From the Kitchen Table: The Duffys - Will Cain On The Indictment Of Former President Trump & Finding The Perfect Woman
Episode Date: August 3, 2023Special Counsel Jack Smith announced Tuesday that Former President Trump would be indicted on charges related to his alleged attempt to overturn 2020 election results. FOX & Friends Co-Host and Host... of the Will Cain Podcast, Will Cain joins to discuss the charges that the former President will face, and why he feels that this is an attack on the principles that the Founding Fathers laid out in the Constitution. Plus, Will lays out what makes a perfect relationship, and gives advice to young people on how to make a marriage work in the modern world. Follow Sean and Rachel on Twitter: @SeanDuffyWI & @RCamposDuffy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
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BetMGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with iGaming Ontario. Hey everyone, welcome to From the Kitchen Table.
I'm Sean Duffy along with my co-host for the podcast, my partner in life and my wife, Rachel
Campos Duffy.
It's so great to be at our kitchen table and And boy, Sean, this has been a crazy,
crazy week. We see Donald Trump indicted yet again. So here is Jack Smith, the prosecutor,
laying out the charges. The attack on our nation's capital on January 6th, 2021, was an unprecedented assault on the seat of American democracy.
was an unprecedented assault on the seat of American democracy.
As described in the indictment, it was fueled by lies. Lies by the defendant targeted at obstructing a bedrock function of the U.S. government,
the nation's process of collecting, counting, and certifying the results of the presidential election.
All right, that was Jack Smith.
Let's bring in our friend, Will Cain, who's been tweeting about this, I don't know, like
all night, last night.
Will Cain, what's your reaction?
Well, hello, Rachel and Sean.
It's great to be with you guys here on the From the Kitchen Table podcast.
My reaction to the indictment is that we are arriving at a point where the American democracy is in an
incredibly fragile state. And the bedrock foundation that is being threatened is not
the transfer of power and the norms and procedures that transition us from one president to another,
but the right that was enshrined first in our Bill of Rights, and that is free speech. I think
what was indicted was not just Donald Trump, but the idea, the concept of freedom of speech. Yeah. I think you're absolutely right,
Will. And even going back to what Jack Smith said, he said, this is an attack on the seat
of democracy. It's fueled by lies, which is a bedrock function of our government. And I can't
help but think when I hear Democrats,
Jack Smith talk about an attack on a seat of democracy,
I can't help but think about Russia collusion.
That was an attack on our democracy
that our federal government,
the bureaucracy of government
had a concerted effort to remove a duly elected president
from the White House by lies, by leaks, by fake stories, fake investigations.
The Department of Justice is accusing Donald Trump of what they themselves did to him.
And you know what's fascinating about that, Sean?
You're right.
The temptation, I think, if you have an impartial listener, would be, well, Sean's playing tit
for tat, right? We're taking one
controversy and comparing it to another. But in my mind, Sean, you've actually drawn upon a very
perfect analogy. And here's why. Russia collusion was a fraud. It was a lie. And the price to pay,
the accountability mechanism for that is political. The people involved in the Russia collusion hoax never
faced any type of criminal charge. Right. And the allegation here is that Donald Trump has lied,
that he lied about the fraudulent nature of the 2020 election. And in the indictment,
Jack Smith lays out the manner and means of his lies turning into a fraud, an attempt to defraud the government of the United States.
And he goes through, it amounts to about five different manner and means that he attempted to perpetrate this fraud.
It's stuff like attempts to sway the Vice President of the United States to set aside the procedure to transfer power.
the procedure to transfer power. It's stuff like trying to persuade state electors or legislators to set aside the popular vote. And it, for example, says you impaneled a fraudulent
alternate set of electors in an attempt to sway the vice president. All of them, by the way,
amount to persuasion. Their speech, it's things Trump said or did along with his quote-unquote co-conspirators to try to get people to change their mind.
But your Russia collusion analogy also interfered with the procedure of the United States government. It obstructed, you know, that was part of the charges, one of the four charges, obstructing an official proceeding of the United States government. It obstructed, you know, that was part of the charges, one of the four charges,
obstructing a official proceeding of the United States government. But the price to pay for all
of that, Sean, is that those guys, for example, Adam Schiff, should pay the price in the political
process, not be faced with an indictment from a special prosecutor. So the point I'm getting at is
even if you don't like
what Donald Trump said, if you don't believe his claims of a fraudulent election, the price for him
to pay should be in politics. He should lose at the ballot, not be drugged before a court because
you think what he had to say is a lie and he knew it was a lie. Yeah, I mean, it says he knew it was
a lie. Well, I mean, if you had a Russia collusion hoax, you know, perpetrated against you for four years and every trick in the book thrown at you throughout this, you know, the time that he has, you know, even before he was in office, but as he was running and everything else, you had the laptop suppressed, you had people, you bring it up in a debate and you had 51, you know, intelligence officers just a couple of days before saying it was Russian disinformation so that Joe Biden in the debate could say, oh, no, no.
Fifty one, you know, intelligence officers said it's Russia disinformation.
I mean, you've had every trick thrown at you.
Why would you believe this election was on the up and up?
But let's let's just put that aside for a second.
What do you what do you make of what happens now? And I don't mean legally. I just mean to our country. Because I think, I just feel like
something really serious has been broken. I mean, we've seen a lead up to this, the Mar-a-Lago raid,
blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But this seems like a moment that is changing
America, maybe forever. So a couple of points, Rachel. First of all, I agree with you. Good
luck trying to convince any jury beyond a reasonable doubt that Donald Trump doesn't
really believe in the integrity of the 2020 election, that he doesn't believe it was fraudulent. I believe he wholeheartedly thought
so in 2020 and still does today, wholeheartedly believes that the 2020 election was fraudulent.
So he couldn't have knowingly lied if he 100% believes that he won in 2020. And from every
passionate speech and rally to every interview, which by the way, whether or not he's asked about it or not, he generally brings it up. I think he might believe that it was a fraud
in 2020. You know, I think secondly, I hope he has a really good lawyer. I hope he has a really
good lawyer. And here's why. I saw a tweet this morning that he intends to subpoena every
intelligence agent that was signed off on that, dismissing Hunter Biden's
laptop as Russian disinformation, that he's looking to bring the entire thing before court. I hope he
does. Me too. Like when they, you know, if you're sued for defamation, truth is the ultimate defense
and you should drag everyone in there to air every truth that you want. You know, I think in this
case, he should air every grievance he has about the 2020 election in Jack Smith's attempted prosecution of him.
But what this means for America, I don't think it's so much as an earthquake as another piece of straw in the camel's back.
And I say that from the average American's point of view, they'll still be diluted by the mainstream media.
They'll still have their Trump blinders on. And I think that the very reasonable people in America have been broken by the image of Donald Trump, the image
painted to them by the mainstream media or their own perception of his personality. And so they're
not going to dive deep into the facts of this indictment. They'll probably just come away from
it going, wow, hat trick, third indictment for Donald Trump. He's so dirty.
But for those that go just a tad bit deeper, it'll be another straw in the camel's back.
And Joe Biden came in saying, I'm going to restore the norms of our democracy and we're going to bring a nice old man back to Washington, D.C. to bring comedy back to our political process.
And I think everyone's going to begin to realize that's total BS.
This thing has entirely been weaponized.
And at some point, it will break the camel's back.
I'm not convinced this one event will be the earthquake that shakes it.
Because I don't think it's about this event.
I just think, listen, this past week was the first week that we really started to see what I've known all along,
which is that this president has been getting, we now see, what, $30, $50 million in money from Ukraine, Russia, China.
We had the Devin Archer testimony, and then all of a sudden this happens. So I'm, I'm, I'm asking,
I don't think it's just this indictment. I think it's this indictment plus the timing of it,
just as, you know, all this information was coming out about the corruption. You don't,
you think even, you know, even Democrat, you know, you don't think Democrats will look at that
or even independents, maybe independents are more important in this.
Well, you're juxtaposing the two big news events against one another this week.
And, of course, you're referencing the Devin Archer testimony.
In my mind, really validating stuff that we already knew about the influence peddling scheme Hunter Biden fronted for what we believe, with reasonable belief, was the Biden crime family, including Joe Biden.
And I agree with you because I actually think that story has the potential to be more of an earthquake than this third indictment of Donald Trump.
And I think it's the beginning. You know, Devin Archer is the first in the deposition phase of this House Oversight Committee with James Comer. There will be more. Eric Schwerin, I assume it. We might even at some point see
Hunter Biden. And I think it's going to become undeniable to the point that I honestly don't
believe that Joe Biden now is going to be the Democratic nominee for president. I think this
story has begun the process of undoing Joe Biden. And so that's really big, at least for our,
you know, every four years democratic process. But for the deeper
point, which I thought you were kind of alluding to more, Rachel, and maybe this plays to it as
well. And that's whether or not we have a real corrupt, deep institutional base in this country,
the DOJ, the FBI, things that we've all spoken about. I think there's still more work to do on exposing
that for everyone where you convince the independent voter. You know, Will, I look at,
you know, whether it's in sports or it's in the courtroom, people always use the phrase,
the best defense is a strong offense, right? And I'm looking ate biden saying you have all of these attacks coming in and listen
no matter what democrats say there is there is real fire when you have this 1031 1023 fbi form
where you have witnesses a witness coming in and saying listen joe biden received five million
dollars in payment as well as hunter b received $5 million. You have the IRS whistleblowers
talking about how the FBI and the DOJ have stepped in to blunt their investigation. They
couldn't get to the big guy. They haven't been able to do a forensic audit of the money that's
come in to the shell corporations and where that money went and did it go to Joe Biden. They've been stopped from
doing that. And every time we get a news event, whether it's about the 1023, whether it's about
the plea deal with Hunter Biden falling apart, Devin Archer testifying on the Hill, the very next
day, there's a new indictment of Donald Trump. So the news cycle, Rachel has mentioned this before you joined us on the podcast,
the news today is not about Devin Archer's testimony about the corruption with Joe Biden.
It's about Donald Trump.
I mean, they're changing the storyline and using the FBI and the Department of Justice to do it.
And I think you can play that game once.
You can play that game maybe twice.
But we're three or four times into the very next day,
the FBI running interference with the media on the real story.
I mean, listen, the charges against Donald Trump, it's nickel and dime.
You and I know that.
I mean, listen, there are real charges and there's nickel and dime petty stuff. This is nickel and dime. You and I know that. I mean, listen, there are real charges and there's
nickel and dime petty stuff. This is nickel and dime petty stuff. But you talk about a president
who potentially sold out the office of the vice presidency to the tune of millions of dollars
and is now the president of the United States and therefore would be compromised.
therefore would be compromised, that is real crime. That is real sedition. And to think that we're not having that conversation as a country blows my mind. Sean Tom, one time I was in the
hallways at ESPN and Joe Tessitore, who used to be the voice of Monday Night Football, he's always
been a voice of boxing. I don't know what it's called.
Boxing at night on ESPN.
He came up to me.
I did first take, you know, at one point like every day.
It's a huge combative debate show.
And he said, Kane, you're a counterpuncher.
You slip.
You move.
Stephen A comes in throwing haymakers and you move and you jab him right in the nose.
My instinct, my point, which he even noticed,
is sort of like counterpunching defense.
And one of the things I've learned,
I'd say over the past three years since I've joined Fox,
maybe we've all learned in politics is what you just said, the best defense is a good offense.
It's 100% true.
Like just stay on offense, offense all the time.
And what you've noticed,
what everyone should notice is exactly right.
Like the minute there's a scandal involving Joe Biden, the next day there's another indictment
or another scandal for Donald Trump. But you're alluding to something that I think I 100% agree
with Sean, which is the Donald Trump indictments commandeer the news cycle for a little bit,
and then it goes away. And here's the reason the story's been told
like there's this trump obsession there's no doubt about it you talk about trump and you turn the
media into a reality show and he's your main character and you've been rewarded with ratings
and attention but the story is old the story is the same for let's see what was seven eight years
yeah they've been telling the same
story that Donald Trump is a corrupt criminal, right? They've been saying that same story.
If you think about it, it's indistinguishable from Russia collusion to this latest indictment.
The end result that you're hoping to sway in someone's mind is this guy's a threat to democracy
and he's a criminal. And the people have heard that story and they've already made up their own mind. I don't think there's anybody left going. Let me just sit back. I'm
undecided. Let me let me sit back and weigh the evidence. But the Joe Biden stuff is yet still
new. And so what I think will happen is the Donald Trump story will be it may even fade today. It may
fade tomorrow. But the Biden story will come back. I'm telling you,
like this deposition phase from James Comer, I think it's going to have weight. There's going
to be more witnesses and it's only going to get more. The evidence is going to get more heavy.
So I think that's the news story in terms of driving the news cycle.
There's more bullets in the gun of the Joe Biden story. You can only indict Donald Trump
so many times, right?
I mean, terminal velocity.
We're going to get the transcript of the Devin Archer testimony, and that is going to then drive the news cycle again.
First of all, a couple of things about what's going to happen.
I'm not sure what was going to happen with the document case down in Florida.
Again, allegedly Donald Trump had classified documents,
but Joe Biden has classified documents.
Mike Pence had classified documents.
That's in Florida.
This case was brought in Washington, D.C.,
where Donald Trump, I think, got 5% of the vote
and Joe Biden got 95% of the vote.
Donald Trump doesn't stand a chance
at winning this election, winning this
trial. He's going to lose. And they're going to try to put him in jail. I mean, that is a flat
out reality. I don't care what the facts are. We can analyze it to death. Juries matter. And who
makes up the jury matters. And you're going to have a pool of people who hate this man.
And no matter what you tell them, they're going, no matter what the defense is, they're going to
convict Donald Trump. And I think it goes to a broader point that you talked about, which is the first
amendment. Um, and it's, this is criminalizing disinformation. Um, and disinformation is defined
as thought that's contrary to the accepted viewpoints of the regime. So if you have a different thought
process, it's disinformation, and that's now being criminalized. You can't actually speak your mind
against the powers that be, whether the globalists, the Democrats, or even those elite
Republicans who can't stand Donald Trump. They're going to take you down.
You know, if you had to define our age, at least the last five years, we're in the
age of disinformation. We're in the age of mind control through the process of controlling
information. And you're right, Sean, the big story here is if this is successful, and if you're
right, and here's what I think will happen for what it's worth. I think you're right. Donald Trump will lose this trial.
He'll lose yet again on appeal, most likely.
And he will win once this goes to the Supreme Court of the United States.
The Supreme Court will acknowledge this as a violation of free speech.
Who's to decide what is true?
Donald Trump believed or did not believe.
Who's to decide?
He criminalizes political speech in particular because, look, with all due respect to Sean, who served and held office, I mean,
politicians, and I'm not saying Sean did, but politicians lie.
You never did. I know what you're going to say, Will. Never lied.
Damn you, Will Kane.
Sean never lied. But good luck. Good luck convincing your listener that politicians don't
lie. And so who, I got you.
And so who's to decide what's a truth and what's a lie?
And if you're going to go down this path, I mean, you better lock up John Kerry.
You better lock up Hillary Clinton.
You better lock up Stacey Abrams.
Paul Gahanis as well.
Yeah, yeah.
Anybody that ever questioned the outcome of an election, then that's just the start.
If we're going to lock up politicians for lying, build new wings, build new prisons. And I think the Supreme Court of the United States will
recognize that Rubicon that we've crossed and throw out the case. But along the way, Sean,
you're right. Donald Trump will lose. He'll win at the Supreme Court. He'll win in New York.
I don't know what will happen with the document case in Florida. Most people seem to think that's the quote-unquote strongest one. So I don't know what will happen in Florida.
But along the way, the real risk is a continuation of our age, which is we're going to—the moment
of truth about our age was the attempt to create the Ministry of Truth. You know, that's where
we're headed. Even though it was a joke and we laughed at that lady. No, they tried to do it though. Well, they tried to do it. And that
was the, that's what told the truth about this age. They're going to be there to tell us what
the truth and criminalize people that fall on the outside of what they define as the truth.
We'll have more of news twice a day.
Featuring insight from top newsmakers, reporters, and Fox News contributors.
Listen and subscribe now by going to foxnewspodcast.com.
Yeah, no, there's no question about that.
I want to ask you what you think happened.
So they put Donald Trump in jail.
Maybe then it goes to the Supreme Court.
Does it go to the Supreme Court and then he goes to jail?
Does it go to jail and then it goes to the Supreme Court?
How does that play out?
And then how does it work with the election?
Well, I will defer to Sean on that one.
Usually you can stay out of jail on appeal, right, Sean?
That's what's happening with Devin Archer.
Devin Archer is, he just got,
I don't remember how long ago it was now,
but he was convicted for defrauding a Native American tribe.
I can't remember the mechanisms of his fraud,
but he was convicted.
And he's out on appeal,
and that's why he appeared
before the House Oversight Committee.
And then the controversy was
that the DOJ sent him a letter
right before he was set to appear,
saying, hey, you should report
to the Bureau of Prisons soon.
You know, like, reminder, you've got to go to jail. I've served in government. Government officials don't work on the weekend. If they work during the week, you're lucky. That was sent over
the weekend to the judge. The judge is not working. The DOJ is not working. But they found time that
weekend before the testimony on this last Monday to write a letter and say Devin Archer has to report to jail.
Can I say something here? Talking about this ministry of truth and where we're going in this
age of disinformation, here's one potentially silver lining, if you can even call it that,
in this expectation that the Democrats have that the population will go along with their narratives,
whether it's about Donald Trump or anything else. And I think in the backdrop is COVID,
that, you know, we all experienced COVID. We all experienced the COVID censorship. And now
we're all also seeing everything they told us we couldn't say or we were shadow banned for saying or whatever has all kind of crumbled.
And now you're right.
No one's been held accountable.
Fauci's still there.
Everybody else who lied about COVID and vaccines is still being celebrated.
We're going to send him to jail, too, as a liar.
I hope there's a whole wing for him in that prison you want built for liars.
But that said, that's also, I think, undermining the control that I think they think they might have or want to have.
Because so many people just are now living in the post-COVID world where everything they were told is now, we know, is not true.
So here's my personal journey on that, Rachel, as I sort of experienced this age of disinformation.
And that is, it first started with sort of America's race reckoning. For me, I was on CNN,
and it was Trayvon Martin, and then it was Michael Brown. And the point of all these cases is,
Trayvon Martin, and then it was Michael Brown. And the point of all these cases is what happened is you were told a story. The story, as it turns out, wasn't true according to the facts,
but the narrative ran away and defined what everyone understood to happen. And then therefore,
how everyone understood the soul of America. And if you pushed back in any way and go, well,
you know, the facts around Jacob Blake are that you pushed back in any way and go, well, you know,
the facts around Jacob Blake are that he actually did have a knife. Well, then you're a racist.
Right. And so that really set the ground for me of like, well, we live totally in an age where we're post-truth. Then comes Donald Trump. And we're overlapping some time frame here a little
bit. But then comes Donald Trump. And I i'll admit to everyone i was a little slow to
seeing the uncovering of the falsehoods around donald trump because his personality drove so
much perception and you know just just the perception of who of how he his demeanor and i
think that's where many people remain today oh i don't like the way he acts i don't like the way
he speaks you know um but if you look back't like the way he acts. I don't like the way he speaks, you know.
But if you look back on it, the way that Donald Trump was covered, largely through what Sean said a moment ago, you know, Russia collusion, you slowly start to go, well, that's not true.
Well, that's not true.
And it wasn't just that story.
It was so many, like, very fine people or whatever it might be. There were so many lies that were told.
If you dug a little bit, you're like, well, that's not exactly how that unfolded.
And then you're right, Rachel. I think the the huge moment was COVID. And then once you get to
COVID, it becomes blatant where, okay, I'm being told a story, the story doesn't totally mesh with
the facts that I'm seeing or the way that I'm living my life. But before you can even start
to dig your shutdown silence, quiet, that's's disinformation you're harming public health
and then then we hit then we started to really speed up then the blm 2020 riots um and you're
told once again be quiet and this is why so many people are skeptical of the war in ukraine because
it's yet another um evolution in this in this age where forget what we're the three of us are
on this war one thing that's absolutely true is it has been treated informationally in the same way we treated COVID, in the same way we treated the 2020 BLM riots, in the same way we treated Michael Brown or Trayvon Martin, or the same way we treated Donald Trump.
You better not question the official narrative. Or you're or you're you're you're in. I mean, I still get tweets sent to me that I'm I'm Putin's puppet.
And I'm like, well, this is the craziest.
But these stories are connecting and they're also connecting the corruption from the Biden administration and this war.
We're starting to see those dots being connected as well.
But asking questions has has been a bedrock of American democracy.
Having a debate between people, letting them speak freely,
that's how democracy works through those debates.
We have laws, Will, as you know, that protect us.
And there are standards and norms around those laws by which we operate.
And with the Donald Trump indictments, I believe that Democrats, liberals, globalists, they're breaking those standards and norms that we have always used.
They're breaking the system.
And I think they believe they're breaking the system and they're justified because the big orange man is a threat to all that we believe.
He's a threat to everything, right?
And so they're okay breaking the rules and the norms and the standards to get Donald Trump.
What I don't think they realize, though, is that when you break the standards, when you break the norms and you use the law as a weapon, it doesn't stay in a box.
It's not just going to be used against Donald Trump.
Once you break it, it's broken for everybody.
And you think you might be protected because you have correct think.
But if you ever cross the line, these standards, these new standards will be used for you.
We had a, there's an article on foxnews.com.
We also had her on my show on Fox Business, The Bottom Line, which, by the way, is at 6 p.m. Eastern.
If you don't catch it, you should.
But she said, I am a black, queer, Harvard law grad.
And I was censored.
What was she censored for?
She had come out and said,
I don't think biological males should compete against females.
And she, in essence, was saying,
I was kind of okay with the crazy conservatives being censored,
their speech being censored,
but I'm black and I'm queer and I'm a Harvard grad grad and i'm being censored whoa whoa whoa whoa and my phone was like right that's why we
defend everybody's right to say crazy say what you want because we defend everyone's right to
say it because if you don't all of a sudden we're on this slippery slope they've made a calculation sean that for the most part the rules don't apply to them for now well i still i mean i still think liberals
get away with everything i don't know well what do you think i love this i love this part of our
conversation but before i dive in deep um while we're on the topic of race ray rachel you did
not respond to my text last night you made a very bold choice in my estimation when we were texting. You asked
me to come on this podcast. Yes. You know this, Sean? She sent me a white thumbs up and then a
brown prayer hands. Did you respond? I didn't see that. I went to bed. You didn't see the response?
I said, wow. I'm pulling it up right now. I'm pulling it up right now. I said, wow,
bold choice here. I don't know what to make of this.
I first thought, Rachel, I think it's a bold choice when anyone chooses skin color on their emojis.
I'm like, why are you choosing skin color?
I choose the default Simpsons yellow hands.
You know what I'm talking about?
That's so funny.
I think it's weird.
If I got a text from Sean and Sean gave me the white thumbs up, I'd be like, wow, Sean, really proud.
You know they're of your skin color.
No, no, no.
So let me explain the emoji.
The white thumbs up was actually Sean and I was the brown praying hands.
That's what you did?
That you were thinking about the two of you as a pair?
Honestly, I have such a mix that I just push from my ones that I use a lot.
But I think that's so funny because you know what's so interesting?
I don't really think about it.
I don't either.
You know what I do?
I don't think about my emojis.
I just sent Willow an emoji that I use all the time.
I have the emoji that has both hands up and to the side.
I don't know.
It's a black emoji for me.
I never intended to make it a black emoji. Why are you doing a black guy uh i don't know i never i never put i never put thought into it
it's like the black emoji came up with the both hands out that's how colorblind we are and so i
use it and i get more people responding to that emoji than anything i send out like why are you
sending this i'm like i it was not intentional it kind of came up in my emojis and i send it
and i'm not going to change it just because
you're giving me a hard time about it.
And so, like, a lot of crap.
I think it's such a bold choice for anyone that goes beyond the yellow.
I think yellow is default.
I agree.
And so, if you start, you've made a concerted choice just to coordinate your emojis with
your skin color.
I'm fighting the man.
Rachel has sent me two skin colors, so I'm, like, highly confused.
So, I sent him a thumbs up, Rachel sent me two skin colors, so I'm like highly confused. So I sent him
a thumbs up, a white thumbs up,
brown prayer hands. He goes, brown and white
emojis, bold move, worthy of a deep
dive. I just saw this.
Jordan Peterson was on Fox
and Friends today, so maybe
Jordan could dive into what does this mean?
He could break this psychologically down for us.
Okay, so go back to the original question. I really like this conversation. So first of all,
I really think that what happened when the American founders adopted the United States
Constitution and the Declaration of Independence and enshrined these principles is, I don't want
to call it a great leap forward for humanity, because we're not going to always remain on our
front foot, but it is the exception to humanity.
So the story of humanity is tribal power.
It is just, you know, most of the time, violent, aggressive struggles for power.
Then our founders come along and they enshrine these principles.
And the principles are really ingenious.
And they're designed to ensure so many different things like that power is fractured, that we have checks and balances, and that some things like you're talking about, the idea of free speech is sacrosanct, and it's better for the overall good.
And the reason it's so genius is because it defies human nature.
Human nature is to acquire and hoard power, and it is to probably silence your detractors.
We all have that little devil inside, right? I don't like what you're saying, and it is to probably silence your detractors. We all have that little devil
inside, right? I don't like what you're saying, and I want you to shut up, and I'm willing to
wield whatever power I have to make you be quiet. That's a devil that exists inside every single
one of us. I think human nature is to censor, and I don't think that's left or right. I think what
his genius is, our founders understood that and created principles or enshrined
principles and created mechanisms to protect us from our devils inside. Now, that being said,
I think progressive ideology, the ideology of the left never truly valued those principles
or this foundation. And here's why. Because they have a belief, I think you're
right, Sean, in a higher moral. They believe they are doing good. I do believe that to be true.
And they think they need power to accomplish that good. And all these checks and balances in this
foundational documents are problematic for them. And that's why for the better part of a century
or more, they've been talking about things like the living constitution, or let's pack the court with Frank and Delano
Roosevelt, whatever it may be. All of these little burdens that the founders put in the way
are in the way of them doing something they think is of a higher ethic moral.
Now, they truly do believe clearly Donald Trump is Hitler. And if you do believe that, I mean, these are quaint principles and these are quaint checks and balances. You're not going to do that. You're not going to abide by them. In fact, you're going to destroy them because you need to live up to the higher moral of saving, quote unquote, American democracy from Hitler.
American democracy from Hitler. And so you're right. I think we're going to cross this. We're going to destroy these things, these genius foundations of America. But I don't think the left will ever look back on it with regret. That's what I think, Sean. I don't think they'll ever look back on it and go, you know, these were protecting us as well, which absolutely they are. But because human nature is tribal and violent and quest for power, they'll just continue on in that path,
believing they are on the side of angels.
Wow.
I think it's,
I think it's fascinating.
And, and it's,
and I agree with your analysis.
Well,
I think you're spot on,
but,
um,
again,
you mentioned that they truly believe that Donald Trump is Hitler.
And I,
I,
I think that's the correct assessment.
And then if you go,
well, what has,
forget what CNN says or MSNBC says, what did Donald Trump do that was so egregious?
He gave power back to states. He tried to decentralize power. What he had a conversation
with Kim Jong-un, right? Which by the way, it turned out pretty, pretty good.
And one with Zelensky where he said,
hey, I think that the Bidens are doing some dirty business in your country.
He got impeached for that.
He put tariffs on China.
A lot of free traders would say, we're free traders.
You can't do that.
Well, it turned out pretty good for America
trying to protect American jobs and businesses
against a country that's cheating and abusing us.
I look at all the things he did, Will, and I'm like, it wasn't Hitler at all.
They don't look at the facts of who the man was and the policies that he was implementing
as compared to what the media narrative was about him.
He's just a threat to the system.
Isn't that it, Will?
He's just a threat.
Yeah, probably, Rachel.
It certainly isn't that he's far right.
No.
No.
Many of the policies you talked
about like like trade protectionism against china it's a democrat issue yeah exactly and there's
more we could go securing the border was a a democrat issue at one time well of course it was
they they i mean democrats and unions didn't want cheap labor coming into the country republicans
that were more corporatists back in the day, they wanted cheap labor in the country.
I mean, so he's flipped all of these issues on their head and really kind of embraced a lot of Democrat philosophy.
Before he ran, he was further to the left than Barack Obama on gay marriage.
He sure was.
Yeah.
And Barack Obama posted gay marriage.
And by the way, he hasn't moved on that.
I mean, he hosts the log cabin Republicans at Mar-a-Lago for their big convention. I mean,
so he's not being, you know, pulled around here or there. I mean, you could say on abortion that
he's come around, but I've talked to people who are close to him and they've said they believe
that's a really sincere change of heart that he's had on abortion. And boy, he's delivered on that.
But I mean, listen, it's fascinating.
It'll be interesting to see what happens.
I do think things are breaking.
And I think that's why you see people saying,
I'm going to, you know,
Sean did a story this week on the bottom line, Will,
where, you know, there's now these huge conventions on homesteading.
There's a lot of people who are going,
maybe it's not that they think there's going to be a civil war
or something crazy happening like that,
but they're basically at least saying,
I want to check out of this system because I don't trust it.
I don't like it.
So homesteading is if you decide to try to feed yourself.
I'm going to have chickens.
I might have a cow.
I might have a pig.
I might grow vegetables.
But I'm going to try to provide my food supply by myself.
Now, some people are doing it for health reasons,
but I think some people are doing it because they just,
they go, I want to live off the grid.
I want to live in the country.
I want to check out of this whole system.
So there's a bunch of liberals,
like we lived up in Northern Wisconsin,
a bunch of liberals,
by the way,
they had the best farms,
like organic farms.
And like,
so they've been doing this for a little while,
but now 40% of the homesteaders are conservatives who I think what happened during COVID was people were like,
listen,
I'm going to the grocery store and I'm seeing a whole bunch of things that
aren't there that are normally on the shelf.
And if there is a crisis and I can't buy food at the store, I can't feed myself.
I can't feed my family.
I don't know how to do anything.
And they made the decision to go try to provide for themselves.
And they don't like big food.
It's like something you would have heard like 1969 like big big food yeah and all of it's like
something you would have heard like 1969 san francisco hippies doing it now it's the right
and well the 40 and a lot of christians a lot of catholics and christians who are concerned about
religious persecution are doing it as well there's they're trying to break free from the system
and there's a number of people who are doing it. And I think what's happening, Will, is there's just a feeling, maybe it's in the American subconscious, that things are
not right. Things are not normal. We're experiencing something that's in the midst of change. We've
never seen it before. And a lot of people feel like it's not for the better. Things are going to get worse.
What do you think's going on?
We just walked through several political issues, right?
And then we even walked through a lifestyle issue.
And then there's the, we could do war.
You know, the two parties seem to have switched sides almost on their approach to war.
Also, when it comes to-
Rachel Sidney Sheehan is who we call her.
Now Will and Pete called me Cindy Snowden.
Cindy Snowden.
Well done.
Same thing when it comes to big pharma.
It's like we switched sides on that.
Totally.
And then I'm just going to throw this in there.
So a friend, a longtime friend, religious entire life, said now questioning their belief in God.
And when pressed a little bit, it seemed like it was connected to politics.
My point is it just on so many things.
It's like the world is turned upside down.
Meaning your friend now believes in God or doesn't know the other way.
Rachel, the other way.
Your friend doesn't believe in God.
Yeah.
Questioning their faith after all these years.
And, and I don't know, because it didn't really, it actually is
a one-off conversation for me. It wasn't a direct conversation for me. It was told to me,
but it seemed in some way, it wasn't pressed, connected to America's political environment.
I just don't understand what's, it's like, there's something deeper going on in America,
and it feels like everything has been shaken up like a snow globe or turned around 180.
We'll have more of this conversation after this.
You know, I want to ask, I don't want to leave you without talking about this next topic,
because I think it's actually kind of tied to this.
I think people are going in either direction.
That's interesting you say your friend is losing faith in God.
I think a lot of people see what's happening.
They're losing faith in institutions and in sort of what they thought America was or could never turn into. And it's
making them want to get closer to their family. And I think that's also part of the homestead
trend that we're seeing. People wanting to go, you know what, I can't control this crap that's
happening in D.C. or in my town. I'm going to move to the country and just, you know, have my own
little plot of land and hopefully my kids will live near me. And I think that's happening. We have,
you know, our own Pete Hegseth did it. And I've been watching that with a lot of admiration.
I want to talk to you about this. Eighty five percent of young people have reported that they
don't feel that marriage is needed or necessary in order to have a fulfilling
and committed relationship. In addition to that, well, one in four young adults have literally
ruled out having kids. So we're seeing less young people less interested in marrying,
thinking it's antiquated, not necessary, and also an unprecedented number of young
people just literally saying, I'm not interested in having kids.
That's such a huge mistake.
Such a huge mistake.
What's happening, though?
That's going to be the trend.
Well, I mean, we could probably look at it, several different factors.
I mean, we've talked about on the show together, Rachel, the decline in religion over time.
I think we're at a,are we at a historical low point?
Yes.
I think we are.
Yeah.
In religion, a marriage is a vow before God.
So if you don't believe in God, then you can just do these civil unions or just live together, right?
Of course, the price to pay for that is huge because what's easily entered can be easily exited.
Yes.
It's bad for women, especially, by the way.
Yeah.
I mean, there's a point to accountability.
And if you're accountable to God, you're going to be more apt to work through your issues.
By the way, Kathleen and I, my wife, have talked about this recently. Several friends who've had
marital troubles, and it really is fascinating those who really adhere to their vow to God and
work through hard things, you know, bad things in a marriage, but then stay together
and work, not, not, not, you know, quiet and silent, but work on it, put work into it.
And I just seen the other side of it. It's fascinating how rewarding it is.
That's right. I have said the same thing. Nothing easy will, um, gives you great joy.
I don't think so. The things that you have to work at and put time into and
focus on and master. I am saying that you are, I think because all marriages are a lot of work.
Everyone will say, and if you think it's going to be easy, you're in the wrong game. It's actually
really hard, but the time you put into it, the reward is great. It's a beautiful thing.
Um, and I, I, I, so I look at just the male side of this, Will,
and if guys get together and the closer the relationship,
I think this will happen more, but they'll talk about sports.
They'll talk about their jobs.
They might even talk about their investments and their bank accounts.
There's a lot of things that guys, some might talk about hunting.
You might talk about roping cows and riding horses. There's a lot of stuff guys talk about. But in those close male relationships, oftentimes you talk about your
family. You'll talk about your kids. You'll talk about your spouse. And you talk about those things
because they're deeply meaningful. They have deep impacts
on your life. And if you ask men who are married with children, and it goes to the point that
Rachel was asking, what's the most important thing? Is it your bank account? Is it sports?
Is it rodeo? Is it hunting? Or is it the kids that you're raising and the wife that you're
spending your life with?
Undoubtedly, the most important thing to me
is not those other things, which I actually enjoy.
The most important thing is this mission in my life
with my wife and my kids.
And to think that so many young people
are willing to give that up, to forego it,
because I think, Rachel,
they don't know what they're foregoing.
I was just going to say, are we just not talking enough about how the pleasures and the joys
of kids and marriage?
Is that what's happening?
But I think we're talking about, yeah, go ahead, Will.
Is that the problem?
Well, I don't know the answer to that.
I mean, if you're writing on paper, I think that the statistical or sort of like generic path to happiness is get married young and have lots of kids.
Hello.
That's it.
Yeah.
But, I mean, so it has a tension, though.
Here's the tension of it.
And, you know, I was just on vacation for a couple weeks.
And my mom, my dad died when I was young, youngish.
And my mom's second husband, great dude. And he and
I were talking and, you know, I've got a lot, I got a lot on my mind lately. And Rachel may
be able to understand a lot of choices I need to make in life and things that I want to do.
And my mom's husband and I were up early one morning having coffee together. And he said,
one thing you got going for you is your wife. And I was like, you're absolutely right. Like, it's so important to marry well.
And what I'm saying about that is, and what is well?
All I know is that I have a partner who will support me.
And I'm not the easiest person to always support.
I make, you know, risky decisions sometimes
and do things that require, it's just like, it's a train that takes a lot of turns on the track.
And so – but I have a person in my life who supports me and is with me and is my partner.
And my mom's husband was like, you can have somebody that does that or somebody that drags you backwards.
And that's without a doubt the case.
So if you're young, you're sitting there going, wow, then I better be careful.
So I'm going to delay marriage, delay marriage. So you do have this tension, but I would say don't
delay marriage for selfish reasons. Don't delay because, oh, I got to make a bunch of money first.
I think that's a mistake men make. Sean, I don't know how you feel about like,
a marriage can actually help you start making more money.
That's statistically actually true. Married men make more money than single men. And by the way, also are healthier. I think that is because of
the women. I mean, I know your wife, by the way, she's amazing. She's like a solid rock
in the Will Kane family. She is rock. And she's just so, she's so solid.
She's so,
she's such a real solid person.
And yeah,
women make men better
and women like Kathleen
probably make you healthier
and probably help you make more money
because she's supportive of everything.
I think it makes,
I just know from myself,
I was doing a lot of different things,
but I didn't really have focus, like the kind of focus you need to launch forward.
And I got married and had a baby on the way, right away, which by the way, I don't necessarily always recommend that.
To spend a little time with your new wife is always a good thing.
We've been in diapers.
Sean's not in diapers.
We've had diapers in our life for our whole marriage, 23 years, 24 years. 51 and we still have one in diapers. We still have diapers. Sean's not in diapers. We've had diapers in our life for our whole marriage,
23 years, 24 years. 51 and we still have one in diapers. We still have diapers. So I'm like,
if you have a little time together and you get to go to dinner without a crying baby, that's kind of okay. But my point with that though is when I had a baby on the way and I was married,
the level of focus I had in making sure I could provide for them, and I wasn't always sure how I was going to do it.
I was taking the bar and I was doing lumberjack shows, but I was stressed out.
And that stress, because of that responsibility, was a really good thing for me.
And I think I've gone to different places because of the need to provide for, to care for.
The need to impress me.
The need to impress you as well.
Made me a better provider,
which made me more successful in my life,
which means you make more money.
And I think that's,
Rachel said the stats are right on that.
But I don't, I think that it's,
to Rachel's point,
I think it's important to talk about the great joys
that come from families and kids,
but also not to lie to people.
Because it is hard.
It can be challenging.
You know, there is sacrifice.
But those are the things
that also give the greatest joy.
You're a sports guy. The greatest
football players and baseball players that didn't
come easy, they sacrificed. They gave up
their Saturdays, their Sundays, their nights.
They played all the time. They practiced all the
time. In the end, we see
the rewards of big contracts
and amazing play.
You do not see all of the time and the sweat
and the effort that went into the glorious moments that they have.
You're missing the point of what I'm saying.
What are you saying?
I think if you talk too much about how hard it is, then young people...
I don't want to lie to people.
You don't want to lie to people, but there's a lot of joy in being married and having children.
I don't think we talk about that, and then we wonder why kids don't want to do it.
You know, I'm a little with Rachel on this one. I mean, I know it's hard
and I a hundred percent agree with what you say, Sean, about like most rewarding things in life
are hard. Um, but the joy really outweighs the difficulty on this choice. It really,
really is an easy call for me. Um, Sean, how about this? Why do you think men delay
it? I think they delay it because they want to make a bunch of money. They overemphasize looks,
and it's not that looks aren't important. They are. But by the way, looks fade in so many of the
shallow ways. My wife's having it. I'm sure Rachel, that's not what I'm saying.
If you could see the look that Rachel just gave, what are you saying?
what I'm saying. If you could see the look that Rachel just gave, it's like, what, Will?
What are you saying, Will? My only point is if you prioritize it, it's what will, it will,
it won't work out for you. Agreed. I promise you. Agreed. Choose, how about this? Choose healthy lifestyles, things, values you share there that help maintain other things. Okay,
well, how about this, Will? I think men can be selfish, right? I want to go on the, I
hang with the guys I can go, I can, you know, I. Freedom.
It's freedom.
Yeah.
And there's, there's a tie down factor that comes with marriage.
Some.
But then their guys, then their buddies start getting married and they're all alone.
Exactly.
But the reason I made the point about, about talking about some of the hardship and I don't want to, I'm not doing that to disincentivize, but I, what I don't want is people to think
it's all easy.
And that's why in the first year you see divorce and to let people know, listen, it's wonderful. It's beautiful. It's
awesome. It's one of the greatest things you'll do, but it's going to be hard. And to set people
up with the right expectations of the difficulty, but then the benefit from it as well.
I always tell people, and this is true for us. And I think it was, I know Evita's first year,
my daughter's first year of marriage.
I mean, there's challenges.
Our first year of marriage was hands down our worst.
It was horrible.
It was horrible.
Yes, it was terrible.
I wanted to leave.
I was just like, what have I done?
It was so hard.
Who was in my house?
Where did she come from?
No, literally, Will, I called home to my mom.
My mom, you've met my mom.
She's like hardcore Spanish lady.
I called her.
We were about a month married, less than maybe a month or two.
No, we're about two months.
We're about two months in.
I called and I said, Mom, I'm coming home.
I made a mistake.
And she said, I'm sorry, honey.
You don't have a home here anymore.
Your home is with Sean.
You need to work that out.
And she hung up.
And actually, that was the best thing she ever did.
I had to work it out.
Will, what would you say?
What would you say?
We're going to end this up.
But I want to end on a positive note for those men out there.
What do you think they should look for in a woman?
Okay.
So, by the way, we should also say,
I get this note a lot from younger guys
whenever I talk about this.
And I don't talk about this kind of stuff a lot,
but there's a lot of guys that are saying,
I want to, I'm ready.
But I don't know.
Women in America today, it's very hard.
That's all they tell me.
You know, I don't know.
Some younger man, younger woman. Can i just say something really quick about that i think that's true
because i think women are getting fed a lot of bad messages about marriage actually they're being
told and men be a girl be a girl boss that'll make you happier um you know we've talked about
the barbie movie ken and barbie don't get married i mean it's just so depressing you gotta find a woman who knows her place well yeah well okay so what do you look
for so the best thing i could say that you look for is a best friend honestly because this is the
person you spend more time with anybody else in your life and it doesn't mean you're not going
to have other buddies and best friends and all those kind of no they remain your life but you
spend no i think when i'm done with this podcast with you guys,
Kathleen and I are going on a walk.
And then we try to do, we're just going to talk, you know,
and walk the dog and talk.
And so it's just somebody you like being around.
Yes.
Like I know physical attraction and all these other things are very important.
They are.
But you've got to be with somebody like you like being around and want to talk
with and hang.
So they add up to being your friend. And i want to be careful how i do this part don't be careful well we do have
pretty traditional we do have pretty traditional roles in our marriage um one of us goes out and
does the work and brings home the money and the other one is in charge of our family basically
you know and what runs the
house and i'm not saying that's how every marriage should work but it is how marriage has kind of
worked for centuries since the beginning of time and i do think there is something to that i i
really do and and kathleen i've talked about this and this there is sometimes this trend which you
just talked about the girl boss thing or whatever.
It's like, well, I'll share to Kathleen talks about there's a trend among women to talk bad about their husbands a lot.
Have you ever noticed?
No, I don't, because I would never participate in that.
Well, they get like they get around and they say, you know, bitch about the husband or say he's like this.
And by the way, dudes do it, too.
You know, I've never done that. And Kathleen doesn't
do that. And the ones that do often seem to think that there's this game that you always have to
play about who's equal, right? Like who's getting the better deal in the relationship. I think
that's a dangerous game. I think that each person in the relationship has a role and you fulfill
that role and it's a supportive role to one another. And I think that is really key to making a relationship work. with someone and what you find is they become even better looking as that friendship grows.
And really beautiful people like on the outside that you start to get to know actually become
uglier the more you get to know them. And it's true. And I think that's a reality. And Rachel
and I have talked about this. When you're on social media and you're just swiping on looks
and you're not actually going out there and engaging in the world and getting to know people, Rachel and I call it dating like it's 1980.
Going out and meeting friends of friends and having coffee and having drinks and having apps, you miss this whole side of this really important part of building friendships that can develop into a love story.
And I think more young people have to do that.
Um, and, and I think again, the culture has to talk about making sure their hearts are
open to marriage and kids.
And, um, and I think, you know, as I say, you can save America by saving your family.
All of us, if we all, if we all save our own kids, we all save our, you know, making sure
the woke lefties don't get them,
that we educate them well in their faith and their rights. We're going to do well in this country.
If we turn them over to the leftist mob, we lose. And so much power comes from the family. And as I
told you, I was in Congress, by the way, there's also this thing in Congress where your staff will
talk bad about you on the Hill. I had that my first two years in Congress, Will,
and we fired the crap out of everyone who did that.
But that's a common trait as well.
But I have more power in my house than I had in Congress
to make a difference in the world, to save America.
More power there.
No, and I do think, Will, that modeling good marriages,
sometimes you don't have to say anything.
I think it was St. Francis says, preach the gospel at all times, if necessary, use words.
And I think that people that are around us will look at, you know, we can say, we need to say more nice things about marriage, but probably the best thing you could do is just have a great marriage.
People will notice.
Well, Ken, you're impressive. I mean, you do water slides, rodeos, you bounce in that little ball
horse on Fox and Friends. You're a legal analyst, a marriage analyst, sports analyst. You cover all
the bases. He's truly a renaissance man. You're just an all-around good guy, Will Kane. Listen,
we appreciate you joining us at the Kitchen Table. I appreciate you guys. A lot of wonderful insights and thoughts.
We appreciate your deep thinking and kind of unpacking these big stories of the day for us at the kitchen table.
Thank you for joining us.
And thanks for being so great to Rachel on the weekend as she—
He is a good friend.
We love you, Will.
And also, when you go on that walk, give Kathleen a big hug for me.
Okay.
Love her.
Thank you, guys.
Love you, too.
All right.
Take care.
Thanks, Will. Bye-bye. I her. Thank you guys. Love you too. All right. Take care. Thanks, Will.
Bye-bye.
I want to thank Will Kane for joining us.
I mean, again, I think there's so many big things happening in the country.
And to really think about them and try to unpack them, it's going to take time.
We're doing this right away, but this is going to unpack over weeks, months, years, decades,
what's happening right now in American history.
And it's so important because this is critical about who we are going
to be as a people and what kind of government and what kind of rights we're going to have. And
I appreciate the way Will thinks through things. Yeah, he's a deep thinker. He thinks about things
in that way. Really glad we got a chance to talk to him a little bit. We always say he's like a
slow peeling onion. You don't get to the core of Will Kane easily.
I'm starting to get to the core Kane after like two years of being on the show with him.
The core Kane.
Who is the core Kane?
The core Kane.
You got a lot to unpack there.
The more you get to know Will Kane, the more you like him.
He's one of those people.
And I think that you could, I think it kind of, I'm really glad we talked to him about both topics.
I think that's what the takeaway I think for our listeners will be.
He's a great guy.
He's a great family man.
He thinks a lot about, just like you do, Sean, about his family, about what he wants to have
happen in his, in, you know, his career, his family, his, you know, he thinks about all
those things.
Sometimes when, when, when you watch someone on TV,
you might go,
Hey,
are they just,
are they like that in person?
And Will Kane is,
um,
he's actually better in person.
I think he's even better,
but he's,
but I was nice.
I was respectful.
I was thoughtful.
Um,
and a lot of fun.
So I appreciate him joining us,
uh,
at the kitchen table.
Um,
unpacking the stories of our day.
And it's been a big week. It's been a big week. Listen, if you like our podcast from the kitchen table unpacking the stories of our day. And it's been a big week.
It's been a big week.
Listen, if you like our podcast from the kitchen table,
you can rate, review, subscribe, wherever you get your podcasts.
You can get us at foxnewspodcast.com.
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Until next time, everybody.
Thanks for joining us.
Bye, everybody.
Bye-bye.
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from the fox news podcasts network i'm janice Dean, Fox News Senior Meteorologist.
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