Those damn startups, man. and the other fascist networks I mean you know whatever it was in the region right it was leveraging whatever was happening in that region and creating something unstoppable

hard to beat to the detriment of billions and billions of people right pretty amazing stuff right and unlike a startup I mean well I guess actually like a startup right so so if you think about a paradigmatic startup. You have the founder, that's the fresh face, right? But then you have to use a favorite of our podcast and something that should be on the radar of everyone, right? The Founders Fund, that's the name of Peter Thiel's outfit. A literal descendant of a Nazi.

descendant of even descendant of a Nazi I think is putting it generously in his case fuck that's like the only reason to vote for Kamala to be honest with you but right but I think a main theme

of our podcast and what we're putting out is the continuity there right the same way that there's that a startup even though it has a facade you know an artifice of novelty that boosts its legitimacy and authenticity and originality in the eyes of the consuming public it's actually a continuity of the project of whoever provides the seed capital, right? And the same goes for geopolitics, in a sense. The seed capital for the American Empire was the exact same networks that backed the rise of Hitler in Nazi Germany.

and those are the same networks that backed, say, the American imperial engagement in the Spanish-American War, half a century earlier than that, right? The Hearst Fortune, for example. Talk about, you know, reasons to support Kamala. The San Francisco, the Chronicle, right, is still run by Hearst. and there's still a big player out there. So here we are, 130 years later. It's the same shit. It feels so simple sometimes to understand the world and the way it works.

However, I think that as a conspiracist, you become steeped in the milieu of paranoia, which I personally think is not an effective tool. I personally am not a paranoid person in that I I don't know I use a VPN occasionally right? I have

you'll see right now I'll show you guys I have a little camera blocker on my computer so that when I'm not using it I close it shut there's a degree of paranoia I do operate under the surveillance state is very real. Shoplifters, I'm doing an upcoming episode.

I'm going to teach you how to be more creative and to get away with shoplifting because they're filming you all the time. And when you use those self-checkout lanes, it's very easy for them to check you out as you think you're checking out. See, I always thought be white and wear a suit was a pretty good. Be wear glasses and a face mask and pay in cash I mean that's probably the or gift cards even Is probably the best way to to to protect yourself

But I think one of the things I I find frustrating about the conspiracist Noid world is that at some point like it it's kind of like fascism itself and that it becomes self-annihilating Mm-hmm If everything is an op, then who can you trust? How can you even trust your own eyes? I find it frustrating. I'm a fan of Truenon. I'm a fan of subliminal jihad.

And I watch the kind of eating of itself, you know? And these are people. One of my favorite things that a lot of the noid folks do is they use Doc Sportello from inherent vice Joaquin Phoenix as their avatar. They do know that Paul Thomas Anderson made a deal with a daughter of Larry Ellison,

known CIA Oracle asset. It was her who told Paul Thomas Anderson that, hey, if you want to I'll fund the master your Scientology movie if you make inherent vice. Love this fact.

It's like, so do they not understand like is it at some point it becomes you become become so paranoid that you become like an auroboros of paranoia like you eat yourself with paranoia how do you guys this i want to end the show this way how do you it is sort of like hopeful a note of advice for people in this world how do you prevent yourself from eating yourself Damn, that is a hard question. I mean, we're very new on podcasting, right? Yeah, I try not to think about it too hard.

That's really good advice. No, I think my, speaking for our project, I think we look at it really in a historical lens and we're always looking for the best possible source. and we're very particular about how we're running the show. And ultimately it is, I mean, we are the endeavor to be informative and all of that, but it is a piece of entertainment and a piece of art. And that's how, like, for our project, at least, this is how I've been engaging in it.

And, you know, as I say, I grew up in an environment that was, had a very healthy suspicion to authority and government and all of that. Yeah, and that's why, I mean, I think as a podcast, even, you know, I think I bless Dick for being less on Twitter than I am. Oh, you need that to balance yourself out for sure. That's a very important partnership.

Although, to be honest, Dick runs the Instagram account, and I logged on there and the comments in that world, it's like even too weird for me. Even weirder in some ways. Talk about California. Yeah, exactly. I got the California anti-Nazis covered. But I've always taken, you know, ever since, like, I just got, I'm not like a, like, a, Twitter lifer by any means. I embarrassingly actually got on Twitter in the 2020 primary season to follow that along as I

naively supported Bernie Sanders campaign. Hey, hey, hey. More confession hour here. That was the right move. Okay. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. It was a learning experience. That's what I try to make every single thing in my life, whether it always works out or not, you know, and sometimes have to engage in a degree of self-coaching to try to take out lessons out of mistakes.

But in this case, right, even I think in my Twitter account that I've had for a few years now, have, always tried to avoid anything that casts aspersions or assumes bad motives on people without really sort of solid evidence. And this comes full circle to your first question that we discussed, which was about how do you tell what the bullshit is? How do you spot the propaganda, the sort of shitcoat? And I think there is, the bullseye. That's what you're really looking for, right? If something is racist, if something puts you on a logical progression that culminates in a racist or a genocidal or a, you know, a sexist conclusion, like for me, those are the tells. That's where you can call shit out for

leading people astray, for leading people in a bad direction, apologizing for U.S. Empire, apologizing for Zionist genocide, whatever the case may be, there's very, very big fish to fry out there. And the beefs, you know, I understand that that's a way to generate community. in a certain way. Certainly there may be valuable work to be done looking into some of this stuff. I 1,000% believe that both government intelligence and private intelligence networks are concerned with stuff that some of the DSA types out there might think is just totally anodyne online content, right? I do think that there's probably signal boosting.

I do think that there's probably funneling. I don't think that any of this stuff, even what we do, is completely off the radar or, you know, outside of the scope. But that being said, you know, we take some reasonable care to not fuck up our day jobs. and we expect that other people have the right to do that. We respect that other people have the right to do that. And it's really more about the content, I think, than trying to look for some there when maybe yes, maybe no. I don't know. I don't want to say, like, it's not.

part of our project to investigate our contemporaries. We support those who expose very interesting things. And I agree with you. You know, I think that both of those, both of those sort of of polls have done valuable things. And, you know, I'm not not out here to start a circular firing squad. I am a Taoist conspiracist in that I operate mostly on vibes. There are simple flags to pay attention to, which I think money is one of them. So until Fourth Reich archaeology is under 10K a month on Patreon, I think we can trust you guys fully. once you surpass that,

then you got to put more effort into proving that you're not a Peter Tiela shill. I'll tell you this. If we get over like 10,000 subscribers on Patreon, paying subscribers, that will most likely be sufficient to face reveal. We'll set a price tag one of these days. That's a big, that's a long marathon. You just gave your subscribers to deal with.

Hey, maybe this appearance, maybe this, you know, my first guest appearance here. You've got thousands in the under 10K listeners on my show to convert here. It'd be very cool if they've made it this long into the episode. I'm not speaking for Dick, by the way. although maybe I am well I'll say yeah I'm into that it's just so yeah our project is really just a long con to see to get to the face reveal so you guys are probably car insurance lawyers you know subsidizing your podcast with a spurious claims the truth is is we are a pair of artists and we're trapped in lawyers bodies and saddled with lawyers' debts. And what we really want to do is express ourselves we have in the works. Well, I don't know if we're ready for plugs yet, Isaac.

Yeah, plug away. It's in the show. Let's go. Let's do it. Plug it. Plug it. But another one of our, I've mentioned a few of our influences, of our, you know, the shoulders we stand on. But another one in our artistic.

shared vision propelled by the power of friendship is Craig Baldwin, a radical underground filmmaker out of the Bay Area who may not have arrived at this generation yet. But we are undergoing, and Dick, feel free to supplement me here, but a epic film project that ties together our deep research into Gerald Ford, the New Wave Movement of the 1970s, and its roots in esoteric Nazism. And the podcast is actually the side project of the side project. I was so proud of us for recording for almost two hours. and not saying the E word, esoteric,

and you just fucked it up, man. All joking aside, big fan of what you guys are doing, and if you're a listener of mine, go give Fourth Reich Archaeology money, at the very least, like and subscribe, all that bullshit that we're required to do

for the almighty algorithm. Guys, I'm so glad you came on. This is a blast, and we'll definitely do this, again. Hell yeah, man. Thanks for having us. Thank you so much. Enjoy the rest of your Friday night. We're officially, we're officially podcast guests. Yes, you're officially, yeah. It's been an honor. Put it on your Tinder profile. All right. I'll talk to you guys later. I don't have a Tinder profile.

I got banned from Tinder, so I can't put it on me. No questions about that. That'll be it for the time I come on your show. I'll talk about it. All right, guys. Keep up the good word.