Frame & Reference Podcast - 4: “9-1-1: Lone Star" DP Andy Strahorn

Episode Date: February 18, 2021

On todays episode of the Frame & Reference Podcast, Kenny talks with cinematographer Andy Strahorn about his work on “9-1-1: Lone Star.” Originally from Australia, Andy has worked on numerous shows including episode of “Fear the Walking Dead”, “Lethal Weapon”, and “Justified.” Enjoy the episode! Liking the podcast? Leave a rating and review on your favorite podcast app! Frame & Reference is supported by Filmtools and ProVideo Coalition. Filmtools is the West Coasts leading supplier of film equipment. From cameras and lights to grip and expendables, Filmtools has you covered for all your film gear needs. Check out Filmtools.com for more. ProVideo Coalition is a top news and reviews site focusing on all things production and post. Check out ProVideoCoalition.com for the latest news coming out of the industry.

Hello and welcome to this, another episode of Frame and Reference. I'm your host, Kenny McMillan, and today we're talking with cinematographer Andy Strayhorn about his work on the television show 9-1-1-Lone Star. Andy, you know, on this podcast, I like to talk to working cinematographers, and that is not exemplified more than Andy as he got offset. started driving to a color session, pulled over to the side of the road, and called me to do the podcast. So, um, big ups to Andy for fitting me into his schedule like that. Um, so you'll have to forgive the sort of cell phone quality. Um, but in the discussion, you know, we talk about his

sort of humble beginnings, as it were in Australia. Um, you know, I, I really enjoyed hearing about his time as a, uh, projectionist. I'm, I'm kind of somewhat fascinated by, the art of projection. The first film I did out of, like personal film I did out of film I did out of film school was about my friend Michael Russelae running a, running the projector at USC, which was a side job he had. He's the guy who does five second films, if you know them. Anyway, Andy talks about that. He talks about, you know, the workman-like ethic that comes from the Outback, which I thought was really fascinating because, you know, Out here in LA, it can get a little frou-frew, you know, a little, oh, we're making magic here.

Whereas to him, it seems it was a lot more like, no, we're just doing the work, which I really appreciate. I like that angle on filmmaking. And, you know, then obviously we get to talk about 911 Longhorn, Lone Star, and the work he's doing on there. You know, it's about firefighters, and so there's a lot of action happening there about his approach to lighting specifically. Really interesting talk about contrast and lighting, especially how sunlight nature provides its influence into his lighting style. So I'm not going to take up too much time on this intro, but that's what's going on. So without further ado, let's hear from Andy Strayhorn. Hello and welcome to frame and reference. I'm your host Kenny McMillan. And

today we are joined by Andy Strayhorn, the D.P. of 911 Lone Star. How you doing, Andy? I'm good, mate. How are you? I am excellent. Where are you calling in from right now? Well, as life would have it, I'm on the side of the road just before I go do color tonight on Lone Star, one of the Eps. So I just pulled off before heading over to the posthouse to do some color. Oh, wow. who's uh who's handling color for you uh mTI okay cool mty i in hollywood so uh doing that with hulio uh groan over there so julia does a great job so uh yeah so you know just finished shooting today and just lucky enough to have a chance to speak to you and then just race off to do color for several hours uh to finish the day you know so so yeah

So we'll get to, I'm actually really interested in coloring so we can get to that in a minute. But I was looking at your IMDB and it looks like you're primarily in television. How'd you get started there? Well, I, you know, starting back in Australia in the mid-90s, you know, you start as a, you know, back then it was film. So it was, you know, I started. as worked my way up through, you know, video split to second AC, first AC and then DP, and then came to stateside and, you know, for about, you know, close to a decade, shot a lot of little independent movies, you know, some okay, some not so okay, you know,

and you kind of meet, you know, multiple people along the way. And next thing you know, you get an opportunity to get a break. And, you know, you're lucky enough to make the most of it. And sometimes it's fortuitous and you go on from there. So it was just, you know, through contacts of these little independent cinema projects that I was lucky enough to meet line producers that then introduced me to show runners and so forth. And then I got my break, you know. So are you always aiming to be a DP? Oh, yeah, mate.

I was seven or eight years old. I lived in the outback in a small country town that has a small one-screen theatre. And I knew when I saw Empire Strikes back as a seven or eight-year-old that I knew what I wanted to do. But, you know, back then in the early 80s in Australia, you know, the opportunity and the industry isn't as prolific as it is here. so it's it you know it seems more remote and pipe dream back there because it's just not

it wasn't an industry that was sustainable and so it's like well how do hell do I do that and so it was you know being back there and working in the industry it just uh it taught you to be very versatile and and persistent you know sure to uh to to get in and and to trying to make headway you know yeah did you uh you started off making just like short films with friends or how did like because i know for me it was a whole lot of um you know i've got a camera here you like we can edit you know i started on um vhs before i went to film school and you shot 16 and that was a whole lot of shooting stuff in sequence and not being able to can you know put it on a computer to edit yeah well it was something like that made it was uh oh

was around 20 years old 19 when I first started and and back then it was video 8 millimeter and you know it was literally I you know I grew up in a small country town and there was literally no one other than what we had local stringers that shoot news and racehors and things like that so I would go do work experience but I the same theater that I saw empire strikes back I ended up working in as a cleaner so when people say what is the lowest position you can start it's not a production assistant it's a cleaner of a cinema yeah and then you work your way to you know archer and candy bar and then projectionist and that's how I started so I literally just watched things like Braveheart and True Lies and Forrest Gump like 80 times and just we'll just watch the lighting and then would go get a video camera and try to make my own little

film you know you just you were so much of a sponge that you just couldn't get enough of it so to speak you know so that's how I started so you know it was very humble beginnings yeah and sometimes innocence and ignorance is actually a really good thing you know totally yeah I know for sure when I thought I wanted to get into cinematography I was actually confused I wanted to get into prop making I thought you know speaking of Empire Strikes back like I thought you know

the snow troopers were the coolest thing in the world I thought the lightsaber you know Han Solo's blaster those were all so cool and for some reason in my head I went yeah that's film you got to have I want to be the camera guy I I don't know where I put those two together. Yeah, me, me neither. I just, I just remember, you know, sitting there at seven or eight. And I, you know, obviously, you can't articulate, but you just, for that 90 minutes to two hours, you're like, I want to do that. And I don't, I don't know what that is, but I want to do that.

And I want to kind of put the camera there and do that. And so it was it was something over time that obviously gestates and it grows and develops and then you start to understand what does it really entail. And, you know, from that going forward, I'm glad that, you know, that genesis happened at such a young and early age because, you know, we all grow up with friends in different avenues of life. And it's interesting to just, I feel very fortunate that I feel very fortunate that I I knew what I wanted to do, even though the path to get there was somewhat convoluted. But I just knew that I wanted to do, you know?

Yeah. What was your experience like being a projectionist? It was great when it worked. You know, if the film got jammed and it's spitting it out at 24 frames a second and just, you know, it's chewing it up. It's like, you know, there's a few colorful expletives that are usually followed. but, you know, it was great. It was just, you know, it was, I felt I was very, very lucky because I, you know, you would get the old canisters

and, you know, you'd get them in 2,000 foot spools and you'd tape them together and join them. And it was really cool handling film. And even though, again, I was so far removed from the execution of what that is, it was still somewhat this you know essence that well you're touching film you're somewhat part of it you know so it was definitely something that in the early days it was uh you know it was a lot of fun just to be even though it was a bit naive to think that you're part of the industry

you know it was just a different side of it was obviously distributing as opposed to uh you know exhibition as opposed to production but uh it was a lot of fun and it was just it was really cool and and um it was just something pretty magical just to hear that flicker much like years later you know operating and then shooting and hearing the sound of film run through the magazine to your ear you know it was uh that's that's one thing i do miss is hearing that sound that's for sure totally yeah when i was uh like i said when i was in film school we got to shoot 16 millimeter and you do start to especially when things go wrong like just little simple things you hear the the mechanism kind of change sounds yeah oh no right in the middle of a really great take you just have to sit there

with your face and the eyepiece and just eat it yeah there's a little bit of that is sometimes that yeah it definitely i didn't really have too many mishaps but it was uh it was nonetheless it was uh it was pretty cool i got to i got paid to sit and watch films through a porthole and that's essentially what I did. I just literally like a sponge just tried to soak up and literally that was my early beginnings of a very

rudimentary film school of looking at an image and trying to follow where the shadow was and then trying to ascertain well if there's a shadow there even if it's soft or hard then that means the light

source must be coming from the opposite direction. Yeah. How were you, when you were looking at that, when you started, like really trying to figure out lighting, what sort of tools were you kind of running into? I assume you just hit the hardware store and grab something, or were you just no lights for, you know, the first 12 projects or whatever? Oh, well, I was lucky enough, as I said, I worked as work experience for a couple stringers with, at rival. networks in that which should local news and whatnot and so i was lucky enough that you know you go to carry around the tripod for them and you know they see that you're keen they had a little toto lighting kit and a redhead and a blondie and uh you know it's funny because i thought that

were the bigger lights that i'd never ever needed ever again you know like you know now you use those to light a catering tent but um you know it's uh so I would I would get those and you know you you learn that there is you know things that are film retardant uh fire retardant and I just thought well back then you know to recreate what Russ Carpenter did on true lies you just put a blue blue filter on the on the lamp you know again I had no influences and this is pre internet and all that type of stuff so I would you know I would you know know, I just went, like you said, but I went to a news agency and foolishly and stupidly, you know, got blue cellophane. Oh, geez. And, you know, you got to understand I was 17, 18 years old when I started this. So, and then I threw that over a lamp and, you know, you make it all nice and neat and tidy and it looks pretty. And then you turn the thing on and within a second, it's on fire.

And, you know, you know, you're patting. down the line not realizing there's 240 volt power running to a lamp but uh you know but you live and you learn and luckily i uh nothing bad happened but uh yeah there's a couple little funny things like that on the way that you just go well not doing that again so sure can you uh can you point to like the first sort of break that you remember coming through where where you felt like oh now i'm in well i remember uh the What got me to the United States was an independent film, and that was probably the thing that started the ball,

particularly stateside, was an independent film with Peter and Michael Spirit back in 2001, called Undead. And it was, you know, at the time I was just about to finish, you know, you're moonlighting on the weekends, shooting, but I was finishing up being a first AC at that time. And I was, I was, I was just about to do a nine months series and, you know, a month in, these blokes called me up and said, hey, listen, we've got this, this horror feature.

It's, it's eight weeks worth on super 16, but it's all deferred. And but these guys were successful commercial directors. I knew it was going to be somewhat stylized. And I just said, I just jumped out of the chance. And I said, yep, I'll do it and went to my UPMs. office for the TV series and said, hey, I have to quit. And they're like, why? And I said, well, being offered a job to shoot a feature, my second feature, you know, and I was 25 at the time. And I was like, you know, this is why I got in the business. I want to do this. And they said,

well, are you making good money? I said, no. They're not paying me until I get until it makes money. And they said, well, wait a minute, you're going to give up nine months worth of work for no money right now and i said yep and uh they were like somewhat taken back and was like look go do the show come back in eight 10 weeks and your job will be here so but fast forward three years later that movie came out because of the visual effects that needed to be done on it took a year to 15 months that released in the states limited with lion's gate in mid to late 2005 and then that I just came over. And once I was here, I was shooting commercial work in Australia.

Things were starting to happen with directors in Sydney, Brisbane and Melbourne. And I just thought, if I go back, I'll never come back to stateside. So I just stayed and got renewed my visa and kept renewing and then went for the 01 and got that and started from scratch here. Totally. When you, you know, obviously you weren't just rolling project, unless you were, but how were you managing between sort of the bigger project? Are you like still doing commercials out here or a side gig? What was that like? No, when I first came here, it was very, you know, working class, humble beginnings. I started off, you know, moving furniture, doing labor work. and uh you know whatever you could do under the table and then i uh you know the one thing that i was very fortunate about in australia was it taught you the hustle so there's always a you know there's no door closed it's just everything's slightly ajar and you know you learn how to uh

a no really means you just got to ask in a very polite manner you know and so you know it was just i back then i you know how do i how do i get a job well i just went to i mdb i looked up every production that was being made in in uh pre-production and i would just go literally from top to bottom and look at who the producers were the directors and click on their companies and if they had their emails i'd cold email and that's how i started and for every hundred emails, I would usually get three to six percent back, three to six of them. So that's how I started and I would do three or four movies a year. Do you think that strategy would work today, just emailing companies like that? I think, look, I think to a degree that, look, those were movies

a million dollars or less. So I think, I think, yeah. And I think that's, you know, that was that was a different time. I think once you start getting above that, you're obviously non-solicitated, you know, you're never going to get an answer. So, you know, for that time, it was more of a case of, well, you know, there's a sense of ownership. If I'm not working and not doing what I want, then it's on me to make that, to make the change. You know, I can't, you know, rely on anyone else to do it and you know so what uh you know Australia taught me so much that you know you've got to be versatile you've got to be a malleable you've got to be fast you've got to be easy to work with all of those attributes seem to pay dividends as you start to make ground

then people always call the previous producer hey what was this bloke like what was this like you know from there you start to get a role on you know totally what that's actually interesting because i've uh i've spoken to a couple Australian DPs and they all do seem to have the same kind of like idea not maybe not idea but you're just shoot it's work you know it's not there isn't that sort of um hoity toyiness about it is there is there anything else that Australia taught you about, you know, doing the work and kind of that L.A. doesn't seem to have that that sort of faux fanciness? Yeah, I mean, look, you know, I, you know, there's a lot left over from the British that we borrow, but, you know, I still to this day call D.P.'s

And, you know, it's lost in translation with ADs because they'll say, the camera operator? No, no, the cameraman, you know. And so, you know, I think that there's no mystique or anything like that or, you know, reverence to the industry back on because it's so small. It's really a tiny, tiny industry. So it kind of, you know, I think the landscape and the culture in general is this kind of, you know, if you injure yourself you know you'll be right mate just get up and walk it off you know i mean our national sport in summer is cricket there's no gloves our national sport in winter is football full contact no pads so it's kind of like this culture that it's kind of like just get on with it

if there's a problem how do you fix it if they you know so it's kind of like you just brought up not knowing any different that this is just what you do you know so it's kind of i think it really you know serves a great purpose in just being adaptable because as you know there is no filmmaking utopia you're always going to be fighting right weather light time uh producers money actors you're always going to be in that situation and all of us have the same tools. We have a camera. We have lenses. Yeah, you might have a bit of gear here and there or what have you or different lights. But essentially at the end of the day, what really separates everyone is their problem solving. And that's all it is. It's just problem solving. That's actually

a good sort of segue into the work you're doing now because I haven't actually spoken to a lot of television DPs, that compressed schedule has got to be really educational when it comes to moving quickly and being adaptable. Yeah, it definitely, you know, I'm enjoying it right now. Just from the, you know, the consistency of problem solving and working two steps ahead and all that type of stuff and and particularly on our show you know the previous show i did was lethal weapon it was very different uh it was a cop buddy drama uh based off the the movies with mel and danny but um you know this show lone star is that i'm doing right now is is really interesting with you know your firefighters are wearing black turnouts or black uniforms and the design of

some of the sets and pieces are these very soft pastel tones and then so how do you know it's that how do you create contrast and and you know and tone of the scene when you're dealing with such extreme values you know so that is a very you know to me that's a great challenge And then obviously each actor, you know, we have Caucasian, we have African American, we have Hispanic, we have British. So you have all these varying degrees of tonality with skin tone and making that work and shooting them in a way, particularly with the way this show works, the camera moves a lot. so it's you know the the the intention behind all that was that the camera was always with the 126 characters and that whether they're skylarking around together in the firehouse or on an emergency or at home you always feel like you're with them as opposed to standing back

and just observing them sure so a lot of handheld then no we don't do handheld on this show. We do more steady Steadicam, Ronan crane, a lot of crane Dolly so it's just a mix of all of those

of those you know tools to you know to create the energy and the through the lens

you know sure and for for lighting you know obviously like you said the different as cinematographers are all pretty much focused on skin tones all the time and contrast on the face are what does that

sort of lighting challenge look like for you? Because I know with darker tones you kind of want to use larger sort of softer sources to more reflect in the skin. You know, lighter skin tends to absorb light a little bit better if that, not literally,

but how are you approaching that? I can't imagine you're flagging off individual actors. No, no, not at all. I mean, sometimes we'll put in a little special here and there but for the most part you know it's more about particularly with the way you know PJ Russ is my DIT on on on on the show and we we came up with a system based off our lead actor uh what worked for him skin tone wise and so we we came up you know the the original show is

obvious successful in its own right and we said well we're not going to do part two of that this is a you know let's let's do a standalone so we kind of came of the approach i wanted when i think of texas i think of copper during the day this kind of dryness that kind of reminds me of australia um and then at night this kind of silver metallic uh tinge to stuff so it has these cooler hues at night and kind of you know yellow brown copper at during the day in the skin or in the vegetation so so greens appear more olive the skies the blue appears more pastel blue as a result more of a warmer blue so you know with that being said you know a lot of our look because we're dealing with such extreme values of skin tone versus costume we basically come at it from a point of

view of really creating a very dense negative in the midtones. So all of our contrast comes in the midtones. And the blacks and the highlights, we don't really push around too much because otherwise you get blocky in the shadows and in the highlights. So a lot of our negative is very thick in the mids and then we pull that all down. And that gives us the illusion of contrast. but you still see texture in the in the in the in the black wardrobe so that so as a result

to your point yeah there's a lot more you know broader lighting to some degree but then there's also it's it's a combination of specular lighting here and there too um primarily because some of our sets are either pastel in tone or have a lot of glass so you're shooting straight into glass or um you know have a lot of you know darkness so it's kind of there's not one size fits all with with the approach because each each set and each location really has to have a different approach in order to how do i how do i attack this now so but uh you know it is a combination of a little bit of specular lighting uh sometimes i'll i'll basically basically light with big, broad, soft sources, but then I'll also light from the same direction

with a little bit more of a specular harder source with an exposure contrast difference. And I also create contrast not only through lighting and exposure, but color. So as it gets darker in exposure, I'll start shifting the hue to cooler. So that gives us some sort of, you know, almost like a two-pronger. effect, not only exposure, but color to give us two layers of contrast. Yeah. Are you kind of on the new LED everything train? Are you still using traditional sources?

I wish I was on the whole LED train. But, you know, we shoot it, you know, through our studio, we obviously, it's on the studio a lot, you know, certain things are we under the, what they call the cap and what they'll give you a hell of a lot of and then the other stuff the new technology is somewhat sparingly so it's a combination of the two um but definitely the the advantages of LED because i i particularly love color so the advantages of uh you know obviously our s 360s s60s are our workhorses interior because i like i like to play with color a lot i don't i don't don't see an environment being 56 or 32 or whatever.

I see it as a multitude or layering of color. That's how I see the natural world. And that, to me, takes a little bit of the sting off. The, you know, sometimes digital can look synthetic and, you know, and too clean. So having a little bit of dirt, you know, in the color, sometimes to me makes it feel more, okay, I buy that this is real. now i buy that this exists you know um so i play with a color a hell of a lot um again very subtle sometimes part of the same family but um to me that approach seems to feel right you know

so you know i might interiors play anywhere a night sequence anywhere from you know 2800 to 5 000 and and shoot at 3200 and it just gives us that little bit of color separation that also helps when you're using soft light that little bit more of a subtle soft contrast in that curve through the use of color. Yeah, what's what speaking of like the digital sharpness, what's your camera lens package and are you filtering at all or is it all pretty clean? We use master primes. We carry zooms just when we're on techno.

and they're the Fugianons great lenses I use them on lethal weapon Yeah, I love them Yeah, they're just amazing mate But the Master Primes wow I mean I mean

It's shot everything They're just beautiful And particularly since We deal with You know The one element of the show is fire And just how clean that halation next to zero halation is pretty amazing now when it comes to filtration we sometimes

you know depending on the on the character and the setting if it's at home or what have you we might use black satins but for the most part you know it's out on the uh the rescues and interiors at the firehouse and all that i just want to keep it a little bit more of a realistic edge and then when they take off their uniforms and they're at home or what have you, that's when it becomes a little softer because the adrenaline's not up and they're not on edge and all that type of stuff. But, you know, usually the black satin is, I just use for the ladies and just to take the edge off a little bit because the Marcia Primes,

beautiful edge to edge, great resolving power, but a little sharp, you know, which is great, but it's just sometimes just takes that off just a little bit which i think gives a bit more of a pleasing result totally and you're shooting uh Alexa or Venice or what uh we're shooting alexas uh mate and uh you know Alexa minis and uh just you know we've got four of those and uh we're you know we're lucky to have you know one on a on um you know we basically a camera basically lives off the A 360 head, the A-360 head. And now with COVID, it's an interesting, it's an interesting scenario landscape that we're all in right now. We're all working through. So generally

speaking, we're using more and more A&B cameras are remotes and just the Dolly grips near the actors. So that allows us, again, distancing and all the rest of it. and allows us to, you know, put less people in a confined area, if you will. Yeah, and so does that mean that you're operating with, like, wheel, like remote wheels or something like that? Yeah, mate, yeah, yeah. I'm, you know, if there's one thing, there's nothing more pretty in this world than a, than a geared head or some wheels, you know, to me it's just, you know,

you jump on there, you do a couple stars or hexagons, and then you're a way to go. And it's just, to me, it's just, there's something about the precision and, you know, depending on who the operator is, some people breathe heavy and some people don't. And I always felt when I operated on Iconors or Sacklers or Ronfords, you know, I always felt like I needed the most amount of, you know, resistance because I like to keep it as solid as possible. And that's the beauty of wheels, you know, is that if you don't turn that wheel, that camera doesn't move. And I think there's something really deliberate about that and the choices an operator makes when framing the action or letting the actors play the frame.

Oh, absolutely. No, I'm in the same boat. I think, you know, the, I don't know, I assume the handheld thing started when cameras started to get smaller, but I, you know, I was raised watching films that were very composed, very sort of proscenium, solid movement, that kind of and that's what I want to emulate personally, if I can. Yeah, I feel the same way, mate. And I think also, too, what's dangerous is, you know, you never want to give people the option that, oh, we got out of a bind because we just slap on a handheld camera

and we run around, you know, all of a sudden, look, I think all cinematographers this day and age, regardless of budget or scale, I think we're all in that same boat where I think, unfortunately, you know, cinematographer's position in the world has somewhat been diminished with the, there's great things that have come from digital, but it used to be something that only cinematographers understood what happened in the bath, what happened when it went to the lab, what printer lights, you know, what, you know, 32, 23, 35 men on printer lights, you know, you know, Those types of things, it was like a mystery. There's like this magic sort of concoction. Now that everyone can see it, it's kind of taken out. Sometimes there's a bit of a committee meeting with regards to people going,

can't you fix that in post or, nah, it looks fine to me, you know. And so, you know, that loss of control, you know, I think it's up to every DP to try to stand his or her ground for the image because really we're the only people standing in the way of the process of going, let's do it faster, cheaper and quicker and easier, you know, so we're the last custodians and usually the people are like, oh, how long is this going to take? It's Friday night. It's near one o'clock.

Can't we just do, you know, so, you know, you're usually the person that's going, no, we're going to do this right. Let's just give me 10 minutes, give me 20 minutes, you know. So, you know, it's one of those things. that it's the last frontier that if it serves the story, then it's a great way to shoot. If it doesn't and it's just because of ease, then I think it's a very slippery slope to entertain. Sure. And I think another thing, too, is it can become dangerous when people think they know what your job is

and start making suggestions or speaking for you to whatever, the producer, director, or something like that. You know, no, he can, like you said, he can fix it in post. Absolutely. Absolutely. And the truth of the matter is, mate, in my experience in episodic, is that, you know, I've just done, I've done two action shows back to back over a five-year period, but you're shooting anywhere for a 43-minute screening. You're shooting anywhere from 400 to 600 shots in 43 minutes. So the idea of not, of fixing it in post doesn't exist because to me, you've got to get it right and then you just fine tune in the color. And you're just really doing the fine tuning at that point as opposed to a total, well, how do I, I only have 16 or 20 hours to color time 600 shots. It's a one light at best, you know, so you're not doing yourself any favors or the show any favors with that kind of approach.

Yeah, there was a quote that I found recently that really stuck with me, which was, you know, if you don't have time to do it right, when will you have time to fix it? Hey, that's a really good line. That's a really good line. Feel free to take it. I took it from someone else. So starting kind of where we started at the beginning of the chat, because I know you've got to go soon. Talk to me about your color grading process.

You said you had a DIT on set. Do you guys have like a work let or is he constantly riding the wheels for you? And, you know, when you go meet up with him in a bit here, what kind of conversations are you having? Yeah, we, you know, PJ and I, when we're at, the station, we, you know, we have a, you know, a lot and a CDO, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we're, we, we, we, don't really suit everything. So, there is several different lots that we have, and, you know, I'm a big stickler for time of day and it's very subtle but to me you know 5 a.m. you know pre-dawn

dawn you know 30 minutes after dawn an hour and a half after dawn two hours after to me there's a shifting color palette with regards to color temperature and and the way that looks and what that does to a set. So there's very much a consistency in a line that we take and then just, you know, adjust for each different set. But, you know, on top of that, you know, time of day is a really big thing that I really put a lot of emphasis on. So, I mean, it's very subtle. You'd really have to look for it. But to me, I see it with regards to you want to see this transition of time. even though an episode might be shot over four or five days screen time that is you know you want to feel that it's real by having different times of day so and then from there I'll go in with Julio with final

colour and then I'll just give him a a background of the episode we'll talk about it first for about 20 or 30 minutes and then I'll talk you know then we'll go through and essentially we'll go through each seen and we'll pick a shot and then we'll just tweet from there and go, okay, let's, you know, do this, that. And usually for the most part, it's really fixing up

you know, it's a little bit of, you know, isolating a window here or qualify for color here to pull down because in our world, reds are burgundy's blues are all of a pastel, warm

blue, so and greens are more of an olive so we kind of just qualify things pull them apart and then put them back together um so it's pretty much just fine tuning it's very little to do with color once i get to do the final color we pretty much stay consistent to getting it right on the day of and then it's just okay tweaking this tweaking the curve here and there but it's all very small stuff at that point. Yeah, how, this is actually a question I should have asked earlier, but how has the process of, or how has digital changed the way you shoot versus film?

Because obviously the digital's two parts, right? You've got the camera and then you've got the DIY, whereas with film you had the negative and then, you know, you had color timing, but it wasn't as targeted as it is now. Yeah. And, you know, it's, you know, I'm caught in two worlds. Obviously, there's a beauty to film. And I think there's, there's also a change in people and the crew's way of looking of execution.

You know, there's none of this, let's just keep the camera rolling. There's a kind of like this prestige of money just pouring through the magazine, the more you shoot and keep rolling without really necessarily fixing or fine-tuning or finessing. I love the idea that there was some. something beautiful about calling the Daly's guy each morning and saying, hey, how did it look? How did Dailies look? You know, and finding that out and waking that out. I always enjoyed calling the next morning and waking up to that.

And knowing that if it was more often than not a great phone call, then you're off with a bit more of a pep in your step to set. The thing I love about digital that film doesn't give is a. I love the immediacy of creating the world right there. And that, to me, is something really exciting is that I can create and shift. And what would normally take 24 hours in the sense of sending notes to the telecine or the lab or what have you, I can do right there because the telecine and lab is right there. So I like that immediacy of doing that.

And, you know, to me, lighting is so immediate. My choice is, you know, it's so instinctual. Yes, logistically, you do lighting schematics and things like that for sets and big set pieces and whatnot. But when it gets down to it, it's really just like cooking, you know, you throw it in the mix and you go, I feel like this needs to be this color or this lighting value because for no other reason than I feel it should be. you know, you can't quantify anything more than that or explain yourself other than

this feels right, this feels right, this feels right, and then, you know, there's something great about that immediacy to me of the art of seeing it right there and then. So, you know, I'm torn in between two worlds, but I do love that part of it as much as I used to love waking up in the morning at 5 a.m. and talking to the lab or telecimmy. Sure. Well, and I guess the flip side of that coin is you know, waking up in the morning, hopping on the phone. And he goes, yeah, all the negatives were blank. Well, yeah, I mean, luckily I never had that.

But I just, you know, it's, you know, that's a very sobering thought where you probably open up the classified pages and go, you know, you start looking for a job at that point, you know, but luckily I never had that situation. But, you know, it's, it's, yeah. I mean, look, it's such an amazing job. And if you can really love what you do, it's just like, you know, you're just eight years old again. You know, it's like you're sitting in a theater and you just, you know,

you get to all this and you're lucky enough that you get to play in a sandpit, you know. And, you know, even the worst day, you know, I know some of my mates that on Monday morning at 8 a.m., they wish it was Friday 5 p.m. you know and i just i've never felt like that no i'm the same way i definitely like i don't i don't i've been a dp for as long as i can remember and and i don't have weekends like that you know it's it's always i'm surrounded by it yeah i mean i i know that uh the last several years you know i'm a huge football fan diehard football fan and usually sundays is putting on some sweatpants sitting on the couch with the computer doing lighting schematics for the

next week and whilst watching football you know so you know not a bad week um i do before we let you go i i'm you know this is the uh i guess this would be the fourth fourth podcast uh and i'm trying to end them all the same way which is uh asking which everyday thing do you find most important um that has helped you in your career that you're you're practicing these days and uh if you have any personal projects that you're working on Yeah. You know, I think the everyday thing, you know, one thing that I love is I love getting up every morning and when I leave, it's usually really early, either before dawn or whatever. And it's just, it amazes me the quality of light that changes every day and just seeing it come through blinds or windows and just this. I'm never. surprise what light can do and i'm always marveled that i think i'll spend a lifetime chasing it and i'm and and that's okay by me you know and and and you know i'm i'm quite happy to have a

carrot two inches from my nose and keep thinking that i'm going to get it you know so you know um with regards to personal projects no not i don't have anything right now you know obviously there's there's there's projects you'd like to work on in the future and directors you'd like to work with on the future but um you know nothing nothing right now i'm just enjoying you know you know i was lucky enough to shoot you know car flips and explosions and shootouts and you know high falls and all that with the previous action drama and now with this i'm shooting firemen and you know so i don't know what's next but um i'm going to I'm glad that I've gotten a chance to shoot different sequence, a different action, if you will.

And I'm looking forward to doing more of that, but in a different way, you know? Totally. Well, I will let you get to your color session. Thank you so much for spending this time with me in your car. And I hope we can have you back next time you have something to talk about. I really appreciate your time, mate. And thank you very much. yeah all right we'll uh we'll talk to you later all right mate thank you seeps mate bye bye bye bye

bye bye so that is it from and me uh i hope you guys enjoyed that conversation i certainly did and uh once again thanks double thanks to andy for um fitting me into a schedule like that that was very cool of him uh next week we'll have someone else i don't know who it'll be there's If I'm perfectly honest, there's like six people in the wind right now. So really exciting from that perspective. So yeah, I'll just leave it at that. That was a good episode. So you'll hear from us next time.

Take it easy. Thanks for listening. Frame and reference is an Owlbot production. It's produced and edited by me, Kenny McMillan, and distributed by Pro Video Coalition. Our theme song is written and performed by Mark Pelly, and the F&R Matbox logo was designed by Nate Truax of Truex branding company. You can read or watch the interview you just heard by visiting Pro Video Coalition.com or YouTube.com slash owlbot respectively. And as always, thanks for listening.