Front Burner - Grief, questions remain after Sask. mass murder

Episode Date: September 15, 2022

After a manhunt that spanned four days, the main suspect in the mass stabbing that injured at least 18 and left 10 people dead in northern Saskatchewan was arrested last Wednesday. Shortly after, he died in police custody after going into what RCMP call "medical distress." His death means we may never know the motive of the attack. But questions remain about why, despite being a wanted man, he remained at large for months before — and days after — the stabbings. Today on Front Burner, CBC Saskatoon reporter Dan Zakreski walks us through all the updates on the attacks, the chase and the investigation.

In the Dragon's Den, a simple pitch can lead to a life-changing connection. Watch new episodes of Dragon's Den free on CBC Gem. Brought to you in part by National Angel Capital Organization, empowering Canada's entrepreneurs through angel investment and industry connections. This is a CBC Podcast. Hello, I'm Jamie Poisson. I have a young lady here. Her husband was accused of killing my sister. Our family is here to forgive.

This is Daryl Burns speaking from James Smith Cree Nation. And he has his arm around the widow of Damien Sanderson, one of two brothers police initially hunted for mass stabbings in Saskatchewan. At this press conference, it's been just four days since Daryl lost his sister. But on top of calling for forgiveness, Daryl used the moment to call out the addiction and systemic injustice he saw behind the attacks. So a tragedy like this, let's learn from it. Let's take strength and courage and let's move on. The violence in Saskatchewan has been hard to make sense of. Ten people died during the stabbing spree on Labor Day weekend, while 18 were injured. And even after Damien was found dead that Monday, a police manhunt for his brother Miles lasted two more days.

And they were able to get Miles Sanderson into custody. A short time later, RCMP say Sanderson went into what they're calling medical distress. He was taken by ambulance to hospital in Saskatoon, where he was pronounced dead on the scene. RCMP say their investigation now points to Miles being the main or maybe only culprit. And we're learning a lot about Miles's criminal history, how he was released from prison and how he remained at large for months before and days after the stabbings. So today, I'm joined once again by CBC Saskatoon reporter Dan Zekreski. He's going to walk us through all the updates on the attacks, the chase, and the investigation.

Hi, Dan. Thank you very much for coming back onto FrontBurner. Oh, you're welcome. So let's pick up here where you and I left off last week when we spoke. We just found out at the time that Damian Sanderson had died, but police were still hunting for his brother Miles. Moving ahead to that Wednesday, what indications did you get that the manhunt could be coming to an end? It was a very dramatic Wednesday. What happened was early afternoon, around two in the afternoon, in the newsroom, all of our phones exploded at once with that wild emergency alert chirping that makes the hair on your arms go up. And the alert that they had sent out was that RCMP believed they had a credible sighting of Miles Sanderson armed with a knife.

Sanderson was spotted in a stolen white truck near Waka, Saskatchewan, about 100 kilometers northeast of Saskatoon. And they didn't know which direction he was going. As you can imagine, in a newsroom, that just went off like a bomb. Because I was covering the story and I knew the area, I was dispatched on my own up to Waka. Right, right. And I know you found the woman who he stole the truck from, right? Yes, yes. My hook and crook people revealed that to me, and I talked to the woman's son, and he gave me this terrifying story. He was actually sitting there with his mother, who was too traumatized to come to the phone. And the way it had shaken down was she is a widowed grandmother who was living on a rural property

30 kilometers north of Waukka. And two in the afternoon on this Wednesday, she looked out her front door and there was Miles Sanderson in her yard with a butcher knife walking towards her house. And as the son said, she grabbed her cell phone, ran into her bedroom, locked the door, went into the master bathroom and locked the door and then tried to phone the authorities. But in everybody's nightmare scenario, she kept on hitting the wrong buttons on the phone because what she was hearing was Miles Sanderson forcing his way into the house, into the bedroom, and then into the bathroom. And the son was telling me that his mother believed she was going to die. He dragged her out of the bathroom. But then, according to her, he said, look, I'm not going to hurt you. I just need something to drink.

I need a phone, and I need some wheels. So he went to the fridge, took some pop and bottled water, took her cigarette and lighter, took her cell phone, and then said, I need some wheels. So he went to the fridge, took some pop and bottled water, took her cigarette and lighter, took her cell phone and then said, I need a vehicle. So she gave him the keys to her white avalanche. And then he tried to get her to get into the vehicle to come with her. She refused. So he just left. Now, the key thing here is he left not knowing that she had a landline. So he was out of that yard within five minutes. The RCMB had been contacted with a description of the vehicle, its license plate, its general direction. And then the chase was on.

Saskatchewan manhunt is over. Just moments ago, police issued a statement saying Miles Zanderson has been found and he's under arrest. RCMP reporting his arrest shortly before 4 p.m. Saskatchewan time in the town of Ross Thurn. It brings to an end a four-day search and provides just maybe a sense of relief for people in the area. Tell me how the police managed to stop the car and capture him. Yes, and we're piecing this together. We have people who have been calling us in saying,

look, this white avalanche, and this is a fairly large pickup truck, and he's driving at, we have reported speeds of upwards of 160 kilometers an hour. So he's highballing it over land. He had gone to this community of Rosturn, had turned south and was heading towards Saskatoon. So there was a panic thinking he's coming into the biggest city in his truck with a police convoy behind him with sirens going. So we know, you can sort of take the police language on this, but effectively what they did was drove him off the road. We've heard that they used what's called a pit maneuver where they bumped the rear

of the truck to cause the driver to lose control. Whatever happened, he was off the highway. We know from people who had been driving by who sent in video and photos that the truck didn't roll, it wasn't smashed up. You could see the airbags had deployed. But we actually have photos that we ran on our web page of Miles Sanderson standing outside the RCMP cruiser, you know, leaning up against it with his hands behind his back. He was being cuffed and searched. So he was alive when he came out of that truck and was placed in police custody. And that's when everything went sideways. Shortly after his arrest, he went into medical distress.

After his arrest, he went into medical distress. Nearby, EMS were called by police to attend the scene, and he was transported to a hospital in Saskatoon. He was pronounced deceased at the hospital. What we know for certain is the language that the authorities are using is that he went into medical distress. He wasn't shot. He didn't have a physical altercation with the authorities. Just something happened. I mean, we were hearing literally within minutes of him being under arrest that something bad had happened and that they were racing to get him into an ambulance and then into the main trauma hospital here where most of his victims were, ironically enough. Yeah, yeah. Since Miles died in police custody, there's obviously going to be an investigation

into what happened here. So what do we know about this investigation so far and who's conducting it? Sure, there's a couple of issues that come out of this. You know, one of the features of the justice system in Saskatchewan, and I know what's mirrored in other jurisdictions, is if you have an individual who dies while in police custody, another police service is appointed to do the investigation into the in-custody death. The people who are going to be investigating are the Saskatoon Police Major Crimes Unit. And they're going to be doing it. The language they used in their news release was in cooperation with the Serious Incident Response Team in Saskatchewan,

which is a body that for the past three years, the provincial government has tried to get up and running. It's supposed to be a civilian oversight body that investigates what I had just described. So you get away from the notion of police investigating police. And I can't overstate enough how in Saskatchewan that's a big deal, especially with the Saskatoon police. You know, on one hand, I know a lot of the major crimes officers. These are good, On one hand, I know a lot of the major crimes officers. These are good, conscientious police officers.

But we're talking about accountability and transparency here. I'm sure you would know the Saskatoon Police Service has a questionable history in terms of dealing with First Nations people and their deaths. So right out of the gate, the fact that Saskatoon police are going to be investigating the RCMP, they'll do a report and it's going to go to the provincial government just has people's hackles up. And as a matter of fact, just to make sure I understood this, we reached out and contacted a gentleman named Ian Scott,

who back around 2008 headed up the Ontario Special Investigation Unit. You know, the Saskatchewan Serious Incident Response Team is going to be working with the Saskatoon police in what they call as an observational capacity, which means you're going to have some investigators watching Saskatoon police do their thing. When I talked to Mr. Scott, he says, no, no, no, no, that's not how you do it. What the police service is supposed to do is freeze the scene as they would any other crime scene. The involved officers, who are ones basically at the scene, are to be segregated.

They're supposed to write up their notes independently without any input from any other police officer or lawyers. Say in the case of Miles Sanderson's autopsy, which will be critical because that will determine, did he just have a heart attack? Did he die of a drug overdose or what? Mr. Scott was saying the special investigation unit should be the people doing this. There shouldn't be any police anywhere near this autopsy. If you want the public to believe

these findings, have a true independent investigation and don't send your findings to the Ministry of Justice to have them come out with a one-page news release or whatever they're going to do explaining what happened. You give the raw data to the public with, you know, some redactions, but you understand the principle. You cut out all the middlemen and you just get the police out of the issue. The Cadillac version is to have a completely independent investigation with including independent investigators without having the police involved. So, you know, it's bound to affect anybody's analysis of independence

to merely put these investigators in an observing category. So let's go back to before these stabbings and talk about what was previously known about Miles. I know when we spoke last week, we knew that he had a criminal record. But what more have you been able to learn about his criminal history since from about 2015 onwards? about 2015 onwards. Peter Robinson It's such an astonishing story because for every development in the story, it just triggers a whole bunch of larger stories. I knew the Sunday of the massacre. Once his name came out, I had contacts within the correctional service reaching out to me saying, Miles Sanderson, actually the police have been looking for this guy since May of this year.

And I'm going like, well, what are you talking about? And it turns out that Mr. Sanderson, by age 32, had racked up 59 adult criminal convictions. That's not including his youth record. So he was, without sounding too glib, a very busy man in his 20s. In terms of this particular set of facts, we now know that in 2018, Miles Sanderson was convicted and given a federal sentence for assault, robbery, uttering threats. He was just, had finally done something bad enough that he was sent to prison instead of jail. Now, the way the Canadian prison system works

is when he was in prison, that was in 2018, he reached a certain point in his sentence where he hadn't screwed up enough in jail, to be colloquial about it, that he was released on what's called statutory release. So it's not like they had a parole board hearing or anything. This is an automatic release for a person back into the community.

So he would have had to report to a parole officer. He would be allowed to see certain people, not allowed to see other people. So in August of 2021, he was released from prison into a healing lodge in Saskatchewan. What happened once he got into the community is he breached his release conditions. Specifically, he wasn't supposed to be living with his former partner, and he was, and she tired of this by November. So he was reported to the authorities and put back in prison. So he was only out for about three months. Then what happened, and this is where it turns into a national political story, is in February of this year, the parole board reconsidered that suspension, took a look at him and thought, well, you know, we know what the

complaint was that sent him back to prison. But when he was out, he was making efforts to work. He was working on his addictions issues. You know, he was trying, you know, in fairness, he was trying in the community. So in February of this year, they re-released him. And then within months, he vanished off the radar. He stopped meeting with his parole officer and just went into the wind, which was problematic because he was in Saskatoon. That was where he went missing, so it was the responsibility of the Saskatoon police to keep tabs on him.

If he left the city, he's not a Saskatoon problem anymore. And you also have to look back in fairness to the people involved here that Miles Sanderson before the James Smith massacre, you know, had done a bunch of bad things, but we've seen worse. You know, in Saskatchewan, we have in any given year, I've done stories on this, upwards of 40 people who did exactly what he did. Just essentially disappear. Just disappear, stop reporting. And they get, you know, there's all sorts of active crimes that police are pursuing.

So, you know, officers will be driving around with this photo, meeting with his known contacts and such. But it's not really a front burner hunt. It's not really a front burner hunt. And what I had referenced earlier about a national political story, when the federal minister Mendocino came out with the notion that they are now going to be reviewing the poll board's decision to release him, that's what they're talking about. Back in February, this guy was back in prison. Why did they let him out again? I have to say this.

That the criminal system again has failed the indigenous community of people. This incident sheds light on the fractured system. Dragon's Den free on CBC Gem. Brought to you in part by National Angel Capital Organization, empowering Canada's entrepreneurs through angel investment and industry connections. Hi, it's Ramit Sethi here. You may have seen my money show on Netflix. I've been talking about

money for 20 years. I've talked to millions of people and I have some startling numbers to share with you. Did you know that of the people I speak to, 50% of them do not know their own household income? That's not a typo. 50%. That's because money is confusing. In my new book and podcast, Money for Couples, I help you and your partner create a financial vision together. To listen to this podcast, just search for Money for Couops. I also want to talk a little more about the people who were killed in this attack. And what more have we learned about who they were? We've learned lots. And not surprisingly, I mean, you know what you're going to be getting into, but it's still so awful to read about these people because they're just people.

You know, we have a woman who was a frontline health care worker who was killed trying to give aid. There was a retired Canadian veteran, Earl Burns Sr., who was with Princess Patricia Rifles. There was a woman who worked as a casino security guard. There was people who were just on the First Nation. The other thing, too, and it just, again, raises so many questions, is six of them had the same last name. And Earl Burns, the Burns family was among the six. Earl Burns was Miles Sanderson's father-in-law. And we learned from the court documents that Miles Sanderson had attacked him

with a knife a couple of years ago and did time for that. So we'd already stabbed Earl once. And he has a history of violence with this family. And again, when they talk about, when they have the news conferences and they talk about the healing and all sort of this stuff, one of the things that really struck me, because I hadn't realized this initially, was one of their leaders stood up and said, you know, he said, we're living on a plot of land that's 12 miles long and six miles wide. And we're in this little postage stamp community. And if we can't learn to forgive and get along and get over this, we are going to be in a very dark place.

And it's just 2000 people, right? Yeah. Um, um, Dan, when we talked last week, of course, Miles' brother, Damien had been found dead. The police say that he had wounds that they did not believe were self-inflicted. And what do we know now about whether Miles' brother was like a culprit or a victim in this? We're being very, very careful with that aspect of the narrative. And, you know, I think we were originally because you have to appreciate the RCMP as they began processing the crime scenes charged both Miles Sanderson and Damian Sanderson with first degree murder.

So those were, you know, based on the initial victims. And then when Damian Sanderson was found, now the question becomes, and we're hearing this as well, was he may have started off as his brother's accomplice, but at some point the suggestion has been he saw that his brother wasn't doing whatever his motive was. If this began, for instance, as Miles Sanderson trying to settle up on a drug debt or whatever his motive was. You hear all these potential motives. But if that was the case and his brother Damien decides to go along as the driver and helper

and then all of a sudden his brother is attacking and stabbing older men and older women and terrifying children, Damien has a change of heart and then is attacked and stabbing older men and older women and terrifying children. Damien has a change of heart and then is attacked and killed by his brother when he tries to intervene. Or someone like Earl Burns, a military veteran, may have gone down swinging, so to speak, and he may have injured both of them. We just don't know beyond the fact that nobody's role outside of Miles Sanderson is especially clear. Right. And I guess with them both dead, what are the chances we'll ever really know what happened here? I don't think we'll know the motive.

And I don't know that people necessarily want to know the motive. They want to know the narrative of what happened. You know, where did these attacks start? Who did he go after? The people who he attacked and survived, what was their understanding of why he was attacking them? We don't know. The answers as to motive died with those two men. Dan, thank you.

Thank you for coming back on and taking us through this. Well, thanks for your interest in the story. All right, that's all for today. I'm Jamie Poisson. Thanks so much for listening and talk to you tomorrow.