From the Kitchen Table: The Duffys - Douglas MacKinnon: Liberty Lessons From Those Who Risked It All

Episode Date: May 20, 2022

This week, Sean and Rachel sit down with former White House and Pentagon official, and author Douglas MacKinnon to discuss his new book, The 56: Liberty Lessons From Those Who Risked All to Sign The Declaration of Independence. Douglas shares the story behind the Fourth of July, analyzes the vision of the signers, and explains how they ended up being erased from our history. He later emphasizes why we should never twist or cancel our shared American history. Follow Sean and Rachel on Twitter: @SeanDuffyWI & @RCamposDuffy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Two freshly cracked eggs any way you like them. Three strips of naturally smoked bacon and a side of toast. Only $6 at A&W's in Ontario. Experience A&W's classic breakfast on now. Dine-in only until 11 a.m. Hey everyone, welcome to From the Kitchen Table. I'm your host, Sean Duffy, along with my co-host for the podcast, but also my partner in life and partner in raising kids,

my wife, Rachel Campos Duffy. That's right. Hello everyone, we're back with more conversations from our kitchen table. And Sean, today, I'm really excited because you brought home this book that a friend of yours gave you, your friend Ed. And I was like, the second I saw the cover and read the book jacket, I'm like, book them now. This is so exciting because we talk so much about how we're losing our liberty. This is so exciting because we talk so much about how we're losing our liberty. And a really amazing American named Douglas McKinnon, who, by the way, worked as a writer for, you know, just Ronald Reagan. Just Ronald Reagan. Just Ronald Reagan. George H.W. Bush and his work inside of the Pentagon, the White House. He wrote a book and listen to the title.

It's called The 56 Liberty Lessons from Those Who Risked All to Sign the Declaration of Independence. I mean, do we need this book now or what, Sean? Listen, now more than ever, because I think that so many of us think that freedom just came free. We don't look at all of the sacrifices that were made by the men, and they were men, who signed this Declaration of Independence. That's very sexist. I know it is. But they did. They risked all.

And we talk about this a lot. But, I mean, Douglas went into this idea so much more. But also, what it means today and why the left is trying to erase our founding fathers and the great work they did to secure our freedom. So, Douglas McKinnon, welcome to From the Kitchen Table. Thank you for joining us. Oh, Sean andon, welcome to From the Kitchen Table. Thank you for joining us. Oh, Sean and Rachel, thanks so much for having me.

I really appreciate it. I can't thank you enough for having me on. Oh, we're so excited. And by the way, Sean's already started the book and like I'm leaving on a trip. I have to go to the border

to do some reporting for Fox and Friends. And I'm like fighting with him about whether I'm going to be on a plane. I should have the book. So leave that book here. But he's I'm going to be on a plane. I should have that book. But he's like, I've already started it, so I should have the book. So anyway, let's get started right away, because I first want to ask you, why did you think it was important to write this book?

Why now? Well, Rachel, it was actually last year on the 4th of July. I was just doing some research to write a column. And then I just went across the usualth of July, I was just doing some research to write a column. And then I just went across, you know, the usual sort of liberal spectrum. And whether it was CNN, MSNBC, Washington Post, NPR, unfortunately, there were guests on or writers on all of those venues on the 4th of July, on the celebration of the birth of our nation, calling for the cancellation of Fourth of July and calling for the cancellation of the founding fathers. And as Sean alluded to, you really can't even say founding fathers anymore

because that's not allowed. Although, I will say in the book, and I don't know if Sean got there yet, but I have a chapter on the manufacturing mothers as well, and we can get into that because I think they were just as important at those kitchen tables in 1776. Absolutely. You know, you talked about it as I got into the book, it was a lot of the concepts, you know, the names were of the men, but the smart women who were there. And obviously a lot of their concepts were probably incorporated through the men, you know, in that time era into these documents. And so, I mean, Douglas, again, we all see this. We all see the left trying to cancel

the founding fathers, attack the Fourth of July, attack the very foundation of this country. And I think you've seen this firsthand. I mean, you kind of recognize there's the deep state that takes place in America, but why is it so important? Yeah, well, Sean, exactly. Because I think what we've talked about in the past, too, is I think over the last six decades, we've basically ceded control over the five major megaphones of our nation. And by that, I mean the media, entertainment, academia. And as we saw the last couple of years and then the last 10 years, so, you know, a great part of science and medicine as well.

And those megaphones control so much of what the American people are hearing. And then when you have so many people on those megaphones calling for the cancellation of our national holiday, calling for the cancellation of the founding fathers, it's, you know, sort of the cliche is, if not us, who, if not now, when? Right. But at some point, sort of to Teddy Roosevelt's speech about the man in the arena, we all have an obligation, I believe, to step into that arena and to fight for the rights that we ourselves are losing. the individual men. I want to talk about the parallels you've seen between the fight for liberty that they fought and the one that I think so many of us are trying to fight right now. But before we get into that, I just want to ask you, I'm sure you've put a lot of thought into it. Why are they so offended on the left by these founding principles, by these founding fathers? What is it that stands in the way of what they want to do

if we as Americans embrace our founding fathers and the principles of the Declaration? Well, because, Rachel, I think the easiest answer to that is so much of the left is all about they worship at the altar of government. They worship at the altar of big government instead of putting their faith in the American people. And as you know, our founding fathers put their faith in the American people. The reason they created this was because they were being so oppressed by the crown, you know, from 1770, basically, through 1776 and even before that they felt, and they were being strangled. And it was one of those things where they saw their rights being taken away from them because of tyranny of big

government. And so, but the left tends to love big government, whereas our founding fathers were building a system that the genius of our founding fathers who sacrificed so much was that they wanted to restore power back to the American people. And that really does, as Thomas Jefferson talked about many, many times, that frightens the left. Unfortunately, that frightens the people that love big government. And as government grows, the power of the individual is diminished. And as the power of the individual increases, you'll see a diminishment of power in government. That's so well stated. And you'll need to run it. Yeah, let's talk about the founding fathers. because so often we talk about the Fourth of July, and oftentimes we celebrate this concept or idea of our founding fathers, and specifically those 56 who signed the Declaration of Independence.

But talk to us about what it meant at that time for these 56 men to sign this document. I mean, it was treason, wasn't it? Sean, it was more than treason. What they were literally doing, and you know this and Rachel knows this, what they were literally doing was signing their death warrants. And every single one of those men knew by signing that document they were signing their death warrants. And then, unfortunately, because they do not tend to, as you know with your kids, they tend not to teach American history anymore in our schools, but so many of our founding fathers, so many of those 56, paid a severe price for signing our Declaration of Independence. Many of them had their homes burned to the ground, their cattle slaughtered, their wives arrested and sexually assaulted, their sons executed, all because they

signed that Declaration of Independence, and they knew if they did not do that, we would not have a new nation. And to then try to cancel that heroism and that genius, because it doesn't fit the prism of 2022. Again, people tend on the left of making a huge mistake when they look at 1776, not only through the prism of 2022, at 1776, not only through the prism of 2022, but through the prism of sort of, you know, far left liberalism, which does not fit that time. Yeah, so really quick, I want to before I get to my next question, that when we say we're coming to you from the kitchen table, we literally are and our two year old is here. So that's what you're hearing here in the background.

Just know that this conversation about liberty is to secure liberty for those for little ones like that. I mean, literally, that's what we're fighting for. So what I mean, we know some of the some of the names in here are very familiar to us. Others aren't. Tell me what surprise like something that surprised you or something that as you were doing the research, you thought, wow, I never knew this happened? Well, thanks for asking that, Rachel, because that's exactly the point. When you do one of these books, you tend to really dive deep into it, hopefully, if you're doing a good job. And what I discovered was, and we're all familiar with Thomas Jefferson and John Adams and Benjamin Franklin, but in many ways, what I discovered was the one person that was really the architect of all of this,

of the Declaration of Independence and of the independence movement, was Richard Henry Lee from Virginia. You know, and he was the chairman of the committee to draft the Constitution, I'm sorry, to draft the Declaration of Independence. But then what happened is literally right before they were going to sign the Declaration of Independence. But then what happened is literally right before they were going to sign the Declaration of Independence, his wife became deathly ill and he had to leave. And so what happened was they transferred the chairmanship of that committee from Richard Henry Lee the day before, basically, to Thomas Jefferson. And it's not that Thomas Jefferson wasn't the genius that we all know him to be. It was just that because of an illness of his wife, Richard Henry Lee never got the credit

for being the true architect behind the scenes of pushing all of this forward. And again, at an amazing risk to himself. You know, I said I didn't know that, and I'm probably going to learn that as I get into the book. Yeah, because that's chapter four, and you're only in Chapter 3. I just started reading on the train back from D.C. And again, I got a sneaky beat because it comes out today. But you mentioned that people lost their cattle. Their wives were arrested and sexually assaulted.

Their sons were murdered. And you look at the trials and sexually assaulted, their sons were murdered. And you look at the trials and tribulations, the cost of freedom that truly these signers paid. At the end of the day, how many of them said, aha, this idea of America, of liberty and freedom wasn't worth the price that my family paid. Sean, not one of them. Not one of them sat back down, ever, even after going through everything they went through. And by the way, then a number of the founders ended up being destitute. A number of the 56 lost every penny they had for this cause, and they never once regretted it because they knew to live under the boot of tyranny was not life. We'll have more of this conversation after this.

Light up Black Friday with Freedom Mobile and get 50 gigs to use in Canada, the U.S., and Mexico for just $35 a month for 18 months. Plus, get a one-time gift of 5 gigs of Roam Beyond data. Conditions apply. Details at freedommobile.ca. You know, I look at this, and again, we are in this fight for liberty and freedom today. And we do have this radical leftism, Marxism, that to your point is well-made, that has taken over all these different corners of culture and media and now in government. And it feels like the left, and I get depressed sometimes because it feels like the left is, I mean, the right is in strategic retreat. Republicans are in strategic retreat. I don't see the Republicans winning anywhere in any

of these battles. And I think sometimes it feels- You see them winning elections, but not really taking back these institutions that Douglas is talking about, right? Is that what you're saying? That's exactly right. And as I think about it, as we're canceled, as we're shamed for, I mean, these very simple ideas that our founders had that created the greatest country, the most prosperous, the most generous, the most innovative country on the face of the earth. And we're canceled and we're shamed and we're blamed. But what we have to stand up and do right now is nothing compared to what our founders had to stand up and endure to actually give us this gift of liberty and freedom. Well, that's exactly right. And it's one of these things, Sean, Well, that's exactly right. And it's one of these things, Sean, is like, you know, going back to, you know, if not us, who, if not now, when? Because in a way, and I talk about it in the book, is we can all be sort of a mini Paul Revere in the sense that unless and until they imprison us or unless and until they kill us, that they cannot take our voices. They cannot take the voices of the American people. And we have the power, not in the macro sense, but we certainly have the power in the micro sense to talk about

the genius of these 56, to talk about the genius of our founding fathers. And we can do that at church, you know, at work, at the bowling league, you know, in the supermarket. But we have to start having that conversation again. It's almost like sometimes the Americans don't remember what the history was like, or sometimes they're afraid to talk about it. But we can't allow the left to take our voices, because if they take our voices, they're taking our liberty. And again, and that was something that, believe it or not, Thomas Paine, with his book, Common Sense, that book, you know, one of my editors said, you know, Doug, this is like a mini version of Common Sense. And that's a very kind thing to say,

but it's also a great exaggeration. But there is some truth to it in the sense that Thomas Paine's book in 1776, in a population of 2.5 million people back then, sold or ended up in the hands of 500,000 people. That's the equivalent, Rachel and Sean, today of 70 million Americans. And what happened with that book when Thomas Paine put out, which was really a 47-page pamphlet, but it was a small paperback, when he put that book out, it put so much pressure on Richard Henry Lee, on Thomas Jefferson, on Benjamin Franklin, on John Adams, because basically one-fifth or more of the America of the colonists already had that,

and they were wondering, how are you going to save our liberty? And so it's one of these things where we do have the power to get this conversation going again. We just have to step into that arena. about it on this podcast and when we're on television is the next generation and how normalized these ideas of censorship have become to them that so many young people, you know, you think about even the young people in the 60s, you know, and even before they were the voices that were, you know, challenging the establishment. And it's quite the opposite now. It feels like young people are the conformers. They are self-censoring to get good grades in school. And eventually they just stop thinking for themselves. And these ideas that you have in this book and that you talk about and you celebrate, so many of them, Douglas, aren't getting these ideas in school. And too many kids are in the public school system or in private schools that are woke. And they're not parents who grew up knowing who these men are. These 56 men are or at least the top names of the 56. reading the Federalist Papers and they're studying these documents. They are the absolute tiniest minority.

So I think what the starting point is for parents and uncles and grandparents and aunts to read this book and to share this with their kids, isn't that the starting point? to share this with their kids. Isn't that the starting point? It was for me, Rachel, because for me, it was like, okay, once I got that wake up call, it was like a five alarm fire wake up call on a last 4th of July that so many people on the left wanted to cancel the 4th of July and wanted to cancel the 56 and the founding fathers. It was like, how can I get something out in print right away that will at least make it much harder for them to do that? And again, talking about the greatness of this country. So I, and I'm a product of, of public schools. I grew up in abject poverty. I grew up homeless as a child. By the time I was 17 years of age, I had been evicted from 34 homes as a child. I literally lived in cars. And yet this

nation, the nation that our founding fathers created, gave me the opportunities to stand on my own with self-accountability, okay, and a great work ethic, and by the way, a huge amount of faith, and to build something and build a life for myself that I could not have done in any other country given the way I grew up. And I think it's so important that American children understand what was given to us with the creation of the United States of America and why that's so important. And this blueprint lives. This blueprint is out there. The founding fathers, the 56, left us this blueprint. We just have to remember to go back and look at it every once in a while. And this book spells out exactly how that blueprint works. And you know what? You're right. It is a blueprint. It's a blueprint on how you navigate

a government, how you navigate freedom and power instilled in the people. But that's why I think the left has worked overtime to cancel, to shun, to not teach our kids about that blueprint that you just mentioned. And so Rachel and I, it's interesting that we talk about the founding fathers, at least briefly in some of the speeches that we've given, the sacrifices that they've made, but never ever had a resource like this. And that's why we were so excited about you coming on today, a resource that lays out the men, the 56, and the sacrifices they made to pass this gift onto us. And why I think the book is so important, again, as we talk as parents and as grandparents or aunts and uncles to our kids, so often we ourselves aren't armed with the knowledge of

history to actually educate our kids. And your book, I think, and again, I don't hawk books at all on our podcast. Yeah, we're just so excited. I just think this is such a great resource for people to read and then be able to go, it's my job. It's my job to talk to my kids or talk to my grandkids or talk to my nieces and nephews about these concepts that are being shunned in the school system and on social media and in media and frankly, in government itself. And before we, because we want to get into a couple of the men and have you sort of talk a little more in depth about that. But before, in addition to getting the knowledge that you have laid out for us in the 56, just as important, I think, is for parents and grandparents to know the fathers in public school history books and civics classes.

They've also canceled, Douglas, the absolute death and destruction caused by communism and socialism. So many kids, when you poll, you know, teenagers and college students will say that they love socialism. They'll actually say they would prefer to live in a socialist or communist country over our country. And yet they don't know what that looks like. They haven't studied or they don't even know who Pol Pot is. They don't know how many people Stalin, you know, was responsible for killing. I think it's just as important to know both sides of that. responsible for killing. I think it's just as important to know both sides of that. Yeah, yeah, Rachel, I think that's exactly right. And to Sean's point earlier, you know,

it's one of these things where, you know, my sort of being is about sort of, you know, conservative values and my faith. And it's about what's the best thing for the people of the United States of America, right? What's the best thing for our children going forward? And to Sean's point earlier, unfortunately, even a number of Republicans seem to be abdicating their responsibilities to our nation. And going back to those five major megaphones in terms of sort of educating those children again, you know, if you look at the sort of the spectrum of super wealthy, either Republicans, conservatives, libertarians, or people of faith, you're talking about collectively well over $1 trillion. And at

some point, again, it's about, do they have a responsibility to get into the media game? Do they have a responsibility to create institutions of higher learning? Do they have a responsibility to start an entertainment company? And also, by the way, if we have to, to create medical schools and schools of science. And again, it's not to turn them into conservative propaganda machines, but it's to create institutions where you are allowed to speak, where you have a free voice, where your voice is valued, where you can't be canceled. And I think that's where some sort of ultra-wealthy conservatives, libertarians, and Republicans are abdicating their responsibility. I just wrote about this recently in a column, and they have to step up also.

Yeah, they're dumping—well, it's just a misallocation of funds. They're giving—we talk about this all the time. of funds. They're giving, you know, we talk about this all the time. They're giving money to super PACs and to think tanks, and they're not actually, you know, giving their money over to take over these institutions that you take, or to create new ones. And we've been talking about that a lot. I mean, we complain on the right all the time about bad, woke universities, but we don't celebrate and lift up and bring a spotlight on those universities and colleges that are doing a great job and actually teaching in a free way. But it brings up a really good point, though. It's like here you need a South African who's the richest man in the world who comes to America and makes his money at PayPal and then starts an electric car company,

celebrated by the left, but also believes in the American idea as a South African, in free speech, in debate. Elon Musk, and he says, I'm going to spend, what, $44 billion to actually buy Twitter. And again, he's selling his Tesla stock here to bring in other wealthy friends. But to go, I think this is a really good idea that we should be able to debate freely on these platforms and we shouldn't be censored. And I think it goes to your other point, Douglas,

that if you can shut down these ideas, if you can shut down this blueprint, you're able to radically reform this country into something that our founders would never recognize. Yeah. Fundamentally transformed. Yes. Yeah. And that's one of the most important points, I think, for, you know, Rachel and Sean, is that the left gets so much accomplished through omission. Right. Because they do control so much of the megaphone. If they don't report it, it didn't happen. And so many working class Americans, the people we mostly really, truly respect, don't have the time always to dig deep into the news.

And so if they don't see it, maybe it didn't happen. And the left understands that's a very powerful tool. tool. Or by the way, if you just repeat the story enough times, like Russia collusion with Donald Trump, when the truth comes out that there was no Russia collusion, nobody hears it. They just heard that Donald Trump is an agent of Russia. I've talked to so many liberals who still believe that. And then the truth comes out that that was a Hillary Clinton campaign made up document that made this allegation wasn't actually true. Most Americans don't hear the correction. They just heard the two years of hype from the left wing media. And that's that's how they're so effective. We'll be back with much more after this. Visa and OpenTable are dishing up something new. Get access to primetime dining reservations by

adding your Visa Infinite Privilege Card to your OpenTable account. From there, you'll unlock first-come, first-served spots at select top restaurants when booking through OpenTable. Learn more at OpenTable.ca forward slash Visa Dining. So Douglas, pick for me one or two of these men who you think you can tell us a little bit about them and who you think are sort of examples of people that we can look to that, you know, maybe in a parallel way in our battle for liberty right now, that we can look to these guys you can go go to chapter whatever read about this guy because this guy did this and sacrifice that sacrifice this and this is what we need to be thinking about in this battle yeah i think one of the most obvious ones but it's but it's a much better story rachel than most people realize is benjamin franklin okay because benjamin franklin is Benjamin Franklin, okay? Because Benjamin Franklin was just an amazing person, and I believe probably intuitively he was a genius, but it's one of these things where he fell out of favor

with his brother early in life, and at 17 years of age, okay, he left Boston and ended up going to New York, and then from New York he walked okay he walked to fit and which is he walked the still without knowing nobody knowing nothing having one dollar in his pocket okay and got to Philadelphia found a job established himself and then and then the end and it's amazing too because the perseverance that he had was remarkable once

you read his background and what he went through and then what he accomplished. And it was one of these things, too, where he did it with basically, he loved education, but he was not an educated man per se. And I think that lesson is so important to working class Americans who sometimes get very much looked down upon by the left, right? So my grandfather, my family emigrated from Scotland to Nova Scotia down to Boston, right? And my grandfather, who left school at 14 years of age to help support his family, was one of the most educated people I ever met, except he did not have a formal education. And he was a mentor to me. And again, Benjamin Franklin, just through real work and

just perseverance. I mean, again, for me, that was one of the most inspirational chapters that I wrote because every single word about that to me spoke to working class America, to the Americans that are doing everything possible to raise their children the right way, to follow the rule of law, to respect our nation, and to realize that, you know, one of these 56, and there's many stories like that, but he especially will speak to that class of people because he was, in fact, one of them. You know, I love that. And I also love, again, it's 56 people, but it's 56 individuals.

I mean, this idea that each of us has the power to make a difference. And I think sometimes, Sean and I, you know, we get on this podcast or we sit around our kitchen table for real and talk about, you know, all the things that are going wrong and we can feel hopeless. But you read these stories and you go, wow, it's just one person networking with another person who shares the same vision and you can make a difference. I think as I like this, you talk a lot about what's happening today, which I love in this book, but then you have a chapter on each of the 56. And again, we know a lot of the names, Thomas Jefferson, John Adams, Sam Adams, Ben Franklin. I mean, there's a number of people that are at the forefront of our minds when we think of founding fathers, but there's 56 of them that signed this document, obviously very big

names in their time. But as history has gone, we've kind of forgotten who they are and you bring them back to life in this book. And I know in their day, they were not unsung heroes, but today, because they've been forgotten, so many of them, they are unsung heroes. And I think in this moment, it's unsung heroes who are teaching their kids, unsung heroes who stand up and defend someone who's being canceled by the left. Or go to a school board meeting or run for school board or try to make a difference in a small way. That you don't get the adulation, but you're part of a movement that can help save this country. And Rachel and I have talked about this a lot, Douglas, is that there's more of us who believe in these concepts than do not.

And so powerfully the left has canceled us and then taken over these institutions that have started to indoctrinate our kids. And that's why this time is so critical but also so dangerous, which is, again, I just want to point out that you have a chapter on each of the men who signed all 56 and who they were, what they did, what it meant for their lives, the good, the bad, and the ugly. And a lot of it was ugly in their lives. Yeah. To sign this document. Yeah. Yeah. Most of it was too, because again, a lot of them, yeah most of it was too because again you know a lot of them the founding fathers of the 56 you know did come from some money but so many of them were just very poor farmers trying to make a living but they realized you know again if not me who if not now when and they decided to you know

step up into that arena that teddy roosevelt talks about and again one of the things that we have to remember too is you know whether we like it or not, so many people on the left are willing to step into that arena and do battle. And again, they tell you up front what they stand for, what they're going to do. And again, we have the power. The majority of the American people think like us, believe in the same things that we believe in, but their voices have been taken away.

And again, we can, as these 56 men showed, just again, just by, to Rachel's point about it starts at the kitchen table too, right? And having that conversation with your neighbor, having that conversation with your friends at work, having that conversation at church, having that conversation at the bowling league, it doesn't matter, but we have to restart the conversation and we cannot let our shared collective American history be canceled. This is crazy. It's nuts. And I'll tell you, the other thing I really, you know,

picked up from the book and the little bit that I have read in it, and I'm telling you, I'm going to devour this. I love it, and I'm telling you, I'm going to devour this. I love it. His pride. You know, you saw this past week that Joe Biden thought he could, you know, smear Donald Trump and all the people, you know, who supported him with this moniker of ultra MAGA. What does MAGA mean? Make America great again. Yeah, you can smear me with that. I love it. Call me that all day long. I want to make America great. And I think what's interesting here is that all Americans have people living in America who are their, you know, they are the ancestors for people who live here. Maybe many of the people for whom these are their ancestors, you know, might be ashamed right now who these

people are. they shouldn't, we should take pride in this. And I look at so many of the people who are leading our country, especially in the tech world, in the in the, in the commerce world, in corporations, they're looking to China, they actually admire China. And I look at this, and I go, wow, we should be so proud of our history. We should be so proud of these 66 men. And we should be so proud that this is who we come from. And, you know, I look at China. I don't want to be China. I don't admire anything about the communist system at all. And it's not just learning these stories, but really taking pride in who we are and owning it again.

Well, I think that's right, Rachel. And again, what these 56 signers were saying was, you know, the reason they rose up and did something was because they understood in 1776 that totalitarian rule ultimately is going to destroy the people. totalitarian rule ultimately is going to destroy the people. And again, and when you look at China, when you look at Russia, when you look at other nations, you know, and of that half totalitarian rule, they are the enemy of the people. What Thomas Jefferson said was totalitarians fear the people. They fear their thinking. They fear their faith. And we cannot allow that. And we just have to remember, as we were just talking about, Sean, again, you know, that blueprint, it already exists. We don't have to recreate the blueprint. These 56 men created the blueprint for us, and it exists if we can just get it taught again. I want to just close out, Douglas, with, by the way, I'm going to, again, for both,

both of us, both of us, all to sign the Declaration of Independence. It's called the 56, and the book jacket says, before they and the Fourth of Independence. It's called the 56th. And the book jacket says, before they and the Fourth of July are banned. You're absolutely right. Sean and I had a similarly depressing Fourth of July because we saw, we actually enjoyed our Fourth of July. We were in a very patriotic place, but we were also seeing some of the things that you saw in the media. And we were going, what is happening to this country? I want to read this from your book as we start to close out here. Those who believe such totalitarian censorship

could never come to be in the United States of America need only review how quickly and brutally many on the left were able to create the woke cancel culture to silence those they oppose today. The book also says that document and those men created, that document and those men created our history, history which should never be bent, twisted, censored, or banned to fit any ideological narrative. If it is good, let us praise it. If it is bad, let us condemn it and learn from it.

But let us never twist, censor, or cancel it. Amen to that. I can't tell you how blessed we are to have you on the show, how blessed this country is to have you take time out of your life to write a book that we need right now, I think more than ever. We need the courage and the hope that comes from this to know that individuals can make a difference. And Douglas, as I say this frequently, but those 56 didn't say, hey, listen, maybe someone else should sign this document. The price for me is too high. I don't want to do it. Let someone else do it. That message to those is today, don't think someone else is going to save your country. Don't think someone else is going to stand up and push back against cancel culture. That's right.

There's no Calvary coming. You are the Calvary. And if you want to save it, you have to be part of the movement, right? Just like these 56, they didn't look at someone else. They raised their hand and they signed. They did it. They made the sacrifice just like all of us have to do today. Yeah, I think that's right, Sean. And again, as we talked about it, many of them at just horrendous sacrifice, right? And for me, by the way, because of this subject matter, I'm working with two former high-level government officials to try to create a foundation to protect the history of these men and to protect their reputations. And again, so for me, if there are any proceeds from this book, it's going to go to that cause, because I believe that's the right thing to do with a book like this. Because, again, this is about our shared American history, which the left should never be allowed to cancel.

And it doesn't, you know, we just have to step up and realize this is happening. You know, even at the archives, they are now putting trigger warnings to people because they might get triggered by our history. What you're doing is a great service. By the way, Donald Trump tried to do that with the 1776 project. I was in Colorado and met some young people who are still working for that. So even though Joe Biden canceled that, the foundation continues and hopefully will be revived if and when a Republican president is elected. So, Douglas, I think what we should do is let's trigger them again. Let's put this on the New York Times best. Yes, let's put the founding fathers back back in the public consciousness.

Well, Sean, I appreciate that, because, as you know, they're going to try to squash this book every chance they get. So any any voice I can get out there to sort of carry the message of this book? Well, honestly, it really does go to, you know, what Thomas Paine did about just spreading the word across the country that, you know, our country is full of tens of millions of American patriots, and we just have to make their voices count again. Absolutely. And, Douglas, the hope is that, the hope I have is the knowledge that I have,

that we were born for Liberty, that our hearts are made for Liberty. We want that. Everyone wants it. It's why for all of our flaws, everyone still wants to come to this country. And so I, I thank you for this.

I think you're a Patriot. We're going to have to have you back. Cause Sean is dying to ask you about Ronald Reagan. Are you going to have to do that? I was is dying to ask you about Ronald Reagan. Are you going to have to? I'm going to have to wait. Next time. Yeah, next time we're going to have to do that. I was mouthing Rachel. Can I ask him about Reagan? I'm like, I got to talk about the 50s thing. I know you have to go and we have to go.

But, you know, look at presidents and Reagan, how they bring in these really smart people that continue to do the wonderful work and continue the vision of their bosses long after their boss is gone. And you're one of those who have done that. Yeah, Sean, just on that point, for 10 seconds, a great story with President Reagan. He and I were once in the Oval Office talking about our alcoholic dads. And he started crying and I started crying. So it was a very special moment. So we can talk about that next time. That's that's that's amazing.

I love it. And by the way, that the yeah, those those experiences are very formative. Douglas, you're amazing. I'm going to immediately get off our podcast to call my producers. I want to make sure we have you on Fox and Friends. I think this is this is this is the message of the time. we have you on Fox and Friends. I think this is the message of the time. Liberty lessons

from those who risked all to sign the Declaration of Independence before they and the Fourth of July are banned by Douglas McKinnon, a patriot. Thanks for joining us at the Kitchen Table. Thank you, Douglas. Rachel and Sean, it's an amazing honor. God bless you both. God bless you as well.

Listen, everyone, thank you for joining us at the Kitchen Table. Love this conversation. Get the book, The 56. God bless you as well. Listen, everyone, thank you for joining us at the kitchen table. Love this conversation. Get the book, The 56. Make sure you're educated. Get it onto the New York Times bestseller. And you have the knowledge and depth to educate your kids. Actually, get it for your kids.

I agree. If you have a middle schooler or a high schooler, get it for them. I started reading it and loved it. By the way, Father's Day around the corner, great Father's Day gift for sure. Or belated Mother's Day gift. Or belated Mother's Day gift. But honestly, buy an extra copy to donate to your child's school library. I'm telling you, these lessons need to get out there. What a pleasure to have him. Just amazing. All right. Well, I've enjoyed the conversation, Sean. You can tell. We were like giddy here. Let us know if you like this podcast as well. Subscribe, rate, and review it

at foxnewspodcast.com or wherever you download podcasts. We hope to see you around the kitchen table next. Have a great week. Bye-bye.