Front Burner - Convoy fallout: Ontario politician faces charges

Episode Date: March 30, 2022

Randy Hillier, a longtime member of Ontario’s legislature, is facing nine charges related to his participation in the Ottawa trucker convoy — and they could lead to jail time. Hillier’s protests against public health restrictions and spreading of misinformation about vaccines have also gotten him banned from Twitter and barred from speaking in the legislature. Today, we speak to CBC reporter Mike Crawley about how the long-standing Ontario politician became a high-profile voice in Canada’s anti-vaccine movement, and the trouble he finds himself in now.

In the Dragon's Den, a simple pitch can lead to a life-changing connection. Watch new episodes of Dragon's Den free on CBC Gem. Brought to you in part by National Angel Capital Organization, empowering Canada's entrepreneurs through angel investment and industry connections. This is a CBC Podcast. Hi, I'm Jamie Poisson. On Monday morning, Randy Hillier, an independent member of Ontario's Provincial Parliament, puffed on a cigarette as he spoke to reporters outside an Ottawa police station. Randy, did you assault a police officer?

No. Hillier had come to the police station to turn himself in. He's facing nine charges and the possibility of major fines or even jail time. It's all related to his participation in the Freedom Convoy that rocked Ottawa for weeks. Well, I'm telling everybody,

and I'm telling that coward in the college, this is the hill we die on. Those charges include one count of assaulting a public or peace officer. And they come on top of other charges Hillier is already facing, related to other COVID protests. I only ever greeted people with love and affection. So unless handshakes or warm embraces are now considered assault, I have no idea. What will happen to those charges remains to be seen. But Hillier's activism, which has included pushing anti-vax conspiracy theories, has had other consequences. Over the past month, Hillier's been banned from Twitter, barred from speaking in the legislature,

and he's announced he won't seek re-election in his longtime Ontario riding. Our political system is broken. There is no sense spending any more time trying to fix a broken system from within. Today, I'm speaking to my colleague Mike Crawley, CBC's Provincial Affairs Reporter for Ontario, about the story of how a longstanding Ontario MPP became a high-profile voice in Canada's anti-vaccine conspiracy movements and the trouble he finds himself in now. Hey Mike, great to have you back. Hi Jamie. So I want to spend some time first just explaining who Randy Hillier is, because outside of Ontario,

a lot of people may have never heard of him. Although inside Ontario, a lot of our listeners probably have, because he's been making headlines for such a long time. So let's start with the basics. Who is Randy Hillier? And how long has he been in politics for? Okay, so he first got elected to the Ontario legislature way back in 2007 as a progressive conservative MPP. He represents Leonard Frontenac Kingston, which is a rural riding about like halfway between Ottawa and Peterborough. And it's extremely rural. He's somebody who has developed a, you know developed quite a reputation as an MPP over those years. And talk to me a little bit about that reputation. How did he get into politics

in the first place? How was the beginning of his career defined? Yeah, so before he actually ran for elected office, he was involved in a group called the Ontario Landowners Association, a kind of like farmers' rights, property owners' rights group, pushing back against government regulation that rural people felt was interfering with their enjoyment of property. And so he, during some of the more spectacular protests of this, of that particular organization, he actually was involved in some blockading of highways to try to get attention we're tired of having farmers getting screwed and consumers

getting gouged by this government and we're not going to take it any longer and then talk to me about once he comes into office in 2007 what kinds of issues has has he for? You know, if I could put a theme on it, it was kind of about having less government in people's lives. He pushed back against a regulation that banned the cosmetic use of pesticides in Ontario. He tried to get Ontario's ban on pit bulldogs reversed. And, you know, generally speaking, if it was a thing that smacked to him of government overreach, that was the kind of thing that he wanted to try to draw attention to. Right, like a libertarian streak, fair to say. I would definitely say that he comes across as a libertarian, for sure. Okay, now I want to get into some of the more controversial stuff. So pre-pandemic,

Hillier was already dealing with some controversies and some fights in the legislature, back when he was still in the PC caucus. And can you tell me about that? Yeah, so after Doug Ford got elected in June of 2018, it became fairly clear within a few months that Randy Hillier was kind of, let's say, on the outs with the brain trust around Doug Ford. The sense that I got was that, you know, he was kind of perhaps like pushing back against some of the stuff that Ford and the people he surrounded himself with in the premier's office, some of the things that they were putting forward. And within the space of about a year after Ford had gotten elected, he got kicked out of the PC caucus.

gotten elected, he got kicked out of the PC caucus. And tell me why he got kicked out of the PC caucus. Was there an event that precipitated it? Well, so there was an event that was the supposed trigger. Saying that is what started this whole story. Doug Ford suspended Randy Hillier from caucus last month after he was accused of giving that retort to parents of children with autism in the legislature. Now he said he was heckling the NDP, which of these two versions is true. You know, we don't really know, but it certainly is not the worst thing that's ever been said in a legislature. So the sense that a lot of us had as observers was that the PCs were looking for an excuse to kick him out of caucus, and they saw this as an opportunity to do that.

Okay, interesting. All right, so then he becomes independent. And during the pandemic, I know he starts to take, if it's fair to say, something of a turn. Initially, you know, I know he just started speaking out against lockdown measures. But what kind of stuff was he doing at first? Yeah, in the, let's say, the summer of 2020, he started showing up at anti-lockdown rallies. And in some cases, you know, organizing anti-lockdown type of demonstration. I don't believe that there is anything that is on the horizon that an elected representative democracy is not better suited to deal with than a single COVID command table made up of unelected, unaccountable people. It seemed to start to get fairly intense in the fall of 2020,

kind of as the second wave of COVID was ramping up and the government was starting to look at bringing in more restrictions. He did things like tweeting that public health officials were guilty of crimes against humanity. He called the head of the World Health Organization a criminal and a liar. He did things like tweeting that public health officials were guilty of crimes against humanity. He called the head of the World Health Organization a criminal and a liar. I think what really raised a lot of eyebrows was in the fall of 2020, he actually spoke in the legislature about this conspiracy theory that the government of Canada was building what he called internment camps to detain people with COVID. These quarantine isolation camps are not limited to people with COVID, but provide a wide latitude for many people to be detained. And then as we head into 2021, it felt like things really started to ramp up even further, hey? Yeah, and again, this is, it coincided with the, you know, the rise of the third wave,

but also with the arrival of vaccines. So he did some things like attending church services that were basically violating the public health guidelines, and he actually got charged, were basically violating the public health guidelines. And he actually got charged, along with the Member of Parliament, Derek Sloan, for that. He was charged for defying pandemic restrictions during a rally at a restaurant, during a time when restaurants were supposed to have been closed. His social media posts also started to put out more misinformation, clearly, about the vaccines and also about public health measures. He compared Ontario's public health measures to the Holocaust and with a photo of Hitler. In his tweet, Hillier compared the third wave of the COVID-19 pandemic to the Third Reich, better known as Adolf Hitler's Nazi Germany.

And in one particular case, he posted the names and photos of 11 people and suggested in it that their deaths or severe health problems that they had were specifically because of having been vaccinated against COVID. Yeah, and I guess we should note that Hillier did eventually apologize for that post, but these were real people whose names and photos he posted and some of their family members have spoken out about how furious they were about this. It is important for me and my family to make sure my sister's name is remembered for who she was and not who Randy Hilliard wants her to be. And the Nazi stuff you were talking about, I know he has defended these comparisons to Nazis. Much of the policies of Nazism were based on public health. This is pretty hardcore stuff. You know, Mike, there are also videos from some of these rallies where you can see him getting into verbal altercations with police, sometimes as he's

getting ticketed. Some of them seem to get pretty heated, hey? That's not what you guys said either. And you didn't tell me about the barricades. So screw you. Some of them seem to get pretty heated, hey? Yeah, and he's facing some charges in relation to some of these protests where there were confrontations. So this is all before anything to do with the Ottawa convoy. thing to do with the Ottawa convoy. And I guess before we get to the Ottawa convoy, how had other members of the Ontario legislature been responding to what he was doing? I remember the premier said he thought that he had essentially lost his mind. I think this guy, I always said before, the chief slipped off the cracker with this guy. He's gone rogue. The guy's lost his mind, in my opinion. gone rogue. The guy's lost his mind, in my opinion. Yeah, well, Randy Hillier did not exactly endear himself with his fellow MPPs in the legislature. In October, just last October,

he tweeted that when the legislature reopens, people should bring a pot of boiling hot tar and a case of feathers, saying that, you know, each politician who comes to the legislature deserves a tar and feathering. And maybe it was metaphorical, but tarring and feathering is a pretty nasty thing. It sounds like he's encouraging people to, you know, assault, violently assault politicians. You know, a few weeks after that, he posted that claim I mentioned about the people having died from the COVID vaccines. And in response to that, the MPPs put forward a motion. They approved it unanimously, calling on him to apologize,

condemning him for what they described as disreputable conduct for this particular thing, but also just his general demeanor related to public health measures and the misinformation he was spreading. In the Dragon's Den, a simple pitch can lead to a life-changing connection. Watch new episodes of Dragon's Den free on CBC Gem. Brought to you in part by National Angel Capital Organization. Empowering Canada's entrepreneurs through angel investment and industry connections.

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So then this past January, the trucker convoy had rolled into Ottawa, of course, and stayed for three weeks. And Randy Hillier was there, too. When I was there, I actually saw him at a press conference called by some people involved in the protests. The emergency act that is being invoked, in my view, demonstrates the gravity and just how dark the situation has become for our country. There's still a lot that we don't know, but what sense do we have, at least from videos and news reports of how active a participant he was in the convoy? Oh, for sure. You know, he was speaking, he was described as a guest at certain events. In one of the very early weekends of the protests, I saw some video where he reaches in and moves fencing on Parliament Hill and

appears to be encouraging people to rush onto the grounds. We don't know to what extent he was in communication with the leaders of the convoy, but certainly he was, let's say, encouraging of the occupation to continue to happen. And then police, they finally went in and they started arresting people on February 17th. And by the 21st, they had shut down most of the protests. Dozens and dozens of people ended up getting charged. One of them is Randy Hillier. What has he been charged with? So he faces a range of criminal charges. It's nine counts in total, including assaulting an officer, obstructing an officer, and mischief. Mischief is one of those criminal charges that doesn't actually sound all that serious, but it kind of depends on what mischief you were up to.

Because, yeah, the consequences can actually be serious. But from what we heard in court, one of the charges relates to a tweet he put out. During the convoy protest, Ottawa police took to social media, pleading with people to stop tying up emergency lines. Hillier encouraged them to keep calling. And the assault charge is related to that thing I mentioned on Parliament Hill. He allegedly threw a metal gate out of the way and used his body to push an officer while these demonstrators were moving. And you can sort of see that happening in the video. But of course, you know, must say that the assault has not been proven in court.

Talk to me about how Hillier has responded to these charges. Basically, he said, as for the idea that he assaulted an officer, he said he didn't assault anyone. All he did was give out hugs and handshakes. His lawyer put out a more formal statement saying that he denies committing any of the offenses and that they're going to vigorously fight the charges. obviously these charges haven't yet been proven in court there's there is still lots we don't know as i mentioned but he has experienced other kinds of fallout already and can you tell me about that yeah so right now he is basically barred from speaking in the legislature as a result of a vote by the MPPs. The Speaker has the power to what they call not recognize him.

So he can show up at the legislature, but he's not going to get a chance to actually talk. He's banned from Twitter. This happened earlier in March. A spokesperson for Twitter Canada told me that Randy Hillier is permanently suspended for violating Twitter's COVID-19 misleading information policy. He's also got some court dates coming up in June related to some charges over a protest that happened outside the local health unit in Cornwall, Ontario. And finally, he recently announced that he's not going to run in the Ontario provincial election in June. The announcement that he's not going to run in June, what has he said about that after 15 years serving as an MPP?

So he posted this 20-minute video to Facebook and right towards the end of it, he said he wasn't going to run again. On June 2nd, I will not be contesting for the seat of Lennart Frontenac-Kingson. And he basically is saying that the political system is broken. He's saying that there's no sense trying to fix the system from within. So that's why he's basically abandoning the politics. So you think that spells the end of his political career? I mean, you never know what someone is going to go and do.

He's certainly been aligned with the federal People's Party of Canada. So there's, I suppose, the possibility that he could run again for them. political career. He's potentially facing the specter of jail time, if some of these charges are proven in court. And I guess, Mike, I'm just curious, as someone who has been covering the Ontario legislature for almost as long as Hillier has been in politics, what have you been thinking as you've watched him go down this road? Well, I've got two thoughts jamie i mean his reaction against lockdowns and his protests of that didn't surprise me in any way it it was on brand for randy hillier to question uh government overreach and i think it's that yeah it's that libertarian street that we were talking about earlier absolutely absolutely and And I think there are points of debate around the extent to which governments needed to use lockdowns or public health restrictions or what have you to deal with COVID. sort of understand what uh what puzzles me though about randy hillier was when he started peddling the conspiracy theories in particular around the vaccines the the way he completely questioned

the science and then you know responded to anybody who um challenged him by saying effectively you got to think for yourself it seemed not logical. And I will say that as a person, as a politician, I've liked Randy Hillier. I've enjoyed talking with him. And to see him go so far down the anti-vax conspiracy theories and what this led him to do. And it seems a bit of a shame. Mike, thank you so much for this. It's always such a pleasure to have you on. You're welcome, Jamie.

I always enjoy talking to FrontBurner. All right, that's all for today. I'm Jamie Poisson. Talk to you tomorrow. For more CBC Podcasts, go to cbc.ca slash podcasts.