From the Kitchen Table: The Duffys - The Battle Against "Big Food" & America's Health Crisis

Episode Date: July 7, 2023

Former Coca-Cola executive and Co-Founder of TrueMed Calley Means joins to discuss how food companies use corporate lobbying to keep healthy items from reaching the mouths of Americans.   Later, Calley talks about the goals of TrueMed, and how every American can retake their health with diet and exercise. Follow Sean and Rachel on Twitter: @SeanDuffyWI & @RCamposDuffy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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BetMGM.com for terms and conditions. Must be 19 years of age or older to wager. Ontario only. Please play responsibly. If you have any questions or concerns about your gambling or someone close to you, please contact Connex Ontario at 1-866-531-2600 to speak to an advisor free of charge. BetMGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with iGaming Ontario. Hey everyone, welcome to From the Kitchen Table. I'm Sean Duffy along with my co-host for the podcast, my partner in life and my wife, Rachel

Campos Duffy. Sean, so great to be back at our kitchen table and today we have a great guest, somebody I've talked to often, both on Jesse Waters show when I was hosting for him, but also on Fox and Friends. And he is Callie Means. He's the co-founder of a company called TrueMed, which seeks to promote the idea that food and exercise are actually medicine. Boy, that is a revolutionary thought.

Callie, thanks for joining us today. So pumped to dig in. So talk to me about food as medicine. Boy, that is a revolutionary thought. Kelly, thanks for joining us today. So pumped to dig in. So talk to me about food as medicine and what we as a culture are getting wrong when it comes to the way we feed ourselves and also the forces behind how our eating culture, if you will, has developed to what it is right now. Yeah, I really just take it from a top-down approach. I mean, let's just think about the economy. We talk about the economy. It's the most important issue in polls. What is that? It's human beings, right, who are trying to live a happy and meaningful life. And just fundamentally, what we have in this country, it's very simple. But when we are, to an unprecedented degree, putting toxic food into our body, to a degree that's evolutionarily just unprecedented.

I mean, it's almost 70% of our diet in the United States. It's really toxic. It's ultra-processed food with ingredients that did not exist 100 years ago. ingredients that did not exist 100 years ago. So, you know, the atomic units, the basic units, the economy, humans, Americans, are fundamentally, we're eating an extremely unhealthy diet, right? We have sleep is two hours down in 100 years. We're living a significantly more sedentary lifestyle. And then we basically have weapons of mass destruction, you know, particularly with kids that drive up chronic stress. So these basic like triggers that really are the foundation of creating, you know, a happy, you know, and meaningful and productive

life are just all slanted against the American people. And I really do feel like we have this Orwellian situation where we're often debating trivia, you know, on a day-to-day basis in the halls of Congress. What's really happening, you know, when you really look at it, and I think the most important issue in the world, you know, it all boils down to food. It boils down to the most important fuel that we're putting in our body, particularly with kids. We have a 30% childhood prediabetes rate. Over 20% of teens have fatty liver disease. Okay, this was a condition that was only seen in elderly alcoholics. A diabetes doctor a generation ago would never have seen a child with prediabetes.

We have 50% of kids overweight or obese. And then, of course, as you get to adults, it's much worse. So, you know, it's the first order issue. I think that underpins every other. And then, of course, the medical system profits. I think incentives explain everything. And, you know, working for Pharma and the medical system early in my career, you know, it's very clear. There's not evil people conspiring here for the most part, but it's very clear that when more patients get sick, that's what drives up their profits. And it's the largest industry

in the country. So I think you have some very broken incentives where, you know, the biggest industries in the country are really prompting, you know, the biggest industries in the country are really profiting, you know, on the food side from people getting, frankly, you know, more addictive, cheaper, less healthy food. And then on the health care side, you know, I'm sure that profiting this machine, this industrial complex that's profiting from people being sick. So, Rachel, you've said this is the sleeper issue of this campaign. I think people are starting to connect the dots and wake up. I think you see, you know, everyone from both sides of the aisle actually in Patsy Mott talking about this. So, but it's connecting the dots. It's connecting the dots on what's really happening,

you know, and what really is the root cause of a lot of other, I think, issues we're seeing in America. So, McKaylee, if you look at what we put in our bodies, right, the food that we eat that comes from, we'll call it big food, and you bring out a good point, that causes us to spend a lot of money on big pharma and a lot of money on big healthcare. As you mentioned, the economy, what is the economy? What is economics? If we weren't spending so much money to try to make ourselves healthy from the toxins we're putting in our body, we would have so much more money and time to put into so many other things in the economy. Because health care is one of the most expensive things that that Americans spend money on. that, we're a fatter, unhealthier population, which means we're less able to recruit young, healthy, strong men and women to join the army to potentially defend us against foreign enemies. So this, I mean, this is truly a threat to our very existence. I don't know how many wake-up

calls we need to have, Sean. The DOD recently came out that 17% of 21 year old males are even eligible to join the military. Well, only 17 percent are eligible to join the military or 17 percent are eligible. That's correct. That's correct. It's under 20. There was a report from the military that under 20 percent meet the fitness criteria. Yeah. And now they're changing, by the way. I just read that they're going to change the requirements because they don't know what to do. They need more people, but they're too fat and unfit, so they'll just change the standards.

So Admiral Mike Mullen, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs, a while back said that our food system, our dietary issues, our obesity is one of the greatest national security threats facing the country. Obviously, Michelle Obama talked about school lunches and she ended up being co-opted by big food, but it shouldn't have been the first way to be frank. It should have been the president. It should have been the secretary of the treasury. It should have been the secretary of defense talking about that. This is an existential issue. You know, you already talk about the economy when you talk about the national defense. You know, we just have systematically Americans that just aren't at their best. I mean, this all goes to very basic things. But if you're overweight, if you're feeding your body with with really crappy ingredients, you know, you are just not going to be at your best. So here's what's just come out, Callie, as an example of what we're talking about,

because this was the FDA just approved. They just gave the go ahead for lab grown meat. And I want to describe what that is. And I want to get your opinion right after. So lab-grown meat is taking a small sample of cells from livestock, such as chickens or cows, cultivating in a lab, then processing it inside of a steel vessel called a bioreactor, which then will make it look and taste like real meat, so they say. And then, you know, and now, by the way, foodies, like I'm kind of confused about this, Callie. Like you have Chef Jose Andres from Spain, who's, you know, is the most famous chef out of,

you know, Spain. You'd think he's a foodie that he would say, no way to this, because so many other European countries are becoming a lot more jealous and, you know, controlling over their food supply. They don't want this stuff to happen. And yet there are already orders for this lab meat, which is like frankenfood. What will something like this

do to the inside of our body? Yeah. So when, with the Jose Andres and with the, whenever you have somebody that's, um, that's, that's,'s endorsing this, it's kind of surprising. You just got to follow the money. There's no question he's on the payroll from this company that's funded $500 million by Bill Gates and the Middle Eastern autocrats. So there's no question there's a financial interest in working for food companies, as we've talked about. It's just a playbook. You find the thought leaders who influence public opinion, you pay them. I mean, when I was working for Coke, we paid the LNAACP to say the parents who were worried about kids drinking too much Coke and thought we shouldn't be government funding Coke were racist. you know, fashions himself as a social justice fighter. You know, he's top of the list of somebody to pay off.

So that happened. That's just part of the playbook to confuse people. But yeah, let's just get back to basics here. You know, I think what's fundamentally happening, if you really break it down, is that we've lost our way a little bit. And I think we have to acknowledge this, because I think as Americans, and certainly me when I was initially working for Food and Pharma, we're kind of proud

of the ingenuity of American agriculture, right? We talk about life expectancy going up 2x from American-driven healthcare innovations. And I think we need to acknowledge these things all started with good intentions. Our shift to this ultra-processed diet started after World War II when we really had to feed the world. And there was this push for more shelf stability. So we really pushed to create new ingredients and new chemicals that would enable food to not rot, so we could ship it around the world. That's how this all started. But that led to the creation and where we are today of ingredients that our body just isn't evolutionarily made to eat. So the three ingredients that are the foundation of the American diet right now

are number one, added sugar. So this is a new invention in just the past 100 years, the processing of the sugar that really didn't exist. Now it's a foundation of our diet. An average kid is eating 100 times more sugar than they did 100 years ago. We also created seed oils. So seed oils are now the top source of American fat. Soybean oil is actually the top single ingredient for American calories. That's an entirely processed ingredient that's created by John Rockefeller early in the 1900s as really a byproduct of industrial oil production. It's an inflammatory processed ingredient that's much cheaper than other fats and is now the top source of our calories. And the other is processed grains. So the processing is something our body is not used to. It takes the fiber off and it makes that

grain when it hits our bloodstream without that fiber that blunts the glucose impact. It basically is effectively sugar. And the fiber which rots, that's the process in taking the fiber off, actually has a lot of the nutrition and blunts the fiber impact. So what's happened while we're in this mess is through subsidies, through corporate capture of these initial good intentions that have led to lobbying and subsidies where we now have 90% of our agriculture subsidies, more agriculture subsidies than every other country in the world combined, go to the basic components of these processed foods and 0.4% only go to fruits and vegetables and natural foods. We subsidize today from the government more for tobacco than we do for fruits and vegetables. So we've created this

system where there's this centrifugal force to creating and incentivizing these ingredients to create these shelf-stable foods. And that's what's gotten us into this mess, putting these inflammatory foods. And let's just get very basic here. These are just not foods that were evolutionary created to eat. These are literally foods that were created in a lab in the past 100 years. That is what clearly led to the influx of all these conditions. So we look at the solution clearly is going back to basics. I'm not against technology, but we should be using technology to help our farmers to grow more sustainable, more natural food. We're not going to out-hack our biology. The problem that we're in right now is that we tried to out-hack

our food system. We're eating frankenfood. And then instead of addressing that root cause that we're putting inflammatory toxic food into our body, which is leading to explosion of literally every chronic disease, again, diabetes, cancer, heart disease, dementia, autoimmune conditions, allergies. They're all exploding all at once. We're all acting like these are separate things. It's a very simple thing. But there's limited profit in getting back to organic broccoli. There's not a big broccoli lobby.

Maybe we need one. We do. not really lobby, right? To the farmers that are trying. Maybe we need one. We do. And the farmers try to raise that's the real, you know, you may need,

and get back to, get back to good farming tactics. There's less of a lobby for them. There's profit in this frankenfood. So we really have this issue of frankenfood and we're solving it with even deeper.

With pharma. We'll kill the intruders and stop death. You cut out the middleman. You cut out the processors. So you go from farm to shipping to stores, right? When you're cutting out big food, you might have big farmers, might have big supermarkets, but you don't have the big processors in between,

which obviously they don't like that. But let's talk about then, very simply, when you're talking about food, is it very basic to go grains, fruits, vegetables? Meat. Meat, dairy? I mean, it's like go back to what was raised on a farm, what grows in a field. Yeah. Is that where you're coming from?

Yeah. When you say go back to basics, is that it? It's just understanding the basic points of what we're putting in our body. Just go back to basics, is that it? putting things in our body that we literally just aren't made to eat. That's number one. Number two, if you trace it a little farther, and I hate to give Europe credit on anything, but there are thousands of chemicals and pesticides because we have pushed this monocropping situation where we incentivize and have big fields of wheat and corn and soy and not biodiversity. We have to now use pesticides because the natural processes of biodiversity, when you have a lot of things growing next to each other and animals on the same, which is the way farming's been forever, that creates natural pesticides, natural fertilizers. We've gotten past that. So we have pesticides and chemicals, thousands that are banned in other

countries. So we're just fundamentally, like the basic point, the most important issue I think in America is we're literally feeding ourselves unnatural poisonous ingredients um so from a public policy perspective you know there's a couple things you can do that and then people say this is complicated nutrition it's complicated it's really it's really not complicated we're actually following government records the government actually uh recommends with the us guidelines, right, to eat 10% of your diet as added sugar. That is their recommendation. 95% of the academics who are on the most recent panel under President Trump, actually, this is bipartisan, were paid for by sugar or pharma companies. The US government through totally rigged panels and studies has recommended seed

oils. It's recommended highly processed grains. The government study right now, the leading study from the NIH says Cheerios is more healthy than quinoa, than whole grain quinoa, a study paid for by the NIH and cereal companies, which we talked about, Rachel. So you have the government basically obfuscating and saying, really this Orwellian thing that these frankenfoods are more healthy than natural foods. So just stopping that, just taking that corruption out and having health leaders just tell us natural foods. Sean, if we as a country, if we as a country cut those three ingredients out of our diet,

sugar, seed oils, highly processed grains, it would almost force us to get to more natural foods. It would transform the economy. It would also, of course, transform our budget trajectory. You know, we're talking about, you know, I think, again, it's a bizarre world where we're talking about, you know, little tweaks to the tax code to solve this budget crisis. We need a revolution, you a revolution in growth and our human capital. And what's happening now, what's bankrupting the country is diabetics. We spend more on diabetes management, significantly more than defense budget. That can be brought to zero

if we just cut those processed foods. So I'm a free market guy. I don't think we should be banning anything, but the government shouldn't be recommended recommending it. And we should not be subsidizing. I totally agree. Go ahead, John, because I want to talk about another piece of this. is that the American taxpayer is not just subsidizing, but actually paying through food stamps for people to buy really f***ing food that then makes them sick. And then we, the taxpayers, are also paying for their pharma bills and then also for their medical bills. And so if you look at, yeah, vegetables and fruits and grains, well, grains are more expensive, but vegetables and fruits oftentimes are.

If we were actually incentivizing people to eat those foods, we save massive amounts of money. And I'm a free market guy, too. But I'm less free market when I'm paying for it. When we're paying for it, all of a sudden, like in my house, when I give money to my kids, I'm in charge. I'm like, okay, I'm going to tell you how you can use the money I give you. The government should be the same way to go, listen, if you need food assistance, we're going to put some strict guardrails around what you can buy because we want you to be healthier. It's in our national interest. Yeah. It's in our national interest

that the kids who are getting government funded food, eat good food that's good for them, that won't give them diabetes, that won't give them chronic illnesses. So when I was working for Coke and the issue in 2011, we had the farm bill up again right now, which we should talk about. But in 2011, it was stopped. And there was a big bipartisan effort to cut soda, which is the number one item on food stamps. We spent $10 billion a year from the government treasury to soda companies. And they, Koch, wanted to stop that. So we actually went to a bunch of conservative groups, so conservative think tanks, and we paid them. And they pummeled lawmakers with a bunch of reports saying it was a nanny state tactic to dictate, you know, what should be what foods people should eat. And there was big up for about that. That's a perversion of conservative principles.

Now, we can debate whether food stamps or these other government programs are good. And I think that's a very legitimate debate, how we should be redistributing. But if we are going to have food stamps, I think most conservatives have agreed for the lowest income Americans, you know, some kind of government nutrition program, but it's SNAP, it's supplemental nutrition. If we're going to pay for it, it's not nanny state to say we shouldn't be funding from the government diabetes water that's having trillions of dollars of downstream impacts on our budget and decimating human capital as an addictive drug nobody's saying that we should be subsidizing nobody's saying we should ban cigarettes but we should not be

subsidizing them right nutrition double right um you know i i enjoy a glass of wine from time to time i you know i don't think that should be banned, but I would strongly oppose some nutrition program funding beer or wine for me to enjoy. So that's the perversion. You're absolutely right, John. I mean, not to turn it back on you, but I'm actually, right after this, I'm engaging with a number of members of Congress. And I think we have this huge fight now where we're on track right now for the farm bill to re-impose these subsidies for Coke. I see a lot of passion. A lot of members of Congress obviously have kids and their hearts go out. But what they're telling me is that

they want to cut that, but they are getting absolutely carpet-bombed by the Grocers Association, by Coke. And I think a lot of, you know, Rachel, as you've pointed out so much, I think a lot of parents, a lot of people are waking up. But unfortunately, they're not targeted, as we talked about the broccoli love. So we're trying, I'm working with some folks to try to drum up grassroots support on this specific issue. But yeah, I don't know. But just, Kelly, I would tell you that, um, we're not going to cut the amount of money that goes into food stamps. So if, if I'm on, you know,

snap or what it used to be called food stamps and I'm going to the grocery store and I'm not buying Coke and I've got to buy vegetables or fruit, the same amount of money is going to be spent with the grocers. It's just, they're going to buy something healthier for them as opposed to something less healthy. So, I mean, and again, if you explain that there might be a coalition between the grocers and Coca-Cola and Pepsi, I think their eyes will open up. But explain what Coke is doing, what Big Food is doing to get, whether it was, I don't know who you guys used back then, was it Heritage or whatever conservative think tank you used to

carpet bomb conservatives, now they may be partnering with grocers. But nothing's more important than the health of our society and the health of our kids. And tell the grocers to pound sand and have kids eat well. We'll have more of this conversation after this. After decades of shaky hands caused by debilitating tremors, Sunnybrook was the only hospital in Canada who could provide Andy with something special. Three neurosurgeons, two scientists, one movement disorders coordinator, 58 answered questions, two focused ultrasound procedures, one specially developed helmet,

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It was crowds of young people who were cheering in Russia after this whole, you know, potential coup that, you know. Wagner was going to march on Moscow. Wagner was going to march on Moscow, whatever. Anyway, people were celebrating after there was no coup, and I suppose in support of Putin. But there was this video that went viral showing these crowds of young people. And the message that came out from this viral post was what they all look like, that they were all, you know, good looking and thin and healthy looking. And the online people were saying, what would it look like if we panned American kids, young

people celebrating and so forth? And people, of course, were posting all these pictures because we have an epidemic of obesity, of just lack of fitness and health in general, as, you know, Callie so aptly talked about some of the numbers that we're facing. This is a crisis. And, you know, I think that was a really interesting thing that, you know, maybe Americans are waking up to the fact that, you know, we are not healthy. And when we compare ourselves to other countries, many of them, some of them, sadly, are falling into our state, but many of them are not. And one of them is Russia. Russia has, just like Italy and France, was trying to get rid of or control and make sure there's labeling on GMO food. or control and make sure there's labeling on GMO food. They don't want any of this lab meat and frankenfood and ultra processed foods.

And they're really trying to take control of organic and make sure that their population understands the difference between good food and bad food. And they understand it's part of their culture and they want to preserve that. And I think there's a lot of Americans who feel the same way. So there was a picture, I don't know if it was taken in the late 1940s, early 1950s, but it's a picture of an American diner. Guys are sitting at the stools at the bar, everyone's at tables. And it's the same thing you noticed how thin and healthy people looked in America. And we have had a massive transition to sickness and people that are fat. And what's frustrating is anyone who loves their country, loves themselves and their families would say, we do have an epidemic.

We do have to change course. What the hell is happening in America where we're so fat and unhealthy? Let's change course. Let's actually, you know, look at how do we grow food in a healthier way with less pesticides, maybe more organic. We know how to do that, Sean. The problem is what's happening at the government level. I'm saying why, if you're in the government, why aren't you doing that? Oh, you're saying the government should, yeah. Should be promoting those kind of concepts. Also, pre-range animals that were then harvested. You don't want to eat chicken that was made in a vessel, taken from cells and produced in a lab?

Not only that, I don't want to have a chicken that was raised in a building that has never seen the sun or the sky. I agree with you. was raised in a building that has never seen the sun of the sky. I agree with you. Has only walked around in a pen that's, you know, a foot and a half by a foot and a half, if even that big. I agree with you. And given injections of antibiotics because they're all dying from... That isn't healthy.

I like the little chickens that I'm like, can we get eggs from a little farm that's near us? The little chickens are running around with all the cows. Actually, you can tell the difference between an egg that came from a farm and one that's, you know, from these factory farms. They look different. You crack them open, they're way different eggs. And I love that. And so I think it's important that just as we have to make choices ourselves. We can't change the government as a whole.

Personal responsibility, yeah. And as a family. And one of the things that Rachel will complain about in our family is like, our kids eat too much cereal, right? And that's full of sugar. Yeah. We cut that back. We just say, you like stop buying cereal. Yeah, because it's convenient, right? It's really easy. And I just stop buying it because it's so easy for them to like, if they're hungry, have a bowl of cereal. buying it because it's so easy for them to like, if they're hungry, you know, have a bowl of cereal. And so, you know, now we do smoothies or eggs or oatmeal, you know, things that are a little more wholesome. Oatmeal is like getting the whole stuff. Yeah. Not the processed one. And so I think,

so again, I think it's having, whether it's oatmeal or eggs, if you can get a dairy that's, you know, you're getting less processed milk, that's hard. But then whole grains, whether it's rice or quinoa or whatever the grains you want to have, and having vegetables. And protein, I believe in protein. And meat. This is what Marilyn Monroe, by the way. Things that aren't packaged.

If you're buying things that are packaged and labeled, you got a problem. Yeah. Listen, I don't, if I buy a bag of brown rice, they don't have to have a label because it's like just brown rice. Right. If I get, you know, I get from some good hamburger, it's like, it's hamburger. It's brown beef. They haven't added anything to it.

Right. If you're getting packaged labels that have to tell you what's in it, that means it's processed. But you do still have to be, when you get your ground beef, you know, there's still ways to make sure that you're getting your beef. Like you said, you didn't want your chickens to be, you know, same with your cow. You want cows that have been, you know, raised in a sustainable, organic way possible. And these are the things that our government... We'll do like grass-fed and raised. I think that you're right. Our government needs to do more to educate us. And in fact, they're the problem. They're in bed with big food. They're in bed with big act. They're in bed with big pharma. And the people suffering are our children, are our families. And I think

that there is a way. And again, if we talk about the title of our podcast, you know, from the kitchen table, you know, eating as a family has so many benefits. And what ends up happening when you sit around, it's just you're not going to eat chicken nuggets around the kitchen table for the most part. People aren't going to do that. It becomes a ritual. Oh, by the way, I'm sorry. It becomes a ritual where you can. Chicken nuggets are so good. I hate chicken nuggets.

And French fries from McDonald's. I do like French fries from McDonald's. But again, but you know what's delicious? My mom will make, you know, fried potatoes at our house and they're actually tastier than McDonald's. fried potatoes at our house and they're actually tastier than McDonald's. But in any case, you can have more of a ritual around the meal. And, you know, maybe it starts simple at first and it gets a little bit as you figure out what you like and what your family likes and you start to have that routine. I mean, you know, our kids love tacos, our kids love, there's certain things that our kids like and we can try to make a little healthier. But that idea of creating

and rebuilding that culture of families sitting around the table, that alone will go far towards helping us have a better, healthier life. And by the way, when you sit on the table, it might not be easy at the start because your kids aren't used to sitting around the table. They have to be trained at how to behave. But that's good training for a kid. So take the time and make sure they don't expect it to go well the first four times. This is my good point for me as tying a couple of things together. So you have people in government, in big food, in big pharma, in big health care that are making decisions that are actually hurting

the American people. We agree on that, right? Yes. It's the same philosophy of American companies that will go over to China and set up shop, invest money in China, sell out the American homeland. They're going to make money and America is going to be hurt. sell out the American homeland, they're going to make money and America's going to be hurt. You have this thing, this mentality today with business leaders and government leaders who are about enriching themselves and their families without care or concern for their country.

And we've seen these new stats that have come out that patriotism has gone down dramatically in the last 25 years. There's a tie in there. When you don't love your country, when you don't understand that your country and its freedoms give you all of the opportunity to make these great business deals that you've made in your life, maybe you should protect it. Maybe you should care about it. And the people that live in it and work in it, and they don't give a damn about any of us. They care in healthcare, pharma, government, food. They care about their pocketbooks. When they go to China, it's white supremacy. No, nationalism is loving your country and trying to protect it and her people. Just like you care about your family and you want to take care of your family first. That's a natural instinct.

And this idea of globalism, when you hear people say, and we hear it all the time on the right, if you look at the loudest voices on the right who are never Trumpers, they're not, they say it's because they hate Trump, but it's not that. If you look deep enough, just like Callie said, follow the money. The loudest voices are against Donald Trump because they're for globalism, because globalism has actually enriched them. Just follow the money. It butters their bread. It butters their bread. There's an old Wisconsin saying. Yeah, that is an old Wisconsin saying.

So that's that. I love talking to Kelly Means. I think he has done so much to pull the curtain back on what's really driving the unhealthy and obesity and chronic disease epidemic that we have in our country. He hits people on all sides of the aisle. He exposed the hypocrisy of, you know, whether it's Jose Andres, these so-called social justice warrior foodies who will take money from big food

and promote lab-grown meat, or even Michelle Obama, who got bought off by big food when she was trying, and I think a really odd and not very effective way to change the food. And her husband had all the power in his hands. Or conservative think tanks that take money to sell Republican legislators on, don't be in any state. Let people use government funding through food stamps to buy Coca-Cola and Pepsi and or like Mountain Dew. It's like, this is dumb. Or the NAACP who was bought off and told if you try to change food stamps so that it's healthier

for black children, then that's racist. So, yeah, it's all over the place. Thank you, Callie Means, for joining us. Thank you for exposing this. We need to keep having this conversation. It is the sleeper issue, I believe, especially on the heels of COVID. Yes. Health and getting rid of chronic illness is a sleeper issue in the next election. And I believe it's a bipartisan issue. It is an issue where we can bring left and right. I'm right with the granola liberal moms on this one. I want to do a podcast on this next thing. I'm hearing a lot about cold baths, like ice baths. Oh yes, we should do that. I don't know if it's good or bad, but- But you've been doing it. You don't even know if it's good or bad. You've been hearing lots of good stuff. I get water from the well. It's really cold. So I'm not putting ice in, but it's really

like, I can't breathe. Anyway, I want to get someone to talk about that if we could. Yeah, we were going to have to talk about that. Some of these health trends. Health trends. All right. Listen, thanks for joining us on the podcast. All over the map. If you like our podcast, please rate, review, subscribe.

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And Amazon Prime members can listen to the show ad-free on the Amazon Music app. Hi, everybody. It's Brian Kilmeade. I want you to join me weekdays at 9 a.m. East as we break down the biggest stories of the day with some of the biggest newsmakers and, of course, what you think. Listen live or get the podcast now at briankilmeadeshow.com.