Fresh Air - Taraji P. Henson On 'The Color Purple'

Episode Date: December 18, 2023

This Christmas, the film adaptation of the musical The Color Purple hits the big screen. For award-winning actress Taraji P. Henson, starring as Shug Avery in the American classic is a full circle moment. Henson first saw Steven Spielberg's film version as a high schooler in D.C., and knew from then on that she wanted to be an actor. "I just remember going to the movies, seeing all those Black people on the screen and I was like, 'Oh my God. I want to do that.' " She spoke with Tonya Mosley about the musical, playing Cookie on Empire, and how her acting training at Howard prepared her for Hollywood.Also, rock critic Ken Tucker reviews two new Christmas albums.Learn more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

This is Fresh Air. I'm Tanya Mosley. This Christmas, the film adaptation of the musical The Color Purple hits the big screen, and for award-winning actress Taraji P. Henson, starring in the American classic is a full-circle moment. Henson first saw Steven Spielberg's film version as a high schooler in D.C. and knew from then on that she wanted to be an actor. I just remember going to the movie seeing all of those Black people on the screen, and I was like, oh my God, I really want to do that. The Color Purple, which was first a Pulitzer Prize novel written by Alice Walker in 1982,

tells the tale of the lifelong struggles of Celie, an African-American woman living in the South during the early 1900s, and the sisterhood of three women. She stars as Suge Avery, a jazz singer who becomes the confidant of the main character, Celie, played by Fantasia Barrino. In addition to the book and the film, The Color Purple also ran on Broadway in 2005 and in 2015, garnering two Tony Awards.

This latest film adaptation features an ensemble cast that includes Danielle Brooks, Coleman Domingo, Ciara, Anjanue Ellis, John Patiste, Louis Gossett Jr., and David Alan Greer. Henson has starred in many movies, including The Curious Case of Benjamin Button, for which she was nominated for an Academy Award. Other movies include Hidden Figures,

John Singleton's 2001 film Baby Boy, and the 2005 film Hustle and Flow. Henson is also known for taking on the role of Cookie Lyons, the wife of a former drug dealer turned hip-hop mogul on the TV series Empire. Taraji P. Henson, welcome to Fresh Air. Thanks for having me. We get to hear you sing in this film. I mean, you really sing.

Thank you. I want to play a clip of you belting it out. You play the singer Suge Avery singing the iconic song, Push the Button. And to set the scene, you're entertaining a packed club wearing a red sequined showgirl outfit, matching headpiece and a fur stall, and you are commanding the crowd. Let's listen. Now there's something about good loving that all you ladies should know. If you want to light your man on fire You gotta start it real slow Keep on turning up the voltage

Till that man begin to glow Like you're switching on a light bulb Watch the juice begin to flow Baby, I've got your attention Watch the juice begins That was Taraji P. Henson as Suge Avery in the new film adaptation of the musical The Color Purple. Taraji, you sound so good. Thank you. Thank you so much. Lots of practice. I mean, people should know that you were initially afraid of this role, specifically the singing. For sure. I was tapped to play her on Broadway, and I just knew that my voice would not withstand eight shows a week singing

at that capacity. So I turned down. And then as fate would have it, she came back to get me. So what is the process of conditioning your voice for a role like this? Because I would guess you have to really reach down because you're acting in the singing. Yeah, I'm a good storyteller. So, you know, that's what makes me the singer I am because I really, you know, for me, it's about telling the story. And so, you know, I know that about me. And my vocal coach, Stevie Mackey, just kept reminding me of that. And any time when I even got down to, you know, production and we were in the studio and Stephen Bray would just be like, just make her sugar. And then the note would come out, you know.

So for me, it's not just about the notes. It's also the storytelling. So but I worked with Stevie Mackey for about two months before I even got down to set in Atlanta because I wanted the music to be in me. I wanted to be in me. I didn't want to have to think about it because I knew once we got down to Atlanta and started rehearsals, we would then have to add the layer of choreography. So I didn't want to be thinking about the words and the steps, you know? Right, right, right. That's a lot to think about. How would you describe Suge? I mean, Suge is a performer.

She, you know, that's how she lives. She lives through this big personality and she's a change maker. She's the one who's the dreamer who left the plantation when all the slaves were freed and was like, I'm going to make something of myself. And so, yeah, I mean, you know, she's just different from all the other women. She don't live under a thumb. She had children. She left those babies behind to make her her dream come true. And even though Sophia is very strong, she stayed with the family.

You know, she stayed with raising her kids and, you know, being a wife. And Suge was like, yeah, I'm not doing none of that. Right, right. Sophia being one of the principal characters. Yes, played by incredible Danielle Brooks, who just got a Golden Globe nomination. I'm very proud of her and Fantasia's work. Oprah is the one who first called you to tell you you got the role. And Taraji, is it true I heard that you didn't answer the call at first?

Well, it's not that I didn't answer. I have a habit of leaving my phone. When I'm home, I like to enjoy home. So when I'm home, work is over there somewhere. And so I finally checked my phone, and I saw it was buzzing, and I had all these missed calls and texts, and it was Tyler Perry that I called back. Because I was like, Tyler's been trying to call me,

and I called him back, and he's like, are you answering your phone? And I was like, no, why, what's up? What's going on? And he was like, Oprah's trying to call you. And I was like, are you answering your phone? And I was like, no, why? What's up? What's going on? And he was like, Oprah's trying to call you. And I was like, oh, bye. So she left the voice note. And I got the voice note.

And I started trembling. And she left her number. And I called her back. And she was like, Shug Avery's coming to town. And then she said, Taraji, it was unanimous. And I just wanted to pass out. Wow. It was unanimous, and I just wanted to pass out. Wow. It was unanimous because I'm also thinking about how you describe the character, Shug Avery.

In a way, it sounds a lot like you. Well, you know, I see this woman who people judge by her lifestyle that she chooses to live. And I just want to give her a voice, and I want her to be opposite of what these people are saying about her. You know, she's a ho, she's a loose woman, she'll take your man, she'll do this, she'll do that, and a third. Well, even her performing and hiding behind this big persona

is a defense mechanism. You know, this is her covering up what no one sees in her and that's that sweet tenderness and the only person that sees her is Celie, and that's the only person who was able to tap into that real tender, sweet, unconditional love that dwells within her. No man she's ever laid with could do it, was able to see it. Even all the fans that she get up on that stage and pour all of herself and soul into, no one really sees her. They sexualize her. They fantasize about her. She's a myth. She's a

fairy. This relationship between your character, Suge, and Fantasia Barrino's character, Celie, is such an important one for Celie, who's the main character, to understand who she is and what she's capable of, I want to play this clip. It's the two of you walking through a field of wildflowers, and you're talking about life. And Shook talks first. Let's listen. Would you look at all of God's beautiful creation. You know God loves admiration. You saying God is vain?

No, not vain, Miss Sealy. God just wants to share a good thing. You see, I think it pisses God off if you walk past a color purple and not notice it. You saying God wants to be loved like they say in the Bible? Oh, everything, and everybody wants to be loved, especially God. That's why God be in everything. And see, when you love what God has made, you is loving God and God is loving you.

You see, God is in music, in the water, in the sunlight. God be, he be as big as the sun, yet small enough to fit in all our hearts. That was a scene from the new film adaptation of the musical The Color Purple, and I'm talking with Taraji P. Henson, who stars as Suge Avery. Well, it goes without saying that The Color Purple, it's really considered an American masterpiece, especially for black people. It was a Pulitzer Prize winning book, as we know, a Steven Spielberg film, an iconic musical, and now this film adaptation to the musical. What did the story mean to you growing up? I just remember going to the movies and seeing, I went to a public school, so we didn't have the book.

But I just remember going to the movies, seeing all of those Black people on the screen. And I was like, oh my God, I want to do that. I really want to do that. Because I didn't get accepted to the High School of Fine Arts. So it just never died in me, that urge and that want to be on the screen or to be an actress. And that just kind of like really solidified me wanting to pursue my dreams for sure. Wow. How old were you about then? I was 15. Was there a particular character that you most identified with back then? I saw myself in all of those women. For sure I did. Because if you think about my career, I played Celie.

My Celie was Suge in Hustle & Flow. You know, I played Sophia before. You know what I mean? Cookie is a Sophia in a way. From Empire. Yeah, Cookie from Empire. She didn't take no mess from no man. You know, so I saw myself in all of these women because I've been every woman in my life as a black woman, for sure.

You know, this latest version, it was directed by a filmmaker, Blitz Basawule. It is a more joyous adaptation. It's more joyous than the 1985 film. It's completely different. But it is especially clear in this rendition, the depth of sisterhood between each character and how they represent different variations of Black womanhood. So we have Fantasia, as I mentioned, as Celie, Sophia played by Danielle Brooks, her as Squeak, Holly Bailey as Nettie. That is a lot of woman power. What was the set like? A lot of fun. Lots of fun. So if you've been watching us on this press tour and you see the joy, it's very real.

You know, we made sure, particularly me, I made sure to make sure we laughed on set because I know we were dealing with such a heavy subject matter. And, you know, this being Fantasia's first feature role and, you know, all of the things that Celie had to carry, I kind of watched her closely. And if, you know, there was a moment where we could insert some joy and she didn't need to stay in that dark place for the next take, I was there to surely, you know, lift the mood and let her live a little bit and breathe in between those takes, you know. I think you said like living between the takes. Living between the takes. Yeah, you have to. And that's how I've trained myself, my instrument, because, you know, I became a mother early on. I was a mother when I

showed up to Hollywood. So whenever I would go to work, I had to leave it on the set because when I got home, it was homework. It was time to do homework. It was time to eat and take a bath and say our prayers and read a book. And what do we get the uniform? You know, I had to be, you know, stay on top of my motherly duties. So I couldn't take my work home. And years and years and years of doing that, I'm just trained to, like, literally, I can be bawling my eyes out in between the take and they'll yell cut. And I'll wipe the tears and tell you about, oh yeah, I'll pick up the story we were talking about before they yelled action. Two important roles early in your career were the 2001 John Singleton film,

Baby Boy, which they call a hood tale and hustle and Flow, which you play opposite Terrence Howard. You were a pregnant prostitute in that. Both were really important to your career, but also you felt like you kind of had to fight a little harder not to be typecast because of those roles. Take me to that place because you're working, so that's great, but you're also kind of being put in a box because you're doing so well at portraying these characters. I really started getting typecast, well, they tried, with Yvette from Baby Boy because I guess she was more closely relatable to me, you know, because I'm edgy, I'm from the hood, you know what I mean? And I'm going to always show up as me. Like, you're going

to get what you get. But if it's Shakespeare in a Park, if it's Chekhov, if it's, you know, August Wilson, I'll give you that too. But that's called work. You know, I'm always going to be me. And I think a lot of times I was judged by that. And they were like, oh, she's not really acting. That's just her, you know. So I got a lot of those baby mama kind of like hood flick scripts. And I was like, yeah, no, this I think I think they're missing the point. I am a trained actress. Did you have to turn a lot of those down? called The Division. And I played a rookie cop who was raised by lesbian mothers. And she lived in the Bay Area, San Francisco. And, you know, she was a rookie cop and she was upbeat and she wasn't this edgy girl from the hood. You know what I mean? So and then when I did that, just when John

called and was like, I need your eyes. And I was like, you need my eyes for what? He was like, for this script I got, you know, hustle and flow and flow and he said you read the script and you tell me which character you want to portray and I remember reading the script and Lex's Paula J Parker's character jumped off the page you know because she was loud and she was she was the one that spoke up for herself and you know at first I saw her first because she just was loud but then it was the quiet mouse. And I was like, that's what he needs my eyes for because she hasn't found her voice yet. And I called him and I said, I want Suge. And he said, thank God, because that's who I wanted you for. You grew up in Washington, D.C., and you had a child in college.

You were studying acting at Howard University, but you knew you wanted to be an actor. You were like, I'm in this place, but I'm not of this place. I'm actually going somewhere. And I think it started as a young age because I got out of my zip code. I know so many people from that area, like we say, that never got out of their zip code. Like I'm talking going downtown just to go get on the bus and go downtown. If you don't get out of your zip code, how do you know there's a real huge world out there to be a part of? And so I think it started with my mother. Every summer she would send me down south. That's why I'm really having infinity for playing Southern women because I spent so many summers with women like that.

Down South where? North Carolina, Scotland Neck, North Carolina, with my grandmother. I'll be the only cousin down there with my grandmother. And, of course, I go from this loud, big city down to country. And I was watching the soaps with my grandma, letting my imagination run wild. I'm an only child, so I have a very vivid imagination. And I portrayed a lot of characters down south, you know, in those moments playing by myself in the mirror.

And that mirror became my stage. I had a chance to read your memoir, your 2016 memoir, Around the Way Girl. You know, the thing I love so much is the way you write about your mom and dad. Yeah. Yeah. You really were a daddy's girl. I was. I was, and I miss him so much because he, everything that you see me doing, he planted those seeds. He started speaking them into me at a very young age when I didn't even know really what acting was. And he would be like, you're going to be the greatest actress alive.

And I was like, huh? How old were you when he started telling you that? I was little. I was like grammar school. And he just saw that I had a real big personality and he sold into that. And not only just him, my aunt, my godmother, they saw that in me as well. And they put me in this program at the Kennedy Center when I was really young. You know, it was an acting program and I really excelled there. So

now it was like, we got to go full head with all systems of go because she has something, you know, and my father just stayed on it. I'll never forget when I was in a talented teen pageant and my father took me to buy my dress. And I'll never forget, we went in the store and the women just started crying, young girls. And they were like, this is so beautiful to see a black girl coming here with her father, buying her this gown. And he was just beaming and proud and just bragging about me. And it made the sales associates weep. Like, they cried because that imagery, we didn't see it often in the hood. There's this particular text from the book that really stood out to me

in your description of your dad. You write, he did a lot of things wrong, but he was a stand-up guy, a good guy who was dealing with the cards life dealt him. Yeah. turned all that ugly upside down and let me examine its underbelly. It was important that I see it all. Yeah. What's an example of some of what he let you see to prepare you for the life that you would lead? My father was just very brutally honest, even in his own faults and mishaps and missteps in life. He was just honest because the thing is, is he never wanted anybody to go through what he went through. And the only way to redemption is to own up to what you did, you know, to own up to your faults and your mistakes because here's the deal.

This is why I do not agree with cancel culture. It has no place in humanity. It just doesn't because who's perfect and who's judging when we all live in glass houses who's throwing stones like who are you and thank god thank god there was no instagram around then because there's no redemption and once people start canceling you where's the redemption where do you get to say okay i was wrong i am sorry i apologize let me make this right that's all we can do as humans. But it's when you avoid your fault.

That's what I have a problem with. Our guest today is award-winning actress Taraji P. Henson. She stars as Suge Avery in the film adaptation of The Color Purple. I'm Tanya Mosley, and this is Fresh Air. Hi, it's Tanya Mosley, co-host of Fresh Air. David Byrne, and so many others. And we're looking forward to 2024, hopefully with your financial support. This is where we want to say a big thank you to our Fresh Air Plus supporters and anyone listening who already donates to public media. Your support is the reason everyone has free access to NPR shows and podcasts. To anyone out there who isn't a supporter yet, right now

is the time to start, especially with journalists gearing up for an important election year. Supporting public media now takes just a few minutes and really makes a difference in what's possible moving forward. So join NPR Plus at plus.npr.org or make a tax-deductible donation now at donate.npr.org. And thank you. Today I'm talking with actress Taraji P. Henson. She stars as Suge in the new film adaptation of the musical The Color Purple. Henson has had an extensive career in film and television, starring in several movies,

including The Curious Case of Benjamin Button, in which she was nominated for an Academy Award. Other movies include John Singleton's 2001 film Baby Boy and the 2005 film Hustle and Flow. In 2016, she won the Golden Globe for Best Actress Television Series Drama, becoming only the third African-American actress to take home the award after Gail Fisher in 1972 and Regina Taylor in 92. She also became the first Black woman to win the Critics' Choice Award for Best Actress in a Drama Series. Your mom and dad weren't together very long. They split when you were young.

Yeah, when you were two years old. I've wanted to ask you about this because there is this scene in Baby Boy where Tyrese's character, your boyfriend, comes banging at your door demanding to see the son that you two have together. And you're afraid because he hit you and so you don't want to open the door as he demands to see his son. And something similar happened to you when you were a child between your mother and your father. Was that scene from Baby Boy based on your real life? No. And that is why when I read that script, I had to put it down several times. I was like, whoa, John. And just before I even knew him, I was like, dude.

John Singleton. John Singleton. I was like, this dude is hitting too close to home. I'm like, did he have cameras watching me? When I, you know, like, it was just too many things in that script that just hit so close to my own personal life that it was uncomfortable to read at times.

I will say that. But that particular incident between your mother and father, it's one of the first memories you ever have. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. But he did it a couple of times.

You know, he came. I don't know who goes to war and come back quite the same. You know. He went to Vietnam. Went to Vietnam. And he came back with all kinds of issues. And, you know, took it out on people. Because that's what you do when life puts its foot on your neck. Then you turn around and put your foot on somebody else's neck you know um and it's up to the next generation or

somebody in the generations to come to break that cycle um so my father I remember when I he just you know when he came to rescue me from my domestic situation, I remember him with his hands clenched real tight in his pockets. And he was just like, I knew I was going to get all of this back through one of my babies. And so just to let folks know, you then, once you became an adult, you were with your boyfriend, and he hit you. Yeah. And you called your dad. He drew blood, and I called my dad. And my dad showed up on the scene, and he was really disappointed and hurt and all the things.

But he was born again Christian, so he handled it well. But because my boyfriend was still there. He handled it well. But then on the way back home when he gathered me and my son and collected all our stuff and has taken us back to his house, with, like, tears in his eyes, I could hear his voice trembling. He said, I knew I was going to get this back through one of my babies. One of the characters that you're known for is Cookie Lyons in the Fox show Empire. Is it true that you channel your dad sometimes in some of the ad-libs? Yeah, my dad was off the cuff. Whatever he was thinking it, it was coming out.

And nine times out of ten, he was saying the things that people were afraid to say. And so a lot of people thought that, you know, I likened that character to some woman in my life. I was like, no, that was my dad. I want to remind people of your character, Cookie Lyons, from Empire, which ran on Fox from, I think it was 2015 until 2020. And it's about members of a family who own a record company,

and we follow them as they fight for control of that company. And Cookie and her husband were involved in the drug trade, and then she ends up in prison for 17 years. And during all of that time, she refuses to snitch on Lucius. So he starts this record label. It's successful. He ices her out. And when she's released from prison, she demands her fair share. So I want to play this scene where she confronts Lucius in his office. She's carrying a bat. And we hear Lucius say, want some trouble, Cookie? Let's listen.

You want some trouble, Cookie? No. No, I don't want no trouble, Lucius. I just have some questions. Solve. Like, this album right here. Nah, I don't want no trouble, Lucius. I just have some questions. So? Like, this album right here. This was your first album to go gold. Now, I remember working on that six months before I went to prison.

So whose DNA is in that Lucius huh DNA boy please that was a scene of Taraji P Henson playing Cookie from the hit Fox series Empire created by Lee Daniels and Danny Strong that ran on Fox from 2015 until 2020. Taraji, you basically go off in this scene. You are smashing glass and just going off on Lucius. That had to be a one take, was it? I think so. It was a lot of fun. Yeah. I was going to say, I got off a lot of frustrations about some things in my life, probably. You know, people, specifically Black women and girls, they just love the character Cookie so much. What do you think they love about her?

She says the things that people wish they could say, you know? I remember it was a tug of war with the pilot where Cookie beats her son with a broom because he calls her a bitch. And they didn't want to show it. And I was like, I remember going over to Video Village. That's usually where all the big wigs hang out, the producers, the director and everybody watching what we do on set and watching what's going on in the camera. And so I went over there and I was like, you got to show this. You must show this. I said, because if that boy calls his mother a bitch and she don't do nothing, we're going to disappoint so many mothers out there.

Because it wouldn't be real. Oh, no, it wouldn't be real. I mean, it's a knee-jerk reaction. Like, it's an honest human reaction from any mother. And so when they did show it, and thank God they did, and it's not just about black mothers. Every mother, every walk of life of a mother was in my timeline like that. You know what I'm saying? It's a knee-jerk reaction. I don't know. Backhand, I mean, the room may have been dramatic, but something, you will get some kind of repercussions.

You don't just get to do that. I want to talk a little bit more about your early life. We mentioned that you gave birth to your son, Marcel, when you were in college studying acting at Howard University. And there was never a question for you that you're going to have a son, that you're going to have your baby. No. Once I became pregnant, I just, I was like, this is a blessing. Like, I didn't second guess it because I had never had an oops moment ever before. And I'm grown. It wasn't like I was a kid in high school. Like, I was, you know, I was a grown woman living on my own. I had my own apartment.

You know, I was putting myself through college. So it was my decision to make. I was like, well, clearly this is a blessing. And that's just how I rolled with it. And then my dad showed up and he literally dropped to the floor and started thanking Jesus. And I was like, oh, Lord, this is a blessing. And then he took me to McDonald's to celebrate. He also pushed you. He was like, you know what?

And the next place you need to go is to Hollywood so with your young son on your hip you didn't have an agent you didn't have a place you didn't have a job you didn't have a SAG card that allowed you to work as an actor you only had $700 to your name when you came to Hollywood I'm gonna tell you what prepared me for that and that was my training at Howard University I have to give them the credit that they're due because the training that I went through there was rigorous and it was unrelenting. Like you had to show up and show out. If not, you would be replaced. They didn't care how light your skin was.

They didn't care how pretty your hair was. They didn't care how thin or thick you were. You had to have the talent. And so I trained hard there. And I knew that I made a name for myself at Howard. I did. I was the one that didn't come from the musical art school, you know, the performing art school. I didn't come from there. I came from public school, you know, and so I had to climb up that ladder and prove myself. And once I did it there, I knew I could do it anywhere because they didn't play. What were those first few weeks and months like in L.A. trying to survive with just $700 in your pocket? Well, I had hookups. I had friends that were on shows at the time. So I got my SAG card fairly quick because I knew to get a SAG card, you just had to become SAG eligible. You had to work on

three SAG projects. So my cousin's show was SAG and my friend Simbi Khali, at the time she's on Third Rock from the Sun, she was on the show. And I was like, so can I come do some extra work? And they were like, yep. And no, the next week my cousin helped me pay those dues and I was zagged. You worked as an extra on movie sets when you first got to Hollywood too, right? Are there any notable ones? Malcolm X. Malcolm X. That's actually, that was before I got to D. I was still in college. And honey, you couldn't tell me I wasn't going to be a star. Spike Lee is going to look deep into my eyes of a sea of a thousand. But there's one scene you can actually see me. My mother, God bless her heart.

My mother found her baby in the crowd in the sea of a thousand. And she paused it. You can even hear my mouth. You can hear me going, all right, yes, sir. You can hear me. But it was a scene where he's talking about the police and how they're the pigs and they are the problem. And it's outside. We're outside, and it's a whole crowd.

And anyway, we were standing there, me and my best friend Tracy from the seventh grade, who runs my foundation. We go way back. And I remember the building caught on fire. And, you know, extras, they place you. But we fought to be in the front. And we were not giving up our place. That building could have burned down and fell on our heads. We still would have stayed in there locked.

I was like, I'm not giving up my position. Because when they yell, when we come back from all this fire, when they fix that fire, we're going to be right here in our same position, front and center of that camera. Okay, let's take a short break. If you're just joining us, my guest is Academy Award-nominated actress Taraji P. Henson. She stars as Suge in the film adaptation of The Color Purple. We'll continue our conversation after a short break. This is Fresh Air. You're pretty serious about a lot of things. And one thing that I've always been struck

by is just how serious you are about therapy. When did it become clear to you that mental health was something you needed to take seriously? When I was looking for a therapist for myself and my son, and I couldn't find one that looked like me. And then I called Tracy Cherie J. Jenkins, my best friend since the seventh grade, who also had her issues with, you know, anxiety and panic attacks for as long as I've known her since the seventh grade. And we cry about it now. We cry about what we laughed about back then because of sheer ignorance. We just did not know. Black families don't talk about it.

And so when I called her and I was like, you know, wow, I can't find a black therapist. This is crazy. And we started talking and I was like, well, you know why that is. And I'm like, because we don't talk about it at home. So these babies don't know that this is a career that they can even go into. I said, we have to do something about this because I'm a privileged woman. I can afford 350 a pop for a session. But what about an entire community that don't even'm a privileged woman. I can afford $350 a pop for a session, but what about an entire community that don't even talk about it, much less can afford it?

So I just felt inclined to do something because my entire career, I had been asked, do you have a charity? Do you have? And I wanted to say yes, but it needed to be something that mattered to me. And this was just organic. Like it matters to me that we are walking around so broken. That bothers me that we have these generational curses that we can't find our ways out of. And so I just want us to heal.

I want us to feel free enough to be not okay. Is there an importance you hold to being a part of this enduring story of the color purple at this stage in your life and career? I listen. I just, for whatever reasons, I was supposed to be a part of it. I don't know why that is yet. I can't put my finger on it. Maybe I don't need to know. You know what I mean? Maybe I'm just supposed to just enjoy it. You know, I don't want to pick it apart too much. But I tell you this, I ran from Suge. I never saw myself playing Suge. I never even saw myself in The Color Purple.

Like when I saw it, I never said to myself, oh, I'll be in The Color Purple one day. They just inspired me to make my dreams come true, to get out of my zip code, to dream, you know. And so that's what that movie represents to me. And I guess for me, I'm going to represent that for some young girl coming up, you know, for somebody. Some young girl or some boy is going to see the possibilities through my, you know, role as Suge in this reimagining, you know, 30 years from now, we get to pass the baton to somebody else, you know, to this next generation of viewers and color purple fans, because you got to realize there's going to be a brand new audience to the story. Yeah. You know, stories come back every few years. And sometimes it's really clear why we need to see that story or read that story

in that moment in time. Why do you think this story is important now for us to sit in a story of sisterhood now? We're in an age of healing, I say, for us Black and Brown communities, because for the first time ever in history, we're open and talking about our mental wellness. And this show, this movie definitely deals with that. It definitely deals with that. And when you say that, why is it important that I think that's why the divine order had me be a part of this. Why now, not 10 years from now? Why now, not 10 years ago? Because now is the moment that we've been dealing with our mental wellness and in the public, out loud. You see celebrities and athletes saying, I'm going to take a break from my mental wellness.

We've never seen anything like this before. And this movie is going to only shed more light on how we need to heal and break these generational curses because we've been functioning dysfunctionally for some time because trauma has been passed down to us. And how to cope in the trauma dysfunctionally has been passed down to us. Just because we don't know. We don't talk about it. It's coming out on Christmas Day. So are you going to watch it or commemorate it on Christmas?

I am. I'm taking my grandmother, who is about to be 100 in April. I'm taking, yes, I'm taking her and my entire family. We're going to take grandma to the theater and I'm going to sit right next to her and watch her every expression. That's so special, Taraji. Well, have a great time and thank you for this movie and thank you for your work all these years. Thank you. Thank you for seeing me. Actress Taraji P. Henson, who stars as Suge Avery in the new film adaptation of the musical The Color Purple.

Coming up, rock critic Ken Tucker reviews two new Christmas albums, one by Cher and the other by The Cow Sills. This is Fresh Air. Every year, a sleigh full of Christmas music gets released, and rock critic Ken Tucker has been listening to a lot of it. He's narrowed down his list to two new releases. Cher has put out her first Christmas album, which is also her first collection of original material in a decade. Ken also really likes the new three-song holiday EP from the Cowsills, the family group that first gained fame in the 1960s and was the inspiration for the Partridge Family TV show.

Here's his review. No one on the streets and the city is quiet I should be asleep by the heat of the fire. But I'm on my way out. I'm going to stay out. I can feel the pulse as I walk in the door. Take me through the crowd to the middle of the floor. The red and the green lights Are hitting me just right

Nothing more, nothing less I got one request DJ play a Christmas song I wanna be dancing all night long It's cold outside but it's warm in here And that's thetune I hear? Why, it's Cher coming down our chimneys with a new album called Christmas. Its lead-off cut is the song I just played, called DJ Play a Christmas Song. It's designed to remind you of her last huge hit 25 years ago, Believe.

This album is stuffed with guest stars including Stevie Wonder, Cyndi Lauper, and Michael Bublé, but I most enjoyed her solo crooning on a nicely wistful tune called I Like Christmas. I like Christmas I like the real Christmas tree I like a mall Santa Claus that lets me sit on his knee. I like a big red bow and mistletoe with you underneath. Cause I like it best when my friends are there to jingle along. You and me in harmony with everyone. Singing at the top of our lungs. Christmas time.

Oh sure, there are a few clunkers here. Sorry Cher, No one but Chuck Berry can rocket through his Run Rudolph run. And I'm afraid she's put in the shade of Darlene Love's radiance on their duet of Christmas Baby, Please Come Home. But this is no cheap throwaway effort. Cher's phrasing, especially without the autotune, is terrific, and the arrangements aren't sticky with candy cane sentiment. Plus, she offers something different for a holiday album, a New Year's song. The warmth of your love's like the warmth of the sun And this will be our year, took a long time to come Don't let go of my hand, now the darkness has gone

And this will be our year, took a long time to come And I won't forget the way you held me up when I was down And I won't forget the way you said, darling I love you You gave me faith to go on, now we're there and we've only just begun The Cow Sills was a family pop group that had a big hit in 1967 called The Rain, the Park, and Other Things. When they started out as kids and had that hit, their mom, Barbara, went on the road with them when they toured, which inspired the 1970s sitcom The Partridge Family. The current version of the Cowsills are siblings Susan, Bob, and Paul Cowsill, and they've just put out a three-song EP titled A Christmas Offering from the Cowsills

that includes this lovely song called Christmastime Song for Marissa. It's Christmastime, a special time When all the world shares The wonder of the holiday With evergreens and caroling And logs by the fire The feeling that love is everywhere Now the snow falls so softly and silent tonight As it blankets a peaceful world Over the years, Susan Cowsill has done backup vocals

for some of my favorite acts such as Carleen Carter, Dwight Twilley, and The Smithereens. She had a duo act with Vicki Peterson of the Bangles and has put out a few solo albums. The current Cowsills lineup does a fine job of reproducing the family's original beautiful close harmonies, as can be heard on their version of Winter Wonderland. We're happy tonight Walking in a winter wonderland Play bells ring, are you listening? In the lane, snow is glistening

A beautiful sight, we're happy tonight Walking in a winter wonderland. Gone away is a bluebird, here to stay is a new bird. We sing to love's song as we go along, walking in a winter wonderland. Both Cher and the Cowsills came to prominence in the 1960s, but they still possessed the distinctive sounds that brought them their initial success. Our warm feelings toward them are rekindled by these new releases, which is in itself appropriate as the chilly season settles in for much of the country.

Happy holidays to you. Christmas Eve Well, at least I've tried. So come on, hurry down the chimney with a kiss for me. And let me wrap my arms around you. I'm so lucky that I found you. Ken Tucker reviewed Cher's new album called Christmas and the digital three-song EP called A Christmas Offering from the Cow Seals. And there'll be more Christmas music on Wednesday when David Byrne, co-founder and frontman of the Talking Heads, joins Terry to play some of his favorite Christmas recordings. His playlist includes songs by Prince and Run-DMC,

and they'll play one of Terry's new favorites, a song written and sung by David Byrne. If you get depressed around Christmas, there will be songs for you too. Tomorrow on Fresh Air, we remember actor Andre Brouwer, who died last week at the age of 61. He's best known for his roles in the TV series Homicide as a police detective and in the comedy series Brooklyn Nine-Nine, as a police captain. He was also acclaimed for his stage performances in Shakespeare plays. We'll feature interviews with him from 1995 and 2006. I hope you can join us. To keep up with what's on the show and to get highlights of our interviews,

follow us on Instagram at NPR Fresh Air. Fresh Air's executive producer is Danny Miller. Our technical director and engineer is Audrey Bentham. Our interviews and reviews are produced and edited by Amy Sallet, Phyllis Myers, Roberta Shorrock, Sam Brigger, Lauren Krenzel, Heidi Saman, Anne-Marie Baldonado, Teresa Madden, Seth Kelly, and Susan Nakundi. Our digital media producer is Molly C.V. Nesper. Thea Chaloner directed today's show. For Terry Gross, I'm Tanya Moseley.