Front Burner - Kris Wu and China’s #MeToo moment

Episode Date: July 26, 2021

Chinese-Canadian pop superstar Kris Wu is caught in a #MeToo firestorm over allegations of predatory sexual behaviour with an underage girl now sweeping Chinese media.

In the Dragon's Den, a simple pitch can lead to a life-changing connection. Watch new episodes of Dragon's Den free on CBC Gem. Brought to you in part by National Angel Capital Organization, empowering Canada's entrepreneurs through angel investment and industry connections. This is a CBC Podcast. Hello, I'm Elamin Abdelmahmoud filling in for Jamie Poisson. That's Chinese-Canadian Chris Wu from his debut album Antares. That track alone has 40 million streams on YouTube and Spotify combined.

40 million streams on YouTube and Spotify combined. He got big with the K-pop group EXO, but carved out a solo career as a model, actor, and singer. Woo, who grew up in Vancouver, has Bieber-like fame in China with over 50 million followers on Chinese social media site Weibo. In cities all over Asia, you're likely to see his face selling products from Louis Vuitton and L'Oreal. But that has changed. Last week, Wu was dropped from at least 11 companies who previously had advertising and endorsement campaigns with him. That's because of allegations of sexual assault brought on by a 19 year old woman who claims he pressured her and others to have sex with him. It's caused an uproar on social media, inspiring conversations about consent and sexual misconduct, something that isn't commonly discussed in public.

Today, what the reaction to the allegations against Chris Wu says about the MeToo movement in the country and how it's evolved over the years. My first guest is Jane Lee. She wrote about this case for courts, and we reached her in Hong Kong. Hello, Jane. Hi. Listen, I want to start with the young woman at the heart of these allegations. What does she say happened?

She went out like in early July, posting on Weibo, saying that Chris Wu had pressured several young girls, including herself, into having sex with told by Wu's agent to go for an interview somewhere. So she thought she was going to an interview, but then it turned out she was sent to Chris Wu's flat where Wu and several other of his staff members were also there. So afterwards, Du Meizhu claimed that she was pushed to drink excessively and she got drunk eventually. And so then she woke up and Chris was back. And she doesn't say that this happened just to her, right? She says that Chris Wu allegedly targeted other young women, including minors. That's right. So Du also told a Chinese media news outlet, NetEase, in which she said she knew of at least another seven victims of Chris Wu, including two minors. So that has been basically pushed Chris Wu to the center of a meteor storm in China.

So far, Chris Wu has denied all of this. Is that right? So Chris Wu and his management team had both repeatedly denied allegations. And Chris Wu also said he had only met Du Meizhu once at a friend's party last December. And he also said if he was found to have engaged in any of the behaviors that he was accused of doing, he would be willingly going to jail. Can you tell us what the Chinese police had had to say about this case? The police basically said they had received a report from Chris Wu's mother who said her son was being blackmailed. So after investigation, the police said they found that Du indeed had sex with Wu

and that Wu's agent indeed asked Du to come to his flat. But the police didn't say whether the sex was voluntary or not. So there are still more details that need to be explained or investigated by the authorities. So we have his denial, but despite that denial, he's already been dropped by a long list of brands, a bunch of brands that had deals with him. That all happened within a few days of these allegations coming out. Why do you think that happened so quickly? I think it's partly because the anger was so overwhelming.

I mean, the anger from the Chinese audience against Chris Wu was so huge that the brands eventually realized they definitely needed to do this even before there were only definite results on whether Chris Wu had conducted the behavior or not. eventually realized he definitely needed to do this even before there were only definite results on whether Chris Wu had conducted the behavior or not. So we've seen hundreds of comments flocking to the Weibo pages, brands like Louis Vuitton, Bulgari, and Porsche, almost like hours after Du Maizhu made allegations against him. In the comments, people were accusing the brands of using a rapist. Basically, they're using very strong language to urge the brands to drop Kresu. And those who haven't actually were singled out by Internet users in China and saying, why you haven't done this? So I feel that's lots of pressure on the brands to do so.

I'm really struck by the size of the brands that are doing this, the brands like the ones that you mentioned, Louis Vuitton, Bulgari, Porsche, L'Oreal, they've all suspended or terminated these contracts with Wu. I guess I'm curious about the risks that these brands are taking on by citing, because it could look like by dropping him, these companies are siding with the women's rights activists. And the Chinese government has cracked down on that form of dissent before. I think the brands definitely consider the risks of siding with the women who are angry about Chris Wu. But I think one reason for them to do so is because this is not

necessarily a feminist movement, because there were so many ordinary young women in China who wouldn't identify themselves as feminists, usually also cited with Du Meizhu. Are you at all surprised by the size of the reaction on social media? Yes, I would say I was a bit surprised personally, because I had expected people to be angry about allegations. But I didn't expect the influence of the reaction to be so far reaching. Like, I didn't expect it to push almost all the prominent brands to drop the endorsement deals. What do you think has changed? Like, what do you think has maybe like led to such an outsized reaction and the brands feeling the need to respond? led to such an outsized reaction and the brands feeling the need to respond? So I think it's actually, sadly, I feel lots of women in China still wouldn't attach themselves to the label of feminist, which is still being used as an insult occasionally, you know,

against women who dare to speak up. So I feel this is more like the Chris Wu case is more like an illustration of how ordinary women are more willing to speak up for their fellow Chinese women. There is a shift in atmosphere. Chinese women are much less intimidated by things like slut-shaming or insults against them for being sexually harassed, because sometimes people will blame the victims in the previous years. But now they're just becoming more brave. Jane, thank you so much for your time.

Thank you so much for having me. In the Dragon's Den, a simple pitch can lead to a life-changing connection. Watch new episodes of Dragon's Den free on CBC Gem. Brought to you in part by National Angel Capital Organization. Empowering Canada's entrepreneurs through angel investment and industry connections. Hi, it's Ramit Sethi here. You may have seen my money show on Netflix. I've been talking about money for 20 years.

I've talked to millions of people and I have some startling numbers to share with you. Did you know that of the people I speak to, 50% of them do not know their own household income? That's not a typo, 50%. That's because money is confusing. In my new book and podcast, Money for Couples, I help you and your partner create a financial vision together. To listen to this podcast, just search for Money for Couples. The reaction to the allegations against Chris Wu has many people talking about what it means for the MeToo movement in China. For more on that, I've got Yachu Wang. She's a researcher for Human Rights Watch in China and a columnist with MSNBC. Hi, Yachu. Hi, thank you so much for having me.

Well, thank you so much for coming on. I'm curious. I want to start with what has stood out to you the most about the public reaction to this case? I think there are two aspects. One is when this got exploded on the Chinese internet, I saw a lot of support, outpouring of support, you know, praising the women for standing up, for coming forward, you know, for being courageous. On the other hand, then there's, you know, there's always this cultural bias against women who, you know, came forward and accused men.

Like immediate, like, dislike, you know, suspecting this woman trying to gain something from alleging this rape against a very powerful and rich man. So it's like this polarization of reactions to this case. We do have to give this a bit of a context about the MeToo movement and how it's doing in China, because that movement gained a lot of momentum in North America with the Harvey Weinstein case. Is the MeToo movement well known in China? Weinstein case. Is the MeToo movement well known in China? Absolutely. I mean, in China started at the very end of 2017, when women in the United States accused a professor who taught her when she was an undergrad in China. I was shocked because this man is known as a very respectable professor.

All that time I thought he was a nice person. I did not realize he was manipulating me. This incident just set off the MeToo movement. And there are many cases following that of women accused powerful, well-known men for sexual harassment. China's MeToo campaign has been gathering pace, with viral social media posts accusing public figures, such as television host Zhu Jun,

and Buddhist monk Shi Shui-chang of sexual assault. What are the challenges that the MeToo movement faces in China? You know, China is politically very repressive. There's censorship online, there's censorship offline. Again, it's any kind of, you know, independent voice. You wouldn't see any public protests because they view this as, you know, threatening to social stability, to their rule of China. But then there are also women who are Chinese.

Now they study in the United States. They study in France, in Canada. They feel they can use the freedom afforded to them in those countries to aid the women's rights activists and just, you know, victims in a way that they couldn't do in China. So all of this story is taking place in the shadow, or I guess in the aftermath of the Feminist Five case, because that feels like it really sort of introduced a new public language for this.

It introduced a new sort of, you know, ability to talk about some of these issues. Can you tell us a little bit more about the Feminist Five? Well, the Feminist Five, you know, this term was coined in March 2015. Five Chinese feminists were detained by the Chinese government after they disseminated leaflet about sexual harassment in public transportation. We were only planning to go to buses and give people stickers with their consent. There were only five of us.

I didn't think it was a big deal. But they said, how do you know it's not a big deal? Those street peddlers got arrested for disturbing social order. It seemed they were really nervous about it. And that, you know, they were detained for 30 days. I think, you know, they were able to be released after 30 days were very much a result of this uproar, not just in China, but also internationally. People were very angry.

Obviously, they were doing great things for the country, but the government detained them. They were threatening me with my girlfriend's safety. Once, one of them puffed smoke in my face. Another time, they had a very bright light on my face. My eyes were so sensitive I almost cried. But I didn't want to cry in front of them. I didn't want to show my weakness. And I think that incident kind of galvanized the women's rights movement in China. When it comes to China's government dealing with the MeToo movement,

what kind of treatment has it gotten? China's government dealing with the MeToo movement, what kind of treatment has it gotten? Once there's the positive reaction, for example, last year, the Chinese Congress introduced the civil code. Now China has codified a unified, internally consistent, and more comprehensive civil code based on these separate civil laws, aimed at providing an encyclopedia on social life and encyclopedia of rights. Enforced the first time defined sexual harassment and a state that you know perpetrators can be held liable although it's still very fake on you know what recourse is available to victims but this is an improvement in the in the sense that at least now what constitutes

sexual harassment is defined. I mean, on the other hand, as I said, you know, there's still a lot of censorship against women's rights against victims. A very well-known is the case of Zhu Jun. Zhu Jun is a famous Chinese anchor and he was accused by his former intern, her name is Zhou Xiaoxuan, for sexual harassment. Her post was quickly censored, but it was already too late. Her story had already been shared widely. A lot of women who reposted this article wrote that it reminded them of their own experiences. I felt very sad, but was also moved. I mean, this case garnered a lot of attention online,

and Zhou Xiaoxuan took the tremendous effort and with a lot of courage to go through the court to sue Zhu Jun. On the other hand, the case has been stalled. The court rescheduled the hearing without giving any explanation. And no new date has been set for the hearing. Like, why was the case stalled? You know, it's kind of discouraging. She says what China really needs is an open discussion about the issue. When it becomes known that a woman has been assaulted,

people will say she has been stained. Even the media use this word. And a woman who has been sexually harassed is suddenly seen as a strange and sick person. Let's return to the Chris Wu case and the reaction that's inspired. What impact might this case, you think, and the reaction that's inspired have in the long run? Right now, it's hard to say because, you know, I think it's yesterday. The police has just, you know just released their investigation results so quickly.

It's hard to believe. And there were so many details that are so puzzling right now. I mean, I think the first thing that really caught my attention was the police framed Du Meizhu as someone who's trying to gain attention for alleging rape against Kui Shu. You know, when I saw that, I just felt, well, again, it's, you know, the public or the government think women trying to gain something from it, you know, think that it's consensual. I mean, it's just very, you know, hard to swallow every time when I see this kind of, you know, reaction from the public or from the government. But I mean, this case has not, you know, ended yet. We'll see how the public will react. So with everything that we talked about today, and with the reaction

we've heard around this Chris Wu story, where do you think China's Me Too movement stands right now? Like, do you think it's moving in the right direction? Well, I think I am hopeful. I would say the women's rights activism in China is one of the most inspiring movements, human rights movements in China. As I said, you know, there's just so many things that are so depressed about China. Nationalism, censorship, the president probably is going to be the president forever. Politically, it's just very depressing. But when you go onto the Chinese internet, these women, despite all this cultural repression, political repression, they are all getting together and telling their own story,

you know, speaking up. There's this tremendous source of solidarity, feeling of solidarity, if you follow the Chinese social media. I think, you know, I can't emphasize more that given China's severe political repression, what is happening to the women's rights movement is just very inspiring. Yachu Wang, thank you so much for your time. Thank you so much for having me. Before we go today, some news on Tokyo. A tropical storm is fast approaching Japan right now. It's expected to make landfall on Tuesday,

and officials are warning that it could bring with it intense wind and rain that could put some Olympic events at risk. I'm Alameen Abdel-Mahmoud. Thanks for listening to Frontburner, and talk to you tomorrow.