Front Burner - Pete Hegseth: the Iran war’s chief promoter

Episode Date: March 16, 2026

U.S. Secretary of War Pete Hegseth is one of the figures central to the ongoing war in Iran. Critics say that the former Fox News host is both dangerous and completely out of his depth. He has made headlines recently for promising “death and destruction," picking fights with the media, and using Christian rhetoric to justify war.The Guardian's Washington bureau chief David Smith joins us to talk about the man who heads the world’s most powerful military. What is Hegeth’s worldview? How does his past shape what we are seeing from him now? And just how much influence does he wield?For transcripts of Front Burner, please visit: https://www.cbc.ca/radio/frontburner/transcripts

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This is a CBC podcast. Hi, everyone. I'm Jamie Poisson. Today we gather to recognize that our rights here in this great country come from a loving and benevolent God, not government. America was founded as a Christian nation. It remains a Christian nation in our DNA if we can keep it. This is Pete Hagsath, the newly rebranded Secretary of War, speaking at a national prayer breakfast in Washington last month. The former Fox News host, who critics say is both dangerous and completely out of his depth, has become one of the central figures in the war

with Iran. Today on the show, we're going to dig into the man who now heads the world's most powerful military. What is his worldview? How does his past shape what we're seeing from him now? Importantly, his embrace of Christian nationalism. And just how much influence does he actually wield? With me now is David Smith, the Guardian's Washington Bureau Chief. David, hi, thanks so much for coming on. Hi, great to be here. It's really great to have you. So let's start with the way Hague Seth has been talking about the war.

He's promised, for example, death and destruction from the sky all day long. He said last week, we will keep pushing, keep advancing, no quarter, no mercy for our enemies. I've seen experts say no quarter essentially means take no prisoners, so just like kill, shoot to kill. And just what kind of message is he sending with language like this? Yeah, Pete Hexert is brash and belligerent and bellicose. And he's really sending a message that might is right, that America is all powerful,

has the most powerful military the world has ever seen and intends to use it without mercy. and just grind enemies into the ground. All the guardrails, all the rules of engagement, all the hesitation that other commanders-in-chief might have had about using that awesome firepower put aside. Hegesith is very much red-blooded, red meat. We are the most powerful nation on Earth, and we're going to impose our will on the planet.

And anybody who stands in our way will be blasted aside. Just a few more lines I had written down. No stupid rules of engagement. No nation-building quagmire. Maximum lethality, not tepid legality, violent effect, not politically correct. You mentioned like past commanders-in-chief. How is it different from how we have heard other commanders-in-chief, but also secretaries of defense talking about war in the past? I think one illustration of that is the name of this operation, because sometimes these wars are framed with names such as Operation Enduring Freedom.

There's that notion that this is about defending democracy and human rights, even though some would raise questions over how true that was in many cases, but this one is called Operation Epic Fury. I stand before you today with one unmistakable message about Operation Epic Fury. America is winning, decisively, devastatingly, and without mercy. And that, I think, speaks to the rage that it embodies in many ways. And Peter Hexuth himself personifies a break from that past. We've seen past defense secretaries being much more somber statesmen with some gravitas and measuring their words and being careful at press briefings to, first of all, pay tribute to American servicemen and women who've died and show at least some sensitivity

to those critics you say America is a global bully sometimes and uses its force crudely. Hectorth is very much, his critics would say, a cartoon version, a Fox News personality. It's all about showmanship and displaying that American firepower and, you know, the libs, as in sort of winding up political foes. Yeah. Just on your point about American lives, he received quite a lot of criticism recently, right, for being too flippant about U.S. casualties. Can you tell me a bit more about that? Yes. I mean, we've obviously got more than a dozen American service men and women kill so far in this conflict, and there was a Pentagon press briefing. And when the issue was raised,

Hexas basically attack the messenger and said, where's the effect of... This is what the fake news misses. We've taken control of Iran's airspace and waterways without boots on the ground. We control their fate. But when a few drones get through or tragic things happen, it's front page news. I get it. The press only wants to make the president look bad, but try for once to report the reality. That was in contrast to the military general standing at his side, who was much more traditional

in owning his remarks honoring the war dead. And it was a lot of criticism of Hegsteth for that. And there has been of Trump as well for really playing down U.S. losses and trying to make it all about the media. For example, a banner or a headline, Mid-East War intensifies splashing on the screen the last couple of days alongside visuals of civilian or energy targets that Iran has hit because that's what they do. What should the banner read instead? How about Iran increasingly desperate? Because they are.

They know it and so do you. One thing that has really stood out to me is just how visible Hegseth has been in all of this, press conferences, interviews. And would it be fair to say that he has effectively become the, public salesman for the war? Yes, I think alongside Trump himself, of course, is always talking and doing phone interviews with reporters. But Exeth, again, I think he was chosen for this role by Trump because of his history as a host on Fox News. He fits Trump's idea of what is telegenic or what Trump would call central casting. And he's been doing these 8 a.m. press briefings at the Pentagon

with this bellicose, macho, muscular language about the operation, you know, saying that our enemies are toast and they know it. And using phrases like that and certainly celebrating, as you mentioned, this idea that we no longer shackled by rules of engagement. And yes, Hexuth is very prominent publicly and does, I think, personify, does embody what this operation is about in terms of attack first, ask questions later, you know, never. apologize and these other piece with these lurid, glossy videos that have been released by the White House that are intercutting actual war footage with movie clips and video games and pictures

of Hexeth himself. I'm here to fight for truth and justice in American way. I am the danger. Time to find out. Maximil Method. I'd be curious to hear your thoughts on behind the scenes. Do we know whether he's actually shaping strategy or whether he's just really been tasked with amplifying decisions being made by others? That's interesting. I think it's more the latter. I think he's an amplifier and a public face and a spokesperson.

Hegsteth is hugely inexperienced for a government role. And I think quite light on political ideology. He's not a deep thinking. about these issues and what views he does have, perhaps, were shaped by his own experience serving Afghanistan and Iraq. But there's very little sense, I think, suddenly from what I'm hearing, that he is leading Trump into this. He's more reflecting what Trump wants to do. I think it's a notable contrast, for example, from when Donald Rumsfeld was the Defense Secretary during the 2003 war in Iraq. Iraq belongs to the Iraqis, and we do not aspire to own it or run it. We hope to eliminate Iraq's weapons of mass destruction and to help liberate the Iraqi people from oppression.

If the United States were to lead an international coalition in Iraq, and let there be no doubt it would be a very large one, we would be guided by two commitments to stay as long as necessary and to leave as soon as possible. There was a sense then that he was one of the neoconservatives who had a very clear ideological view about nation-building, about imposing democracy on the Middle East and was leading George W. Bush in that direction, with Bush himself perhaps not being a great ideological intellect, some would say. But in this instance, I think Hegsith is more reflective, more of an enforcer, more of a spokesperson. more of a spokesperson. Yeah. I mean, to that point, you know, people might remember that big speech that Hegg Seth gave when he, I think it was when he hard launched the Department of War, where he called out, like, fat generals. It's tiring to look out at combat formations or really any formation and see fat troops.

Likewise, it's completely unacceptable to see fat generals and admirals in the halls of the Pentagon and leading commands around the country in the world. It's a bad look. It is bad, and it's not who we are. Male level standards for physical fitness for women. Any job that requires physical power to perform in combat, those physical standards must be high and gender neutral. If women can make it excellent. If not, it is what it is.

If that means no women qualify for some combat jobs, so be it. He's been on this anti-D-EI crusade. No more identity months, DEI offices, dudes in dresses. no more climate change worship. No more division, distraction, or gender delusions. He's talked about, as we just said, things like not engaging with stupid rules of engagement. And, you know, would you say that this is mostly kind of symbolic culture war stuff? Or have there been real structural changes happening inside the military that might actually have an impact on this war?

Yeah, a bit of both, I think. I mean, yeah, first and foremost, Hexeth is a culture warrior. And even at university, he was writing about abortion and homosexuality from a very right-wing viewpoint. And all his years on Fox News, so much of it is about throwing red meat to the Trump base. And no less importantly, just saying things that will provoke and rile up liberals and make them tear their hair out. And he's certainly said disparaging things about women in the military in the past, for example. But there had been important changes at the Pentagon as well in terms of people who've been fired, and that includes some of those who might have brought expertise to the Iran situation.

Also, some who are more perhaps moderate figures who might have put the brakes on, such as there has been restructuring there. It's been in a hexath leaning direction, and that certainly alarms some military veterans watching this from afar. He complains a lot about press coverage in general, but he's been complaining a lot about press coverage of this war. But I think importantly, early on in his tenure, he changed the rules for reporting on the Pentagon. And nearly all traditional outlets gave up their press credentials rather than sign a pledge agreeing to restrictions on their journalism. Now the press corps is made up mostly of these kind of right wing outlets, right, including former mega-affiliated congressman, Matt Gates, conspiracy theorist, Laura Lumer, this Lindel TV run by the My Pillow guy, the New York Times has sued

the Pentagon arguing these rules violate the First Amendment. And just what does all of this tell you about how Hegsseth views the media and I guess accountability in wartime? Yeah, it speaks volumes. I think many historians and political commentators are watching this and saying it's another sign of America's slide into authoritarianism. It's fundamentally, a view that the media exists as an official government math piece, that it should be cheering on our troops overseas and any kind of negative reporting or dissent is somehow intrinsically unpatriotic and should be banished. Another example of a fake headline that I saw yesterday, war widening. Here's a real headline for you for an actual patriotic press. How about Iran shrinking,

going underground. And even in the last few days, there's been another incident where some photographers were denied access to the Pentagon because supposedly they've been taking pictures of hexaths that were unflattering. It's straight out of a satire such as Joseph Hedder's Catch 22. And there have been, again, in last few days, also some dangerous warnings to the media about their coverage. it does to some observers smack of Russia or North Korea or those kind of regimes.

And I will say some of these Pentagon press briefings, there have been more traditional independent outlets allowed in. When I gather, they've generally been at the back of the room and not getting many questions in with Hegsteth. But even so, it's pretty clear that the Trump-Hexeth approach is one of everybody should be on message with this war and not asking too many questions. Isn't for everyone. You need grit to climb this high this often.

You've got to be an underdog that always over delivers. You've got to be 6,500 hospital staff, 1,000 doctors all doing so much with so little. You've got to be Scarborough. Defined by our uphill battle and always striving towards new heights. And you can help us keep climbing. Donate at Lovescarborough.cairot.com. At Desjardin, our business is helping yours. We are here to support your business through every stage of growth, from your first pitch to your first acquisition.

Whether it's improving cash flow or exploring investment banking solutions, with Desjardin business, it's all under one roof. So join the more than 400,000 Canadian entrepreneurs who already count on us and contact Desjardin today. We'd love to talk. Business. I want to spend a bit more time with you today trying to understand Hague Seth a little bit more

because even if he's not making all the strategic decisions behind the scenes, he clearly has one of the most important jobs in the U.S. administration right now in an enormous amount of power. And this is a guy. who almost didn't get confirmed, J.D. Vance had to break the tie during his confirmation. And you write that his rise to Secretary of Defense would have been unthinkable under any other administration. And why?

A huge lack of experience for running such an important organization. I think the Pentagon's often described as the world's biggest bureaucracy. And then also, Hegson has a very check-up. history that I think under any other administration, this person would not have been nominated in the first place. And if they had, it would have been very quickly dismissed by the Senate's as just having too many skeletons in their cupboard. So, yeah, I can talk a bit about the hexath backstory. He's originally from Minneapolis. He went to Princeton University. He was editor of a conservative student paper there. Obviously, an important point in his favor

as defense secretary is, you know, he is a military veteran. We spent time at Guantanamo Bay in Cuba. He went on tours of Iraq and Afghanistan. There's just a today, a New York Times report, people praising his service in Iraq and Afghanistan, you know, his dedication to the job. But when he came home, things went downhill somewhat and he was involved in two. veterans' non-profit organizations where he left under a cloud and people have said he really ran those organizations into the ground. All sorts of allegations against him surfaced of drinking too much alcohol, allegations of sexual misconduct. Even his own mother wrote an email that was pretty disparaging about his behavior and a severe lack of the right kind of CV or resume required to run such a massive organization as the Pentagon.

Right. And I mean, even there was an accusation of rape, right? A woman accused him of raping her in 2017, which, of course, he denied. He did settle with that woman civilly. And you mentioned that email from his mother. I just have a portion of it here. I might read it for people listening. This is from his mother.

In 2018, you are an abuser of women. That is the ugly truth. And I have no respect for any man that belittles, lies, cheats, sleeps around, and uses women for his own power and ego. You are that man and have been for years. And as her mother, it pains me and embarrasses me to say that. But it is the sad, sad truth. I know that his mom has taken, like, umbrage with it being used widely, but she did write that. normally these kind of allegations during a confirmation would sink a nomination like this.

And I just, how do you think ultimately Hegset survived that process politically? Oh, I think the Donald Trump cult of personality, especially in Trump's second term, he utterly dominates the Republican Party. They are fiercely loyal to him on everything. And of course, this paradox has been set up now where the more. allegations like that surface and the more outcry there is from Democrats and the media, then the more Republicans dig in on their own side for their person. This is Trump's guy, and the media hate him and the Democrats hate him. Therefore, we're going to defend him twice as hard.

We've talked about Heg-Sep. as a soldier, as a media personality, as someone who's had quite a bit of personal turmoil. But a lot of people say that to really understand him, you also need to understand another central thing in his life, and that is religion. And I think it's around the time that Hegseth is having all of this life turmoil that we talked about, that he really starts to embrace Christianity. I grew up as a Christian. My mom was on Fox and Friends. She's wonderful Christian parents. I intellectually was associated with it and understood it. but never really lived it.

And it was those moments in those places, in my relationship with Jen as we grew together in Christ, that I've become a changed man. Am I a perfect man? No. Can you tell me more about that and the type of Christianity that he ultimately embraces? Yeah, Hexlerth has repeated, they expressed sympathy for Christian nationalism. And this is even written on his body. we've seen photos of him with two tattoos associated with the imagery of the crusaders. One of them is a Jerusalem cross on his chest.

Nearby there's an image of a sword along with the Latin phrase, deus vault meaning God wills it. This has been historically linked to the Crusades and more recently linked to far-right groups. We saw its surface of the January 6th, the 2021 attack on the US Capitol, for example. And Hegsoff has also spoken frequently about these issues. He's written about them. He's got a book that came out in 2020 called American Crusade. He says those who benefit from, quote, Western civilization should thank a crusader.

And in various other incidents as well, including a report in the New Yorker magazine, that he was once her drunkenly shouting, kill the Muslims. He really comes over as a hardline Christian nationalist who right now potentially regards America's embarked on a holy war against Islam, smiting the Muslims. And he's previously endorsed the doctrine of sphere sovereignty, and he's been linked to this really well-known pastor, Doug Wilson. I wonder if you could tell me more about that. Yeah, Exeter has spoken approvingly of so-called sphere sovereignty.

This is a worldview that comes from Christian reconstructionism and some of its more extremist beliefs. It calls for capital punishment for homosexuality and strictly patriarchal families and churches, wives being subservient to their husbands. A crucial aspect now to look at this is Hexer's relationship with a pastor called Doug Wilson, who's the communion of reformed evangelical churches. Wilson also has this very theocratic vision of society with, again, wives being subservient. And it was noted

just recently there was a worship service at the Pentagon. Doug Wilson was there. First of all, thank you for being here. Thank you. Thank you for your leadership, for your mentorship, for the things you've started, the truth you've told, your willingness to be bold. It's the type of thing that we're trying to exercise here, too, with a monthly worship. Yeah, Hexert is very open about these somewhat regretive beliefs. Is there evidence that this worldview is influencing any kind of changes in the Department of War and also influencing how this war right now is being framed and justified? organization called the Military Religious Freedom Foundation said it's already had more than 200 complaints from members of the military about commanders invoking some of this extremist Christian rhetoric, even about the end times as some kind of justification for this Iran war.

Wow. Yeah. And I think as well as what's happening internally, this being a potential, motive for the battle. It's also, of course, a great propaganda win for Iran, because the Iranian regime can point to these sort of reports and exits embrace of Christian nationalism and say, look, we told you all along, America is interested in holy wars. This is about Christian versus Muslims. This is about crushing us. I mean, that seems to me like it could be a problem internally in the military, like for morale. And in addition to that, I was recently reading this New York Times piece that dove into how this war wasn't being waged with a moral purpose like democracy or nation building. And of course, we can debate whether that has ever been the case. But in the past, that has been sort of the raison d'etra. This war also does not. have much public support. And given all of this, how do you think that this war could be viewed

in the military? Like, how popular is Hague Seth and these ideas? And could that be a real problem in terms of, like, morale for the people who actually have to wage a war? Yes, it could be. I mean, I think a couple of quick points. One is the military, of course, is not a monolith. You know, there's thousands of people there with very divergent views from all sorts of different backgrounds, I think probably running the gamut from fierce Trump supporters to those were much more skeptical. Secondly, I would say based on my past reporting as an embed with the US military in Iraq, for example, is there is a very strong bond between these soldiers fighting these missions. they're looking out for their mates and very dedicated.

And that tends to take priority over everything else. And that can be exploited by governments. These men and women will do anything for each other, including running into danger. And you're not necessarily be questioning the bigger, broader purpose of why we're here in the first place. That is open to some exploitation, perhaps. And in this particular context, I have spoken to veterans' groups who are in touch with soldiers who are fighting this war, and certainly some of them are questioning it and do not like the approach from Trump and Hegsseth, from the rhetoric to the apparent lack of compassion for the Americans who die, to the unwillingness to discuss and own up to the killing, for example, of school bells at an Iranian school on the first day. and certainly object to some of those lurid videos.

And so, yes, I think in some cases, it could be terrible for morale to not have a clear framework, not have a clear sort of purpose, not understand why they are there in the first place. But that's one section. There'll be others who are focused on their comrades and fighting for them, others perhaps who do believe that the military should be,

used in this way and perhaps are even grateful that Hexeth, as he says, is taking off the shackles is not telling them just to stay on some military base for the next decade, doing nothing, perhaps find it exhilarating to be in action with a sense of purpose. This is a final question for you today. We've discussed the Secretary of War who rose to power through TV, who has a deeply ideological view of the military who openly is talking about America in religious terms. But, you know, when historians look back at this moment, what rule do you think ultimately, Hegseth, we'll play? I think many historians will regard him as a somewhat shameful character in the Trump

cinematic universe, so to speak, and a symbol of the chaos and somewhat say, depravity of the Trump era, just this authoritarian flexing, this projection of US military power, this failure to engage the public, this very cavalier attitude to civilian casualties. But perhaps one important legacy and reflection for historians will be the muscular, hyper-masculine sort of macho posturing that we've seen from Hexeth. And he feels, he feels feels like a figure from the manosphere, just to use that term that we heard a lot about in the 2024 election. These bros with this new version of masculinity that is denigrating towards women that seems to be seducing a lot of young men who are lacking purpose in their lives,

you know, fueled by the internet and podcasters and influencers. All of that was seen as pretty significant in Donald Trump's election victory, notably over a woman, of course, in Kamala Harris. And those trends continue and Hexeth with his very sort of aggressive macho language, with his troubling asked regarding women, the allegations he's face. He really embodies that aspect of Trumpism. David, thank you for this. Really appreciate it. Thank you. All right, that is all for today. I'm Jamie Pueblo, and thanks so much for listening. Talk to you tomorrow. For more CBC podcasts, go to cbc.ca.ca slash podcasts.