Fresh Air - Alex Van Halen / Selena Gomez

Episode Date: January 2, 2025

We continue our series featuring some of our favorite interviews from 2024, this time with Alex Van Halen and Selena Gomez. Alex Van Halen talks about his life and the career he built with his late brother Eddie, and the formation of their band Van Halen. From growing up as immigrant kids in California, to the wild antics of life on the road as rock stars and some of his stunts, like setting his drums on fire.Selena Gomez talks about her role in the Spanish-language musical film Emilia Pérez, where she stars as the wife of a brutal drug cartel boss. We talk about the evolution of her career, from a Disney kid to a pop star.Learn more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

This is Fresh Air, I'm Tanya Mosley. Today we continue our series featuring interviews from 2024, this time with Selena Gomez and Alex Van Halen. ["Rolling in the Rain"] Along with his late brother, Eddie, Alex is a founding member of the rock band Van Halen. Known for their extravagant high energy performances, Van Halen is credited with being one of the most influential rock bands of all time. In a memoir published this year called Brothers, Alex charts both he and Eddie's life and

music career, from their arrival to the United States from the Netherlands as kids, to the influence of their father, who was a Dutch jazz musician, and the formation of the rock band in 1974, after meeting vocalist David Lee Roth and bassist Michael Anthony. But mostly, Brothers is a love letter to the music they created and to Eddie, who has been called for decades one of the greatest guitarists of all time. Van Halen disbanded after Eddie died in 2020, but throughout their run, Van Halen produced 12 studio albums, four compilation albums, two live records, and 56 singles. They were inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame in 2007.

Alex Van Halen, welcome to Fresh Air. Thank you for having me. Alex, music was in your blood because your dad was a jazz musician, so you were watching him while you guys were also performing yourselves. What was your earliest recollection of doing gigs? The first thing we wanted to do is put a band together. I think the first band we did put together was a band called The Broken Combs, which was I played sax and Ed played piano,

had two other guys in there, and we managed to play for the school functions. It was a good lesson for the school functions. And it was a good lesson for us as well. You knew what kind of music that you wanted to play as soon as you experienced rock. You experienced, you guys, like so many teenagers during that time period, it was the British Invasion, it was the Beatles.

Also a lesser known group called the Dave Clark Five. Bingo. I'm glad you mentioned that. It was those guys. They were really what we thought was the epitome of that kind of music at the time. What was it about them that blew your mind? They had a grungy sound that the saxophone provided. And because I think maybe somewhere in our psyche, because our dad played saxophone,

it was deeper in our DNA. But it's a good thing we didn't bet on anything and that we weren't financial advisors because you would have bet on the wrong horse. But yeah, so when the Beatles came, the talent and the music that came out was unmatched. I mean, there were a lot of bands around, a lot of from Herman's Hurwitz to The Seeds, you name it, I can't even name them all. But the Beatles clearly were a notch above all that. And that appealed to us.

I'm really interested, though, in how you and Eddie came to your instruments because at first the guitar was your instrument, right? How did it become Eddie's? I was taught very strict and very by the book. You learn to read, you learn the chords, you listen to the classical music and all that. But I had no connection with the instrument. I just wasn't, I hate to use the old expression, I just wasn't feeling it, right? So, and there's this story about

Ed doing papers and that I became better than him, it's not quite how it happened, but the fact was when Ed played, he made that instrument sing. It was unbelievable. I'm going, Ed, you're playing guitar. I want drums. Besides, Dave Clark V was my idol and he was the drummer. So, but again, it was on a serious note, when Ed played the guitar, he made it sing. I want us to play a little bit of Eddie on his guitar. 1986, peak Van Halen. This is live in New Haven. The crowd is electric and we see your brother in all of his glory at the top of his powers as a guitarist. He gets up there and I think it's like a 12-minute guitar solo called Eruption. Let's play a little bit of it. That was the late Eddie Van Halen playing a solo of Corruption.

The one and only. That entire performance, Alex, is mesmerizing. I mean, Eddie looks like he's having the time of his life. That's because he is. He played guitar from the moment he woke up to the moment he went to sleep. And it was just his way of either communicating or finding peace with himself on the earth. I don't know. And I'm certainly not going to stop him while he's getting better and better every day. The problem with Ed was he could play anything. So the most difficult thing for him was to find his own voice. And he spent a lot of time

doing it. Then when he finally found it, that was it. Big smile. Alex, you wrote about David Lee Roth, the lead singer. You said this, the bottom line is that Dave desperately wanted to be an artist, but something was always missing. He could never really feel the music. He didn't get the part

where you need to resonate with something deeper, something like the eternal force of the universe. That was like a very powerful thing to say about your lead man, because his showmanship also seemed to provide something that you and your brother needed, and that was this front man, because seemed to provide something that you and your brother needed and that was this front man because absolutely weren't going to shows just to see instrumentalist play during that time period. So first off you and your brother met David Lee Roth very young. I mean you all basically started the group together. It was David who came up with the name Van Halen. Yeah you know was. Yeah. You know, I was probably overthinking it, but I thought he was trying to curry a favor with us. And I figured, so the first thing was I fought

it. Now you can't name the Van Halen. But eventually it took. And of course, Gene Simmons said, you can't use that name. It sounds like a shirt company, like a band using. Well, Gene Simmons from Kiss, he's famously credited with discovering you guys. I mean, and to put this time period in perspective, this was right as MTV was starting. This was right as the visual part of it was coming into play for us where expectation was there.

So I can imagine that was part of the conflict too, right? You know, if you watch the bands and see how they progress, even Led Zeppelin was using explosions. Okay? So when the guys are the highest of form of the food chain, when they do it, it's okay. It's now become part of the language of rock and roll. And why fight it? Okay, bring on the flashpots

Well, I get the sense that before David Lee Roth joined you guys that you and Eddie would have been fine doing sets And t-shirts and jeans because you were about the music and he was about the show Right. What were some of the things that David would push you guys to do? It wasn't so much pushing us and there was more we needed something the show. And what were some of the things that David would push you guys to do to be showmen? It wasn't so much pushing us. It was more we needed something, we needed someone to get us off our ass because we knew we had to do it. But we're waiting for the last minute possible to have to do it. Because to dress up for a gig, that's not your back to playing with suits on or whatever. a gig, I mean that's not your back to playing with suits on or whatever. That was how I saw it. Rock and roll is supposed to be about freedom, about you just show up and play,

right? But when you're in the thick of it, when you're on Sunset Boulevard and you're walking down Hollywood Boulevard, you're walking down anywhere in Hollywood at that time, there is a whole rainbow of colors and styles. There was a band called Zolar X, and they dressed as space guys. It was mind-bending. Their image was so overpowering, why would even one listen to the music? Who cares? That was my read on it.

Now, because we were all very opinionated, we fought it out until somebody came up with the right solution. And that's basically the process. How did you get the idea to set your drums on fire as part of your act? There were a number of people at that time who tried different versions of it. I've always been fascinated by fire because for me, fire represents the temporariness, is that a word? Only the moment counts. I mean, the flame is there and poof, it's gone. So is life, right? So to me, that represented that. And there was an element

of danger because we did it on such an amateur level that any given night when we did it, if my drum tech, Greg, an old buddy of mine, if he put too much stuff on it, it would leak. And there were several times when... What do you mean by stuff? Like gas? Oh, yeah, lighter fluid. Yeah. Lighter fluid? Yeah. My favorite memory of all of that was we kind of got down to a science and as we're doing it during the performance, the lighter fluid starts to come down my arm and then I look over

and I notice my arm's on fire. So I'm thinking that can't be good, right? So I look at Greg, who's, you know, in theory, he's there with a fire extinguisher so he can So I look at him and he's looking at me and he gives me the thumbs up looks great, man I'll never forget that as long as I live Greg. I love you. But man put that damn fire Wait, did he do you have burns? What's going on? Yeah, we had but it was very low-ditch. We just used lighter fluid and you put a match to it and poof, there it goes. It's very uncontrollable.

You're taking a risk every night. But, you know, we were young, so it's okay. We're all right. Did you end up having to get new drum sets every time? I mean, how did that work? No, actually, it wasn't until the end of the tour I got slapped with like, I don't know how much. All the microphones and the cords were fried and nobody told me that when we were doing it.

The drum set itself was made out of stainless steel. Ludwig was very accommodating. They made a stainless steel drum cut for me. It wasn't the only one, but they gave it to me. And it really goes to show you how at that age, you know, you don't really, the stuff doesn't really register in your brain. It turns out that the average male brain does not completely mature until the age of 27. I'm still waiting. Hot for Teacher was a song from your album 1984.

It's one of Rolling Stone magazine's, it was on their list saying that this was the album that brought Van Halen's talent into focus. Let's play a little of Hot for Teacher. I'm gonna be a good boy Oh wow, man. Wait a second, man. What do you think the teacher's gonna look like this year? Whoa! Oh, yeah! Teacher, teacher, stop that screaming!

Teacher, don't you see? Don't wanna be no uptown fool! That was Van Halen's Hot for Teacher from the album 1984. Also humor is a big part of your act. I wanted to say that. I mean, I know we've been talking about it not being an act. It's who you are, but yes. Yes.

But this album overall was pioneering because there's a lot of synth, which was a new sound back then. Yes. And we were always looking for the next, what's around the corner, and we heard a lot of synthesizer music. It was all this progressive rock stuff, you know, whether it was Mahavishnu or Billy Cobham,

and there were a number of people who used that sound quality, if you will. One of the things that you like to make the point of is that you all aren't heavy metal even though you're put in that category. Yes because heavy metal, I love heavy metal but because we had a lot of different influences so we had to look for because people like labels and it was very difficult to find a label that would define us. Not that we needed definition.

But you know, the irony of all of it was when rock and roll, which was originally rebellion, became structured and organized. What the hell is that? Right, right. I mean, did you, you watch Spinal Tap, right? Oh yeah, yeah. That wasn't funny at all. Why wasn't it funny? Well, Ed and I saw it and we said, man, that's how, that's't funny at all. That was the real deal. Why wasn't it funny? Well, when Ed and I saw it and we said, man, that's what we experienced.

That is really how things happen. It's mind-bending. The public doesn't really have any idea what goes on behind the scenes, and I'm certainly not going to burst a bubble, but that movie, there were a lot of elements that were more true than they were parody. And of course, then they believed their own stuff and they went out and toured.

You and Eddie famously for a long time never recorded any music without each other, until a request from Quincy Jones for a little known song called Beat It. Let's listen. That was a solo. I'm lucky the strongest can fight it. It doesn't matter. We're stronger than the rest. That was a solo Eddie did on the iconic song, Beat It, by Michael Jackson. And Alex, I think it was on the charts the same time as 1984, if I'm not. Yeah. Yeah, it was.

Yeah, why do you think Eddie went and did that without consulting you guys? If I remember, he did consult and we said, no. What are you going to do? I'm not going to make something. We really did not overthink anything, but I did want to kick his ass. Because our model was basically Led Zeppelin. The way that they structured their business, the way they structured how they played, who they played with. Led Zeppelin was Led Zeppelin. The way that they structured their business, the way they structured how they played, who they played with, Led Zeppelin was Led Zeppelin. You couldn't get

Jimmy Page anywhere else. You can only get him on Led Zeppelin. Come to the show. That's it. You don't get him with Michael Jackson. You don't get him with so-and-so. But Ed violated that and it started a whole cascade of these bad, bad vibes. And it was the beginning of the end for you guys as a unit. In all fairness, it really was not the single thing because things were already starting to unravel. When we named the album 1984, it had nothing to do with the year.

It had to do with George Orwell and the dystopia of what was going on. This band was so fractured. You know, we barely ever played together anymore. And unfortunately, MTV became the predominant way of conveying all this, and Dave being the visual guy, naturally opted for more visual stuff. I don't blame him for any of it, but you know, it's just too bad because we were on the cusp of something really, really big. Ed, going and doing this song with Michael Jackson, if you guys had always said you wanted to be Led Zeppelin,

what do you think it was that made him say, I want to do this anyway? I don't know. There's some aspects of his behavior, or even to me, a mystery. I just have to say to you, Alex, it also opened up another world to you guys. I mean, I'm a little black girl in Detroit hearing that little solo from Van Halen, and

it introduced me to you. That was the argument that a couple other people make, but I tell you, I don't buy it. My suggestion would have been put Michael on our record. Okay? Then you got something. And people will say, are you out of your mind? Well, you can have guest people on your records. But am I angry? Of course not.

You know, that's just posturing. That's what you do to your brother and your bandmates. You know, nobody fights better than friends. Alex Van Halen, this was such a pleasure. Thank you so much. It was my pleasure. My interview with Alex Van Halen was recorded in October when he published his memoir, Brothers. Alex and his late brother Eddie were founding members of the rock band Van Halen.

After a short break, we'll hear my conversation with actor, singer, and entrepreneur Selena Gomez, who stars in the Netflix Spanish-language film, Amelia Perez, and the Hulu comedy series Only Murders in the Building, which have both received multiple Golden Globe nominations. I'm Tonya Mosley, and this is Fresh Air. I live my life like there's no tomorrow And all I've got, I had yet to steal I'm living at a place like you. Ooh, yeah. Running with the devil. Ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh,

ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, Hey, it's Tanya Mosley. It's almost the end of the year, and this is the season when we here at NPR come to you as a nonprofit news organization and ask for your support. Maybe you're already an NPR Plus supporter, and if so, thank you so much. But if you've never given to public media before, or not in a while, please consider it now, because supporting public radio is a great way to show what matters to you. You want to stay informed about what's going on in your community and around the world. You want to know where to turn for information you can trust and to hear perspectives that challenge your opinions.

And believe me, I get it. Sometimes you wanna tune out from the news and just hear about the beautiful things in life, like artists, musicians, and actors who bring us joy, whose work can also challenge us. NPR gives you that space to experience all of it. The Fresh Air team is like a cultural machine. We love spending our time following investigative journalists who are covering important issues,

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This is Fresh Air. I'm Tanya Mosley. The Netflix Spanish language musical film, Amelia Perez, centers on a drug cartel leader who decides to undergo gender affirmation surgery and start a new life with a new identity as Amelia Perez. My guest, Selena Gomez, stars as Jessi Del Monte, the wife who is forced to start a new life of her own after her husband disappears. The film is almost entirely in Spanish, and in preparation for the role, Gomez had to

brush up on her Spanish after losing fluency as a kid once she started acting. Emilia Perez leads in the Golden Globe film categories with 10 total nominations, including Best Motion Picture, Musical or Comedy, and Best Supporting Actress in a Motion Picture for Gomez. Gomez got her start in acting at 10 years old when she was on the television series Barney and Friends. She went on to star in several Disney shows before her breakout role in the series The

Wizards of Waverly Place. Since 2021, she has starred alongside Steve Martin and Martin Short as true crime enthusiasts turned podcasters and crime solvers in the Hulu comedy series Only Murders in the Building. The series is currently nominated for three Golden Globe Awards, including Best Actress in a Musical or Comedy TV Series for Gomez. Gomez is also a two-time Grammy-nominated musician. She's had 16 consecutive top 40 hits on the Billboard Hot 100, the longest active run of any artist.

My interview with Selena Gomez was recorded in November. Selena Gomez, welcome to Fresh Air. Thank you. That was such a lovely introduction. Let's talk a little bit about the themes in the movie. She's looking for freedom because she's married to this very brutal drug kingpin. And so all the things that go along with that life, she has two children by him. It's not explicitly said, but it seems as if maybe she got married when she was very

young to him. That's correct. There's a transformation with your husband from male to female, but there's also a transformation of this character. She's like a dormant volcano of a wife. And I wanna play a clip, and this clip I'm about to play. It's several years after her husband has had the transition, she thinks he's dead, she goes back to Mexico

and she connects with a man who really is the love of her life. And in this scene, the two of you, this man, you and this man, you all are in a club and you're singing the song Mi Camino. Let's listen. I'm in pain It's my pain If I'm sent to the seventh heaven It's my heaven If I'm wrong, I'll walk the same way When I go out

A lot of party When I behave like a... Cuando me porto como una p*** Cuando soy la señora perfecta Cuando digo si para decir no Quiero, quiero That's my guest, Selena Gomez, singing the song Mica Meno in the musical film Amelia Perez. Okay, Selena, this is a liberation song. It is.

It's so beautiful. I'm so proud of it. The words, I'm going to read a little bit of the words in English. If I fall into the ravine, it's my ravine. If I double the pain, it's my pain. If I send myself to the seventh heaven, it's my heaven. If I lose my way, it's still mine. I wanna love myself.

It's a liberation song. And to me, without like being too sappy about it, I feel like it sounds familiar to your life path. Do you see that? Yeah, actually I do. It's, it was one of the most emotional songs that I got to record during the process of shooting this movie.

And I remember just singing it and thinking to myself, this could have been my song, you know, this could have been a, you know, me song on an album I would put out personally because it's so well said and it feels very true to who I am, to where I am. I think that when I do make mistakes, I don't feel like I should or necessarily need to be punished for them. It's something that I feel like I need to grow and learn from.

And I think that sometimes there's been moments in my career where people weren't allowing me to grow up. They weren't allowing me to make choices that wasn't exactly what they thought I should be doing. Acting, as you said, has always been your first love. We're gonna get into some things like, I can't believe Girl Interrupted is one of the first films you saw. Like, what? I'm sorry, Bob.

I know. Sorry, Bob. Yeah, no, my mom was, you saw, like what? I'm sorry, Bob. I know. Sorry, Bob. Yeah, no, my mom was, you know, she was so just, I just remember feeling like she was the coolest person ever. She's still cool, but as a kid, I looked up to her so much. But she kind of was, I mean, she was 16 when she had you, so she was a young mom. Oh yeah, we were like sisters in a way. And she loved everything about art.

And I remember sometimes she would let me watch things, but she would do the old cover your ears nice, like be careful. And so yeah, she was young, maybe I shouldn't have watched some of the things I did. However, I think I fell in love with it for the right reason. So it was a whole range of different styles. And we'd watch, you know, French films or we'd watch anything

that kind of sparked something in my mom. And she would explain things to me and I would always ask questions and I was inquisitive about the work and it wasn't just an experience for me. I wanted to know everything and I think that's where it kind of stemmed from. Do you remember the first time you were on stage or first performance? Yeah, the funny thing is, is I wasn't in any school plays necessarily. I was seven when I auditioned for Barney, which is the big purple dinosaur, if people don't remember.

But I was in line. It was 1,400 kids. And it was in Texas. And I waited in line for a while. And I just thought, here's while, and I just thought, here's my chance. I could do something really cool. You thought that in the moment.

Yeah. I just thought, this is something I really want to do, and I hope I get it. And I went to three rounds of callbacks. They were very serious about that. I had a barney back in the day. And I got the part and it would have to be the first time I stepped foot on the set of Barney.

It was magical, not to mention I'm seven and they make it for kids, you know, they make it this beautiful experience and the sets are gorgeous. I just got the bug immediately. I had school there as well, a bunch of kids I got to grow up with. And at the same time, maybe Barney taught me how to clean and how to say I love you. Right, because you're taking in all the lessons that you all are teaching us to. Totally. Acting is your first love.

Music is also what you are known for worldwide. Huge fan base. You've called it a hobby that kind of got out of control. Yeah, and I think I need to correct that because I think whenever I do interviews that are written, I think it's very challenging for me because it gets a little misunderstood. Music is going to forever be a part of my soul. I was named after a Tejano singer.

My dad was a DJ. My mom listened to Frank Sinatra, Ella Fitzgerald, Patsy Cline, Dolly Parton, Bonnie Raitt. Like, I grew up around music and every genre. So what I meant by that was it did kind of, you know, take over for a while. And it's not that I was upset or bothered by it. It was more so that I had missed and I was really craving something different. I just really missed being on a

set and creating content that had nothing to do with me. We're listening to the interview I recorded with actor and singer Selena Gomez in November. She's nominated for two Golden Globe Awards for her performances in the Netflix musical film Amelia Perez and the Hulu comedy series Only Murders in the Building. More of our conversation after a break. This is Fresh Air. This is Fresh Air. Let's get back to my interview with actor and singer Selena Gomez.

She's nominated for a Golden Globe Award for her role in the film Amelia Perez. The film is nominated for a total of 10 Golden Globes. The award ceremony is on Sunday. Well, for those who don't watch it, Only Murders in the Building, the Hulu series, is centered on you, Martin Short and Steve Martin. You guys are a trio of residents in this really beautiful Upper West Side apartment building

called the Arconia and you set out to investigate a string of murders in the building and start a true crime podcast to chronicle the investigation. Martin Short has said like in all of the interviews just how much fun you guys have on the set. He alludes it to being kind of exceptional in that way. What makes it fun? Well, first off, Steve Martin and Martin Short are legends in their own right. And it is very difficult to keep a straight face when you're talking to them about anything

because they simply exude and radiate comedy. How do you do it? Because you're the straight man of the three. I know, but I mean, I just have to, I got to get through it. You know, once we do the table read and they'll chime in, it's, it is challenging. But I think the best part of all my murders is the environment. And I think that's what Marty is referring to, because these two actors who have been working longer than I've been alive are always on time, could not be more compassionate and kind to everyone.

Class act, intelligence, their humor is smart and wise. And they'll sit down and talk to, you know, our camera guy and ask how his daughter's doing. It just, to me, was a very good place for me to start back into acting. It just was safe and it was so fun and they made it feel like it was, they just made it feel like it was home. I want to play a clip from season one. So you all live in the same apartment and you don't really know each other that well, but you're starting to come into this idea

that something really fishy is happening. Here, your character, Mabel, is joining the two others in Oliver's apartment, and Oliver is played by Martin Short, and Charles is played by Steve Martin. Let's listen. Oh, how did you get here? It was open.

I don't lock my door. Never have. That's insane. Neighborly. I mean, a murderer probably lives in the building. But I guess old white guys are only afraid of colon cancer and societal change. Sad.

A murderer doesn't probably live in the building. A murderer definitely lives in the building. Lester checked all the security footage, and no one unknown to him came in or out during the hours around Tim's murder. Isn't that great for the podcast? So, Mabel, tell us, did you learn anything from the online world of Tim Kono? He didn't post much in his online world. He seems to have had a really sad, quiet life.

You checked all the websites. Yep, all the websites. Well, we've exhausted the internet. That's my guest Selena Gomez with Martin Short and Steve Martin in the very popular Hulu series Only Murders in the Building. Selena, there's such a tenderness to your relationships with those guys that seems like it's only grown over the seasons. I was watching, I think I saw you and Martin Short on a TV show recently, and you were showing him

how to put on makeup from your rear beauty line. And it felt natural and connected, like you all are your friends. Yes. And it's an absolute joy. They'll joke and laugh and say, oh, we didn't know what to expect when we met Selena. But I don't know, by the first week of us working together, they really took me under their wing.

They didn't make me feel separate because I was younger. They made me feel incredibly included. If they would change a joke or want to try something different, they would always incorporate me into the conversation. And they respected me. And I felt safe, you know. These are gentlemen that want nothing from me but to have a great experience at work and create bonds with everybody on set. And they disarm people by their kindness. So yeah, I've done interviews or I've been upset on days of working if I got bad news and they're protective, they listen, they give great advice. That's something I'll cherish. It could have been totally different. It could have been, you know, hard to connect,

but they are genuinely wonderful people. And it's just been a huge blessing because I get emotional thinking about it because I really do love them and they care about me a lot. Meryl Streep starred in season three and you mentioned how in awe you were those first days on the set. What did you learn working with her? Class act. Absolute class act. I always tell this story about her because I think it just sums who she is up really well. She was on set and because of course she's Meryl, we wanted to shoot her out so that she would have a shorter day

out of respect for her and her schedule. So we would shoot her scenes and then we could say, okay, you can go home and someone would, you know, replace her and they would do the other actors. She refused. She said, no, I'm staying for all the actors. And it was probably 13 hours that she was on that set and the camera wasn't on her once. And she was thrilled to be there. She was so communicative to everyone.

She would walk around barefoot, humming music, listening to folk music. She doesn't take herself too seriously. You know, she's something, she read a comment about something that said that she was overrated and she laughed and she was, well, maybe they're right. She just has a good sense of humor about the icon that she is and she doesn't look at herself that way.

And I like that. We're listening to the interview I recorded with actor Selena Gomez in November. She's currently nominated for two Golden Globe Awards for her performances in the Spanish language musical film, Amelia Perez, and the comedy TV series Only Murders in the Building. More of our conversation after a break. This is Fresh Air. This is Fresh Air. Let's get back to my interview with actor and singer Selena Gomez.

She stars in the Spanish language film Amelia Perez, which is nominated for 10 Golden Globe Awards. Gomez is nominated for Best Supporting Actress in a Motion Picture. You're 32 years old, right? Yes. And you have so many firsts. Mm-hmm. And your first, not only, mentioned the Billboard 100, you also were one of the ten highest paid children TV stars of all time.

Oh, that one's not on your list of like your firsts. But your role on the Disney show Wizards of Waverly, I got the sense from your 2022 documentary, My Mind and Me, that you have kind of a complicated relationship with your Disney years, that it made you feel like a product. In what ways did it feel like that? I think during the period I was shooting the documentary, the context of what I felt was unfair is that I don't regret or dislike Disney. I think Disney gave me my platform and I will forever owe them for that

because I was able to do incredible things. Doesn't mean that I wasn't frustrated with other people. So my frustration is not necessarily ever been with Disney. It's just been with the idea that people would not take anything I was saying, not seriously. If it was me talking about philanthropy, if it was me wanting to talk about something important, it was, do you like marshmallows? And, you know, so you were on Disney. And it's like they just, it just felt so crippling. And I, at that point

when I shot the documentary, hadn't moved on into doing other things. So I just was a little frustrated. I had a chance to talk with Tyler James Williams a few months ago, another child actor who has gone on to do great things. And like you, he says like he really couldn't imagine himself doing anything else in life from a very young age. He knew that was what he wanted. But he also talked about some of the dark sides of being a child actor. And he survived because of his parents, he says. He feels like though this is an industry that is not really for children, that it eats them up and spits them out. You have been able to have a successful career

and he finds, I just wanna say, he said, he thinks that anyone who has come out of it whole is a success, even if you're not in show business. And- I thought that's very nice. Yeah, I wanna know how you feel about that because it seems that folks like Tyler have a complicated relationship with even the use of children in Hollywood.

Yeah, I mean, I think my perspective goes both ways. I think that there is a point in your life where you have to just, you have to let yourself be a kid. And I think the dark sides that, you know, I would reflect on is the fact that I couldn't have a private life. I couldn't necessarily do things because I was held to a specific standard of like, you know, I'm a Disney kid and children look up to me and and all of that stuff was really difficult. I just, I don't want to necessarily, I guess I'm just trying to think about this because I know that there are incredible actors that have come out of this whole industry. But I think you can say that about anything sometimes. I guess what I'd say is I am actually

glad that my sister doesn't want to do that right now at least. I just think it is pretty dangerous. You're around adults, people say things, people do things that maybe you just shouldn't be exposed to. And the moment I first started experiencing fame, it wasn't something that I thought was cool. It got really weird for me. It felt uncomfortable. I remember being 15 at the beach with my family, and it was one of the first times there were, like,

five grown men taking photographs of me coming out of the water, and I was sitting there, and my stepdad got really upset because something seems extremely wrong with that underage. And so I just, to me, that's the stuff that I don't think is right. And I just, it threw me off for a bit. But it sounds like your mother, your family, protected you. They did.

And here's the thing, my parents did the best with what they got. And they were 16 and 15. And they did their best. And it wasn't always perfect, but they, especially my mom and my stepdad, specifically made sure that they held up these boundaries that sometimes I'd get mad at, but they were necessary. For example, you're inviting kids to this beautiful premiere and they're walking the carpet and experiencing all this attention

and that can be overwhelming. Then I have the after party and that's when kids can come and all the adults start drinking and all the all the stuff starts going on. At a very young age my mom said you're there to walk the carpet for your job but then you're going home. And I'd always say well they're gonna stay and my other friends get to stay. She said you're not old enough. When you're old enough you'll go to the parties and have all the fun but right now you're going home and you can invite a friend over and just be watch a movie.

You know and I I do have to say she was very good at that stuff. And sorry I'll just add and in rooms. My mom never let me go into any room without her. You mean like an audition room or a room to practice or a room to- Room for like meetings, room for anything. Not necessarily auditions, but I did a lot on tape. So, but she was right by the door. My mom was very protective of me in the best possible way.

And though maybe it didn't make much sense to me then, I could not be more grateful now. Yeah. Selena Gomez, this has been such a pleasure to talk with you. It's been so nice. My interview with Selena Gomez was recorded in November. She's nominated for two Golden Globe Awards for best supporting actress in the Spanish musical film Amelia Perez and for best actress in the TV series Only Murders in the Building. The Golden Globes are on Sunday and the ceremony will be hosted by comic Nikki Glaser. She's known for her scathing jokes at celebrity roasts, including the roast of Tom Brady, which made headlines.

Tomorrow, to end our series of our favorite interviews of 2024, we'll listen back to Terry's interview with Glaser. I hope you can join us. And if you'd like to catch up on interviews you missed this week, like our conversations with actors Mark Ruffalo and Sterling K. Brown,

or the first part of our program Remembering Jimmy Carter check out our podcast. You'll find lots of fresh air interviews Our interviews and reviews are produced and edited by Phyllis Myers and Marie Valdonado Sam Brigger Lauren Krenzel, Teresa Madden, Monique Nazareth, Thea Challener, Susan Gnocchendi, and Anna Baumann. Our digital media producer is Molly C.B. Nesbur. With Terry Gross, I'm Tonya Mosley.