Free With Ads - Zodiac

Episode Date: July 22, 2026

For July-brary this week, we opened up our Kanopy App and checked out Zodiac, the David Fincher serial killer drama about how getting super into true crime will make your family leave you. Tune in next week when our movie will be... Mouse Hunt  ----- FlemGems ETSY Store! Jordan is going to be at San Diego Comic Con July 24th and 25th. Jordan will be at Cape and Cowl Con, Sunday August 30th at Faction Brewing in Oakland. Jordan's new comic mini-series The Amazing Venom is coming in September. Pre-order signed copies bit.ly/goofriends.   Help support this show and unlock bonus content! Become a member at https://maximumfun.org/joinfreewithads

This is free with ads, the podcast that asked the question, why pay Netflix eight bucks a month for a bunch of eight-part artificially stretched out true crime documentaries when you could go online with your library card for free and watch an efficiently made true crime story that's over in a brisk, bite-size, 162 minutes. I'm Jordan Morris. And I'm Emily Fleming. Today's movie is Zodiac, the story of the famous serial killer that takes Hollywood's hot. hunks and puts them in the world's most unflattering suits.

With us as always is the super producer, the he freak Matt Lee, pittance with those drops inspired by true life events. Who am I speaking with? This is the... I can call you that's a little less ominous. What was that, Sam? Hey, what's up, guys?

Wow. You know, sometimes you've got to do a long one. Sometimes you just... Sometimes you got to do a long one. Sometimes you just like, you know what? I was just going to make this one long, just for fun. Matt, Matt, hold on. Have you been the Zodiac killer this whole time?

Oh, my God. Is that the big reveal? You'll never know. I will say, do not check my date book from the 60s. All right? Just don't do it. Hold on. Where were you in the 60s?

I don't think I never tell. Wait, was the Zodiac just come? Yeah, the Zodiac was just come. Your dad's come was just in there. Yeah, I was just... But it was also the Zodiac. I was in my dad's balls killing people. I was...

Yeah. I've been there since day one. He'll write in ciphers. That's right, dude. That's right. Yeah. Well, we solved it. We did the thing this movie could not do,

which is tell you who the Zodiac Killer is. I don't know about that. I think that they told us. Yeah. I mean, yeah. They better out. Well, hey, we're going to talk about Zodiac for sure. But first, we're going to talk about something else.

we saw for free on the internet this week. Other free stuff. Yes. Emily, you had some internet gunk you wanted to discuss. Please tell us what it is. Okay, so I've been watching, there's a couple of like singers who are purposefully bad, but they're also kind of impressively good at the same time. Okay.

I've seen a couple of these, but I've been watching this girl forever. her name is her name is beta Mona Lisa cool aka Bita no I think it's Bda Mona Lisa but that's not a real name

because she is the younger sister of Greta Thunberg What? And yeah she's her younger sister Oh my God This came out in like interview magazine like a little while ago and I was like no fucking way

is this hilarious. I'm looking at a picture of her right now, and she's like, she looks kind of like a de brats doll. Kind of, with bad extension. I believe it's just brats, Matt. Oh, is it, they're not, oh, I'm thinking of da brat, the rapper. Who might have a doll, who might have a doll. It might be a doll of da brat, but I'm thinking brats with a Z.

Honestly, I buy that dog. The dolls with the giant eyes. Oh, God. I'm so old. Wow. That's a cool, so old reveal. I think that's pretty good. I enjoyed DeBrasse.

But yeah, she's, I've been, I think that she's one of the most impressively bad singers I've ever heard. Okay. She can hit some high notes. It's just the order she puts the notes in is like, it's insane. That's the problem. You see, that's the problem is you got to put the notes in the right order or else it's no good. Yeah. But the way she can hit these really high notes perfectly, like the pitch is perfect, but you're like, did she mean?

to hit that? I don't know, but I love her. I fucking love this chick. So can we play Yeah, let's hear a little bit. Yeah, yeah. Here you go. I mean, you know, is it good and bad? I mean, the

important part of the cover song is to make it your own. Absolutely. We've, you know, we've heard so many people do this song. And this, This is unique. It is unique. I will admit, I have never heard that before. If I would, if you were just to play me that audio, I was like, oh, this is a, like a Saturday

night live character. Like when a Saturday night live, like when, you know, Maya Rudolph has to play Celine Dion. That's the kind of thing you get. Yeah, it's, it sounds like she's doing like a sarcastic parody version of that song. But she's also a classically. trained singer. Her mother's an opera singer. I guess I don't know if her and Greta have the same mother, but like this girl's mother

is an opera. So I'm like, I think she's trolling us or it's like she's like I've heard jazz. This is what jazz is, but with my voice. Is this jazz guys? Every time you don't like music, you go, guys, is this jazz? Well, I don't know. The notes she's picking are and the, the growling in weird spots. I think it's amazing.

I don't know, but I just texted you something. Oh, here's the other clip. Hold on. I feel like I interrupt. I'm like. It's like. It's impressive. something that's so it's like it's off-putting but I also can't stop listening to it.

That was very good. The, you know, the last video I watched before we jumped on the Zoom today was, you guys watched the Tiny Desk concerts, the NPR Tiny Desk concerts? Oh, of course I do. Of course I do. Look at me. I'm white. Yeah.

What am I talking about? Yeah, look at me. Do you listen to them audience? Yeah, of course you do. We know you love the tiny desk. Yeah. Also, this podcast, well, I'd be like no matter what, these are tiny desk people. That's right. I just have a feeling. We love you. We love the little desk. We love how tiny the desk is. We love when our concert is small and intimate. Exactly. So the last thing I watched before we jumped on was the NPR Tiny Desk concert featuring Napalm Death, the original grindcore band. I don't know if it's the original, but like if, you know, it's like challenging metal. It's just.

like, it's a guy going, boh. Yeah, yeah, yeah. A guitar, bass, and drum all doing a different thing. And that, this sounds like just that. This is that, but for pop music. I'm going to look up grindcore music because this is, or metal, because this is the first time ever hearing.

Anyway, but yeah, this just seems like a challenging version of pop music for a listener who has heard it all. Yeah, yeah. If you are a grindcore band and you're listening to this podcast, guess. Get this girl in your band. Yeah, sure, sure. Yeah, keep it, you know, weird. But I like the cover that she did of, you know, are we just watched the bodyguard, yeah, not too long ago. So I liked her cover up, but I'm like, what other songs do I think she

should cover? My heart will go on. I mean, it should be all the 90s hits, you know. My neck, my back. Yes. That's rap, but she'd make it around. My neck, my back, my poo, she had me crick. Because that's how they would sing. That's just the Swedish chef covered it. Well, yeah, but you know, they're sweet as what am I going to do? They're sweetest. Borg for, borg. Bork, bork.

Bork, work. Bork. Look, no. Lick it. Gould. Like my pussy, like you should. Like a shell. La, la, la, la.

It's fucking crazy. Talking on my teeth is like the moon. You be cooling me. What is that? You sound like the French chef or the Swedish chef. Yeah, that's what I'm doing. I'm doing a Swedish chef. Yeah, that's what I'm, because they're Swedish.

Oh, I thought you were. I thought you were doing her singing. I was. I was. It's that, it's that too. Wow. Good stuff. Well, yes.

Thank you, Emily, for sharing that wonderful musical interlude. Hey, as like we talked about at the top of the show, we're going to talk about Zodiac. Before we get into this movie, we want to let you know that it features sexual assault. So if that's not something you want to hear us talk about, we're going to play some music and give you a chance to find another episode. Hey, we're back. It's free with ads.

We're going to talk about Zodiac that we all watched for free with no ads using our library card. Yeah, that's right. We're in the middle of Jew Library, a month where we're watching movies for free using our library cards. We watched this on Canopy today. That's a streaming service that many libraries belong to. There's also Hoopla. Hopefully your library participates. Get in there.

Get yourself some free streaming services. And, you know, your library gets its money based on use. So every time you're clicking on one of these things, your library's getting some support. That's nice. We love it. Okay. So Zodiac, I just want to ask. I had never seen this before.

Me neither. Had y'all seen it and do y'all like, is this like a, you know, do y'all get into true crime stuff? this? I believe, it sounds like I'm the only one who has seen it. Oh, wow. Yeah, you two were both said no, you hadn't seen it. I had seen this before, but not because I like true crime, just because it's a David Fincher movie.

And I was like, well, he makes good movies and, you know, Zodiac sounds kind of good. So I, you know, I went and saw it. First time I saw it, I have to admit, I did not like it. and my thoughts have changed somewhat this time around. I usually don't get into true crime. I don't like the genre. I find the genre to be like Loki evil. And so it's just something I don't really like to participate in.

I don't find myself ever getting sucked in the way everyone did. I think I got sucked into the cereal, that first season of cereal. And that was the only time where, I was like, wow. And I think, you know, since then, everything else has just been kind of shitty, except for maybe the jinks. The jinks was dope. But that's, you know, that was a documentary. Yeah, I also like Finchers.

I think he's got some big old hits and some stuff that's been more of a miss for me. I've always heard this is like, I feel like there's a set of movie guys who are like, low-key, this is like the best movie of the past 20 years. So I've always been curious about it. But I have always avoided it because I do get. out by true crime stuff. So, yeah. So I think I've, this is a great excuse to watch this thing that's like been in my queue forever.

But yeah, I'm finally, I'm glad I finally got a chance to sit down and watch it. I'm glad I'm not the only one who finds true crime to be distasteful. All right. That's enough of that. Oh, I'm sorry. No, listen. We're not. I fucking love it.

Yeah, that's fine. It's fine. I'm an icky little slut. I know. It's bad. I'm icky. Yes, we're two holy men. I don't, like, I don't.

Like, I get icked out by certain things like the, you know, Ryan Murphy stuff kind of icks me out. Sure. Because it's trying to be like exploitation. Yes. Kind of level camp. Whereas this movie, I don't know if you guys watched anything about it. I've watched things about this movie and then never seen it. There's one scene that I see all the time suggested as one of the best like tension horror scenes that it's even better in the movie.

Yeah. With context. But this movie was made like all. almost shot by shot exactly like what was in the news. Like they picked the settings, the way people look. Yeah, I read a little bit. I read a little bit about this too. And yeah, he was, you know, Fincher and the team,

they were very, like, concerned with making sure it was accurate. And so they didn't depict any murders where there weren't any, like, living people who could tell them about it. And I guess there was a scene where they shot it at the place the murder supposedly happened. And there were no trees. So they flew in trees. that would have been there at the time. Reverse Predator rules.

Oh, yeah? That's right. Because Predator, they just made everything work in the setting without having to chop things down. So, yeah, apparently he really cared about accuracy and stuff like that. Except for, you know, like the big story liberties that they took to make sure the movie had a story.

But as far as like showing the murders, they like. But I did appreciate that there was only two actual murder scenes that in the whole movie. It's like they start out with a couple of those And then everything else is just about how this case is about how drunk Journalists used to be in the 70s Well and And police

Smoking cigarettes A lot of smoking a lot of drinking So I don't know I like watching them and I think that there is something to be said about the The stereotype that women like fall asleep To true crime And I think it is just like I believe all of it like I'm looking at it

going, yep, that would happen. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because women just feel we're on hypervigilant, like, all the time. Yeah, yeah. It feels like a relief to, I don't know, be like, I was right. Yeah. These things do happen. Yeah, I knew I was right to be scared.

I knew I was right to be scared. And I'm going to keep being scared every day I walk outside. That's right. Yeah, let's talk about what happens in the movie. As we mentioned, this is, you know, a real case. These are real people. I am sorry, I will be referring to people by their actor names. Sorry to all the actual people that this predict.

Totally fine. This depicts. Well, yeah, let's get into it. We start with a shot of suburbia. White picket fences on the 4th of July. Hey, do you think there's some darkness behind these white picket fences? I don't know. This is a Fourth of July movie, an Independence Day movie.

It is an Independence Day movie. There you go. 1969, Vallejo, California. Hey, Vallejo, California, it's kind of like another character in the movie. Oh, my God. We got some teens. We got some teens going out to Lovers Lane. They're listening to Donovan, a hurdy-gurdy man on the radio.

This song will kind of come back. The soundtrack was pretty lit. It was. Yeah, soundtrust great. Great period stuff. Great, you know, songs that, you know, because this, you know, spans decades. So, great little needle drops to tell you what decade you're in. But then the score is sometimes like, is this a Quint Tarantino movie?

What the fuck's going on right now? Sure. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's good stuff, though. The soundtrack is good. So, yeah, we, these teens. they're parking up at a lover's lane.

The guy, he's not that into it. The girl, she's ready to rock. They see a mysterious car kind of watching them. He says, is that your husband? So I don't know if, like, he's joking or if this woman was really married at the time. Whatever, because someone gets out of the car and just really, really shoots the crap out of them.

Yeah, this is like one of the big murder scenes in the movie and it's, like, very well done. It's right at the top. Yeah. This, this, like, movie wastes no fucking time. Well, I don't know about that. At the beginning. Yeah.

I really like this movie, too, but it is exhaustive. Yeah. Wow. Yeah, it's long. It's very long movie. It's a long movie. And, you know, it, a lot hinges on you, you know, wanting to know what happens and the answers. And you're not entirely going to get those, which makes it feel longer.

And I think it is. It is kind of like long for a reason because the people in this movie who are like obsessed with finding this killer, it just spanned decades. Right. So it shows you just how long these people were like obsessed with this. Somebody coded one of the ciphers five like years ago. Like five or six years ago. There was, have you guys seen that one? No.

No. So I, you know, I did not know a ton about the Zodiac Killer and this got me interested in it. And so I'm like, oh, I'll go to YouTube. I'll go to YouTube and title and, you know, type in Zodiac Killer. and just got a list of the worst thumbnails I have ever fucking seen just the most annoying like Mr. Beast is subtle

compared to the people who are like I decoded the cipher and I'm just like I am not clicking on any of these RIP my algorithm so I don't think I will be learning anymore about the Zodiac. No, I didn't care about how they decoded

the cipher. I just looked up what it was and it's some of the most terrifying I want to hear more about these thumbnails. A guy shrugging and scratching his head going, Israel did Zodiac. That would be so great. Zodiac is a weather balloon. I left my friend in a train.

It's just like, Ted Cruz is Zodiac and we want fucky? And there were so many of them. And they were all. over two hours and I'm just like, and they all had 14 million views. Yeah. I can't.

No, thank you. Can't do it. Anyway, the guy survives. The, the, the, the, the woman dies, the man lives. Which is crazy. And we get kind of a 911 call from what, perhaps what we think is the Zodiac killer, kind of confessing to everything.

This is kind of cool. So you don't, you know, you never see the face of the Zodiac killer, but, you know, you see his body. He's in disguise. And there's a different. guy playing him in every scene. So it's a different actor. It's just fucking genius because it's like anyway.

The descriptions aren't like completely the same. Yeah. Every single time. And there's a question in the movie as to have like, was this one person or is it a person taking credit for stuff? Right. Yeah. So the choice of it being slightly different guys in every scene I think is awesome.

Anyway, we get our main character. Yeah. Jake Jillon Hall, he's a single. dad he's haggard he is a cartoonist for the san francisco chronicle i actually looked up this guy's cartoons totally was just a political cartoonist it's like richard nixon smoking a cigar that says tariffs the guy just did those classic and then got obsessed with finding the zodiac killer yeah that's great yeah makes a great character and god the casting in this movie is immaculate yeah everybody it's one of those like every and i think this is something fincher is so good with is like every

little character is great. He's so good with every, if a person has one scene. Fucking Ione Sky from Say Anything, isn't it? Yeah. I know. Yeah, really fun. Really, uh, yeah, great, great actors. You know who else is in it? Who? Casey Jones from the Ninja Turtles movie.

Yeah, he is. And as soon as I saw him, I went, Casey Jones! Like, I got so excited. Really? He's the guy, you think might have, maybe was supposed to be Christopher Maloney at some point and then. Yeah, probably. He's one of the detectives. Like, Huh. Yeah, it's him, but he's bald.

But, I mean, he's still doing it. You know, he's still doing his thing. So, yeah, Jake Gyllenhaal, he's the cartoonist. And also working at the paper is Robert Downey Jr. He's the hot shot reporter and he's a real Robert Downey Jr. Kind of guy. Drinking, smoking, wearing a little ass guy. I think he's the tallest person in the movie.

Just kidding. Just kidding. He's famously short and wears lifts. That's right. I didn't know he wears lifts. I sure does. There's some Downy height truthers out there. Of course he's short.

That's not surprising to me. I think all of them are probably short. I've heard Mel Gibson short. I've heard, you know, it's just Matt Damon and Ben Affleck make you think everyone's tall. He's wearing a little ass guy. Yeah. And he's a real Robert Downey Jr.

ass kind of guy. Ripping it up, going to, you know, doing his job and then going to get lunch at Monty's bar. You get a little. shot of him in like the bar next to the uh you know next to the newspaper him just like you know drinking at fucking 11 a.m. with the other reporters it's great um Matt I I thought of something I think this is your observation. It's like these movies take on a new layer of enjoyment because

it's like wow a job what's that like having a job going into an office and getting coffee. What's that like do it like there's something about movies where the era is that of a bustling middle class where you watch someone and they're like not going to work because they're obsessed with their little fucking oh I got to find out who's doing the zodiac and I'm like you have a job where you're is draw a cigar that says tariffs on it and you get health insurance you get health insurance for that just just fuck it stop looking this gift horse in the in the mouth you can buy a house you can But still, he like discovered the first little clue and he got high off of it.

And because they were, the Zodiac cure was sending letters into this publication. I know, but it's like when I'm watching the movie, it doesn't matter what's happening. All I'm thinking is like, oh man, must have been nice to live then. They didn't have to have five podcasts to survive. You got to go to get drunk with your coworkers at lunch. Smoke inside. Real, though, there's like a scene where it's Downey Jr. and Jillen Hall and they go to the bar together. Yeah.

They're smoking cigarettes and drinking a blue fruity drink. Dude is drinking. I'm like one night of that would fix me right now. Yes. I know. I know. Reset button. He's drinking an aqua velva.

And I was like, hell yeah, dude. Did you, didn't you? I didn't, I made a note to look up what's in an aquavela, but I did not. Anybody know what's in it? Is that what that blue thing was? Yes. That's what he. calls it and it just it's got to be blue curacao or something it's stuck with me because i was just

like god that is what they would name blue drinks in the 70s something's like lavish like that's decadent uh... apparently according to google aqua velva is an after shave so well then he was doing a joke and i didn't get it um i think it's also a drink oh yeah it's also most famous for its iconic ice blue scent and then there's why are there pictures of a blue drink then when I do it? Say cocktail say

booze on the rocks you can order an aqua velva I see it's also the name of a drink they named that vodka gin lemon lime blue cura sow Okay Bam outaholic for the win Yeah So Downy and

You know Downey and Jolin Hall This is a very good scene But also a good way to like show They're very different men Downey's a hard drinking guy You know Jill and Holler is the fridiest drink possible He is a little nerd

He's the cutest little nerd He is very cute And yeah And these guys did not know each other in real life This is a you know liberty That they took for the thing It's like they But yeah

Them being buddies and this is fucking great That thumbs me out so much Well I'm sure they both had other friends They probably did yeah I want them to have each other Yeah So yeah so these guys are kind of Both looking for the Zodiac

in their own way. We get the second big murder scene where the Zodiac is in his like supervillain outfit. It's like a black hood. It's got the Zodiac target sign on it and he does this kind of big kind of torture,

you know, psychological torture rigamarole to this, another couple out on a kind of a lover's lane. This is I guess where they flew in the trees so it would be more accurate to the time. Yeah, this scene is so, was so disturbing to me. It really is, yeah.

The first. time I saw it, it immediately soured me on the rest of the movie. And like it, that scene is the reason that first time I saw it, I thought it was, I was like, I don't really like that movie. I guess the only reason, like, I had heard some interviews with the people who survived it and they were like very matter of fact about it. It didn't seem to be something that bothered them. I'm sure it bothered this guy, his interview is pretty amazing. I would, I'll check that out. Maybe I'll feel better about it. But it just, it felt, uh, I think I missed also the first time around that, uh, the guy survived. Um, and I knew that going in. See, I didn't know. Yeah. And so when I saw it,

I was just thinking to myself, I was like, man, that's really good filmmaking, incredibly, uh, effective scene for something that feels like the exploitation of like this horrific, uh, you know exactly what happened is the thing that's right. Yeah. Talked about how he saw it out of the corner of his I will point one thing out. Oh, that's crazy because that is how it. And that's how it was, uh, it was, you know, shot. It was shot. He gave the fucking interview and they shot it like his memories.

Wow. The Zodiac kind of ties up him and the woman and maybe kind of makes it seem like he's going to let them get away. He like has a gun. He puts his gun away. And then, you know, stabs, stabs both of them. Stabs the woman to death. And yeah, like Emily said, you can kind of see it from his perspective.

The crazy thing about the two murders that you see in this movie, the women die both times. Right. Right. Which I'm like, that's interesting. They didn't really point that out in the movie. Well, no. In the movie, they said that because I caught it this time around, they talked about how he was really focused on the women, making sure the women were dead. So much so that he didn't even think to finish off the men that he had shot and stabbed. At the same time, he had also all.

already shot and stabbed them, I also would have assumed they be dead. And so, like, it's... He sucked at killing people. Yeah, he weirdly sucked at it. If he didn't... Stick to the... Stick to mailing people little crossword puzzles. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You're great, it's a crossword puzzles.

You fucking nerd. Stick to making little Sudukus for everybody. Sudukus. Seducus. Stick to making you seddukus. Well, the crazy thing is, at this, like, when I watched this, I went, oh, if this person have been born in our timeline. He would have been like just a YouTuber.

Yeah, exactly. I'm making little, I have merch. I have buttons. Yeah. You guys want a button? Yeah. Dude, straight up, he had merch.

That was the other thing I noticed this time around. Yeah, so one of the like, Zodiac demands. And again, we're not sure if it's actually coming from the killer, if it's people like taking credit for it. But yeah,

he wanted people to wear little like, you know, those little punk buttons with the Zodiac logo on it. Yeah. So yeah. And he, you know, Obviously, whoever's sending these, like, fame is a big part of it.

He wants stuff published in the newspaper. There is this scene where I think where Matt's drop came from, where one of the requests is a, like, TV call-in interview with Brian Cox, who is playing like a Dr. Phil type. Sure. Well, he's a real guy, the shots of this guy. It's real. Real guy who was also really on Star Trek.

He is like a hologram guy. There's a little line about it. Someone's like, hey, I saw your episode of Star Trek. track show about the show. I think it's probably canceled at this point. That guy was actually a character on Star Trek. Oh, that's amazing. I miss that part.

Yeah, I love that. This is such a fucking great. There's a couple of different Brian Coxes. I like this one. He's kind of like his Deadpool character. He's kind of like a fancy pants. Very good Brian Cox here. Also, the mutton chop wig for me is the worst hat.

Oh. Oh, yeah. Okay. That's a wig wig with mutton chops. Yeah, here it is. 100%. So we kind of have our other set of characters here. We have Anthony Edwards and Mark Ruffalo who are like the cops, who are like the detectives,

out looking for this guy. I did not recognize Ruffalo for like a scene and a half because his voice is different. He's like acting. Ruffalo like, you know, everybody else is really in their star persona here. Downey, you're not mistaken that guy for anybody. Jilling Hall's, you know, a classic little wiener. Ruffalo kind of disappears into the character. I was like really, you know, this guy who is so recognizable now.

I'm like, oh, he's like really given a performance. He really is like, we should pay more attention to how amazing his career is. I was thinking about this because I was like, why is his voice completely different? And I was like, I guess he is significantly younger in this. And then I had to like look up when this movie came out. This movie's from 2007, which is, yeah, isn't that? 20 years ago almost? That's crazy.

Yeah, doesn't that feel earlier? Like, the movie itself does not feel like a movie from 2007. No, it doesn't. It feels like a movie from the last 10 years. Probably. Yeah. And so, you know, at this point in Mark Ruffalo's career, he's been in movies, but he's, you know, he wasn't in the Fantastic Four yet or whatever the fuck, you know, so maybe.

Hulk, he's the incredible. Incredible Hulk, Matt. Oh, but was, that's right. I forget. I forget who he was. You know, he's, uh, he's incredible Hulk. Remember that movie? Yeah, but that was way later.

It's just, uh, you know. Yes, he was not, he was, he had, he had yet to be the Hulk. I think he replaced Edward Norton in the event. He was, Edward Norton had that movie. Good fucking call. Whose decision was it to put Ed Norton as, I get it. Is such a stretch. I don't know.

No, I like, I mean, I think, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, You like it? That movie wasn't, that's not a great movie. No. But I do think Edward Norton's a fun choice for it. I do, Ruffalo's great. I think he,

you know, they, they trade it up, but I do, I do kind of like, I like what they were going for with that Norton Hulk movie. I,

not great. All right. I haven't watched them. I just wanted to have an opinion about something. I get taking a chance on Edward Norton. Edward Norton, you know, you have to think at the time.

I mean, he was one of the biggest actors in the world. But anyways, Mark Ruffalo at this point is he's famous, but he totally, totally melts and melds into the character in a way that you yeah you don't even notice it's him great performance oh it i thought he was in this and yeah i had this really moment where yeah he's kept being like a you know that meme of uh leonardo decaprio and once upon a time in america

it kept being that every time he saw another actor you were like holy shit at this point in his career he was mostly playing cops i think which is interesting yeah and he so his thing is he's always mooching food and he has, you know, he's always eating animal crackers. Yeah. And this, you know, this movie is very like, I think, like, formally interesting and it like, you know, goes against what you think in a lot of ways and goes against what you expect. But also it's got some just fucking cop-ass cliches in it. Yeah, this guy's always eating.

He's on a steak out. He's always eaten. So it's funny that this movie that it feels like, you know, very like original and jarring. in many ways, just has some cliche shit in it. That's right. A-Cab, all cops are borrowing other people's cookies. Borrowing. Yeah, yeah.

That's right. Well, I was thinking about this because there's a couple of food things that happened where I'm like, oof, there was just nothing to eat in 1969, I guess. That's true. Because the animal crackers one is like, ugh, have you had animal crackers? Worst type of cracker. The fact that it's shaped like an animal does nothing for the flavor. It's like, be a cookie.

That little box with the string. The box is nice. The box is cool. I love those as a kid. They spent more money on the box. The box is a tease. It's a slutty little lingerie outfit on a crusty old bitch. And I like, I hate it.

I love those cookies as a kid. What you would do is you would suck them until they dissolved. That is a texture. That is a texture experience like no other. And then you could put your little child treasures in the box and carry it around with the street. Okay, the box is great, but that's the sad. way to eat a food I've ever heard about. Sucking it till it's a pace? No, no.

That's the best way to eat food. That's for someone who respects their mouth. I feel like you're a guy who liked Fig Newton's. Am I right? Oh, totally. Oh, yeah. I love a thing. Oh, wow. You told me. That's incredible. Ooh, give me your. Nilla wapers and fig Newton. Well, Nila. Why is Nila

wayfers catching us cooking? I feel like animal crackers are made of Nilla Wafers. No. They're made as animals. It's like a Ritz Cracker and a Nillahper. They're made of the animal they're shaped like. That's right. Exactly. The tiger was tiger meat.

There was something else really funny that happened earlier. Food wise. Jake Gyllenhaal's character has a son and he's like putting him to bed. Like he was such a cute dad throughout this whole thing until the end. But anyway, he was like, did you swallow the toothpaste to his son? And he goes, it was venty. And then I was like, remember how hungry we were as kids? I do.

I ate a handful of tums because I was hungry once. I swallowed gum. I swallow gum too. Or you just like swallow a sugar packet in a restaurant, like a psychopath or eat the butterpads? Eat salt. Oh yeah. Like feed your kids. You know, I would take a little ketchup packet.

And I think this is just me liking textures. I just have, I just, you know, I like a texture. Yeah. I would like make a little hole with my, you know, eye tooth in the ketchup packet. You just slowly suck the ketchup, just gradually over the course of several levels. Feed your fucking kids. So they don't swallow toothpaste and ketchup packets. It's crazy.

But yeah, I was thinking about other snacks that you did as a kid that were like scrappy, scrappy snacks. And I'm like, I poured maple syrup into my mouth in the pantry and then would walk outside with like this mouth full of syrup. Wow. You guys have anything else?

That's not about covers that I think. Yeah, that's pretty much it. Flintstones vitamins. Don't do that. You get itchy if you have too many. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Your head gets itchy.

So their main suspect for all this, they get a weird kind of confession from the friend of this guy. It's played by John Carroll Lynch, great that guy from that thing. Norm, Norm Gunderson from Fargo. He's the guy who painted the photo and they put the bird,

or they peated the painting that they put on the three-cent stamp. Anyway, great scene. Yeah. He's the guy from the Drew Carey show. Am I crazy for the game? See, I've heard other people say that and I'm like, I need to watch the Drew Carey show. I need to watch it.

You know, I was in Toronto not long ago and just had like the hotel TV in Canada. They're just playing the Drew Carey show 24-7. They should be. It's a good show. Yeah, I really liked it. Drew Carey, nice guy. Great, just like one-two punch setup, you know, punchline sitcom writing. And I'm like, Drew Carey.

So I'm like, where is? visit in America. I know where it is on Canada. It's on TV all the time. Yeah. Drew Carey show, currently all on Tubey people. I've watched, uh, yeah. Oh my God. Free with ads. Free with ads, everybody. That feels like a Christmasy thing. There's something celebratory and kind of festive about that show. About Drew Carey. Yeah. I don't know. The show, because there's that lady with all the makeup. Yeah. Me. Me. Me. Yeah. Uh, yeah. Yeah. A lot of great, uh, like, old school sitcom stuff that they don't really do anymore.

Sure. show really funny um okay but this guy john carroll lynch he's a real weirdo he works at a factory uh he got fired from a job at a school from touching kids uh something that you know everybody asked him about and you know he does not deny uh they go into search his house and he has a bunch of squirrels in cages and there are also squirrels in the freezer yeah we can probably just arrest this guy right just arrest them anyways okay wait wait wait wait for rights, but I don't know. I have a story that attaches to this.

It didn't seem that weird to me. Of course it didn't. Of course it didn't. As everybody knows, I went to college in Batesville, Arkansas. In a dry county, it's weird. I was in a sorority because there wasn't much to do with 500 kids. I joined one. Anyway,

I had fun. One of my sorority sisters bleep this out, but I need you to understand her name to understand. Her name's... Baby, baby, baby. Emily just said Emily, we bleeped out the name, but Emily just said a real southern-ass name. Very southern-ass name. She's wonderful.

I love her. But I went to have a sleepover because she's from Batesville. So like her family owned like a house or whatever. So we had a sleepover, went to church the next, on the Sunday the next day. Baptist churches are fun, y'all. It's theatrics. Sure.

Anyway. But she was like taking me for a walk. They had properties. They had like pigs. go to this kind of metal like shed thing and she opens the door it is dark as fuck closed the door turns on the lights and like a million chinchillas are like bouncing like fucking ding dong dong ding dong like on the like steel doors and she was like check it out and I was like they were raising them they their fur like oh to make coats it was a chinchilla coat factory that's how they made

their it's not a factory trust me it's not a factory right it's just just a big metal tin thing of chinchilla. Oh, boy, and they were just whacking them, and they were just whacking him and skinning him, huh? Yeah, I guess. I don't know. So I was like, he's probably just making, like, squirrel coats. He might have been making squirrel coats.

Okay, so, but to me, he's just a sodiac killer. He's just a guy making squirrel coats in a trailer park. Get your guy who's got hobbies. Emily, I hear that story and all I see is you reinforcing the point that everyone who has that many rodents in their house needs to be a arrested. So this guy, despite, you know, having people kind of saying that he confessed to being the Zodiac killer and he's got the, you know, kid touching in his history and all the squirrels in the freezer, they can arrest him because his handwriting is different. There's a lot of handwriting

analysis stuff in this. But yeah, that's kind of the thing. Like, is he amidextrous? What hand is he writing with? So that's just kind of a mystery they can't solve. Kind of meanwhile, Jillon Hall is getting more and more obsessed with this. And he goes and he goes on a date. He gets on the set up date and he kind of wanders in late he's got an arm full of a zodiac shit with him and he's just like not there he's not present um and he's just like and he kind of explains to her sorry i'm just kind of caught up in this whole zodiac killer thing uh and so downy has gone off to like interview a source and he's worried about downy and she kind of follows him out to a phone booth and he's like i'm really really sorry like you know i should probably just go home and keep looking for the zodiac killer

and she's like, this is some ploy to get me home with you, isn't it? Yeah. Okay, I'll take it to go. So she's so into this. And just a great tip, if you're out with a white woman, just say to her, I'm working on a true crime case and she will react like Scooby-Doo when he sees a big sandwich. It's so true. Yes, we will.

Like I told you about the- I'm sorry, baby. I just got this true crime thing I'm trying as all. You remember I went on a fucking, okay, Cupid date with a private eye who took me on like a drive when he picked me up. That I was like, yeah, I've into this. There does not need to be a male loneliness epidemic. That's right.

If you're out there and you're looking for a date, just try and find the zodiac. I think I would have kept dating him more had he not put all of his pill bottles on the top of his dresser. You put him in the drawer if you want to like keep me around for a while. Thank you. Don't let me see him yet. Keep the pills in the drawer.

That's right. Just a couple more days. But we like see them. they like eventually get married. They eventually have kids. And you kind of like see these little like snapshots of their life. And yeah, Jillen Hall is just kind of like getting kind of more and more obsessed with everything.

But it's Chloe Sevenny. Is that her name? Yeah. Oh, that's another. Chloe Seventy. I didn't. I kind of recognized but didn't know who was. She was great in this.

Yeah. I love her. I love her. And Downey's wife is played by June Diane Rayfield from out of the Skit Made. Oh, yeah. royalty. Wow. John Innes from Mr.

show is in this for a little scene. He's in handwriting. Yeah, he's great. I was like so happy. But can we get her on the show? Is she too famous? She's so famous. Probably.

But we know, we can ask. We can ask everybody. Put it out there, y'all. If you know her. We love her. I'm sure she's like, oh good. I get to watch a movie for a podcast.

Fun. Who thought of that? That's true. But yeah, she is hilarious. One of the best. Yeah, great. And again, just like Fincher's so fucking. so fucking good at just casting great people in every little part.

Like, yeah. And there's no Josh Gad in this. Yeah, I did like, I did like there was no Josh Gett. For me, whenever I see a movie and there's no Josh Gadd, I was like, wow, good casting. Pretty good movie. Also, what a diamond in the rough. What a diamond in the rough. To find.

All right. Well, yeah, we're everybody, they're looking for this Zodiac. It's like 1980 at this point. We haven't found the guy. Let's do this. Let's take a little break. and we'll come back for a little bit more. We're back.

It's free with ads. We're talking about the Zodiac. So kind of by this point in the movie, like most people have given up looking for the Zodiac, except Jillon Hall. He's getting crazier and crazier. That's right.

Making a murder board. He has his kids making the murder board with him. Yeah. His kids are doing the thing where you connect the string to the newspaper articles. It was cute. It was very cute.

And then one of them says, why don't you and mom sleep in the same bed anymore? Yeah. Fucking heartbreaking. Yeah. Like, they're giving you

these little details to show you how much his life is falling apart. Yeah, but just on a little like, you know, just tangent, but that doesn't necessarily mean anything.

I don't think they, right guys? It didn't imply that they got, like if you don't, just because you don't sleep in the same bed because it's more comfortable actually to sleep in separate beds. Yeah,

and if you like get up at a different time. Exactly. You get up at a different time. Or sometimes, let's say sometimes you have to do a podcast podcast at like, you know, at night.

You know, and then you're just like, well, I don't want to wake the baby because the baby keeps coming in and interrupting. So it's not actually that bad. Yeah, like sometimes your wife's like tennis coach has to come over. Yeah, and sometimes he gets tired and you can't drive home because it's actually more dangerous to drive tired than it is to drive drunk. Look up the statistics. Look up the statistics. Anyways. And what am I going to do?

Make him sleep on the floor. So Jill and Hall's getting close. And because fun little tie-in to the month. theme because he's checking out cipher books from the library shout out to library and even Downey Jr. has to give him props and he's like the fucking library

anyway connections we love him so Jillon Hall has a new suspect he thinks that the Zodiac Killer worked at a movie theater because he's referencing the most dangerous game right and because he gets a call from a random person who says you need to look

into you know whatever the dude's name is and he takes it seriously. And I got to say, this adds about 20 to 30 minutes in the movie that honestly didn't need to be there. I don't know. I liked it.

I liked it. Because it gave us the scariest scene of the movie. Okay, go ahead. This next scene, I'm also with you, Emily. I think this next scene is great. It is so, yeah,

Jolen Hall's following this road to nowhere where he goes over to this projectionist's house. And like, he's just a creepy ass old man in a Resident Evil seven ass house and he is like looking you know and so they think maybe the sodiot killer drew the movie posters

but this guy's like but I drew all the movie posters and then he's like come to the basement he goes it's rare for California houses to have basements he goes well mine does so this is very scary but also I think it's the funniest scene it is a very funnesty I think this is camp and I think this is also

something that Fincher does great is have a little funny thing in the middle of like your murder movie. Yeah. I don't know. I, yes. I agree. And I think of...

I did not think it was funny. It was very funny. I was like, this guy's gonna kill him. It's how it felt. It's great. Because this was the second time that I was watching it. And the first time around,

so basically the second time around watching it, I know he's not going to die in the scene. So I was kind of watching it with a little bit more just. Right. I think when you don't know, then it becomes this like incredibly scary scene. For me, I got to rewatch this scene and enjoy it for the comedic, you know, scene that it was, especially at the end when he's trying, he runs out of the basement because he's like, he doesn't want to go anywhere, you know, closer to him because he's like, the dude is like standing by a light bulb. And then he like, he turns it off with all the lights and it's pitch black in the bus. And it's just kind of like, you know, kind of like disappearing and reappearing behind the shit in his basement. It is like, it's the bit in Dracula where he's like, I never drink. Yeah. Why?

Why? It's just like, it's just a whole scene of that. Yes. But then he runs to the front door and he can't get through because it's locked. It's locked from the inside. It's locked from the inside. And then the guy shows up with his key and he opens it up, lets him out. the dude runs away and he's got this little smirk on him where he just says like bye jake jillen hall or whatever his character's name is and there was something really funny about like this guy sort of knowingly fucking fucking fucking fucking fucking fucking fucking fucking fucking he's like he's like i know i'm a little weirdo in a creepy half feeling that this is not the first time that some fucking true crime fanatic trying to solve the fucking zodiac has gone to his place and he gets a kick out of scaring people that's

He's got a lock from the inside. That guy was doing other creepy shit in there, but he just wasn't the Zodiac. Right. He just wasn't the Zodiac. That guy kills people, for sure. I was thinking like, does this just turn into that Hugh Grant movie Heretic at some point?

Yeah. Yeah. I've never seen that. Oh, you must. Oh, you simply must. Heretic's crazy. Put it on the list. You simply must. Put it on the list.

But anyway. But yeah, but also this is just another. It's a road to nowhere. Like, it's not this guy. Right. It's just another. thing that Julian Hall spent amongst of his life chasing. Well, you just start noticing how if you want something to be it, like, Mark Ruffalo's

character has a line where he's like, I don't know if I just wanted him to be it or if I just wanted this to be over. Right. Yeah. And so you could trick your mind into solving the puzzle if you're looking for too much. Yeah, and you're looking for an exit. So, and you realize, because you've been kind of like, this is going on too long, you're starting to do it.

Like, you're starting to look around and go, let's just fucking solve this. Yes. It's probably the squirrel guy. That's what makes... It is the squirrel guy! That's what makes it great filmmaking. It's so cool. Yeah.

Yeah. So that's, it's, we're kind of almost at the end here. We're picking and choosing what we're talking about. But yeah, we're almost kind of at the end. So Jillyn Hall has been right as stopped making cartoons. He's just writing a book. He's just, you know, and we see his wife leave him at some point. And so he starts going after squirrel guy.

He gets another tip that, yeah, it's like he was ambidextrous, so maybe he was writing with the other hand. He goes to, like, stalk him at a hardware store and just like, again, the great needle drops that tell you what decade is. We see him at the hardware store and in the background, we have the saxophone from Baker Street. That's right. Yeah, so good. While he's like staring at this fucking nightmare guy at the, anyway, it's great. The Zodiac Killer. The Zodiac Killer.

So yeah, he writes this book. It becomes a bestseller. And we know that because we see it at an airport. Great little detail to show like how big this book got, but also maybe a little dig at the book too. It's like, eh, it's just at a fuck it. It's an airport. Right.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I thought that was kind of a funny little way to show the book got so successful. And to show that like, you know, what is your, you know, this thing you work so hard on, you sacrificed your family for. and you did it. You got a fucking, you know, a bestseller novel out of it. And where does it end up at a fucking bookstore at the airport? Like, that's what you sacrificed everything for.

And yeah, so then we get kind of a final scene of the someone playing, a different actor playing the kid from the first murder who they want to show him some photos. And it's no one we've really seen before. It's not Ruffalo and it's not Jillen Hall. It's one of the other random cops. And yeah, just, I thought about No Country for Old Men a lot when I was watching this of just like, yeah, they don't give you the story you want. And they don't give you the story that like makes total sense, but it is just kind of random things happening. Anyway, it's not one of the end people, you know, not one of the main characters solving the crime.

But he's showing you, you know, which of these. people is the one that shot you and he points to squirrel guy. And then you just hear that Donovan song again and it's kind of over and they show you some stuff about what happened to the people. That guy, squirrel guy, just died of a heart attack and like, we'll never know. We'll never really know and people will keep making four hour YouTube videos about it. That's right. Thank God because Emily needs to fall asleep to something.

Yeah. I just want to point out that that last guy in the scene where he's the old. version of the kid who survived is one of the Mick Boyle from It's always Sunny in Philadelphia The actor is Jimmy Simpson

Oh right Oh yeah Yeah you might know him from West World First season of West World Yeah he's just really good at playing Very good A scared boy

He's just like he's very good at it The McBoy haircut though that he had Like it just looked like like he came from an always sunny set. Yes, it did. And I was like, I would have done something different to his hair. I don't know.

I'm glad it was the same. It was awesome. Yeah, that's the end of Zodiac. We're going to tell you what we thought of it. But first, you know we got to do the hunk watch. It's hunk watch. A lot of hunks in this movie. A lot of bad brown suits on the hunks.

Right. Everyone's wearing tan suit. Unfortunately for the hunks. Yeah. Okay. The suits. The suits. Brown suits.

Yeah. Any strong opinions about the hunks of the film? Casey Jones. Casey Jones. Yeah. Well, I love me a hot Greek actor. I did look him up and I was like, wait, isn't that the guy from the wire, second season of the wire? Didn't he play the Greek?

And I looked it up and no, it's not that guy. But it is another Greek guy. and so I'm glad I can look at someone and know whether or not they're Greek. What's the name? I've heard of Gaydar, but Greek Dar? I've got Greek Dar straight up. I was like... That sounds like a dragon from Game of Thro.

Greek Darr? That's a good... That's a good ass name for a dragon. I'm not going to lie. Yeah, his name is like Elias. Elias Cotees. Oh, yeah, there we go. Apologies to all Greeks.

Yes. Yeah, no, what am I going to say? He looks Greek, and I was right. He is Greek. Anyways, yeah, that's a good choice. Mine is going to be Mark Ruffalo. I just fucking love Mark Ruffalo. He's great in this movie.

He's a great actor, and I love him. Yeah, I also love Ruffalo on this. Also love Casey Jones and this. And yeah, hey, a little shout out to Brian Cox, and especially fancy Brian Cox. We get gruff asshole Brian Cox a lot, but this is kind of, you know, lush, fancy Brian Cox. Like whimsy.

Whizzy? A little whimsy. There's a third Brian Cox that I think is my fit. Yeah, it's a voiceover for McDonald's commercial. Yeah, guy who likes McDonald's. Guy who likes McDonald's Brian Cox is really fantastic. Dominering asshole. That's right.

And a fancy dandy and guy who likes McDonald's a lot. Yeah. Do you think there's some Orson Wells like Brian Cox, McDonald's? 100% Oh, the McDonald's. French. Yeah, I guess he would say, Oh, the Irish.

A fucking McFlurry. What is a McFlurry? Wow. Yo, that was pretty good. Jordan, that was pretty good. Anyway, add that to your impressions list. I will. Lauren, call me.

You need a 44-year-old guy to play Brian Cox on S&L. Listen, honestly, a behind-the-scenes, like Brian Cox's character doing the McDonald's ads would be that would be. He's drunk off his ass. It's a great idea. It's a good pitch. It's a good pitch.

Do it during your S&L audition. All three of us are very funny people who are writers. That's right. Yeah. Give us jobs. Yeah, help us. Let us work in a little office and get coffee and go to lunch. Oh, coffee and lunch.

Oh, I just want to draw tariffs on a fucking, on a cigar. Can you buy lunch, though? I really need some tender green. We need food. free tender greens. Okay. We're going to tell you what we thought of Zodiac overall when we come back. Hey, we're back.

It's free with ads. We're going to tell you what we thought about Zodiac, but first we want to tell you about our bonus episodes. That's right. It's we like shows. Sting goes here. Yeah. Our episode this week was a blast.

It is on Spider-Nor. the Nicholas Cage starring Spider-Man spin-off show. It was a totally a fun discussion. I finished the show. I think in our discussion of the pilot, we're all like, we all kind of like, we like this, we wish it got a little weirder. It gets weird.

It has some horror stuff in it. Oh, hell, yeah. They let Cage do some like spider ballet dancing. It's a blast. Yeah, I say if you're, if you kind of like the pilot, finish the show, it's awesome. Okay. Here's a little taste

Oh, this is kind of interesting This is a fun little aspect of the show You can watch it in black and white You can watch it in color What did you guys watch it in? Okay, so in like I've done both But I like black and white better because Me too, yeah, I've watched a few episodes in black and white

And a few in color and I think the black and white's a more fun experience Well, they also have kind of a hand-painted backdrop set Kind of mystique kind of thing, aesthetic going on And it feels very, very, old Hollywood and it just looks better in black and white. I agree. I assume it was intended to be watched in black and white. I think so too.

And you know, this is not a, this does not have a movie's budget. So sometimes when they're doing CGI stuff, it looks. It looks like trash. It looks like TV. It looks like shit. Yeah. The three of us can agree that we like style when it comes to CGI. Yes.

You've got a point of view and you have a style. It's not about it looking realistic. Like, you know, but, uh, yeah, no. I'm into it in black and white. It also makes Nicholas Cage's hairpiece more believable. In color, you're like, oh, Lord. I watch clips immediately after of the show in black and white. And I was like, God damn it, this is what I was supposed to do.

Why didn't anyone tell me? Don't give me the option. That's what I say. Stop giving me the option. That's not there. I think the webs are cool in black and white. The web's look kind of cool. It really does.

The action looks amazing. Everything looks better in black and white with this show. super ropey and thick. I think he should see his urologist. But I was... It does. It does. It does. It does. It does.

It's a metaphor for come. Isn't it supposed to be come? I don't know. It's come to me. All right. It's if you choose it. But I told my... They will come.

They will... Yeah. If you choose it, they will come. If you spider, it will come. With great power comes. Great come. Big. Thick ropes.

But I told my parents yesterday that we were going to watch this, and my mom's like, how's this weird hair? That was a clip from our discussion of Spider-Noir. You can hear it by going to maximum fun.org slash join. You become a MaxFund member you get access to all the bonus shows. Emily, you had some Spider-Noir thoughts? Okay. So it seems that people cannot believe that I think that Nicholas Cage's voice

in Spider-Noir is just the voice he has and everything. And I think that's crazy. I think I'm right. I will never back down from this. Okay. But somebody emailed us. Die on the hill, Emily.

Yes. I will, this is the hill right here. This is my hill. There'll be other hills. Yeah. But right now this is the one. It's the current hill.

Somebody emailed and told me to get the corn out of my ears. And I will never forget that phrase and I use it constantly. I love it. Is that a phrase people say? Is that a downhome? Southernism? It sounds like it should be, but I've never heard it in my life,

and now I use it all the time. Gotta be corn out of years. It's got to be an Idaho thing. Yes, that was it. That's potatoes, Matt. Whatever, dude. Sorry. Never, man.

It's all the same. Potato. Idaho. Corn. Yeah. Potato. Who make corn? I don't even know anymore.

Who make corn? Oh, bapado. Bakerfield. Bakersfield. That's where corn from Bakersfield, California. Home of rap, metal, legends, corn. Yes, that was an argument we had.

A spirited discussion in the Spider-N-War episode. Matt and I think Nicholas Cage is doing a goofy detective voice. Emily thinks that's just what he sounds like. That's what he sounds like. What do you think, listener? You got to listen to the episode, maximum fun.org slash join. Okay.

Zodiac 1 to 10 super loud commercials. Matt, I think you have the most interesting take here because you've seen it. You said, maybe you've re-evaluated, so we'll let you close it out. I will go first. Yeah, I was curious about this movie. I was not sure if it would be my cup of tea or not. Again, not a big true crime guy. I think this movie is great.

I think this is a really, really good movie. I like the way in which it kind of messes with your expectations. I like the way it, because, yeah, it's like thinking about the source material. This is a pretty much unsolved murder. People go and say, I mean, you know, I mean, there's four million YouTube videos about it. Like, people are obsessed with this. And it really showed, like, how people got obsessed with this. And it's kind of more about that than who did the actual killing, but also, like, just a fascinating look at this crime that this investigation that went on for years and years and years.

Yeah. And the suspense scenes are, like, so well done. They're terrifying, like, scarier than anything that would be, you know, just like hereditary level, scary scenes for the murders. Yeah, I think it's a great movie. Yeah, I'm gonna, I'm gonna say, what am I gonna do? I'm gonna give this a nine.

I think this is a really, really terrific movie. Yeah, Emily, what you think? I loved this a lot. And I was glad how long it was. That's like the first time a movie is, I'm like, I'm so glad there's more of it. Yeah. It's, you know, I think the length is a feature and a bug,

too. I think it needs to be this long, but also it is occasionally annoying how long it is. Anyway, what were you saying? Well, did Fincher do Mind Hunter the series? I produced it. On Netflix? Oh, he produced it. Okay. Well, you know, Mind Hunter, it's like, I wish there was more episodes and then this is like, oh, this is very satisfying. If you're pissed that, you know, Mind Hunter isn't still going, I feel like watch this movie. I don't know. I know that I agree that true crime. is icky if you are focusing on the like the disturbing nature of the crimes themselves but this was

more about to me how media can fucking muddy the truth and actually like solving something and how if you become obsessed and everybody wants to everybody wants to be the one who discovers a thing instead of all helping you know I don't know it it was like the zodiac was so obsessed with fame that's why he feels like a YouTuber. It's like, you know, and so then everybody started feeling like they were a hero or something. I don't know. It was, I loved the obsession with media throughout the movie and how it like he was able to manipulate people because of it. Yeah.

It's like he became a serial killer just to be in the media. It was so interesting to me. Also, you were talking about the planes, like airport books. My favorite thing about this movie is it's hard to tell what time period it is because the, like, you know, transportation, automotive design has been the same forever. The airplane from the 70s looks exactly like a Southwest flight today. Yeah, that's because they keep using same planes. That's a real thing fucking plane.

They'll, they change the seats. But the windows are the same. Yes, yes, it's crazy. And even the seats, do you ever go on a plane and there's a fucking ashtray there? And you're just like, that's in the bathroom. And like, sometimes. There used to be ashtrays that were just. just welded shut on the sides of the fucking like plane seat and I was like why is there an ashtray

you're not allowed to smoke and I was like well there was a time when America was great so there was like this you know there was a murder in a taxi cab like that's right towards the beginning and the cab from that shot looks almost the same as the cab like a decade later and so I'm like this idea of time in this movie yeah in terms of cars and planes was so interesting to me yeah so I feel like having that in the airport, I was like, this is, this case is frozen in time. Yeah, yeah. As are our airplanes. Is that good?

It's a nine for me, dog. It was really good. I loved it. Matt, what did you think after not loving it on your first view? What did you think of it this time? Upon review, a little bit older, a little bit wiser, a little bit more, you know, podcast-brained. realizing I needed to watch it in order to talk about it on a podcast, which is how I watch movies now.

I liked it a lot more. This movie, I think, like I said, the first time I saw it, it turned me off because I just thought it was exploitative and gratuitous. I was just so disturbed by that scene. Then having realized the accuracy of the scene and the, the painstaking accuracy of the murder scenes in general of this movie and trying to get everything right. I read it as sort of more of a critique on the way in which murders like this, especially serial killer murders and whatnot, are exploited. It's a critique on it. It is not doing it for

the sake of gratuitous violence. It is showing the actual violence and showing all of the different leach is feeding off of that violence, not just, you know, monetarily, but also, you know, people who, you know, want to solve it, you know, for, yes, the purpose of money, but also for the purpose of their own sanity as if they could solve it, then the world will finally make sense. Ooh, you said it way better than I did. That was just cut out everything I said. No, no, everything you said was good too. But yeah, it's the movie, for some reason this time around, I was able to actually sit and watch it for what I think was intended to be.

And I was much more impressed. That said, it was a little bit long. And I understand that it needed to be that long because it also needs you to take, you know, wrong turns and go down blind alleys and, you know, reach a dead end. but there's something I have a general distaste for movie that's like no you're suffering right now because you're supposed to suffer Yeah I know I know that's I agree with that

It's a copy But I'm watching a movie It's two Passover sater plate for me Where it's just like no you got to drink the salt water Because it's like the tears of our ancestors Like why do I need to suffer Why don't I can just read about it Anyways I'm gonna give it a nine as well

I really really really liked it Very good movie All right Anybody got any plugs? Oh, plugs. When does this come out? Next week. I don't have the episode out by then.

So I have nothing. Okay. Nothing. Hey, if you're listening to this, the week it comes out, I will be at Comic Con in San Diego on Friday and Saturday, the 24th and 25th.

Check out my social media. I'm there on Blue Sky and Instagram. I'll have all the stuff times, locations, that sort of thing, come out and say hi. Would love to see any free with ads listeners there. I have a little stash of free with ads and max fun, stickers and pins and stuff. So if you come up to me and you say you like the show, I got a free sticker pin or something for you while supplies last. And yeah, my new comics miniseries, The Amazing Venom with artist Luke Ross, is coming in September if you want to pre-order.

signed copies for you in the mail. Go to bit. l.Y slash govrens. That's right, bit. L.Y slash goo friends to get those issues for you in the mail. Here's a connection. Mark Ruffalo played the Hulk in The Amazing Venom. We have a Hulk.

Not going to say which one. Oh, yeah. We got a Hulk. Make it for Rigno, please. Oh, I'm not telling. I'm not telling which one. You gotta read. Dig it.

Dot L-Y slash goo friends or tell your local comic bookshop you want the amazing venom. Okay. Next week, the end of Jew Library, this most blessed of months where we will be watching a movie very tonally similar to Zodiac. Yes, we will be watching Mouse Hunt. Bye. Maximum Fun. A worker-owned network of artists-owned shows. Supported directly by you.