Friday Night Comedy from BBC Radio 4 - Catherine Bohart: TL;DR

Episode Date: September 22, 2023

The fifth of our satirical specials this summer. Columns. Analysis. The Guardian's Long Read. Who has time? Catherine Bohart, that's who, and she's going beyond the headlines to give you the lowdown on one of the biggest stories of the week, alongside journalist James Ball and roving correspondent Sunil Patel. Catherine has fast become one of the most sought-after comedians in the UK and Ireland. She co-hosted the BBC Sounds Podcast and Radio 4 show You’ll Do and has appeared on multiple radio shows including The Now Show, The News Quiz, Museum of Curiosity and A Good Read. The past twelve months have seen her record her debut special for Amazon Prime Video. She has also made multiple appearances on shows such Mock The Week, Late Night Mash and The News Quiz. Catherine’s other broadcasting credits include Sky1’s A League Of Their Own, Channel 4’s 8 Out Of 10 Cats, Comedy Central UK’s Roast Battle, ITV2’s The Stand Up Sketch Show, Dave’s Jon Richardson: Ultimate Worrier and BBC2’s Richard Osman’s House Of Games. She was also a regular correspondent on BBC2’s The Mash Report and has written material for BBC Radio 4’s The Now Show and Frankie Boyle’s New World Order (BBC2). Written by Madeleine Brettingham, Sarah Campbell, Emma Nagouse and Pravanya Pillay. Produced by Victoria Lloyd. A Mighty Bunny production for BBC Radio 4

This is the BBC. This podcast is supported by advertising outside the UK. All day long. Taxes extra at participating Wendy's until May 5th. Terms and conditions apply. BBC Sounds. Music, radio, podcasts. Welcome to TLDR. Too long, didn't read. The news for people who read the headline, got upset, opened a bottle of wine and fell asleep. I'm Catherine Bowhart.

You are me. I am you. Wakey, wakey, sweet one. Don't worry, we've got your back. We'll fill you in. This show is a place where we will delve into a big story of the week. That's right, one story of the week. We are not afraid of commitment here. We are going deep, not wide.

And with each story, I will be asking how we got here. And you'll leave with a greater understanding than you had before and a couple of interesting things to say if asked your opinion. I love a story. I love gossip, I love people, and I'm a curious person. Yes, I said curious when I meant nosy. We're not going to worry about it. The problem is, I have no idea how people are keeping on top of all the news. When are you all watching Below Deck? And may I say, a lot of news is kind of boring.

Sorry, inflation rates, if you're listening, my interest rate just plummeted. One for the dads, just there. If Christian and Guru Murthy opened the news every night cracking open a bottle of Pinot Grigio and said, you are not going to believe what's going down in the Bank of England.

I would never miss an episode. How have they not rebranded to Murthy Gets Messy With Merlot? Right? I would watch that every single night. So that's what we're planning to do here. We want to tell you

the news in detail like it's hot goss and we are all humans who need details and receipts. So that's the plan. So, how the hell do we choose a story? The lionesses are back home

but who am I kidding? I'm a lesbian in London. I know, if anything, way too much about what's going on with them. It turns out all it took for me to learn what the offside rule is was for Mary Earps

to stick her tongue out in high def. At the time of recording this, Putin's only comment on the death of Wagner leader Yevgeny Prokofiev in a plane crash near Moscow was, he was a good businessman. There's massive speculation as to what happened, but I promised you a story I could give you details and receipts on,

and we aren't likely to get them quickly from Russia. If I'm being honest, there's only one story I've been looking away from this week, like it's an eclipse and I don't have the right glasses, and that's Donald Trump and his current legal woes. Now, if, like me, you're groaning internally at the thought, bear with, because we've got you.

We also have got an in-house nerd, I'm not sure how you'll feel about that title, who's going to explain why there's actually loads of this story, and it's also all actually very important. So, please welcome, joy of our hearts, it's Tom Neenan! Tom is a satirist and American obsessive. He was the lead writer on Mashed Report. I quite liked that show. He was also the lead writer on Hello America,

and he is the friend I go to for all Gotham elections, and not just because he wears glasses and a cardigan on Ironically. Hi, Tom. How are you? I'm very good, thank you. Tom promised me this story was interesting. I promise you, it definitely is. Did you believe him? Yes.

Two of you. Okay, so that's okay. That's the audience we're looking for actually. What do you not know? far. That's okay. That's the audience we're looking for, actually. What do you not know? Okay. Yeah, okay. That's actually a question I can get on board with. Thank you so much. First of all, I don't know why this is still happening.

I don't know how these charges are different to the charges before or why it's taking so long for all the charges to come up. I didn't watch the debate because, can I just say, sorry, from my point of view, there are still too many characters in that show. It's like, you know the first episode of Drag Race where you're like, I don't know whose name I have to remember? I think, Tom, that you can't make me care about this story

if it's not possible that he might go to prison, so I need to know that too, because I can't go through this all again if there's no chance he'll be punished. Trump has surrendered himself to these 13 counts, including the violation of Georgia's racketeering... Wait, he surrendered himself? He surrendered himself. Sorry, do you see how slowly you're going to have to explain this story to me? OK, including the violation of George's racketeering. Wait, he surrendered himself? He surrendered himself.

Sorry, do you see how slowly you're going to have to explain this story to me? Okay, right, yeah, yeah, yeah. But I thought his whole thing was that he doesn't think that he... I guess it was just that he was stopping himself being arrested. Exactly. He didn't want the indignity of being put in handcuffs and his hand slipping out of them. That's what he was avoiding.

He has, like, 19 co-conspirators. He does. It shocks me he even has 19 friends. Who were they? The other co-conspirators. He does. It shocks me he even has 19 friends. Who are they? The other co-conspirators, Rudy Giuliani, who you might know from last year when he melted. Rudy! We've all had a dye job go badly. True, true.

A lady called Jenna Ellis, I don't know if you saw her mugshot, she was smiling and she looked terrifying. Was she the one who had her photo taken at the same time as Giuliani? Yeah. Why do they look so fit? My favourite, probably, of the co-conspirators is a guy called Kenneth Cheesebro, because his name is Kenneth Cheesebro.

It seems like we're having debates really early. Yeah. Where are we at in the process? Are we at judges' houses? Are we still at boot camp? What are we saying? Imagine if we're on The Voice. Oh, we're switching shows?

Yeah, yeah. Okay. Basically, if we're on The Voice. Oh, we're switching shows? Yeah, yeah. Okay. Basically, if you're not facing the candidates, you hear them speak, and then you just work out if there's a way to make your chair sort of descend into the floor. That's where we're at at the minute. Okay, so very early days.

Okay. Are the Republican Party scared of him? I mean, I understand. Is it just that he's popular with people, or is it that he might run as an independent? I don't think we'll ever see him run as an independent. I think that running as an independent is seen as maybe not the most sensible thing to do. And it's not done by the most sensible people.

I'm thinking the people most recently sort of the famous independent candidates have been people like Cornel West, Jill Stein and Kanye. Right. Thank you for saying an example that we all knew at the end. Kanye. Right. Thank you for saying an example that we all knew at the end. If he, for some reason, doesn't get the nomination to be the nominee for the Republicans... Yes, and that's some reason

being hell's frozen over or... Really? Are that sure? I reckon short of a nuke hitting Washington, we are going to be seeing Donald Trump as the Republican nominee. Wow. Don't tempt us. So the question I guess is then, does that really inform the fact that

the rest of the Republicans are really vying to be VP? Except for the ones who aren't. Chris Christie, certainly. I don't think we'd see... I mean, I wouldn't put it past him, actually. He's incredibly vocal against Trump. But didn't he used to like Trump? This is where I'm confused. Oh, that that's what you see with trump all the time

ted cruz we all saw when ted cruz's wife was insulted by donald trump and then like a few months later he was phone banking with him like there is he has a unique ability to make people absolutely drag their respectability through the mud and i kind of respect him for it i wonder if they're actually trying to be VP or if what they have an eye on is the election after. Because whatever happens in this election, I don't think we'll see Trump running again. How are the Democrats playing this?

You would like to think it's a shoo-in that you win against the guy who may or may not be in jail and certainly will be on trial. Oh, I'm sure the Democrats are sitting there thinking, sorry, we're going to fight an election against Donald Trump. I think we're going to be OK. You know that thing they thought in 2016? Damn.

Is his trial going to be, like, Judge Judy on television? I think that it's the kind of situation where Donald Trump will fight as hard as he can to be on television because that's how he... Did someone just woo that? Woo! More Donald Trump on TV. Of course he will. That didn't occur to me. Most people would not want that on television because that's how he went. Did someone just woo that? Woo! More Donald Trump on TV. Of course he will. That didn't occur to me. Like, most people would not want that on television,

but of course he'll want it on television. Definitely, because he's box office. Do we know what's up with Melania? I assume she wants him to go to prison? Here's the thing about Melania that I find absolutely fascinating is that there's a lot of people who think, like, oh, you know, she was just with him for the money and now then he ran for president and then she got sort of

stuck in this situation of like smiling next to this guy that she can't stand. But what people forget about Melania is that she is actually quite a spicy figure when it comes to her political views. More specifically when she really got behind Donald Trump when he was sort of promoting the birtherism fallacy.

Specifically saying it's not only Donald who wants to see President Obama's birth certificate, it's the American people. Oh, wow, so it's just that she has a face that says she hates him, but actually she agrees with him. Yeah, yeah, yeah. She's got resting unhappy wife face. Does anyone have a question?

So far, is anyone unsure of anything about the current Trump situation? Yes! Okay, this woman over here. Hello. Hi, what's your name? Hi, Jenny. If he is found guilty, how long could Trump go to prison for? Great question. There are two answers to this.

The first one is that the charges which he's currently facing in Georgia could see him served around 20 years in jail. Yes! which he's currently facing in Georgia could see him serve around 20 years in jail. Gasps. Gasps, delight, tears of support. All of those who are excited are going to hate the next part of my answer. Which is that if I had to put money on it, I'd say that he will not go to jail.

For starters, we don't know if he's guilty, guys. Right, OK. I hope I never get any of you in a jury, by the way. Whatever. Wait, wait, wait. What do you mean he will probably not go to jail? If I could distill it down to a legal term, it's a lot of faff.

And something we like about Americans, they don't like faff. But they love prisons. Jenny, is that the most depressing answer in the world? It started positive. And then it quickly went downhill. Good. Does anybody else have a

question? Hi. What's your name? I'm Abby, hi. So, I know you're saying he's stolen the election, but what do you mean? Can I try? Please please he lost the vote in georgia by like ten and a half thousand votes i think a prox and he basically rang his cohort of evil and was like yeah we're gonna have to have won it and they were like yeah but you didn't and he's like oh the thing is, we do have to have won it, though. And they were like, no, no, no, but you didn't. And he was like, uh-huh.

So how would we have made it so that I did? And that's, I believe, on tape. Number one, there's that. So actually trying to change the result and outcome of elections. And also encouraging a violent uprising on the Capitol. You remember that one, Abby. Surely.

Okay, good. We've all had people who we work with who we don't like. Very few of us have sort of inspired a mob to try and hang them. I'm not saying no one in this room, but it'd be a minority. And so that's also what he's been up to. And the trouble with that one, and once again, I have to say, innocent until proven guilty, that one is on camera. Well up to and the trouble with that one and once again i have to say innocent until proven guilty that one is on camera well he did the tweets didn't he he was like he's like hey don't mind what you're doing this afternoon but say if it were like meeting

on the capital but with them like i don't know um you know i wouldn't say weapons if you want to bring them though that's up to you that's just like whatever your vibe is hello what's your name hi my, my name's Maeve. Do the Republicans actually think that Donald Trump could win for them, or are they doing it for, like, publicity things? Because I know he's, like, the big name that's like, oh, yeah, Donald Trump's going to go forward and try and be president. I don't know. I have been checked out since January 6th.

OK, so this is a really good question. This is the bit that actually I do know the answer to. He actually can win. Like, he could win. He's 37 points ahead as the candidate for the Republican Party because he is the by far most popular candidate. And there genuinely seems to be enough people who might actually vote for him that he could win the election. He is box office.

There are people... You know, the Republican Party is basically now a cult of personality built around the game show host, which is terrifying, but also the reality that the Democrats now have to reckon with, and I don't think they are at the minute. And he is popular, he's just not popular with people that we necessarily interact with,

but there's huge pockets of support for him, and I think we ignore that as our peril. I've got quite sort of dark there, so I will say, but he does have small hands, so there we go. Now it's time to head over to our TLDR special correspondent to take a look at the news sidebar. What's the story overshadowing that we might be hearing more about otherwise?

Well, in all of the Trump madness, it's easy to forget that there actually is a current president of America, Joe Biden. So I thought, who better to ask to cover this topic than the most forgettable man in my life? It's Sunil Patel! Thank you. Thank you. Very kind of you.

Now, right, if you think that the trial of Donald Trump is going to be gripping, wait until you've watched me, a man with a full beard, eat this ice cream sundae in front of a live audience. Why the ice cream? Right, well, being forgettable isn't the only thing me and Joe Biden have in common, OK? We also love ice cream.

Joe Biden is possibly the world's greatest ice cream lover after Ben, Jerry, Mr Whippy and wasps. I'm going to start tucking into this to see if we can... Is it delicious? Because I've got to finish this before I get to see if it... Is it delicious? Because I've got to finish this before I get to the end. How is it? It's really cold. It's real cold, Dan.

Don't let it interrupt your speech. Keep going. That's a pint of ice cream. Joe Biden... ..loves ice cream almost as much as his son loves stuff I can't talk about. Now, with our politicians, when they get called a melt or a flank, that's an insult, but Biden would just

say, yes, please. He's not always gone according to plan for him. He got into trouble for making jokes about ice cream at a press conference about a mass shooting. You might say he's got 99 problems. Is that...? LAUGHTER

Well, I absolutely stuck the landing of that joke, so you can't complain. Biden recently boasted to the press that he's got a whole refrigerator of chocolate chip ice cream. It's pretty hard to hear you when your mouth's so full. Of course. It's a bit dangerous, though, because now enemies of America, they know that if they want to lure him out of the White House,

they can just play the Mr. Softee jingle. But this is my point, right? Joe Biden is kind of like his favourite ice cream flavour, which is chocolate chip. Boring, but dependable. And I would much rather have chocolate chip than a Donald Trump presidency, OK? It's quite nice being forgettable, OK?

Mostly, I get left alone. And every now and then, my flatmate opens the door of my room and pokes me with a stick to work out whether I'm asleep or dead. It's all in your beard. It's so, there's so little of it that I've eaten so far. But we've been listening to you too the whole time. There are people that have that as a, you know, they just don't like it. A phobia, yeah. Well, here we go. Here we go with the biggest mouthful so far. this will be good for radio there's so much in his beard

you can't see at home go on brain freeze you got brain freeze or are you joking my teeth really hurt Biden is so forgetful I'm not even sure

he remembers he's president it's like we invited Obama to the party and he brought his weird friend from home and then Obama went home, left his friend and now his friend is in charge of the party.

Now, Hunter Biden, the big story there is all the spicy stuff that they're supposed to have found on Hunter Biden's laptop. In his defence, I don't think there's anything on that laptop. He very much looks like a man who knows his way around incognito mode. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol.

Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol.

Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol.

Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. Mae'n ddiddorol. inflation reduction law which moved the US closer to meeting its clean energy goals, which is really exciting, I think. But does he get the credit for it? No, he doesn't. Just like I get no credit for moving our gas bill to a cheaper provider or rationalising the HDMI

leads in the house, OK? But like Biden, in future years, my contribution as a housemate will be recognised. Unfortunately, by then we will both be dead no one cares about Biden right now but in the future I think Lin-Manuel

Miranda will play him in a rap musical and then we will know his value I think some of history's greatest leaders have actually been forgettable, of course there was that guy that dude with the moustache and the sword he was good have actually been forgettable. Of course, there was that guy. He was that dude with the moustache and the sword.

He was good. In a way, me and Biden are a bit like a mint cornetto. Doomed to lie at the bottom of the freezer, underappreciated, under a bag of magnums and a walls of Ionetta. But our day will come. And until then, please, can I have a napkin? To Neil Patel, everyone! Hey, Tom, there's plenty of precedent

for narcissistic political imposters, but where would you say all this started? Is there a moment when the ball that is Donald Trump started rolling? You can look at it from both ways. You can look at it from the point of view that Donald Trump is absolutely a symptom rather than the disease of all of the way that America is structured. Or you can see it that you ask yourself, where did the journey of Donald Trump becoming president start? And that is a very

specific clip that you can all watch, which is at the White House Correspondents Dinner, when Obama is being very, very cool, very very very sort of charming and ripping into donald trump and he doesn't move a muscle and you can just see a man there thinking i am going to try and tear this country apart piece by piece and to be fair he's nailed it i have so many questions about this and luckily we have a guest on the line who i think can help. Kate Shaw is a professor at the Yeshiva University Benjamin N. Cardoza School of Law and co-host of podcast Strict Scrutiny, not actually a harsh ballroom dancing podcast, but in fact one about the US Supreme Court

and the legal culture that surrounds it. So, bit of a waste of a name if you ask me, but that's fine. Hello, Kate. Hello, Catherine. Thank you for having me. How are you? I'm doing well. I wish I was in the room with you. We wish you were too, but that's fine. Hello, Kate. Hello, Catherine. Thank you for having me. How are you? I'm doing well. I wish I was in the room with you. We wish you were too, but may I say, as you are now being kind of boomed in here,

it feels like you are like the voice of God. That's pretty powerful, Kate. So just be careful with the power you wield, is all I'd say. I'll try to use it wisely. Oh. Be careful with the power you wield, is all I'd say. I'll try to use it wisely.

Oh. Okay, Kate, now the whole room's very excited. First of all, Trump, is there any possibility you will actually go to jail? I mean, a girl can dream, so... Look, more seriously, he is presumed innocent until proven guilty, so these prosecutors, all of them, four separate teams of prosecutors, have to make their cases. But some of what is in the indictments looks very strong. So assuming they can prove these crimes occurred, hush money, classified documents, trying to steal the 2020 presidential election, right? That's the range of crimes he's accused of.

Whether he's going to prison really depends on whether he wins this presidential election. So that's obviously true about the two federal cases, because he's running to be the head of the federal government. So if he wins, and he has already been convicted, he could try to pardon himself. Okay, so that's a genuine possibility that he could pardon himself? Yeah, I mean, so, you know, pre-prison, from prison, after prison, there's not really any constraint on the pardon power in the Constitution. You're blowing my mind.

He can pardon himself from his cell. Is that to say that he could, first of all, run for president and then consequently run the country from prison? Well, there's a constitutional answer, which is that yes, he could. There's no constitutional limitation on running for president from prison. There are practical constraints. Uh-huh, I bet there are. But the constraints, I think, are more practical than legal.

Our constitution has like three requirements for running for president. You have to be 35, you have to be a natural-born citizen, and you have to have been a resident for 14 years. That's it. Being a person at liberty, not incarcerated, those things aren't constitutional requirements. Just to clarify, you could run for president from a prison where you've been put for stealing an election,

but you couldn't run for president at 34. It sounds insane, but yes. Uh-huh, okay, good. I'm glad we're in agreement. Okay, does he get Secret Service protection in jail? Yeah, the question I think is whether they would be in the cell with him, but definitely the protection would remain.

Wait, I thought that was a joke question. You're saying yes. Do you think there's any possibility that this would lead to a constitutional change? Well, one of the things that is definitely wrong with the Constitution is how hard it is to change the Constitution, which is why you all are smart just not to have one at all.

It is almost impossible to change it. Yes, that's also fine and has no problems. Essentially what it seems like you're saying to me is that there's nothing inhibiting him from pardoning himself, which would presumably be the inevitable outcome of him winning presidential power. So, actually, the pardon power only extends to federal crimes.

So he could absolutely pardon himself for any of the federal offences, or... Right. I shouldn't say he should, absolutely. It's never been tried. He would certainly try. He could also try to do something where he transferred power briefly to the vice president. This is something that our constitution actually does provide for.

So like if the president is getting a colonoscopy, he can briefly make the vice president the acting president and then take the power back. That's such an American choice of example. The state crimes he can't pardon himself for. So those are different. So the New York charges and the Georgia charges, if he is convicted, he could not pardon himself. So that is a really important distinction. But I would imagine that most state judges would basically say if he's convicted and hasn't yet started serving, or even if somehow he had already started to serve a sentence, if he managed to get elected president, they would basically allow him to defer continuing the sentence so he didn't have to literally govern from prison just for the sake of the national interest. I presume

that's what a judge would do. I would not be as lenient as that judge that you imagine. I would be petty AF. I'd be like, no, he can do it from jail. Do you think that if he is found guilty and he has the capacity to run, do you think that these court cases will occur prior to the 2024 election? I think there's definitely a chance. The case that is the cleanest and sort of, I think, could be ready for trial is the classified documents case that's right now scheduled for trial in May of 2024. So, you know, definitely before the November election. It's just like pretty straightforward. The evidence is the documents.

election. It's just like pretty straightforward. The evidence is the documents. There's a lot of recorded information that makes clear that he took the documents, that he bragged about the documents, that he tried to conceal having the documents. But I guess I would say the two federal cases, there's a real chance they could happen in the spring of 2024. And maybe the New York state, that's the hush money payment case involving the adult film actress. Yeah, I think that was a possibility too. Well, I got nervous after hearing the colonoscopy response. So, yes. You know, I think we can sometimes be quite nihilistic about British politics, but this is worse.

And I mean, the fact that it's like, that there's a genuine consideration that a likely guilty of federal crimes president will rule before a woman does is fascinating um do you think that there will ever be an acceptance of his guilt even if he is convicted is that something that you feel like you have any sense of a measure on you know there is a strong contingent right of the kind of Republican base that seems kind of unwilling to ever accept that Trump can do any wrong, you know. So I think that for the kind of hardest of hardcore Trumpists,

no, probably they'll never accept any wrongdoing, even if there are convictions. And those convictions would be rendered by, you know, juries. But I think that, you know, it looks like even all these charges have only sort of locked in his support among, again, his sort of hardest of hardcore supporters. That's not a majority. It's not even probably a plurality of the American public, but it is sort of the Republican base. And I think for them, probably the verdicts will make no real difference. But again, a girl can dream. So it could be that seeing him held to account, maybe that will mean the bloom is off the rose and maybe that will change public perception of him.

But at this point, I think all indications are that his supporters are not easily dissuaded. Last thing, I guess, is that there's this contention from the right that you have essentially got a two-tiered system. Basically, the Republicans argue that the Democrats have weaponised the Department of Justice. Do you think there's something in that argument? No.

Okay. Biden retained a Trump prosecutor. So Hunter Biden is facing real legal consequences. And Joe Biden has taken very serious care to make sure that the wheels of justice turn in a normal way. And if anything, he's stayed very far away from anything involving his son. Do you think there's a way that you would ever see the Republican Party separating themselves from Trump, even if the voters didn't?

You know, I think that there are signs that some of the kind of party leadership are distancing themselves from him somewhat. I think that you saw a little bit of that right after January 6th. Would you agree there's probably no likely chance that they wouldn't have him as their candidate given that he might run as an independent

and then ruin their chances? Right now it looks really unlikely. But again, like hope springs eternal. So it may be that the aggregate effect of all of these charges, they're just at some point, they may just say the baggage is too much, but there have not been a lot of signs

that that's happening anytime soon. Kate, what an amazing comprehensive answer of questions and how you keep so positive is genuinely so admirable. Can we all please give it up for Kate Shaw? She's smart. Before we go, I have a question for our audience. What I want to know is, do you think Trump will go to prison? Not whether or not he should, whether or not he will is what I want to know. Anyone who thinks that Trump will go to prison, give me a jumpsuit. Jumpsuit.

Whoa. Three of you. I mean, we have to ask the other question, so let's ask it. Anyone who thinks he'll go free, give me a free bird. Free bird! Somebody shouting at the back, what was that? Yeah, I think he'll be president again, and if you have been to Georgia or Arkansas or

Missouri, they absolutely adore him. You can't go anywhere without even pledging your allegiance to the American flag. I mean, even, I went to I think you could try. No, no, no, I laughed out loud because we were like at some caves and they were putting the flag and everything

and everyone was up in allegiance and I laughed and they wanted me to leave. I am more interested in the story than I initially thought I was. Do you feel like you're more interested in following this story than you would have been prior to the show? Yes. Okay, great. That's good. Excellent. All it took was the destruction of democracy.

Yes. And quite a few holes in the story that you then do have to go look up. So that's good. This has been TLDR, and if you made it all the way to the end of the episode, we are so proud of you, and we love to see you being the change you want to see in the world. Good for you. Go watch some reality TV.

You earned it. TLDR was written and hosted by Catherine Bohart with Tom Neenan, Sunil Patel and Professor Kate Shaw. It was also written by Madeleine Brettingham, Sarah Campbell, Emma Neguse and Pravanya Pillay. The producer was Victoria Lloyd. It was a Mighty Bunny production for BBC Radio 4. Call Jonathan Pye?

I want something better than that. No. What's wrong with Call Jonathan Pye? I want something better than that. No. What's wrong with Call Jonathan Pye? It's really boring. Okay, so let's all do a brain fart. Actually, what about that? Jonathan Pye's brain fart. It's hilarious.

Jonathan Pye, off my chest. Off my chest. Chewing the fat, chewing the pie. Chewing the cud. Cud? The title for my new phone-in show is Jonathan Pye cheoses Own Sick. I'm just spitballing. Let's just spitball.

Jonathan Pye Spits Balls. Shall we just stick with Call Jonathan Pye? Yes. Call Jonathan Pye. Listen first on BBC Sounds.